# Bare Shaft Tuning is driving me nuts!!!!



## Al33 (May 30, 2014)

I tried bare shaft tuning in the long ago past a few times and each time gave up after frustration got the best of me. My methods for tuning hunting arrows with broad heads have been shoot 'em and if they fly good out of a particular bow then mark them for that bow. In preparation for my Africa trip I reluctantly decided to once again give bare shaft tuning a go, hopefully to ensure my arrows would get maximum penetration on the big game there. I realize that if I ever do finally accomplish this task I will have a lot more confidence about not only hitting where I look but with penetration as well. I have spent the past few weeks working on this and got some bare shaft 3555's with 225 to 250 grains up front flying good but wanted more overall weight. When I went above 250 up front the 30" shaft got weak. I knew that Paul Redavid likes adding weight to the nock end and that he can get a bare shaft to fly straight even out to 30 yards so I gave him a call. He explained that adding weight to the back end would stiffen the shaft up a bit so I asked him to bring a few nock end weights to the NGTA shoot this Sunday for me to play with. That wouldn't do for Paul so he came here yesterday afternoon with his tool box and weights and together we tried to make the 3555's work from my 62", 53#@28 Black Feather longbow but to no avail. We concluded I needed to experiment more with stiffer shafts and point weights. I learned a lot from Paul and am still trying.

Last night I found I had on hand a 29" 5575 (400 spine) bare shaft and I cut one of my 3555's (500 spine) shaft to 29" and added 100 gr. brass inserts to both. I also tried a 30" 3555 with standard aluminum insert. Trying a variety of point weights from 125 to 225 and it appears the 29" 5575 with 300 grains on the tip flies slightly stiff while the other combo's for the two other shafts failed to give me any conclusive  results. Crazy thing is that on the 30" 3555's with 225 to 250 up front were doing real well the other evening but not so today. All of my arrows are hitting nock high despite adjusting my string nock up and down the scale to correct it.

Even when you have the correct spine range for your poundage of bow there are SO many variables one has to consider. String material, brace height, nocks fitting string properly, shelf material and where the arrow rests on the shelf, arrow length, arrow wraps, how you hold the bow (vertically or canted), solid and consistent anchor, point weights, overall arrow weight and distance to target are some of them. Even your target material can give incorrect readings if it causes your arrows to penetrate at an angle versus straight in. Trying to resolve all of these potential problems can be overwhelming, at least for me they have been. I haven't given up yet but I'm close to just going back to shootin' 'em fletched up and if they visibly fly good be happy with that. If you notice me acting a bit stranger than I normally do just know I have been trying to bare shaft tune my arrows.

Wonder how the Indians did it.


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## Mudfeather (May 30, 2014)

Al, My experience has been some of my bows just will not shoot the bare shaft like a dart....That being said....I grew out of the which way is the nock pointing stuff...

I think it was OL Adcock  that said as long as the shafts fly to the  spot as you are looking dont worry about the direction the nock points...

None the less ...that is what I have noticed....I take a bare shaft and if it hits what Im looking at.....The fletching will keep it flying straight even with any broadhead I hunt with...

Most time to get a shaft to fly like a dart I think it has to be way to stiff actually.....

Just my .02


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## Hammer Spank (May 30, 2014)

If my feathered shafts fly like darts with field points and bh's, they hunt. Traditional archery is frustrating enough!


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## Todd Cook (May 30, 2014)

Al, I have never been completely satisfied with bare shaft tuning. I've watched Paul shoot at 30 yards bareshaft and tried it myself; sometimes it worked better than others. I know if ANYTHING form related is off, it's hard to get consistent results.

Having said that, I've shot with you enough to know you have good form. Sometimes use a modified version of bareshafting. I'll shoot a couple fletched and a couple bare and tinker with them until the impact point is the same, not particularly worrying about the angle of the shafts, just trying to get them into a group.

But mostly I do like you said, shoot broadheads till I get good flight. I figure if it'll shoot a 160 snuffer with feathers, it's pretty well tuned.

I bet a 60-65 shurwood with a Mag 1 would fly good


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## Gordief (May 30, 2014)

Al, back in the day... i was a paper tuner... give it a try, but
remember,  us leftys read the tear in reverse.

you will need fletched arrows...


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## Tailfeather (May 31, 2014)

Al, the paper-tuning article below is how I've been doing my tuning.  Super easy, and I was amazed how what I thought was "perfect" arrow flight was way off.  I just used an old, empty picture frame to shoot through. I've never seriously tried bare shaft tuning, though.

http://www.bowhunter.com/tips-for-tuning-your-traditional-arrow.html


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## sawtooth (May 31, 2014)

Al, there's nothing wrong with your shooting! You always do just fine. Don't fix what ain't broken.


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## Barry Duggan (May 31, 2014)

Mudfeather said:


> Most time to get a shaft to fly like a dart I think it has to be way to stiff actually.....
> 
> Just my .02



I hear ya. If I don't leave my bareshafts a little weak, they hit left when fletched.

Al, don't forget bareshafting is just a means to an end. If your arrows, with broadheads attached, fly straight and hit where you are looking, you've reached that end. Don't matter how you got there.


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## Al33 (May 31, 2014)

Thanks guys for the encouraging words and advice in your replies here , texts, PM's, and phone calls. I have a few more things I want to try thanks to your suggestions but my arrows will have fletchings on them.


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## Munkywrench (May 31, 2014)

A little knock high should be fine. Mine were the same and my broadheads, field points and bare shafts all shoot the same minus the knock high


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## Clipper (May 31, 2014)

I will share my experiences tuning carbon shafts in hopes that you may glean something that will be of help to you.  I had the same problem you mentioned about nock height.  I struggled for a couple of months trying to tune without success. I eventually put painters tape on my riser and shelf, chalked it good and discovered that even my bare shafts were bouncing off the outside edge of the shelf.  I had to switch to 3 under to correct that situation (due to a certain peculiarity of my bow) and subsequently was able to successfully tune 3555 shafts by shooting bare and fletched shafts at separate targets until I could see a definite pattern.  This method allows you to cull out the "bad shots".  I found that to get the same impact point for both bare and fletched shafts the bare shaft was hitting moderately nock left.  OL Adcock's instructions for bare shaft tuning explain this procedure in more detail.  My conclusions from a couple of months of tuning are:  1.  Chalk your riser and shelf to see what your arrows are doing 2.  Nock left or right on bare shafts are not reliable indicators of dynamic spine  3.  When bare and fletched shafts shoot "groups" to the same point of impact you are properly tuned.  Good luck and good hunting in Africa.  That has to be a dream come true for every bow hunter.


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## Clipper (May 31, 2014)

I also tried adding weight to the nock end of my shafts and gave up due to inconsistent results.


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## 1gr8bldr (May 31, 2014)

Not sure what poundage your shooting,..... but compared to my set ups, unless your shooting 35 lbs, your waaaay weak


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## 1gr8bldr (May 31, 2014)

My 45lb bow shoots perfect bullet holes with full length 340 spine, alum insert, 150 grain tip. This is to weak for my 50 lb set up. Waay to weak for my 55lb set up. I have to go 28 inches 340 spine, brass insert, 125 grain tips.


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## 1gr8bldr (May 31, 2014)

I have a shoot test set that I put together. 6  32 inch arrows of 600, 500, 400 and 340. One of each spine that is left bare shaft. I have this same set with the exception of the 340 in the traditional also [heavier shafts]. I got tired of wondering if I were shooting the correct shafts. LOL, I also have the complete set cut at 29 inches. So, with this, It does not take much to see which arrow performs best


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## 1gr8bldr (May 31, 2014)

Some bows are tillered so that to get a perfect bullet hole you wood have to go as much or more than 5/8 nock high. I found that in this situation even a perfect bullet hole would not allow good fletch clearence. Frustrating. You could put a piece of paper under the limb bolt to change the tiller. I'm going ILF from now on. I can adjust to wherever I need, adjusting the tiller to shoot bullet holes at 1/16 nock high . I'm working opposite of most, rather than move the nock, I set where I want and adjust the tiller


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## ddauler (Jun 2, 2014)

If my arrow will shoot field point and broadhead straight with feathers both impacting same spot I'm done! I used to bare shaft way to fussy for this old guy!


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## dm/wolfskin (Jun 2, 2014)

I never did get the bare shaft thing down. I'm lucky that I shoot the same arrows out of all my bows. From 42# to 53# bows. I mainly use full length GT 3555 and GT 1535.


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