# Long tracking job because of Powerbelt?



## bublewis (Oct 6, 2010)

This past weekend, I shot a deer with a 50cal, 295gr aerotip powerbelt bullet with 2X50gr 777 pellets.  The shot was at aprox. 105yds.  The deer was slightly quartering away.  I actually heard the bullet impact, so I knew that I had hit it.  When I reached the spot where the deer was standing, I immediately found blood splattered on the ground, so I was optimistic about finding the deer.  But that would prove to be more blood than all the rest of the blood I found on the entire track.  The area in which I shot the deer has been recently thinned, and where the ground is not littered with debris, it is hard packed from the equipment running over it and the sun baking it.  After two skeptical hours of tracking, finding only occasional specks of blood and a few tracks, when the deer crossed strips of soft ground or leaves, I decided that I had lost any sign of a trail.  I began walking the cut rows of pines that run perpendicular to the general path the deer had taken, looking for the deer in the thick uncut strips.  After traveling about 50 yds. in the second row, I saw the deer laying dead; it was over 300 yds. from where I had shot it.  I think this was the furthest I've ever had a deer travel that I recovered.  The entry hole was near the back of the rib cage and the exit wound was about 4 inches behind the off shoulder.  The exit wound appeared to be aprox. 1/2" in diameter, and the wound channel was about mid height on the body.  The deer had foamy blood all around its nostrils.  The bullet clipped the front edge of the paunch, went through the liver and the offside lung.  

I know that a deer can travel some distance with one lung, but I don't understand why a blood trail was almost non-existent.  Also, I was surprised that from the internal damage sign and exit wound, it appeared that the bullet didn't expand much, if any.  I've shot several deer before with the powerbelt hollow points w/o the plastic aerotip, and they seemed to have major expansion and the deer all dropped within sight.  However, they were all at closer ranges.  Does the aerotip limit expansion that much, or is this simply a case of hitting a deer too far back?  Is this about the best results I can hope for with a deer shot where this one was?


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## Milkman (Oct 6, 2010)

I have shot several with my 50 caliber ML using different loads with results similar to what you describe.  The last deer i shot was a shot similar to the one you described and it too went over 300 yards. 

I have hunted with my ML since Ga started the special season for them, but have never been impressed with how they work for killing a deer.  I have lost some that I never found due to lack of blood trail.


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## Flintrock (Oct 6, 2010)

That load has over 1100 ft /lbs of energy at 100 yards so I think it has more to do with shot placement/point of impact /bullet accuracy.
.
I am using 80 fff and only a 138 grain prb and have not had any problems with killing a deer


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## bacon6 (Oct 6, 2010)

I've taken several deer w/ powerdelts had simular problems, was lucky enough to recover a bullet that lodged in the far side shoulder it had very little expansion, switched to Knight Red Hots and never had another problem, lucky maybe but!!!!


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## donald-f (Oct 6, 2010)

I have never had a problem with the 290gr powerbelt. Shot placement I think was your problem. If shot is too far back you will not get the boodtrail you get when you take out the lungs.


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## FireHunter174 (Oct 7, 2010)

That's weird

I shoot the same exact load/bullet and was presented with the same shot last week.  Except mine was only 50 yd.

Actually, it was a pretty extreme angle.  Shot behind the ribcage and ended up under the skin about 2" behind the opposite shoulder.  Although it didn't go all the way through, it mushroomed and did some major damage inside.  She only ran about 30 yds and left a lot of blood on the ground.

I've used powerbelt hollow points until this year and have noticed a lack of blood to trail, but never had to look far for them.


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## dgilles (Oct 7, 2010)

I shoot a 240 grain powerbelt Aerotip and have never had any problems with recovering the deer, usually drt.


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## FrontierGander (Oct 7, 2010)

long tracking job due to shot placement IMO.

The bullet exited and left you 2 holes.  Why didnt it bleed? Maybe the shot was up high, who knows.

I know one deer we shot a few years ago, the bullets force actually pulled the stomach deep into the chest cavity and part of the stomach came out of the entrance hole.


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## RipperIII (Oct 7, 2010)

My only two experiences with powerbelts are thus....
1) killed nice buck at about 80 yds, entered just behind the elbow, did not exit, buck ran 30 yds up hill dropped,...thick, wide "red carpet" blood trail
2)killed small doe at about 70 yds, hit high shoulder, clean pass through, drt.
No problems so far.
I shoot 275gr platinum aerotip with 2ea. pellets of 777 and winchester 209 primers.


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## bublewis (Oct 8, 2010)

FrontierGander said:


> long tracking job due to shot placement IMO.
> 
> The bullet exited and left you 2 holes.  Why didnt it bleed? Maybe the shot was up high, who knows.
> 
> I know one deer we shot a few years ago, the bullets force actually pulled the stomach deep into the chest cavity and part of the stomach came out of the entrance hole.



There was no stomach/intestines plugging the holes on this one.  The entrance and exit wounds were pretty much the same size and were open when I found the deer dead.  The shot wasn't what I'd call high, either.  Entrance was about midways up and I was shooting at a slightly downward angle from a treestand.  However, it was back some, and could've stood to be @ 2" foward poi.


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## Jimmyp (Oct 8, 2010)

donald-f said:


> I have never had a problem with the 290gr powerbelt. Shot placement I think was your problem. If shot is too far back you will not get the boodtrail you get when you take out the lungs.



if it has one lung left and an intact heart it can go a long way, it was just how you hit it.


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## miles58 (Oct 8, 2010)

I guess I am not too surprised at your result.  A 300 grain bullet isn't going to have any extra velocity at that range.  That makes for less wound channel .  A hit a little on the marginal side makes for less critical damage as well.

I have seen enough deer hit with 30-06 180s or 220s that made it comparable distance or even further.  I wouldn't blame the power belts.  I might however, move down to a 250 grain bullet or maybe a little less yet.

Dave


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## gtparts (Oct 8, 2010)

miles58 said:


> I guess I am not too surprised at your result.  A 300 grain bullet isn't going to have any extra velocity at that range.  That makes for less wound channel .  A hit a little on the marginal side makes for less critical damage as well.
> 
> I have seen enough deer hit with 30-06 180s or 220s that made it comparable distance or even further.  I wouldn't blame the power belts.  I might however, move down to a 250 grain bullet or maybe a little less yet.
> 
> Dave



I agree. At that distance, a 300 gr. would be essentially "coasting" to a stop compared to half that distance. If it didn't strike bone, there wouldn't be enough impact from soft tissue to expand properly. The combination of poor terminal ballistics and less than optimal shot placement can result in a long stroll. Just my .02 cents.


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## formula1 (Oct 8, 2010)

*Re:*

I have heard others say things like this about powerbelts, therefore I chose not to use them.  I'm glad you recovered the deer so we could get a first hand account.

Sounds like to me your shot was good enough.  One thing I noticed that you did not say is how long after you shot you took up the track. If the shot was marginal and you took up the track too quickly, you could have pushed the deer that far.  Just a thought!

I use a 300 grain Nosler Partition with BH209.  So far it's been an excellent combo out to 180 yards.  All but one deer fell on impact and that one only ran about 10 yds.  Though your PowerBelt was effective in the end,  I am confident that given the same hit I probably would have gotten better expansion and better results, but I will admit that I don't know this absolutely.  But if you have lost confidence in your bullet, I'd suggest trying another.


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## JWarren (Oct 8, 2010)

Y'all keep talking about lack of expansion, a .50 bullet should kill simply by passing through even with no expansion.....  .44mag and .45lc cast bullets kill untold numbers of deer and they do not expand.


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## FrontierGander (Oct 8, 2010)

Round ball as well


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## Dead Eye Eddy (Oct 8, 2010)

I've shot 4 deer with 295 grain copper HP Powerbelts.  Two were DRT.  One ran about 50 yards and left a super blood trail.  The other, I swear I hit it, but I never found a drop of blood or a piece of hair to prove it.


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## PWalls (Oct 8, 2010)

I use the Aerotips now instead of the Hollow Points. I get a more consistent pass through with the Aerotips. Well, I had to track two deer with the Hollow Points. Haven't had to track one yet with the Aerotips. I just got some of those Platinum Aerotips and going to give them a try.


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## 7Mag Hunter (Oct 8, 2010)

Flintrock said:


> That load has over 1100 ft /lbs of energy at 100 yards so I think it has more to do with shot placement/point of impact /bullet accuracy.
> .
> I am using 80 fff and only a 138 grain prb and have not had any problems with killing a deer




Shot placement, not bullet.....High lung shots are deadly,
but the lungs have to fill up before the deer will die....
I shot a 10pt, (both lungs) a bit too high...Deer ran 50yds
and left very little blood...Best thing to do is back off and
let the deer lay down and die...


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## bublewis (Oct 8, 2010)

JWarren said:


> Y'all keep talking about lack of expansion, a .50 bullet should kill simply by passing through even with no expansion.....  .44mag and .45lc cast bullets kill untold numbers of deer and they do not expand.



Cast bullets in handguns will kill well, but most of them used for hunting have a flat meplat, not a round nose, semi-spitzer or spitzer.  If a 50cal. bullet with a pointed profile passes through without expanding, it will transfer little of the bullets energy and leave a holes same or smaller than actual caliber.


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## Bodycamp13 (Oct 8, 2010)

*Powerskirts*

I've seen three deer hit with them that were unfound.  I know the guy who shot them and he is a good shot and handloads centerfire and shoots a number of deer every year.  He claims to have gotten excellent shots and the deer just ran forever.  We hunt a lot of cutovers and trailing is extremely difficult.  

I have seen him kill deer with them but the number of unexplained lost deer have steered me away. 

You positively WILL NOT have the same problem with Barnes bullets.  They will shoot more accurately if you find the right load.  Either the Expander MZ or Spitfire line won't let you down.

I'm sold on Barnes.  I am trying a pack of Hornady FPB's the next time I go out for the heck of it.  I killed a doe at 198 yards with a Hornady SST and had great expansion and blood trail.  The deer went about 30 yards with a great blood trail.

Good luck!


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## bublewis (Oct 8, 2010)

Dead Eye Eddy said:


> I've shot 4 deer with 295 grain copper HP Powerbelts.  Two were DRT.  One ran about 50 yards and left a super blood trail.  The other, I swear I hit it, but I never found a drop of blood or a piece of hair to prove it.



I've had similar results to yours with the 295 copper hp, but this was the first deer I shot with the aerotip.  I don't know if the aerotip limits expansion or it was the longer shot, but the internal damage and exit wound were a lot less than with the copper hp's, I've used.


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## bublewis (Oct 8, 2010)

I went to the powerbelt website and found recommended loadings.  Here they are:  http://www.bpishopping.com/skin/frontend/default/powerbeltbullets2010/docs/PBB_Game_Loads_Guide.pdf

There must be something to the aerotips not expanding as much because they don't recommend using them in 295gr. on a deer less than 150lbs, so maybe I need to try the lighter weights or go back to the hp's.


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## CamoCop (Oct 9, 2010)

i've had bad issues with PB over expanding.  i guess i'm just pushing them too fast.  i stay with them because of their accuracy.  even though they seem to over expand/fragment on impact, i have never had to track a deer over 40 yards.


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## Ronbow (Oct 9, 2010)

*245 gr PB  is the way to go never had a prob with them, Ive shot them through the the heart and had them run 200 yds before not un common. Glad you found the deer.*


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## Bruz (Oct 9, 2010)

The problem I've see with Centerfire and ML shots over the years has more to do with level than angle. IF the entry and exit are roughly the same height your blood trail is going to be harder to follow....if those are higher in the body cavity the deer will travel farther as the body must fill up with blood before the deer bleeds out and expires.  

This is why I try to shoot at a downward angle when possible and use Barnes bullets for ALL OF MY RIFLES. 

Bruz


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## LEON MANLEY (Oct 9, 2010)

FrontierGander said:


> long tracking job due to shot placement IMO.
> 
> The bullet exited and left you 2 holes.  Why didnt it bleed? Maybe the shot was up high, who knows.
> 
> I know one deer we shot a few years ago, the bullets force actually pulled the stomach deep into the chest cavity and part of the stomach came out of the entrance hole.



All tracking jobs are due to shot placement.


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## Bowyer29 (Oct 9, 2010)

bublewis said:


> Cast bullets in handguns will kill well, but most of them used for hunting have a flat meplat, not a round nose, semi-spitzer or spitzer.  If a 50cal. bullet with a pointed profile passes through without expanding, it will transfer little of the bullets energy and leave a holes same or smaller than actual caliber.


It is an impossibility of physics to leave a hole smaller than the bullet. That said, the hole will close back up some sometimes, tissue moves around. Hollowpoint PB's are suspect on less than perfect shots if I am being honest. That being said, I still use them, they do kill.


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## rutandstrut (Oct 9, 2010)

Flintrock said:


> That load has over 1100 ft /lbs of energy at 100 yards so I think it has more to do with shot placement/point of impact /bullet accuracy.
> .
> I am using 80 fff and only a 138 grain prb and have not had any problems with killing a deer



I agree! The shot was too far back and the exit Hole was Higher than it would have been with a well placed shot! The fact that you hit the Paunch and the High Exit Hole explain why there was very littel Blood trail after the initial Blood you found! I have shot Power Belt Bulltets (260Gr Bullet with 150 Grains of Pyroodex) exclusively for the last 4 or 5 years. They are Devasting on both Deer and Hogs with a Well Placed shot! Usually don't go out of sight!


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## Fishin & Hunting (Oct 9, 2010)

Have shot five deer with 295 grain powerbelt hollow points.  One did run for a while before it went down.  Almost got thirty yards before it fell.

Shot placement.


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## THREEJAYS (Oct 9, 2010)

i use the 245 PBelt and have taken 6 with them.4 dropped 2 ran.The longest was about 70 yds.I like them.I use the 777 powder,100 grs.


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## bublewis (Oct 9, 2010)

Bowyer29 said:


> It is an impossibility of physics to leave a hole smaller than the bullet. That said, the hole will close back up some sometimes, tissue moves around. Hollowpoint PB's are suspect on less than perfect shots if I am being honest. That being said, I still use them, they do kill.



So you're saying that it is impossible for a bullet to leave a hole smaller than its full diameter, but in the next sentence you say that it will close back up sometimes.  I agree with your second statement - the hole will close back up sometimes.  Because a deer's hide is elastic, a pointed bullet can slip through, and the hide will rebound, leaving a hole smaller than the bullet.  This also is the case when babies are born, except a baby is larger than most bullets.


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## stevetarget (Oct 10, 2010)

shot placement problem, deer have a will to live that is un matched by any other animal I have seen. 
I commend you for not giving up looking for the deer and glad you found it. Some folks would have went home. Good job on the recovery.


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## mtstephens18 (Mar 6, 2011)

i have had some similar problems with powerbelt.   most deer drop in their tracks.... but hardly ever bleed!!!  if one does run, it usually is pretty hard to find


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## watermedic (Mar 7, 2011)

Worthless thread!! If you punch a .50 cal hole through an animal and it doesn't bleed, it is definitely shot placement!!


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## mtstephens18 (Mar 7, 2011)

i have shot deer that you couldnt walk up to it and draw a bullseye on it any better..... and be dead before it hit the ground.    but not bleed a drop   thanks though


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## smessler34 (Mar 7, 2011)

i hear alot about jacketed bullets..good and bad...im here to tell ya , ive been shootin an all lead bullet from knight . its there low end 250 grn .45cal sabot for my .50 cal disc rifle. ive been shooting them over ten years now and man im tellin ya they perform. ive killed em out to 160 yrds . ive taken 12 deer and 4 hogs . and have not lost one yet. i only shoot 100 grns of pyrodex so jacketed bullets just didnt perform like i thought they should.


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## benosmose (Mar 22, 2011)

I made the dumb move of thinking that an powerbelt or the hornady sabots in 250 grain where expanding to much i shoot them in front of 61 grains of smokeless powder they killed great just rarely passed through so i got my self some barnes pistol bullets triple shock all copper they shot great at paper then i wounded a 9 point opening day and it took me a half a mile and our bluetick to find him it made a tiny hole no blood and he was hit great through both lungs i will stick to soft bullets let them do the damage they cant go far


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## grouper throat (Apr 12, 2011)

I shot the PB bullets also and killed 4-5 bucks with them. I noticed most didn't run out of my sight but most didn't leave a decent blood trail either. They expanded correctly at short distances, but I never got a pass through when hitting shoulder bone (even at 30 yds w/ 100&150 grains). I decided it was time for a change then...

I switched to the Hornady SSTs that most of my family and buddies were shooting and I love them. I've killed 5-6 bucks with them and they're much, much better IMO.


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