# Nephilim



## SarahFair (Nov 3, 2009)

Anyone ever heard of them?
Can you explain them to me?


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## Lowjack (Nov 3, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Anyone ever heard of them?
> Can you explain them to me?



 "Nephilim"Hebrew Word for Great Stature ( Giants), Used in Genesis Chapter 6 and the book of Enoch Chapter 1 to described a race of half Angels and half Human, When Satan came with the Ultimate plan to eliminate any possibility of a pure Human race, which would have contaminated the gene pool thus a Human Messiah would not have being born.

God's solution was to destroy the earth by flood , killing those who had sinned by allowing such a mixture on earth and saving only 8 people and animals by the building of gigantic ark.

It is too long of a subject for me to get into today.


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## SarahFair (Nov 3, 2009)

So what happend to the Nephilim? Are these giants they are finding part of nephilim race?


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## ddd-shooter (Nov 3, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Are these giants they are finding part of nephilim race?



Source?


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## Lowjack (Nov 3, 2009)

The Nephilim are mentioned in The Bible even when Yohoshua Led the Israelites into Canaan after Moses died, Then you find it also in the Story of David and Goliath and later Another Giant(Goliath Was also Slayed) It is possible that Gene Pool exists today, But that would be a very difficult Genetic Study.


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## pigpen1 (Nov 3, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> The Nephilim are mentioned in The Bible even when Yohoshua Led the Israelites into Canaan after Moses died, Then you find it also in the Story of David and Goliath and later Another Giant(Goliath Was also Slayed) It is possible that Gene Pool exists today, But that would be a very difficult Genetic Study.



 You must not watch WWE Wrestling or you would know they still exsist....his name is Big Show...


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## SarahFair (Nov 3, 2009)

Seems back during time everything was big at one point or another.
Ex. Todays dragon fly has a wing spand of 4 inches vs fossils found of 30 inches 
Ex. Mammoth vs Elephants


Why are things getting smaller?


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## tell sackett (Nov 3, 2009)

Uh, no, the nephelim were not half angel and half human.


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## Lowjack (Nov 3, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> Uh, no, the nephelim were not half angel and half human.


Depends on your English Understanding of Angel.


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## Inthegarge (Nov 3, 2009)

Sackett your right. Scripture makes it clear that spirit beings could not have physical relations with women. If they could Satan would have his way with humanity by now. This old wife's tale has been passed down for quite a few years. Any one with any sense can see how illogical it is.....RW


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## tell sackett (Nov 3, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> Depends on your English Understanding of Angel.


???


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## SarahFair (Nov 4, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> ???



I think what he means is the word Nephilim translates into different things in different languages..

What do you think they are Tell Sackett?


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## No. GA. Mt. Man (Nov 4, 2009)

I thought it was a brand of Cold Medicine.


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## mtnwoman (Nov 4, 2009)

Inthegarge said:


> Sackett your right. Scripture makes it clear that spirit beings could not have physical relations with women. If they could Satan would have his way with humanity by now. This old wife's tale has been passed down for quite a few years. Any one with any sense can see how illogical it is.....RW



What scripture? I'd be interested in reading that.

This is what I found.

Genesis 6:2
That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
Genesis 6:1-3 (in Context) Genesis 6 (Whole Chapter) 
Genesis 6:4
There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Genesis 6:3-5 (in Context) Genesis 6 (Whole Chapter)

and this

Luke 1:35
And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Luke 1:34-36 (in Context) Luke 1 (Whole Chapter)


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## RT51 (Nov 4, 2009)

One person on the internet that discussess this alot is Steve Quayle @ stevequayle.com.


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## tell sackett (Nov 4, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> I think what he means is the word Nephilim translates into different things in different languages..
> 
> What do you think they are Tell Sackett?


From what I understand in Gen.6:2, the sons of God refers to the line of Seth and the daughters of man refers to the line of Cain.

The word translated as giant(or nephelim) in 6:4 means bully or tyrant according to Strong's, not necessarily a very large person.


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## rjcruiser (Nov 4, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Seems back during time everything was big at one point or another.
> Ex. Todays dragon fly has a wing spand of 4 inches vs fossils found of 30 inches
> Ex. Mammoth vs Elephants
> 
> ...



I don't think you can point to two species and then make a generalization like that.

What about life expectancy?  Was super high back in Genesis, then super low in the middle ages..and now it is inching it's way back up.

Be careful when you read books/watch movies that are historical fiction.  They can really mess with you and your view of reality.


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## SarahFair (Nov 4, 2009)

Ok so is the line of Cain man and woman?
What is the line of Seth?


So the Nephilin are from the line of seth?
And they were bullies that took what ever woman they wanted and made some kind of new human?


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## rjcruiser (Nov 4, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Ok so is the line of Cain man and woman?
> What is the line of Seth?
> 
> 
> ...



Seth was Cain and Abel's younger brother.

Line of means descendents.  So...Line of Cain would have been kids/grandkids of Cain.  Line of Seth would've been kids/grandkids of Seth.  They would've been cousin's


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## SarahFair (Nov 4, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> From what I understand in Gen.6:2, the sons of God refers to the line of Seth and the daughters of man refers to the line of Cain.
> 
> The word translated as giant(or nephelim) in 6:4 means bully or tyrant according to Strong's, not necessarily a very large person.





Why is the Line of Seth refered to as the Sons of God??


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## pnome (Nov 4, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Anyone ever heard of them?
> Can you explain them to me?




Yes.
They are creatures of myth.  Like Odysseus's Cyclops.


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## TonyE (Nov 4, 2009)

*You might find this very interesting!*



SarahFair said:


> Anyone ever heard of them?
> Can you explain them to me?



http://calvaryadvisor.org/9.html


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## pnome (Nov 4, 2009)

TonyE said:


> http://calvaryadvisor.org/9.html


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## Jeffriesw (Nov 4, 2009)

TonyE said:


> http://calvaryadvisor.org/9.html





pnome said:


>



yes, quite the read ain't it?


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## Lowjack (Nov 4, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> ???



Angel = Malak or Messenger , the title does not always Imply Spirit beings.
Paul says to be "hospitable because many had entertained angels in tehir house with them Knowing"
Jude 1 says.
5 Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus, who saved [3] a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe. 6 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day—
7-Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
8 Yet in like manner these people also, relying on their dreams, defile the flesh, reject authority, and blaspheme the glorious ones.
Remember the two angels that went to rescue Lot yet the men wanted to have sex with them ?
So the word malak doesn't always imply spirits but apparently there are angels( Fallen and Heavenly) who look just like us .
We shouldn't put everything in the Bible in Boxes.


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## rjcruiser (Nov 4, 2009)

pnome said:


> Yes.
> They are creatures of myth.  Like Odysseus's Cyclops.



Stay out of this.  To you, the whole Bible is a mythical tale.


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## pnome (Nov 4, 2009)

rjcruiser said:


> Stay out of this.  To you, the whole Bible is a mythical tale.



LOL  

Not the WHOLE Bible.


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## dawg2 (Nov 4, 2009)

Swamp Runner said:


> yes, quite the read ain't it?



yep


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## Lowjack (Nov 4, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> From what I understand in Gen.6:2, the sons of God refers to the line of Seth and the daughters of man refers to the line of Cain.
> 
> The word translated as giant(or nephelim) in 6:4 means bully or tyrant according to Strong's, not necessarily a very large person.


Why would the sons of seth mixed with other women and the offspring be Giants ?
Jews are the line of seth and most are 5'8" on the average, there some in the 6-6:3 such as myself but not very common, The giants were the enemies of Israel.

Job chapter 1 describes the sons of God as coming to render Worship and report to God  of their whereabouts and what they were doing among them came haSatan.
If you read Genesis 6 the word Took means literally Kidnapped , not that they took wives but actually kidnapped the women nd had children with them, Enoch describes this being as Children from the Stars.


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## earl (Nov 4, 2009)

Well adding UFO's to the bible certainly makes it easier to take for me.


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## BANDERSNATCH (Nov 4, 2009)

The phrase "sons of God" is used about 4 times in the old testament, and every other time it refers to angels....no way it could refer to Seth's offspring.   

Obviously there were giants of old, as David killed one, and Jonathan is said to have killed one of Goliath's sons I believe.   

No reason to make Genesis' use of 'giants' to mean anything less....

Bandy


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

Ok so nephilim are giants that had offspring with regular sized people?
I got the impression that God sent down some kind of holy type thing that werent these HUGE people but they were larger than the average person. 
When I googled images of the Nephilim this is pretty much what I imagined.









I havent gotten a chance to read the link yet. I plan to after I get my son off to school.


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

Ok so I read the link.
From what I gather the Nephilim were angels that got "greedy" at the site of a human woman. They left the heavens to have sexual encounters with these women. Once they left the heavens they became the 'fallen' and turned to the devils side of things.
When thes 'fallen' had encounters with women the women bore superhumans (aka giants) that were nasty hearted things. 

And then Im thinking that the devil used these 'fallen' to pollute the human race with the exception of Noahs family (who was from the line of Seth??). 
So then I wonder... 
Are we all related to Noah?


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## rjcruiser (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> So then I wonder...
> Are we all related to Noah?



Yes....all are related to Adam and Eve.  And then when the human race was wiped out by the flood, the only survivors were Noah and his 3 sons and their wives.

It was from these 3 sons that the 3 people groups of the world come from...most well known...semitic or semites come from Shem.  Jews are Semites and that is why when someone is Anti-Israel/Anti-Jew, they are anti-semitic.

oh...and btw, I'd be careful of images googled.  Again, the internet is a good way of getting information, but there is a lot of false information on the web.


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## tell sackett (Nov 5, 2009)

BANDERSNATCH said:


> The phrase "sons of God" is used about 4 times in the old testament, and every other time it refers to angels....no way it could refer to Seth's offspring.
> 
> Obviously there were giants of old, as David killed one, and Jonathan is said to have killed one of Goliath's sons I believe.
> 
> ...


Sorry Bandy, I have to disagree with you about the sons of God in the O.T. Read Is. 43:6.

Yes, there were giants in the Old Testament, but if you look up the word in Strong's concordance, there are different words used. The one in Gen.6:2 is not the same one used to describe Goliath.


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

rjcruiser said:


> Yes....all are related to Adam and Eve.  And then when the human race was wiped out by the flood, the only survivors were Noah and his 3 sons and their wives.
> 
> It was from these 3 sons that the 3 people groups of the world come from...most well known...semitic or semites come from Shem.  Jews are Semites and that is why when someone is Anti-Israel/Anti-Jew, they are anti-semitic.
> 
> oh...and btw, I'd be careful of images googled.  Again, the internet is a good way of getting information, but there is a lot of false information on the web.



Quite right my friend. That is why I have come here to get many opinions


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## tell sackett (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Ok so I read the link.
> From what I gather the Nephilim were angels that got "greedy" at the site of a human woman. They left the heavens to have sexual encounters with these women. Once they left the heavens they became the 'fallen' and turned to the devils side of things.
> When thes 'fallen' had encounters with women the women bore superhumans (aka giants) that were nasty hearted things.
> 
> ...


RJ got it right in his post, but I just wanted to add(again) the angels did not have sexual relations with humans. Jesus clearly taught that angels are not sexual beings in Matt.22:23-33.


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## tell sackett (Nov 5, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> Angel = Malak or Messenger , the title does not always Imply Spirit beings.
> Paul says to be "hospitable because many had entertained angels in tehir house with them Knowing"
> Jude 1 says.
> 5 Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus, who saved [3] a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe. 6 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day—
> ...


Jude 7 is refering to the people of Sodom and Gomorrah, not the angels.

Yes, at times God sends angels in the form and apperance of men to do His work, but they are not men.


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## Lowjack (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Ok so nephilim are giants that had offspring with regular sized people?
> I got the impression that God sent down some kind of holy type thing that werent these HUGE people but they were larger than the average person.
> When I googled images of the Nephilim this is pretty much what I imagined.
> 
> ...



No, Nephilim were the product of that prohibited match ,between fallen sons of God and women.
The Ones that had the relation with women were called Ben Elohim or in modern ha ba'r Elohim.


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> RJ got it right in his post, but I just wanted to add(again) the angels did not have sexual relations with humans. Jesus clearly taught that angels are not sexual beings in Matt.22:23-33.



Ok not angels but the 'fallen' was some kind of worker under God? A higher being than human but not as high as Angels?


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> No, Nephilim were the product of that prohibited match ,between fallen sons of God and women.
> The Ones that had the relation with women were called Ben Elohim or in modern ha ba'r Elohim.




So how many Nephilim were produced with these prohibited matches?
and if the Ben Elohim were not Angels what were they?


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## Lowjack (Nov 5, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> Jude 7 is refering to the people of Sodom and Gomorrah, not the angels.
> 
> Yes, at times God sends angels in the form and apperance of men to do His work, but they are not men.


Jude not only speaks of The people who die in Sodom and Gomorrah but of the fallen stage of Angels who left their habitat and the people who died in Sodom and Gomorrah died for going after the "STRANGE FLESH"the word Strange translated from te Hebrew means other than human Flesh.
Read what paul says about the different flesh.

If you want to believe that all angels are spiritual then go ahead you are 50% correct.
If you want to believe that there are not other beings in the Universe go ahead, but explain why does Revelation says Satan dragged down 1/3 of the Stars with him ???

Again I repeat many Christians put the Bible in a box that they can understand and sometimes even put God in a box and say , yes he can do this but no he can't do that "
So did we create God or did he created us, Strong's Dictionary although a good source , is not accurate in many things as a Hebrew Speaker would understand it, when reading such passages.
See you all ,heading for the farm in Jefferson Co. to Hunt, Shalom


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## rjcruiser (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Quite right my friend. That is why I have come here to get many opinions



Touche


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> Jude not only speaks of The people who die in Sodom and Gomorrah but of the fallen stage of Angels who left their habitat and the people who died in Sodom and Gomorrah died for going after the "STRANGE FLESH"the word Strange translated from te Hebrew means other than human Flesh.
> Read what paul says about the different flesh.
> 
> If you want to believe that all angels are spiritual then go ahead you are 50% correct.
> ...



If angels are not spiritual what are they?


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## pnome (Nov 5, 2009)

So Sarah,  do you believe it?


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

pnome said:


> So Sarah,  do you believe it?



Believe what exactly?


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## dawg2 (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Believe what exactly?



In Atheists?


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## tell sackett (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Ok not angels but the 'fallen' was some kind of worker under God? A higher being than human but not as high as Angels?


No, they weren't higher beings, just the descendants of Seth and Cain(post16). They are described as mighty men in vs.4,but they weren't some super race of giants.


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## tell sackett (Nov 5, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> Jude not only speaks of The people who die in Sodom and Gomorrah but of the fallen stage of Angels who left their habitat and the people who died in Sodom and Gomorrah died for going after the "STRANGE FLESH"the word Strange translated from te Hebrew means other than human Flesh.
> Read what paul says about the different flesh.
> 
> If you want to believe that all angels are spiritual then go ahead you are 50% correct.
> ...


Jude is giving three different examples of apostacy in vs.5-7: the Israelites(vs.5),the angels(vs6), and Sodom and Gomorrah.

Where do I say that all angels are spiritual? Brother,you or I neither one know what all the angels are like, but as far as that goes we are spiritual beings(created in the image of God). No one has said that Satan didn't  drag down  1/3 of the stars from Heaven or that there aren't other beings in the universe.

You are accusing me of putting God in a box, but then you state that because most jews are only 5'8", that is some argument that the lines of Seth and Cain(which btw were hundreds of years before the establishment of the Jewish race) could not have been giants. Sounds kind of like putting God in a box to me.

Finally, yes it is much to my shame that I have only the word of God along with concordances and commentaries to help me in my understanding.


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## pnome (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Believe what exactly?



That these giant demi-angels, or whatever, actually existed and walked this Earth.


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## rjcruiser (Nov 5, 2009)

pnome said:


> That these giant demi-angels, or whatever, actually existed and walked this Earth.



Would you believe if I gave you a modern day example of a giant?


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## pnome (Nov 5, 2009)

rjcruiser said:


> Would you believe if I gave you a modern day example of a giant?



That was the offspring of a human and an angel?


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## rjcruiser (Nov 5, 2009)

pnome said:


> That was the offspring of a human and an angel?



No...just a giant.  I thought you asked if Sarah believed in Giants.

LJ is the one saying that they are half-breeds.


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## pnome (Nov 5, 2009)

rjcruiser said:


> No...just a giant.  I thought you asked if Sarah believed in Giants.
> 
> LJ is the one saying that they are half-breeds.









Looks like at least one escaped the flood.


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## Jeffriesw (Nov 5, 2009)

pnome said:


> Looks like at least one escaped the flood.



He is a big ol' rascal ain't he ?


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## rjcruiser (Nov 5, 2009)

I was thinking more along the lines of Andre.



Hmm...maybe LJ was right about this kidnapping of women


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## SarahFair (Nov 5, 2009)

Welllllllll I dont know about them being half angel half human..

But what about all these giant skeletons that have been found all over the world? 







> A. Present day modern man which averages about 6-feet tall + or - several inches or more
> B. 15-foot human skeleton found in southeast Turkey in late 1950's in the Euphrates valley during road construction. Many tombs containing giants were uncovered here.
> C. Maximinus Thrax Ceaser of Rome 235-238 A.D. This was an 8' 6" skeleton.
> D. Goliath was about 9 feet + or - a few inches. I Samuel 17:4 late 11th century
> ...






Could it just have been a mutation caused from inbreeding or something else?

I cant imagine there were too many people to choose whom to have children with back then..


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## rjcruiser (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Could it just have been a mutation caused from inbreeding or something else?
> 
> I cant imagine there were too many people to choose whom to have children with back then..



Who knows...but really, the amount of children and people to choose from would have been a great number.

Remember, no birth control back then.  Longer life spans.  No woman's Lib group.  Really, think about a bunch of Duggars running around having 10-15 kids each.

Within several generations, you've got multitudes of people.

15x15 is 225.

15x15x15 is 3,375

15x15x15 is 50,625

So, if everyone avgs 15 kids, by the 3rd generation, you have over 50,000 people.


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## gtparts (Nov 5, 2009)

rjcruiser said:


> Who knows...but really, the amount of children and people to choose from would have been a great number.
> 
> Remember, no birth control back then.  Longer life spans.  No woman's Lib group.  Really, think about a bunch of Duggars running around having 10-15 kids each.
> 
> ...



Sounds like the NBA and enough to fill  any NBA venue.

Jumping jeepers , Batman!!!


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## Lowjack (Nov 5, 2009)

http://www.letusreason.org/Doct11.htm


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## ambush80 (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Welllllllll I dont know about them being half angel half human..
> 
> But what about all these giant skeletons that have been found all over the world?
> 
> ...



There are no 36 foot tall human remains.  

Animals are limited to their size by gravity.  Bone is bone and muscle is muscle. no matter what the creature it's in. it has basically the same limitations.  Bones have certain limits on how much weight they can support and how much muscle the ligaments can support, heart muscles are limited on how much blood they can pump etc.  

Whales can get so big because they live in the water where they are buoyed.  If they are on land they die; crushed by their own weight.

It has been speculated that Medieval people would sometimes find dinosaur fossils and attribute them to dragons.  Perhaps the Greeks may have found some some mastodon skulls and thought they were Cyclops.  If you look at a mastodon skull it has a great big hole in the forehead that might look like an eye socket to a primitive.  Do you think that is possible?

That's one of the potential problems with relying on ancient texts.  They didn't know any better.  Do you think that people during Biblical times had any idea of how old a rock might be?  How could they?   Do you think many people during that time understood the concept of a million years much less a billion?  I still have trouble wrapping my head around that kind of a number.


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## SneekEE (Nov 5, 2009)

Appendixe 23 of The Companion Bible of Dr. EW Bullinger 


"THE SONS OF GOD" IN GEN. 6:2, 4.



It is only by the Divine specific act of creation that any created being can be called "a son of God".  For that which is "born of the flesh is flesh".  God is spirit, and that which is "born of the Spirit is spirit" (John 3:6).  Hence Adam is called a "son of God" in Luke 3:38.  Those "in Christ" having "the new nature" which is by the direct creation of God (2Cor. 5:17.  Eph. 2:10) can be, and are called "sons of God" (John 1:13.  Rom. 8:14, 15.  1John 3:1). (*1) 

This is why angels are called "sons of God" in every other place where the expression is used in the Old Testament.  Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7.  Ps. 29:1; 89:6.  Dan. 3:25 (no art.). (*2)  We have no authority or right to take the expression in Gen. 6:2, 4 in any other sense.  Moreover, in Gen. 6:2 the Sept. renders it "angels". Angels are called "spirits" (Ps. 104:4.  Heb. 1:7, 14), for spirits are created by God. 

That there was a fall of the angels is certain from Jude 6. 

The nature of their fall is clearly stated in the same verse.  They left their own oiketerion.  This word occurs only in 2Cor. 5:2 and Jude 6, where it is used of the spiritual (or resurrection) body. 


The nature of their sin is stated to be "in like manner" to that of the subsequent sins of Sodom and Gomorrha, Jude 7. 


The time of their fall is given as having taken place "in the days of Noah" (1Pet. 3:20.  2Pet. 2:7), though there may have been a prior fall which caused the end of "the world that then was" (Gen. 1:1, 2.  2Pet. 3:6). 


For this sin they are "reserved unto judgment", 2Pet. 2:4, and are "in prison", 1Pet. 3:19. 


Their progeny, called Nephilim (translated "giants"), were monsters of iniquity; and, being superhuman in size and character, had to be destroyed (see Ap. 25).  This was the one and only object of the Flood. 


Only Noah and his family had preserved their pedigree pure from Adam (Gen. 6:9, see note).  All the rest had become "corrupt" (shachath) destroyed [as Adamites].  the only remedy was to destroy it (de facto), as it had become destroyed (de jure).  (It is the same word in v. 17 as in vv. 11, 12.)  See further under Ap. 25 on the Nephilim. 
This irruption of fallen angels was Satan's first attempt to prevent the coming of the Seed of the woman foretold in gen. 3:15.  If this could be accomplished, God's Word would have failed, and his own doom would be averted. 

As soon as it was made known that the Seed of the woman was to come through ABRAHAM, there must have been another irruption, as recorded in Gen. 6:4, "and also after that" (i.e. after the days of Noah, more than 500 years after the first irruption).  The aim of the enemy was to occupy Canaan in advance of Abraham, and so to contest its occupation by his seed.  For, when Abraham entered Canaan, we read (Gen. 12:6) "the Canaanite was then (i.e. already) in the land." 

In the same chapter (Gen. 12:10-20) we see Satan's next attempt to interfere with Abraham's seed, and frustrate the purpose of God that it should be in "Isaac".  This attempt was repeated in 20:1-18. 

This great conflict may be seen throughout the Bible, and it forms a great and important subject of Biblical study.  In each case the human instrument had his own personal interest to serve, while Satan had his own great object in view.  Hence God had, in each case, to interfere and avert the evil and the danger, of which his servants and people were wholly ignorant.  The following assaults of the great Enemy stand out prominently :-- 

The destruction of the chosen family by famine, Gen. 50:20. 


The destruction of the male line in Israel, Ex. 1:10, 15, &c.  Cp. Ex. 2:5.  Heb. 11:23. 


The destruction of the whole nation in Pharaoh's pursuit, Ex. 14. 


After David's line was singled out (2Sam. 7), that was the next selected for assault.  Satan's first assault was in the union of Jehoram and Athaliah by Jehoshaphat, notwithstanding 2Chron. 17:1.  Jehoram killed off all his brothers (2Chron. 21:4). 


The Arabians slew all his children, except Ahaziah (2Chron. 21:17; 22:1). 


When Ahaziah died, Athaliah killed "all the seed royal" (2Chron. 22:10).  the babe Joash alone was rescued; and, for six years, the faithfulness of Jehovah's word was at stake (2Chron. 23:3). 


Hezekiah was childless, when a double assault was made by the King of Assyria and the King of Terrors (Isa. 36:1; 38:1).  God's faithfulness was appealed to and relied on (Ps. 136). 


In Captivity, Haman was used to attempt the destruction of the whole nation (Est. 3:6, 12, 13.  Cp. 6:1). 


Joseph's fear was worked on (Matt. 1:18-20).  Notwithstanding the fact that he was "a just man", and kept the Law, he did not wish to have Mary stoned to death (Deut. 24:1); hence Joseph determined to divorce her.  But God intervened :  "Fear not". 


Herod sought the young Child's life (Matt. 2). 


At the Temptation, "Cast Thyself down" was Satan's temptation. 


At Nazareth, again (Luke 4), there was another attempt to cast Him down and destroy Him. 


The two storms on the Lake were other attempts. 


At length the cross was reached, and the sepulcher closed; the watch set; and the stone sealed.  But "God raised Him from the dead."  And now, like another Joash, He is seated and expecting (Heb. 10:12, 13), hidden in the house of God on high; and the members of "the one body" are hidden there "in Him" (Col. 3:1-3), like another Jehoshaba; and going forth to witness of His coming, like another Jehoiada (2Chron. 23:3). 

The irruption of "the fallen angels" ("sons of God") was the first attempt; and was directed against the whole human race. 
When Abraham was called, then he and his seed were attacked. 


When David was enthroned, then the royal line were attacked. 


And when "the Seed of the woman" Himself came, then the storm burst upon Him. 




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


(*1)  The word "offspring" in Acts 17:28 is quite different.  It is genos, which means merely kin or kind, our genus as being originated by God. 
(*2)  In Hos. 1:10, it is not beni-ha-Elohim, as here, but beni-el-chai. 



Appendixe 25 of The Companion Bible of Dr. EW Bullinger 

THE NEPHILIM, OR "GIANTS"
Of GEN. 6, &c.

The progeny of the fallen angels with the daughters of Adam (see notes on Gen. 6, and Ap. 23) are called in Gen. 6, Ne-phil-im, which means fallen ones (from naphal, to fall).  What these beings were can be gathered only from Scripture.  They were evidently great in size, as well as great in wickedness.  They were superhuman, abnormal beings; and their destruction was necessary for the preservation of the human race, and for the faithfulness of Jehovah's Word (Gen. 3:15). 
This was why the Flood was brought "upon the world of the ungodly" (2Pet. 2:5) as prophesied by Enoch (Jude 14). 

But we read of the Nephilim again in Num. 13:33 :  "there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, which come of the Nephilim".  How, it may be asked, could this be, if they were all destroyed in the Flood?  The answer is contained in Gen. 6:4, where we read :  "There were Nephilim in the earth in those days (i.e. in the days of Noah); and also AFTER THAT, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became [the] mighty men (Heb. gibbor, the heroes) which were of old, men of renown" (lit. men of the name, i.e. who got a name and were renowned for their ungodliness). 

So that "after that", i.e. after the Flood, there was a second irruption of these fallen angels, evidently smaller in number and more limited in area, for they were for the most part confined to Canaan, and were in fact known as "the nations of Canaan".  It was for the destruction of these, that the sword of Israel was necessary, as the Flood had been before. 

As to the date of this second irruption, it was evidently soon after it became known that the seed was to come through Abraham; for, when he came out from Haran (Gen. 12:6) and entered Canaan, the significant fact is stated :  "The Canaanite was then (i.e. already) in the land."  And in Gen. 14:5 they were already known as "Raphain" and Emim", and had established themselves at Asteroth Karnaim and Shaven Kiriathaim. 

In ch. 15:18-21 they are enumerated and named among Canaanite Peoples :  "Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites, and the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims, and the Amorites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites" (Gen. 15:19-21; cp. Ex. 3:8, 17; 23:23.  Deut. 7; 20:17.  Josh. 12:8). 

These were to be cut off, and driven out, and utterly destroyed (Deut. 20:17.  Josh. 3:10).  But Israel failed in this (Josh. 13:13; 15:63; 16:10; 17:18.  Judg. 1:19, 20, 28, 29, 30-36; 2:1-5; 3:1-7); and we known not how many got away to other countries to escape the general destruction.  If this were recognized it would go far to solve many problems connected with Anthropology. 

As to their other names, they were called Anakim, from on Anak which came of the Nephilim (Num. 13:23), and Rephaim, from Rapha, another notable one among them. From Deut. 2:10, they were known by some as Emim, and Horim, and Zamzummim (v. 20, 21) and Avim, &c. 

As Rephaim they were well known, and are often mentioned :  but, unfortunately, instead of this, their proper name, being preserved, it is variously translated as "dead", "deceased", or "giants".  These Rephaim are to have no resurrection.  This fact is stated in Isa. 26:14 (where the proper name is rendered "deceased," and v. 19, where it is rendered "the dead").  It is rendered "dead" seven times (Job 26:5.  Ps. 88:10.  Prov. 2:18; 9:18; 21:16.  Isa. 14:8; 26:19). It is rendered "deceased" in Isa. 26:14. 

It is retained as a proper name "Rephaim" ten times (two being in the margin).  Gen. 14:5; 15:20.  Josh. 12:15 (marg.).  2Sam. 5:18, 22; 23:13.& b31 nbsp; 1Chron. 11:15; 14:9; 20:4 (marg.).  Isa. 17:5. In all other places it is rendered "giants", Gen. 6:4; Num. 23:33, where it is Nephilim; and Job 16:14, where it is gibbor (Ap. 14. iv). By reading all these passages the Bible student may know all that can be known about these beings. 

It is certain that the second irruption took place before Gen. 14, for there the Rephaim were mixed up with the five nations or peoples, which included Sodom and Gomorrha, and were defeated by the four kings under Chedorlaomer.  Their principal locality was evidently "Ashtaroth Karnaim"; while the Emim were in the plain of Kiriathaim (Gen. 14:5). 

Anak was a noted descendant of the Nephilim; and Rapha was another, giving their names respectively to different clans.  Anak's father was Arba, the original builder of Hebron (Gen. 35:27.  Josh. 15:13; 21:11); and this Palestine branch of the Anakim was not called Arbahim after him, but Anakim after Anak.  They were great, mighty, and tall (Deut. 2:10, 11, 21, 22, 23; 9:2), evidently inspiring the ten spies with great fear (Num. 13:33).  Og king of Bashan is described in Deut. 3:11. 

Their strength is seen in "the giant cities of Bashan" to-day; and we know not how far they may have been utilized by Egypt in the construction of buildings, which is still an unsolved problem. Arba was rebuilt by the Khabiri or confederates seven years before Zoan was built by the Egyptian Pharoahs of the nineteenth dynasty.  See note on Num. 13:22. 

If these Nephilim, and their branch of Rephaim, were associated with Egypt, we have an explanation of the problem which has for ages perplexed all engineers, as to how those huge stones and monuments were brought together.  Why not in Egypt as well as in "the giant cities of Bashan" which exist, as such, to this day? 

Moreover, we have in these mighty men, the "men of renown," the explanation of the origin of the Greek mythology.  That mythology was no mere invention of the human brain, but it grew out of the traditions, and memories, and legends of the doings of that mighty race of beings; and was gradually evolved out of the "heroes" of Gen. 6:4.  The fact that they were supernatural in their origin formed an easy step to their being regarded as the demi-gods of the Greeks. 

Thus the Babylonian "Creation Tablets", the Egyptian "Book of the dead", the Greek mythology, and heathen Cosmogonies, which by some are set on an equality with Scripture, or by others adduced in support of it, are all the corruption and perversion of primitive truths, distorted in proportion as their origin was forgotten, and their memories faded away. 

http://levendwater.org/companion/append25.html


----------



## BANDERSNATCH (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Welllllllll I dont know about them being half angel half human..
> 
> But what about all these giant skeletons that have been found all over the world?
> 
> ...



Sarah, can you provide the reference for this info?   I knew that Goliath was supposed to be around 9 feet...but I've never heard of any 15 footers....much less a 36 foot human skeleton.   I'd be impressed with a 36 foot primate skeleton of any kind!   lol

Bandy


----------



## BANDERSNATCH (Nov 5, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Ok so nephilim are giants that had offspring with regular sized people?
> I got the impression that God sent down some kind of holy type thing that werent these HUGE people but they were larger than the average person.
> When I googled images of the Nephilim this is pretty much what I imagined.
> 
> ...




Something we should all consider about angels is that, according to the New Testament, you can't tell the difference between an angel and a regular person.   "lest you entertain angels unawares"....

No wings on angels.....sorry.

Angels were described as 'men' numerous times.   

Bandy


----------



## pnome (Nov 5, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> There are no 36 foot tall human remains.




You had best believe son!
http://www.snopes.com/photos/odd/giantman.asp


----------



## tell sackett (Nov 5, 2009)

BANDERSNATCH said:


> Something we should all consider about angels is that, according to the New Testament, you can't tell the difference between an angel and a regular person.   "lest you entertain angels unawares"....
> 
> No wings on angels.....sorry.
> 
> ...


If angels look just like men, why were the people who saw them, almost without exception, frightened by their apperance?

As for wings, try Is. ch.6


----------



## BANDERSNATCH (Nov 5, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> If angels look just like men, why were the people who saw them, almost without exception, frightened by their apperance?
> 
> As for wings, try Is. ch.6



Was it an angel that told Mary that Jesus had risen?

Also, Seraphims and Cherubims are not angels.    

Bandy


----------



## Lowjack (Nov 5, 2009)

SneekEE said:


> Appendixe 23 of The Companion Bible of Dr. EW Bullinger
> 
> 
> "THE SONS OF GOD" IN GEN. 6:2, 4.
> ...



Excellent article !


----------



## Lowjack (Nov 5, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> If angels look just like men, why were the people who saw them, almost without exception, frightened by their apperance?
> 
> As for wings, try Is. ch.6



There are many different ranks and types of angels, if we continue to use the word angel as Biblical "Malak" means envoy or messenger, it doesn not emply a physical description, we know there are Cherubins, serafins and living Creatures, they are rank like this;

Angels have been broken in to several classes or "Choirs" a few times. Originally, the Choirs were;

First Hierarchy 
Seraphim 
Cherubim 
Thrones 

Second Hierarchy 
Powers 
Dominions 
Principalities 

Third Hierarchy 
Virtues 
Archangels 
Angels 

At some point in the middle ages this change was proposed;

First Hierarchy: 
Seraphim 
Cherubim 
Archangels 

Second Hierarchy: 
Dominions 
Virtues 
Principalities 
Rulers 
Authorities 
Powers 
Thrones 

Third Hierarchy 
Angels 

The First Choir contained;

Seraphim
The Seraphim are the highest order of angels, serving as the caretakers of God's throne and continuously singing his praises. It is said that they surround the throne of God, singing the music of the spheres and regulating the movement of the heavens as it emanates from God.

The Seraphim are mentioned in Isaiah 6:1�7 [1] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/isa6.htm )
("Tell someone you are the Metatron, and they stare at you blankly, mention something from a Charlton Heston movie and suddenly everyone is a Theology scholar" -Alan Rickman as The Metatron in Dogma)


Cherubim
The Cherubim are beyond the throne of God; they are the guardians of light and of the stars. It is believed that, although they are remote from men's plane of reality, their light still touch their lives; the divine light that they filter down from Heaven.

The Cherubim are thought by some as an order or class of angels, though others hold them to be a higher class of heavenly beings than angels. Their rank among angels is uncertain, but they are always categorized in the First Sphere.

Many Christians believe that the Devil is a fallen angel that was among the Cherubim prior to his fall from Heaven. They believe that the Devil was considered as the angel of light before his sin against God.

The Cherubim are mentioned in Genesis 3:24 [2] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/gen3.htm ); Ezekiel 10:17�20 [3] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/eze10.htm ); and 1 Kings 6:23�28 [4] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/1ki6.htm ).

Archangels
The Archangels are usually considered the lowest order of the First Sphere; these angels tend the larger arenas of human endeavor and act as the administrative leaders of the Heavenly beings. An archangel is usually given a task of great importance to men. According to Pseudo-Dionysius the Areopagite's Angelology, however, the Archangels lie just above the lowest of the angel orders, the common Angels.

The word archangel is used only twice in the canonical Scripture�but several times in the Septuagint, once to refer to Michael the archangel [5] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/jud1.htm ) and the other to who is believed to be Gabriel during the return of the Lord (Gabriel is preferred over Michael since he is the messenger angel). [6] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/1th4.htm )

Christians who disagree that Satan was a cherub before his fall from heaven are more modern and believe that he was an archangel, basing this belief on the facts that (a) the cherub that fell was a King on earth; and (b) the matchup in Revelation against the archangel Michael seems to show that he was an archangel [7] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/rev12.htm )


Second Choir

Dominions
The Dominions, also known as the Hashmallim, hold the task of regulating the duties of lower angels. They receive their orders from the Seraphim, the Cherubim or God Himself, and are responsible for ensuring that the cosmos remains in order. It is only with extreme rarity that the dominions make themselves physically known to mortals, instead quietly concerning themselves with the details of existence.

It should be noted that the term dominions was used by Paul in Colossians 1:16 [8] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/col1.htm ) and Ephesians 1:21 [9] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/eph1.htm ) but he may have used it to refer to the dominions of nations and men, instead of referring to angels. 

Powers
The Powers are angelic beings shaped like hazy fumes in bright colors. They are the bearers of conscience and the keepers of history. The angels of birth and death are in this category. They are academically driven, and are concerned with ideology, philosophy, theology, religion, and documents pertaining to those studies. Powers are the brain trusts: a group of experts who serve as advisers and policy planners. Their duty is to oversee the distribution of power among mankind, hence their name.

Paul used the term powers in Colossians 1:16 [10] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/col1.htm ) and Ephesians 1:21 [11] ( http://www.bible.org/netbible/eph1.htm ) but he may have used it to refer to the powers of nations, societies or individuals, instead of referring to angels. 

Rulers & Authorities
These two types of angels are equal in power and authority. Rulers develop ideologies, while Authorities write the documents and doctrines.

Both Powers and Rulers are involved in formulating ideologies; the difference is Powers are all encompassing, and Rulers are more focused on specific lines of thought.

Authorities specialize in putting those ideas into print and in producing actual documents.


Thrones
The Thrones are angelic beings shaped like shiny orbs of shifting colors. Their duty is to carry the throne of God around in paradise, hence their name.They are the companion angels of the planets.

Thrones are fully equal in authority and power in comparison to the Powers. However, Thrones are politically, militarily and economically oriented, and their main concerns revolve around people and world events. Thrones have authority over major divisions of the world.



Principalities
The Principalities are angelic beings shaped like rays of light. They lie beyond the group of archangels. They are the guardian angels of nations and countries, and are concerned with the issues and events surrounding these, including politics, military matters, commerce and trade. One of their duties is to choose who among humanity will rule.



Virtues / Fortresses / Strongholds
The Virtues, also called Fortresses or Strongholds, lie beyond the Thrones and are equal to the Principalities. Their task is to oversee groups of people. They are shaped like sparks of light that inspire humanity to many things, may it be art or science.

It is unclear where the name of this order originated from.


Angels
The Angels are the lowest order of the angels, and the most familiar to men. They are the ones most concerned with human affairs. Within the category of angels, there are many different kinds, with different functions. The angels are sent as messengers to men.
Systematic Theology , Angeology:
Seminary Of The Americas.


----------



## ambush80 (Nov 5, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> There are many different ranks and types of angels, if we continue to use the word angel as Biblical "Malak" means envoy or messenger, it doesn not emply a physical description, we know there are Cherubins, serafins and living Creatures, they are rank like this;
> 
> Angels have been broken in to several classes or "Choirs" a few times. Originally, the Choirs were;
> 
> ...



Which ones rode on unicorns?


----------



## Lowjack (Nov 6, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> Which ones rode on unicorns?


Ask teh hippies of the 60s such as Bill clinton


----------



## mtnwoman (Nov 6, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> Which ones rode on unicorns?



Ask that giant in your avatar...

That's either a giant woman or the other one is a shrunken man.


----------



## SarahFair (Nov 6, 2009)

I did not have time to read some of the longer posts. When I do have a little more time I will come back and read them 



ambush80 said:


> There are no 36 foot tall human remains.
> 
> Animals are limited to their size by gravity.  Bone is bone and muscle is muscle. no matter what the creature it's in. it has basically the same limitations.  Bones have certain limits on how much weight they can support and how much muscle the ligaments can support, heart muscles are limited on how much blood they can pump etc.
> 
> ...


In the young earth/old earth thread it was stated that men use to live 900 years! '900 years!' I asked. 'If our skin sags and bones are brittle by 100 years how are they living 900 years?!' They told me that the atmosphere wasnt as bad as it is today and we have moved further and further from the garden of eden (or something along those line)
Would this not come into play here?




BANDERSNATCH said:


> Sarah, can you provide the reference for this info?   I knew that Goliath was supposed to be around 9 feet...but I've never heard of any 15 footers....much less a 36 foot human skeleton.   I'd be impressed with a 36 foot primate skeleton of any kind!   lol
> 
> Bandy


I can not find the exact link but here is one with the same picture and information. 
I will look futher when I have more time
http://prophecyarchive.com/ray/barr-family.com/godsword/giants.htm

It says about the 36 foot one:


> Almost beyond comprehension or believability was the find of the two separate 36-foot human remains uncovered by Carthaginians somewhere between 200-600 B.C.


I would think that back that long ago they would not know  how to properly store a skeleton or have any way to.


----------



## ambush80 (Nov 6, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> I did not have time to read some of the longer posts. When I do have a little more time I will come back and read them
> 
> 
> In the young earth/old earth thread it was stated that men use to live 900 years! '900 years!' I asked. 'If our skin sags and bones are brittle by 100 years how are they living 900 years?!' They told me that the atmosphere wasnt as bad as it is today and we have moved further and further from the garden of eden (or something along those line)
> Would this not come into play here?



I have to say that I honestly don't know if there are conditions that would allow for people to live for 900 years.  Last I heard, there are genes that are responsible for initiating the decay of one's body.  

You can research "aging" and get alot of information on how and why we age.  Of course there's probably alot of science on the subject.  The bigger issue is: do you believe that science is capable of answering questions about the physical world or would you rather believe an ancient text, written by people that thought that lightning was magic?





SarahFair said:


> I can not find the exact link but here is one with the same picture and information.
> I will look futher when I have more time
> http://prophecyarchive.com/ray/barr-family.com/godsword/giants.htm
> 
> ...



Do you believe in the process of fossilization?   I mean, do you believe that it happens like science says it does?


----------



## SarahFair (Nov 6, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> I have to say that I honestly don't know if there are conditions that would allow for people to live for 900 years.  Last I heard, there are genes that are responsible for initiating the decay of one's body.
> 
> You can research "aging" and get alot of information on how and why we age.  Of course there's probably alot of science on the subject.  The bigger issue is: do you believe that science is capable of answering questions about the physical world or would you rather believe an ancient text, written by people that thought that lightning was magic?
> 
> ...



Ive honestly never read up on how things fossilize. But I have seen bones that seem to deteriorate over a corse of time.


----------



## ambush80 (Nov 7, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Ive honestly never read up on how things fossilize. But I have seen bones that seem to deteriorate over a corse of time.




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fossil


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## SarahFair (Nov 7, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> I have to say that I honestly don't know if there are conditions that would allow for people to live for 900 years.  Last I heard, there are genes that are responsible for initiating the decay of one's body.
> 
> You can research "aging" and get alot of information on how and why we age.  Of course there's probably alot of science on the subject.  The bigger issue is: do you believe that science is capable of answering questions about the physical world or would you rather believe an ancient text, written by people that thought that lightning was magic?
> 
> ...



Question:
Who are you saying believed that lightning was magic?

Another Question:
Why ask me about fossilization?
These people couldnt have just dug up these bones and pulled them out for the elements to have its way with them causing them to deteriorate into nothing?

I believe a lot about what science has to say but I dont exactly understand why you are asking me about what science says about fossilization?


----------



## ambush80 (Nov 7, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Question:
> Who are you saying believed that lightning was magic?



I was referring to ancient people but I'm really talking about anyone who doesn't understand how something works attributing it to supernatural causes.



SarahFair said:


> Another Question:
> Why ask me about fossilization?
> These people couldnt have just dug up these bones and pulled them out for the elements to have its way with them causing them to deteriorate into nothing?
> 
> I believe a lot about what science has to say but I dont exactly understand why you are asking me about what science says about fossilization?



My question about fossilization was unrelated to the giant man bones.  I was just curious to know if you think that the process of fossilization happens like science says it does.


----------



## SarahFair (Nov 7, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> I was referring to ancient people but I'm really talking about anyone who doesn't understand how something works attributing it to supernatural causes.
> 
> 
> 
> My question about fossilization was unrelated to the giant man bones.  I was just curious to know if you think that the process of fossilization happens like science says it does.



How else could it happen? Do  you think that it goes the way science says it does?

I believe there are other "supernatural" things out there. Do I believe that some things just magically happen? No.


----------



## Inthegarge (Nov 7, 2009)

Had a friend I was stationed with in Germany who said he could prove Evolution...He took me to a cemetary where they had unearthed some skeltons that were 9' tall. They were real but what he couldn't explain was why they had all the same bones that every other corpse had. Yup, there are tall people and there are short people but they are not 1/2 Man 1/2 Angel.....2 random scritpures don't make a doctrine...especially when it conflicts with other scripture.."That which is flesh is flesh ans that which is spirit is spirit".........................    RW


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## ambush80 (Nov 7, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> How else could it happen? Do  you think that it goes the way science says it does?
> 
> I believe there are other "supernatural" things out there. Do I believe that some things just magically happen? No.



The scientific description of how fossilization works seems plausible to me.  It makes sense.  

Do you think it is possible that if people keep looking for other explanations that "supernatural" things might some day be understood?


----------



## Lowjack (Nov 7, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> How else could it happen? Do  you think that it goes the way science says it does?
> 
> I believe there are other "supernatural" things out there. Do I believe that some things just magically happen? No.



I don't believe it is all as science says,

http://paleo.cc/paluxy/boot.htm


----------



## ambush80 (Nov 7, 2009)

Lowjack said:


> I don't believe it is all as science says,
> 
> http://paleo.cc/paluxy/boot.htm



LOL!!!  Did you even read it, Lowjack?  Or did you find this on some Christian anti-science site and assume it supported your ridiculous beliefs about a 6000 year old Earth?

"Conclusions

Unless more rigorous evidence is provided by Baugh or other "limestone cowboy boot" advocates, their claims that the boot contains a fossilized leg must be regarded as dubious at best. It appears more likely that the boot contains unfossilized bones surrounded by whatever sediment filled and hardened in the boot void after the flesh decayed away--providing no evidence against evolution, nor even rapid fossilization."


----------



## SarahFair (Nov 8, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> The scientific description of how fossilization works seems plausible to me.  It makes sense.
> 
> Do you think it is possible that if people keep looking for other explanations that "supernatural" things might some day be understood?



I hope they keep looking. But it might change they way science looks at a few things..

But maybe some things werent ment to be understood with a scientific explanation..


----------



## ambush80 (Nov 8, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> I hope they keep looking. But it might change they way science looks at a few things..
> 
> But maybe some things werent ment to be understood with a scientific explanation..



I hope you keep looking too.   

Science is just a way of describing what happens in the world.  Just because science may come up with a way to explain how something works doesn't detract from how an individual experiences it.  

Science will not necessarily minimize your concept or relationship with your God.  It may change your concept of religion.  But if you are so inclined to be a believer in things by faith alone then you will continue to believe in a deity. 

You should decide if that's the kind of person you want to be in general.  Do you want to believe in ghosts or not?


----------



## Lowjack (Nov 8, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> LOL!!!  Did you even read it, Lowjack?  Or did you find this on some Christian anti-science site and assume it supported your ridiculous beliefs about a 6000 year old Earth?
> 
> "Conclusions
> 
> Unless more rigorous evidence is provided by Baugh or other "limestone cowboy boot" advocates, their claims that the boot contains a fossilized leg must be regarded as dubious at best. It appears more likely that the boot contains unfossilized bones surrounded by whatever sediment filled and hardened in the boot void after the flesh decayed away--providing no evidence against evolution, nor even rapid fossilization."



Who says i believe the earth is 6000 years old ?, and the point is i don't believe as this web site does; that foot is fossilized in a few hundred years.


----------



## SarahFair (Nov 8, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> I hope you keep looking too.
> 
> Science is just a way of describing what happens in the world.  Just because science may come up with a way to explain how something works doesn't detract from how an individual experiences it.
> 
> ...



I believe what Ive experienced


----------



## ambush80 (Nov 8, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> I believe what Ive experienced



I was working with a guy the other day and I bumped into a bike that was hanging from a hook.  He saw it swinging and he said with a a tremble in his voice "dude, do you see that bike swinging by itself?"  Realizing that he was presuming ghosts, I told him that I bumped into it a second ago.

The point being that if some one were to incline themselves (and one's inclination is completely under one's control) to look for a supernatural explanation first, then they might be led to believe in all kinds of erroneous causes for things that may have more rational and correct explanations.

I'd rather look at the bike swinging on the hook and try to figure out what caused it.  Ghosts would, and should, be well down the line of possibilities.


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## tell sackett (Nov 8, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> I believe what Ive experienced


Sarah, please accept what I am about to say in the spirit that it is given. Someone on here with greater biblical knowledge can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe what I'm about to say is correct.

Please don't base what you believe solely on your experiences. Our minds(and hearts) are easily decieved by satan. Put your trust in what God tells us in His word. It is absolutely true and trustworthy. Romans3:4 says "let God be true and every man a liar." Have faith in God and ask Him for wisdom and guidance.


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## ambush80 (Nov 9, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> Sarah, please accept what I am about to say in the spirit that it is given. Someone on here with greater biblical knowledge can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe what I'm about to say is correct.
> 
> Please don't base what you believe solely on your experiences. Our minds(and hearts) are easily decieved by satan. Put your trust in what God tells us in His word. It is absolutely true and trustworthy. Romans3:4 says "let God be true and every man a liar." Have faith in God and ask Him for wisdom and guidance.



Meaning: "Believe what the book says.  Don't ever question it.  Even if what it says doesn't make sense."


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## rjcruiser (Nov 9, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> Meaning: "Believe what the book says.  Don't ever question it.  Even if what it says doesn't make sense."





Too funny.  Interesting how someone not interested in the Bible goes out of their way to prove it is incorrect and come up with an un-scientific reason that somehow must be correct.

Evolution for instance.  Hmmmm after all these years, the link is still missing


Back to fossilization.

Here's an excerpt from here  http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/cfol/ch3-how-fast.asp  on how fossils have formed in less than 24 hours.  



			
				article said:
			
		

> A museum in central Tasmania has a “fossil hat” on display. A miner had dropped his felt hat, and the limey water had turned it into a “hard hat” (which the curator was kind enough to let me feel and photograph). That same process, mineral in-fill, can turn wood, bones, and shells into fossils in a short period of time. Indeed, fossils can be made in the laboratory!
> 
> 
> Figure 31. Because massive flooding seems to be the most logical inference from our observations of fossil deposits, a number of evolutionary geologists are now calling themselves “neo-catastrophists.” Catastrophist geology, originally a creationist idea associated with Noah’s Flood, has stimulated a great deal of research, and it helps us to understand how fossils form (above) and why such huge numbers are spread over such broad areas (below).
> ...



So as you can see, even "science" isn't too sure on this one.


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## SarahFair (Nov 9, 2009)

tell sackett said:


> Sarah, please accept what I am about to say in the spirit that it is given. Someone on here with greater biblical knowledge can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe what I'm about to say is correct.
> 
> Please don't base what you believe solely on your experiences. Our minds(and hearts) are easily decieved by satan. Put your trust in what God tells us in His word. It is absolutely true and trustworthy. Romans3:4 says "let God be true and every man a liar." Have faith in God and ask Him for wisdom and guidance.



What I saw was NOT a swinging bike. It was true form man walking out a window. He was not "see through". 
I was young, maybe 6 years old. Remember it clear as day. 

Now Im not one to believe all these "orbs" are "angels" or "spirits" kind of person. In fact I dont believe in orbs at all.. 
And I agree that supernatural should be the last thing to consider because it is SO rare. 


But there are many things I believe that yall might consider me crazy for


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## ambush80 (Nov 9, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> What I saw was NOT a swinging bike. It was true form man walking out a window. He was not "see through".
> I was young, maybe 6 years old. Remember it clear as day.
> 
> Now Im not one to believe all these "orbs" are "angels" or "spirits" kind of person. In fact I dont believe in orbs at all..
> ...



Ever wake up from a dream and think you were still where you were in the dream?  You're all, like,  "Where am I?"

What if you did that while you were awake?   Kinda "daydreamed off" for a second.  

Most of the world believes in some kind of spirits or ghosts.


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## SarahFair (Nov 10, 2009)

ambush80 said:


> Ever wake up from a dream and think you were still where you were in the dream?  You're all, like,  "Where am I?"
> 
> What if you did that while you were awake?   Kinda "daydreamed off" for a second.
> 
> Most of the world believes in some kind of spirits or ghosts.



Well I guess Im not alone then 





Anyways..
I still dont understand who the sons of god are..


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## Branchminnow (Nov 10, 2009)

No. GA. Mt. Man said:


> I thought it was a brand of Cold Medicine.



what do you know you old mountain hoojer


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## Branchminnow (Nov 10, 2009)

SarahFair said:


> Why is the Line of Seth refered to as the Sons of God??



Seth took the spiritual meaning portion that Able had and continued with it.......the scripture has a two fold meaning.


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