# Barnes 30-30 TSX Bullets



## guesswho (Nov 19, 2013)

I finally got to try out a handload for my 30-30 with the Barnes TSX 150 grain 30-30 FN.  I shot a small buck at 50yards broadside.  It went in his left shoulder and exited his right shoulder.  The deer was hit in the heart, and ran about 40 yards.  He had a broken right leg at the shoulder.  He didn't bleed a drop until about 30 yards from the shot location.  I was really suprised at the exit hole.  I expected full penetration on the deer, but also a bigger hole.  While dressing the deer, I saw that it completely devastated the internals, but the exit was as small as the entrance hole.  I'm happy with the bullet so far, but plan on trying it on a few more animals before making my decision to keep it or lose it.  Has anyone else expierenced this with the Barnes before.


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## miles58 (Nov 19, 2013)

Someone's got to ask...

Is there something the matter with you?  There is no other 30-30 bullet that you can use that will let you EXPECT an exit hole.  You might get one often as not, but it's a 30-30 and even often as not getting an exit is going to be conditioned upon not hitting much bone and not having a long path through the deer.  

You got "completely devastated" heart and lungs and a dead deer inside fifty yards.  If you drop the blood pressure to zero (like you did), the deer is not going bleed.  It cannot without blood pressure.  It can leak, but it cannot bleed.  Once enough blood drained from the the body into the chest to raise the level of the puddle enough to slosh some up to where you made the holes it leaked some out.  If you want better than that, the only way to get it is CNS hits, something that 30-30s are somewhat less suited to altogether.

Ten days ago  did the same sort of thing to a deer with a Barnes.  I put it n on the right side, blew up the heart and wrecked the lungs, broke the left shoulder.  The place where the deer stood at impact had a fistful of lunge and heart tissue in two distinct clumps, one on each side.  That deer made it about seventy yards with a very sparse and very difficult to follow blood trail.  The saving grace in the situation was the extremely thick cover which would once in a while show a wipe where the deer brushed against it.  I think we found two drops of blood on the ground in the entire distance.  The "completely devastated" contents of the chest in this case managed to very quickly plug the holes and little or no more blood leaked out.

If you want to fix the problem, my thinking is that it's going to take something with a 3/4 inch bore or bigger and some pretty respectable velocity.  I've put a golf ball size hole all the way through both shoulders (both scapulae) which in the process "completely devastated" the heart and lungs.  I had decent blood for about three jumps after there was none for the first three jumps and then nothing at all for 30 or so yards to the deer.  That was with a fifty caliber, obviously, not big enough.  I suspect a 3/4 inch bore with a tough bullet moving at or above 2400 FPS would probably make a big enough hole to give you holes that wouldn't plug so readily.  Of course, the deer whether it's hit with the 30-30 or the 3/4 bore, will still have the ability to run off, and it won't leak blood until the level rises high enough to slosh some out the holes.

Lead core bullets in a 30-30 do not exist that will guarantee an exit and a big hole.  30-30s are low velocity rifles.  Lead core bullets made for them have light jackets.  You could reload other 30 caliber bullets with moderate jackets that might in some cases make a bigger hole and in others a smaller hole.  Heavy jacketed bullets with bonded cores would probably be miserable failures because they'd be hard put to expand at 30-30 velocity.  Either of course would likely be pointed and not suitable in a 30-30 magazine, limiting you to a 2 shooter.

You seem to be reloading these.  If you use LeverEvolution powder you might be able to push them up to 2700 FPS or a little better which probably would help, but, the deer I mentioned above was shot with a Barnes moving at 3170 FPS, so expecting two big hole and lots of blood is probably being more than optimistic for a 30-30.

You did good.  You got about as much out of a 30-30 as can be got in any circumstance.


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## MCW1984 (Nov 19, 2013)

miles for the first time i disagree with you, i always get exit holes with my 30-30 and using winchester powermax i get golf ball size exits more times than not, it also works like a charm for cns shots to the neck or top of the shoulder. with all i have said keep in mind that i hunt ga deer at woods ranges, furthest kill with the 30-30 is 170yds so im not trying to say it works miracles or does better than bigger guns, i just think it deserves a little more credit than most people here give it.


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## B Man (Nov 19, 2013)

MCW1984 said:


> miles for the first time i disagree with you, i always get exit holes with my 30-30 and using winchester powermax i get golf ball size exits more times than not, it also works like a charm for cns shots to the neck or top of the shoulder. with all i have said keep in mind that i hunt ga deer at woods ranges, furthest kill with the 30-30 is 170yds so im not trying to say it works miracles or does better than bigger guns, i just think it deserves a little more credit than most people here give it.



Agree 100%   All my buddies coming up had a 30-30 growing up, most of them passed down from there daddy's, and shot Remington or Win soft points.  Trailed a many deer that leaked from two holes and silver dollar exits.  

Your next deer may have better results, but For deer I would stick with traditional SP in 30-30.  

This is coming from someone has has never owned or cared to own a 30-30.  Always been  a 35 rem guy just for something different.  But I have much respect for it.


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## SCDieselDawg (Nov 19, 2013)

MCW1984 said:


> miles for the first time i disagree with you, i always get exit holes with my 30-30 and using winchester powermax i get golf ball size exits more times than not, it also works like a charm for cns shots to the neck or top of the shoulder. with all i have said keep in mind that i hunt ga deer at woods ranges, furthest kill with the 30-30 is 170yds so im not trying to say it works miracles or does better than bigger guns, i just think it deserves a little more credit than most people here give it.



I agree with this^^^^^^^^
I've never had a problem with 170gr core-lokts. I hear a lot of people claim to get no exit with the 150gr hollow points offered by Winchester and Remington in their standard loads. But with the 170 gr soft points pass throughs are not a worry.


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## guesswho (Nov 19, 2013)

I expected a complete pass through. I just expected a bigger hole on exit. Not disappointed in performance, just wondering if anyone else has had similar performance in the caliber and bullet.


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## miles58 (Nov 19, 2013)

I am sure you all believe the 30-30 goes through all the time and makes a big hole.

I know from a lot of experience it doesn't.  Not only that, but it's nowhere near as consistent at doing that as are much more powerful rounds shooting much tougher bullets.  All you need do is look at and listen to the posts on this forum alone.  Even on small deer down there a lot of 30-06/308/270 etc just don't make it through all the time.

I am not knocking the 30-30.  It is just not a high performance round.  I take a 30-30 to deer camp with me every year and have done so for many years.


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## MCW1984 (Nov 19, 2013)

i dont think a 30-30 passes though everytime with a big hole thats why i said more times than not, by more times than not i mean i have shot over 50 deer with a 30-30 and can only remember recovering four bullets and two of those were severe quartering shots. i wasnt trying to argue in my first post and almost always agree with you, you made a believer out of me with small calibers and the tsx and i know how much you love them but run to your kocal walmart and get a box of winchester powermax  150s and shoot a deer with it, ive shot about everything available for a 30-30 over the years and have yet to find a better load.


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## miles58 (Nov 20, 2013)

MCW1984 said:


> i dont think a 30-30 passes though everytime with a big hole thats why i said more times than not, by more times than not i mean i have shot over 50 deer with a 30-30 and can only remember recovering four bullets and two of those were severe quartering shots. i wasnt trying to argue in my first post and almost always agree with you, you made a believer out of me with small calibers and the tsx and i know how much you love them but run to your kocal walmart and get a box of winchester powermax  150s and shoot a deer with it, ive shot about everything available for a 30-30 over the years and have yet to find a better load.



I understand what you're saying.  That's why  illustrated the point with how much bigger guns don't produce consistent exits.

I almost exclusively shoot small deer up here.  Probably 100-110 lbs is about typical for me.  I pick out a nice fat fawn and that's what goes in the freezer.    Were  to get on the radio and ask for the meat wagon and help because I got one with horns, the guys  hunt with would be getting down and coming over to see it and would expect a really, really big deer.  Look at the picture.  Without any references, it's still obviously a very large deer.  Shooting through them is a lot harder than shooting through what I normally kill.  Shooting through a lot of bone or big bones or shooting at steep angles makes full penetration a whole lot harder than shooting a 70 pound live weight animal.

The buck on the right in my avatar was smaller than the doe in the picture.  He still had 30+ inches of penetration before the bullet exited.  The 30-30 I shoot is accurate enough to have made the shot even at the same distance, 140 yards,  but, even with the Barnes 150 TSXs which I also shoot, I have no doubt it would have been my first recovered Barnes had I shot the deer with the 30-30.  Never mind a lead core bullet.  But... Like I said originally, 30-30s need to have much more fragile bullets in order to expand properly.  Even the Barnes carries that huge hollow point to accommodate the typically low velocity.

With the release of LeverEvolution powder, and the realistic capability of 150 grain 30-30 bullets moving at 2700+ FPS, we will see tougher bullets.  We will see better penetration.  But to get big holes all the way through you have to carry a lot of velocity all the way through.  Cavitation is what does that obviously since bullets can't expand to 2-3 inch diameters.


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## lonewolf247 (Nov 20, 2013)

I think it has a lot to do with where the deer is hit and what angle it is at.  I quit shooting deer in the shoulders years ago, not because of that, but got tired of ruining both shoulders.  If broad side I shoot just behind the shoulder, and get a double lung exit wound.  Maybe that's one of the reasons I always get an exit wound. Even on quartering deer I try to stay out of the shoulders. 

I bought a used Marlin 336 30/30 today, so anxious to take it out and see how it goes with the exit wounds.


If the gun likes them, gonna try these:
http://i.walmartimages.com/i/p/00/02/94/65/06/0002946506432_500X500.jpg


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## guesswho (Nov 20, 2013)

Mine liked the winchester soft points. In the 170 gr weight but it was an old winchester 94 though.


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## guesswho (Nov 20, 2013)

Just hard to find any n the shelf at stores.


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## Larry Rooks (Nov 24, 2013)

I have never had a Barnes bullet not perform.  I use em in every rifle I own that is used for hunting, 30-30, 243 Win,
25 WSSM, 257 WBY, 7mm-08, 308, 444 Marlin and more.
I ALWAYS get exit holes with the "X" that I could not guarantee with any other bullets.  Some big hogs have been taken too, and only one bullet has ever been recovered, 150 gr X from 30-30 on a 300 plus lb hog that was shot length wise.  Bullet was recovered in left ham after going into the front of right shoulder.  Recovered bullet still retains its weight too


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