# Dog/Bear Hunt Timing



## jbogg (Jan 11, 2021)

https://georgiawildlife.com/regulations/meetings

I am not a Dog hunter, but I completely understand and support the importance of the Dog/Bear Hunt as a management tool.  I do have a big problem with the timing of the hunt.  Bowhunting bears on Chattahoochee and Chestatee WMAs has been reduced to essentially one week before the rifle hunters roll in, followed immediately by dog hunters.  Everyone I have spoken with agrees there would be no downside to the dog hunters by moving the dog hunt back a few weeks.  In fact cooler temps would be easier on dogs and hunters alike, and would likely result in more bears on the ground.  

Please consider opening the link above and sending an email requesting the dog hunt to be rescheduled.  Public comments will be accepted until January 22nd.  You boys over on the Cohutta side of the mountains may feel like this doesn’t affect you, but the dog hunt is likely here to stay, and You’re likely to find a dog/bear hunt in your neck of the woods before to long.  

There are no longer many of us who hunt these mountains.  Every voice counts, and your help is appreciated.


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## 35 Whelen (Jan 12, 2021)

Done.


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## GT Whitetail (Jan 12, 2021)

Done.. Thanks for the info.


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## strothershwacker (Jan 12, 2021)

I'll be attending the public meeting in Calhoun tonight. This year you had to pre-register due to limited seating because of covid. Only 25 seats were available. May get some insight on the next 2 year plan.


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## jbogg (Jan 12, 2021)

strothershwacker said:


> I'll be attending the public meeting in Calhoun tonight. This year you had to pre-register due to limited seating because of covid. Only 25 seats were available. May get some insight on the next 2 year plan.



I’m glad you are able to attend in person. I will be going tomorrow night to the meeting in Jefferson.


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## splatek (Jan 12, 2021)

Doesn't look like I can attend in person, but I am writing emails and going to log on to the virtual thing.


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## northgeorgiasportsman (Jan 12, 2021)

Done, and also suggested a spring bear season.


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## NCMTNHunter (Jan 12, 2021)

I haven't thought about it until just now but I would think if this season was pushed back until bear season is open in TN and NC it would really help GA residents odds of drawing this hunt.  I know if I were still raising bear dogs and I had an opportunity to go down there and hunt a few weeks before my home season opened I would be all over it.  If that hunt was during my home season I doubt I would even consider it.

I am afraid if the goal is to stabilize or reduce bear numbers bow season is still going to take the hit no matter when the dog season is.  I wonder if there would be any room for consideration for tacking on an extra week of bow season at the beginning?  If the goal is to reduce bear numbers anyways it isn't going to hurt.  I would be surprised if there are enough bow kills in a week to matter much anyways.  

Just an outsider looking in.


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## jbogg (Jan 12, 2021)

NCMTNHunter said:


> I haven't thought about it until just now but I would think if this season was pushed back until bear season is open in TN and NC it would really help GA residents odds of drawing this hunt.  I know if I were still raising bear dogs and I had an opportunity to go down there and hunt a few weeks before my home season opened I would be all over it.  If that hunt was during my home season I doubt I would even consider it.
> 
> I am afraid if the goal is to stabilize or reduce bear numbers bow season is still going to take the hit no matter when the dog season is.  I wonder if there would be any room for consideration for tacking on an extra week of bow season at the beginning?  If the goal is to reduce bear numbers anyways it isn't going to hurt.  I would be surprised if there are enough bow kills in a week to matter much anyways.
> 
> Just an outsider looking in.



That’s a great point about How moving the hunt back could benefit Georgia dog hunters, and a good reason they should consider supporting this change.  I would much rather give up the last week and a half of Bow season In order to hunt undisturbed bears in early season. There is definitely not a bear hiding under every rock, so being able to pattern them around a food source during early season makes a huge difference as opposed to trying to narrow them down in mid October once most of the acorns are on the ground.  Additionally, the pressure of the dog hunt definitely changes bear patterns for a while.  It takes a little while for the remaining bears to fill back in, and by that time bow season is over.


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## Stump06 (Jan 12, 2021)

Done. Pitched the idea of a spring bear season and also echoed the concerns about the dog hunt.


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## Doug B. (Jan 12, 2021)

jbogg said:


> https://georgiawildlife.com/regulations/meetings
> 
> I am not a Dog hunter, but I completely understand and support the importance of the Dog/Bear Hunt as a management tool.  I do have a big problem with the timing of the hunt.  Bowhunting bears on Chattahoochee and Chestatee WMAs has been reduced to essentially one week before the rifle hunters roll in, followed immediately by dog hunters.  Everyone I have spoken with agrees there would be no downside to the dog hunters by moving the dog hunt back a few weeks.  In fact cooler temps would be easier on dogs and hunters alike, and would likely result in more bears on the ground.
> 
> ...


I'm really not for or against but I do have one question.  Before everybody goes and make their comment "heard", from a management standpoint what would be better? Or does that even factor into the equation?


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## jbogg (Jan 12, 2021)

Doug B. said:


> I'm really not for or against but I do have one question.  Before everybody goes and make their comment "heard", from a management standpoint what would be better? Or does that even factor into the equation?



The dog hunters would kill just as many if not more bears at the end of October versus earlier in the season. There would also be limits in place to insure there would not be an over harvest. I cannot envision a downside resulting from this change from a management perspective.


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## strothershwacker (Jan 12, 2021)

I'm gonna be promoting a spring bear bow season! If ye ain't gonna be there in person push it on-line! Just week in late may early june!


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## tree cutter 08 (Jan 12, 2021)

2nd or 3rd week in October wouldn't interfere with anything.


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## tree cutter 08 (Jan 12, 2021)

I also mentioned about wma rotation every few years.


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## jbogg (Jan 12, 2021)

tree cutter 08 said:


> I also mentioned about wma rotation every few years.



I heard there was a good chance that this was already in the works.


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## strothershwacker (Jan 13, 2021)

The only mention of bear during the presentation part of the meeting was to add bear to the game check. Most of the new proposals revolved around turkey season. I found it interesting that out of 25 pre-registered seats only 14 people showed up. Why go through the trouble of registering but then not show up?


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## northgeorgiasportsman (Jan 13, 2021)

strothershwacker said:


> The only mention of bear during the presentation part of the meeting was to add bear to the game check. Most of the new proposals revolved around turkey season. I found it interesting that out of 25 pre-registered seats only 14 people showed up. Why go through the trouble of registering but then not show up?


Care to summarize the turkey discussion?


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## splatek (Jan 13, 2021)

Did you bring up any bear discussion?


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## strothershwacker (Jan 13, 2021)

splatek said:


> Did you bring up any bear discussion?


I proposed a spring archery season.


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## splatek (Jan 13, 2021)

strothershwacker said:


> I proposed a spring archery season.



How’d that go over?
I wish they’d accept comments and proposals prior to the meeting so that popular ideas could be discussed 

I would love a spring bear season. My woman would not. ?


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## strothershwacker (Jan 13, 2021)

T





northgeorgiasportsman said:


> Care to summarize the turkey discussion?


They had the Turkey biologist present some info, that indicated there will be adjustments made to the season. Some of the things they are considering are later opening date, 1 bird limit per wma, 1 bird a day type things. The ideas were not well received but I think they are on the right track.


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## strothershwacker (Jan 13, 2021)

You can go online 





splatek said:


> How’d that go over?
> I wish they’d accept comments and proposals prior to the meeting so that popular ideas could be discussed
> 
> I would love a spring bear season. My woman would not. ?


And cast the same proposal until Jan 22nd! They will consider it if enough people bring it up.


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## 35 Whelen (Jan 13, 2021)

Eliminate the 75 pound weight restriction.  What biological purpose does it serve?


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## jbogg (Jan 13, 2021)

35 Whelen said:


> Eliminate the 75 pound weight restriction.  What biological purpose does it serve?



I have never understood the 75 pound minimum either, but it’s probably A good thing that it is in place from a public relations standpoint. If images started showing up on Facebook of guys posing with a 50 pound cub The anti-Hunter crowd would use that against us to try and shut down bear hunting in a hurry.


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## C.Killmaster (Jan 13, 2021)

jbogg said:


> I have never understood the 75 pound minimum either, but it’s probably A good thing that it is in place from a public relations standpoint. If images started showing up on Facebook of guys posing with a 50 pound cub The anti-Hunter crowd would use that against us to try and shut down bear hunting in a hurry.



That is the purpose.  I hate the rule too, but people go crazy over killing bears and all it takes is a distasteful picture and a slow news day.


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## C.Killmaster (Jan 13, 2021)

splatek said:


> How’d that go over?
> I wish they’d accept comments and proposals prior to the meeting so that popular ideas could be discussed
> 
> I would love a spring bear season. My woman would not. ?



What you will often see is that new ideas that are popular from a set of public meetings will get discussed internally within WRD, vetted biologically, and brought up the following regulation cycle.  Sometimes smaller changes can be done in the same year, but it depends on what it is.

The current public meetings this week are proposing ideas that arose over the last couple of years, but need your input to help shape the final proposals.  Once the regulations are officially proposed in a few months there will be a round of public hearings where you can weigh in on what is actually being proposed.


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## chrislibby88 (Jan 14, 2021)

I sent a request for the dog season to move back a few weeks.


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## 1eyefishing (Jan 14, 2021)

First time I've seen this thread, just now. 
But John texted me a few nights ago and asked me to put in my 2cents. 
 I sent in my 5 paragraphs immediately, but  I just wanted to give a big shout out and thank you to Jbogg for his work and extra curricular activity involving this subject.
 I am guessing I am not the only one he has motivated to comment to the DNR with our concerns.


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## chrislibby88 (Jan 15, 2021)

It might be useful for us emailers to voice our support of moving turkey season back, or whatever parts of it we agree with. I’m cool with all the proposals that strother mentioned. I see the turkey reg changes getting some pushback though. @C.Killmaster can we email twice?


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## C.Killmaster (Jan 15, 2021)

chrislibby88 said:


> It might be useful for us emailers to voice our support of moving turkey season back, or whatever parts of it we agree with. I’m cool with all the proposals that strother mentioned. I see the turkey reg changes getting some pushback though. @C.Killmaster can we email twice?



If it's a different topic, absolutely.  Just don't try to get double counted on the same issue.


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## 35 Whelen (Jan 15, 2021)

C.Killmaster said:


> If it's a different topic, absolutely.  Just don't try to get double counted on the same issue.



Can I send in emails for dead relatives?


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## chrislibby88 (Jan 15, 2021)

35 Whelen said:


> Can I send in emails for dead relatives?


Only if you’re a democrat.


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## C.Killmaster (Jan 15, 2021)

35 Whelen said:


> Can I send in emails for dead relatives?



Not touching that with a 10 foot pole.


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## bany (Jan 20, 2021)

I emailed a few cents. I’ve been plotting a mountain return, mainly for bear and the dog hunt shut that down for me. I was sure a couple weeks were in order for the woods to come back. 
Also commented on continuing habitat work if that matters.


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## Heath (Jan 20, 2021)

You boys need to learn the other couple hundred thousand acres outside of those 2 wastelands and you would really enjoy life a lot more.


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## jbogg (Jan 20, 2021)

Heath said:


> You boys need to learn the other couple hundred thousand acres outside of those 2 wastelands and you would really enjoy life a lot more.



Thanks for the advice, and I will keep that in mind. Please remind me how moving the dog hunt back a couple of weeks would negatively impact you guys.  I’m still waiting to take you up on your open invitation to tagalong to see how those dogs work.


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## ddd-shooter (Jan 20, 2021)

Heath said:


> You boys need to learn the other couple hundred thousand acres outside of those 2 wastelands and you would really enjoy life a lot more.


If it becomes a rotating hunt, the timing will affect many of us outside of those areas. If you can run bears in October in North Carolina, you can in Georgia also.


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## jbogg (Jan 20, 2021)

The following screenshot was taken directly off North Carolina’s website. Just in the NC western mountain counties the dog hunters are able to hunt bears for most of October, most of November, and half of December.  The fact that the Georgia DNR scheduled this hunt so as not to interfere with dog hunts scheduled in other states is unconscionable.  The Georgia DNR told Georgia resident bowhunters to take a backseat to Houndsman, many of them from other states. Rescheduling the current GA dog hunt to occur just a couple of weeks later gives bow hunters a little bit of a fighting chance on these WMAs without having any negative impact to resident Houndsman.  If I were a Houndsman I would be thrilled that people are not screaming to get rid of this hunt, when all we are asking for is a little cooperation.


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## deerpoacher1970 (Jan 20, 2021)

Could they not have bow season in August.


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## deerpoacher1970 (Jan 20, 2021)

I hate to see the dog hunt changed ,they are doing such a good job of killing off some of these mangy bears.


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## jbogg (Jan 20, 2021)

deerpoacher1970 said:


> I hate to see the dog hunt changed ,they are doing such a good job of killing off some of these mangy bears.



I haven’t seen any bears with mange, but how would moving the dog hunt back a few weeks adversely affect the number of bears taken by dog hunters?


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## Pig Predator (Jan 20, 2021)

jbogg said:


> I haven’t seen any bears with mange, but how would moving the dog hunt back a few weeks adversely affect the number of bears taken by dog hunters?


https://rumble.com/vcxfrd-big-pappa-black-bear.html


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## splatek (Jan 21, 2021)

Outside of interfering with other state's season dates, has anybody provided a rationale for why/how moving the dates back a few weeks would negatively effect the success of the dogs on bears?

I don't think the goal is to simply "kill off mangy" bears, right? Otherwise, why not just implement a trap and kill program, instead of a trap, collar, release program? Seems like this is part of a larger conservation-minded management program. I just think that bowhunters, like myself, feel like the presence of bowhunters in the woods for a few extra weeks will not effect the success of the doggers nearly as much as the presence of dogs running them. I know little about this stuff, so I could be completely off base and incorrect.

I also get the note about "learn the other thousands" of NF land. There is a lot of public land up there and I really do get that. But, these two WMAs are popular, easy to access, and hold a lot of bears, well at least hooch does. I see these two WMAs as "gateway" hunting areas to the larger undeveloped national forest. These WMAs have great road systems, trails, food plots and are managed well for wildlife, for the most part. The larger NF is not and it presents a challenge for many folks. Perhaps that ease of access and popularity are why they chose those two WMAs. I can remember on more than one occasion seeing bears in broad daylight along certain trails. I was fishing a creek one time, a bunch of hikers were hollering at me... I just thought they were asking if I'd caught anything, but they were letting me know a big old bear was wading through the creek about 15 feet behind me. We, the bear and I, were both startled to find each other in the creek.


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## Heath (Jan 21, 2021)

Splatek,  I don’t think moving it back would harm anything.  However, I would appreciate if that decision was made scientifically and not because of a group of people are butt hurt.  My point is this argument of only having a week is invalid.  We archery hunters have from the second weekend of September to the last weekend in September before a dog hunt is held for 9 days on 50,000 acres of something like 400-500,000 acres that is still open and untouched.  The argument is silly at best.  I don’t know the exact acreage but y’all are griping about something that literally doesn’t touch 10% of your opportunity and only 9 days even at that.  We then have 2 more months to fill what tags you have.  

Forgive me for not understanding this mentality of making excuses for why they can’t fill a tag with a 3 week head start and then <10% of their area compromised for 9 days. Then they have another 2 months to fill tags.  For those type people there will always be an excuse.  

So again,  if you will learn areas outside of those WMA’s the problem is solved for you.  I keep trying to throw you guys a bone and tell you there are far better places to kill a bear than these 2 WMA’s but you keep beating that dead horse.  It suits me just fine to keep you gurus rounded up in the wasteland while I reap the rewards.

You can lead a horse to water....


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## Buckman18 (Jan 21, 2021)

I say move it back a few weeks. No reason to schedule the dog hunt during the archery hunt. Plenty of time and cooler weather between the end of archery and the traditional rifle hunts, and after the hunts in December and January. 

Everybody is a winner this way, and everyone hunts. Id also like to see a few more WMA's added at separate times such as Swallow Creek, Blue Ridge, Coopers, and the old Burton WMA.


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## Heath (Jan 21, 2021)

Buckman18 said:


> I say move it back a few weeks. No reason to schedule the dog hunt during the archery hunt. Plenty of time and cooler weather between the end of archery and the traditional rifle hunts, and after the hunts in December and January.
> 
> Everybody is a winner this way, and everyone hunts. Id also like to see a few more WMA's added at separate times such as Swallow Creek, Blue Ridge, Coopers, and the old Burton WMA.



Pour more salt in that wound... lol!

Funny,  you never make excuses.  You just go right on killing. My bet is they can change the rules and you will still go right on killing.  These boys still think you’re lucky... LOL!

I think it would be nice if they spread it out more as well.  Simply because they all need a little fat trimmed.  Maybe do a early season on one and late season on another.  5-10 years in they would be able to see trends as to what works best and adjust from there.  These dudes claiming management out of one side of their mouth and then me me me out the other side is what’s absurd.  These same people are gonna turn against the dog hunts, if they aren’t already, once they realize it’s not the season timing that keeps them from being successful.  They’ll need a new excuse!


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## jbogg (Jan 21, 2021)

Heath said:


> Splatek,  I don’t think moving it back would harm anything.  However, I would appreciate if that decision was made scientifically and not because of a group of people are butt hurt.  My point is this argument of only having a week is invalid.  We archery hunters have from the second weekend of September to the last weekend in September before a dog hunt is held for 9 days on 50,000 acres of something like 400-500,000 acres that is still open and untouched.  The argument is silly at best.  I don’t know the exact acreage but y’all are griping about something that literally doesn’t touch 10% of your opportunity and only 9 days even at that.  We then have 2 more months to fill what tags you have.
> 
> Forgive me for not understanding this mentality of making excuses for why they can’t fill a tag with a 3 week head start and then <10% of their area compromised for 9 days. Then they have another 2 months to fill tags.  For those type people there will always be an excuse.
> 
> ...



Heath, you are great at name-calling and throwing stones, but you can’t answer the simplest of questions. What is the harm in moving the hunt back a couple of weeks? We both know we don’t need a scientific study to answer that question.  Speaking of folks being butt hurt,  I seem to recall you being upset because some non-resident Houndsman got drawn in your home state and you didn’t.  As somebody pointed out earlier in this thread, moving the hunt back a couple of weeks would probably help your chances of being drawn.  

I’m well aware of how many acres there are available to hunt outside of the WMAs, and I take full advantage of the entire national forest. But that’s not the point.  My fear is if and when the dog hunt is expanded one day to include national forest outside of WMAs then the timing of the hunt will be much more impactful.  For the life of me I cannot understand your attitude. As many have stated, rescheduling the hunt by just a couple of weeks appears to be a win-win, so I am surprised that you are so resistant to it.


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## doehunter (Jan 21, 2021)

Heath said:


> Splatek,  I don’t think moving it back would harm anything.  However, I would appreciate if that decision was made scientifically and not because of a group of people are butt hurt.  My point is this argument of only having a week is invalid.  We archery hunters have from the second weekend of September to the last weekend in September before a dog hunt is held for 9 days on 50,000 acres of something like 400-500,000 acres that is still open and untouched.  The argument is silly at best.  I don’t know the exact acreage but y’all are griping about something that literally doesn’t touch 10% of your opportunity and only 9 days even at that.  We then have 2 more months to fill what tags you have.
> 
> Forgive me for not understanding this mentality of making excuses for why they can’t fill a tag with a 3 week head start and then <10% of their area compromised for 9 days. Then they have another 2 months to fill tags.  For those type people there will always be an excuse.
> 
> ...


Very well said!!


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## Pig Predator (Jan 21, 2021)

What if they put the bear dog hunt on during the May 16-31 during the hog and coyote on wma's? Would probably take out a lot of boars as breeding starts. I know it would be hot but.....


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## Heath (Jan 21, 2021)

jbogg said:


> Heath, you are great at name-calling and throwing stones, but you can’t answer the simplest of questions. What is the harm in moving the hunt back a couple of weeks? We both know we don’t need a scientific study to answer that question.  Speaking of folks being butt hurt,  I seem to recall you being upset because some non-resident Houndsman got drawn in your home state and you didn’t.  As somebody pointed out earlier in this thread, moving the hunt back a couple of weeks would probably help your chances of being drawn.
> 
> I’m well aware of how many acres there are available to hunt outside of the WMAs, and I take full advantage of the entire national forest. But that’s not the point.  My fear is if and when the dog hunt is expanded one day to include national forest outside of WMAs then the timing of the hunt will be much more impactful.  For the life of me I cannot understand your attitude. As many have stated, rescheduling the hunt by just a couple of weeks appears to be a win-win, so I am surprised that you are so resistant to it.



Did you read the very first part of what I replied to Splatek?  No, you have your mind made up.  I would like ALL seasons determined by what is best for ALL wildlife.  Period.  I went back and read what I wrote in the previous post.  If you found that offensive,  you’ll never see anything outside of yourself.


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## jbogg (Jan 21, 2021)

Heath said:


> Did you read the very first part of what I replied to Splatek?  No, you have your mind made up.  I would like ALL seasons determined by what is best for ALL wildlife.  Period.  I went back and read what I wrote in the previous post.  If you found that offensive,  you’ll never see anything outside of yourself.



I’ve noticed you can’t come on here without being condescending.  Nobody on here is whining because they were unsuccessful, or making excuses for that matter. Those are your words.  I don’t recall anybody calling Buckman lucky. I know him, do you?  Proposing that a dog hunt be rescheduled by a couple of weeks is not making excuses.  The fact that you have to talk big and name call is more than enough evidence that you can’t support your position with anything but emotion.


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## splatek (Jan 21, 2021)

Heath said:


> Splatek,  I don’t think moving it back would harm anything.  However, I would appreciate if that decision was made scientifically and not because of a group of people are butt hurt.



Can you point me to where the decision to hold it in the beginning of archery season was based on science? 

I can’t seem to find the report or publication. 
Apologies if my post seemed whiny or excuse making. That’s not my style.


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## Heath (Jan 21, 2021)

Name call?  Emotion?  I Literally just typed two posts explaining why your argument has very little merit.  I’m sorry you didn’t appreciate it but then again most people don’t like someone disagreeing with them.


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## Heath (Jan 21, 2021)

splatek said:


> Can you point me to where the decision to hold it in the beginning of archery season was based on science?
> 
> I can’t seem to find the report or publication.
> Apologies if my post seemed whiny or excuse making. That’s not my style.



I didn’t think you were whining.  I have no idea why they chose their dates.  My guess would be because Georgia has a limited number of bear hound owners due to lack of opportunity and it would make sense to hold it when neighboring states  hunters could attend and that way increase likely revenue.  It’s a sound theory anyway.  They get increased management volume and revenue to boot. 
What time would anyone not gripe?  The answer is never.  The state is danged if they do and danged if they don’t.
I don’t know all the answers.  However, I do appreciate that the state is making an effort and maybe they will get it adjusted to make it work out in everyone’s favor.  It’s doubtful but maybe!


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## Heath (Jan 21, 2021)

jbogg said:


> The following screenshot was taken directly off North Carolina’s website. Just in the NC western mountain counties the dog hunters are able to hunt bears for most of October, most of November, and half of December.  The fact that the Georgia DNR scheduled this hunt so as not to interfere with dog hunts scheduled in other states is unconscionable.  The Georgia DNR told Georgia resident bowhunters to take a backseat to Houndsman, many of them from other states. Rescheduling the current GA dog hunt to occur just a couple of weeks later gives bow hunters a little bit of a fighting chance on these WMAs without having any negative impact to resident Houndsman.  If I were a Houndsman I would be thrilled that people are not screaming to get rid of this hunt, when all we are asking for is a little cooperation.
> View attachment 1061539



It very evident that you are worried about dog hunters.
Do you know why North Carolina’s western seasons are the way they are?  It’s because for most of my life we were void of a deer population.  Deer season was closed permanently in a few western counties for multiple years because the deer population was so low they feared it couldn’t recover.  I can still remember people telling stories of a deer they saw because it was so rare.  They have slowly came back and are slowly lengthening deer season and opportunities in the western counties now.  Let’s tell both sides of the story and not the boogy man version about how dog hunting ruins deer opportunity.


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## jbogg (Jan 21, 2021)

Heath said:


> It very evident that you are worried about dog hunters.
> Do you know why North Carolina’s western seasons are the way they are?  It’s because for most of my life we were void of a deer population.  Deer season was closed permanently in a few western counties for multiple years because the deer population was so low they feared it couldn’t recover.  I can still remember people telling stories of a deer they saw because it was so rare.  They have slowly came back and are slowly lengthening deer season and opportunities in the western counties now.  Let’s tell both sides of the story and not the boogy man version about how dog hunting ruins deer opportunity.



Who in the world is talking about deer hunting? I love hunting bears which was the reason for my post.  I’m not going to keep arguing with you. You’re obviously an outstanding mountain hunter. Personally I find the mountains very challenging, but it’s a struggle that I welcome. If I had been pushing for the dog hunt to be canceled I could understand the hostility. However, no one in this entire thread including yourself has been able to give a reason as to how rescheduling the hunt by a couple of weeks would harm dog hunters, bears, or DNR management goals.


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## Buckman18 (Jan 22, 2021)

This debate may end up having to be decided in mediation. I vote our new health secretary to be the decision maker since it will now be in charge of our health!


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## Heath (Jan 22, 2021)

Jbogg,  the point you were making was that there is a long bear dog season in NC.  You fear that’s going to happen here and take away your opportunity.  I say, that is not going to happen for a lot of reasons. While I understand your reasoning for wanting it moved back I don’t agree with the motive.  No sweat man,  we don’t have to agree.  I’d like deer season cut in half in my area,  you figure out a proposal to let archery season start the last week of Sept. and run till the second weekend of October let us dog bear for the last two weeks of October and then have gun season November and December and I’ll sign the petition tomorrow.


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## jbogg (Jan 22, 2021)

Heath said:


> Jbogg,  the point you were making was that there is a long bear dog season in NC.  You fear that’s going to happen here and take away your opportunity.  I say, that is not going to happen for a lot of reasons. While I understand your reasoning for wanting it moved back I don’t agree with the motive.  No sweat man,  we don’t have to agree.  I’d like deer season cut in half in my area,  you figure out a proposal to let archery season start the last week of Sept. and run till the second weekend of October let us dog bear for the last two weeks of October and then have gun season November and December and I’ll sign the petition tomorrow.



We will agree to disagree on this one. There’s nothing wrong with a good debate, but let’s keep it civil. When you claim that those proposing changing the dates were only doing so because they were unsuccessful and looking for an excuse you were making an assumption. When you make it personal it’s hard to have a good discussion.  If wanting to have a couple of additional weeks to bow hunt undisturbed bears is selfish, then so be it.  If making such a change would be to the detriment of no one, then what’s the problem?  Just curious, do you actually bow hunt bears in the early season? I know a lot of guys don’t mess with bowhunting bears in the heat.


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## Buckman18 (Jan 22, 2021)

My opinion is deer/bear still hunting season needs to be extended on the CNF to at least Jan 1, like it was for decades.

I also think the dog bear/hog opportunities should be expanded to cover other WMA's after archery closes and in-between and after the managed rifle deer hunts close.

And I like the idea of a spring/summer bear still hunting season.

More opportunity for everyone. Cooler weather for the dogs. Whats not to love?


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## ddd-shooter (Jan 22, 2021)

Buckman18 said:


> My opinion is deer/bear still hunting season needs to be extended on the CNF to at least Jan 1, like it was for decades.
> 
> I also think the dog bear/hog opportunities should be expanded to cover other WMA's after archery closes and in-between and after the managed rifle deer hunts close.
> 
> ...


That sounds like the email I sent to the dnr about proposed regulation changes... Agree completely


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## Heath (Jan 22, 2021)

jbogg said:


> We will agree to disagree on this one. There’s nothing wrong with a good debate, but let’s keep it civil. When you claim that those proposing changing the dates were only doing so because they were unsuccessful and looking for an excuse you were making an assumption. When you make it personal it’s hard to have a good discussion.  If wanting to have a couple of additional weeks to bow hunt undisturbed bears is selfish, then so be it.  If making such a change would be to the detriment of no one, then what’s the problem?  Just curious, do you actually bow hunt bears in the early season? I know a lot of guys don’t mess with bowhunting bears in the heat.



Yes, back when I would have killed a bear without a dog.  I would hunt every day it was open and I could get free.  For a span of 5-10 years I would rarely hunt less than 5 days a week.  Answer this for me,  We had 106 Archery days to kill a bear here in the mountains on public land this year. How many of those days did You hunt?  Did you take off and hunt all 7 days of the first Chattahoochee Archery hunt or perhaps even the early firearm week knowing there would be a 9 day dog hunt for over a year prior?  And finally,  did you hunt elsewhere during any of the 9 days these WMA’s were being occupied by another group getting an opportunity?  Maybe this way we can reach a common ground about why we disagree.  Im genuinely curious as it might sway my opinion.


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## jbogg (Jan 22, 2021)

Heath said:


> Yes, back when I would have killed a bear without a dog.  I would hunt every day it was open and I could get free.  For a span of 5-10 years I would rarely hunt less than 5 days a week.  Answer this for me,  We had 106 Archery days to kill a bear here in the mountains on public land this year. How many of those days did You hunt?  Did you take off and hunt all 7 days of the first Chattahoochee Archery hunt or perhaps even the early firearm week knowing there would be a 9 day dog hunt for over a year prior?  And finally,  did you hunt elsewhere during any of the 9 days these WMA’s were being occupied by another group getting an opportunity?  Maybe this way we can reach a common ground about why we disagree.  Im genuinely curious as it might sway my opinion.



I hunt regular NF 95% of the time.  I own a small business so it’s difficult to get a full week off.  I usually try to hunt the first four or five days of bow season, but with family and work obligations  I am usually lucky to go once a week during most of the season. I hunted Chestatee a couple of times last bow season, but did not spend any time on Chattahoochee.  I’m not going to invest a lot of time in a spot where I know I’m only going to have one week of bow season before the Bears start receiving a lot more pressure.   

There are plenty of bears on regular national forest, but Chattahoochee WMA has or at least had the highest bear density of probably anywhere on the national forest.  I haven’t seen the data, but since the first dog hunt occurred last year I don’t think there have been more than two or three bears killed on Chattahoochee WMA outside of either of the two dog hunts, and that includes rifle hunts.  I’m not pointing the finger of blame at the dog hunt for those numbers, but for the guys that talk like there is nothing to it, and as if there is a bear hiding behind every tree, they would be mistaken.  My whole point since this began a year and a half ago is if this dog hunt can be scheduled during the last nine days of bow season so as not to interfere with those first few weeks, then what’s the harm in rescheduling it?


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## Raylander (Jan 22, 2021)

The hunt was scheduled on those dates on purpose- as not to interfere with the neighboring state’s seasons. The goal is to draw out of state license fees. IMO the hunt should be for Ga residents ONLY. Many states save the limited opportunity hunts for resident only, I would like to see GA fallow suit. The folks who really take it on the noggin are the ones who lobbied so hard for the hunt in their home state; only to have the opportunity handed off to NRs. The early hunt dates encourage NRs to apply, thus reducing a resident’s chance. It’s a sad deal.. We have plenty of folks in GA these days, we should not be prioritizing NR dollars. Moving the hunt back would probably keep some of the NRs from applying and allow Georgians a better shot at being drawn.


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## jbogg (Jan 22, 2021)

Raylander said:


> The hunt was scheduled on those dates on purpose- as not to interfere with the neighboring state’s seasons. The goal is to draw out of state license fees. IMO the hunt should be for Ga residents ONLY. Many states save the limited opportunity hunts for resident only, I would like to see GA fallow suit. The folks who really take it on the noggin are the ones who lobbied so hard for the hunt in their home state; only to have the opportunity handed off to NRs. The early hunt dates encourage NRs to apply, thus reducing a resident’s chance. It’s a sad deal.. We have plenty of folks in GA these days, we should not be prioritizing NR dollars. Moving the hunt back would probably keep some of the NRs from applying and allow Georgians a better shot at being drawn.



^^^^^^
This is exactly why I thought that Georgia resident Houndsman would be in favor of pushing the hunt back a few weeks.  Tell me about the bear dog training season. Looks to me like it’s legal to train dogs for over four months in GA, but I wasn’t sure if they allow non-residents to train in Georgia, and if so do they have to buy a nonresident hunting license to do so?


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## Raylander (Jan 22, 2021)

jbogg said:


> ^^^^^^
> This is exactly why I thought that Georgia resident Houndsman would be in favor of pushing the hunt back a few weeks.  Tell me about the bear dog training season. Looks to me like it’s legal to train dogs for over four months in GA, but I wasn’t sure if they allow non-residents to train in Georgia, and if so do they have to buy a nonresident hunting license to do so?



I have no idear about license to train. I’d hazard a guess that you e got to have a hunting license but no big game.  Yes, NRs train in Ga, go take a ride through the old Burton WMA in August..

I’m not a hound hunter. I’m a bowman..


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## Heath (Jan 22, 2021)

jbogg said:


> ^^^^^^
> This is exactly why I thought that Georgia resident Houndsman would be in favor of pushing the hunt back a few weeks.  Tell me about the bear dog training season. Looks to me like it’s legal to train dogs for over four months in GA, but I wasn’t sure if they allow non-residents to train in Georgia, and if so do they have to buy a nonresident hunting license to do so?[/QUOTE
> 
> Yes they are required to buy nonresident license.  And yes that was implemented to draw revenue.  What’s the problem with that?
> ...


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## jbogg (Jan 22, 2021)

Based on your post last fall shown below you didn’t seem that thrilled with non resident hunters at that time.  Sounds like you’ve had a change of heart.  Glad to see you were open minded.


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## jbogg (Jan 22, 2021)

Heath, where did I say I had a problem with non residents training dogs in GA?  I asked a simple question for clarification.  Geez you are wired a little tight.


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## Raylander (Jan 22, 2021)

If we are to start prioritizing out of state dollars over residents it will be real fun once the Californians catch wind


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## northgeorgiasportsman (Jan 22, 2021)

Impressive bunch of critters, Heath.  Are those all yours?


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