# Wedding Photos?



## Crickett (Jun 7, 2009)

I've been asked to do photos at a wedding. The couple is on a tight budget & can't afford a professional photographer. So that's why they've asked me to do it. I'm still pretty much an amateur. I have the Canon 40D. Not sure if the wedding is outside or in but what kind of accessories would I need? Like flash, filters, etc? Also where is the best place to get pictures printed professionally? I have used Wal-Mart online & they were ok but I am looking for something more professional. Any other tips y'all can offer would be great? Thanks!


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## Hoss (Jun 7, 2009)

Can't help much with this, but I do know that Feral One has reccommended AdoramaPix for prints.  Here's the link.

http://www.adoramapix.com/?sid=1234060127827741

Here's a couple links with suggestions.

http://digital-photography-school.c...21-tips-for-for-amateur-wedding-photographers

http://www.christophermaxwell.com/wedding-photography-tips.htm

Best of luck with the experience.  

Hoss


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## Crickett (Jun 7, 2009)

Thanks Hoss. Those links are very helpful.


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## Crickett (Jun 7, 2009)

Another question. Is this a good flash?
http://www.adorama.com/SYSF99CEOS.html


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## Crickett (Jun 7, 2009)

No one else can offer any tips or advice? Come on y'all I am really nervous about doing this shoot. I want to make sure I don't mess it up.


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## Browtine (Jun 7, 2009)

I shot one wedding back in my film days for a cousin that couldn't afford a photographer. Here's what I learned... Don't shoot weddings... 

Ok, seriously... Here's what I really learned. First of all, that flash. I'm thinkin' I'd never hang a wedding shoot on a 50$ flash. There are no redo's on 90% of the shots that will really matter, and having a flash either not be strong enough to bounce, or one that konks out on ya mid shoot would really be a bummer. I read the reviews on the link you posted and they're mixed. Not what I'd want to read about a flash I needed to trust for this type of shoot.

 I had a Canon A2E film body at the time, and had a nice Canon flash. I found that in the church, with the high ceilings even my "nice" Canon flash wasn't nearly enough to bounce off the ceiling to light my subjects as they should have been lit. I pulled off enough shots to make them happy, but none that I truly felt were up to par for such an important event. 

So, the things that come to mind based on my one time "experience" would be... 

Find out the location for the wedding as soon as possible. Check ceiling height and color where the money shots will be taken. Take a friend or two prior to the wedding date and shoot some pics there with the equipment you plan to use. Learn before the wedding, and don't go in to the shoot trying to figure things out. Make sure one of your helpers in the pre-shoot wears all white to simulate exposing for a white dress on the big day, if she plans to wear white. I went in without a practice/learning curve shoot and just lucked out on some shots. I'd never go in blind again... Also, have the bride clue you in on what's going to happen where so you can pre-plan where to set up for a nice perspective for the shot without too much interference with the crowd's view of the services. You can be somewhat "intrusive", but I'd limit that as much as possible. 

And as for flash... go with the biggest, best flash you can afford and don't cut corners there. Maybe you could borrow a better one if you can't afford it right now. I know Wolf Camera used to rent equipment. Maybe they'd have a good flash option that you could rent for the price of the cheap unknown quality flash. I'd definitely check before hanging a wedding on the flash you linked to. 

On the subject of flash... Play around with a bouncer like DRB made and posted the instructions to just in case you can't bounce flash from the ceiling. You'll want to soften any direct flash use as much as possible. Also look into a flip bracket to get the flash higher up and off to the side slightly to decrease red-eye and help with the shadows a bit. If you don't have one and can't afford one right now I could probably let you borrow mine. I wish I'd had it when I shot the wedding! Just let me know. If it came down to it I could probably let you borrow a Canon 550EX flash and off camera cord as well. I just hate the thought of you shooting a wedding with that $50 flash...

Past that, make sure your battery is charged FULLY right before the shoot. Ideally you should have at least one spare battery for the camera. In fact, have a spare camera if you can. On that note, have a new set of batteries in your flash, and at least two sets of fresh ones with you. If it's a dark, cavernous room like I shot in, trying to light the shots will EAT light and burn through flash batteries FAST. 

Take lots of shots, bracketing exposures. Also take several memory cards if you're shooting in digital format and shoot some pics on all cards. That way if a card goes south on ya, you will still have something to give them. 

Lastly, doing it for free, which is what I assume you're doing... I handled prints by having ALL my shots, good and bad, printed 4 X 6 and had my cousin's Mother help me put them all into a pretty nice album that I bought for their wedding present. I gave them all the negatives and let them handle any enlargements they wanted. I couldn't afford to furnish the film, batteries, etc... and make them a lot of big, nice prints. They were happy with that and it worked out well. I'd discuss this with them prior to agreeing to do it though, just to make sure you know what they're expecting. If you're shooting digital and not buying film, maybe you could have them a few nice prints made and give them the rest of the files on CD so they could get prints made when they could afford it. Just an idea...

Hope some of this helps. I'm by no means an experienced wedding photog, but I learned a few things on that one. I hope I'm never talked into covering another one unless I end up with some much better suited gear between now and then.

Oh, and one last thing... Make sure you have some large memory cards, and SHOOT IN RAW MODE!!! That will give you much more latitude in processing shots that were less than perfectly exposed. I have the 40D as well, and there's a TON of info in it's RAW files.


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## Browtine (Jun 7, 2009)

Oh, and as for prints... I get my best print results lately from Sams Club, or Ritz/Wolf. I used to use an online printing service, but get results just as good for less at Sams. That's my main printer these days for anything nice enough to care about print quality on.


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## Crickett (Jun 7, 2009)

Thanks Browtine. That helps alot. I do plan on charging them for my time. I talked with the Mother of the Bride today & she told me that she only wants to purchase a memory card for me to use that day & a CD to put of the photos on. I am going to try to talk her out of the card b/c more than likely it will be a waste of her money b/c she will not be able to reuse it unless she buys a camera that will take that card. IMO she will be better off just buying the CD, letting me do the post processing in photoshop & then downloading them to the CD.....right?
She wants to have the photos printed herself. Which is fine with me. She wants this done for a cheap as possible. She did tell me that the actual wedding will be done outside & the reception will be indoors in a room that has no windows. I did ask her to meet me at the venue one day so that I can get a better idea & she can discuss what shots she would like for me to get. She is suppose to get back with me on that. She was very clear with me that she does not want any photos taken during the ceremony. She doesn't want any distractions. Which that is fine with me too. I don't want to be in the way during there special moment. Although the bride may want "You may kiss the Bride" shot.  I dunno though her Mom's paying for it so I think she is pretty much running the show. I may take you up on the flash b/c I really can't afford a decent one right now. I can even rent it from you just tell me a price. 

This will be my 2nd wedding. The first one was my brother's wedding. I didn't have my 40D back then but was using an older 35mm SLR. I gave the film to my sister-in-law & she had them printed herself. I never saw the shots so I have no idea how those turned out.

Oh & I do plan on shooting in RAW.


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## Crickett (Jun 7, 2009)

Maybe I should just refer her to you Browtine


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## stillman (Jun 7, 2009)

I shoot weddings for a living and Browtine covered most of the advice you need at this point.

I will also echo his advice that a third party flash is more than likely bad news. If you want to save money on camera equipment you are better off to buy top quality used items. Take a look around www.keh.com

www.mpix.com is the best place available to the public for professional prints.


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## Browtine (Jun 8, 2009)

Crickett said:


> Thanks Browtine. That helps alot. I do plan on charging them for my time. I talked with the Mother of the Bride today & she told me that she only wants to purchase a memory card for me to use that day & a CD to put of the photos on. I am going to try to talk her out of the card b/c more than likely it will be a waste of her money b/c she will not be able to reuse it unless she buys a camera that will take that card. IMO she will be better off just buying the CD, letting me do the post processing in photoshop & then downloading them to the CD.....right?
> She wants to have the photos printed herself. Which is fine with me. She wants this done for a cheap as possible. She did tell me that the actual wedding will be done outside & the reception will be indoors in a room that has no windows. I did ask her to meet me at the venue one day so that I can get a better idea & she can discuss what shots she would like for me to get. She is suppose to get back with me on that. She was very clear with me that she does not want any photos taken during the ceremony. She doesn't want any distractions. Which that is fine with me too. I don't want to be in the way during there special moment. Although the bride may want "You may kiss the Bride" shot.  I dunno though her Mom's paying for it so I think she is pretty much running the show. I may take you up on the flash b/c I really can't afford a decent one right now. I can even rent it from you just tell me a price.
> 
> This will be my 2nd wedding. The first one was my brother's wedding. I didn't have my 40D back then but was using an older 35mm SLR. I gave the film to my sister-in-law & she had them printed herself. I never saw the shots so I have no idea how those turned out.
> ...



Well, that doesn't sound quite as bad as being expected to get the money shots during a ceremony. And I think you're right about the memory card. I'd much rather be able to process and edit my shots before they see them. Handling post processing and burning them to disc for her would be the way I'd handle it or I think I'd have to bow out. I see nothing but trouble coming from handing someone like that a card full of unedited photos. She'd be expecting spit shined and polished type end results and you just don't get that without editing sometimes. I rarely EVER take a shot that I don't at least do a levels or curves adjust on and then sharpen to suit the end use. 

I'd just explain to her, in layman's terms of course, that to be able to give her the best images possible you will be shooting in a digital format that won't print directly through any available printing options (that's the truth, too, so you don't even have to lie...) so you'll have to process them in your software and burn them to disk for her. I'd think she'd understand the logic in that. 





Crickett said:


> Maybe I should just refer her to you Browtine



Ummm... I'm busy that day!   Or, refer to the first thing I mentioned learning from shooting that one wedding.  

In all seriousness, I'm willing to help in any way I can as far as advice, or even in post processing if you need it. As I mentioned before, I'm no pro, but I'm willing to help with anything I do know how to do. 

Feel free to PM me anytime about anything to do with this. I'm not good at keeping up with threads sometimes.


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## Browtine (Jun 8, 2009)

stillman said:


> I shoot weddings for a living and Browtine covered most of the advice you need at this point.
> 
> I will also echo his advice that a third party flash is more than likely bad news. If you want to save money on camera equipment you are better off to buy top quality used items. Take a look around www.keh.com
> 
> www.mpix.com is the best place available to the public for professional prints.



Thanks for the heads up on mpix. I haven't had any online printing done in years and wouldn't have had a clue where to go for higher end results.


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## stillman (Jun 8, 2009)

I missed the part about her buying a card for you to shoot then hand over. I would never do this. If she doesn't know what she's doing she can mess up the originals or corrupt the card or 100 other bad things. And then it will look like you did something wrong.


If you need some equipment for the day you might want to look at www.ppratlanta.com for rentals.


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## fussyray (Jun 8, 2009)

I know how you feel, back in 2007 I got a new kodak I think a 710. I had a few week to play it and my best friend ask me to do a wedding. They did not have alot of money to spent, so did did this as a wedding gift. They loves it all I had was the Kodak. 
http://forum.gon.com/showthread.php?t=93256&highlight=

all the pic are still on the walmart link.

Good Luck!!


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## Crickett (Jun 8, 2009)

Thanks everyone.

Stillman I did get your PM & I will probably call you after I talk to the Mother of the Bride again & she lets me know for sure that she wants me to do it. 

My Hubby is the one that mentioned her buying a card. He wasn't thinking about post processing either. I will just have to explain it to her that she will not be able to print the photos & I will have to convert them to a different format. 

Now when I do convert them from RAW what is going to be the best format for printing? tiff? I don't really print most of my photos so I just usually convert them to jpg.


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## JasonF (Jun 8, 2009)

I've shot a couple of weddings so I'll try and offer what I learned/know...

First, shooting a wedding is a big responsibility.  I would highly recomend shooting it with someone else or if you must shoot it alone, have a back-up body.  
Find out where this wedding is to be held...if it's at a church, make sure you are allowed to use a flash as some churches do not permit flash use inside.
If flash is not permited, a fast prime (24mm-85mm range)  is a must for the ceremony.  Make sure to have a wide angle lens for group shots.  I shot one wedding enirely with a 50mm prime and another with a 24-70 , 70-200 combo...so it really depends on the venue.  Rent the glass if you don't have it!!
Take lots of pictures!!
Make sure to get the "money" shots:

Ceremony
Outside of ceremony site
Maid of honor walking down the aisle
Bridesmaids walking down the aisle
Flower girl and ring bearer walking down aisle
Ceremony musicians
Officiant
Close up of bride, just before she makes her entrance
Bride and father walking down aisle
Groom seeing bride for first time
Father giving bride away
The unity ceremony
Close up of bride and groom saying the vows
Wide shot of bride and groom saying the vows
Exchanging the rings
The kiss
Bride and groom leaving the ceremony

After the wedding (perferably) is when you want to get the group shots of the wedding party and family.

Reception
Outside of reception site
Bride & Groom arriving
Table centerpieces
Table setting
Bride & Groom's table (head table)
Guest book
Guest signing the guest book
Closeup of bride and groom's place card
Wedding cake
Gift table
Decorations 
The food
Bride & Groom's first dance
Bride & Father dancing
Groom & Mother dancing
Guests dancing
Bride & Groom cutting the cake
Bride & Groom feeding each other cake
Toasts 
Bride & Groom drinking champagne
Signing the marriage license
Bride throwing bouquet
Groom retrieving garter
Groom tossing garter
Garter/Bouquet dance
Bride & Groom leaving party
Bride & Groom driving away
_Be sure and cature the emotion of the wedding!_

Other Must Have Shots
Ring shot
Bride getting ready
Groom getting ready
Brides shoes
The dress before the bride puts it on
Etc, etc, etc...

I recomend doing alot of research before the big day to prepair yourself as much as possible.
Shoot me a PM if you want an I'll send you some great links.

Good luck!


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## Crickett (Jun 8, 2009)

Thanks Jason. That does help. The only thing(for some strange reason) the Mother of the Bride does NOT want any shots during the actual ceremony. I know the Bride has said that she does wants shots of the ceremony & doesn't want a lot of posed shots. They will have to decide on that one. 

I'm still not 100% sure that see is going to use me. She is suppose to call me to let me know. I haven't heard from her yet. 


Also, with me being an amateur what do y'all think is a fair price? I told her a price & I could hear her gasp on the other end of the line. She is expecting me to be there for a minimum of 4 hrs. so I was thinking somewhere around $250-$300 for everything(i.e. My time, post processing, costs for the CD) Is that too much or does that sound reasonable? She doesn't want to pay more than $200 for everything. This is my first wedding with this camera but I don't want to undercharge for my time. Also, do I ask for a non-refundable deposit & how much? I know I have so many questions. Maybe I'm just not ready for this.


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## leo (Jun 9, 2009)

I have had a few request to do friends and families weddings, but I have declined ... mainly for the reasons that seem to be developing in your last post .... Good luck


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## Razorback (Jun 9, 2009)

Okay I'm both lazy & busy at the moment but here a few cents of what I have to say on shooting weddings...

GET PAID FOR YOUR TIME! 

Now that I said that subtly enough. Make sure your getting paid for your 'shooting time',  'computer time', 'driving time' expendable hardware~gas, CD's, memory cards, etc, rented hardware and anything else you can think of.  Now how much you charge is up to you but think about ALL your hard cost that need to be covered as well as PIA cost the MIL may cost.  Make it enough to add some cool kit to your 40D.

Keep communicating and repeating back to the MIL & Bride what they are asking for.  That way you know what they want & you have told them what you heard them say.  So EVERYONE knows what they will get..you get $$$ & they get the images they want.

Shooting weddings can be fun or like sticking sharp sticks in your eye just depends on your attitude.

Razor


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## Razorback (Jun 9, 2009)

Crickett said:


> Another question. Is this a good flash?
> http://www.adorama.com/SYSF99CEOS.html




Reviews are not so good.

If I was going to add a flash, my first choice is the 580 EX II, then 430 EXII either new or used.

Razor


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## Crickett (Jun 9, 2009)

Thanks Razor.

I doubt I am shooting this wedding now. I haven't heard from either of them so I have no idea what's going on. I plan on calling her tonight to find out what she's decided on. I am pretty much only charging her for my time & the CD. I plan on using some of the money to purchase the PSE7 that I've been wanting for months. If I have to rent any equipment I will not charge her for that since that will be something extra that I will be wanting to use. I will keep y'all posted.


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## Browtine (Jun 9, 2009)

Crickett said:


> Thanks Razor.
> 
> I doubt I am shooting this wedding now. I haven't heard from either of them so I have no idea what's going on. I plan on calling her tonight to find out what she's decided on. I am pretty much only charging her for my time & the CD. I plan on using some of the money to purchase the PSE7 that I've been wanting for months. If I have to rent any equipment I will not charge her for that since that will be something extra that I will be wanting to use. I will keep y'all posted.



If she says she's still interested in having you do it, I'd set her a deadline to make the final decision and make a deposit (She'd pay in full ahead of time if it were me, I think...). Let her know that you need the money up front because you may or may not have to rent some equipment that you'll need, and don't have since you don't normally shoot weddings.Tell her that you will need enough notice that you can do some test shots at the locations and such. If she went past that deadline without letting me know something I'd decline the shoot. I'm afraid she's gonna try to come to you last minute, when she figures out nobody's gonna do it free, and expect you to be able to just run in and do it. I'm afraid that sort of scenario would only play out badly for all involved. 

I just really have a bad taste in my mouth about this lady already, just based on what you've posted about her. Just not getting a good feeling about this at all.


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## Crickett (Jun 9, 2009)

Just wanted to let y'all know that I've decided to pass on this wedding. I really appreciate all of the advice y'all have given me. It will help me later on if/when I do decide to do a wedding.


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## huntin1 (Jun 12, 2009)

I'm a bit late here. But I'll offer my 2 cents in case you decide to shoot someone elses wedding.

My ex F-I-L owned a photo studio, I used to help him with weddings. That was back when I still had my Canon F-1n's, and A-1.

The flash you posted a link to will likely be a disappointment. I agree with razorback, go with either the Canon 580 EX II, or 430 EX II, they cost a lot more, but you get what you pay for.

The only filters we used were a cross screen star filter. Makes points of light, like the flame on candles, look like stars, kind of cool, and a soft focus filter.

We used 4 cameras, my 2 F-1n's, and A-1, and his A-1 and an 80mm Hasselblad. That way we could use different film, filter combinations and just grab a different camera instead of messing with changing film or filters. It worked for us.

Other than that I can't add anything more to the advice you have already gotten. 

People have asked me on several occasions to shoot their weddings, I tell them to hire a pro and skimp somewhere else. There is no way to go back and duplicate that special day.


huntin1


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## Bubba_1122 (Jun 13, 2009)

Crickett said:


> Just wanted to let y'all know that I've decided to pass on this wedding.



Good move. 

Don't know if you realize it, but you call yourself an amateur photographer. You weren't going to be when you took that deposit and charged them to take their wedding pics.  

There are some implications from a liability standpoint. If something happened and the difficult mom wasn't satisfied with the pics of the "once in a lifetime" event, not unheard of that she'd hire a lawyer. Doubt your homeowners is going to cover professional liability for a professional (ie charged money) photographer. 

Second, when you start using your photography equipment for pay, might have some issues with coverage for business property on your homeowners as well. 

I'm trying real hard to accumulate some nice camera gear. Would hate to find out too late that earning a couple hundred bucks had jeapordized coverage for my stuff.  

Bottom line - couple of hundred bucks to deal with difficult people really isn't worth it. 

I shoot a fair amount of sports for a local team (no pay - I just do it for the experience and out of my love of sports - primarily football). It allows me to be on the sidelines during the games, up close to the action. 

Had a friend that knows I enjoy photography and do that. He asked me if I'd shoot his wedding in August. I told if would if they'd get married on the football field. His fiance declined.     .

(PS - on the liability issue, you might inadvertantly do what I did this morning. Took my camera with me fishing. Took 173 pics. Sunrise/first light with a wide angle over the lake. Close ups of gators. Various types of birds, including an osprey diving and coming out with a fish. Pair of wood ducks swimming - male and female. Also, very pretty pic of the two of them on a log. And I looked at the pics, processed a few of them, thought I had imported them on my computer, put the card back in my camera and erased and formatted the card.    Guess what. I hadn't imported them. Gone in a blink. Where's my sign? )


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## Crickett (Jun 13, 2009)

Thanks for the additional advice y'all. I'm glad I declined on this one. I am not prepared for that kinda stuff yet. 



Sorry to hear about your photos Bubba. I only delete my pics on my card when it's almost full or after I make sure I've downloaded them on the computer & saved to a file.


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## Razorback (Jun 15, 2009)

Hijack on...
Bubba,
If you haven't used the 'erased & formatted' card yet you still have a good chance of recovering those shots.
Google up 'photo recovery software'.  You should get several choices for recovering those 'lost' images.  Granted they will have new file names & dates but you will have your images.
If you have any questions shoot me a PM.
...highjack off.

Crickett, 
I'm glad you dodged a bullet.
Razor


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## pdsniper (Jun 15, 2009)

Crickett
I photograph weddings all the time and it looks like your getting some very good coaching there is a place called Mpix.com and the picture processing they do is outstanding and there pricing is very reasonable


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## Crickett (Jun 15, 2009)

MOTB called me today. She asked me if I was still interested & I politely told her no. I told her that she should really hire a professional to do the job. I explained to her why I decided not to do it & she understood. 

Thanks again for all of the advice y'all.


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