# Black Powder rifle "must-haves"



## pnome (Jul 11, 2007)

All,


Ok just got a new hawken like my other thread describes.  The rifle won't be coming with any extras though.  So I need to purchase accessories and whatnot for it.

What are the things I'm going to need to buy before I take it to the range to shoot?  Any thing you think will help out to get me sighted in and ready to hunt hogs.


TIA!!


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## 7Mag Hunter (Jul 12, 2007)

bullet starter
Jag
Ball(bullet) puller
Cleaning rod (range rod)
Lots of patches(rags)
Bore butter-solvent-
Bore Brush
Bore Mops
Spare nipples
Nipple Pick (make one from paper clip)
Tools for nipples and nipple plug, screwdriver,pliers
Bullets/Balls
Powder 
Powder Measure
caps
"Possibles Bag" (to put all this stuff in)
Targets, just in case you ever get this thing to shoot !!!!

Just kidding...Good Luck, and let us know how your Black
Powder experience progresses


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## pnome (Jul 12, 2007)

7Mag Hunter said:


> bullet starter
> Jag
> Ball(bullet) puller
> Cleaning rod (range rod)
> ...



Thanks again for all your help 7mag.


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## 7Mag Hunter (Jul 12, 2007)

Just thought of a couple other "tips"....

As stated earlier, make sure you seat the ball or bullet
"firmly" (not to tight) on top of the powder....Further..
Now , mark a line on your ramrod to the proper loading
depth for your load...Prolly have to have 2 marks, if you
use balls and conicals...
As you shoot multiple shots during practice, the rod will
become harder to seat the bullet (crud build-up) , so 
to ensure proper seating depth for each shot, use the
visual indicator on your ramrod....
If you do not seat the bullet firmly on the powder, it can
result in excess pressure and possibly damage to your
gun( and you!!!)...
Also, always pop a few caps before you 1st load er up....
Another...Always remove nipple plug and nipple for
storage, and like above make a scribe mark on your nipple
plug, so you can align it up with the hole in the barrel
and make sure your hammer will strike the cap...
Just make sure you have a clear channel for the cap to
fire and send a spark to the powder...
Plugged nipple hole (not aligned) or wet, or packed
powder are the main reasons muzzle loaders do not fire...
Still another...There are 3 diameter balls for the 50 cal,
and you may want to try all, but I would use the larger
( .490 or.495), as it will give you tighter seal with your  
patches...Try different thickness of patches....

Start with 60-70 gr of Pyrodex or Triple 7, and get your
hands dirty !!!!


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## LOVEMYLABXS (Jul 12, 2007)

7mag didn't leave much out but one thing I didn't see in his lists were some speed loader. These little plastic cylinders normally come in a pack of 3 and don't cost a lot but are very handy in the field if you need a quick reload be sure to take these to the range and practice using them.


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## pfharris1965 (Jul 12, 2007)

*...*

Great list that 7Mag provided...a good start for sure and as time wears on you will find other items you may want...

A few things you may consider adding...

- a medium sized tool box with a top storage shelf to dedicate to your black powder supplies...then from the box you can load up your possibles bag before going to the field...just a good way to keep everything in a central location...

- pipe cleaners...for when you remove the nipple...it is great to soak it in solvent and run it through the bolster to keep it clean...

- bottle of 70% isopropyl alcohol...for use in prepping the gun to fire after it has been lubed and stored for any period of time...this is just a suggestion...I soak a patch in it and run it up and down the barrel and it dries away quickly leaving a clean, lube free bore...then of course I will pop a cap to make sure the bolster and such are clear...

- Range rod for when you are shooting repeatedly...I bought one that is about 4 feet long with a big wooden handle and the rod is brass and you can easily attach any of your various jags to it...this rod is a lot more durable than the one that comes with the gun itself...the one that comes with the gun of course is still the most ideal for use in the field...

- Lastly, I may have missed it on the list, but a bore scraper jag...it looks like a big slot screwdriver tip and is great for removing powder/residue buildup from the very bottom of the bore...

Just my thoughts...you will enjoy the heck out of that gun I bet...


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## pnome (Jul 12, 2007)

She arrived in the mail today...







Thanks for the replies.  I've got some shopping to do!


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## Nicodemus (Jul 12, 2007)

Pnome, here`s what`s in my percussion rifle pouch, or tied to the shoulder strap. 

Elk antler powder horn 
deer antler powder measure-70 grains
brass powder measure (adjustable)
Ted Cash brass percussion caps holder
patchin` cloth (can also be used for cleanin` patches)
nipple wrench
spare nipple
blacksmith forged screwdriver and vent pick
small bottle of bear oil
patch puller
ball puller
cleanin` jag
extra bullets
a few small feathers (for pluggin` the vent hole while cleanin`)

All this fits into a small buckskin riflemans pouch,and this kit will clean, maintain, and load this rifle.

I also have a 4 foot range rod with a T handle on it for serious work.

This setup is for my 50 caliber Great Plains rifle.

The pouch and setup for my flintlock is similar, but contains the items needed for that particular rifle.


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## pnome (Jul 12, 2007)

nicodemus said:


> Pnome, here`s what`s in my percussion rifle pouch, or tied to the shoulder strap.
> 
> Elk antler powder horn
> deer antler powder measure-70 grains
> ...



Thanks Nic!  BTW:  What is the bear oil for?


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## Nicodemus (Jul 12, 2007)

The bear oil is used to lubricate the mechanism and all metal parts of the rifle after I clean it. I also use it to grease patches when loadin` for huntin`.  When shootin` at a range, I just spit patch. I`m something of a traditionalist and like to use the same stuff that was used "back then". It works well, and both my rifles and my blackpowder pistol stay in fine workin` condition. I don`t know what it is about bear oil, but a little goes a long way!

My cleanin` solution is cold water. I learned this trick from Chotawlb. I was curious as to how the early frontiersmen and fur trappers kept their weapons in good firin` condition way out from civilization with a minimum of gear and supplies. He explained the method and it`s really simple and effective. Plug the flash hole on a flintlock, or the nipple hole on a percussion rifle with a feather. Pour a small amount of cold water down the barrel. With your thumb, plug the open end of the barrel and shake the water in the barrel back and forth till it softens up the foulin`. Then set the buttstock on the ground with the barrel up. Use your ramrod with the cleanin` jag and patch on it and force it partway down the barrel till there is a good bit of pressure built up. Reach down with the other hand and pull the feather while forcin` the rod down at the same time. DON`T DO THIS CLOSE TO THE COOKIN` FIRE OR THE WOMENFOLKS!! The water will be forced out of the flash hole and take most of the foulin` with it. Then, run clean patches down the barrel to remove remainin` foulin` and to dry the barrel. After that run a patch soaked in bear oil down the barrel, and wipe the rest of the metal on the gun down as well.

Modern solvents work well too, but water does just as good, and is mighty cheap.

I forgot something in my first post too. I have a short starter made from a section of deer antler and hickory stick.


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## pfharris1965 (Jul 13, 2007)

*...*

Good point on the use of the water Nick...I bet it would have been hard to get solvent back in the day...

One thing and you may have additional info as well, but for aside from water, I also use a home made cleaner/solvent that is a mixture of 1/3 each of - 

- Murphy's Oil Soap
- Hydrogen Peroxide
- Isopropyl Alcohol

A friend of mine that collects a lot of custom made flintlocks, etc taught me about that...any other mixtures that you know of?  or little tips/tricks...Just curious...


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## pfharris1965 (Jul 16, 2007)

*...*



pnome said:


> She arrived in the mail today...
> 
> 
> Thanks for the replies. I've got some shopping to do!


 
That is a pretty gun...you will be hooked once you start experimenting with various powder amounts to find the right load for your desired range and situation...

Is that barrel a 1 in 66 turn?


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## pnome (Jul 16, 2007)

WPH44 said:


> That is a pretty gun...you will be hooked once you start experimenting with various powder amounts to find the right load for your desired range and situation...
> 
> Is that barrel a 1 in 66 turn?



I'm hooked.  It's actually a 1 in 24.


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## pfharris1965 (Jul 16, 2007)

*...*



pnome said:


> I'm hooked. It's actually a 1 in 24.


 
Cool!  I saw your other thread after I posted this...

That 1 in 24 will put a nice zip in the shot and give you a nice flat shot and good group for a pretty long distance...

Just wait til you kill an animal with it...nothing like the smell and smoke of that burnt powder hovering all around you on a still morning...quite a rush...


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## Flintrock (Jul 17, 2007)

pnome said:


> I'm hooked.  It's actually a 1 in 24.



.
pnome
Please  recheck yor barrel.  I have never heard of a 1 in 24 twist. A inline normally has a 1 in 28 twist. I think with the style muzzleloader you have it is a 24 inch barrel with either a 1 in 48 or 1 in 66 twist. 
.
IF it is a 1 in 66 twist, You will have to shoot round balls and not bullets as bullets will not shoot well at all in a slow twist barrel
IF it is a 1 in 48 twist, this is considered a hybrid twist and will shoot round ball or bullets ok but will not normally stack either hole in hole at a long distance.
.
One more thing, since your rifle has a drum, you will need to shoot loose powder and not a pellet as a pellet can not turn the corner into the drum area thus  leaving an air pocket in the drum. The loose powder will fill up the drum allowing the fire from the cap to directly contact the powder.
.
Please confirm your twist and reply.
Thanks


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## pnome (Jul 17, 2007)

Flintrock said:


> .
> pnome
> Please  recheck yor barrel.  I have never heard of a 1 in 24 twist. A inline normally has a 1 in 28 twist. I think with the style muzzleloader you have it is a 24 inch barrel with either a 1 in 48 or 1 in 66 twist.
> .
> ...



Here it is a Cabelas:
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/t...e+matchall&Nty=1&Ntt=hawken+carbine&noImage=0

Unless they are lying, it's 1 in 24.

Check out my range report for what I am shooting: http://forum.gon.com/showthread.php?t=124326


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## Flintrock (Jul 17, 2007)

Thanks for the reply. .The shorter 21 inch barrel explains it.I could not tell the barrel length with the original picture.
.
Now that the barrel twist has been clearded up for me.I can tell you that you will have to shoot the cronical bullets/sabots/powerbelts ect... and not the patched round ball. Your instructions probably tell you that.
.
You will still need to get the loose powder and not the pellets. This will require a powder measure.
.
as far as accuracy. Try what ever your manual suggest.If the results are not to your satifaction, try a different combination  of powder / brand/type of bullet .


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## pnome (Jul 18, 2007)

Flintrock said:


> Now that the barrel twist has been clearded up for me.I can tell you that you will have to shoot the cronical bullets/sabots/powerbelts ect... and not the patched round ball. Your instructions probably tell you that.




The instructions suggest there is nothing wrong with using .490 round balls.  They have a maximum powder load of 90grs.  I'm using 80.  It also contains detailed instructions for loading PRBs.  

I see where you are coming from.  I've read, both on this forum and elsewhere, that PRBs prefer slower twists.     However, they shot just fine for me.   I was impressed.   I was prepared for them to be awful and had some powerbelts and other conicals lined up, but I didn't bother with them after the PRBs worked.  (at least good enough for my purpose anyway)  

I don't plan on ever attempting a shot beyond 80yrds or so with just iron sights and the PRBs we're all within a pie plate at 80 for me.   I'll be mostly hunting for feral hogs in creek bottoms in the north Georgia mountains, not many long shots there. 

Also to consider, PRBs cost me $8 for 100, while the powerbelts are something like $14 for 13.


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## contender* (Jul 20, 2007)

I was reading the posts here about cleaning and am wondering if i may be going about it wrong. I have just been using dish washing liquid and as hot as I can stand water in the bathtub to clean my barrel. I will use the soapy solution with jags and  patches until the barrel is clean then rinse with very hot water. I have a TC Scout.


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## Nicodemus (Jul 20, 2007)

contender-6030 said:


> I was reading the posts here about cleaning and am wondering if i may be going about it wrong. I have just been using dish washing liquid and as hot as I can stand water in the bathtub to clean my barrel. I will use the soapy solution with jags and  patches until the barrel is clean then rinse with very hot water. I have a TC Scout.



Nothin` wrong with that method. I cleaned mine that way for years.


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## choctawlb (Jul 20, 2007)

The hot water and soap will clean a muzzleloader no problem, and do a good job. The reason for using just plain water is pretty much the same principle as cleaning a black iron pot or skillet. If you use soap, you remove the oil in the pores and the pot or barrel never gets seasoned. I never use soap on my cast iron pots, or my muzzleloader barrels. 
Some folks don't like cast iron pots because food sticks to em, if you clean them with soap.Soap has ruined many a good cast iron pot. I've got one that is 24 years old and has never seen soap except when I cleaned the coating off it when it was brand new. You can cook a pineapple upside down cake in it right now, turn it upside down , and it will fall out ,no buildup. Just wipe it out with a rag, and your good to go.  I just use water and a straw scrubber, and mine never stick. 
I figure it probrobly works the same way with the smokepole barrel. Also I never use any petrolium products to lube or clean with . Just natural stuff like bear oil, deer lard, and sweet oil(olive oil), and I can shoot several shots before I have any problems ramming a ball home. Folks didn't carry a bunch of cleaners with them in the old days, and a lot of times in a hostile enviroment, you couldn't build a fire to heat water. Plain water is available everwhere, easy to use, and cleans just as good. 
Ken


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## broncobob (Jul 20, 2007)

*Neat trick*

pnome, go to a welding supply house or a auto parts supplier ( NAPA ) and buy you some torch tip cleaners. To clean the nipple and the flash channel out. Next here's the trick, use a Minny ball or a maxi ball. I found that they shoot the best out of my Hawken Renegade. The "old style" muzzlers will handle up to 120 grains of black powder or my favorite which is Hodgon 777. Anyway back to the trick. Use your ram rod to clean the barrel in between shots. Place a clean square patch or a round one which ever you have. ( It needs to be thin ones like comes with a gun cleaning kit.) Load the gun with your powder charge use the ball starter and shove the bullet as far down the barrel as the ball starter will reach then place the patch over the muzzle and use the jag end ( The jag end is designed to hold on to the cleaning patchs.) of the ram rod and push the patch down the barrel and seat the bullet firmly and simply remove the ram rod and the patch will come out dirty and your barrel will stay a lot cleaner and your groups will be tighter.   I hope this will help.


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## pnome (Jul 22, 2007)

broncobob said:


> Use your ram rod to clean the barrel in between shots. Place a clean square patch or a round one which ever you have. ( It needs to be thin ones like comes with a gun cleaning kit.) Load the gun with your powder charge use the ball starter and shove the bullet as far down the barrel as the ball starter will reach then place the patch over the muzzle and use the jag end ( The jag end is designed to hold on to the cleaning patchs.) of the ram rod and push the patch down the barrel and seat the bullet firmly and simply remove the ram rod and the patch will come out dirty and your barrel will stay a lot cleaner and your groups will be tighter.   I hope this will help.



Thanks!  That sounds like a great little trick.


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## 7Mag Hunter (Jul 22, 2007)

I'll add a bit more about cleaning....Specifically cleaning
in the bathtub....Tried that several times untill the wife
decided it would be "better" if I did it outside !!!!!
Know what I mean ????

Now I use a 5 gallon bucket with hot soapy water....I do 
use a hair dryer and lots of patches to dry it inside and
out...Then a good slather (inside and out) of Bore Butter..
Use several patches to remove excess lube before
shooting, and pop a few caps before the 1st shot to
ensure ignition...

Man, all this talk about Hawkens...Guess I will hafta get
mine out, and get dirty !!!!
Thanks, pnome!!!!


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