# Are Plott hounds good for a bay dog?



## Mossy Oak Man (Mar 4, 2010)

I was wanting to know if Plott hounds are good for hog bay dogs?


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## hoghunter102 (Mar 4, 2010)

Yeah there pretty good.


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## tnhillbilly (Mar 4, 2010)

YES, they are, some better than others, depending on the bloodline, but mostly all plotts are good bay dogs, been raising them for almost 20 yrs.


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## NCHillbilly (Mar 4, 2010)

Plotts'll get er done. I'd hate to guess how many bears and Russian boars up here in the mountains have been got by a pack of Plotts. Plotts originated right here in Haywood County, NC and were originally bear dogs, but have been used for boar hunting too since the Russian hogs showed up here in the Smokies in the 1920's. Like TNhillbilly said, there are different bloodlines, some of them nowadays have been bred more toward being coon dogs.


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## MULE (Mar 4, 2010)

If you don't mind open mouthed dogs and you get your stock from big game dogs, there is no better as far as hounds go.


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## gin house (Mar 4, 2010)

plotts are great hounds, if you could find a silent one you would have a jam up dog but that would be hard to find.


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## luludavis (Mar 4, 2010)

No bark on track dont need that get a silent dog like the best Black mouth curs !!!!!!!!!!


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## Scott Cain (Mar 4, 2010)

*AS a breed*

AS a breed i think that if you conpare them to the curs you will not be happy with there gritt! There are some rough plotts but i am speaking about the plott dog as a whole .In my opinion too many folks have bred them for coon hunting and they are no were near the dogs of the past. Plotts have the rep but now a days a gritty one is an exception rather than a rule. Try you a good family of good hunting curs and you will be much more happy as far as there fighting big game.I promise you it will save you alot of money and time if the actual fighting of the game is what you are asking about. If i were going the hound route i would recomend white cloud bred big game walkers.Although if you have a good line of JULY you couldnt go wrong. This is like every one else and only my opinion.It is what i have learned over 30 years of hunting all kinds of dogs. I hope this will help you.


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## big country rnr (Mar 5, 2010)

There aint many dogs that can compare to the drive and stay that a plott dogs has! They have lasted this long for a reason!  There the real deal...$2k Couldnt move my plott ..RUFF-N-READYS PD KATE !


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## NCHillbilly (Mar 5, 2010)

There's plenty of good, really gritty Plotts around here. The good gritty ones aren't the ones that get sold off to Georgia, they pretty much usually have a home for life.


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## Scott Cain (Mar 5, 2010)

mossy oak man I guess it depends on what you consider gritty. TO ME they are not as abreed. Go and hunt with some then hunt with other breeds and that way you can judge for your self brfore you put down your money!


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## koyote76 (Mar 5, 2010)

Scott Cain said:


> mossy oak man I guess it depends on what you consider gritty. TO ME they are not as abreed. Go and hunt with some then hunt with other breeds and that way you can judge for your self brfore you put down your money!



i have to go with scott on this one. as a whole breed in these modern times they are not as gritty as compared to a good cur. ive seen many of plotts that were gritty as they come. alot of ppl have gotten away from gritty plotts becasue of coon hunting or for the pure fact that 90 percent of what they are used for actually trees, unlike a hog, execpt for the occasional walking bear.

what really has diluted plotts is alot of houndsman. who claims the plotts to be a hound and breeds for the hound traits. they are not hounds they are pretty much curs, back in the old days they werent so filled with houndy traits as seen today. if you get yourself a nice full crockett dog than you will be happy with it. they are more cur than any plott. seems like a lil bit of bull dog was added to them. 

anyways if you get some good plotts you will be pleased, bad ones you wont be pleased and that goes for any breed.


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## MULE (Mar 5, 2010)

Like I said before, get it out of big game stock and not small game stock and  you'll be happy with them as far as hounds go. Sure they don't all make it as hog dogs but there isn't a bred of dogs out that 100% of them make it.


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## koyote76 (Mar 6, 2010)

MULE said:


> Like I said before, get it out of big game stock and not small game stock and  you'll be happy with them as far as hounds go. Sure they don't all make it as hog dogs but there isn't a bred of dogs out that 100% of them make it.



hes right. what would you say the blood lines for the best hog plott. pocohantas, weems, crockett,

and actually if you follow mules post. hes gotta a good way of running a pack. one plott with some catahoulas. very good way of hunting if you got good rangey cats. 

you might want to go that route. esp if your dogs are getting dropped in areas where they have to find sign.


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## hawgrider1200 (Mar 6, 2010)

Lots of Plott Hounds used for Bear, Mountain Lion, Coyote and bobcat hunting. They are some of the grittiest hounds god built. I suspect they would b great for hunting hogs.


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## tnhillbilly (Mar 6, 2010)

Scott Cain said:


> AS a breed i think that if you conpare them to the curs you will not be happy with there gritt! There are some rough plotts but i am speaking about the plott dog as a whole .In my opinion too many folks have bred them for coon hunting and they are no were near the dogs of the past. Plotts have the rep but now a days a gritty one is an exception rather than a rule. Try you a good family of good hunting curs and you will be much more happy as far as there fighting big game.I promise you it will save you alot of money and time if the actual fighting of the game is what you are asking about. If i were going the hound route i would recomend white cloud bred big game walkers.Although if you have a good line of JULY you couldnt go wrong. This is like every one else and only my opinion.It is what i have learned over 30 years of hunting all kinds of dogs. I hope this will help you.



  A walker grittier than a plott? I have to disaggree on that one, not to say that there aint a "FEW" gritty walkers out there, but as you were saying about the plotts to curs, walkers "as a breed just aint got it. and yes i have owned both. There are plenty of gritty catchin plotts out there, they just aint advertised like the coon dogs are. but i will agree that alot of them are being bred for coon huntin, but the curs are being bred for color, so you could say that all breeds are being watered down. it all boiles down to personal preference, and finding the right line, and as was stated before i would go with the crocket line, they are gritty. JMO


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## NCHillbilly (Mar 6, 2010)

I've seen a couple of those "non-gritty" Plotts fall ten feet out of a tree because they were clamped down hard on a big bear's hindermost parts while he was climbing up it, and there has been a pile of big Russian hogs killed in these mountains with packs of straight Plotts. Some of the Plotts I've had were too durn ill to suit me when they got stirred up. They do have some GA cur bred into some strains back a long time ago, but they're definitely more hound than cur, IMO but they have some cur characteristics, like shorter ears and a generally hotter nose than most hound breeds. My dad bear hunted back in the day some with Von Plott , Taylor Crockett and several more of those old-school NC bear hunters and Plott breeders. Plott Creek where the breed originated, is a few miles from where I live. I agree that there are more coon-dog types now than there used to be, but there are still strains bred for big game here in the mountains, too. The two main types you see around here mixed into in bear packs are hotter-nosed gritty dogs that will eat a bear up, and cold-nosed, more laid-back houndy ones that can work out a cold track and get it to the point that the gritty ones can do their thang. 
Of course Plotts are like any other breed of hound that I've owned-there are a few really good ones, several decent ones, and the majority aren't good for anything except running up a feed bill. One downside of Plotts that I have noticed is that the pups seem to be later starters than most breeds.


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## JohnE (Mar 7, 2010)

Has anyone heard of the Cascade line? 
My dad used to have a couple of them he got from washington state.
Short eared, VERY gritty, and liked to fight. I think the line is about dead now though.


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## Scott Cain (Mar 7, 2010)

*ALL at once.*

First of all i am not a plott hater . But the truth is the truth.   I never said that there wasnt any gritty plotts but as a breed i do not find them any grittier than a walker redbone or any other hound. TRaditionally plotts may have been but not know. I have owned Weems CAscade,Hawg,  KID and i personally bought 4 from H.T.Crocket himself. AT the time he lived near Franklin N.C Talked to him many times. Ironically he too felt the plott dog was loosing its grit.And had set out to fix it.                                                                                     N.c Hillbilly if you are inpressed with plotts hunt them. I have had fiest dogs grab a bear by the backside going up a tree . Is that what you call grit.                                                                                          Tn hillbilly laugh all you want buddy but i owned a plott dog of yours you said was gritty he bayed 15 feet of a boar hog is that the grit you are talking about. dont mean to bite you buddy but it happens when you jump in a fight.                                                                                       Hawggrinder you suspect they would make good hog dogs ?Have you ever owned any plotts that you used on hogs?                                                                                           Koyote76 you buddy have proven my point if you have to feed cur dogs in to a plott what does that tell you about the plott? If they are so rough why do you need to send in the curs ?If the dog needs help send in more plotts! Just something to think about.


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## hoghunter08 (Mar 7, 2010)

mr. scott, i hav a lot of respect for u and have really enjoyed reading ur article in bayed solid last month and am looking forward to next months. however the plotts as a whole breed may have lost some grit but still would not compare them to any other hound. if u get the right stock crocket,gante,ursus,nabek,and i have even had som rough star mountain bred dogs. they will make u good big game dogs if u get them from big game stock wether it be bear or hog it doesnt matter.

mr scott, what would u consider a gritty dog?


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## alpha1 (Mar 7, 2010)

*plott hounds*

Like any breed there is more crap than good.  Find the right line and the right dog within that line.


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## NCHillbilly (Mar 7, 2010)

If grit and meanness was all that mattered in a hunting dog, nobody would hunt with anything but rabid rottweilers, jack russells and 10-year old chihuahuas. I like a dog to hunt with that has a good nose, doesn't sound like you're beating it with a stick when it opens, and has some sense and a good personality. I don't like silent dogs, either. In other words, I like a hound. You'll never see a bulldog eating out of a hubcap on my place- I can't stand 'em. Granted, I've never had a pack of dogs just for hog hunting, nor would I really want to-back when I kept Plotts I was mainly bear hunting, but they would work a Russian hog over pretty good too when they ran across it. If they were as worthless as some people let on, I don't know why people have been happily breeding them for a couple hundred years, just don't know no better, I guess. Everybody likes something a little different, and gets way too tore up over somebody else's likes and dislikes. I don't even own a hound at the moment, sold my last one a few years back. Don't have time to hunt 'em if I had 'em.


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## olcowman (Mar 7, 2010)

Back in the 60s and 70s in polk county tennessee, my family bred a bunch of plotts that was as game as any i have ever seen. They were bear/boar and had been in that hollow for a century bred up by 3 or 4 families for those purposes. Thinking back they didn't really favor what many today are calling Plotts. As mentioned above they were more cur type... were generally more along the lines of the original plotts brought to this country per historical accounts.

I tend to agree that the entire breed swung heavy over to the coon hunting side and that has greatly influenced (or eliminated in some cases) those traits that made these dogs effective on larger game. Granted I do agree there probably exist some lines among the breeders who have maintained stock specifically for bear/boar, but actually locating them may be another obstacle. I personally haven't seen the type of plott we are discussing here in 20 years and the closest thing I have hunted with were some crosses between pit and plott that were at best, marginally suited for our hog hunting methodology.

But I will make a final point.... in all honesty I would have bet money with anyone that the blueticks we all grew up on were nothing more than coon treeing, pretty to look at, bench show dogs and that the breed's grit and ferocity had been plumb bred out centuries ago. Well about 15 or so years ago I sorta accidently ended up hunting with a bunch of Cracker's on the Suwanee river in Florida for some pretty rank hogs. Them boys turned out their "hog dogs" which were some short legged, really stocky, kinda ugly looking square headed blue ticks. If I hadn't been raised half decent I'd just busted on out laughing right then and there, but with all the restraint I could muster and only a comment or two about treeing climbing hogs I took off after them, with them Crackers when we heard they had "treed"? Well I was wrong about "them" ticks fellers, I aint sure where they come from (them boys weren't a real talkative bunch to start with) but them dog's wrote the book on grit. If the hog wasn't sure enough bad or at least put up a fight of sorts, let's just say you had to get there in a hurry. 

They was some big and bad hogs in this bunch, specifically because most had escaped out of a pen that had a baying scheduled for the next morning. Out of the 7 or 8 I was in on I only saw the bulldog once and he was just an ornament that time, the ticks done got the boar about ready to surrender on his own by then. I lost contact with the pen owner, as I was planning on coming back and getting me a pup, but the blueticks belonged to another bunch down the road aways and like i said.... they was a little stand-offish. Back on topic... I would say if you just got to have you a plott to hunt hogs with, well I bet they're out there somewhere... you just got to hunt you some up. BTW the baddest dog i know of is my little chihuahua Isabelle, they's a heart as big as a washtub in a dog that won't weigh 10lbs? How did that happen?


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## JohnE (Mar 7, 2010)

olcowman, what county were you huntin in with them bluetics?


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## olcowman (Mar 7, 2010)

JohnE said:


> olcowman, what county were you huntin in with them bluetics?



West of Lake City, don't know the county but the closest town I think was Branford? Suwannee Hunting Preserve I think, was where the baying was to be held. Been awhile and I got crs alot lately.


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## Scott Cain (Mar 7, 2010)

*Hog Hunter 08*

You have asked me what i consider to be a gritty dog so i will tell you.In my opinion a gritty dog is not satisfied merely to corner its game but to destroy it. It attacks and attacks regardless of the injury to its self. I personally would rather loose a dog now and then than loose the game for lack of courage in the dog .I do not like to walk up to a bay and the dogs are standing back barking . I want to see them attacking the game always pulling hair some were. wearing the game down to the point they will try to kill it.If the dog is able to bark he is able to bite. the only difference is courage!I am not cutting down any one elses dogs hunt what works for you. this is what i like. They are hard to find i dont have many my self ,but this is what i am always looking for. that is what i call a gritty dog. of course we have not touched on hunt. Good hunting Scott.


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## sureshot375 (Mar 7, 2010)

I don't know a thing about hunting dogs but i heard about Plott hounds this summer at the family reunion.  My grandmother's madien name is Plott and supposedly some of my kin folks way back were involved with the dogs.  I'd like to learn more about the history of the breed.


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## koyote76 (Mar 7, 2010)

olcowman if your looking for old school blu's look up cameron hounds. expensive but apparently well worth the price.
http://www.cameronhounds.com/


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## tnhillbilly (Mar 7, 2010)

Scott Cain said:


> First of all i am not a plott hater . But the truth is the truth.   I never said that there wasnt any gritty plotts but as a breed i do not find them any grittier than a walker redbone or any other hound. TRaditionally plotts may have been but not know. I have owned Weems CAscade,Hawg,  KID and i personally bought 4 from H.T.Crocket himself. AT the time he lived near Franklin N.C Talked to him many times. Ironically he too felt the plott dog was loosing its grit.And had set out to fix it.                                                                                     N.c Hillbilly if you are inpressed with plotts hunt them. I have had fiest dogs grab a bear by the backside going up a tree . Is that what you call grit.                                                                                          Tn hillbilly laugh all you want buddy but i owned a plott dog of yours you said was gritty he bayed 15 feet of a boar hog is that the grit you are talking about. dont mean to bite you buddy but it happens when you jump in a fight.                                                                                       Hawggrinder you suspect they would make good hog dogs ?Have you ever owned any plotts that you used on hogs?                                                                                           Koyote76 you buddy have proven my point if you have to feed cur dogs in to a plott what does that tell you about the plott? If they are so rough why do you need to send in the curs ?If the dog needs help send in more plotts! Just something to think about.



Well scott, I'm going to have to call you a liar, you never got a dog from me that would bay 15 feet back, got the pics and video from every dog that you ever got off of me to prove it bud, of course it wouldn't be the first time you ever *bold faced* lied.  But i think everones figured that out already. nuf said


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## tnhillbilly (Mar 7, 2010)

Scott Cain said:


> You have asked me what i consider to be a gritty dog so i will tell you.In my opinion a gritty dog is not satisfied merely to corner its game but to destroy it. It attacks and attacks regardless of the injury to its self. I personally would rather loose a dog now and then than loose the game for lack of courage in the dog .I do not like to walk up to a bay and the dogs are standing back barking . I want to see them attacking the game always pulling hair some were. wearing the game down to the point they will try to kill it.If the dog is able to bark he is able to bite. the only difference is courage!I am not cutting down any one elses dogs hunt what works for you. this is what i like. They are hard to find i dont have many my self ,but this is what i am always looking for. that is what i call a gritty dog. of course we have not touched on hunt. Good hunting Scott.



then you don't want a gritty dog you want a catch dog, there is a difference there mr. profesional hog dogger.


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## Scott Cain (Mar 8, 2010)

That is a brave thing to say a state away .  i dont care what kind of video you have. i saw the dog stand back off a 120 pound boar with six people watching and laughing . there is a big difference between a dog in a pen with other dogs and one in the woods by himself. IF you keep hunting you will learn that. I have nothing to gain by telling a lie! THE TRUTH IS THE TRUTH. arE YOU GOING TO SAY THE OYHER FOLKS ARE Lying TOO.  The dog was just not gritty with out other dogs Sorry if that hurt your feelings but i stand by it.


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## tnhillbilly (Mar 8, 2010)

you didn't hurt my feelings at all, and yes i would say they were lying too, funny thing you sold him for $1,000 after you told me that you wouldnt get rid of him and that you would let me know before you did, then went straight and sold them couple days later. its funny that you talk about being brave a state away, when you lying bout a mans dogs. I never said he was a catch dog, or would hang off ones ear. and its funny how you were telling me how good he was, and now he wasnt worth a dime, so yes a lie is a lie, and i would tell it to your face. you lied to me more than once. its funny you aint called me back ever since i called you on it either. hhhmmmm. you stirred this pot now you don't like the way it smells, well you should have thought about that before you started bashing everybody. guess you didnt think you would find me on here.


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## Scott Cain (Mar 8, 2010)

*Tom franklin*

First off i am in the same place i have always been in i am not hard to find. It would be a good idea for you to think back to who you orginally traded the dog to.IF you made a Deal with them you need to take it up with them. I have never told you a lie.Now do you remember? The only lie i know of is that we let you have a boar to breed and you took it and sold it!  My name is intact i deal with hundreds of people a year you are the only one crying. Im sorry if your deal went bad but it wasnt with me. I will gladly give you the mans number if you would like to take it up with him.Im sorry that your dog was no good but there is nothing i can do about it.But i will be sure to tell him you called him a lier. By the way how did that deal with being a preacher turn out i thought they wre pretty honest ? these are the facts. Enough said!


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## big country rnr (Mar 8, 2010)

Scott and tnhillbilly ...Why dont yall take this to pm and quit stomping on each other and mudding up the thread! 
Myself i dont like overly gritty dogs. You dont want a gritty dog in south Ga or you wont bay many hogs! All they will do is run if every time they stop they got a dog nippin at them! You need a dog thats gonna catch and hold or one that gonna speak to him and if he turns his butt him he'll get a mouthful and as soon as the hog starts to turn he will let go and speak to him..That kind of plott dog is what i own and its what it takes to bay hogs where they are pressured.You always have to remember a good dog one place is trash at another!!! I purchased a plott dog years ago from The mountains ..He was a jam up hog dog up there got him down here and he was just a hog runner.Sent him back home and went and hunted with him and he stopped a few hogs the first hunt! Different woods different hogs different dogs!!!!!!


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## hoghunter08 (Mar 8, 2010)

big country rnr said:


> Scott and tnhillbilly ...Why dont yall take this to pm and quit stomping on each other and mudding up the thread!
> Myself i dont like overly gritty dogs. You dont want a gritty dog in south Ga or you wont bay many hogs! All they will do is run if every time they stop they got a dog nippin at them! You need a dog thats gonna catch and hold or one that gonna speak to him and if he turns his butt him he'll get a mouthful and as soon as the hog starts to turn he will let go and speak to him..That kind of plott dog is what i own and its what it takes to bay hogs where they are pressured.You always have to remember a good dog one place is trash at another!!! I purchased a plott dog years ago from The mountains ..He was a jam up hog dog up there got him down here and he was just a hog runner.Sent him back home and went and hunted with him and he stopped a few hogs the first hunt! Different woods different hogs different dogs!!!!!!



great post! what line of plotts do u run


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## big country rnr (Mar 8, 2010)

Jackson ,dorsey bred crockett and von plott...Dad Started this breeding years ago and i have been involved since about 1995..I still have two dogs off the same lines as dad started with .Even tho dad passed a few years ago i still got them going strong! Need to out breed to some nose cause there starting to speed up but are losing there cold nose! As with any breed you only breed to the best to the best...


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## Scott Cain (Mar 8, 2010)

*Big country*

I am not going to sit by and let somebody muddy my name . Because they dont like to hear the truth! But you are right this is not the place. This all started with me giving my opinion on plotts nothing has changed i still stand by it. but for those who like them have at it your the ones feeding them. they are just not rough enough for me. good hunting to you all.


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## MULE (Mar 8, 2010)

First and fore most there isn't a perfect dog. Be it a hound or a cur. That's why you run more that one dog. Much like any other team. You don't see a football team with nothing but quart backs, ect,ect. Every dog should bring different things to the table. NOW--Every dog should be able to stand on his own too, not just a me too dog.


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## tnhillbilly (Mar 9, 2010)

big country rnr said:


> Scott and tnhillbilly ...Why dont yall take this to pm and quit stomping on each other and mudding up the thread!
> Myself i dont like overly gritty dogs. You dont want a gritty dog in south Ga or you wont bay many hogs! All they will do is run if every time they stop they got a dog nippin at them! You need a dog thats gonna catch and hold or one that gonna speak to him and if he turns his butt him he'll get a mouthful and as soon as the hog starts to turn he will let go and speak to him..That kind of plott dog is what i own and its what it takes to bay hogs where they are pressured.You always have to remember a good dog one place is trash at another!!! I purchased a plott dog years ago from The mountains ..He was a jam up hog dog up there got him down here and he was just a hog runner.Sent him back home and went and hunted with him and he stopped a few hogs the first hunt! Different woods different hogs different dogs!!!!!!



Very good point, do apologize for muddying the thread. Its over and done with.


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