# New To Lab Training and Duck Hunting



## acemedic1 (Apr 5, 2012)

I recently bought an awesome lab puppy from a very reputable blood line (grouse wings and Fowl reapers) with a solid pedigree.  This puppy is soaking up obedience training like a sponge, which is something I have done with all of my dogs.  After 3 weeks he sits without trouble or hesitance and before crossing any threshold, comes on command,he stays fairly well (maybe 50%  the time) and has a huge drive to fetch.  

I have been taking it very slow on the retreiving because I dont know that much about training but I want to do it myself.  I saw a few people suggest duck dog basics by chris aikins, which looks appealing.  

I want a companion dog that will be steady as a rock in the boat and that can handle double/some triple marks without problems.  I dont think handling the dog is in his future and certainly do not want to get into hunt tests or anything, but I do want a good duck dog.  What do you guys suggest? 

Here is is getting acustomed to the boat around 9wks old and again going for a ride 2 weeks later. His name is Scotch for various reasons haha.


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## stick_slinger (Apr 5, 2012)

Its amazing how quick they grow in 2 weeks.. I just got mine myself, i am using Bill Hillmans training a puppy retreiver.. Its a good Dvd i bought it used, if money isnt a issue i recommend it.. If it is, then you may be able to go over to the Retreiver Training Forum and find one used to save you abit.. 

Balance fun with obidience stuff.. Basically, Let him do alittle of what he wants to do and mix in what you want him to do.. If you make it fun, it will go much smoother for you.. 

Hope this helps alittle.

CJ


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## acemedic1 (Apr 5, 2012)

It definately helps thanks.  Good luck yourself!


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## Scottyhardison (Apr 5, 2012)

No DVD can or will give you a finished retriever. Your much better off with a complete training set like Evan Graham's Smart Works or Mike Lardy's set. They are pricey but will save you a ton in Tylenol for all the head aches you'll get from a single DVD or book.


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## Scottyhardison (Apr 5, 2012)

On a side note join a training club as soon as you can and attend training days as often as they have one. Not sure your location but we have a small one here in middle georgia non affiliated with any organization called middle Georgia retriever club look us up on Facebook and your welcome to join us any time we post a training day. Good luck with your new pup.


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## acemedic1 (Apr 5, 2012)

thanks for that info as well.  I am in south west georgia americus/albany area.  Anybody know of any training clubs around here?


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## Scottyhardison (Apr 5, 2012)

SOWEGA HRC 
Great group of folks to have in your corner. 
Google them they have a web page.


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## stick_slinger (Apr 5, 2012)

I agree with Scotty about no single Dvd will give you a finished retreiver.. You can go with a complete set as well.. What I am doing is The puppy program that Bill Hillman offers and then moving probably to Mike Lardy's total retriever training when he is ready for that.. Also on the retreiver club, cant wait to bring my pup to his first training day.

CJ


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## gsubo (Apr 5, 2012)

I wanted the same thing out of my dog..just a companion and a hunting dog that could handle doubles and triples. Once I started training him I decided to take him all the way through and teach him whistle sit and casting. You'll find that once you get into the retrieving that casting him is not that hard to teach..in fact its pretty easy.  It makes the dog complete..youll always have that bird that you have to whistle sit and cast your dog toward. Youll be glad ya did after he picks up the first long retrieve that he wil need your help on..or when ya have a volley of shots and several birds fall and he cant mark all of them.


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## acemedic1 (Apr 6, 2012)

gsubo what program did you use


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## The Fever (Apr 6, 2012)

gsubo said:


> I wanted the same thing out of my dog..just a companion and a hunting dog that could handle doubles and triples. Once I started training him I decided to take him all the way through and teach him whistle sit and casting. You'll find that once you get into the retrieving that casting him is not that hard to teach..in fact its pretty easy.  It makes the dog complete..youll always have that bird that you have to whistle sit and cast your dog toward. Youll be glad ya did after he picks up the first long retrieve that he wil need your help on..or when ya have a volley of shots and several birds fall and he cant mark all of them.



I am not claiming to have seen his dog work but I have seen the dog behave when around other dogs and a lot of people and chaos and this dog heeds the mans command like there is no other option. Very obedient and loyal dog from the few minutes I watched him. There were other people that had dogs there and they were not obeying near as well. I would take the advice he gives seriously.


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## duckhunter2010 (Apr 6, 2012)

Smartworks. and beautiful dog. have fun with it!


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## gsubo (Apr 6, 2012)

I honestly began with watching youtube and ducks unlimited short videos..then i watched Chris Akins Duck Dog Basics.  I really didnt have one program that I stuck to start to finish(although that would definately be the most effective route) Some of the programs are pretty pricey.  Duck dog basics is cheap and will get you through alot of the early stages.  Retriever training forum is great and also DU's website has alot of training drills that give you an idea on how to get them started on casting, intro to gunfire, and other things.  Theres so much to it..the more time you put in the more you will get out of your dog.


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## acemedic1 (Apr 6, 2012)

thanks, I'm going to go ahead and start with duck dog basics and see where that takes us


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## Turkey Trax (Apr 6, 2012)

acemedic1 said:


> thanks, I'm going to go ahead and start with duck dog basics and see where that takes us



That will only take you through FF (though not a real good guide from a comprehensive standpoint) and to a steady dog to the shot. With simple doubles.


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## acemedic1 (Apr 6, 2012)

so should I skip it and go straight to smartworks


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## stick_slinger (Apr 7, 2012)

Well you cant skip what that dog learns in it... Best thing to do it watch the Dvd and see how you like the way the trainer sends the message to the dogs.. Do you like his training style if not move on to something else... Smartworks or Mike Lardy Total Retreiver Training are supposed to be pretty good if you go with a full program.

CJ


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## Turkey Trax (Apr 7, 2012)

acemedic1 said:


> so should I skip it and go straight to smartworks



It's very cheap so no harm in getting it just not much to it  I've trained a few dogs and my recommendation would be to get Jackie Merterns puppy DVD called sound beginnings. Then transition into Smartworks after adult teeth come in with the Smartfetch DVD. Or buy Lardys full program.


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## webfootwidowmaker (Apr 7, 2012)

gsubo said:


> I honestly began with watching youtube and ducks unlimited short videos..then i watched Chris Akins Duck Dog Basics.  I really didnt have one program that I stuck to start to finish(although that would definately be the most effective route) Some of the programs are pretty pricey.  Duck dog basics is cheap and will get you through alot of the early stages.  Retriever training forum is great and also DU's website has alot of training drills that give you an idea on how to get them started on casting, intro to gunfire, and other things.  Theres so much to it..the more time you put in the more you will get out of your dog.



LOL I did the same. Before I got my lab I watched youtube videos to help me and after I got him home I got two diff. dvds and a book to get me started. I would reminded you that your learning as well as your dog, So be patient.


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## king killer delete (Apr 10, 2012)

Scottyhardison said:


> On a side note join a training club as soon as you can and attend training days as often as they have one. Not sure your location but we have a small one here in middle georgia non affiliated with any organization called middle Georgia retriever club look us up on Facebook and your welcome to join us any time we post a training day. Good luck with your new pup.


The best advice I  have heard.


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## NG ALUM (Apr 17, 2012)

After hunting with a dog for a few years now my opinion is that the MOST important thing you can teach is solid obedience. Sit, Stay, Heel, Down, and to only go on command! If you can get your dog to be an ace at these task it's very hard for him to mess up on a hunt. Staying until commanded to retrieve is huge!! and heel is also huge if you will be walking into roosted duck holes early in the morning. For most good labs retrieving is the easy part that comes off of instinct. He will instictively figure out what he is supposed to retrieve, where they fall and learn to watch the sky. One of the best things I ever did was set my dog on a pedestool ten yards or so behing the action during the hunt and make him stay until I had ducks on the ground. then I would release him to retrieve it. I think there is something about watching the big picture unfold in front of them that helps them figure out exactly whats going on rather than sitting right under you and watching your every move. I want my dog looking at the sky watching for ducks and when They hit the water I want him to stay until I tell him to go and get it. 

So if you can get you dog to master the basic obedience skills you will have a pretty darn good hunting dog. He will figure out the rest on his own (watching and marking dead birds and such). Another good thing to work on is to hide his ball in the yard and then point him in the direction. He will learn to trust your hand signal. 

Just my opinion and it has turned my dog into a hunting machine...


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## acemedic1 (Apr 17, 2012)

Thanks for the advice guys...I have been in the front yard with him every afternoon since this thread and he has been doing amazing.  He naturally retrieves and delivers to hand, its just hard for me to keep from being selfish.  Every now and then I will sneak and make him sit and stay before the retrieve and he does well with that which makes it even harder for me to NOT do it hahaha...I know that for now retrieving is just a game and is supposed to be all fun...how did yall keep from trying to do too much too fast?


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## stick_slinger (Apr 17, 2012)

^ Same here, i have just started my pups ACTUAL training the last few days.. Before it was all fun while getting used to everything and getting potty trained. Now that he seems to be getting the hang of chasing something and not going to the bathroom in the house.. With the traffic cop method Bill Hillman uses i can get him to stay in the sit position.. I got him in the sit position and kept commanding sit, tossed the bumper out and he just sat there, i hollered MAX and he took off after it.. I was like oh wow lol.. Shouldnt have done it that early, but sometimes we move faster than what we should.... Max's sit command isnt solid yet so i shouldnt have done that.. I mean he will stay put once i get him in the sit position and keep commanding sit... 

But i have just been reminding myself lately, he is just a pup, teach him the bare basics and let him have FUN, dont try and teach him something he isnt ready for.

CJ


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## ngaduck (Apr 17, 2012)

My advice is get out of the yard and with someone to help you. If you only do work in the yard throwing bumpers from the dog's side, that distance will be all you get in the field. When the dog is accustomed to just going 40-50yrds, he will only hunt out to 40-50yrds. Have someone else throw for the dog, and gradually increase the distance. I see this all the time when guys come out to train with us. We set up marks that are further than the owner can throw and the dog stops short. Like has been said above, get a full training program, and find someone in your are that has trained retrievers and have them help you.


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## acemedic1 (Apr 17, 2012)

How old is your dog Stick...thats good advice ngaduck, I havent thought of it that way at all....thanks


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## mdhall (Apr 18, 2012)

*Waterdog*

Waterdog by Richard Wolters is a great book with step-by-step advice. I trained my dog with it and an e-collar, and he is steady with hand signals and retrieves really well for someone who's a poor shot. It just takes patience and a lot of time, the more time you spend, the better they are going to be. 10 mins a day every day is better than an entire afternoon on Saturday.

I don't know if you have plans for an e-collar, but it is suggested to not put an e-collar on that dog until its 6 months old and completely understands what you are asking it to do.

My dog is also a companion, he sleeps inside, walks with my wife and rides in the back of my truck.


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## stick_slinger (Apr 19, 2012)

@ Acemedic, my pup is only 9 weeks old as of today.. He is starting to get the hang of things, we have only been into real training for about 3 days, as far as our sit command its far from perfect, once i get him in the sit position I can normally keep him there, I just repeat the sit command and he will stay there.. He just hasnt caught on to sitting the first time i say it yet, normally i have to give a small pop on the lead or push down on his rump.. 

He is also getting the hang of actually retreiving now instead of just chasing it down and playing with it, he will bring it back now.. Also stretching out alittle more now that he is getting the hang of running and is not tripping all over himself on the way to the bumper lol.. Not chunking it as far as i can by no means but adding some distance none the less.

CJ


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## acemedic1 (Apr 21, 2012)

Thats awesome stick...Well with the help of a fellow gon'er I will be using Smartworks... I cant wait, Scotch is doing awesome.  On a whim yesterday I walked him to the pond (water hole really) and threw the bumper in...he piled in after it and drank for what seemed like minutes before high tailing it back to my side.  I looked at him and said "go get that duck and he looked at me with that oh yeah look there he went!...first semi complete water retrieve...we stopped there, but we both are having a blast!


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## bnew17 (May 4, 2012)

Ive heard real good things about Rick Stawski's Fowl Dog 3 disc set. I ordered the set a few weeks ago and have been watching them. Gonna be picking up my pup in another month. Seems like a pretty good program so far. 60 bucks for the set.


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## acemedic1 (May 7, 2012)

keep me posted on what you think about that set...that price isn't bad 
at all


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## macondaly (May 7, 2012)

bnew17 said:


> Ive heard real good things about Rick Stawski's Fowl Dog 3 disc set. I ordered the set a few weeks ago and have been watching them. Gonna be picking up my pup in another month. Seems like a pretty good program so far. 60 bucks for the set.



There is nothing wrong with fowldogs. From what I remember Rick spent some time on the left coast with a fella by the name of Rex Carr. Mr. Carr was the mentor of some of the best trainers in the business, including Judy Aycock, Evan Graham, and Mike Lardy. Any of thier basics programs are structurally the same with differences in detail. 

Like Scotty H. said, a training group with experienced members in much just as valuable as a program. SOWEGA HRC is based out of Albany and they love new members.


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## acemedic1 (May 8, 2012)

I've been going back and fourth about giving those guys a call but figured I would wait until his adult teeth came in...im glad you said that they like new comers some groups just don't like newbies...I have been mainly doing ob work this last couple of weeks because he has been teething but yesterday I took him out and tossed a few and yall would not believe how hard he ran to get it and bring it back.....his mouth is still bothering him so I quit but it sure did make me feel good to see him trying so hard...


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## ngaduck (May 8, 2012)

Why wait to start training with a group? It's a really good way to socialize the dog. They will also be able to help you through some of the early formal training which can be very frustrating for some one new to retrievers.

Also, while he is teething, use a paint roller. It will be much more comfortable for the pup.


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## king killer delete (May 8, 2012)

*NGADuck is so dead on.*



ngaduck said:


> Why wait to start training with a group? It's a really good way to socialize the dog. They will also be able to help you through some of the early formal training which can be very frustrating for some one new to retrievers.
> 
> Also, while he is teething, use a paint roller. It will be much more comfortable for the pup.


 This is outstanding advice. It will save you when you hit a road block and you will. You will not be trying to figure out what do do next. You will have help.


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## acemedic1 (May 8, 2012)

excuse my ignorance but how do the training days work....do you go and work on things seperately or concepts as a group? it doesn't loo sportsk like the sowega hrc site has been updated in a while...I'll probably just give those guys a call


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## ngaduck (May 8, 2012)

I am not sure how they run there club training days, but we normally have a wide variety of marks and blind setups that you can run as you see fit. If your dog is not ready for something, they will make adjustments to help you and your dog succeed. The most beneficial thing you can do at one of these training days is network and pick experienced trainers brain. Most of these guys have smaller groups that train together and that is where you will get the best training in. The group that I do most of my training with usually consists of up to 10 or so dogs, but mostly only 2-4. We will figure out what everyone needs to work on and go from there. If someone needs something specific, a couple of us may focus on that.


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## acemedic1 (May 8, 2012)

ok thanks that puts things in a little better perspective...that does seem like a fun and beneficial thing....hey btw if I could ask for an unbroken prayer request of our fellow members had a couple of deaths in the family....I hope I'm not overstepping any lines and if I offend anyone please forgive me I just remembered the conversation and thought I'd ask for help in that respect as well...




now one last thing..does anyone know the hrc guys in albany personally, and if so what is the best way to contact I called the two numbers I found earlier and got error messages both times


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## acemedic1 (May 8, 2012)

*unspoken prayer request.....this is hard to do on a phone hahaha


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## Turkey Trax (May 9, 2012)

ngaduck said:


> I am not sure how they run there club training days, but we normally have a wide variety of marks and blind setups that you can run as you see fit. If your dog is not ready for something, they will make adjustments to help you and your dog succeed. The most beneficial thing you can do at one of these training days is network and pick experienced trainers brain. Most of these guys have smaller groups that train together and that is where you will get the best training in. The group that I do most of my training with usually consists of up to 10 or so dogs, but mostly only 2-4. We will figure out what everyone needs to work on and go from there. If someone needs something specific, a couple of us may focus on that.



have you figured out what we need to work on friday yet?


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## waterdogs (May 9, 2012)

NGHRC will host a training day in Martin GA, on the 19th of may. Check out there web sight for info. Also if you would like to join the club, its well worth the 25 bucks. come out and have fun.


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## ngaduck (May 10, 2012)

Turkey Trax said:


> have you figured out what we need to work on friday yet?



Line manners and breaking!


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## Turkey Trax (May 10, 2012)

ngaduck said:


> Line manners and breaking!



I can't wait. i love any opportunity to beat a black girl.


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## acemedic1 (May 11, 2012)

that sounds like a fun time for sure....I hope the training goes well and post some pics up if yall do not mind


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## Turkey Trax (May 11, 2012)

acemedic1 said:


> that sounds like a fun time for sure....I hope the training goes well and post some pics up if yall do not mind



it wasn't much fun today. some training aint fun. but tomorrow is a new day we'll see....


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## acemedic1 (May 11, 2012)

what went wrong?


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## Turkey Trax (May 11, 2012)

acemedic1 said:


> what went wrong?



LOL...they're dogs. I don't care how good they are one day, and how much you train. They're gonna show up from time to time and not do anything right. I train about every day. you're gonna have days. we had winger problems (lost transmitter), and a couple good battles with 2 dogs stubbornness. It happens. We will be back at it tomorrow and hopefully they'll have their heads on straight.


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## ngaduck (May 11, 2012)

We hope.


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## king killer delete (May 12, 2012)

*This is so true.*



Turkey Trax said:


> LOL...they're dogs. I don't care how good they are one day, and how much you train. They're gonna show up from time to time and not do anything right. I train about every day. you're gonna have days. we had winger problems (lost transmitter), and a couple good battles with 2 dogs stubbornness. It happens. We will be back at it tomorrow and hopefully they'll have their heads on straight.


 A well trained dog is still a dog. To many times I have seen great dogs do the wrong thing. I will tell you something  a well trained dog that you have paid to be trained and that you have spent many hours with will die on you in a second. The mut down the street that does not get fed half the time could get shoot with a 3006 and he would limp around for about week and he would be in good shape.


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## acemedic1 (Jun 8, 2012)

rereading this after asking the questions in my other post today is wild.  When I wrote this I said I didnt want to handle him or get into hunt tests.  After spending time researching training, speaking with a couple of members on here and visiting some amazing lab trainers and watching the dogs work, my whole outlook has changed.  I definately want my dog to take casts and cant wait to try out a hunt test hahaha.  Just thought Id share how my thoughts on the perfect dog has changed since I have learned a lot more...


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