# Nail scars in Jesus' feet and hands



## Jody Hawk (Sep 19, 2006)

Me and Rhonda had a discussion going the other day. There's a Christian song that I love called "Plan of Salvation". A line in the song goes like this, "I want to be there on, that great judgment morning. To touch all the nail prints, in his feet and his hands".  Rhonda says that she doesn't believe the Bible mentions Jesus having nail scars but it says something along the lines of after the resurrection he was whole or as new. I've searched my Bible and can't find anything. Can y'all help?


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## Flash (Sep 19, 2006)

I don't have my Bible in front of me but didn't one of them (Peter or Thomas) say I want to see where they stabbed you in the side and he reached his hand in and believed??? Forgive me for my weak paraphrase


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## GeauxLSU (Sep 19, 2006)

He most definitely appeared with holes in hand and side after his resurrection.  Or are you referring to something different?


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## SBG (Sep 19, 2006)

Flash said:


> I don't have my Bible in front of me but didn't one of them (Peter or Thomas) say I want to see where they stabbed you in the side and he reached his hand in and believed??? Forgive me for my weak paraphrase



Yes Flash, that was "doubting" Thomas. Jesus still bore the scars of His sacrifice even after being glorified; He still has the scars today!


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## GeauxLSU (Sep 19, 2006)

*John 20:19-29*

Jesus Appears to His Disciples 
 19On the evening of that first day of the week, when the disciples were together, with the doors locked for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you!" 20After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord. 
 21Again Jesus said, "Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you." 22And with that he breathed on them and said, "Receive the Holy Spirit. 23If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven."

Jesus Appears to Thomas 
 24Now Thomas (called Didymus), one of the Twelve, was not with the disciples when Jesus came. 25So the other disciples told him, "We have seen the Lord!" 
      But he said to them, "Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe it." 
 26A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you!" 27Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe." 

 28Thomas said to him, "My Lord and my God!" 

 29Then Jesus told him, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."


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## Jody Hawk (Sep 19, 2006)

Thanks fellows, Phil those verses were what I was looking for.


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## groundhawg (Sep 19, 2006)

SBG said:


> Yes Flash, that was "doubting" Thomas. Jesus still bore the scars of His sacrifice even after being glorified; He still has the scars today!



Not sure I can agree with you this time.  How about when John saw Christ and wrote about it in the book of Revelation's?

12I turned around to see the voice that was speaking to me. And when I turned I saw seven golden lampstands, 13and among the lampstands was someone "like the Son of God,"dressed in a robe reaching down to his feet and with a golden sash around his chest. 14His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and his eyes were like blazing fire. 15His feet were like bronze glowing in a furnace, and his voice was like the sound of rushing waters. 16In his right hand he held seven stars, and out of his mouth came a sharp double-edged sword. His face was like the sun shining in all its brilliance. 

 17When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: "Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. 18I am the Living One; I was dead, and behold I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades. 

Of course I feel that The Son of God can take what ever form he needs to at a given time and as much as I like that song I do not believe Jesus still bears any scars from his time here on Earth.  I agree he had the scars when he rose from death and when he appeared to Thomas and others but I can not think that after his accession to Heaven that he still has bears them.


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## Hawkeye (Sep 19, 2006)

Not only in the New testament but also in The Old it says when God shows Himself to the Jews, They Will ask What are these wounds in Your Hands ? And He will respond In The House of my friends I was Wounded "


What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he shall answer, those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.” (Zechariah 13:6).

It is one of the most powerfull verses in the old testament ,that has brought many Jews to Christ.


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## groundhawg (Sep 19, 2006)

Hawkeye said:


> Not only in the New testament but also in The Old it says when God shows Himself to the Jews, They Will ask What are these wounds in Your Hands ? And He will respond In The House of my friends I was Wounded "
> 
> 
> What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he shall answer, those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.” (Zechariah 13:6).
> ...




Hawkeye I think you are really reaching if you are refering that this passage is about Christ since the entire passage is:

 2 "On that day, I will banish the names of the idols from the land, and they will be remembered no more," declares the LORD Almighty. "I will remove both the prophets and the spirit of impurity from the land. 3 And if anyone still prophesies, his father and mother, to whom he was born, will say to him, 'You must die, because you have told lies in the LORD's name.' When he prophesies, his own parents will stab him. 

 4 "On that day every prophet will be ashamed of his prophetic vision. He will not put on a prophet's garment of hair in order to deceive. 5 He will say, 'I am not a prophet. I am a farmer; the land has been my livelihood since my youth. [a] ' 6 If someone asks him, 'What are these wounds on your body ?' he will answer, 'The wounds I was given at the house of my friends.'

This seems plain enough to me that it is about how someone(s) will try to make others believe he is not a prophet not about Jesus.


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## Hawkeye (Sep 19, 2006)

That is your Opinion and you are in title to it,but you must realise that chapter 13 is just a contnuation of chapter 12,
Chapter 13, continues where Chapter 12 finished.  In the 12th Chapter we see the inhabitants of Judah and Jerusalem look on “Me whom they pierced”( Zech 12;10). The nation then begins to mourn and wail for Him, mourning their actions, which resulted in the rejection of Messiah at His first coming.  The first five verses, which follow the 12th chapter, show what follows in the Millennium, during the reign of the Messiah.  

In the Millennium, false prophets will be a thing of the past, and anyone claiming to be a prophet will be a serious event.  Since the knowledge of the Lord is not hidden, there will be no need of prophets. The remembrance of idols, will also be a thing of the past.  Israel as a nation will be exalted above the nations their obedience allows God to fulfill His word. Blessing them above all nations on the earth (Deuteronomy 28:1-2)

The sixth verse’s meaning is still debated, does it refer to the Messiah, who was pierced or to a false prophet in the Millennium.  There are arguments on both sides, following the sixth verse, the seventh through the ninth are clearly Messianic in nature. 

Jesus quotes from verse 7, after the disciples flee, when solders arrest Jesus.  



Zechariah 13



In that Day…



1 "In that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for sin and for uncleanness. 

2 "It shall be in that day," says the Lord of hosts, "that I will cut off the names of the idols from the land, and they shall no longer be remembered. I will also cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to depart from the land. 

3 "It shall come to pass that if anyone still prophesies, then his father and mother who begot him will say to him, 'You shall not live, because you have spoken lies in the name of the Lord.' And his father and mother who begot him shall thrust him through when he prophesies. 

4 "And it shall be in that day that every prophet will be ashamed of his vision when he prophesies; they will not wear a robe of coarse hair to deceive. 

5 "But he will say, 'I am no prophet, I am a farmer; for a man taught me to keep cattle from my youth.' 



(1 ) In that Day:  In the 12th chapter, this term is used 6 times, referring to the that day or time when  the Kingdom of Messiah is established on the earth.  That Day corresponds with the judgment of the nations and Israel restoration and blessing.  This section corresponds with the events following the 2nd coming and the establishment of Jerusalem.  According to Daniel, there is a 45-day period, during which the nations are judged, and the Messianic Kingdom established on earth.



11 "And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away, and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days. 

12 "Blessed is he who waits, and comes to the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. 

13 "But you, go your way till the end; for you shall rest, and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days." Daniel 12:11-13

A fountain:  Throughout scripture there is a theme of a fountain, which will be in the city of Jerusalem in the Millennium and the New Jerusalem following the Millennium.  When Jesus was at the well talking to the Samaritan women, he referred to the fountain of Life, which will remove her thirst.  



10 Jesus answered and said to her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water." 

13 Jesus answered and said to her, "Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, 

14 "but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life."  John 4:10,13-14



This fountain in Jerusalem will be a picture of God’s Grace, to those dwelling in the Millennium. According to Ezekiel, the fountain will flow from the Throne of God to the Dead Sea bringing life to what is dead.  



1 Then he brought me back to the door of the temple; and there was water, flowing from under the threshold of the temple toward the east, for the front of the temple faced east; the water was flowing from under the right side of the temple, south of the altar. 

2 He brought me out by way of the north gate, and led me around on the outside to the outer gateway that faces east; and there was water, running out on the right side. 

8 Then he said to me: "This water flows toward the eastern region, goes down into the valley, and enters the sea. When it reaches the sea, its waters are healed. 

9 "And it shall be that every living thing that moves, wherever the rivers go, will live. There will be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters go there; for they will be healed, and everything will live wherever the river goes. 

Ezekiel 47:1-2,8-9

The fountain flowing from the Temple, to the Dead Sea will become a river of life, illustrating for ages to come, life flows from the Lord.  In the New Jerusalem, which follows the Millennium, we also see a river or fountain proceeding from the throne.

1 And he showed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb. 

2 In the middle of its street, and on either side of the river, was the tree of life, which bore twelve fruits, each tree yielding its fruit every month. The leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. 

3 And there shall be no more curse, but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it, and His servants shall serve Him.  Revelation 22:1-3

(2) Cut off: The Idolatry and false prophets have plagued Israel from the time nation was called out of Egypt. In the time to come, in “That Day”, false prophets and idols will not be permitted, bringing terminal judgment on those who lie in the name of the LORD. (vs.5)

The word used here trk Karath,(cut off) is also used in reference to what takes place when a covenant is establish, to cut the animal in two and to walk between the half’s.  Here proclaims the Idols and false prophets will be eliminated from the land. (Jeremiah 34:18)

Remembered:  Demonic and Idol’s will not be brought to memory, by those who are on the earth, during this period.  The last event, which plagued the earth was the Antichrist who put an image of himself in the  Third temple, demanding the earth to worship his image, this will not be remembered in the Millennium.

Unclean spirits:  At the Second Coming, Satan, the fallen angels, the Antichrist and False prophet will be judged. The Antichrist and False prophet are the first two occupants of the Lake of Fire. (Revelation 19:20).  Satan is cast into the abyss for 1000-years the duration of the Millennium.  During this period, demonic power in the earth will be non-existent.  

1 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, having the key to the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2 He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till the thousand years were finished. But after these things he must be released for a little while. Revelation 20:1-3 

Satanic and Demonic power will not be an influence on people during the Millennium,  

(3) Any one still prophesies:  Those who are born in the Millennium will still have free choice, the main difference being Satan will not be present in the world to give them his choice.  Just like in Adam’s day, he had the ability to choose or reject, to obey and disobey. So people will in the Millennium, those who prophecy (speaking lies in the name of the Lord), will die according to the laws of Moses. (see Exodus 32:27,28; Deuteronomy 13:6-11; 18:20 33:9)

      False prophets will not be tolerated, a false prophets own parents will punish their child with death in that day, by piercing him through.

(4) ashamed of his vision:  The temptation to be a prophet will also be present in the age to come.  Speaking for the Lord, gives the speaker (Prophet) power, because if you disobey his words, you are disobeying God’s word.  This fear give the false prophet power.

      In the day to come, those who are tempted by their dreams or their desire to speak for the Lord will be ashamed of their actions.

(5) he will say: The role of the prophet is to relay the Words of the Lord to the listener, implying a separation from God.  In the Millennium, God’s presence will be visible in Jerusalem and the knowledge of Him will be like the omnipresent like the ocean. There will be no need for a prophet to speak to humanity on God’s behalf. 

      People will reject any implication of prophecy, today to be a “True” prophet is an honor, in the day to come, (that day) it will be a shame. 

Wounded in the house of friends



6 "And one will say to him, 'What are these wounds between your arms?' Then he will answer, 'Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.' 

(6) Say to him: One of the more controversial verses in the 13th chapter is verse 6. The debate over its meaning involves whether verse 6 amplifies verses 2-5 or 7 to 9.  If the meaning is connected to the four previous verse, some see this person who is pierced as a false prophet who was pierced or wounded by those in his own house, for example, his parents (verse 5).

Matthew Henry, the 16th century commentator writes regarding this verse, 

He shall acknowledge those to be his friends who by a severe discipline were instrumental to bring him to a sight of his error, v. 6. When he who with the greatest assurance had asserted himself so lately to be a prophet suddenly drops his claims, and says, I am no prophet, every body will be surprised at it, and some will ask, "What are these wounds, or marks of stripes, in thy hands? how camest thou by them? Hast thou not been examined by scourging? And is not that it that has brought thee to thyself?’’ (Vexatio dat intellectum—Vexation sharpens the intellect.) "Hast thou not been beaten into this acknowledgment? Was it not the rod and reproof that gave thee this wisdom?’’ And he shall own, "Yes, it was; these are the wounds with which I was wounded in the house of my friends, who bound me, and used me hardly and severely, as a distracted man, and so brought me to my senses.’’ By this it appears that those parents of the false prophet that thrust him through (v. 3) did not do it till they had first tried to reclaim him by correction, and he would not be reclaimed; for so was the law concerning a disobedient son—his parents must first have chastened him in vain before they were allowed to bring him forth to be stoned, Deu. 21:18, 19. But here is another who was reduced by stripes, and so prevented the capital punishment; and he had the sense and honesty to own that they were his friends, his real friends, who thus wounded him, that they might reclaim him; for faithful are the wounds of a friend, Prov. 27:6. Some good interpreters, observing how soon this comes after the mention of Christ’s being pierced, think that these are the words of that great prophet, not of the false prophet spoken of before. Christ was wounded in his hands, when they were nailed to the cross, and, after his resurrection, he had the marks of these wounds; and here he tells how he came by them; he received them as a false prophet, for the chief priests called him a deceiver, and upon that account would have him crucified; but he received them in the house of his friends—the Jews, who should have been his friends; for he came to his own, and, though they were his bitter enemies, yet he was pleased to call them his friends, as he did Judas (Friend, wherefore hast thou come?) because they forwarded his sufferings for him; as he called Peter Satan—an adversary, because he dissuaded him from them.

The problem with the view this applies to the false prophet is demonstrated in the fact the false prophet is still alive, in verse 3 we read the parents say to the false prophet you shall not live.  Now why is he then permitted to live, responding, “which I was wounded in the house of my friends”.  

 Wounds: The word in Hebrew also implies the wounds was unto death, as if the person would be killed and come back to life.  Two separate Hebrew words are used,  hkkm Makkah meaning blow, wound or slaughter.  The one replies, by saying it is the wounds or (hkn Nakah), which I received in the house of my friends.   To be consistent with the previous four verses, the individual could not reply if he was killed by his parents.

House of my friends:  The meaning fits more properly as applying to the Good Shepherd, who is God Himself, who comes to His flock. (Zechariah 10;3). God the Good shepherd is valued at 30 pieces of silver, and the money is thrown into the Lord’s house.


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## Dixie Dawg (Sep 19, 2006)

groundhawg said:


> Hawkeye I think you are really reaching if you are refering that this passage is about Christ since the entire passage is:
> 
> 2 "On that day, I will banish the names of the idols from the land, and they will be remembered no more," declares the LORD Almighty. "I will remove both the prophets and the spirit of impurity from the land. 3 And if anyone still prophesies, his father and mother, to whom he was born, will say to him, 'You must die, because you have told lies in the LORD's name.' When he prophesies, his own parents will stab him.
> 
> ...


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## SBG (Sep 19, 2006)

groundhawg said:


> Not sure I can agree with you this time.  How about when John saw Christ and wrote about it in the book of Revelation's?
> 
> 12I turned around to see the voice that was speaking to me. And when I turned I saw seven golden lampstands, 13and among the lampstands was someone "like the Son of God,"dressed in a robe reaching down to his feet and with a golden sash around his chest. 14His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and his eyes were like blazing fire. 15His feet were like bronze glowing in a furnace, and his voice was like the sound of rushing waters. 16In his right hand he held seven stars, and out of his mouth came a sharp double-edged sword. His face was like the sun shining in all its brilliance.
> 
> ...



Fair enough Groundhawg...but for discussion sake, what in those verses would lead you to believe that Jesus no longer has the scars?


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## PWalls (Sep 20, 2006)

SBG said:


> Fair enough Groundhawg...but for discussion sake, what in those verses would lead you to believe that Jesus no longer has the scars?



Good question. I also believe that Jesus could take any form that he so wishes. But, there is nothing in those passages in Revelation that says he no longer has those scars and they are clearly evident at His ascension. I would like to think that Jesus will wear those scars for all eternity and all the heavenly host will rejoice at the symbolism. Of course, that is just my opinion.


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## Flintlock1776 (Sep 20, 2006)

*Thanks*

I remeber it, just not good at remembering it exactky as written


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## Pro40Dually (Sep 21, 2006)

GeauxLSU said:


> He most definitely appeared with holes in hand and side after his resurrection.




You sure?  How do you know?


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## StriperAddict (Sep 22, 2006)

Pro40Dually, the verses showing this were quoted in post #5.


I believe it is likely Jesus will still come back with those same scars of redemption....  note what was said right after the ascension:

Acts ch. 1:
 9 And after He had said these things, He was lifted up while they were looking on, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 

 10 And as they were gazing intently into the sky while He was going, behold, two men in white clothing stood beside them. 

 11 They also said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into the sky? This Jesus, who has been taken up from you into heaven, will come in just the same way as you have watched Him go into heaven." 

my 2c


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## GeauxLSU (Sep 27, 2006)

Pro40Dually said:


> You sure?  How do you know?


Yes. Because I believe the Gospels are the Truth.


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## SUPERDAVE (Sep 27, 2006)

The scars that Jesus has is proof to the nonbeliever that he died and rose again.It also signifies who did this to him.I truly believe when he bares his wounds for all to see ,satan will be there on his knees confessing Jesus is king of kings and lord of lords.Then satan gets to go to his eternal home.


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