# Haints



## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

I was down in South Ga. this past week on my annual pilgrimage to fill the freezer with deer meat.  I don't get down there much, 'cause life is too busy, and gas is too expensive.

Anyway, the property we were on has a lot of history.  9000 year old arrowheads have been found there, and the land has been farmed for hundreds of years.  However, there is an old houseplace that the everybody swears if "haunted."  Having never encountered anything supernatural, I am always a bit skeptical of these things.

The theory on this particular house is that it was used for nefarious purposes, and the "evil" remained.

So.....for anybody interested in this stuff (atheists are welcome in this thread too ), have you ever encountered anything of the sort, if so, what were the circumstances, and what is your theory on it?  For Christians....do you believe demons remain in houses after the inhabitants leave (as was the suggestion where I was at)?

Please don't bash anybody who posts their thoughts.  I am very curious on the subject.


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## Nicodemus (Nov 26, 2012)

I don`t much attention to haints and such, but 9,000 year old projectile points are a fairly common thing down here.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

Nicodemus said:


> I don`t much attention to haints and such, but 9,000 year old projectile points are a fairly common thing down here.



My son and I spent a lot of time looking, but were not successful.  I have only found a few in my life.  If I had more time to spend down there, I'm not sure if I would spend more time hunting deer or artifacts.......

One of the hutners on the farm is a hard core arrowhead hutner, and he finds them all the time.  I guess it's an art like anything else, and requires a lot of practice.

BTW, I used "arrowhead" to be generic.  I think the point was pre-arrow if I remember correctly.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

I don't get too worried about Native American sights. I've been told that their spiritual process leaves very little chance for hauntings by Native American spirits. In terms of houses and places in the woods, I have encountered things I can't explain and have learned to pay attention when the hair on the back of my neck stands up. If it's an old home place and I get that feeling, I don't stick around.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> I don't get too worried about Native American sights. I've been told that their spiritual process leaves very little chance for hauntings by Native American spirits. In terms of houses and places in the woods, I have encountered things I can't explain and have learned to pay attention when the hair on the back of my neck stands up. If it's an old home place and I get that feeling, I don't stick around.



Thanks for weighing in, MC.  I do know of one SoGa farm where I get that "feeling" every time I am there.  I am not sure if it is because I was always told bad things about the place, or if it real.  

Interesting thoughts on the native Americans' processes.  I know this farm had a lot of pre-historic activity on it, but I know very little about their culture.  My son is extremely interested in them.  I take him by the Kolomoki mounds every time we drive through there on our way to SGI every summer.  The nice people at the museum will run the 15 minute documentary for us even though we are usually the only ones there.  It is a great place to stop.  We always hike to the top of the biggest mound, and marvel at how they managed to build that with manual labor.  Amazing people.

I wish I knew more about it.


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## gemcgrew (Nov 26, 2012)

Watch the movie "The Ghost and Mr. Chicken" and then go spend the night in the old home place.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> Watch the movie "The Ghost and Mr. Chicken" and then go spend the night in the old home place.





One of the fellas we were with was a combat vet, old school military guy.  He won't go near this particualr houseplace anymore after one apparently disturbing event.  If he won't walk near it.....I dang sure won't spend the night in it.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

I've heard 'bumps in the night' even voices (sounds like voices, anyway).  They get filed in the AS OF YET unexplained folder.  

I have a friend of mine who believes in haints.  He sees them everywhere....


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I have a friend of mine who believes in haints.  He sees them everywhere....



One of the most reasonable and rational people I know swears he has seen them.  A place where several children were killed.  He says he saw them as clearly as he sees everybody else.

I believe he saw something.  I just don't know what he saw.  Like you said....."as of yet" unexplained.

BTW.....thanks for your input.


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## Jeff Raines (Nov 26, 2012)

I'd love to go over the place with a metal detector......Then depending on what is found,maybe set up a sifter.

It's got to where I'd rather hunt old home sites than deer.To hold a piece of history,even if it's just an old spoon.Study the site,while thinking what life at this particular place and time was like.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

Jeff Raines said:


> It's got to where I'd rather hunt old home sites than deer.To hold a piece of history,even if it's just an old spoon.Study the site,while thinking what life at this particular place and time was like.



My son said "why didn't we bring my metal detector!"  He loves the stuff.  

On one of my leases in the northern zone there is an old homesite where we find horseshoes, and various other artifacts from 100+ years ago.  The coolest thing I found there is an old bell.  I am not sure what it was for, but it was only about 4 inches tall.  I have never felt uneasy at that site.....but, there are old stone walls, only a few feet high, where stones were piled in a line, running all around that property.  I am not sure what purpose those walls served, but they are everywhere.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> One of the most reasonable and rational people I know swears he has seen them.  A place where several children were killed.  He says he saw them as clearly as he sees everybody else.
> 
> I believe he saw something.  I just don't know what he saw.  Like you said....."as of yet" unexplained.
> 
> BTW.....thanks for your input.



My friend says sometimes he 'sees' them, like real people and sometimes he 'feels' them.  He says he woke up one night and the 'old lady' of the house was pulling the covers up on him, tucking him in..... oooo, gave myself the chill bumps.  He says he sees her dog, too.  

When I get the willies, I force myself to laugh and shake it off.  It's all in your head.....or is it......


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## DCHunter (Nov 26, 2012)

It's interesting to me that 99% of reported ghost sightings and alien abductions occur when  someone is waking up and still in a dream like state.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

DCHunter said:


> It's interesting to me that 99% of reported ghost sightings and alien abductions occur when  someone is waking up and still in a dream like state.



I am sure that has a lot to do with many of the things seen and heard.....but it doesn't account for a fella seeing and hearing things wide awake.  The guy I know who saw the "ghosts" was not anywhere near sleep or a dream like state.  Who knows what it really was.....could just be a well told ghost story, or maybe not.

The "6th sense," what ambush80 referred to as the "willies," is also interesting to me.  I know I have experienced it while wide awake, I just don't know what it is.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> I am sure that has a lot to do with many of the things seen and heard.....but it doesn't account for a fella seeing and hearing things wide awake.  The guy I know who saw the "ghosts" was not anywhere near sleep or a dream like state.  Who knows what it really was.....could just be a well told ghost story, or maybe not.
> 
> The "6th sense," what ambush80 referred to as the "willies," is also interesting to me.  I know I have experienced it while wide awake, I just don't know what it is.



Ever watched a wise old buck act like he knew something wasn't right, even when you were well camo'd and well down wind from him. They've learned to use something we all probably have, but have forgotten how to use.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> Ever watched a wise old buck act like he knew something wasn't right, even when you were well camo'd and well down wind from him. They've learned to use something we all probably have, but have forgotten how to use.



I like when I turn my head while driving and catch someone staring right at me.  Makes me feel like I have super powers.

I suspect it's some subconscious function as well.  Critters are probably way more 'in tune' to those things; not having to deal with all this annoying conceptual thinking cluttering our heads.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> Ever watched a wise old buck act like he knew something wasn't right, even when you were well camo'd and well down wind from him. They've learned to use something we all probably have, but have forgotten how to use.



Yes.  I have.  I know of at least one that has lived another day this year on account of it.

On the opposite side of that, I have also known a deer was there before I ever saw or heard it coming.  It is cool, but something "perks up" inside, (I could be hearing faint tnoises that don't register, I dunno).  Has happened on a very few occasions. So.....I think we all do have it.  Now, if I could ever figure out how to "use it" with consistency I wouldn't be up in the hunting forum complaining about bag limits


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## JFS (Nov 26, 2012)

I'm a skeptic (who would have guessed ) on these things too.  Paranormal claims suffer from the same baggage that religious claims do in that everytime you debunk one sham claim it tends to diminish the credibility of the others.   There is some faulty wiring the brain that makes us susceptible to psychic/religious explanations but it doesn't ever hold up to scrutiny.  If you think I'm wrong, please cut me in for 10% as a finder fee when you collect your million dollars (which has been long offered but never collected) http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> I'm a skeptic (who would have guessed ) on these things too.  Paranormal claims suffer from the same baggage that religious claims do in that everytime you debunk one sham claim it tends to diminish the credibility of the others.   There is some faulty wiring the brain that makes us susceptible to psychic/religious explanations but it doesn't ever hold up to scrutiny.  If you think I'm wrong, please cut me in for 10% as a finder fee when you collect your million dollars (which has been long offered but never collected) http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html



I'm glad you weighed in on the matter.  When I started the thread, I had hoped to get some "skeptic" contributions as well as religious ones.

I do believe in the "6th sense."  I also believe it could be a very natural phenomena.  I watch my 3 yr old daughter filter people based on it.  Some folks she naturally goes up and hugs......others, she will hide behind me when she encounters them.

.....then there's the deer.......

As far as "haints" are concerned, I am still not entirely convinced one way or the other, but will probably fall in the skeptical camp based primarily on my religious beliefs.  If they do exist, I would have to think they are more "other beings" rather than human spirits.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> I'm glad you weighed in on the matter.  When I started the thread, I had hoped to get some "skeptic" contributions as well as religious ones.
> 
> I do believe in the "6th sense."  I also believe it could be a very natural phenomena.  I watch my 3 yr old daughter filter people based on it.  Some folks she naturally goes up and hugs......others, she will hide behind me when she encounters them.
> 
> ...



I would think that your religious beliefs would support the idea of haints.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I would think that your religious beliefs would support the idea of haints.



Depends on how we are defining "haints."  If we are talking human spirits.....then I would be skeptical because I am not so certain such a thing would linger.  If we are talking "other beings," then, sure?????


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> Depends on how we are defining "haints."  If we are talking human spirits.....then I would be skeptical because I am not so certain such a thing would linger.  If we are talking "other beings," then, sure?????



As contradictory as the Bible may seem to those that may take individual verses out of context, it is pretty clear that there are only two places that a soul will go once it departs the body, and neither of those places is here on earth. The resulting conclusion is that those encounters of the paranormal type are of demons or spirits not of this world and used as one device or another by the devil to dissuade our faith.


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## gemcgrew (Nov 26, 2012)

In my youth, after one episode of "The Twilight Zone", I suffered the agonizing pain of shampoo in my eyes, out of fear of shutting them. The haints were there. I am convinced of it.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> As contradictory as the Bible may seem to those that may take individual verses out of context, it is pretty clear that there are only two places that a soul will go once it departs the body, and neither of those places is here on earth. The resulting conclusion is that those encounters of the paranormal type are of demons or spirits not of this world and used as one device or another by the devil to dissuade our faith.




...I'm biting my tongue....


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> As contradictory as the Bible may seem to those that may take individual verses out of context, it is pretty clear that there are only two places that a soul will go once it departs the body, and neither of those places is here on earth. The resulting conclusion is that those encounters of the paranormal type are of demons or spirits not of this world and used as one device or another by the devil to dissuade our faith.



And that's kind-of what I was gettin' at with my "religious beliefs" comment.

As far as angels and demons, I have heard and read all kinds of stuff relevant to that.  I alluded to it in the OP.  The folks down where I was tend to believe that's what is happenin' with that old house place.  I am not sure, I just know I have never encountered anything "concrete" as far as that is concerned.  Just that "feeling," and perhaps the occasional unexplained noise, etc.


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## JFS (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> I do believe in the "6th sense."  I also believe it could be a very natural phenomena.  I watch my 3 yr old daughter filter people based on it.



One of the most interesting things to me is how the brain works.  There is no doubt that a great deal of subconscious thinking occurs, sometimes with significant results (some good, some bad).  "Intuition" or "rapid cognition" can be examples of this, but I don't think that is supernatural, it fits in the realm of natural but still being explored.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> ...I'm biting my tongue....





It's all good, Ambush.  I appreciate your practicing restraint.  I would love to discuss the existence of such things in another thread.....I am enjoying all the thoughts and comments from all religious / non-religious perspectives in here.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> One of the most interesting things to me is how the brain works.  There is no doubt that a great deal of subconscious thinking occurs, sometimes with significant results (some good, some bad).  "Intuition" or "rapid cognition" can be examples of this, but I don't think that is supernatural, it fits in the realm of natural but still being explored.



I think it is entirely possible that such intution is a natural occurence.  I watched my daughter as we took her trick or treating this year.  Some folks she would light up for, others, she would completely shut off and shy away from.  It was quite interesting.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> In my youth, after one episode of "The Twilight Zone", I suffered the agonizing pain of shampoo in my eyes, out of fear of shutting them. The haints were there. I am convinced of it.





I guess that puts you in the "it's all in your head" camp????


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## stringmusic (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> As contradictory as the Bible may seem to those that may take individual verses out of context, it is pretty clear that there are only two places that a soul will go once it departs the body, and neither of those places is here on earth. The resulting conclusion is that those encounters of the paranormal type are of demons or spirits not of this world and used as one device or another by the devil to dissuade our faith.



This sums my thoughts up on the subject exactly.

Good post Miguel


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## JFS (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> it is pretty clear that there are only two places that a soul will go once it departs the body



What is a soul?


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> What is a soul?



The part that thinks, feels, etc.????


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> What is a soul?



It's a KIA..........duhhhh.


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## stringmusic (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> It's a KIA..........duhhhh.
> View attachment 701279


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> The part that thinks, feels, etc.????



Your brain?


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> Your brain?



Who the heck knows.  I only answered to keep that one post from being a thread killer.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> Who the heck knows.  I only answered to keep that one post from being a thread killer.



I suppose we just have to speculate; like "what haints are made of".


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## JFS (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> Who the heck knows.  I only answered to keep that one post from being a thread killer.



Not sure why it would it be a thread killer. 

Serious question - what is a soul?   Seems to be a necessary prerequisite to knowing whether we have one and why we would care where it goes.

Great commercial too.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> Not sure why it would it be a thread killer.



....cause it leads to the discussion of the existence of such.  But, I'll play along since it's going that direction.....and in about 100 posts, I'll be able to say "told 'ya so." 



JFS said:


> Serious question - what is a soul?   Seems to be a necessary prerequisite to knowing whether we have one and why we would care where it goes.



As ambush states, any answer I give is pure speculation, and I will add to that my beliefs are based on my faith, and nothing scientific.

From what I believe, your soul is the conscience part of your being.  Not the chemical reactions that occur within your brain causing one thing or the other, but the part which drives "morality."  The part which makes us empathize with things.  What makes us think and feel.

The brain is "how" we think and feel.

I have heard the evolutionary arguments explaining "how" such characteristics evolved, but am not convinced "why" such a thing would have only occurred within humans....to such an extent (I know there are always isolated examples within the animal kingdon).

A lot of this has to do with why I believe we are created different.  Our morality evolved to a much greater degree than other animals.  Though I certainly believe in evolution, I tend to think ours was unique, and the evidence of such is everywhere.  Nothing has dominated through intelligence, only us.  

I cannot produce a soul for you, or fill you in on what it is made of.  I can only tell you why I believe such a thing exists.


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## NCHillbilly (Nov 26, 2012)

I don't believe in haints and such because I've never seen one, even being in many places that were supposedly hainted. Never saw an angel or a demon, either. Couldn't say that any of the above do or don't exist, only that I've never encountered any of them in 45 years so far.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

NCHillbilly said:


> I don't believe in haints and such because I've never seen one, even being in many places that were supposedly hainted. Never saw an angel or a demon, either. Couldn't say that any of the above do or don't exist, only that I've never encountered any of them in 45 years so far.



Same for the Bigfeets?

(That's a derail, for those keeping score at home)


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

NCHillbilly said:


> I don't believe in haints and such because I've never seen one, even being in many places that were supposedly hainted. Never saw an angel or a demon, either. Couldn't say that any of the above do or don't exist, only that I've never encountered any of them in 45 years so far.


I can, my ex-wife was a demon, my current wife is an angel.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> I can, my ex-wife was a demon, my current wife is an angel.



I hooked up with a Bigfeets in college.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I hooked up with a Bigfeets in college.



On a dissimilar slant on that topic, you ever eat "Soul Food"? Ever wonder why it is called that?


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> On a dissimilar slant on that topic, you ever eat "Soul Food"? Ever wonder why it is called that?




Do tell....


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## JFS (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> From what I believe, your soul is the conscience part of your being.  Not the chemical reactions that occur within your brain causing one thing or the other, but the part which drives "morality."  The part which makes us empathize with things.  What makes us think and feel.
> 
> The brain is "how" we think and feel.



You are right of course, this goes to one of the great historical philosophical debates - mind/body dualism.  Funny thing is dualism has been getting it's rear kicked recently, which if you are honest has to undermine the concept of soul.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> Do tell....



Those were not rhetorical questions.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> Those were not rhetorical questions.



OK.  Yes.  I have eaten (sometimes cook) what is commonly considered 'Soul Food'.  Why is it called that?


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> OK.  Yes.  I have eaten (sometimes cook) what is commonly considered 'Soul Food'.  Why is it called that?



I asked you first.
I think the new politically correct / non-religious word for it is "Comfort Food".


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> I can, my ex-wife was a demon, my current wife is an angel.





I have an identical story to tell.  However, demon was too nice, I typical refer to my ex as satan.


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## hobbs27 (Nov 26, 2012)

Us bible readers know that the dead has been risen in the past by evil spirits, such as when Saul had Samuel risen by the witch of endor.
We also know evil spirits could take over peoples bodies and even in swine.I believe this power of Satan was lost when he was defeated at Calvary.
 There is a way though..even in Christs present kingdom that we may see,smell, or feel the presence of those that have gone, and that is through the Holy Spirit.I never believed that this was possible and thought just like NCHillbilly until it happened to me.I sat on the end of a church pew one sunday night, only a handful of folks were in the house.We began to sing a song and I began talking with the Lord praying earnestly and I lifted up my head and noticed a man came walking from the altar toward me down the aisle, I put my head back down to the song book and as the man got beside me he just stood there, so I lifted my head with a greeting smile on my face, noticed he had on bluejeans and an old western styled shirt and as soon as my eyes got to his face....nothing.....no one was there, but a smell in the air of my grandfather that I loved and missed so much...God sent me an Angel that night, a gift from the other side...I had Holy Ghost bumps from my head to my toe and no one else in the house knew what had happened to me, but I will never forget it and always am reminded of it when my faith gets weak.
So I do believe in spirits but good spirits.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> You are right of course, this goes to one of the great historical philosophical debates - mind/body dualism.  Funny thing is dualism has been getting it's rear kicked recently, which if you are honest has to undermine the concept of soul.



I am not aware of the current trend.  I am open to hearing the "cons" of this particular belief system.

I read a good bit about it years ago in school, but I wasn't a philosophy major, only took those classes which were mandatory, so I am no scholar on the subject.  Much of my perspective is derived from logic/religion/a little bit of study.


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## Nicodemus (Nov 26, 2012)

My defination of soul food (which is not in my vocabulary, btw) is the classic food of old, in all parts of the country, not just the South. Another term would be "comfort food". This would be staples, like greens, peas, beans, seasonal vegetables normally grown at home, and meat like smoked and-or cured pork, chicken, and small wild game like rabbits, squirrels, possums, coons, and birds. 

Heckfire, I still eat most of that stuff myself.


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## groundhawg (Nov 26, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> I don't get too worried about Native American sights. I've been told that their spiritual process leaves very little chance for hauntings by Native American spirits. In terms of houses and places in the woods, I have encountered things I can't explain and have learned to pay attention when the hair on the back of my neck stands up. If it's an old home place and I get that feeling, I don't stick around.



Have had the same thing happen to me a few times and like you there are few places I just will not return to.


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## ambush80 (Nov 26, 2012)

Nicodemus said:


> My defination of soul food (which is not in my vocabulary, btw) is the classic food of old, in all parts of the country, not just the South. Another term would be "comfort food". This would be staples, like greens, peas, beans, seasonal vegetables normally grown at home, and meat like smoked and-or cured pork, chicken, and small wild game like rabbits, squirrels, possums, coons, and birds.
> 
> Heckfire, I still eat most of that stuff myself.



Dang Nic!  Did you write the Wikipedia definition?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul_food

_Soul food
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
For other uses, see Soul food (disambiguation).
Ham hock and black-eyed peas
Hushpuppies

Soul food cuisine consists of a selection of foods traditional for African Americans. It is closely related to the cuisine of the Southern United States. The descriptive terminology may have originated in the mid-1960s, when soul was a common definer used to describe African-American culture (for example, soul music).
Contents

The term soul food became popular in the 1960s. The origins of soul food, however, are much older and can be traced back to Africa—and to a lesser extent, to Europe, as well. Foods such as rice, sorghum (known by some Europeans as "guinea corn"), and okra — all common elements of West African cuisine — were introduced to the Americas as a result of the trans-Atlantic slave trade. They became dietary staples among enslaved Africans. They also comprise an important part of the cuisine of the American south, in general. Many culinary historians believe that in the beginning of the 14th century, around the time of early Euro-African exploration, European explorers brought their own food supplies and introduced them into local African diets. Foods such as corn and cassava from the Americas, turnips from Morocco, and cabbage from Portugal would play an important part in the history of African-American cooking.[1]

When the Europeans began their African slave trade in the early 15th century, the diet of newly-enslaved Africans changed on the long journeys away from their homelands. It was during this time that some of the indigenous crops of Africa began showing up in the Americas.[2]

European enslavers fed their captive workers as cheaply as possible, often with leftover/waste foods from the plantation, forcing slaves to make do with the ingredients at hand. In slave households, 'vegetables' consisted of the tops of turnips, beets, and dandelions. Soon, African-American slaves were cooking with new types of "greens": collards, kale, cress, mustard, and pokeweed. They also developed recipes which used lard, cornmeal, and offal; discarded cuts of meat such as pigs' feet, oxtail, ham hocks, pig ears, hog jowls, tripe, and skin. Cooks added onions, garlic, thyme, and bay leaf as flavor enhancers. Slave owners provided their slaves with the poor parts of the pig such as the small intestines: chitterlings/"Chitlins" were a dish of poor people in medieval England and the name was adopted by the African-Americans through their European slave owners. Some African-American slaves supplemented their meager diets by gardening small plots given to them for growing their own vegetables; many engaged in subsistence fishing and hunting, which yielded wild game for the table. Foods such as raccoon, squirrel, opossum, turtle, and rabbit were, until the 1950s, very common fare among the then still predominantly rural and Southern African-American population.[3]
Native American cuisine

Southern Native American culture (Cherokee, Chickasaw, Choctaw, Creek) is the cornerstone of the American south's cuisine. From their cultures came one of the main staples of the Southern diet: corn (maize) – either ground into meal or limed with an alkaline salt to make hominy, in a Native American technology known as nixtamalization.[4] Corn was used to make all kinds of dishes, from the familiar cornbread and grits, to liquors such as whiskey and moonshine (which were important trade items).

Many fruits are available in this region. Muscadines, blackberries, raspberries, and many other wild berries were part of Southern Native Americans' diets, as well.
“ 	To a far greater degree than anyone realizes, several of the most important food dishes that the Native Americans of the southeastern U.S.A live on today is the "soul food" eaten by both Black and White Southerners. Hominy, for example, is still eaten: Sofkee live on as grits; cornbread [is] used by Southern cooks; Indian fritters -- variously known as "hoe cake" or "Johnny cake"; Indian boiled cornbread is present in Southern cuisine as "corn meal dumplings" and "hush puppies"; Southerners cook their beans and field peas by boiling them, as did the Native tribes; and, like the Native Americans, Southerners cured their meats and smoked it over hickory coals... 	”

—- Charles Hudson, The Southeastern Indians.[5]

Native Americans of the U.S. south also supplemented their diets with meats derived from the hunting of native game. Venison was an important meat staple due to the abundance of white-tailed deer in the area. They also hunted rabbits, squirrels and opossums. Livestock, adopted from Europeans, in the form of hogs and cattle, were kept. When game or livestock was killed, the entire animal was used. Aside from the meat, it was not uncommon for them to eat organ meats such as liver, brains and intestines. This tradition remains today in hallmark dishes like chitterlings (commonly called chit'lins) which are fried small intestines of hogs, livermush (a common dish in the Carolinas made from hog liver), and pork brains and eggs. The fat of the animals, particularly hogs, was rendered and used for cooking and frying. Many of the early European settlers in the South learned Native American cooking methods, and so cultural diffusion was set in motion for the Southern dish.

Impoverished whites and blacks in the South prepared many of the same dishes stemming from the soul tradition, but styles of preparation sometimes varied. Certain techniques popular in soul and southern cuisines (e.g., frying meat, using all parts of the animal for consumption), are shared with ancient cultures all over the world, including Rome, Egypt, and China.[6]_

I've always associated it with the South.  I wouldn't call scrapple or stuffed cabbage 'Soul Food' but some consider it 'comfort food'.  I guess I would call anything at a proper meat and 3 'Soul Food'.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

hobbs27 said:


> Us bible readers know that the dead has been risen in the past by evil spirits, such as when Saul had Samuel risen by the witch of endor.
> We also know evil spirits could take over peoples bodies and even in swine.I believe this power of Satan was lost when he was defeated at Calvary.
> There is a way though..even in Christs present kingdom that we may see,smell, or feel the presence of those that have gone, and that is through the Holy Spirit.I never believed that this was possible and thought just like NCHillbilly until it happened to me.I sat on the end of a church pew one sunday night, only a handful of folks were in the house.We began to sing a song and I began talking with the Lord praying earnestly and I lifted up my head and noticed a man came walking from the altar toward me down the aisle, I put my head back down to the song book and as the man got beside me he just stood there, so I lifted my head with a greeting smile on my face, noticed he had on bluejeans and an old western styled shirt and as soon as my eyes got to his face....nothing.....no one was there, but a smell in the air of my grandfather that I loved and missed so much...God sent me an Angel that night, a gift from the other side...I had Holy Ghost bumps from my head to my toe and no one else in the house knew what had happened to me, but I will never forget it and always am reminded of it when my faith gets weak.
> So I do believe in spirits but good spirits.



Thanks for sharing that   I was hoping a few would chime in with personal stories.


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## Nicodemus (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> Dang Nic!  Did you write the Wikipedia definition?
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul_food
> 
> ...





Dang!  Believe it or not, I didn`t get my info there!    I reckon I just got lucky, and remembered from when I was a youngun. 

I meant to add too, that this type food was used by all races and creeds of people. Might not what`s best healthwise, but it sure is good.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I've always associated it with the South.  I wouldn't call scrapple or stuffed cabbage 'Soul Food' but some consider it 'comfort food'.  I guess I would call anything at a proper meat and 3 'Soul Food'.



I hate to say it, but I always thought of pigs ears and chitlins.  

I like nics definition better.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

NCHillbilly said:


> Never saw an angel or a demon, either. Couldn't say that any of the above do or don't exist, only that I've never encountered any of them in 45 years so far.



I have difficulty with that stuff myself, primarily because of my lack of experience or encounters.  I know what the Bible says about it, though.  It's kind-of like "heaven."  I struggle a lot with that concept as well.  Just can't wrap my head around it.

I started the thread to get a conversation on the topic going, and to hear personal stories.  So far, we have covered ghosts, dualism, bigfoot, Indian artifacts, and soul-food.


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## bluemarlin (Nov 26, 2012)

NCHillbilly said:


> I don't believe in haints and such because I've never seen one, even being in many places that were supposedly hainted. Never saw an angel or a demon, either. Couldn't say that any of the above do or don't exist, only that I've never encountered any of them in 45 years so far.



I feel the same way... I've wanted to see, looked into, and even tried to believe that type stuff is real but it's always been debunked. I don't believe but I do feel that your mind can play tricks on you and you will see what you want to see.

Another piece to the puzzle is the paranormal challenge that's been in place since 1964... http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html 

There's nothing I can think of that would be any cooler than someone collecting the cash because they have evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event.


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## JFS (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> I am open to hearing the "cons" of this particular belief system.



The first person experience is a cool and mysterious thing, but the more we learn about neuroscience the more mechanistic and integral mind appears.  There doesn't appear to be much about mind that is in fact independent of matter.   I personally never found dualism to make much sense since no one could explain satisfactorily how mind interacts with matter if it was in fact separate, but that's just logic.  The medical part is really the recent compelling info.


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## JB0704 (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> The first person experience is a cool and mysterious thing, but the more we learn about neuroscience the more mechanistic and integral mind appears.  There doesn't appear to be much about mind that is in fact independent of matter.   I personally never found dualism to make much sense since no one could explain satisfactorily how mind interacts with matter if it was in fact separate, but that's just logic.  The medical part is really the recent compelling info.



Hmmmm, I have always wondered what makes me...."me."  The assumption is the soul.  The part of me which thinks things through, and drives the processes that the brain controls.

I do what I want, but why do I want the things I do?  Interacting on this forum, for example.  I find pleasure in discussing these topics which are so rarely covered in personal conversation....but it is an exercise in "mind," because the body has very little to do with it.

The reason dualism seems logical to me is that "what I want" would be driven by the survival instinct absent the soul.  My participation in this forum has very little to do with survival, and a lot to do with mental activity.  What is the reason for seeking that?


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## JFS (Nov 26, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> The reason dualism seems logical to me is that "what I want" would be driven by the survival instinct absent the soul.  My participation in this forum has very little to do with survival, and a lot to do with mental activity.  What is the reason for seeking that?



People's desires and activities are complex, but there is nothing about that that indicates the existence of something outside of normal physical processes.  In fact with the right supplies we can totally manipulate your wants or many other facets of your personality and cognition.

This thread may provide a good analogy.   A while ago people ascribed supernatural causes to complex systems, whether it was illness or weather or whatever.  What was the reason for those events- it must be some mystical intelligence typically interpreted as "gods" or magic.  Now we know there are direct physical causes of things like lightning and understand it was a virus that killed your cow, not your neighbor's evil eye.  Understanding the way the world works diminishes the need for hidden supernatural things, be they gods, magic, or mind/soul/spirits.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 26, 2012)

JFS said:


> People's desires and activities are complex, but there is nothing about that that indicates the existence of something outside of normal physical processes.  In fact with the right supplies we can totally manipulate your wants or many other facets of your personality and cognition.
> 
> This thread may provide a good analogy.   A while ago people ascribed supernatural causes to complex systems, whether it was illness or weather or whatever.  What was the reason for those events- it must be some mystical intelligence typically interpreted as "gods" or magic.  Now we know there are direct physical causes of things like lightning and understand it was a virus that killed your cow, not your neighbor's evil eye.  Understanding the way the world works diminishes the need for hidden supernatural things, be they gods, magic, or mind/soul/spirits.


And since we now have the ability to synthesize practically every element known to man we have started producing synthetic humans, instead of the natural process that is well understood down to the very what, why and how.


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## JB0704 (Nov 27, 2012)

JFS said:


> In fact with the right supplies we can totally manipulate your wants or many other facets of your personality and cognition.



From what I understand, personality is still a mystery, and the current thinking is that it is a blend of genetics and evironment.  Only environmental factors can be manipulated.



JFS said:


> Now we know there are direct physical causes of things like lightning and understand it was a virus that killed your cow, not your neighbor's evil eye.  Understanding the way the world works diminishes the need for hidden supernatural things, be they gods, magic, or mind/soul/spirits.



Or, science explains "how" it is done.  It still does not answer "what makes me....me?"

I am sitting here in my office debating the existence of a soul with a bunch of complete strangers for no reason outside intellectual stimulation.  There is no "survival" portion of that equation, yet something drives me to log in here every morning when I get to the office.  I think it's "me."  The chemical reactions firing the neurotransmitters in my brain enable the soul to achieve it's purpose.

I guess that's how I see it??????


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## gemcgrew (Nov 27, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> From what I understand, personality is still a mystery, and the current thinking is that it is a blend of genetics and evironment.


My two children were not exposed to their cousins. I was amazed in the similarities they shared. Not just looks but expressions, motions and mannerisms.


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## JB0704 (Nov 27, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> My two children were not exposed to their cousins. I was amazed in the similarities they shared. Not just looks but expressions, motions and mannerisms.



My son, even though he was raised by me.....has a lot of his mother's personality.  My daughter (from a different mom, my current wife), is a carbon copy of her mother.

Both would be a good argument for genetic personality.


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## JFS (Nov 27, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> It still does not answer "what makes me....me?"



One of the best questions I've seen posed in this context is "would you still be you if "you" had a different father?  You tend to think of "you" as a disassociated something with independent existence.  So does that independent you exisit independent of the body (i.e. the genetic component)?  Do you think you still be "you" if your parents were different people?


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## JB0704 (Nov 27, 2012)

JFS said:


> Do you think you still be "you" if your parents were different people?



Yes.....but only because I believe in the soul


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## Artfuldodger (Nov 27, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> Yes.....but only because I believe in the soul



Then your soul was here before you were born.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 27, 2012)

Sure would like some more Haint stories, this other stuff is boringly similar to the chicken and the egg argument.


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## JB0704 (Nov 27, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> Sure would like some more Haint stories, this other stuff is boringly similar to the chicken and the egg argument.



I agree....


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## Ronnie T (Nov 27, 2012)

In 1969 myself and 4 other GI's experienced something that is still unsettling to me.  We sat in a huge warehouse, a little after midnight.  We were the only 5 people there.  We all heard, and saw the door at the far end of the building open, then close.  We all 5 heard the footsteps of the person walking from that door on into the building towards us.  The closer it got, the loader it got, and steps came right up to the shipping crates we were sitting on.
Then they stopped.  But no one was there. (I just got chillbumps remembering it).
We all stared at each other with blank expressions.  We didn't speak for at least 15 minutes.
It happened.  There isn't a doubt in my mind.  It was steps.  It wasn't the building creeking.


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## JB0704 (Nov 27, 2012)

Ronnie T said:


> (I just got chillbumps remembering it).



I just got 'em reading it.  Thanks for posting that.  I know a lot of very trustworthy people with similar experiences.  Do you think that helps your faith....to have experienced something "supernatural?"  I have often said that faith would be easy if we could see angels.  

Were the 5 of you able to discuss it later?


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## Ronnie T (Nov 27, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> I just got 'em reading it.  Thanks for posting that.  I know a lot of very trustworthy people with similar experiences.  Do you think that helps your faith....to have experienced something "supernatural?"  I have often said that faith would be easy if we could see angels.
> 
> Were the 5 of you able to discuss it later?



Oh yeah! We discussed it.  Mostly with this weird sort of laughter, like, we were at a total loss.

I personally don't connect it with my Christian spiritual life.  Even now, I'm at a total loss as to the what/why/how of that night.  I don't even have an offer.
It sure did scare us.


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## gemcgrew (Nov 28, 2012)

When I was in my 20's, I was alone in my apartment and had just got into bed. I felt the covers to my left pull back and somebody laid down beside me. As I gathered my thoughts, I eased out of bed and turned on the light. Nothing was there. The imprint was there and was made by something with some weight to it. I did not sleep well that night, on the couch.


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## JB0704 (Nov 28, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> When I was in my 20's, I was alone in my apartment and had just got into bed. I felt the covers to my left pull back and somebody laid down beside me. As I gathered my thoughts, I eased out of bed and turned on the light. Nothing was there. The imprint was there and was made by something with some weight to it. I did not sleep well that night, on the couch.



Thanks.  I'm glad some of you guys finally started sharing these stories.  As I told Ronnie, I know a lot of very decent, trustworthy people who have had some very strange things happen.

Do you have a theory on what was there?


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## gemcgrew (Nov 28, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> Thanks.  I'm glad some of you guys finally started sharing these stories.  As I told Ronnie, I know a lot of very decent, trustworthy people who have had some very strange things happen.
> 
> Do you have a theory on what was there?



None. I failed to mention though, that in this same apartment, I heard my name called on 3 or 4 different occasions. It was so clear that I would always answer, forgetting that I was alone.


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## JB0704 (Nov 28, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> None. I failed to mention though, that in this same apartment, I heard my name called on 3 or 4 different occasions. It was so clear that I would always answer, forgetting that I was alone.



I think I would have moved as quickly as possible.

When I was a kid, a lot of the folks at church, and my parents, talked a lot about "spiritual warfare." The youth group was treated to multiple presentations on "the occult," and various other things. Naturally, this included a ton of conversation on demons, possession, oppression, etc.  There were several books at the house on the stuff, and, as a curious kid, I read them all.  That made for a lot of terrified and sleepless nights growing up.


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## ambush80 (Nov 28, 2012)

I've woken up in the middle of the night and smelled blueberry pancakes. The smell lingered in my nose/mind until I fell back to sleep.

I heard my boyhood friend's voice call my name.  I don't know what ever became of him.


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## JB0704 (Nov 28, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I heard my boyhood friend's voice call my name.  I don't know what ever became of him.



I've heard a lot of stories like that.....btw, I was hoping some of the "skeptics" had similar stories.  My Dad swears he has heard his father calling for him, years after the man's death.


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## JB0704 (Nov 28, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I've woken up in the middle of the night and smelled blueberry pancakes. The smell lingered in my nose/mind until I fell back to sleep.



I have also heard folks who swear they have encountered "evil spirits" (demons), and they typically describe smelling sulphur.


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## ambush80 (Nov 28, 2012)

I dabbled in Transcendental Meditation some.  I once tried to 'taste' a strawberry.  I just meditated intensely on the experience of a strawberry; the way it smelled and felt in my mouth, the juice, the little seeds.  It was amazing.  The more serene and focused my mind became the more real the strawberry became.


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## JB0704 (Nov 28, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I dabbled in Transcendental Meditation some.  I once tried to 'taste' a strawberry.  I just meditated intensely on the experience of a strawberry; the way it smelled and felt in my mouth, the juice, the little seeds.  It was amazing.  The more serene and focused my mind became the more real the strawberry became.



I follow what your saying....and to some extent, I think you are onto something.

The closest thing I have to a ghost story would be very similar.   I believe I "made myself" see something.

A few years back, my best friend was killed in an auto accident.  At the time, I was on a weekend fishing trip in Florida.  Obviously, I was very upset at the situation.  Anyway, I sat in my room that night just absolutely torn up over the loss.  Plain as day, and very clearly, my dead buddy, in his laid back way, told me "it's all good."

It was very comforting at the time.....but I am certain it was just my mind finding a way to ease the pain.  I don't necessarily believe in human spirits remaining after death, but dang, that made the next few weeks a little easier.


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## gemcgrew (Nov 28, 2012)

With flashlight in hand, I went out to feed the hounds last night. When I entered the kennel, something jumped on my head and started beating me with a vengeance. As I swung at it, the light blinded me and now I am fighting for my life as the hounds flee for theirs. When I was able to gather myself, I saw that it was nothing more than a red cardinal.


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## JB0704 (Nov 28, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> With flashlight in hand, I went out to feed the hounds last night. When I entered the kennel, something jumped on my head and started beating me with a vengeance. As I swung at it, the light blinded me and now I am fighting for my life as the hounds flee for theirs. When I was able to gather myself, I saw that it was nothing more than a red cardinal.



Was this before or after you posted your "haint" memories on here????  I think the timing may have enhanced the experience a bit


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## gemcgrew (Nov 28, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> Was this before or after you posted your "haint" memories on here????  I think the timing may have enhanced the experience a bit


Before. What may have enhanced it though was a video sent to me of an elevator prank. If I still have the link, I will pm it to you.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Nov 28, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> Before. What may have enhanced it though was a video sent to me of an elevator prank. If I still have the link, I will pm it to you.



They showed those on TV last night, with the trap door, little girl in pale makeup and dressed in white. She scared the poopy out of quite a few folks and I'm surprised there weren't some heart attacks from the event. But it was hilarious.


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## JB0704 (Nov 28, 2012)

Miguel Cervantes said:


> I'm surprised there weren't some heart attacks from the event.



I was thinking the same thing when I watched it....


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## ambush80 (Nov 28, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> Before. What may have enhanced it though was a video sent to me of an elevator prank. If I still have the link, I will pm it to you.





Miguel Cervantes said:


> They showed those on TV last night, with the trap door, little girl in pale makeup and dressed in white. She scared the poopy out of quite a few folks and I'm surprised there weren't some heart attacks from the event. But it was hilarious.





JB0704 said:


> I was thinking the same thing when I watched it....



http://dailypicksandflicks.com/2012/11/26/scary-ghost-girl-elevator-prank-video/

That would suck if they did that to me.  Often when startled I come out swinging.  I shoved a poor "spook" to the ground in a haunted house once and punched my wife (when we were dating) in the nose when she tried to scare me.  This Halloween, my daughter tried to scare me by jumping out of the closet in her costume.  Mommy told her not to try to scare daddy cuz he gets "mean" as she shot me the stink eye.


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## mtnwoman (Dec 13, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> As far as "haints" are concerned, I am still not entirely convinced one way or the other, but will probably fall in the skeptical camp based primarily on my religious beliefs.  If they do exist, I would have to think they are more "other beings" rather than human spirits.



My religious beliefs cause me to think the opposite. I believe in the supernatural and things like 'them bones'. I believe in demons, even though I haven't seen one. I believe in angels, even though I haven't seen one....I believe they are amongst us. So I don't know about common 'haints'..(lol)...but I do believe it's possible.

Even in the bible it says 'fear not' when an angel has appeared, because it would be normal to be afraid of something like that, that's why they say 'fear not'.


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