# Accidental Discharge



## medic1 (Oct 22, 2007)

A friend of mine borrowed one of my rifles this weekend, a Savage 110 in .243. He told me today when he gave it back that while he was racking the rounds to unload the gun it discharged. Thankfully he had the gun pointed in a safe direction. I have fired this gun several times and have never had that happen. The trigger is fairly light. I've never had it measured but I would say 3-4 lbs. He told me his hand was nowhere near the trigger. What could have caused it?


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## 7mm REM MAG (Oct 22, 2007)

Its not "if" its going to happen, but "when" and will the gun be pointed in a safe direction.


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## jbi1104 (Oct 22, 2007)

No such thing as an accidental discharge, only negligent discharges.  Glad no one was injured.


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## Jim Thompson (Oct 22, 2007)

I have seen it happen with a very light trigger job, or possibly a faulty trigger job


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## Wetzel (Oct 22, 2007)

jbi1104 said:


> No such thing as an accidental discharge, only negligent discharges.


I have a Model 700 that started discharging when the safety was pushed off.  Don't feel that I was negligent when this happened.  Sent if back to Remington to have it repaired.  Hadn't had the gun but about six months.


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## jbi1104 (Oct 22, 2007)

Sounds like it was Remington's negligence.


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## medic1 (Oct 22, 2007)

jbi1104 said:


> No such thing as an accidental discharge, only negligent discharges.  Glad no one was injured.



Yes, it was accidental. If the story is true my friend did nothing wrong. In fact, he did something right by having the gun pointed in a safe direction. Who is to blame was not my question.


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## Wetzel (Oct 22, 2007)

medic1 said:


> In fact, he did something right by having the gun pointed in a safe direction.


You got that right.



jbi1104 said:


> Sounds like it was Remington's negligence.


My thoughts exactly...


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## dixie (Oct 22, 2007)

Sounds like it may have slammed fired, I had one that would do that, I found out about it before ever chambering a round in it, I had the trigger set a little too light.


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## dawg2 (Oct 22, 2007)

Jim Thompson said:


> I have seen it happen with a very light trigger job, or possibly a faulty trigger job



Gotta agree with Jim.  

Either send it back to the guy who did your trigger job or if it is still in warranty, send it back to manufacturer immediately.  I would not load that rifle again until it is fixed.


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## CAL (Oct 22, 2007)

Many times when a bolt gun's action is worked fast to unload it will discharge.This happens when the trigger is set too light!Working the action as such is also the way to check to see if the trigger is set too light.Of coarse the gun is not loaded in the test.

With the gun unloaded,work the action real fast and see if it will hold.One can tell if the action does not hold by the feel.If it will not hold only sometimes!Reset the trigger to a heavier pull and the problem is most likely solved!


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## Sargent (Oct 22, 2007)

Back when I took the hunter safety course (almost 20 years ago!!), the DNR officer who taught the course told a story where this happened and it led to an near fatal accidental shooting.  

I can't remember the particulars, but the theme of the story he told has stuck with me since then.... and helped me be consistently safety conscious.  

So, pass this thread along....maybe someone will learn something!


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## rayjay (Oct 22, 2007)

Savage has a 3 position trigger which allows you to cycle the bolt with the safe on. It is possible for the trigger to be adjusted wrong and the safe not work.

 It is foolish to cycle the bolt fully closed when emptying the magazine.

If he was closing the bolt all the way his hand was near the trigger no matter what he says.

I have seen AD's that were not negligent no matter what somebody on the internet says. Broken firing pins or other metal failure does happen.


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## Ga-Bullet (Oct 22, 2007)

Likely the Sear Engagement.Chance are, It will do it again. If not fix.If it had trigger work. The factory want touch it, Without replacing it. Either way it need fixed.


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## OkieHunter (Oct 22, 2007)

First of all if the rifle has a floor plate that is how you unload the extra rounds not by working the action. And second I have to agree there is no excuse for a discharge.


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## Greg Tench (Oct 22, 2007)

OkieHunter said:


> First of all if the rifle has a floor plate that is how you unload the extra rounds not by working the action. And second I have to agree there is no excuse for a discharge.



I agree


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## Nicodemus (Oct 22, 2007)

MUZZLE CONTROL!!! Never forget it.

And, never trust a safety.


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## BgDadyBeardBustr (Oct 22, 2007)

I have a Winchester Model 70 and it has a 3 position safety. When I unload mine I do not push my bolt all the way forward. I push it forward enough so that the next bullet comes out of the magazine. I pull out the bullet and repeat. Glad he had the muzzle in a safe direction. If there is a defect in the gun, it should discharge for you if you do the same thing you said he did. Just try this while it is unloaded and the muzzle in a safe direction. It should do the same for you IMO. I know Savage at one time had a srew in the rear of the bolt and if it got loose, the handle would turn but the bolt stayed in the chambered position. Make sure the screw is tight. Good Luck, Tim


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## biggabuck (Oct 22, 2007)

I had a remington that did the same thing. Send it BACK!!!


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## Hammack (Oct 23, 2007)

I don't care how light the trigger is it should not fire accidentally.  I don;t know much on the savage trigger, but since the Remingtons were brought up I will address them.  I have a couple of older Remington 40xbr target rifles that have 2oz triggers, they don;t break until you pull them, not matter how hard you jar them or flip on and off the safety.  Remington had a bad batch of 700's back years ago that would fire when the safety was taken off.  They were sued after a man was shot by one, and supposedly ran a recall on them.  I had one of those rifles in 6.5mm Rem Mag.  I have also seen Remington triggers that would fire when the safety was taken off it the unit was extremely dirty.  With that said I am not sure about Savage, but if you send a rifle into Remington for ANYTHING they will pull your trigger and replace it and YOUR cost if it has been readjusted.  Ga-Bullet has the right idea I believe. It's probably in the sear engagement, but have a competent gunsmith go over it or send it back to savage.


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## medic1 (Oct 23, 2007)

I appreciate the advice. I bought the gun used last year. I don't know for a fact of any trigger work done but since it is lighter than other Savages I own I'm pretty sure it has been adjusted.  The gun does not have a floor plate to unload the ammo. I will take it to a gunsmith for evaluation and repair.


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## Jetjockey (Oct 23, 2007)

BTW... For you Remmy guys.. It costs $20 to get remmy to replace the old style 700 triggers.  My dads 700 went off on me when I was closing the bolt with a round in the chamber.  My hands were no where near the trigger.  I had the front of the rifle with my left hand and was cycling the bolt with my right hand, the butt was resting on my thigh with the muzzle pointed into the air.  If you have the old style 700's where the bolt will lock down with the safety on, and you have to push the safety off to get the bolt to move, I would highly suggest you have remmy replace the trigger.


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## Dillon (Oct 30, 2007)

My wife was using my Savage model 110 in a 30-06. She was chambering the bullets to unload it and then all of a sudden it went off. Lucky she had it pointed in a safe direction. I had owned this gun for years and have shot many deers with it and never had a problem. The year before this happen i had a guy adjust the tigger, the only problem was he wasn't a gun smith by trade just as a hobby. So after the accident i called some gunsmiths to look at the gun but the only problem was that Savage had went bankrupty and changed new owners after may gun was made. So Savage takes no responsability for the gun, so then none of the gunsmiths wanted to take a look at the gun neither. The only person to look at it was the gunsmith at Franklin Gun Shop in Athens. He readjusted the tigger to factory  and tightened up the safty on the gun and sayed there was nothing wrong with the gun. But i will always be very careful with this gun.


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## polaris30144 (Oct 31, 2007)

Unless you are in a race to see who can unload the fastest, there is no need to ever close the bolt to unload a rifle. Push the bolt far enough to strip a cartridge from the mag., open bolt and take cartridge out or tip gun to let it fall into your hand. I have never heard of a gun firing with the bolt open. I even unload my Model 94 lever without closing the action. Close it just enough to strip cartridge, then open and remove.


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## Jorge (Oct 31, 2007)

Medic1, I would be willing to bet you have some gunk built up in the trigger assembly. Remove the barrel and action from the stock and throughly blast out the trigger assembly. Especially where the trigger shear is.


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## biggtruxx (Oct 31, 2007)

i just bought a savage model 110 accutrigger 7mag remington......

this one ever had any problems like that??? im always careful anyways just now i feel slightly leery on the subject


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## seaweaver (Nov 1, 2007)

My Marlin MR7 has the three position safety they "borrowed" from the M70. I went to unload it and the safety flipped from safe, pass the safe Unlock, to fire and did.
I sent it back as the gun was new and they could not find anything wrong. A club member who is very knowledgeable said the same thing happened to him on his M70.
cw


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## doates (Nov 1, 2007)

Scary!!! I would find me a new gun.


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## rustvyper (Nov 2, 2007)

2 years ago my brother-in-law got his grandfather's remington 870 pump when grandad had to go into assisted living. That gun probably hadn't been fired in 20 years. I picked it up one evening to put it away, b/c someone had left it out.
I cycled it once to see if anything was in the chamber...nothing in the chamber, but one in the mag. went off soon as the champer closed on the round. my hand wasn't even on the trigger guard. blew a hole in the ceiling w/double 00 buck. I pee'd my pants. so yes, it does happen.


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## dawg2 (Nov 2, 2007)

rustvyper said:


> 2 years ago my brother-in-law got his grandfather's remington 870 pump when grandad had to go into assisted living. That gun probably hadn't been fired in 20 years. I picked it up one evening to put it away, b/c someone had left it out.
> I cycled it once to see if anything was in the chamber...nothing in the chamber, but one in the mag. went off soon as the champer closed on the round. my hand wasn't even on the trigger guard. blew a hole in the ceiling w/double 00 buck. I pee'd my pants. so yes, it does happen.




I clear my pump by short cycling.  I don't let it go back into the chamber, but either way, at least you had it pointing at the ceiling.


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## SHMELTON (Nov 19, 2007)

I got a model 1400 from my grandad before he passed, it had been sitting around for yrs and yrs.  I took it to the woods to test it out, I put one round in and pulled the trigger, turning my head away from the muzzle incase it blew up.  It fired, and ejected the shell no problem.  So I loaded it up with 3 #8's and went squirrel hunting.  About 5 mins into the hunt I found my first squirrel.  I put the bead on him and pulled the trigger, all of a sudden all 3 shell fired off.  You talking about scared to death.  All I can say is I am glad the second shot didn't cause the gun to fall out of my hand.  Who knows what would have happened.  Needless my 1400 is a wall hanger now.


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## whitworth (Nov 29, 2007)

*Check the firearm recalls*

You'd be surprised what you can find on the internet. Just key in your rifle name, model and recall

SAVAGE
MODEL 110E,
.30-06 SPRINGFIELD CALIBER, RIFLE

WARNING: The rifle did not fire with its safety engaged. However, with the safety “off” it fired when struck on top of the receiver bridge or grip area of the buttstock from underneath, regardless of the whether the rifle is in an horizontal, vertical or upside down position.

    Savage Arms
    100 Springdale Road
    Westfield, MA 01085
    (413) 568-7001

Source:

    *

      AFTE Journal, January 1994; Volume 26, Number 1:2-3
****************
Remington had a recall on several rifles; one was accidental discharge.


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## Jack Flynn (Nov 29, 2007)

Here's what I'd do. Cycle the action without a round cocking it. Make 110% sure no round is in it. Take the safety off. Now hold the gun by the barrel like you are going to lean it up somewhere. Now drop the butt of the gun on the ground letting the barrel just guide it to the floor. Totally let go of it with your hand encased around the barrel. Do it quite a few times. If it doesn't trip the sear, cock it real fast and drop it again several times. Check to see if it has tripped by pulling the trigger again. It will take a good bounce each time but will not hurt the scope or the gun. If it does not trip while doing this I'd say 20 or more times there was a stray finger in the way I promise. FWIW if you are cycling an action your hand has to be close to the trigger guard...........


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## Alan in GA (Dec 11, 2007)

*whether or not,,,,*

whether or not the trigger is THOUGHT to be incorrectly adjusted,,it MUST be checked out by the factory or a competent trigger smith [gunsmith]. It is not worth wondering if "it's the trigger" or the shooter. After an AD, everything is suspect because the danger is too great of a repeat.
By the way, I've seen ADs happen, the shooter says he did not touch the trigger, and bystanders SAW the shooter touch the trigger. I don't know if it's 'denial' or just shock of the occurance [it is loud~!].
Anyway, the rifle MUST be checked out. Consider that the previous owner did his own 'tuneing' - your rifle's trigger now needs to be checked for cleanliness, sear engagement, sear surfaces/angles [hack smith stoning incorrectly previously], adjustment screws and return springs,,,the whole ball of wax.
Now, some rifles won't extract a round unless the bolt handle has been turned down. Spring extractor claws have to be forced over the case rim to be able to grab and pull the rounds out so 'short cycling' or just pushing the bolt all the way forward is not always possible and a case will be left in the chamber. Controlled feed actions and SOME spring claw extractor bolts will easily snap over the rim, but not all.
As one said,,an AD can happen anytime,,THAT'S why muzzle control / direction is SO important.
I still remember a guy shooting out his own truck's windsheild in deer camp. Brother in law and I were sipping coffee about 10 am back in camp as we watched it happen from about 50' away.
We didn't say a  thing,,just looked at him and smiled while he started sputtering excuses, reasons,,and just general jabber about the 'happening'.
He started out saying "I didn't touch a thing" [while cycling his bolt action rifle and unloading it with one leg up on the door ledge of his truck]. After mumbling and jabbering for a few minutes, he finally changed his story and started saying something about 'well,,,,maybe I DID have my finger 'close' to the trigger?!'


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## polaris30144 (Dec 11, 2007)

Alan in GA said:


> whether or not the trigger is THOUGHT to be incorrectly adjusted,,it MUST be checked out by the factory or a competent trigger smith [gunsmith]. It is not worth wondering if "it's the trigger" or the shooter. After an AD, everything is suspect because the danger is too great of a repeat.
> By the way, I've seen ADs happen, the shooter says he did not touch the trigger, and bystanders SAW the shooter touch the trigger. I don't know if it's 'denial' or just shock of the occurance [it is loud~!].
> Anyway, the rifle MUST be checked out. Consider that the previous owner did his own 'tuneing' - your rifle's trigger now needs to be checked for cleanliness, sear engagement, sear surfaces/angles [hack smith stoning incorrectly previously], adjustment screws and return springs,,,the whole ball of wax.
> Now, some rifles won't extract a round unless the bolt handle has been turned down. Spring extractor claws have to be forced over the case rim to be able to grab and pull the rounds out so 'short cycling' or just pushing the bolt all the way forward is not always possible and a case will be left in the chamber. Controlled feed actions and SOME spring claw extractor bolts will easily snap over the rim, but not all.
> ...



You don't have to close the bolt to strip a round from the magazine. Most "experts" think you have to cycle or chamber a round to get it out of the gun. Short cycle means close bolt just enough to strip cartridge but don't push into the chamber, open bolt, tip gun to the side and let cartridge fall out into your hand. Every now and then you may have to assist the cartridge out with your finger. Why do "expert" shooters think the bolt has to pull the cartridge out of the gun? If the cartridge is never chambered, it will fall out after it is stripped. You only have to close the bolt handle if you push the cartridge into the chamber. I have never heard of a firearm discharging without the bolt being closed on a live round. If a shooter takes being safe serious, the amount of "accidental" discharges could be largely eliminated. 

 I bet a lot of times when guns slam fire or fire upon taking off safe, a wannabe home gunsmith adjusted or modified the trigger at some point. This is the reason why most gun manufacturers don't tell you how to work on the triggers in the owners manual, unless they make the adjustments idiot proof someone will screw it up and make a gun unsafe. There are rare occasions when a defect is built into a gun, but it is usually apparent very early and a recall is issued promptly.


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## EON (Dec 11, 2007)

I've got a Remington 700 that did that once, seems when it came from the factory they pack the bolt with some kind of grease.  Over many years the grease hardened.  When I closed the bolt it fired.  Took it to a smith where they disaccembled the bolt and stripped the old grease out.  They dipped it in some type of solvent, don't remember what. At the time it had not had a trigger job.

I take great pride in my guns and ability to keep them in peak performance so this was a shock to me, not to mention a heart stopper at the time. Not had a problem since.


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## Alan in GA (Dec 11, 2007)

*I agree,,,*

-I'm no "expert".
Yes, push bolt part way to strip round and let fall sideways works.
Glad you cleared it up for us.


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