# Kids Church



## huntmore (Feb 15, 2011)

I have been meaning to ask this for a long time. Who came up with this notion. I do not agree with this and here is why. Kids play with each other all the time and learn from kids all the time as well, (bad habits). Why not make them sit beside you in Church so the parent can teach them how to behave and help instruct them about God. My kids are pretty much grown and I still ask them about what went on during the Mass. I would think you would want your kid to grow up to be an adult so the best way to do that in Church is for them to be around the adults.


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## PWalls (Feb 15, 2011)

Different philosophies. Some feel a more "age-appropriate" lesson taught in a side room is more apt to be remembered and learned versus the standard 30min+ sermon in Hebrews that some adults have a hard time understanding. Then some feel that kids learn things rapidly and we should give their abilities and the Holy Spirit's ability more credit. Then some feel that a little kid squirming in the bench in front of you is a distraction.

Personally, I feel that if the children (maybe up through elementary school) are taken aside during the "sermon" and given their own Bible lesson, they will also learn. Parents can be involved with that by getting copies of that lesson as well for home re-inforcement. Of course, I also think if a parent wants their child to sit next to them, then that is their right as well.

I don't get worked up over it either way.


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## rjcruiser (Feb 15, 2011)

I agree with the above two posters. 

I think problems come when parents want church to be solely responsible in teaching their kids about Christ.  

On the flip side, I think problems come when church's feel it is their responsibility to do it all.

The two should work together in harmony, with the end responsibility laying solely on the parent.


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## polkhunt (Feb 15, 2011)

Kids church is a great thing if it is done correctly. If it is just to feed them gold fish and let them play then obviously it is not beneficial. The people who work with the kids at the place of worship I attend go to great lengths to teach the kids about God and make it fun. I look around at the kids who do end up coming to the adult service and they are bored out of their minds and staring at the walls the ground or anything else they can think of to look at. The other reason I think it is good is that if a pastor is talking about subjects that Christians deal with everyday some of those things are not really appropriate for kids to hear.


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## safebuilder (Feb 15, 2011)

We have childrens church during our regular service and it is for ages 6,7,8 or there about. Nothing hard and fast. But for the last 3 or 4 months my 8 yr old has been asking and going to service with me. I try and get him to follow the songs and scripture and he does listen. I think parents know(especially when you have been teaching and praying with your child at home) when their child is ready for a full service.


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## FishingAddict (Feb 15, 2011)

Same reason that you don't make a kid read Shakespeare.   They are not emotionally mature to get anything out of it.

One building block at a time.  Miss part of the foundation, the building will crumble.


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 15, 2011)

My guess is children's church is meant to get them out of the sanctuary before they start wiggling too much and causing a scene.  Nobody wants to hear that.


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## huntmore (Feb 15, 2011)

We have religious education either before or after Mass. This gives teachers a chance to explain in a more age appriate manner thinngs they should know. The classes are all broken down by age group, so each class can learn at there level. Then during Mass they learn how to be adults which I think alot of kids are not getting these days. I personally believe that is one of the biggest problems with kids today. They are allowed to act childlike all the time. I see the merits of doing it other ways but don't feel it may be as helpful as some think.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

Why not start a kid right out in college then....
They can sit by their older brother and that brother can teach them as they go.

Is there any reason you wouldn't take a kid to an office party? Maybe they might whine or cry or wet their pants or giggle or get hungry or cough and gag or jump around or say daddy forty eleven times....try taking your two yr old to your office Christmas party and teach them how to act when they are 21.....good luck.


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## huntmore (Feb 15, 2011)

FishingAddict said:


> Same reason that you don't make a kid read Shakespeare.   They are not emotionally mature to get anything out of it.
> 
> One building block at a time.  Miss part of the foundation, the building will crumble.



I think if they read comic books all the time they will get no education. If you wait till they are 12 or older and then start making them read Shakespeare it is to late. They have already been started on worthless words.


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## huntmore (Feb 15, 2011)

mtnwoman said:


> Why not start a kid right out in college then....
> They can sit by their older brother and that brother can teach them as they go.
> 
> Is there any reason you wouldn't take a kid to an office party? Maybe they might whine or cry or wet their pants or giggle or get hungry or cough and gag or jump around or say daddy forty eleven times....try taking your two yr old to your office Christmas party and teach them how to act when they are 21.....good luck.



Are you refering to my post mtwoman?


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

huntmore said:


> We have religious education either before or after Mass. This gives teachers a chance to explain in a more age appriate manner thinngs they should know. The classes are all broken down by age group, so each class can learn at there level. Then during Mass they learn how to be adults which I think alot of kids are not getting these days. I personally believe that is one of the biggest problems with kids today. They are allowed to act childlike all the time. I see the merits of doing it other ways but don't feel it may be as helpful as some think.



They act like children because they are children. 

And children distract other adults who'd rather not hear the little chatter of other peoples children when they are trying to pay attention. But we don't do the same thing every week in church, we learn different things, so I dunno, it may be different in your church.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

huntmore said:


> Are you refering to my post mtwoman?



I'm posting what I think about childrens church. If'n I'm speakin directly to you I will backquote you as I have done here. Would you prefer I stay out of any thread you are posting in?


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

huntmore said:


> I think if they read comic books all the time they will get no education. If you wait till they are 12 or older and then start making them read Shakespeare it is to late. They have already been started on worthless words.



When I was in childrens church and when my grandchildren are in childrens church, they learn bible stories and learn how to sing in a choir and they learn plays and then they have a childrens sunday performance for the assembley, which in my opinion is teaching them on a more age appropriate level than feeding them the meat of the word. It's doubtful a 9 year old would grasp, Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Maybe Noah and the Ark might be a better place for them to start, yeah maybe drawing and coloring, whatever. I don't recall reading a comic book, do you know of a chuch that passes out comic books?
When I used to sit in church with my grandma even at age 10 I remember being pretty clueless as to what the pastor was talking about when he was doing bible study.

I agree with maybe 8 and up could sit in adult church and act ok, but they probably still would get more out of childrens church until they were 10 or so, just my experience from working with them....5 yr olds, not a chance.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 15, 2011)

Children need to have Bible class and an opportunity to learn, just as their parents do.  So churches really need to have children classes, and youth groups, and teen devotionals.  Even on Wednesday evenings.
But if your kids are shuffled off to another room during worship service, that means they are seperated from you, the parents, again.  
I suggest keeping your kids with you during your church one hour worship service.  Teach them to sit quietly.  Teach them to not make so much noise cause they might interrupt some of the old phogies who are either trying to sleep or can't congure up enough 'focus' to be able to ignore a baby that might cry a bit.

I believe your children will benefit a lot from being there with you.

But that's just me.  Everyone needs to decide for themselves.
Not all families or children are the same.

I wonder if they had kids church at Corinth?


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> Teach them to not make so much noise cause they might interrupt some of the old phogies who are either trying to sleep or can't congure up enough 'focus' to be able to ignore a baby that might cry a bit.



Are you talking about me again?....LOL....no I can't pay attention for worrying about my two granddaughters and their two friends tapping and writting and looking at the other 4 behind them, and you can warn them before, but once church has started they know you can't do anything and they begin, and I miss the whole service attending to them.


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## huntmore (Feb 16, 2011)

mtnwoman said:


> I'm posting what I think about childrens church. If'n I'm speakin directly to you I will backquote you as I have done here. Would you prefer I stay out of any thread you are posting in?



Is that more sarcasim. Post all you want. You saying I want to muzzle you doesn't mean I want you muzzled.


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## huntmore (Feb 16, 2011)

mtnwoman said:


> They act like children because they are children.
> 
> And children distract other adults who'd rather not hear the little chatter of other peoples children when they are trying to pay attention. But we don't do the same thing every week in church, we learn different things, so I dunno, it may be different in your church.



The more I hear about other people and their times in Church I am amazed. My mother must have been even more amazing than I ever thought. She (by herself)took 4 kids to church every Sunday and holy days from the time we where born untill we left home. We did not act up in Church. If you even started to open your mouth she could look it shut. If during the times we kneeled down your tail bone tried to rest on the bench behind you your ear was pulled untill you were back in place. We would not dare make a sound when it was pulled either. Thanks mom!!

We had a place in Church behind glass for kids once. A new Priest from Ireland came and took it down. He said sit in the back and if your kid acts up take it out back straighten it out and come back in. We are Christains we will understand.
They keep acting like Children because they aren't trained right.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 16, 2011)

huntmore said:


> The more I hear about other people and their times in Church I am amazed. My mother must have been even more amazing than I ever thought. She (by herself)took 4 kids to church every Sunday and holy days from the time we where born untill we left home. We did not act up in Church. If you even started to open your mouth she could look it shut. If during the times we kneeled down your tail bone tried to rest on the bench behind you your ear was pulled untill you were back in place. We would not dare make a sound when it was pulled either. Thanks mom!!
> 
> We had a place in Church behind glass for kids once. A new Priest from Ireland came and took it down. He said sit in the back and if your kid acts up take it out back straighten it out and come back in. We are Christains we will understand.
> They keep acting like Children because they aren't trained right.



I know I can understand that, but why should I have to sit on the back row with them, and miss half the service dealing with them....I need to be fed too, so I can teach them. If I have to spend out back with them, how am I getting anything out of adult church? I agree they should have a good switching after church but that's child abuse, too, ya know. So you deal with it by beggin' them PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, keep your trap shut...LOL

You still can't treat a child like anything else or train them to be anything else. Otherwise, I'd be perfect on earth considering my age...LOL


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## rjcruiser (Feb 16, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> But that's just me.  Everyone needs to decide for themselves.
> Not all families or children are the same.



Bingo



			
				Ronnie T said:
			
		

> I wonder if they had kids church at Corinth?



I think they did....I read about it in Acts 29


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## formula1 (Feb 16, 2011)

*Re:*

Deuteronomy 11
18 You shall therefore lay up these words of mine in your heart and in your soul, and you shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. 19 You shall teach them to your children, talking of them when you are sitting in your house, and when you are walking by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise. 

Proverbs 22:6
Train up a child in the way he should go; even when he is old he will not depart from it.

Ephesians 6:4
Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord.

Colossians 3:21
Fathers, do not provoke your children, lest they become discouraged.

Hebrews 5:12-14 
12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the basic principles of the oracles of God. You need milk, not solid food, 13 for everyone who lives on milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, since he is a child. 14 But solid food is for the mature, for those who have their powers of discernment trained by constant practice to distinguish good from evil.

I throw these verses out for thought and not response.  My own feeling is that you train children in the Way, but you give them what they need appropriate to their maturity. Milk when they need it and solid food when they can handle it, but always diligent in training with Love. This is the teaching of the whole of scripture and it bears witness to me.  Hopefully it will bear witness to you also!


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## mtnwoman (Feb 16, 2011)

formula1 said:


> Deuteronomy 11
> 18 You shall therefore lay up these words of mine in your heart and in your soul, and you shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. 19 You shall teach them to your children, talking of them when you are sitting in your house, and when you are walking by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise.
> 
> Proverbs 22:6
> ...



I totally agree. How in the world could most children understand the messages most pastors teach in church? Our pastor doesn't teach much on basic Bible stories, like Daniel in the Lions Den, Noahs Ark, Jonah and the Whale, etc. He teaches prophesy and Revelation and Ruth and Ester and Hebrews, etc. and teaches us how it relates to our lives today. I just don't see how children could possibly get anything out of it. Sure they might learn to sit still in church, just seems they would get more out of their own bible study age level until they are old enough to grasp some of the meat of the word.  That's why they wiggle and squirm, most of the time they are bored.
I dunno that's just me.


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## thedeacon (Feb 16, 2011)

huntmore said:


> I have been meaning to ask this for a long time. Who came up with this notion. I do not agree with this and here is why. Kids play with each other all the time and learn from kids all the time as well, (bad habits). Why not make them sit beside you in Church so the parent can teach them how to behave and help instruct them about God. My kids are pretty much grown and I still ask them about what went on during the Mass. I would think you would want your kid to grow up to be an adult so the best way to do that in Church is for them to be around the adults.



What if you were out in the woods with a group of people and stumps were provided for everyone to sit on. Yours just happened to be only 12 inches high and the others we about 24 inches high, on top of that you were smaller than the rest of the peopel. When the speaker stood to speak he spoke in a language that you did not understand. On top of that there was a big tree between you and the speaker. How much would you learn in the meeting.

I feel that is the way a lot of kids feel in the worship services. In children's church a lesson is presented that the kids can not only hear and understand but they can see it.

I do admit that in some instances the teacher may fail to teach a good class or there could be other problem. We need to do everything and I do mean everything possible to teach our children. We will be dependent on them in a few years. 

Just my opinion.  God Bless


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## huntmore (Feb 16, 2011)

thedeacon said:


> What if you were out in the woods with a group of people and stumps were provided for everyone to sit on. Yours just happened to be only 12 inches high and the others we about 24 inches high, on top of that you were smaller than the rest of the peopel. When the speaker stood to speak he spoke in a language that you did not understand. On top of that there was a big tree between you and the speaker. How much would you learn in the meeting.
> 
> I feel that is the way a lot of kids feel in the worship services. In children's church a lesson is presented that the kids can not only hear and understand but they can see it.
> 
> ...



Please don't take this the wrong way but have no better way to say it. No matter how far my ears are off the ground  or who is standing in front of me I can still hear. Most teachers can not control their own kids much less a room full. Children will not know how to act in Church unless they are put in that environment and taught.

You said "We will be dependent on them in a few years." I am not sure what you mean by this statement.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 16, 2011)

There is a group, actually it's attached to a Bible University, that's knows as the Center for the Study of Church Growth.  It studies trends in the growth and decline of spiritual growth.
According to them, children that do nothing but attend youth devotions, youth bible classes, youth church, and youth camps but are seldom involved with their family in the church setting, those children, believe it or not, or much more likely to graduate high school and never attend church again.  At least for several years.
I personally think children should be made to behave themselves in church just as you would expect them to behave in a doctor's waiting room, a restaurant.
My seven year old grandson sings along with the adults and has been known to be a little upset if, during a sermon, the story of Noah doesn't include all the necessary parts.

But then again, some churches have some great children programs.


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## huntmore (Feb 16, 2011)

Careful RonnieT it sounds like you may agree with me and that could get you in hot water.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 16, 2011)

huntmore said:


> Careful RonnieT it sounds like you may agree with me and that could get you in hot water.



Historically, eventually I'll end up agreeing with everyone at least once.
And I'm glad to agree with you.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 17, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> There is a group, actually it's attached to a Bible University, that's knows as the Center for the Study of Church Growth.  It studies trends in the growth and decline of spiritual growth.
> According to them, children that do nothing but attend youth devotions, youth bible classes, youth church, and youth camps but are seldom involved with their family in the church setting, those children, believe it or not, or much more likely to graduate high school and never attend church again.  At least for several years.
> I personally think children should be made to behave themselves in church just as you would expect them to behave in a doctor's waiting room, a restaurant.
> My seven year old grandson sings along with the adults and has been known to be a little upset if, during a sermon, the story of Noah doesn't include all the necessary parts.
> ...



Well 7 yrs old is not too young really to sit in 'big church'. 

He probably wouldn't like our church then, because our pastor rarely repeats Noah's ark that many times....lol. But we do have a great children's program. They go to sunday school, then choir and/or music, like bells and other percussion instead of 'big church'. They do the flag thing and practice for a Christmas or Easter program/play, so they don't just play, well except for the ones in the nursery and they mostly just cry...lol.

It's nice to have a choice. 

I haven't seen them slinging a rock thru a giants head though....not so sure about that...lol.


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## sea trout (Feb 17, 2011)

my wife n i have a 2 yr old and a 3 month old.
our church used to have kids time during mass but not anymore..(now that we have a 2 yr old of course)
our 2 yr old boy does well most of the time but then has his restless moments and can become obnoxious.
so we try to make him want to be quiet and still. somtimes i have to take him out and let him run around the front hall, so were missing scripture readings.
so with no kids church....whats our best way? i don't want to disciplin my boy to the point of him dreading going to church. i don't want a wild child during mass either. i know he's close to understanding how he needs to act but not just yet.
i wish we still hads kids church.....i think my boy would jump out of bed on sunday and would be excited about going to church.


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## crackerdave (Feb 17, 2011)

mtnwoman said:


> I'm posting what I think about childrens church. If'n I'm speakin directly to you I will backquote you as I have done here. Would you prefer I stay out of any thread you are posting in?



Annie,I am so glad to see you posting again.Your wisdom is appreciated very much! By _most_ of us,anyway.


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## thedeacon (Feb 17, 2011)

It is very important that we make a way for the children to take a part in the worship services of our Lord, "BUT" the few hours a week that a child spends in the services is not likely to make the most differance in there lives.

The home is the place to mold a child, the home is the place to teach a child, the home is the place where they should find the examples of a christian life.

Train up a child in the way he should go and he will not depart from it.

As for as my house, we will serve the Lord.

We all, even the children need balance. We can only find that balance if we work 24/7 for the glory of God.


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 17, 2011)

sea trout said:


> my wife n i have a 2 yr old and a 3 month old.
> our church used to have kids time during mass but not anymore..(now that we have a 2 yr old of course)
> our 2 yr old boy does well most of the time but then has his restless moments and can become obnoxious.
> so we try to make him want to be quiet and still. somtimes i have to take him out and let him run around the front hall, so were missing scripture readings.
> so with no kids church....whats our best way? i don't want to disciplin my boy to the point of him dreading going to church. i don't want a wild child during mass either. i know he's close to understanding how he needs to act but not just yet.



This is pretty much what I had in mind when I made my post about it being more or less to remove young (ie-restless and disruptive) children from the sanctuary.  At least that way (with chirren's church) people would still come because they would a) not have to keep their kids quiet and b) wouldn't have to listen to other people's kids.  This way people will still show up and donate.


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## huntmore (Feb 17, 2011)

sea trout said:


> my wife n i have a 2 yr old and a 3 month old.
> our church used to have kids time during mass but not anymore..(now that we have a 2 yr old of course)
> our 2 yr old boy does well most of the time but then has his restless moments and can become obnoxious.
> so we try to make him want to be quiet and still. somtimes i have to take him out and let him run around the front hall, so were missing scripture readings.
> ...



Do you think he would dread being home if he got disciplined at home.


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## huntmore (Feb 17, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> This is pretty much what I had in mind when I made my post about it being more or less to remove young (ie-restless and disruptive) children from the sanctuary.  At least that way (with chirren's church) people would still come because they would a) not have to keep their kids quiet and b) wouldn't have to listen to other people's kids.  This way people will still show up and donate.



Is that all it would take to get you to go to Church?
A. I kept my kids quiet as my mother did.
B. as long as I don't have to listen to them for ten min I understand. Soon as they make a peep they get it.
See thedeacons post!


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## huntmore (Feb 17, 2011)

thedeacon said:


> It is very important that we make a way for the children to take a part in the worship services of our Lord, "BUT" the few hours a week that a child spends in the services is not likely to make the most differance in there lives.
> 
> The home is the place to mold a child, the home is the place to teach a child, the home is the place where they should find the examples of a christian life.
> 
> ...



You are right. That is why alot of kids act like nuts in Church. Their parents do not teach them at home.


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## sea trout (Feb 17, 2011)

huntmore said:


> Do you think he would dread being home if he got disciplined at home.



that would just be tough petooty


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## huntmore (Feb 17, 2011)

So thats how you spell petooty. I believe if you discipline children all the time they will not have a problem with it in Church. Kids are smarter than most parents give them credit for. My wife can tell my kids to do something and sometimes they ignore her. All I have to do is look at them and they go take care of it.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 17, 2011)

huntmore said:


> Do you think he would dread being home if he got disciplined at home.



oooooooooooooooooooo.
I didn't even see that one coming.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 17, 2011)

I'm always amused when visitors come to our worship service and it's easy to tell their family is accustomed to kids church.
The parents have no idea how to get their children to sit quietly.
But that isn't a call for more kids church.  It's a call for parents to raise their children so they'll be able to sit quietly.
Sorry, promise I don't mean to offend anyone.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 17, 2011)

thedeacon said:


> It is very important that we make a way for the children to take a part in the worship services of our Lord, "BUT" the few hours a week that a child spends in the services is not likely to make the most differance in there lives.
> 
> The home is the place to mold a child, the home is the place to teach a child, the home is the place where they should find the examples of a christian life.
> Train up a child in the way he should go and he will not depart from it.
> ...



Totally agree.  There's nothing for a child to learn in kids church that they shouldn't have already learned at home.  
And these young children have already had 45 minues of Sunday school just prior to worship.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 17, 2011)

I get a serious blessing by checking out all the families sitting together during worship.  Dads holding their toddler while she sleeps.  Mom playing with her young son's hair while she listens to a lesson.  Little children yawning and falling asleep halfway through worship.  And still other children who just sit, sometimes listening, and sometimes playing with Dad's watch.
Could they maybe memorize a short scripture if they'd been in kids church?  Yeah, but they got time for those things.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 18, 2011)

I think a lot depends on your pastor and the type of services you have. We have intense bible study, usually book by book and I do not want to miss one jot or tittle. Our pastor sort of teaches in a series and if you miss even 10 minutes of a sermon then you miss some major points.

If you have a pastor that just sort of teaches the same things over and over and you've heard it over and over and you know you're not gonna miss much then it won't really matter that you miss it.

I can't teach my children or grandchildren something that I miss. Seems to me that sitting in big church with children drawing or twiddling thru a book or poking mom or dad or whispering or napping doesn't seem so important as teaching them how to pay attention to learning God's word on their level in their own church like atmosphere. It's not like in children's church they aren't taught to sit still and learn bible verses and pray, they're not swinging from the rafters or anything they are studying on their level just like we are.

I'm sorry to be adament about sitting in church and being distracted about people having to disipline their children in church while I'm trying to pay attention to something that I myself am trying to learn, I am there also to study and learn something to teach my children.  It's taken me 40 yrs to even to be able to pay attention in church and not think about what I'm gonna do afterward and I don't even want my own grandchildren poking me, wanting a pencil or some gum or staring at me from the row in front of me. Course I have adhd...and not everyone has that....one hour I can stand to sit in church without them and spare everyone else around me who does want to pay attention the grief of going to church once a week and missing a whole hour dedicated to learning the word tending to your child, something you do all week.


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## sea trout (Feb 18, 2011)

why dont you spell petooty.
i wish our church still had kids church.


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## Jeff Phillips (Feb 18, 2011)

I have been involved with both. My bride was the Director of Children's Ministries and has been a Weekday Pre-School Director, so I have been heavily involved with Children's Church.

We should enjoy worship! It should be a pleasant experiance! Worship should be fun!

Having a child sit through music and teaching that are above their understanding is not a pleasant experiance.

Age appropriate music and teaching along with some type of art for the refrigerator is fun! 

My kids wanted to go to Church when they were little and they have a strong desire for worship now that they are adults


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## Ronnie T (Feb 18, 2011)

mtnwoman said:


> I think a lot depends on your pastor and the type of services you have. We have intense bible study, usually book by book and I do not want to miss one jot or tittle. Our pastor sort of teaches in a series and if you miss even 10 minutes of a sermon then you miss some major points.
> 
> If you have a pastor that just sort of teaches the same things over and over and you've heard it over and over and you know you're not gonna miss much then it won't really matter that you miss it.
> 
> ...



What you're saying is that you're at church to learn, not to play and hassle with kids.  And that's a good thing.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 18, 2011)

Jeff Phillips said:


> I have been involved with both. My bride was the Director of Children's Ministries and has been a Weekday Pre-School Director, so I have been heavily involved with Children's Church.
> 
> We should enjoy worship! It should be a pleasant experiance! Worship should be fun!
> 
> ...



And you can't really ask for more than that.


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## Jeff Phillips (Feb 18, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> And you can't really ask for more than that.



You really can't.

BTW: They know how to behave in "Big Church" too. Even without suffering through it as children.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 18, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> And you can't really ask for more than that.



Having said that, I must confess that I'm a lot surprised at the high number of Christians Dads who believe Adult worship on the Lord's day is not a place for children.

My how things have changed.


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## PWalls (Feb 18, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> Having said that, I must confess that I'm a lot surprised at the high number of Christians Dads who believe Adult worship on the Lord's day is not a place for children.
> 
> My how things have changed.



I believe that is a decision each family should make on their own. Personally, mine did not go to Kid's Church. I wanted them with me and hearing what I heard so we could discuss as necessary. However, if that Dad thinks his children would benefit more from a more age appropriate lesson taught in a side room than sitting and doodling in the main worship hall while a Preacher talks on the difference between the 5th and 6th bowl judgement in Revelation, then that should be their decision.

Now, if Kid's Church ends up just being a daycare with no instruction or meat to it, then I agree 100% that it shouldn't be offered.


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## Jeff Phillips (Feb 18, 2011)

One of the things that helped make it work for my family is Mom was working in Children's Church every Sunday, I was working there most Sundays (done a lot of time in the nursery too), and my kids started working there when they were old enough.

There was never any free time, always instructional, always Bible based, and well planned out at least a month in advance. Parents recieved the lesson plans for discussion and prayer time.

On 5th Sundays there was no Children's Church and the pastor planned for some lesson at the level of the children. So 4 times every year they were in big church.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 18, 2011)

PWalls said:


> I believe that is a decision each family should make on their own. Personally, mine did not go to Kid's Church. I wanted them with me and hearing what I heard so we could discuss as necessary. However, if that Dad thinks his children would benefit more from a more age appropriate lesson taught in a side room than sitting and doodling in the main worship hall while a Preacher talks on the difference between the 5th and 6th bowl judgement in Revelation, then that should be their decision.
> 
> Now, if Kid's Church ends up just being a daycare with no instruction or meat to it, then I agree 100% that it shouldn't be offered.



I totally agree.  It's a decision that Christian parents, or the church, need to decide.  I wouldn't expect anyone to change just because of something that's been said here.

But I just didn't realize it was such a widespread thing.
I feel sure that this policy didn't enter the Lord's church until the last 50 years.
Part of the new 'modernization of the church'.
But if it blesses the lives of christian families, it has to be a good thing.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 19, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> What you're saying is that you're at church to learn, not to play and hassle with kids.  And that's a good thing.



Our church has grown so much over the past 10 yrs that we've had to build on and we've added a school which is an awesome thing. Children's church is held in the old sancuary (that I miss). Our pastor does encourage us to take our children to childrens church so we can learn something to teach them. Maybe it has something to do with the size of church and the amount of seating and all that. Like I've said before I sit up front and have taught myself to pay strict attention...however if my granddaughters do end up sitting with me for some reason, even though they act reasonably sensible in church, they are picking at me and I'm paying attention to them instead of the word.  And Lord knows I need all the word I can get.

Each of us are convicted in different ways and that's what we need to go by. I missed so many years in church that I'm so hungry for each and every word.

Every wednesday night and once a month on sunday nights we do all sit together and the other 3 sundays we have small groups which does of course include the children.

When my oldest granddaughter was young we had to keep her in church with us. She was adhd and difficult in childrens church. We missed many a 'word' dealing with her. But once she got out of the service, she could almost quote word for word what the pastor said....whoda thunk it?


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## thedeacon (Feb 19, 2011)

I am not saying childrens church is the best way to go and I am not saying the oposite. I am saying that it is good that churches are concerned with the growth of the youth in there group.

We have children church available for k thru 3rd grade. We also have a nursery. The nursery is not because we don't want the babies crying its because most of the mothers don't have a lot of help with their children "especially from their husbands" and the nursery provides them with the help they need so they can enjoy and take part in the worship services.

Originally Posted by Ronnie T  
Having said that, I must confess that I'm a lot surprised at the high number of Christians Dads who believe Adult worship on the Lord's day is not a place for children.

My how things have changed

I have read all the post and I don't see where anyone has even hinted that the worship services is not a place for children. 

They are usually full of children, most of them above the age of 30

Here again we are argueing about opinions about things that doesn't matter.

We should never condemn any one for trying to do things good and right even if we disagree with them. 

I have worshipped where both methods are used for the children and I think God is ok with either way.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 19, 2011)

thedeacon said:


> I have worshipped where both methods are used for the children and I think God is ok with either way.




Amen


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## Ronnie T (Feb 20, 2011)

thedeacon said:


> I am not saying childrens church is the best way to go and I am not saying the oposite. I am saying that it is good that churches are concerned with the growth of the youth in there group.
> 
> We have children church available for k thru 3rd grade. We also have a nursery. The nursery is not because we don't want the babies crying its because most of the mothers don't have a lot of help with their children "especially from their husbands" and the nursery provides them with the help they need so they can enjoy and take part in the worship services.
> 
> ...


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## emtguy (Feb 21, 2011)

Have to admit i did not read entire thread but i can say when i was growing up I sat in church and was still and kept my mouth shut...the wiggling and mis behaving part dont fly...Kids can sit and listen AND understand, if they are acting up its THE PARENTS fault, take em outside like mine did and spank em bout twice and they will behave next time in church...
I like the idea of a childrens church but we dont have one and the kids in our church are still and quiet so i guess it dont matter...I think sunday school is where the kids should ne taught the young age appropriate lessons and then trhey should go into church to learn from a young age the word of god AND how to act in church,


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 21, 2011)

emtguy said:


> Kids can sit and listen AND understand, if they are acting up its THE PARENTS fault, take em outside like mine did and spank em bout twice and they will behave next time in church...



At what age do you think it's okay to spank a kid for acting up in church?


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## thedeacon (Feb 22, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> At what age do you think it's okay to spank a kid for acting up in church?



I think things like that are up to the mom and dads. I spanked my first kid too early, in and out of Church. I would like to think that I could handled the situation in a more mature manner.

I don't think childrens church should be used as a baby sitter. If you take the kids out of the regular services you must have something to offer that is better for them than the services.

There is nothing more distracting in the service than a heavy handed mamma hitting a child right in the middle of things. All that does is spark a quick and loud yell.
OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.
I wish there was a place to send some of the misbehaiving adults.


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## huntmore (Feb 22, 2011)

We would never have said ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh in Church. We took it like men,because we were trained at home all the time. Parents don't take the time anymore to train at home and  they want their kids to be there friend and thats bad.

I  have often wanted to whack a grown up that was sitting in front of my kids and wispering in someones ear during mass. They were setting a bad example for my kids any anyone elses watching.


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## emtguy (Feb 22, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> At what age do you think it's okay to spank a kid for acting up in church?



3 years old ...thats the nursery age limit so send em in church and train them right...my mom whupped me when i acted up, she'd take me outside, tear my tale up and then we'd go sit back down...after about 2 times of that i got the picture...dad didnt whup me cuz he was preaching...LOL


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## huntmore (Feb 22, 2011)

emtguy said:


> 3 years old ...thats the nursery age limit so send em in church and train them right...my mom whupped me when i acted up, she'd take me outside, tear my tale up and then we'd go sit back down...after about 2 times of that i got the picture...dad didnt whup me cuz he was preaching...LOL



I guess some of us are just smarter than others. My son was younger than three and I can remember two times.


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## Ronnie T (Feb 22, 2011)

emtguy said:


> 3 years old ...thats the nursery age limit so send em in church and train them right...my mom whupped me when i acted up, she'd take me outside, tear my tale up and then we'd go sit back down...after about 2 times of that i got the picture...dad didnt whup me cuz he was preaching...LOL



I once saw a preacher leave the pulpit and take his two boys out for a whopping.  Brought them back in, sat them down, then continued on with his lesson.
Their mom was home sick, so they though they could 'get away with it'.
Funny


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## huntmore (Feb 23, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> I once saw a preacher leave the pulpit and take his two boys out for a whopping.  Brought them back in, sat them down, then continued on with his lesson.
> Their mom was home sick, so they though they could 'get away with it'.
> Funny



Did the congregation understand, or did they get upset?


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## Ronnie T (Feb 23, 2011)

huntmore said:


> Did the congregation understand, or did they get upset?



As I remember it, everyone sat quietly and nothing was ever said of it.
This was back in the 60's.


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## huntmore (Feb 24, 2011)

The good ole days


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## gtparts (Feb 24, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> As I remember it, everyone sat quietly and nothing was ever said of it.
> This was back in the 60's.



Wondering who might be next probably took the urge to wiggle out of the whole congregation.


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