# the "Local Church"



## Huntinfool (Dec 19, 2011)

Had the opportunity to attend a "meeting" at the "local church" in Atlanta because it was a meeting after the wedding of a cousin-in-law.  It was interesting to say the least.

Did a lot of research before we agreed to attend because I was concerned that I might be convinced they were a cult.  

Anybody familiar with the movement?  Thoughts?  I have my own.  But I'll reserve them for a while.  I'm curious what others think.


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## centerpin fan (Dec 19, 2011)

Is this Watchman Nee's "local church" movement?


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## JB0704 (Dec 19, 2011)

Do you have a website?


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## Huntinfool (Dec 19, 2011)

centerpin fan said:


> Is this Watchman Nee's "local church" movement?



Yes.  and his protege Lee who brought it to the States.


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## centerpin fan (Dec 19, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> Yes.  and his protege Lee who brought it to California.



I have heard negative, "cultish" things about them but am no expert.  I'd be cautious.


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## Huntinfool (Dec 19, 2011)

We're not joining....just were there for a wedding "meeting".  Just curious what others think.  There seems to be a lot of disagreement on whether it's a cult or not.


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## centerpin fan (Dec 19, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> There seems to be a lot of disagreement on whether it's a cult or not.



I understand.  Although I've heard some bad reports, I have read a little of Nee's stuff.  It didn't seem radical or crazy to me.


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## formula1 (Dec 19, 2011)

*Re:*

Read alot of Nee's stuff and enjoy it.  I know nothing about the church though.  But since Mr. Nee is no longer with us, can you be sure it follows what he desired?  As long as is follows the pattern of scripture and lifts up the name of Jesus as Lord and Savior, it should be fine though.


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## Huntinfool (Dec 19, 2011)

> As long as is follows the pattern of scripture and lifts up the name of Jesus as Lord and Savior, it should be fine though.



Ah....but does it?

He translated his own version of the Bible called "The Recovery".  Nothing necessarily added/deleted.  But the study notes outnumber the words in the Bible and he and Lee encouraged their followers to essentially read nothing but what they published.  

Their Bible is called "The Recovery" because they feel that the RC Church and all Protestant denominations are tools of Satan meant to divide the Body of Christ.  In fact, he referred to the RC Church as "the 'hoe' of Babylon" on many occassions.

They have their own publishing arm and have spent decades sueing other churches and publishers if they call them a cult.

Nee is consistently accused of being a Modalist (i.e. the Father became Jesus.  Jesus became the HS).



All that said....they try to follow the NT model of "church".  They believe that there is only one body and it should not be divided denominationally.  They "meet" rather than have services.  There is no pastor, just elders and they all sit around and give testimonies and sing songs at the meetings.  No sermon.  Just whoever is led to share shares.  

It's a good intention I think.  But I'm convinced that it is mis-guided at best and it's focus on "the body" is sort of creepy.  They elevate the body to a status that is near God.  Several times I heard the phrase "we consecrate ourselves to you AND to the Body".  I think that the focus on Lee and Nee and the sort of isolation to their works is dangerous and I'm concerned at their historical attitude toward the RC Church and to other denominations.

Cult?  I don't know.  I've read a lot.  But not enough.  I got a strange "vibe"  being there and so, if you were going to make me label them, I'd say yes....it's likely very cultish in nature.  I do believe that they are trying very hard to follow the NT model and they are (for lack of a better term) "purists" in that regard.  I'm just concerned about some of their stuff...that's the best I can put it.


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## centerpin fan (Dec 19, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> Nee is consistently accused of being a Modalist (i.e. the Father became Jesus.  Jesus became the HS).



Thanks for the reminder.  That was one specific criticism I had heard.




Huntinfool said:


> They ... have spent decades sueing other churches and publishers if they call them a cult.



... just like the Scientologists.

Are the members mostly Asian or is it a mix of all ethnicities?


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## Huntinfool (Dec 19, 2011)

Not mostly Asian.  But definitely a good number in the group.  Not trying to be funny.  But it probably doesn't hurt that they are very active at Tech.

Christians, in general, are probably "stranger" than most folks....these folks were "stranger" than most Christians.  Very much a fringe type of feeling.  Nothing necessarily wrong with that.  Just kind of the vibe that was there.  

I wasn't uncomfortable.  But I definintely wasn't comfortable either.


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## Ronnie T (Dec 19, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> Had the opportunity to attend a "meeting" at the "local church" in Atlanta because it was a meeting after the wedding of a cousin-in-law.  It was interesting to say the least.
> 
> Did a lot of research before we agreed to attend because I was concerned that I might be convinced they were a cult.
> Anybody familiar with the movement?  Thoughts?  I have my own.  But I'll reserve them for a while.  I'm curious what others think.



Sounds like a 'bad reputation' is in the works for them.
I don't know anything about them.


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## Ronnie T (Dec 19, 2011)

I found a site for "The Church" in Atlanta.
But not "Local Church".


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## Huntinfool (Dec 19, 2011)

That's the one Ronnie.


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## StriperAddict (Dec 19, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> Christians, in general, are probably "stranger" than most folks....


 
Thanks for the compliment !


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## Ronnie T (Dec 19, 2011)

Their website sounds very appealing.

http://www.churchinatlanta.org/index.php?cat=home

One statement on the first page includes this statement:   " In order to practice the oneness of the Body with all the Christians in Atlanta, we meet as the church in Atlanta."

I like the broad reaching, borderless attitude of the statement.


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## Huntinfool (Dec 20, 2011)

> Thanks for the compliment !



I include myself in that...and I meant "strange" from the world's perspective.  So, yes, it's a compliment of sorts!


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## Huntinfool (Dec 20, 2011)

> I like the broad reaching, borderless attitude of the statement.



Me too.  What I don't like is the condemnation of Christians in denominations and the RC Church in statements like this...



> "The Lord is not building His church in Christendom, which is composed of the apostate Roman Catholic Church and the Protestant denominations. This prophecy is being fulfilled through the Lord's recovery, in which the building of the genuine church is being accomplished."





> “We do not care for Christianity, we do not care for Christendom, we do not care for the Roman Catholic Church, and we do not care for all the denominations, because in the Bible it says that the great Babylon is fallen. This is a declaration. Christianity is fallen, Christendom is fallen, Catholicism is fallen, and all the denominations are fallen. Hallelujah!”





> "Do not try to be neutral. Do not try to reconcile them.... You know the denominations are wrong, yet you still remain because you are afraid of what others will say



...and they refer to the RC Church as the "(w)hore of babylon" and protestant denoms are simply children of the same and all are used as instruments of Satan.


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## formula1 (Dec 20, 2011)

*Re:*

HF:

I have not read any such thoughts in the books I have that Mr. Nee wrote, though I only have 4 of his books.

But I will go so far as to say this, denominationalism has done more to separate the true Church of Jesus Christ than to bring it together in unity.  Removing those booundaries, were it possible, would be a good thing for Christ and His message.

Of course, it is equally separating for the blatant condemnation you see in the words you quoted. That won't go very far in solving the issue either.  I can see how some thought taken to their extreme can lead to the doctrines such as these apparently devoid of love.

So in the lack of no other wisdom on the  subject, I suppose that the wheat and the tares will continue to grow, and Jesus will separate them at the harvest!


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## Ronnie T (Dec 20, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> Me too.  What I don't like is the condemnation of Christians in denominations and the RC Church in statements like this...
> 
> ...and they refer to the RC Church as the "(w)hore of babylon" and protestant denoms are simply children of the same and all are used as instruments of Satan.



The quotes that you supplied are not included on the Atlanta church's website.  Since their web site seems to differ with the hard stance of the one who people credit as 'founding' this church, this church might actually differ with his stance.

The church in Atlanta seems to be seeking the 'oneness' in Christ while keeping open arms to all Christians and the adopted church they each claim.

I go along with what formula1 said.  Catholicism and denominationalize is a burden we all live with and have been affected by.  I applaud their wish to move beyond it.
Good luck to them, but christianity can be cruel.  We all know that.


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## 1gr8bldr (Dec 20, 2011)

It's been about 8 years ago, when I read about 10 of Nee's books. I chose the smaller one's.   He was very "orthodox" in his writings. But no telling whether this group reflects his beliefs. Don't they publish a "Statement of Faith"?


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## Huntinfool (Dec 21, 2011)

Ronnie T said:


> The quotes that you supplied are not included on the Atlanta church's website.  Since their web site seems to differ with the hard stance of the one who people credit as 'founding' this church, this church might actually differ with his stance.
> 
> The church in Atlanta seems to be seeking the 'oneness' in Christ while keeping open arms to all Christians and the adopted church they each claim.
> 
> ...



I think you guys are missing what I'm talking about.  It's not on the website?  That's what we base our understanding of a group on?


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## JB0704 (Dec 21, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> That's what we base our understanding of a group on?



I used to always check out a Church's stated values on their website before attending.  You can tell a lot about an organization by reading what they have to say on their site.


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## Huntinfool (Dec 21, 2011)

JB0704 said:


> I used to always check out a Church's stated values on their website before attending.  You can tell a lot about an organization by reading what they have to say on their site.



...and how'd that work out for ya? 


When a church or organization has been consistently accused of being a cult, I tend to do a little more research on the background and facts than just looking at their website.


Read this:



> Jesus Christ is the Savior of the world and the Son of God. He is our Redeemer. The Holy Bible teaches us that Jesus Christ's mother was Mary, His father on earth was Joseph, that He was born in Bethlehem and raised in Nazareth, and labored with Joseph as a carpenter. When he turned 30, He began a three-year ministry of teaching, blessing, and healing the people of the Holy Land. He also organized His Church and gave His apostles "power and authority" (Luke 9:1) to assist in His work.
> 
> But what do we mean when we say He is the Savior of the world? The Redeemer? Each of these titles point to the truth that Jesus Christ is the only way by which we can return to live with our Heavenly Father. Jesus suffered and was crucified for the sins of the world, giving each of God’s children the gift of repentance and forgiveness. Only by His mercy and grace can anyone be saved. His subsequent resurrection prepared the way for every person to overcome physical death as well. These events are called the Atonement. In short, Jesus Christ saves us from sin and death. For that, he is very literally our Savior and Redeemer. In the future Jesus Christ will return to reign on earth in peace for a thousand years. Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and He will be our Lord forever.





The Mormons have a pretty ok statement about who Christ is on the website....don't ya think?  See my point?


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## JB0704 (Dec 21, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> ...and how'd that work out for ya?



Back then, well, it was basically a tool to "rule out" this one or that one.  I guess it did little in helping me find a church, just kept me out of a few.



Huntinfool said:


> ...The Mormons have a pretty ok statement about who Christ is on the website....don't ya think?  See my point?



Point taken.


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## 1gr8bldr (Dec 21, 2011)

JB0704 said:


> I used to always check out a Church's stated values on their website before attending.  You can tell a lot about an organization by reading what they have to say on their site.


Funny thing, I was searching through, years ago, what different folk believe, The one I saw as most comparable to the bible, on paper, was the Anabaptist. LOL Turned out to be the Quakers


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## JB0704 (Dec 21, 2011)

1gr8bldr said:


> Funny thing, I was searching through, years ago, what different folk believe, The one I saw as most comparable to the bible, on paper, was the Anabaptist. LOL Turned out to be the Quakers






As much as I would like to be accurate, I am not certain I could convert........


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## Jeffriesw (Dec 25, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> Ah....but does it?
> 
> He translated his own version of the Bible called "The Recovery".  Nothing necessarily added/deleted.  But the study notes outnumber the words in the Bible and he and Lee encouraged their followers to essentially read nothing but what they published.  That would raise red warning flags all over the place for me right there!
> 
> ...



If what you have said is correct, I would have nothing to do with them, nor call them Brother. BUT, I probably ought to read up on them further for myself.


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