# Bible Geek



## 1gr8bldr (Feb 15, 2012)

Wondering if any of you guys are familiar with "Bible Geek". It is a internet question and answer sort of thing. Some of what he says is true. Much of it is a misrepresentation of Christianity. I have listened a few times while I workout. Funny thing is while most would be ready to stone him, I'm carefully listening and pondering my own position. Even though I don't consider much as true, I face the opposing views and recall verses for or against what he is saying. You full blown athiest will love this guy. I believe that most of the atheist here will recognize where he is misrepresenting Christianity. I think I will tune in more often. I need to be aware of the arguments. A few things he said today concerning the feeding of the 5000 was very interesting. Another thought about the pillars of the temple, probably to far a strecth but interesting. Most believers will not find this interesting at all. But if your into apolgetics, you have to know the issues or else you better go back to keeping babies in the nursery


----------



## centerpin fan (Feb 15, 2012)

I had to Google him.  The link below told me all I need to know:  "Fellow, The Jesus Seminar".

If that's not enough, just scroll down and look at some of the books he's written:

_The Case Against the Case for Christ_

_Jesus is Dead_

Here's the Amazon description of the latter:

"This book argues that (1) not only is there no good reason to think that Jesus ever rose from the dead, (2) there is no good reason to suppose that he ever lived or died at all."

http://www.robertmprice.mindvendor.com/


----------



## jmharris23 (Feb 15, 2012)

No thanks


----------



## Asath (Feb 15, 2012)

Not familiar with the fella, so I'm in no position to endorse or condemn.

From a cursory look, he seems a bit upset, which (as a non-believer) I find a little odd.  

Granted the 'believers' in everything under the sun seem to think that evangelism and terrorism and simply shouting down opposing thought is their birthright, but usually the non-believers are a little more calm about things, and tend to take a longer perspective . . .


----------



## 1gr8bldr (Feb 15, 2012)

Yea, he has written several books that he often mentions in an effort to sell. But not all his information is negative. It has to do with bible contents. I have listened to half of 3 lectures now. Funny thing is that until the third today, I did not know he was not a believer. But no doubt about it today. He was mocking in his comments. But like I said, I learn the most about my faith from opposition. You don't learn anything from those who repeat the same thing over and over. No thinking required there. Opposition is like training for a big fight.


----------



## 1gr8bldr (Feb 15, 2012)

Asath said:


> Not familiar with the fella, so I'm in no position to endorse or condemn.
> 
> From a cursory look, he seems a bit upset, which (as a non-believer) I find a little odd.
> 
> Granted the 'believers' in everything under the sun seem to think that evangelism and terrorism and simply shouting down opposing thought is their birthright, but usually the non-believers are a little more calm about things, and tend to take a longer perspective . . .


I thought you were that guy Just kidding, but your comments are very similar. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy your post. The brutal honesty is many times a breath of fresh air as opposed to those who think we can prove the resurection cause the bible says so.


----------



## Artfuldodger (Feb 15, 2012)

1gr8bldr said:


> Yea, he has written several books that he often mentions in an effort to sell. But not all his information is negative. It has to do with bible contents. I have listened to half of 3 lectures now. Funny thing is that until the third today, I did not know he was not a believer. But no doubt about it today. He was mocking in his comments. But like I said, I learn the most about my faith from opposition. You don't learn anything from those who repeat the same thing over and over. No thinking required there. Opposition is like training for a big fight.


They don't feel that way on the Spiritual discussion forum. I too am unorthodox and they think my post are too different from the norm. They would rather rehash the same old fundamental stuff. I referenced True Christian traits from a Universalist site and got called on it.
Why is there never any Jewish posters on the Christian & Judaism  forum?


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 15, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> They don't feel that way on the Spiritual discussion forum. I too am unorthodox and they think my post are too different from the norm. They would rather rehash the same old fundamental stuff. I referenced True Christian traits from a Universalist site and got called on it.
> Why is there never any Jewish posters on the Christian & Judaism  forum?



Jews don't hunt.  It's fiscally irresponsible.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2012)

centerpin fan said:


> I had to Google him.  The link below told me all I need to know:  "Fellow, The Jesus Seminar".
> 
> If that's not enough, just scroll down and look at some of the books he's written:
> 
> ...



Thanks I'll follow your's and and Jim's lead, and not even look.


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 15, 2012)

mtnwoman said:


> Thanks I'll follow your's and and Jim's lead, and not even look.



........Fingers in ears, eyes shut tight screaming "LA la la la la la!"


----------



## Asath (Feb 16, 2012)

Right.  I should have expanded on the thought – “  . . . seem to think that evangelism and terrorism and simply shouting down opposing thought is their birthright . . . “ – by adding, also, ‘ignoring, failing to acknowledge, dismissing without reading or hearing, refusing to entertain as valid, and closing discussion by condescension.’

My bad.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 16, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> ........Fingers in ears, eyes shut tight screaming "LA la la la la la!"




You know me...lol...I do that a lot...usually becasuse I've heard it a million times before....and absolutely cannot stand to hear it another time, kinda like a song and dance sorta thing.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 16, 2012)

Asath said:


> Right.  I should have expanded on the thought – “  . . . seem to think that evangelism and terrorism and simply shouting down opposing thought is their birthright . . . “ – by adding, also, ‘ignoring, failing to acknowledge, dismissing without reading or hearing, refusing to entertain as valid, and closing discussion by condescension.’



Really??? I feel exactly about the same folks that can only comprehend the natural. Open your mind to the supernatural and you might see that some of us are more openminded than some of the naysayers, and our horizon is broader than someone who says that the reality they see is in a box...ie *‘ignoring, failing to acknowledge, dismissing without reading or hearing, refusing to entertain as valid, and closing discussion by condescension.’ especially if you admit you only live in one dimension, can't comprehend without condescension, dismissing anything else anyone else might choose to believe....and believing something else is out there, is living in a box?
Alrighty then.  I at least admit that there's more out there than what I know.
*


----------



## 1gr8bldr (Feb 16, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> They don't feel that way on the Spiritual discussion forum. I too am unorthodox and they think my post are too different from the norm. They would rather rehash the same old fundamental stuff. I referenced True Christian traits from a Universalist site and got called on it.
> *Why is there never any Jewish posters on the Christian & Judaism  forum?*


 On the other forumn, that I frequent, there is a section for Jews. They have good participation. Several there are very helpful. I go there from time to time and ask questions, such as messiah expectations, etc, stuff like that. One of the posters is very informative and patient while answering questions.  It is so interesting to see there views. I observed on conversation once, amusing between two Jews who were debating over a light switch. LOL You see one was saying that you could not even flip on a light switch on the sabbath. The other, being comdemmed by the first, was saying that he changed his to motion sensors therefore he was not sinning when the light came on. LOL, but it is real. The bondage that some are under in the name of religion.


----------



## Four (Feb 16, 2012)

There are no/not many jews for the same reason there aren't any/many muslims, or even catholics. This is a forum based in georgia... its the bible belt.. Protestant only!


----------



## centerpin fan (Feb 16, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> Jews don't hunt.



A Jewish guy I work with told me the same thing, and those were the exact words he used.


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 16, 2012)

mtnwoman said:


> Really??? I feel exactly about the same folks that can only comprehend the natural. Open your mind to the supernatural and you might see that some of us are more openminded than some of the naysayers, and our horizon is broader than someone who says that the reality they see is in a box...ie *‘ignoring, failing to acknowledge, dismissing without reading or hearing, refusing to entertain as valid, and closing discussion by condescension.’ especially if you admit you only live in one dimension, can't comprehend without condescension, dismissing anything else anyone else might choose to believe....and believing something else is out there, is living in a box?
> Alrighty then.  I at least admit that there's more out there than what I know.
> *



It's one thing to admit ignorance about something and an entirely different thing to say "it's because the God of Abraham did it!  I believe it, it says it in the Bible and all those Hindus and Muslims and atheists are just plain wrong.  It's the Gospel truth and no one can change my mind."

Does that sound open minded to you?


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 16, 2012)

centerpin fan said:


> A Jewish guy I work with told me the same thing, and those were the exact words he used.



My neighbor is Jewish.  When she saw me wrapping deer meat one day she told her husband that he needs to hunt with me.  When I started enumerating the expenses involved she reconsidered.


----------



## JB0704 (Feb 16, 2012)

centerpin fan said:


> A Jewish guy I work with told me the same thing, and those were the exact words he used.



Reminds me of "Meet the Fockers" where Barbara Striesand says "Our people do not shoot ducks."


----------



## JB0704 (Feb 16, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> My neighbor is Jewish.  When she saw me wrapping deer meat one day she told her husband that he needs to hunt with me.  When I started enumerating the expenses involved she reconsidered.



Do you butcher your own?  Just curious 'cause that's the only way I can keep hunting affordable.  Hoof to table.....


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 16, 2012)

JB0704 said:


> Do you butcher your own?  Just curious 'cause that's the only way I can keep hunting affordable.  Hoof to table.....




I butcher.  Its mostly the cost of gas anymore.  At $40 per round trip, if it takes me 5 trips to get a deer with an average of 30lbs. boned out meat, The cost of the meat is about $7/lb.,  a little more when camping supplies are added in plus time spent processing.   Cheaper than farm raised deer meat and better for us than store bought meat but it can't beat some $.89/lb.  Kroger chickens.  I can get 4 meals out of a chicken plus a carcass for stock.


----------



## JB0704 (Feb 16, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I butcher.  Its mostly the cost of gas anymore.  At $40 per round trip, if it takes me 5 trips to get a deer with an average of 30lbs. boned out meat, The cost of the meat is about $7/lb.,  a little more when camping supplies are added in plus time spent processing.   Cheaper than farm raised deer meat and better for us than store bought meat but it can't beat some $.89/lb.  Kroger chickens.  I can get 4 meals out of a chicken plus a carcass for stock.



Gas costs me a little more than that, I drive two hours, but I don't camp (kids in sports...rarely have a whole weekend to hunt), and I have to pay club dues where I hunt.  I don't know many folks folks who do their own butchering anymore.  I enjoy it.  One deer takes my son and I about an hour.  It is not the cheapest meat, but we love to eat it.

Sorry I dragged the thread off topic.


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 16, 2012)

mtnwoman said:


> You know me...lol...I do that a lot...usually becasuse I've heard it a million times before....and absolutely cannot stand to hear it another time, kinda like a song and dance sorta thing.



Most hard core atheists I know still read the Bible, even though they've read it several times already.  I look up verses that people bring up in discussion.   

Don't get stuck in one place.  These opposing ideas may have different meanings to you as you change your perspective with age or new information.  

Or stay where you're at.  Maybe it's too late to change.


----------



## 1gr8bldr (Feb 17, 2012)

Listened to him again today. It sure spurs me to thinking about my position and what is the foundation built upon. Makes me recall verses to mind and come to conclusions. But I do see a problem here, This guy misrepresents the facts, that's OK because I know what he is twisting. But others who don't know, even those that might have read the bible once or twice, those might consider what he is saying to be true. Almost everything I heard today was incorrect. And I could easily point how how and why, but him having a one man show with no opposition, allows him to have a negative influence.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 18, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> It's one thing to admit ignorance about something and an entirely different thing to say "it's because the God of Abraham did it!  I believe it, it says it in the Bible and all those Hindus and Muslims and atheists are just plain wrong.  It's the Gospel truth and no one can change my mind."
> 
> Does that sound open minded to you?



Hellooooo out there, Hindus and Muslims do believe in the supernatural, too. Atheists are wrong if they don't think we all do.....goodness gracious ambush...whatchu talkin' bout?


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 18, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> Most hard core atheists I know still read the Bible, even though they've read it several times already.  I look up verses that people bring up in discussion.  *I'm glad you do....the word of God is sharper than a two edged sword, dividing asunder soul and spirit, keep reading my friend.*
> 
> Don't get stuck in one place.  These opposing ideas may have different meanings to you as you change your perspective with age or new information.  *I think I might know what you mean, but yeah, we start out with milk, as a dependent suckling and move to the meat of the word, which is a deeper understanding.*
> 
> Or stay where you're at.  Maybe it's too late to change.


*It's never too late to change, not for me and not for you and I'm joyful for both of us on that.*


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 18, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> It's one thing to admit ignorance about something



Well we're all ignorant in one way or another. For example, you may see my ignorance, and I may see yours. Works out though, makes us even.


----------



## Asath (Feb 19, 2012)

Anybody else want this one?    “Really??? I feel exactly about the same folks that can only comprehend the natural. “

Please?  I’m certainly not qualified to deal with folks who can comprehend the unnatural.  That one is far above my pay grade, as the government types like to say . . . 

Plus: “Hellooooo out there, Hindus and Muslims do believe in the supernatural, too. Atheists are wrong if they don't think we all do.....goodness gracious ambush...whatchu talkin' bout?”  

Um? Muslims actually believe in the very same supernatural proposition as Christians – the god of Abraham, as was pointed out.  The Hindu tradition, while no less fragmented into multiple sects, cannot reasonably be included in this thought, what with being effectively polytheistic naturalists and all . . . 

And I don’t understand (he says, exhaustedly) – “Atheists are wrong if the don’t think we all do.”  What does that mean exactly?  I mean, no disrespect, but just what is it that we’re wrong about?  We’re pretty clear on the point that a whole bunch of folks ‘believe’ in invisible ‘Holy’ ghosts.  So we aren’t wrong about that part.  We just went ahead, being curious, and looked up the word ‘holy,’ both in our unabridged dictionaries and in our thesaurus, and found that every term that can be used to designate the state of being ‘holy’ turns out to be a self-glorifying human term, not an abstract term describing what we are told is the sublimely transcendent and not at all understandable supernatural.  And every definition and/or synonym for the word ‘ghost’ turns up equally predictable results.

All that is being described is described in all cases and at all times as an idealized version of self, and you’ll have to pardon us if we fail to realize how a ‘believer’ can think it possible that an invisible supernatural force capable of creating the actual universe around us can somehow have such uniquely human characteristics.  That just seems a bit too coincidental for my taste, speaking only for myself, and smacks of anthropomorphism on a brain-washingly grand scale.

If you can describe this supernatural in such specific terms, and condemn all others who do not share the same vision, then you are claiming a familiarity that you simply cannot have.  And if you, “ . . . all do . . .,” then you have invalidated your own contention unless you all actually do.  That can only be true if there is only one religion, and only one belief system, and all of them adhere to, and agree upon, the very same vision.  

But you don’t.  So it is kinda fair for us to ask – WHY NOT?  If you ALL, Christian and Muslim and Hindu alike, believe in this supernatural, as you contend here aloud,  and seek to overwhelm us by sheer numbers, then how is it possible that you disagree on anything at all?  

Why is it not possible, in your view, that (as Douglas Adams conjectured, just for the fun of it) the supernatural ‘being’ is not a being at all, but merely a hyper-intelligent shade of the color blue?                         

That would be equally 'unnatural,' and equally 'supernatural,' and should, as a belief, be afforded equal time.  Nobody has yet demonstrated why their own particular 'supernatural' is superior to any other that can be proposed, and nobody has yet explained why theirs seems to be so very human in description, when by definition it cannot possibly be anything of the sort.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 19, 2012)

Asath said:


> Anybody else want this one?    “Really??? I feel exactly about the same folks that can only comprehend the natural. “
> 
> Please?  I’m certainly not qualified to deal with folks who can comprehend the unnatural.  That one is far above my pay grade, as the government types like to say . . .
> 
> ...



Wow! What a load!

Every atheist person here says 'which god'?...all I'm saying is what difference does it make? if you don't it's ok to believe in the supernatural,(whether you agree or not) then you're not only doggin' Christians but almost every other religion, which is what you accuse Christians of doing....that blows my mind. Every religion believes in the supernatural.....as if we (Christians) are different/less/prejudiced some how. I'm not the one that supposes that one is superior to another....I'm saying we are all equal. But somehow only the Christians here seem to be condemned for what they believe....and your post proves that to be true. There is only one predjudice here and it's against Christians. Everyone else can believe what they want to except Christians, including you??? Trust me there are no hindus or buddhists or muslims here because they do not care what you believe....you can go to hades for all they care...hellooooo.

And as far as atheists go.....they all have opinions, and they all are not the same...and we know what opinions are like...don't we? Can you see fit that it's ok for anyone to believe what they want to believe, just like you and all other atheists expect to have the freedom to believe what they believe?? I don't care what you believe, ya know and I don't dog you out for it, do I? So let me believe what I want to believe too...if in fact you believe 'live and let live'....which obviously you don't.

I once, many years ago, had a husband who fought for my freedom of belief and for what your freedom of disbelief is, also.....can you at least have some respect for that? Or are you so against and have such a bad taste in your mouth for Christians that you can't even believe that people die for both of our beliefs??


----------



## WTM45 (Feb 19, 2012)

Posting in this particular forum just might not be for some folks.
They take discussion all too personally.

NOBODY has stated there is no freedom for folks to believe as they wish.
The very nature of the discussions in this particular forum are about questioning the reasons why folks do.  And why folks don't.  And that questioning is not limited to Christianity, Islam or any other belief system.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 19, 2012)

WTM45 said:


> Posting in this particular forum just might not be for some folks.
> They take discussion all too personally.
> 
> NOBODY has stated there is no freedom for folks to believe as they wish.
> The very nature of the discussions in this particular forum are about questioning the reasons why folks do.  And why folks don't.  And that questioning is not limited to Christianity, Islam or any other belief system.



And of course I suppose that post was meant for me....

no one has ask me what I believe in this thread,  not saying I don't step up to the plate and say it anyway....does that somehow bother you? Mostly these threads are talking down and making fun of Christians who believe in talking donkeys...ya know?
Please don't try to believe you can read my mind, or my intentions....I can comprehend what I read.  I've got sense enough to know when someone is mocking or making fun of what I believe when I do express it and everytime I express it....


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 19, 2012)

mtnwoman said:


> Wow! What a load!
> 
> Every atheist person here says 'which god'?...all I'm saying is what difference does it make? if you don't it's ok to believe in the supernatural,(whether you agree or not) then you're not only doggin' Christians but almost every other religion, which is what you accuse Christians of doing....that blows my mind. Every religion believes in the supernatural.....as if we (Christians) are different/less/prejudiced some how. I'm not the one that supposes that one is superior to another....I'm saying we are all equal. But somehow only the Christians here seem to be condemned for what they believe....and your post proves that to be true. There is only one predjudice here and it's against Christians. Everyone else can believe what they want to except Christians, including you??? Trust me there are no hindus or buddhists or muslims here because they do not care what you believe....you can go to hades for all they care...hellooooo.



No, it doesn't make and difference which god and no one is "dogging" anyone.  Believers assert that they are privy to some kind of knowledge of something that (by their own admission) is impossible to prove aside from personal testimony and nonbelievers say that that's not good enough.  Sometimes a believer will present a rational argument to back up this irrational claim and that's what Apologetics is.  No one "condemns" anyone here except for the believers.  Turns out that they are the only ones who have the lock on not only what the soul is but also how to insure it's grace.  I'm pretty sure that the reason that there are no Hindus, Buddhists or Muslims on here has little to do with the Spirituality section of this website.   



mtnwoman said:


> And as far as atheists go.....they all have opinions, and they all are not the same...and we know what opinions are like...don't we? Can you see fit that it's ok for anyone to believe what they want to believe, just like you and all other atheists expect to have the freedom to believe what they believe?? I don't care what you believe, ya know and I don't dog you out for it, do I? So let me believe what I want to believe too...if in fact you believe 'live and let live'....which obviously you don't.
> 
> I once, many years ago, had a husband who fought for my freedom of belief and for what your freedom of disbelief is, also.....can you at least have some respect for that? Or are you so against and have such a bad taste in your mouth for Christians that you can't even believe that people die for both of our beliefs??



No one is telling you not to believe what you want, but if you expect people to just agree with you that the Bible is the truth because "you just know it" I think you might be barking up the wrong tree.  The "hallelujah, amen" department is a few floors up.  People here want proof.


----------



## WTM45 (Feb 19, 2012)

mtnwoman said:


> And of course I suppose that post was meant for me....
> 
> no one has ask me what I believe in this thread,  not saying I don't step up to the plate and say it anyway....does that somehow bother you? Mostly these threads are talking down and making fun of Christians who believe in talking donkeys...ya know?
> Please don't try to believe you can read my mind, or my intentions....I can comprehend what I read.  I've got sense enough to know when someone is mocking or making fun of what I believe when I do express it and everytime I express it....



I don't expect you to NOT defend your beliefs.
Or, for a non-believer NOT talk about what they see as folly.
That's what the whole idea of discussion is about.
When stepping into this particular forum, one must realize there will be dissenting opinion and views.  It simply goes with the territory.  That territory was created when the A/A/A forum was set up.  Whether it was intended or not, it became the venue/arena for an "us vs. them" type of interaction.

Sometimes we get too emotionally wrapped up in it.  I'm including myself in that collective "we" here too.
It is why I don't say too much here anymore.

Just don't let things here get the best of you.  That is what I'm saying in a nutshell.  I like your style of communicating what you feel and believe.  I just don't want you to let things here get to you.


----------



## Asath (Feb 20, 2012)

Ah . . . go ahead – let it get to you . . . it is entertaining as all get out, and educational as well, in a terribly odd way . . .


----------



## ambush80 (Feb 20, 2012)

Asath said:


> Ah . . . go ahead – let it get to you . . . it is entertaining as all get out, and educational as well, in a terribly odd way . . .



I personally haven't learned anything from the dialogue.  I've heard it all before but I agree with you that it never gets old.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 20, 2012)

WTM45 said:


> I don't expect you to NOT defend your beliefs.
> Or, for a non-believer NOT talk about what they see as folly.
> That's what the whole idea of discussion is about.
> When stepping into this particular forum, one must realize there will be dissenting opinion and views.  It simply goes with the territory.  That territory was created when the A/A/A forum was set up.  Whether it was intended or not, it became the venue/arena for an "us vs. them" type of interaction.
> ...



I understand. Things don't get to me, really. 

It's mostly comical to me....not in what anyone does or doesn't believe. Just that it seems to be ok to speak your opinion while calling someone else's opinion ignorant/a fairy tale/unrealistic/ ridiculous, when you really think the same as they do about what they believe, but don't usually say it because some of us believe we all have the right to believe what we want to without condemnation. Then when we/I say the same thing back, all of a sudden I become condescending

Thanks for your thought though, by blood pressure doesn't even go up a point around here.  I come here mostly so my daughter can read it, too, and we both cannot believe what some people think about us.....leaving a child to die in the dirt....yeah ok, all Christians would do that.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 20, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> I personally haven't learned anything from the dialogue.  I've heard it all before but I agree with you that it never gets old.



Of course you've heard it all before, because y'all keep saying the same things, too, and you get the same response. What do you expect???  How many times can you say talking donkey and get a different reply


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 20, 2012)

Asath said:


> Ah . . . go ahead – let it get to you . . . it is entertaining as all get out, and educational as well, in a terribly odd way . . .



It doesn't get to me personally, but it may get to someone who is searching for something and I don't want them to hear just your side.....I've said that maybe a hundred times....maybe sooner or later it will sink in.  I'm not here because of you or any one else who believes/acts like you. I'm here in spite of what you believe/say or act like.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 20, 2012)

ambush80 said:


> No, it doesn't make and difference which god and no one is "dogging" anyone.  *Good me either, neither am I being condescending, as accused, works both ways that's my point.*Believers assert that they are privy to some kind of knowledge of something that (by their own admission) is impossible to prove aside from personal testimony and nonbelievers say that that's not good enough.*So? What you believe isn't good enough for me either....again it works both ways, my point again.*  Sometimes a believer will present a rational argument to back up this irrational claim and that's what Apologetics is.  No one "condemns" anyone here except for the believers.*Really??? have I ever told you what you believe is ridiculous? I never have.*  Turns out that they are the only ones who have the lock on not only what the soul is but also how to insure it's grace. *So why don't you tell us what lock you have...I try to share my lock with you, whatever 'lock' means and you know that I do.* I'm pretty sure that the reason that there are no Hindus, Buddhists or Muslims on here has little to do with the Spirituality section of this website.  *Why? are they anywhere else on this website???Show me one.*
> 
> 
> 
> No one is telling you not to believe what you want, but if you expect people to just agree with you that the Bible is the truth because "you just know it" I think you might be barking up the wrong tree.  The "hallelujah, amen" department is a few floors up.  People here want proof.*You're kidding, right? You want proof? I want proof of why I shouldn't believe as I do and you haven't offered anything up but insults. Calling something a fairy tale by you, doesn't mean it is so.*



Whether you're a believer or not, the best thing to do, is do unto others as you wish for them to do unto you. Not to treat them like they're idiots and expect some kind of repect for your own beliefs and expect them not to defend themselves.

Mr A says he comes here because it's entertaining....same for me. If I didn't come here who'd y'all be talking to? yourselves. Nobody cares what you believe really either...well except for me. And I'm not trying to change it, it just reminds me of how I looked and sounded when I believed as y'all do, makes me wanna run to Jesus.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 20, 2012)

Asath said:


> Nobody has yet demonstrated why their own particular 'supernatural' is superior to any other that can be proposed, and nobody has yet explained why theirs seems to be so very human in description, when by definition it cannot possibly be anything of the sort.



Who here has said their own particular 'supernatural' is superior?
No one that I've heard has said anything about it being anything near human, who has implied that?

You are right the natural is us, humans, the supernatural is not humans. 

I know what I 'see' in my supernatural belief....but I don't always 'see' what someone else 'sees' why would I condemn something I myself cannot see? Why do you?

So why do you think that your nonbelief in the supernatural is superior to my belief? You can't prove anything either to me or to any one else.  Even to ambush, you cannot prove 100% that there is no supernatural....he can believe it if he wants to, that's fine, but you cannot prove it absolutely.


----------



## Asath (Feb 20, 2012)

“Whether you're a believer or not, the best thing to do, is do unto others as you wish for them to do unto you. Not to treat them like they're idiots and expect some kind of repect for your own beliefs and expect them not to defend themselves.”

K.

Got it.

So if what is actually done ‘unto us’ is to kick us down here into the basement forum, reserving all other forums only for their own witnessing, and THEN also show up way down here, so far beneath themselves, to continue shouting, disrespectfully, then are you advising us to also do the same ‘unto’ them?

“ . . . do unto others . . . “   I like that phrase a lot . . . But please be aware that others can also get in on that ‘doing unto’ bit . . . 

I know – that stinks, doesn’t it?  Unfortunately, the ammunition supply was equally distributed – we call it free public schools and free public libraries – and having gone to all that trouble and expense we can hardly then be held responsible for folks who failed to show up and claim their fair share  . . . 

Proof is not the lack of proof.  If you say that I cannot ‘disprove,’ then you are merely saying that you cannot prove.  And, nothing personal, but it is never incumbent upon anyone else to ‘prove’ or ‘disprove’ what you, personally assert --  If you say that something is true, then it is quite reasonable for us to ask you to demonstrate that such a thing actually is true.  We need do no work in that direction whatsoever – YOU DO.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 21, 2012)

Asath said:


> “Whether you're a believer or not, the best thing to do, is do unto others as you wish for them to do unto you. Not to treat them like they're idiots and expect some kind of repect for your own beliefs and expect them not to defend themselves.”
> 
> K.
> 
> ...



Okay got it.

You still cannot prove that you are right in your nonbelief, no more than I prove in my belief.  It's when y'all bring up talkin' donkeys and laugh and make jokes about what I believe, when you can't even prove I'm wrong. Talkin' donkeys and whales are the least of my worries, I can take them or leave them, my belief in Christ are not based on those two things. My belief is based on the teaching of Christ and the 10 commandments, do you agree with the 10 commandments or are they a joke to you, too? Are they unconceivable? wherever they came from...do you agree with them? What about proverbs, are they all a joke or does any of it make sense? It's just a standard to try to meet the mark. Just like in archery, missing the mark is a sin, that's all sin is, is that we are missing the mark of what we are trying to accomplish in our lives, to be better people, and most of the time that doesn't work, because we aren't strong enough to do all those things. None of us, believers or nonbelievers. We all sin or miss the mark set before us in some ways.  I don't care about proving anything about a whale or ark or any of that stuff. I'm a NT believer and my belief is Jesus Christ. I'm not a Jew, I don't have to know or understand any of the OT to meet the mark. I'm interested in it and I like studying it and relating it to the NT but I only have to believe/understand one little teeny weenie verse to be saved.

Wonder how many mockers the wright brothers had to listen to...or isaac newton, I bet he was called a dweeb. 

No one here can prove to me that all the history books or all the science books ever written have no mistakes in them or things that are questionable....and yet you base your beliefs on all that. You're not a scientist, I don't think anyway, and you're only taking the word of someone else that some of this stuff is correct. I take their word for it....how am I gonna go about proving them wrong when I don't even know what they are talking about, now you might know everything about science and swear that it's all true. I just take their word for it, that's all I can do.
I think somethings are just to hard to comprehend, understand and believe on all sides....unless of course you understand/comprehend it all....I don't know of anyone like that.

Perhaps you have an insight to the "entire" bible that the rest of us do not, and that you could, if you felt like it prove it all wrong, especially the talking donkeys, but you don't feel like you should have to, it's my burden to prove it is all true.....uh, excuse me, no it ain't. We are all on our own. I don't care what you know or how much think you know, that is your business, just don't make fun of me for believing what I believe and then come back with some pity party of how terrible you are treated around here, just to mock me even more.

Y'all ask questions or make statements that I try to explain and all it is is bait, or a trap so that you can make fun in the next post.

Ok ok, tattle tail, my flesh says go jump/or take a hike , my spirit says don't leave, someone needs to hear something.

If you prefer it, I'll not come back here, I have no problem with being ask to leave....and you wonder why it's quiet.....because I happen to step out for a few and no one else is interested.


----------



## Asath (Feb 21, 2012)

“My flesh says up yours . . . “

Um?  Gentlemen moderators?  

This sort of thing makes any real discussion impossible.


----------



## mtnwoman (Feb 21, 2012)

Asath said:


> “My flesh says up yours . . . “
> 
> Um?  Gentlemen moderators?
> 
> This sort of thing makes any real discussion impossible.



Oh for theloveofpete I changed it. I wasn't saying that to you, I'm just saying that's what I'd like to say to people who make fun of me, ok....and talkin' donkeys make a great debate I suppose.

I won't be back in here, talk to the hand.....that totally surprised me that you'd say that, I thought you'd get my drift without taking it personal....course that's exactly what I'm talking about....some people can dish it out, but can't take it. Just when I was....well never mind....poof I'm gone...if that's all you got out of that entire post, no debate IS possible.


----------

