# RAW data



## hummerpoo (Dec 6, 2017)

I make no claim by these numbers,
nor do I perceive any cause of them,
therefore, I draw no conclusions from them,
but I do, somehow, find them interesting;
and I thought someone might understand,
and draw some conclusion from them:


November
Christianity and Judaism........................19 posts
Spiritual Discussions and Study..............39 posts
Atheists/Agnostics/Apologetics...........904 posts


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## gordon 2 (Dec 6, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> I make no claim by these numbers,
> nor do I perceive any cause of them,
> therefore, I draw no conclusions from them,
> but I do, somehow, find them interesting;
> ...



The only response I can come up with is: "To be or not to be, that is the question. " By this I mean it easier to be a Christian than to debate it. If I am is an example...It might just be a better course to be than to debate... being.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 6, 2017)

gordon 2 said:


> The only response I can come up with is: "To be or not to be, that is the question. " By this I mean it easier to be a Christian than to debate it. If I am is an example...It might just be a better course to be than to debate... being.



Your post caused an overload of my brain: scriptures that give guidance for "debate/discussion" of scripture/doctrine among brothers, between believers and nonbelievers, teachers toward disciples, disciples toward teachers ...


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## gordon 2 (Dec 6, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> Your post caused an overload of my brain: scriptures that give guidance for "debate/discussion" of scripture/doctrine among brothers, between believers and nonbelievers, teachers toward disciples, disciples toward teachers ...




 I have no doubt.  However I bet there are a few that claim it is better to be charitable than to debate/discuss about it. But perhaps not.


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## Artfuldodger (Dec 6, 2017)

It was partly my fault.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 6, 2017)

gordon 2 said:


> I have no doubt.  However I bet there are a few that claim it is better to be charitable than to debate/discuss about it. But perhaps not.



Oh yes, there are occasions where that applies.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 6, 2017)

Artfuldodger said:


> It was partly my fault.



Somehow, the word fault doesn't sound right to me, but the correct term evades me at the moment.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 6, 2017)

Perhaps someone would like to work up a list of scriptures that would give us guidance in this area.  If there is interest more will be added.


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## atlashunter (Dec 6, 2017)

I noticed the same thing hummer. It's a real snooze fest in here. Glad we have some believers participating in the AAA forum to keep things interesting.


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## hobbs27 (Dec 6, 2017)

I find myself too involved in FB groups to participate much here,  and we've pretty much covered the entire Bible and all possible views of every verse amongst the same folks for the last few years.


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## red neck richie (Dec 6, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> Perhaps someone would like to work up a list of scriptures that would give us guidance in this area.  If there is interest more will be added.



Matthew 4:19-20


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## hummerpoo (Dec 6, 2017)

red neck richie said:


> Matthew 4:19-20



Man, that's a great example of "no debate", when He called it was nothing but drop everything and go.  Luke 9:57-62 shows the opposite perspective.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 6, 2017)

O.K.; I went where I knew I would find something about dealing with controversy—the pastoral epistles—and found these:

1 Tim. 1:3-11; 4:7; 6:2-5; 6:20-21
2 Tim. 2:14-18; 2:22-26
Titus 3:1-3; 3:9-11

The problem that I, sort of, expected, but is somewhat tougher than I expected, is audience relevance.  Sometimes Paul is instructing Timothy as to his actions as a pastor; other times Paul is instructing Timothy as to what he should teach to his congregation.  For some passages, it is not perfectly clear to which category they belong, and there may be some leeway for particularly egregious situations.  How do we view instructions that we know are directed to one who is a pastor?


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## red neck richie (Dec 6, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> O.K.; I went where I knew I would find something about dealing with controversy—the pastoral epistles—and found these:
> 
> 1 Tim. 1:3-11; 4:7; 6:2-5; 6:20-21
> 2 Tim. 2:14-18; 2:22-26
> ...



We are called to bare witness and to testify regardless of audience. 1 John 1:2-3


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## Artfuldodger (Dec 6, 2017)

Did Paul's epistles have the same message to each congregation? Were there some things he addressed to the Galatians vs other things that were addressed to the Romans?
I mean he didn't write just one letter and send it to everyone.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 7, 2017)

red neck richie said:


> We are called to bare witness and to testify regardless of audience. 1 John 1:2-3



My reference to audience was not intended to exclude any person, or group of people, from our responsibility to represent our faith, but to emphasis that not all instructions given are intended for all of Christ's disciples.  Some are called to a particular type of ministry (pastors, evangelists, teachers, etc.); all who are called to Christ are called to ministry but most are not called to be pastors or evangelists, and there are instructions in scripture that are directed to those who have those particular callings.

My personal take on those instructions which are of a general nature has been expressed in the witticism "tell everybody about your Savior, Jesus Christ, and if you must, use words." (1Pet. 2:12,15; 3:14-16; Phil. 2:14,15; 2 Cor. 8,21)

My intent in post #8 was to suggest that, since we are required here, on an internet forum, to "use words", that we might benefit by talking about those general instructions, and how they apply to our use of this medium.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 7, 2017)

Artfuldodger said:


> Did Paul's epistles have the same message to each congregation? Were there some things he addressed to the Galatians vs other things that were addressed to the Romans?
> I mean he didn't write just one letter and send it to everyone.



I think the answer to both questions is "yes"; but I don't quite see how they tie into the pastoral epistles, except that there are definitely some instructions that Paul gave to both pastors.


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## hummerpoo (Dec 10, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> Somehow, the word fault doesn't sound right to me, but the correct term evades me at the moment.



O.K., so maybe I was wrong.


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## gordon 2 (Dec 10, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> O.K.; I went where I knew I would find something about dealing with controversy—the pastoral epistles—and found these:
> 
> 1 Tim. 1:3-11; 4:7; 6:2-5; 6:20-21
> 2 Tim. 2:14-18; 2:22-26
> ...



 Ref: Pastor.

11 But you, man of God, flee from all this, and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, endurance and gentleness. 12 Fight the good fight of the faith. Take hold of the eternal life to which you were called when you made your good confession in the presence of many witnesses.

This sums it up mostly for me I think....?

The flip side being this: These are the things you are to teach and insist on. 3 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, 4 they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions 5 and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.


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## gordon 2 (Dec 10, 2017)

Audience relevance:

The best at audience relevance might be those who have the Holy Spirit on them as opposed to the Holy Spirit in them only.

Few have the Holy Spirit on them ( controlled by the HS)  as Paul did or Peter did so audience relevance is a " Hail Mary" for most saints.


 Hebrews 13:2 Look on Jesus who is the source and the completer of our faith.

When saints try their goat at audience relevance many or even most might not heed to Hebrews 13:2--but to the audience itself, or worse some agenda...or task they have  taken apon themselves...( such as spin to derail a tread by discrediting an individual in a discussion... etc... or spinning from politics in a spiritual debate.)



1 Corinthians 12:8

For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit;...

Knowledge and wisdom are different things... Paul and saints like him have them both...

The rest of us... well ... we struggle.


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## Artfuldodger (Dec 10, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> O.K., so maybe I was wrong.


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## gordon 2 (Dec 10, 2017)

hummerpoo said:


> My reference to audience was not intended to exclude any person, or group of people, from our responsibility to represent our faith, but to emphasis that not all instructions given are intended for all of Christ's disciples.  Some are called to a particular type of ministry (pastors, evangelists, teachers, etc.); all who are called to Christ are called to ministry but most are not called to be pastors or evangelists, and there are instructions in scripture that are directed to those who have those particular callings.
> 
> My personal take on those instructions which are of a general nature has been expressed in the witticism "tell everybody about your Savior, Jesus Christ, and if you must, use words." (1Pet. 2:12,15; 3:14-16; Phil. 2:14,15; 2 Cor. 8,21)
> 
> My intent in post #8 was to suggest that, since we are required here, on an internet forum, to "use words", that we might benefit by talking about those general instructions, and how they apply to our use of this medium.



This is what I glean:

Honesty.


Well doing. 

Sanctify the Lord God in your Hearts: answer a human being in meekness and fear.

No murmerings or disputing... "and I will add no name calling or labelling".


Be blameless and harmless, without rebuke.

Be honest to a fault to saint and sinner... this serves as a witness.

------------------

Tall order! It is a tall order in a world where professional people are paid handsomely to spin the truth and to lie covertly.  It is a tall order in a world where being a professional liar is a  respectable career choice for our children and their parents. It is a tall order in a world where everything is false news--even for some, more now than before, the Good News suspect... It is a tall order when I  say on Sunday "It is better to give than to receive." and the week remaining "It is better to control than to be controlled."


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