# Dumb question on elk



## lampern (Jun 11, 2015)

If a wild elk wandered into GA from ,say, TN, KY or NC, would you be able to legally shoot it?

Thanks


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## Budda (Jun 12, 2015)

Depends on who finds out bout it.


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## Uptonongood (Jun 12, 2015)

Nope.


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 12, 2015)

Good question.  In Georgia, elk are legally defined as "farmed deer" raised for the commercial sale of meat and other parts.  There is no law that directly addresses an elk originating from the wild in  another state.  From the hunter's perspective you probably wouldn't know the difference if it wasn't tagged.  Since there is a provision that protects hunters from being liable if they kill an escaped farmed deer (below), I would expect the same to be applied for any elk.  I'm not a lawyer so don't take my word for it.  

_§ 4-4-174.  Escaped deer or cervid 


   Any farmed deer or cervid which escapes from a licensed deer farm shall be subject to the jurisdiction of the Department of Natural Resources and may be treated as an escaped wild animal which is subject to the provisions of Chapter 5 of Title 27, except that, while such animal is roaming freely outside the enclosure of any licensed deer farm, the owner of such farmed deer or cervid shall have 48 hours from the time the escape is detected to recapture such animal and return it to the licensed deer farm. As a condition for maintaining a deer-farming license, it shall be the duty of the owner or operator of a licensed deer farm to notify the Department of Natural Resources immediately upon discovery of the escape of a farmed deer. When such notice has been given, no legal hunter shall be held liable for killing or wounding an escaped deer._


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## 660griz (Jun 12, 2015)

C.Killmaster said:


> When such notice has been given, no legal hunter shall be held liable for killing or wounding an escaped deer.



I would think it would still have to be 'deer' season. 
This just protects the hunter from killing a person's property. 

There is no elk season so, I wouldn't do it.


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## lampern (Jun 12, 2015)

Thank you for the reply.

Since elk are defined as 'deer', I guess they would count towards the season bag limits of 2 antlered deer and 10 antlerless?


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 12, 2015)

lampern said:


> Thank you for the reply.
> 
> Since elk are defined as 'deer', I guess they would count towards the season bag limits of 2 antlered deer and 10 antlerless?



No, the only definition of elk in Georgia law is "farmed deer" which has no relation to deer seasons or bag limits for our native whitetails.


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## ripplerider (Jun 12, 2015)

Maybe this needs changing with some of the Smokies herd wandering close to the N.C. line. Id like to see them be protected, maybe get a foothold in N. Ga.


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## sea trout (Jun 12, 2015)

Would it be like fishing?
Like say..... red drum are in the fishing regs, so one must abide by the regs to be legal. Stingray is not in the fishing regs...so people can do what they want???

If elk arn't in our hunting regs could you do what you want????

But then there was the stink a few years back about the guy who killed the florida panther...

Good qeustion for the dnr to clarify..... but then you couldn't play the act dumb card for the first time...


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## RUGERWARRIOR (Jun 12, 2015)

That's the point I was gonna make. They said for years there are no Cougars, mountain lions, or panthers in Georgia. They were proved wrong and fined the man. I could see the same happening to an elk being killed in Georgia outside of deer season.


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## lampern (Jun 12, 2015)

> florida panther..



Pretty sure Florida panthers are protected by the federal government.


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## RUGERWARRIOR (Jun 13, 2015)

lampern said:


> Pretty sure Florida panthers are protected by the federal government.



I understand that. But at the time "they didn't exsist in Georgia". As of right now as far as we know there are no wild elk making there way to Georgia. But when they do are they going to get someone in trouble? I hope not. I was glad that a hunter was able to prove big cats are in Georgia. I hate that it was an endangered species, and really hate the hunter got in trouble for it. I feel that an announcement should have come out that it is possable for the cats could be around and no more killing of them will be tolerated. Although making an example out of the first man would probably prevent  further Panther deaths. Personally I think there could be more panthers killed but a very tight lipped hunter


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## lampern (Jun 13, 2015)

Maybe the WRD should put a blurb about elk in the regulations digest?


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## Buck Roar (Jun 13, 2015)

ripplerider said:


> Maybe this needs changing with some of the Smokies herd wandering close to the N.C. line. Id like to see them be protected, maybe get a foothold in N. Ga.



One of my friends posted some pics of a herd that had found its way to a NC county about 5 miles from N.GA last month.............


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## lampern (Jun 13, 2015)

Buck Roar said:


> One of my friends posted some pics of a herd that had found its way to a NC county about 5 miles from N.GA last month.............



Some of the elk are in Jackson County, NC which borders Rabun County, GA.


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## Buck Roar (Jun 13, 2015)

lampern said:


> Some of the elk are in Jackson County, NC which borders Rabun County, GA.




these were in Clay county, NC I think.


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## jrmcc (Jun 13, 2015)

lampern said:


> Some of the elk are in Jackson County, NC which borders Rabun County, GA.



Jackson county does not border rabun GA. There have been a few elk staying in Macon and clay county nc. I would not suggest trying to shoot one of these and hoping some law protects you from fines. They are highly protected in nc can't imagine a mile across the state line would be that much different.


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## lampern (Jun 13, 2015)

Along the Chattooga River area it does.

The elk in clay and macon counties migrated from the Cherokee Indian Reservation in Jackson County.

Rabun borders all three NC counties (I think). So elk in GA are possible.


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 14, 2015)

RUGERWARRIOR said:


> I understand that. But at the time "they didn't exsist in Georgia". As of right now as far as we know there are no wild elk making there way to Georgia. But when they do are they going to get someone in trouble? I hope not. I was glad that a hunter was able to prove big cats are in Georgia. I hate that it was an endangered species, and really hate the hunter got in trouble for it. I feel that an announcement should have come out that it is possable for the cats could be around and no more killing of them will be tolerated. Although making an example out of the first man would probably prevent  further Panther deaths. Personally I think there could be more panthers killed but a very tight lipped hunter



Unlike the elk situation we're discussing, mountain lions/panthers are protected in Georgia law.  They are listed as a game animal with a closed season.  That cat in Troup county wasn't the first one killed in relatively recent years.  There was at least one killed back in the 1990's, a Texas cat released in north Florida as part of a research project.  That hunter was also charged.  DNR's stance is that we don't have a documented, breeding population of panthers.  Why would Georgia cats be so good at avoiding trail cameras when Florida cats show up on them all the time? All that Troup county cat proved is that large carnivores are capable of traveling long distances and are liable to show up virtually anywhere.  We have proof that that cat came from Florida and didn't originate in Georgia.


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## ripplerider (Jun 14, 2015)

DNR needs to list elk the same way. There is a wild population north of us that has wandered close to the Ga. line  recently. They need to be protected if they stray into Ga. The Rocky Mtn. Elk foundation and the government spent a lot of money and effort  stocking them in the Smokies.


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## RUGERWARRIOR (Jun 14, 2015)

I did not realize that. I knew the Florida strain was a protected species but did not know mountain lion strain was a closed season in Georgia. That my ignorance. I also didn't know of the cat from the 90's. My hunter safety card is from I think 94. I was a youngan. Thanks for setting me strait. So just to be clear, there is no closed season to elk?


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## RUGERWARRIOR (Jun 14, 2015)

ripplerider said:


> DNR needs to list elk the same way. There is a wild population north of us that has wandered close to the Ga. line  recently. They need to be protected if they stray into Ga. The Rocky Mtn. Elk foundation and the government spent a lot of money and effort  stocking them in the Smokies.



I agree.


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 14, 2015)

RUGERWARRIOR said:


> So just to be clear, there is no closed season to elk?



That is correct, the law just doesn't address wild elk.


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## lampern (Jun 14, 2015)

Would the legislature have to address elk?


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 14, 2015)

lampern said:


> Would the legislature have to address elk?



Yes, it would require a law change to add them as a game animal.


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## lampern (Jun 14, 2015)

Would the WRD oppose such a move?

Both NC and SC moved to protect wandering elk.


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## lampern (Jun 14, 2015)

> (34) "Game animals" means the following animals: bear, bobcat, deer, fox, opossum, rabbit, raccoon, sea turtles and their eggs, squirrel, cougar (Felis concolor), and all members of the families Alligatoridae and Crocodylidae.



I take it all one has to do is classify elk as a game animal?


http://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2010/title-27/chapter-2/article-1/27-2-18/


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 14, 2015)

lampern said:


> Would the WRD oppose such a move?
> 
> Both NC and SC moved to protect wandering elk.



Not really my place to say, I've never had that discussion with the appropriate people.  I don't see WRD raising the question with the legislature until they make their way here though.  Every time you open up any wildlife code for debate, you never know what other things get added on or messed with.  Unless it's really important, it's not worth the risk.  I just don't see the fact that elk might make their way here as really important.


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 14, 2015)

lampern said:


> I take it all one has to do is classify elk as a game animal?
> 
> 
> http://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2010/title-27/chapter-2/article-1/27-2-18/



Yes, in addition to establishing a closed season or a season framework for DNR to regulate within.  The latter wouldn't require a law change to allow limited harvest in the future if they ever got established.


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## lampern (Jun 14, 2015)

Thank you sir for the reply.

They have been spotted recently around Lake Chatuge (Clay County, North Carolina)


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## ben300win (Jun 16, 2015)

Technically if an elk come across the state line there is no laws regarding them. You could legally shoot one but it might be like the guy that shot the man lion in Carroll county a few years back.


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## RUGERWARRIOR (Jun 16, 2015)

Oh boy!


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## C.Killmaster (Jun 16, 2015)

ben300win said:


> Technically if an elk come across the state line there is no laws regarding them. You could legally shoot one but it might be like the guy that shot the man lion in Carroll county a few years back.


 post #19


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## ripplerider (Jun 17, 2015)

Just cause you can shoot something dont mean you should shoot something.


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## dgmeadows (Jun 17, 2015)

Since elk are non-native, wouldn't they technically be deemed an invasive species, much like the coyote when it first started showing up a couple decades ago ?  

I am not promoting shooting elk on sight if they show up in N GA.  I'd agree it would be best to protect them for a while to see if they could proliferate into a manageable & huntable population.  However, as they are non-native and otherwise non-regulated (i.e. not an endangered species under federal law) I would expect a wild elk roaming into N Ga would be deemed a non-native invasive species, not regulated under current laws.


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## Michael (Jun 17, 2015)

dgmeadows said:


> Since elk are non-native, wouldn't they technically be deemed an invasive species, much like the coyote when it first started showing up a couple decades ago ?
> 
> I am not promoting shooting elk on sight if they show up in N GA.  I'd agree it would be best to protect them for a while to see if they could proliferate into a manageable & huntable population.  However, as they are non-native and otherwise non-regulated (i.e. not an endangered species under federal law) I would expect a wild elk roaming into N Ga would be deemed a non-native invasive species, not regulated under current laws.




This is my "belief" too. I once had an Emu walking through my back yard. A Game Warden later told me basically what was said above and I could have kilt it. 

I also know of several places in GA that have elk fenced in, just like the guy who had the Emu. So I'm thinking the outcome could be the same?


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## Limbhanger2881 (Jun 17, 2015)

You could kill an elk whenever you want. Matter of fact several years ago a trailer hauling elk wrecked somewhere around Atlanta. People did kill some of them during hunting season. In regards to mountain lions they are federally protected. They come into Georgia on a regular basis from Florida too. If GA wanted to reintroduce elk then they would be protected or if they changed the legislature to protect them in GA


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## lampern (Jun 17, 2015)

Elk are native to the N GA mountains area.


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## Nicodemus (Jun 17, 2015)

lampern said:


> Elk are native to the N GA mountains area.





According to the historic records, if, and this is a big IF, elk were ever in Georgia, it was the occasional vagrant that wandered in from Tennessee back when original herds of elk were in the East. This doesn`t apply to the Ice Age when Megafauna was everywhere.

Now buffalo are a different story. Plains buffalo (not woodland buffalo) were here and even down into Florida.


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## lampern (Jun 17, 2015)

This thread says elk were wiped out in GA during the 1770s


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## Nicodemus (Jun 17, 2015)

lampern said:


> This thread says elk were wiped out in GA during the 1770s





There hasn`t been enough elk remains found in prehistoric Indian middens up in the North Georgia mountains to hardly warrant mention. Just a scattered bone here or there in a few. If they were here, then they would have been utilized. Hard to argue with those findings. Those archaeologists are meticulous on a dig.


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## 660griz (Jun 17, 2015)

Eastern Elk range.


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## lampern (Jun 17, 2015)

That is the map I was referring to.


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## Joe Brandon (Jun 19, 2015)

ripplerider said:


> Just cause you can shoot something dont mean you should shoot something.


 Amen!


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## The mtn man (Jun 26, 2015)

Please don't shoot our elk! There is a small herd hanging around the towns / Rabun county lines in Clay county, my parents had a 7x7 in there yard this past Sunday, in a straight line that is about 1.5 miles from towns county, Hightower/ Charlie's creek area if you know where that is, I don't doubt they have been in ga since they do a lot of roaming. Just let them be, maybe we will have a huntable population in 20 years, I think it's great their back after more than 200 years, let's give them a chance!


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## lampern (Jun 28, 2015)

Apparently the elk in Clay County are only bulls?


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## Buck Roar (Jun 29, 2015)

lampern said:


> Apparently the elk in Clay County are only bulls?



No. I know some guys who have some pics of some cows in Clay from a couple months ago


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## RUGERWARRIOR (Jun 29, 2015)

Why would they only stock Bulls? Sounds like a waste of money.


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## The mtn man (Jun 29, 2015)

Not true, there is one herd of 17 cows that I know of.


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## lampern (Jun 29, 2015)

cklem said:


> Not true, there is one herd of 17 cows that I know of.



Sorry but I'm not buying there are 17 elk of any sex in Clay County.


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## The mtn man (Jun 29, 2015)

lampern said:


> Sorry but I'm not buying there are 17 elk of any sex in Clay County.



Ok


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## Buck Roar (Jun 29, 2015)

lampern said:


> Sorry but I'm not buying there are 17 elk of any sex in Clay County.



What if we give you a reduced price on your purchase?


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## The mtn man (Jun 30, 2015)

Buck Roar said:


> What if we give you a reduced price on your purchase?



Haha, don't worry little buddy, not worth it. The guys that took the pics of the cows that you know, do they work for the power company? The big herd of cows have been seen a few times in a cross country power line. They don't seem to be quite as tame as the bulls that are hanging around the hayfields down in the community.


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## NCHillbilly (Jun 30, 2015)

lampern said:


> Sorry but I'm not buying there are 17 elk of any sex in Clay County.



Believe it. I have seen 30-40 at a time here in Haywood many times, I've seen 25 at a time in Swain, seen them in Jackson, and they constantly roam all over. There was a cow elk from Kentucky roadkilled in Buncombe a few years ago. They don't pay any attention to the park boundaries, for sure. One of my neighbors wound up selling his cattle because the elk wiped his hay crop out two years in a row.


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## The mtn man (Jun 30, 2015)

NCHillbilly said:


> Believe it. I have seen 30-40 at a time here in Haywood many times, I've seen 25 at a time in Swain, seen them in Jackson, and they constantly roam all over. There was a cow elk from Kentucky roadkilled in Buncombe a few years ago. They don't pay any attention to the park boundaries, for sure. One of my neighbors wound up selling his cattle because the elk wiped his hay crop out two years in a row.



They have done some hayfield damage here, it is possible that they could have moved on from here, only 1 big bull has been spotted in the past week that I'm aware of, most folks talk about it if they see one. I went to an area today that is a remote 50 acre field on FS, to look for sign of the herd of cows that were spotted very near there, I didn't see any obvious sign, but there is a lot of woods they could be in, I'm not an expert on elk habits in WNC, not sure their gonna lay down roots here.


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## The mtn man (Jun 30, 2015)

View attachment 840925 this is the field I figured they would be using to graze, herd of cows was spotted about 500 yards from here not long ago.


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## northgeorgiasportsman (Jun 30, 2015)

cklem said:


> View attachment 840925 this is the field I figured they would be using to graze, herd of cows was spotted about 500 yards from here not long ago.



No need to browse in that field when there's fresh, tender alfalfa growing a few miles southeast.


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## The mtn man (Jun 30, 2015)

northgeorgiasportsman said:


> No need to browse in that field when there's fresh, tender alfalfa growing a few miles southeast.



True, but nobody seeing them, could be they moved on, or eatin somethin in the woods, if you want we can give it a good goin over pretty soon. If their still here I want to be the first to hear an elk bugle in this county in over 200 years. I think I'll try to keep up with them until they leave , or stay, whatever they decide.


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## The mtn man (Jun 30, 2015)

NCHillbilly said:


> Believe it. I have seen 30-40 at a time here in Haywood many times, I've seen 25 at a time in Swain, seen them in Jackson, and they constantly roam all over. There was a cow elk from Kentucky roadkilled in Buncombe a few years ago. They don't pay any attention to the park boundaries, for sure. One of my neighbors wound up selling his cattle because the elk wiped his hay crop out two years in a row.



I'll bet you see them all the time.


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## Nicodemus (Jun 30, 2015)

I need to trade ya`ll gator hunts for elk hunts.


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## lampern (Jun 30, 2015)

NCHillbilly said:


> Believe it. I have seen 30-40 at a time here in Haywood many times, I've seen 25 at a time in Swain, seen them in Jackson, and they constantly roam all over. There was a cow elk from Kentucky roadkilled in Buncombe a few years ago. They don't pay any attention to the park boundaries, for sure. One of my neighbors wound up selling his cattle because the elk wiped his hay crop out two years in a row.



Plenty of elk around Cherokee but I doubt they have moved as far as Clay County.

As far as leaving the park the grass is definitely greener and better outside the park from the few trips I have made to the area to see them.

The elk in Cherokee seem to prefer town to the park proper.


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## northgeorgiasportsman (Jun 30, 2015)

lampern said:


> The elk in Cherokee seem to prefer town to the park proper.



Those are just the ones you see...while you're in town...


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## northgeorgiasportsman (Jun 30, 2015)

From the pasture on the right hand side (going north) of 441 just north of Cherokee, which is where most people get their first glimpse of a Smoky Mountain elk, to the fields they've been frequenting in Clay county is right at 35 miles.  That's 35 miles through relatively uninterrupted wilderness.  Not that far for an animal whose western cousins often migrate more than 90 miles between seasons.  Longest recorded elk migration was over 200 miles.


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## Buck Roar (Jun 30, 2015)

northgeorgiasportsman said:


> From the pasture on the right hand side (going north) of 441 just north of Cherokee, which is where most people get their first glimpse of a Smoky Mountain elk, to the fields they've been frequenting in Clay county is right at 35 miles.  That's 35 miles through relatively uninterrupted wilderness.  Not that far for an animal whose western cousins often migrate more than 90 miles between seasons.  Longest recorded elk migration was over 200 miles.



That field is where I saw my first Elk earlier this year.  Awesome animals and hope they stay around Clay and maybe Towns.


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## The mtn man (Jun 30, 2015)

northgeorgiasportsman said:


> From the pasture on the right hand side (going north) of 441 just north of Cherokee, which is where most people get their first glimpse of a Smoky Mountain elk, to the fields they've been frequenting in Clay county is right at 35 miles.  That's 35 miles through relatively uninterrupted wilderness.  Not that far for an animal whose western cousins often migrate more than 90 miles between seasons.  Longest recorded elk migration was over 200 miles.



It's not hard for a couple dozen elk sized animals to go undetected for a while around here, course when bear season opens , this dream of having elk here will probably be short lived.


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## lampern (Jun 30, 2015)

northgeorgiasportsman said:


> From the pasture on the right hand side (going north) of 441 just north of Cherokee, which is where most people get their first glimpse of a Smoky Mountain elk, to the fields they've been frequenting in Clay county is right at 35 miles.  That's 35 miles through relatively uninterrupted wilderness.  Not that far for an animal whose western cousins often migrate more than 90 miles between seasons.  Longest recorded elk migration was over 200 miles.



Would they not have to cross that highway you take to get to Cherokee?


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## The mtn man (Jul 1, 2015)

lampern said:


> Would they not have to cross that highway you take to get to Cherokee?



Yes, then go through cowee area, crossing 2 lane hwy 28, then it's nothing until they get here, it is know that there were approx. 30 head hanging around Wayah bald area( according to GW). If you know this area, then you know how close Wayah is to buck creek and shooting creek.


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## NCHillbilly (Jul 1, 2015)

lampern said:


> Would they not have to cross that highway you take to get to Cherokee?



They go back and forth across I-40 here all the time. Why do you doubt that an elk would travel 35-40 miles? That's nothing to them. And what do you think the folks in Clay county are seeing and taking pictures of? They sure look like elk to me. I don't understand the disbelief that elk have feet and know how to walk? They migrate long distances seasonally out west every year. Like I said, one came from Kentucky and got hit on 19/23 just above Asheville a few years ago. It's not a lot farther from Cherokee to Clay County than it is from Cataloochee to Cherokee, and they sure didn't take long to make that trip. They have also stocked them in eastern TN, got a good herd going down there. They will likely be everywhere in a few years.


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## The mtn man (Jul 1, 2015)

NCHillbilly said:


> They go back and forth across I-40 here all the time. Why do you doubt that an elk would travel 35-40 miles? That's nothing to them. And what do you think the folks in Clay county are seeing and taking pictures of? They sure look like elk to me. I don't understand the disbelief that elk have feet and know how to walk? They migrate long distances seasonally out west every year. Like I said, one came from Kentucky and got hit on 19/23 just above Asheville a few years ago. It's not a lot farther from Cherokee to Clay County than it is from Cataloochee to Cherokee, and they sure didn't take long to make that trip. They have also stocked them in eastern TN, got a good herd going down there. They will likely be everywhere in a few years.



I wonder if ncw has a plan for dealing with elk trashing hayfields? Some here said they took care of garden issues with a sling shot, it's hard to chase them out of a hayfield every night, and do you know if elk eat corn?


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