# Duck Dog



## N GA beagler (Jan 14, 2014)

Me and my son are new to duck hunting and thinking about getting a lab. We've have had dogs most of our life beagles, squirrel dogs and coon dogs. I have lots of questions my first one is whats the difference in American and English is it just registry?


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## strutlife (Jan 14, 2014)

English labs are block headed, broad chested and are "big boned" or weigh more. American labs have small head with long snouts.


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## krazybronco2 (Jan 14, 2014)

like strutlife said most (that is a loose term)british labs look like a show dog. shorter legs stockier body big block head. the american lab is the normally skinnier leggier dog. but really if you asked them what they are they wouldnt care. you just want one that has some drive to pick up a duck and both will do it. the obidience and all that other stuff comes later but the main thing is have a dog that wants to go.

both can be registered with the AKC and UKC.


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## steelshotslayer (Jan 14, 2014)

Your biggest differences is the American Line is bred for hunting they tend to be taller, leaner, and a ton more energetic.  The English line is more of your showroom dog they are broader, more mellow, and have the thick otter tail.  You can also find the American lab with English lines.  This dog may have the appearance of  either blood line, but generally have the temperament of the American line.  Personally I think you can make either a great duck dog.  My dog was an English and worked wonderfully.  I tend to like the bigger blockier body type.  Plus it made training a lot easier.


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## one_shot_no_mor (Jan 14, 2014)

*British Lab*

My hunting partner, Chase is British. He's more responsive to positive reinforcement as opposed to "correction". He was pretty easy to train and is VERY loyal.


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## king killer delete (Jan 14, 2014)

A good dog is a good dog.  The first thing I would do if I was wanting to get a new dog I would go to a hunt test. AKC/UKC does not make a big difference. Go see what a good working dog can do. Talk to the people that have dogs that are running the test. Proven blood goes a long way.http://forum.gon.com/album.php?albumid=5438&pictureid=29909


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## N GA beagler (Jan 14, 2014)

Thanks Everbody That helps alot..  Its just me but as far as looks, i think i like the square muzzle blockier head type.
Now if we can just find one in our price range.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 14, 2014)

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!
There is ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, NO SUCH THING AS A "BRITISH" LAB.  Unless you actually import him from England...and then it has NOTHING to do with the way the dog looks. There are labs with blockier heads and dogs with narrower snouts.  There are dogs with shorter stockier builds and some with longer, leaner looks.  The term "British" has been coined by a couple of marketing specialists at WildRose and Duckhill kennels in an attempt to sell puppies and a positive only approach to training...for a lot more money. American or British only refers to the dogs country of origin not to the dogs conformation.  
What you see is the "bench", "show", or "conformation" lines with a tendancy to be shorter, FATTER, and blockier in the face.  
"Field" dogs tend to be longer in the leg...
If its a hunting dog you seek then forget all this british/american garbage and buy a pup out of the best breeding you can possibly afford.  Look at HT and FT titles in EVERY generation...NOT which side of the pond someone claims the litter comes from.


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## Millcreekfarms (Jan 14, 2014)

Mountain view retrievers has a great litter on the ground now i have a male from the first breeding and he has been outstanding he is american/british check them out


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## king killer delete (Jan 14, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!
> There is ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, NO SUCH THING AS A "BRITISH" LAB.  Unless you actually import him from England...and then it has NOTHING to do with the way the dog looks. There are labs with blockier heads and dogs with narrower snouts.  There are dogs with shorter stockier builds and some with longer, leaner looks.  The term "British" has been coined by a couple of marketing specialists at WildRose and Duckhill kennels in an attempt to sell puppies and a positive only approach to training...for a lot more money. American or British only refers to the dogs country of origin not to the dogs conformation.
> What you see is the "bench", "show", or "conformation" lines with a tendancy to be shorter, FATTER, and blockier in the face.
> "Field" dogs tend to be longer in the leg...
> If its a hunting dog you seek then forget all this british/american garbage and buy a pup out of the best breeding you can possibly afford.  Look at HT and FT titles in EVERY generation...NOT which side of the pond someone claims the litter comes from.


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## steelshotslayer (Jan 14, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!
> There is ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, NO SUCH THING AS A "BRITISH" LAB.  Unless you actually import him from England...and then it has NOTHING to do with the way the dog looks. There are labs with blockier heads and dogs with narrower snouts.  There are dogs with shorter stockier builds and some with longer, leaner looks.  The term "British" has been coined by a couple of marketing specialists at WildRose and Duckhill kennels in an attempt to sell puppies and a positive only approach to training...for a lot more money. American or British only refers to the dogs country of origin not to the dogs conformation.
> What you see is the "bench", "show", or "conformation" lines with a tendancy to be shorter, FATTER, and blockier in the face.
> "Field" dogs tend to be longer in the leg...
> If its a hunting dog you seek then forget all this british/american garbage and buy a pup out of the best breeding you can possibly afford.  Look at HT and FT titles in EVERY generation...NOT which side of the pond someone claims the litter comes from.



I see your point, but just because its not recognized by the AKC doesn't mean there is a noticeable difference between the "types".  By your point the "silver" lab is technically a chocolate because AKC doesn't recognize silver as a color yet there is a very distinguishable difference between the two.


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## Blindside (Jan 14, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!
> There is ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, NO SUCH THING AS A "BRITISH" LAB.  Unless you actually import him from England...and then it has NOTHING to do with the way the dog looks. There are labs with blockier heads and dogs with narrower snouts.  There are dogs with shorter stockier builds and some with longer, leaner looks.  The term "British" has been coined by a couple of marketing specialists at WildRose and Duckhill kennels in an attempt to sell puppies and a positive only approach to training...for a lot more money. American or British only refers to the dogs country of origin not to the dogs conformation.
> What you see is the "bench", "show", or "conformation" lines with a tendancy to be shorter, FATTER, and blockier in the face.
> "Field" dogs tend to be longer in the leg...
> If its a hunting dog you seek then forget all this british/american garbage and buy a pup out of the best breeding you can possibly afford.  Look at HT and FT titles in EVERY generation...NOT which side of the pond someone claims the litter comes from.


Very well said unlike the others. Robert Milner is the biggest joke in the retriever world.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 14, 2014)

steelshotslayer said:


> I see your point, but just because its not recognized by the AKC doesn't mean there is a noticeable difference between the "types".  By your point the "silver" lab is technically a chocolate because AKC doesn't recognize silver as a color yet there is a very distinguishable difference between the two.



NO, NO, NO.  You are saying there are 2 types of labs...American and British.  Well what about Venezualian, Mexican, Spanish, Canadian, German, and even Scottish labs??  You are falsely labeling a body type.  Again, labs are labs...some have different conformation from others but thats NOT what makes a dog British or American.  By your definition any dog with a blocky head or short legs is british...wrong! And, what is not recognized by the AKC??  What is there to not be recognized??  Call them show dogs, bench dogs, conformation dogs but that dont make em british.  Why is this so hard??Just because a dog is leggier and runs field trials dont make him american...
I dont get it...


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## steelshotslayer (Jan 14, 2014)

The term American and British has been coined as you said by marketing specialists.  Its pretty much another way of saying "field" line or "show" line.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 14, 2014)

Then why not call them what they are?? Field or conformation? Why misuse a term because some money hungry puppy mill does??


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## bander_TC50 (Jan 15, 2014)

listen to joe or killer, their is no substitute for experience with labs and these guys have a ton of it. if you want a good dog, pick their brains on what to look for and dont get hung up in the marketing trap. certified hips, and such!


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## strutlife (Jan 15, 2014)

I have an "English/british" bloodline choclate lab and he is by far totally different looking than an "American" bloodline lab. Big block head, short snout, broad chested and shouldered and also a little shorter in legs. Paid $250.00 for him and he is a beauty.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 15, 2014)

strutlife said:


> I have an "English/british" bloodline choclate lab and he is by far totally different looking than an "American" bloodline lab. Big block head, short snout, broad chested and shouldered and also a little shorter in legs. Paid $250.00 for him and he is a beauty.


Please post his pedigree


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## tradhunter98 (Jan 15, 2014)

I'm a drathaar man, look at them, we retrieve , run rabbits, point woodcock, and bloodtack deer. But don't get me wrong labs are great dogs too.


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## Tag-a-long (Jan 15, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> Please post his pedigree



You wouldn't understand it Joe, it's written in the King's English.   I prefer to buy American when I can so I got the long & lean variety.  He's got a little "Made in the USA" label on the underside of his left ear.


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## Dustin Pate (Jan 15, 2014)

steelshotslayer said:


> By your point the "silver" lab is technically a chocolate because AKC doesn't recognize silver as a color yet there is a very distinguishable difference between the two.



There is some very sound science that says the "silver" is a product of past breeding of a Weimaraner to a Labrador.


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## northgeorgiasportsman (Jan 15, 2014)

Dustin Pate said:


> There is some very sound science that says the "silver" is a product of past breeding of a Weimaraner to a Labrador.



Well it made a gorgeous dog.


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## ghadarits (Jan 15, 2014)

*When picking a dog*

I wouldn’t worry about the American or British tag I would be looking for a dog who has parents that are good hunters. I got my Lab from a guy that I hunted with. His dogs were jam up so after we hunted I asked him to let me know if he ever had a litter so I could get one of them. That was the best thing I could have done. 

My dog Oolie isn’t the smartest but I'd have something to say to you if you were to say that. She isn’t the biggest Lab but that’s not what I wanted, what she is is a great family pet and hunting dog that lives to get birds and that’s what I wanted. She’s small so seeing her drag a big ol goose in is kind of funny but she does it and wants to go back for more. I think that’s what everyone wants in their hunting partner. 

The pic was on one of the really cold days last week and I only shot one bird. I wasn’t sure if Oolie would go in after it when I gave her the command but she did it without hesitating. Out of over 30 retrieves so far this year that was the one that made me the proudest of her because you can’t see it in the picture but here was ice all over her vest. The pic was taken an hour after the retrieve.


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## mikeys250 (Jan 15, 2014)

If you want a true American lab find on that is overweight and lazy. You probably don't want that cause its not gonna want to go to work.


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## Brad30110 (Jan 15, 2014)

While everyone is arguing about labs check out Boykin Spaniels. They are the dog that won't rock the boat. Bred in South Carolina for Swamp duck hunting! Very pretty handsome dogs. Smaller than a lab but five times the stamina. Great dogs!


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## ADDICTED2HUNTIN (Jan 15, 2014)

Or look at the chessie!


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## mikeys250 (Jan 15, 2014)

ADDICTED2HUNTIN said:


> Or look at the chessie!



If I hadn't been given a lab I would have gotten a chessie


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

*English lab*

A good dog is a good dog. Does not matter what breed of retreiver you have. If he works for you great. But as far as English labs or American labs. No such thing. Read the breed standard. Show dog breeders, breed for the standard. http://www.akc.org/breeds/labrador_retriever/index.cfm    Fld trial and hunt test dogs are bred for performance. Now that being said you can have both. The kennel club ( The Stud Book for Great Brititan) and the AKC Stud book,  accept each others registration as does the CKC. Many dogs that run U.S. Fld trials also run Fld tirals in Canada. Go and learn something about the dog sports.  AKC and The UKC are U.S.stud books http://www.ukcdogs.com/Web.nsf/ /GunDog/LabradorRetriever06232004 . The kennel CluB http://www.thelabradorretrieverclub.com/  The CKC http://www.canadasguidetodogs.com/retrieverlab.htm  ,http://www.fci.be/uploaded_files/Lette r%20of%20understanding%20FCI_AKC_16072008.pdf  ,http://www.fci.be/uploaded_files/CKC-FCI.pdf , http://www.fci.be/uploaded_files/Accord Kennel Club, May 2009_2pages.pdf  , Here are the  communications between kennel clubs. Now show me where you see English Lab or American lab or for that matter a Canadian Lab.


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## quacktastic (Jan 15, 2014)

Most of the advice on here is garbage.  As some other have said...look for dogs with a good pedigree.  If you can, go watch the parents work.  And don't pay attention to the purchase price of a dog if your wanting to stack the chips in your favor towards a good hunting dog.  The purchase price is the cheapest part of owning one.


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

quacktastic said:


> most of the advice on here is garbage.  As some other have said...look for dogs with a good pedigree.  If you can, go watch the parents work.  And don't pay attention to the purchase price of a dog if your wanting to stack the chips in your favor towards a good hunting dog.  The purchase price is the cheapest part of owning one.


 x2x2x2


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

mikeys250 said:


> If you want a true American lab find on that is overweight and lazy. You probably don't want that cause its not gonna want to go to work.


 Breed 108 Labrador retreiver. These were all born in Georgia.


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## Tag-a-long (Jan 15, 2014)

killer elite said:


> Breed 108 Labrador retreiver. These were all born in Georgia.



Oh my gosh ... as long as you've had this pic I never knew there was a 4th dog in there!   All you can see is a tongue.  Look at the muscles on that yellow on the right.  Is that a male or female?


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

San Joaquin Annie. Guess who her daddy was. That is a very old picture as you well know I ran my last trial about 1990
 They yellows were  males Father and son. The center yellow was a Candlewoods Mad mouse puppy and the younger yellow was the first AKC master hunter to come out of the CSRA. Correction flip the yellows


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## Joe Overby (Jan 15, 2014)

killer elite said:


> San Joaquin Annie. Guess who her daddy was. That is a very old picture as you well know I ran my last trial about 1990
> They yellows were  males Father and son. The center yellow was a Mad mouse puppy and the younger yellow was the first AKC master hunter to come out of the CSRA. Correction flip the yellows



Would that be Honcho by chance???


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> Would that be Honcho by chance???


  Yes sir.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 15, 2014)

quacktastic said:


> Most of the advice on here is garbage.  As some other have said...look for dogs with a good pedigree.  If you can, go watch the parents work.  And don't pay attention to the purchase price of a dog if your wanting to stack the chips in your favor towards a good hunting dog.  The purchase price is the cheapest part of owning one.



PROPHETIC!!!!!!!  If you listen to anything on this thread...please, PLEASE, PLEEEEAAASSSSSEEEEEE listen to this.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 15, 2014)

killer elite said:


> Yes sir.



Shes built like her daddy...absolutely beautiful.  British or American??  I mean, shes short and stocky and has a blocky head but she was born here and her parents do field work but she has good conformation...im so darn confused!!


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

You know Joe all these folks that have videos out on how to train dogs. I knew all of them. I was at the Fld trials before we had hunt test. I was a NAHRA judge that had a NARHA and AKC rule book before they broke up. The UKC was not even on the Atlantic seaboard at that time. I was Hugh Arthur's bird boy. I help train the only Flat coat to ever become an AFC.


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## Tag-a-long (Jan 15, 2014)

killer elite said:


> San Joaquin Annie. Guess who her daddy was. That is a very old picture as you well know I ran my last trial about 1990
> They yellows were  males Father and son. The center yellow was a Mad mouse puppy and the younger yellow was the first AKC master hunter to come out of the CSRA. Correction flip the yellows



So Annie was the black on the upper right?  The center yellow is the one I was talking about being muscular.  Not to hijack the OP's thread but I'd love to hear about them some time.  I don't see any orange in that collection of ribbons.


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

Back in those days the ribbons were camo orange came on later.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 15, 2014)

Thats cause Killer didnt run master tests...he ran field trials...

And Honcho was built like a brick house...


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

I ran hunt test to but after those pictures were taken. One of the first hunt test I ran Richard Walters was the judge.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 15, 2014)

I was just pickin at ya a little Killer!!


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

I am still looking for that english lab.  So i can use my gold A180 tritronics collar that is in a green box.


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## king killer delete (Jan 15, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> I was just pickin at ya a little Killer!!


 I know . You gota know I was the guy that threw all the no birds in the third series of the 1985 national Retreiver Championship. They talked bad about me in the Retreiver Fld trial news. I think that was before they renamed the Magazine to the retreiver news.


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## krazybronco2 (Jan 15, 2014)

im lost who is Honcho?

also i dont care how many no birds you threw i will could use a bird boy so come up to augusta throw some birds and tell me stories of the good old days haha! might could even take you to some training grounds that hugh used to use. (train there about once a week)


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## Tag-a-long (Jan 15, 2014)

krazybronco2 said:


> im lost who is Honcho?



You're much too YOUNG to know about him!  Google "San Joaquin Honcho"

http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=169

Edit:  Jeez Ben, looking at that link he probably died before you were even BORN!


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## creekrocket (Jan 16, 2014)

I've got a pup I need training James... Care to wet your feet again?


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## Joe Overby (Jan 16, 2014)

Ben, Google San Joaquin Honcho story and read parts one and two written by Dr aycock...its a pretty good read albeit short.


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## cocdawg (Jan 16, 2014)

This is good reading between you three. Why don't y'all start a thread and tell us all some of the FT/HT stories you've encountered through the years. Stories about y'all, the dogs, test/trials, people you've trained with, etc., etc.


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## krazybronco2 (Jan 16, 2014)

Tag-a-long said:


> You're much too YOUNG to know about him!  Google "San Joaquin Honcho"
> 
> http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=169
> 
> Edit:  Jeez Ben, looking at that link he probably died before you were even BORN!



i was almost a year old when Honcho passed. and word on the street is you might be coming to linconton next thursday.


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## krazybronco2 (Jan 16, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> Ben, Google San Joaquin Honcho story and read parts one and two written by Dr aycock...its a pretty good read albeit short.



really good read and thanks.


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## padkisson (Jan 16, 2014)

Just got Lil Rhetta. Born and bred here in GA.


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## padkisson (Jan 16, 2014)

Joe Overby said:


> WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!
> There is ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, NO SUCH THING AS A "BRITISH" LAB.  Unless you actually import him from England...and then it has NOTHING to do with the way the dog looks. There are labs with blockier heads and dogs with narrower snouts.  There are dogs with shorter stockier builds and some with longer, leaner looks.  The term "British" has been coined by a couple of marketing specialists at WildRose and Duckhill kennels in an attempt to sell puppies and a positive only approach to training...for a lot more money. American or British only refers to the dogs country of origin not to the dogs conformation.
> What you see is the "bench", "show", or "conformation" lines with a tendancy to be shorter, FATTER, and blockier in the face.
> "Field" dogs tend to be longer in the leg...
> If its a hunting dog you seek then forget all this british/american garbage and buy a pup out of the best breeding you can possibly afford.  Look at HT and FT titles in EVERY generation...NOT which side of the pond someone claims the litter comes from.



This guy is on the money.


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## king killer delete (Jan 16, 2014)

creekrocket said:


> I've got a pup I need training James... Care to wet your feet again?


You just be at the ramp Sunday morning or I will use my collar on you Captain. fetch fetch drop.


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## creekrocket (Jan 16, 2014)

Hope you have your game face on...


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## Tag-a-long (Jan 16, 2014)

krazybronco2 said:


> i was almost a year old when Honcho passed. and word on the street is you might be coming to linconton next thursday.



I heard you were up there today.  Thanks for the head's up there buddy! Tell me you didn't put Bell in the water this morning.  

Don't know that it'll be next Thursday but I'd definitely like to spend some time up before Mason goes back to the kennel.  You gonna be in Waynesboro Saturday?


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## king killer delete (Jan 16, 2014)

Tag-a-long said:


> I heard you were up there today.  Thanks for the head's up there buddy! Tell me you didn't put Bell in the water this morning.
> 
> Don't know that it'll be next Thursday but I'd definitely like to spend some time up before Mason goes back to the kennel.  You gonna be in Waynesboro Saturday?



How many derby points does your puppy have?


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## king killer delete (Jan 16, 2014)

creekrocket said:


> Hope you have your game face on...



Guess will be up the creek then


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## krazybronco2 (Jan 16, 2014)

Tag-a-long said:


> I heard you were up there today.  Thanks for the head's up there buddy! Tell me you didn't put Bell in the water this morning.
> 
> Don't know that it'll be next Thursday but I'd definitely like to spend some time up before Mason goes back to the kennel.  You gonna be in Waynesboro Saturday?



yes will be there saturday, yes was there today really nice to run a couple of set ups quickly, and yes Belle went in the water today. Gina was kinda concerned as well but belle is used to cold water from hunting and when we go scouting she will play in the water on the way back in. but she just picked up 4 bumpers, got a happy bumper to dry her off some, then toweled dry and then back into the warm car. the whole time tail wagging and launching into the water.

but i will talk to you sat about trying to get up there since my scheduale is pretty nice right now to be able to train in the mornings.


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## Tag-a-long (Jan 16, 2014)

killer elite said:


> How many derby points does your puppy have?



He's got 5.  And that's what we'll age out with; he turns two on Sunday.  I'm entered in the double in TX this weekend but we decided to scratch.  It was a long trip that would have been more for my pride than the good of the dog.  There were 43 dogs entered and Danny Farmer & Judy Aycock have a pair of Ali litter-mates entered that are just burning up the field!  I would have enjoyed the chance to line up against them no matter how we did.  

James, I've never been a competitive person and I always said I wasn't a "field trial kinda girl" but that was the most fun thing I've ever done!  I don't know if it will be this one but I'm gonna have me a trial dog one of these days.


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## king killer delete (Jan 16, 2014)

Tag-a-long said:


> He's got 5.  And that's what we'll age out with; he turns two on Sunday.  I'm entered in the double in TX this weekend but we decided to scratch.  It was a long trip that would have been more for my pride than the good of the dog.  There were 43 dogs entered and Danny Farmer & Judy Aycock have a pair of Ali litter-mates entered that are just burning up the field!  I would have enjoyed the chance to line up against them no matter how we did.
> 
> James, I've never been a competitive person and I always said I wasn't a "field trial kinda girl" but that was the most fun thing I've ever done!  I don't know if it will be this one but I'm gonna have me a trial dog one of these days.


Just proves what I have said in the past. You do not know until you try. You will be wearing a white coat and tight black gloves soon.


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## Scottyhardison (Jan 17, 2014)

N GA Beagle, so are you completely confused yet? I am after reading all the replies and I'm aware of the differences. I'm going to attempt to help you out in a way to simplify your search for a good retriever. Your question was the difference between English and American Labradors without one mention of the British/Irish lines. Joe was right when he said labs were labs, but that does not mean these "coined phrases" don't have a meaning behind them. The term "English" lab means absolutely nothing across the pond. What you will hear instead is the reference toward field or conformation breed. "English" has taken on many meanings here in the states but it started when American standards were slightly altered from that of English Standards for comformation to be slightly better suited for the field bred dog to compete in the ring as well. Just look up the number one best in breed comformation labrador in America and the do the same for England, there is a noticeable difference. The term "English" is more often than not used in the states to describe a comformation or as Joe said bench bred Labrador. 

Ok, now that we've covered that. The term "British" has absolutely nothing to do with the term "English", but rather it is more of a reference to what traits the "british" breeders have bred for. Notice I said "traits" not looks or conformation, although usually smaller and more closely resembling the standard as it is written this is not what it refers to.  A "British" bred lab is 
usually a calmer, softer dog yet bred to be very forgiven and yes does respond to gentler hand better than that of force and negative stim. Usually a welcome addition to being a member of any family and sound enough to do any field work necessary. Some draw backs for some can be a lack in drive or too soft for a more commanding styled trainer. 

Now some have said buy the best you can afford and pedigrre/blood is what you need to look for. I agree but for different reasons. Ask yourself this what are you looking for out of your working companion? Someone looking for a family pet/gun dog retriever that is planning on training himself as a first time trainer through the aid of a DVD set and maybe the help of a buddy or two would have their hands full and with a solid proven Field Trial bred puppy it would simply be more dog than needed and unless the time was there to work and run the dog properly could be a disaster waiting to happen. A good HT bred dog with a calm deminor is just a much better fit for the individual described above. 

My advise, google HRC Hunt Test in Georgia. Find all the web pages for the several clubs we have and contact the club president and ask him to point you in the right direction. Do this with all the clubs. Contact every number given, be honest about what your looking for, and take the advice of the one you feel most confident about. If someone comes off cocky or arrogant, trust me it's a pretty good sign that what they have to say is pretty much "grain of salt". Remember well bred can mean several things and I agree that breeding helps up the odds just make sure that the breeding fits your needs. No one needs a race horse to pull a plow or ride a trail in fact a good quarter horse is much better served in that job. 

I hope this helps and good luck.


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## Joe Overby (Jan 17, 2014)

That might be your best post yet Scotty.


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## bander_TC50 (Jan 17, 2014)

this is a great thread!! i have learned allot, thanks joe, scott, killer and the rest for all the info. i hope the OP got as much out of it as i have!


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## king killer delete (Jan 17, 2014)

*Outstanding Post*



Scottyhardison said:


> N GA Beagle, so are you completely confused yet? I am after reading all the replies and I'm aware of the differences. I'm going to attempt to help you out in a way to simplify your search for a good retriever. Your question was the difference between English and American Labradors without one mention of the British/Irish lines. Joe was right when he said labs were labs, but that does not mean these "coined phrases" don't have a meaning behind them. The term "English" lab means absolutely nothing across the pond. What you will hear instead is the reference toward field or conformation breed. "English" has taken on many meanings here in the states but it started when American standards were slightly altered from that of English Standards for comformation to be slightly better suited for the field bred dog to compete in the ring as well. Just look up the number one best in breed comformation labrador in America and the do the same for England, there is a noticeable difference. The term "English" is more often than not used in the states to describe a comformation or as Joe said bench bred Labrador.
> 
> Ok, now that we've covered that. The term "British" has absolutely nothing to do with the term "English", but rather it is more of a reference to what traits the "british" breeders have bred for. Notice I said "traits" not looks or conformation, although usually smaller and more closely resembling the standard as it is written this is not what it refers to.  A "British" bred lab is
> usually a calmer, softer dog yet bred to be very forgiven and yes does respond to gentler hand better than that of force and negative stim. Usually a welcome addition to being a member of any family and sound enough to do any field work necessary. Some draw backs for some can be a lack in drive or too soft for a more commanding styled trainer.
> ...


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