# Hunting Hogs with Dogs Unethical??



## Mossy0ak270 (May 21, 2005)

I was at the tire store today and while waiting was halfway watching their t.v. and a news commercial came on talking about a segment they done on this, but I missed what night it was gonna be on. It was Channel 2 news. It showed dogs runnin hogs in pens, so I don't know if they are talkin about that or out hunting in general. Either way I'm hopin to catch this.


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## Arrow3 (May 21, 2005)

I don't think it is....Especially out in the wild...Ive only hunted with dogs a couple of times but neither time we had any luck....Ive had more luck trapping and stalking...


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## Handgunner (May 21, 2005)

I don't see it being any worse than running squirrels, rabbits, coons, or birds with dogs...


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## leo (May 21, 2005)

*I saw a lead into the story*

on ch 2 this afternoon, but I was under the impression the story was about about dogs and hogs in a pen for "sport", the pic they showed was not hunting but more like fighting


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## Handgunner (May 21, 2005)

Now we didn't expect them to shine the WHOLE light on it, did we?


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## Arrow3 (May 21, 2005)

You don't think the media would turn things around do you????


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## DanTroop2000 (May 21, 2005)

On the news monday night chan 2


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## bull0ne (May 21, 2005)

Likely about ''bay pens'' where dogs are judged how good they can bay a hog, no catching allowed.

Fla. already outlawed it so some of the  hog hunters started having them on indain reservatations.


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## bilbones (May 22, 2005)

*Antis at work on channel two*

The bay pen story is supposed to be shown on wsb(I think) Monday at 5:00.This will not be a pro hunter story. Hogs can tear each other up worse than dogs. If you have a catch or bay dog you have to train him somehow.


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## j_seph (May 22, 2005)

*Disagree w/ news*

Monday at 5pm Channel 2 investigates dogs fighting hogs in a ring for sport! 

To me this would be no diffrent than sanctuned coon hunts, rabbit dog trials.
It seems to me that at least this way the hogs can be gotten off the dog before it(dog) is harmed. However I guess until we see the special we don't really know for sure if it is some sort of dog trial scnerio or if it is like dog fighting


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## Davexx1 (May 23, 2005)

In all probability the show is detailing the activities of an organized "Bay Pen" competition and not actual hunting in the wilds.

First, let's define a bay dog and catch dog.  A bay dog trails up and finds the hog, then stops him, and tries to keep him in one place not allowing him to run.  They do this by crowding the hog barking and carrying on.  Hogs are very aggressive by nature and will fight the dog trying to rip him up with their tusks.  If the hog turns to run many bay dogs will snap at his hind legs which will make the hog immediately stop and turn to fight.  The hogs stops and spins to fight the dog, the dog backs up and barks continuously.  That is a bay dog.

A catch dog is just that, a dog that will actually run in and catch the hog.  These dogs usually grab the hog by the thick cartilidge at the base of the ear but can will catch other parts.  His job is to catch the hog and not let go.  When the catch dog has the hog caught, the hunter or handler usually runs in and grabs the hog by the hind legs and flips him off his feet where the hog can be tied up.  The catch dog is then removed.  These are usually bulldogs or bulldog/cur dog crosses that have strong jaws with a strong relentless bite.

Essentially a bay pen competition is a points contest on how well a trained "baydog" can keep a big agressive hog at bay.  There are usually three judges that watch your dog work the hog and they award points for this and take away points for that.  The job of the dog is to stop the hog and keep him in one location.  If the hog runs at will that is not good.  If the dog turns away or runs from the hog that is not good.  Points are deducted for both.

If the dog stops the hog and stays in his face so to speak barking every breath forcing the hog to face him head on the judges award points.  If the hog tries to run and the dog cuts him off and makes him stop and/or spin to face the dog, the judges award points.  30 points is a perfect score.

These are timed events and the dog has either two or three minutes.  If the dog catches the hog and holds him for greater than 5 seconds i.e. "catch out", he is disqualified.

There are a few bay pen operators that were starting to have catch and tie contests where two handlers and a catch dog teamed up to catch and tie the hog, again a timed event.  Fastest team wins.  These could be brutal because the hogs in many of these bay pens were NOT fresh out of the wilds and had lost much of their fight and agressiveness.  These "catch" contests have recently become under the scrutiny of animal activists and law enforcement and are being banned and operators prosecuted.

Hope this helps.

Dave1


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## Jesse James (May 23, 2005)

Bay pens have been in the hot seat for a long time, most pens are trying to keep aggressive dogs out when possible. The object for the dog to do is control the hog with out chewing him up. Some folks can`t hunt so to get involed in the hog dog stuff they run bay pens, thats fine by me. The woods dogs are a whole differant dog than a bay pen dog, I got no problem hunting hogs with dogs. Me & the fellas catch plenty hogs, some nights we catch nothing but thats hog hunting. A few pens have done things that were not so good and did not help the sport. The media will always show bad before good, thats the way to keep ratings. They don`t show the fella that raised his dog from a pup, fed him well kept up his shots. Took lots of time to train & handle this dog, put lots of money into him. Keeps a vest & collar on him and has taken time to learn to sow up minor cuts. My hat goes off to that fella, the media is alwyas looking to make anything bad. This is the USA so they can do that, there are alot of bay pens that test their hogs. Keep a vet close at shows and if your dog was to get hurt some of the folks you see walking around, would be some of the many that would help you get your dog fixed back up. Just the way I see it.


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## DanTroop2000 (May 23, 2005)

chan 2 said it would be on tuesday night


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## leo (May 23, 2005)

*It was on the 5pm news on 2*

It is apparently a "bay pen" as described in this thread, and the the reason it was aired is the anti's are involved and stating that it is cruel to the hog.

They showed the bay dogs that were described by Jesse and Davexx1 in their posts. 

They also showed dogs that latched on to the hog and the handlers immediately went in and tried to get them to let go, it was difficult to get one of the dogs they showed to release the hog.

They were also comments about legislation that is supposedly coming up next session about this.


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## hawg dawg (May 23, 2005)

*hog hunter*

fellas ,hog hunting is my passion .I have to earn the right to take a hog , we cross creeks ,swim creeks crawl into the thickest briars you could imagine we walk all day in search for him sometimes he is just better than us. it is something I love. my dogs are part of my family my kids help raise puppies , feed and take general care of them . this has shown my kids love, respect and honor for the dogs. I look at the wild boar with great respect he is truley an awsome creature untill you have looked at him face to face you have no idea what i mean.I am a hog hunter. dont get me confused with what you see on tv thanks scott.


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## Ga-Spur (May 23, 2005)

hawg dawg we are going to fight for your right to hunt hogs with dogs . Sounds like ya'll got it going good.


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## hawg dawg (May 23, 2005)

thank you!


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## Jesse James (May 24, 2005)

I`m with ya hawg dawg, that looking in the face to face can get sticky sometimes. I love to hunt hogs and will keep on.


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## Mossy0ak270 (May 24, 2005)

hawg dawg, you don't have to worry about that! I don't even hunt hogs, although I want too, and I'll be right beside ya fightin for our rights!


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## sr.corndog (May 29, 2005)

*Hunting Hogs with dogs!*

I enjoy Hog trials it allow me time to visit with other Hog Doggers and learn my skill better it also allow a place for Hog Doggers to trade dogs and purchase a better dogs. I hope this bill never passes if it does then look out for any other dog trials in the state there closure will be next. 
This is my 2 cents KEEP ON HOG DOGIN IT IS A REAL SPORT!
Corndog a catahoula owner and hog dogger!


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## CAL (May 29, 2005)

IMO it just ain't no way to dispose of a wild hog unethical!


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## Jesse James (Jun 3, 2005)

*Bay pen field trial dogs!!1*

Here are a couple of my pen dogs at Uncle Earls 2001 in Louisiana, this trial last 4 days and some of the best pen dogs in the US.


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## coon dawg (Jun 3, 2005)

*just a little side info..............*

 .........we used to be able to hold treeing contests in Georgia at our coon dog clubs...............coon was in a metal cage...........never touched......dogs were released one at a time, AFTER the coon cage was hoisted up a tree............number of barks a dog made in 30 seconds was counted as the score.........charged a 3 dollar entry fee, gave out 2 trophies..............the clubs made some money...................humane-iacs put a little heat on the DNR, and they immediately caved and said we could not do it anymore   .....................I support ya'all hog hunters 200%!!!


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## leadoff (Jun 3, 2005)

hawg dawg said:
			
		

> fellas ,hog hunting is my passion .I have to earn the right to take a hog , we cross creeks ,swim creeks crawl into the thickest briars you could imagine we walk all day in search for him sometimes he is just better than us. it is something I love. my dogs are part of my family my kids help raise puppies , feed and take general care of them . this has shown my kids love, respect and honor for the dogs. I look at the wild boar with great respect he is truley an awsome creature untill you have looked at him face to face you have no idea what i mean.I am a hog hunter. dont get me confused with what you see on tv thanks scott.



We're with you 100%, hawg dawg!!!  A friend that I play softball with hunts hog.  He sounds like you...when he's not working or playing softball, he is chasing hogs!


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## frankwright (Jun 3, 2005)

I don't see the hog pen deal as any worse than boxing or professional wrestling.

I have never understood why some people make it their life's work to try to stop people from doing what they want just because that person does not like it.

I support any dog hunting you want to do. I have never done it and really don't want to but that is not an issue. I do want to hunt hogs but I would prefer treestand or stalking but that is just my thing. You are entitled to yours as well! Good Hunting!


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## GeauxLSU (Jun 3, 2005)

I can see why people have a problem with CATCH dogs in a pen.  If the BAY dog is doing what he's supposed to do, then I can STILL why it would bother SOME people, but not I.  
Pitting animals to fight (no matter how 'natural' the instinct) in an ARTIFICIAL enviornment, is begging for resentment from non-hunters.  Ever been to a dog fight or a chicken fight?  
I've got no issue with running hogs with bay dogs, especially when hunting.  Sounds like a blast.  
Catch dogs admitedly bother me a bit.  Would I vote against it?  Never.  But I can see how it's a practice, like many others, that leaves a bad taste in non-hunter's mouths.  
We hunters have a unique relationship with our hunting dogs.  Tend to put a different value on them (compared to most all other animals).  Remember, some folks look in that pen and see two animals of EQUAL  value.  Save your breath trying to win that debate.  
In the mean time, enjoy your sport.  Please continue to do it as ethically as you know how and most definitely, enjoy the sausage!   
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## GeauxLSU (Jun 3, 2005)

frankwright said:
			
		

> I don't see the hog pen deal as any worse than boxing or professional wrestling.


Frank,
Those boxers ASKED to go in the ring.  I know some folks believe their dogs want in the ring (and they probably do) but I doubt the hog has the same affinity for it.    
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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