# fish kill in the Ogeechee?



## sleepindawg

I heard there was a sizable fish kill in the Ogeechee River above 301 bridge sometime Friday or Saturday.  The DNR was supposedly investigating.   A friend of mine told me he saw "several hundred" fish of all species dead around Bulloch Sportman's Club landing and above and also said people in some other boats said"all the fish are dead up there" when they were returning to the landing.  Anyone have any info as to size of the kill or its source?


----------



## albrown100

Havent heard anything about a fish kill , but am very interested in it seeing how this is where I fish in the Ogeechee River . I will do some asking around , suppose to work on D N R officers personal truck next week  at Ford Dealer I work at, I will ask him maybe he knows something about it


----------



## sleepindawg

I fished there Thursday and was as disappointed as I've ever been... We did very poorly until we got way up into the Jones Lane water.  My partner returned either Friday or Saturday morning and said he saw a LOT of dead fish of all kinds except gar, which seemed to be not impacted.  People were coming back from fishing early pretty disgusted.  He said "people" were taking water samples.  Whether he meant DNR or someone else I don't know.  I plan to call DNR and Riverkeeper tomorrow to try to find out something.


----------



## SASS249

Yes there is a major fish kill occurring on the Ogeechee.  DNR wildlife resources and EPD are there along with federal EPA.  Water samples are bring taken but results will take time.

Right now there is not much info on possible causes.


----------



## dannyoneal68

I fished around oliver bridge yesterday and saw some dead Redbreasts. And a dying Catfish that was tore up really bad. I sure hope it's nothing serious.


----------



## dannyoneal68

I just Emailed the DNR about it. We'll see what they have to say. I'm scared to eat the fish I have in my fridge now.


----------



## jabb06

I just returned from Williams landing & there are dead fish every where.It does seem that gar are the only ones that havent been affected by this.I did manage in 3 hours to catch one stump knocker.I hope DNR finds out what this is.There was prolly 30 people swimming at the landing.I hope its not hazzardous to humans.


----------



## radams1228

Saw some other comments about this from friends on another site.  VERY interested to know what's going on. I caught some on Wednesday at Millen bridge..... kinda wondering whether I need to keep them or not.


----------



## slab_slayer

I have seen them too, at Oliver bridge yesterday afternoon.  Didnt see any at Morgans bridge today.


----------



## slab_slayer

The river also had a weird smell yesterday afternoon.


----------



## slab_slayer

sleepindawg said:


> I fished there Thursday and was as disappointed as I've ever been... We did very poorly until we got way up into the Jones Lane water.  My partner returned either Friday or Saturday morning and said he saw a LOT of dead fish of all kinds except gar, which seemed to be not impacted.  People were coming back from fishing early pretty disgusted.  He said "people" were taking water samples.  Whether he meant DNR or someone else I don't know.  I plan to call DNR and Riverkeeper tomorrow to try to find out something.



Them boys get mad as fire seeing strangers up around " THEIR " water! LOL!!  I run up there from 301 and got questioned one time as to who I was, and if I was a member.  Said nope, I ran up from 301, boy was he mad!!


----------



## dannyoneal68

Just found this. http://savannahnow.com/latest-news/2011-05-22/residents-advised-not-swim-consume-fish-ogeechee-river


----------



## croaker

No dead fish at Rocky Ford or Jones Landing this afternoon.  Dead fish at Hwy 301 and Bulloch Co. Wildlife Club...


----------



## wilber85

Wow this is terrible news.  Used to have a blast down there.


----------



## danbo

No dead fish at Midville or Millen Friday. We went Wednesday also and did not see any signs. Fish were biting Wed but not too good on Friday.

My friend went today at Williams Landing and said he had never seen so many red breast at one time----all dead. He said he saw no gar or catfish floating but everything else dead.


----------



## ROAM

went to william's landing Sat and a fella told me about the dead fish as he was leaving. I took his word and went ahead and headed up to scarboro landing.  Didn't see any fish kills up there.  Didn't really catch any either though, but with me that doesn't necessarily mean anything.  I'm glad they are checking up on it, it will be interesting to see what develops.


----------



## j_seph

This Sux


----------



## jabb06

this forum is great...we get alerted to trouble on here before the authorities tell us anything about it.I just hope me & my kids dont grow some extra toes or worse bcuz of this crap...we were swimming at williams landing yesterday


----------



## slab_slayer

This is bad!!


----------



## sleepindawg

Fish are fine at Jones Lane's Landing and above but dead at Bulloch Sportsmens Club and below...hmmmm.  Wonder if it has something to do with that "artesian" that boils up into the river a couple of miles above 301.  If so,  I'm not sure they'll be able to keep it  under a barrel this time.


----------



## slab_slayer

sleepindawg said:


> Fish are fine at Jones Lane's Landing and above but dead at Bulloch Sportsmens Club and below...hmmmm.  Wonder if it has something to do with that "artesian" that boils up into the river a couple of miles above 301.  If so,  I'm not sure they'll be able to keep it  under a barrel this time.



I know right where you are talking about!!  I bet it has something to do with it.


----------



## sleepindawg

Apparently DNR posted notices at all landings by this afternoon...however,  Riverkeeper tells me that dead fish have been found up to the discharge pipe but not above.


----------



## purvis1012

cant really say my scources so i dont get anyone in trouble but ive been told it was a textile mill near the river


----------



## dannyoneal68

King finishing?


----------



## purvis1012

yeah


----------



## danbo

http://www.kamfin.com/index_files/Page485.htm


----------



## bassin billy

Wow - this sucks to hear!! Hopefully whoever is responsible will not only have to clean the river, pay a huge fine, and restock a LARGE number of native fish back into the river!!


----------



## radams1228

dannyoneal68 said:


> King finishing?



That's what I heard too.


----------



## Gutbucket

Yep,    I keep hearing King Finishing to. Im sure the EPA etal. are asking them if they know whats goin on. Problem is, they are a little to late. One would think they would check on stuff like this BEFORE they dump in the river


----------



## Hut2

Hate this for the river & the folks who go there. 
Never been there but, I always check out the redbreast threads on here. Beautiful fish!


----------



## Cletus T.

I hate to hear about this…..sad…sad….sad!  Hopefully they find out who is responsible and make them pay.  No excuse for something like this happening!


----------



## panoz11

just left from stealbridge on hwy 119 in effingham county . the us epa was down there with 4 other trucks taking samples . they said this thing stretches over 35-40 miles of river .this really sucks bad . and just think they want to put more factories on this river ...


----------



## simpleman30

one of my coworkers leases hunting land on the ogeechee just down river from this place.  he said the same thing as a few folks earlier... no dead fish above this plant but plenty of dead fish downstream.  supposedly, DNR has closed all public boat ramps and has asked that no one swim or eat any fish from the river until they can figure it all out.


----------



## slab_slayer

Someone will more than likley try to cover some of this up.  But if fish at the sportsman's club is dead, and fish at Jones Lane ramp are ok, it really points to one thing.  And their name has already been mentioned on here.  Just my .02, and this makes me mad and upset at the same time!


----------



## rglinton66

It is painfully obvious what has happened.  I rode from the sportsman club to Jones lane yesterday.  The discharge pipe from King Finishing is the line.  Above is a beautiful river.  Below all the fish are dead.


----------



## rglinton66

I paddled from rocky Ford to Jones lane and did not see one dead fish. but below king finishing smells like death.


----------



## mtr3333

Bad thing. I guess the responsible person/s live in a very isolated reality figuring this would go unnoticed.


----------



## southgaoriginal

i have heard from folks that worked there years ago that they would just dump whatever they wanted in the river.  I guess this time the results just happened to be a little more noticeable.  Someone is going to be in trouble


----------



## danbo

Amen


----------



## rglinton66

*King Finishing contact info*

I called the VP of the local plant today and asked what they had discharged to kill all of the fish.  He was not happy!  You think you would be a little apologetic if you had just poisoned one of the best fisheries in the state.  If any of you would like to make your opinion heard Mr. Dodd can be reached at 912-863-4516 ext. 243;  email tdodd@kamfin.com.


----------



## fishtail

Easy girls.
You already got the noose made, at least see the outcome.


----------



## rglinton66

I would not rush to judgement.  The is no other industry, not even a home, within MILES of their discharge.  The pipe draws a line.  Fine above,  dead below.  I spoke with the DNR in Metter, Ga today.  They claim we all know the source.  Just waiting on the EPD report.  First hand evidence was a little overwhelming.


----------



## BowArrow

This will end my fishing this year as I fish Oliver Bridge and the Bulloch Wildlife Club area. The river can not survive a discharge when the water level is so low. Apparently it was a mistake when someone dumped a high concentration of toxic waste into the river.


----------



## rglinton66

I'm also a member at the Sportsman's Club.  I go 2-3 times a week this time of year.  It is one of my favorite places on earth.  This feels like when International Paper sold all of their land and I lost my hunting club. ....


----------



## jkk6028

wow, this is bad. if it turns out to be what everyone claims, i hope they pay a high price for their mistake. i work in textiles....but my employer is very, very strict with enviromental issues.


----------



## dannyoneal68

BowArrow said:


> This will end my fishing this year as I fish Oliver Bridge and the Bulloch Wildlife Club area. The river can not survive a discharge when the water level is so low. Apparently it was a mistake when someone dumped a high concentration of toxic waste into the river.



How long do you think it's gonna take to recover? And like somebody said, It HAS to be King Finishing. There's nothing else it could be.


----------



## rglinton66

It depends completely on weather the effects are short term or lasting.  If they just depleted the water of oxygen the fish population can rebound, but what if it is more along the lines of a toxin? Even when the fish return you could not eat them.


----------



## dannyoneal68

Let's just hope that they pay the price for what they have done. I might send them a nastygram tonight.


----------



## slab_slayer

rglinton66 said:


> I'm also a member at the Sportsman's Club.  I go 2-3 times a week this time of year.  It is one of my favorite places on earth.  This feels like when International Paper sold all of their land and I lost my hunting club. ....



X2, I LOVE the Ogeechee River.  All this had me soo upset at work today, I have spent soo many enjoyable days catching Redbreast on this river.


----------



## sleepindawg

In the first place, I don't believe this is a one-time event.  I believe it has been going on for some time but has not had such a severe result.  Temperatures are high and river level is low,  most likely magnifying the effect of any toxin being released... and  I'm not the only old-timer that thinks that outfit has been impacting the river for years either.  If that gentleman is so sure that his company should bear no blame, ask him to dip him up a cup of whatever is coming out of that discharge pipe and take a swig!   It just galls me that plants (or chicken houses, or even State Prisons) are allowed to locate on a river bank when there sole reason for doing so is to use the river to carry away some form of waste.  They'll get no sympathy from me if they are forced to shut down...but with the economy such as it is, I'm really afraid that won't be the case.


----------



## agradywills

panoz11 said:


> just left from stealbridge on hwy 119 in effingham county . the us epa was down there with 4 other trucks taking samples . they said this thing stretches over 35-40 miles of river .this really sucks bad . and just think they want to put more factories on this river ...



Yeah, I live just down the road from the bridge. What a dump that place is, and I'm not saying that as a figure of speech. Everyone dumps everything there.


----------



## Nicodemus

Bottom line is that we all live downstream. And water is one of the two most needed essentials of life. We as a people, treat both of these with complete disrespect. Us, and the generations to follow, will pay a severe price. I hope it`s worth it. There should be no tolerance, at all. Makes me sick...


----------



## dannyoneal68

slab_slayer said:


> X2, I LOVE the Ogeechee River.  All this had me soo upset at work today, I have spent soo many enjoyable days catching Redbreast on this river.



Me too. The whole thing makes me want to cry. I have so many awesome memories that were made on that stretch of river. And now it's ruined thanks to the greedy people at King Finishing.


----------



## Ohoopee Tusker

This makes me angry and sad. I've spent a lot of fun days on that stretch of river.


----------



## GSUbackwoods

Me and some friends went swimming yesterday afternood at the flat forjd landing in Stilson, right in the middle between Oliver and steel bridge and we didn't see any dead fish around.  We did hear about someone seeing some dead fish a little down river from Oliver though.  I just hope the river recovers soon because I grew up on this river and don't wanna have to start fishing somewhere else.


----------



## southgaoriginal

i know the area well, i know this is a very thing that happened and i am in no way taking away from that.  I hope the punishment is severe as well, however jobs in our area are hard to come by.  I hope it doesnt cost any hard working honest people their jobs


----------



## slab_slayer

Nicodemus said:


> Bottom line is that we all live downstream. And water is one of the two most needed essentials of life. We as a people, treat both of these with complete disrespect. Us, and the generations to follow, will pay a severe price. I hope it`s worth it. There should be no tolerance, at all. Makes me sick...



Very well said!!!


----------



## rglinton66

Really? I know jobs are important, but mistakes carry a cost.  Do dead river otters get a say?


----------



## slab_slayer

Just watched this, its sad!

http://www.wtoc.com/global/story.asp?s=14700108


----------



## a-mc

Makes me sick to my stomach to think about it, I have had some great times on that part of the river from 301 and up. To my understanding nothing has been reported upstream, but does anyone know if it is safe to fish upstream or where i could find that information? I apologize if this has already been answered.


----------



## slab_slayer

a-mc said:


> Makes me sick to my stomach to think about it, I have had some great times on that part of the river from 301 and up. To my understanding nothing has been reported upstream, but does anyone know if it is safe to fish upstream or where i could find that information? I apologize if this has already been answered.



It appears to be safe to fish from the Rocky Ford area and up.


----------



## SOUTHERNMASON

My better half is one. Of the biologist for feds and says that the water is highly contaminated. They have found a couple of chemical compounds and some tritiumin the waters


----------



## across the river

sleepindawg said:


> In the first place, I don't believe this is a one-time event.  I believe it has been going on for some time but has not had such a severe result.  Temperatures are high and river level is low,  most likely magnifying the effect of any toxin being released... and  I'm not the only old-timer that thinks that outfit has been impacting the river for years either.  If that gentleman is so sure that his company should bear no blame, ask him to dip him up a cup of whatever is coming out of that discharge pipe and take a swig!   It just galls me that plants (or chicken houses, or even State Prisons) are allowed to locate on a river bank when there sole reason for doing so is to use the river to carry away some form of waste.  They'll get no sympathy from me if they are forced to shut down...but with the economy such as it is, I'm really afraid that won't be the case.




Thats a great idea.  Lets just shut all the plants down on every river so we can completely eliminate any risk to mother nature.  Then you can come on here next month and moan and complain about how you have no electricity, no food, and fuss about how all the jobs are in China.   Look, I think it is terrible that someone dumped chemicals into the river.  If they exceeded levels on their discharge permit, then they should pay accordingly.  However, the bottom line is industry is what makes the world go round and many plants have to locate on a body of water.   There are risks involved with everything and occasionally stuff is going to happen.   Its like the oil spill in the gulf, you work to correct it and make sure it does happen again.  However, you can just quit drilling, or manufacturing because something has happened or potentially might happen again.   If everybody thought that way, nobody would drive a car because they might die. 
Like the gulf, mother nature will recover.  Trust me, shutting the plants down isn't the answer.


----------



## danbo

Read this article about the investigation;

http://savannahnow.com/news/2011-05-23/ogeechee-fish-kill-unsolved

Maybe we need a Rocket Science man to come down.LOL


----------



## danbo

*Resolution*

Georgia needs a law that requires all industry/government with waste treatment facilities recycle part of the treated water back in the plant for drinking, etc...

After all many of our bottled waters are recycled water that has been purified.


----------



## rglinton66

I'm glad the the linked article states that the current water discharge is within their permitted limits, but how does that in any way rule out the possibility of a one time release from the plant?


----------



## simpleman30

the song "Dirt" by Chris Knight.  somebody embed it for me b/c i can't figure out how.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-BOH3cXNQ0

"and they tell us that they don't pollute.  the s*** they dump in the river is perfectly safe.  but all the talk in the whole wide world can never bring back what they've laid to waste."


----------



## Curly

Where is the factory located at?


----------



## ngoodson

The Georgia EPD is driven and controlled by Georgia industry in many ways...I've seen too many instances of their blatant ignorance with regard to natural resource management to put any trust in them. I'm not surprised that Monday's press release all but absolved King Finishing. Lets hope that the EPA puts the screws to King Finishing. I'm all for jobs and for business. But, if you own a business and make money by using the people of Georgia's rivers in some way, you better treat the waters with respect....just as if someone were to let you fish their pond or picnic at their creek....you wouldn't litter....your wouldn't dump....and if you did, it'd be the last time you used the water.


----------



## Lukikus2

Sad to hear that. But they will get no more than a slap on the wrist from the EPA. The EPA's will say "dilution is the solution". Let mother nature work it's course and it will go away. I have witnessed this first hand on the Tenn. River with toulene and when I was a mere child it was DDT's. Not only that, during periods of heavy rains and swift currents waste management facilities will open the gate and let untreated waste spill directly into the river. There is alot that goes on beyond what we see.
But, if an idividual were to spill five gallons of gasoline or oil the EPA would levy some heavy cleanup fines. Just doesn't seem right now does it?


----------



## southgaoriginal

if its not oxygen levels and it appears by some of the news reports they have checked out king and doesnt appear anything is wrong there i wonder what could be going on here


----------



## rglinton66

The article said that the epd found kings discharge to be safe yesterday.  Fish were starting to die last Friday.  Whatever is killing them was released last week.  Mondays test should in no way clear king finishing.


----------



## Gordon

Even if they are proven to be guilty, it is a sad fact that fines imposed by the EPA on polluters are relatively small making it a "Positive business case" for the company rather than disposing of toxic waste the correct and "More expensive" way.

It has happened many times in the past and will continue to do so.  The government of this country is in the pocket of industry;

$500 Bucks should be about right!

http://gaenvlaw.wordpress.com/2008/11/22/are-georgia-epd-fines-high-enough/


They have done this kind of thing before;


Facility: King America Finishing, Inc./Dover 
Location:  Screven County 
Order Number: EPD-WS-2710 
Date of Issue: April 13,2009 
Cause of Order: Violations of Rules for Safe Drinking Water, Water Quality Control, and Rules for Solid Waste Management    
Requirement(s) of Order:     Provide proper drinking water system evaluation, performed by professional engineer; submit plan/schedule to upgrade system, including wells, distribution lines, pumps, appurtenances, etc., to comply    
Settlement Amount: $5000.00   


http://www.gaepd.org/pls/enfo/enfo.result


----------



## Horns

The river is stressed already due to the drought conditions. Sometimes it doesn't take a lot to create a huge problem downstream. If it is proven that King caused this fish kill, they need to be burned to the bone for it.


----------



## mk00897

This situation really ticks me off, since I went to the 301 boat ramp this morning for the first time in my new (to me) boat... I can not wait to see the consequences the responsible party has to bare.


----------



## southgaoriginal

noticed the rockyford landing is closed today as well


----------



## slab_slayer

southgaoriginal said:


> noticed the rockyford landing is closed today as well



Yep a guy I work with said it was closed off yesterday.  Also said some guy pulled up in a green truck drinking beer, got out of the truck, picked up 2 beers and a scrub brush and went to the end of the ramp and took a bath.


----------



## rglinton66

WTOC just reported that the EPD does not believe it was King Finishing but test results are not in yet! How do you rule out anything before you get the results.  I guess the hand of God drew a line at their discharge pipe and smote all the fish below.  I spoke with Ogeechee riverkeeps today and they said the government is bending over backwards to absolve king. Everyone just move along, nothing to see here.  Fish do make a poor tax base and Screven county does not have much industry anymore.


----------



## southgaoriginal

slab_slayer said:


> Yep a guy I work with said it was closed off yesterday.  Also said some guy pulled up in a green truck drinking beer, got out of the truck, picked up 2 beers and a scrub brush and went to the end of the ramp and took a bath.



That doesnt suprise me lol, only live a few miles away and you never know what you may see around here


----------



## across the river

Lukikus2 said:


> Sad to hear that. But they will get no more than a slap on the wrist from the EPA. The EPA's will say "dilution is the solution". Let mother nature work it's course and it will go away. I have witnessed this first hand on the Tenn. River with toulene and when I was a mere child it was DDT's. Not only that, during periods of heavy rains and swift currents waste management facilities will open the gate and let untreated waste spill directly into the river. There is alot that goes on beyond what we see.
> But, if an idividual were to spill five gallons of gasoline or oil the EPA would levy some heavy cleanup fines. Just doesn't seem right now does it?



Where have you seen a water management facility purposely dump raw sewage into a river in the last 25 years.  I'm not saying it didn't happen 50 years ago, but to say plants aren't being watched closely is just false.    I have either worked in or been involved with several plants and water treatment facilities and to imply that no one is watching them and they are purposely dumping hazardous material into a body of water is just ignorant. The plant I work at now has to monitor some chemicals down to the part per billion.  Permits are tighter now than they have ever been, and only getting tighter.   Look I am as sorry as anyone that a few fish died in the river, but having it out for a plant that hasn't even be proven to be at fault is absurd.  I don't know where you witnessed Toulene being dumped into the river, but I think I would have reported that.   As for DDT, they have been studying people who have been eating the stuff for years as a test, and they have had no ill health effects. In the meantime, since it was banned millions have died of malaria because DDT could no longer be used to spray them.  Makes a lot of sense to me.   Here is a little reading for you if you get bored.


http://www.jpands.org/vol9no3/edwards.pdf


----------



## rglinton66

across the river said:


> Where have you seen a water management facility purposely dump raw sewage into a river in the last 25 years.  I'm not saying it didn't happen 50 years ago, but to say plants aren't being watched closely is just false.    I have either worked in or been involved with several plants and water treatment facilities and to imply that no one is watching them and they are purposely dumping hazardous material into a body of water is just ignorant. The plant I work at now has to monitor some chemicals down to the part per billion.  Permits are tighter now than they have ever been, and only getting tighter.   Look I am as sorry as anyone that a few fish died in the river, but having it out for a plant that hasn't even be proven to be at fault is absurd.  I don't know where you witnessed Toulene being dumped into the river, but I think I would have reported that.   As for DDT, they have been studying people who have been eating the stuff for years as a test, and they have had no ill health effects. In the meantime, since it was banned millions have died of malaria because DDT could no longer be used to spray them.  Makes a lot of sense to me.   Here is a little reading for you if you get bored.
> 
> 
> http://www.jpands.org/vol9no3/edwards.pdf



Do you work at king finishing? A few fish? You are very obviously defending an indefensible position.  The river has been decimated.  My name is Bobby Linton.  I can be reached at 912 536 6868.  I will show you what they have done if you would like.  I saw it first hand.


----------



## dannyoneal68

Here's some pictures of the kill if anyone's interested.
https://picasaweb.google.com/dwedin...gCM7aiJze19WWRQ#slideshow/5609638787419401410


----------



## rglinton66

A few fish! I love this river like a home.  It is such a part of my life.  I have pictures of me as a child between the bridges at 301.  It's a part of me. Don't make light of a "few dead fish"


----------



## jabb06

yeah a few dead fish is what you see everywhere you look..it adds up to thousands of dead fish.Somebody completely ruined our river & should pay for it.I understand accidents happen,but they should man up & accept responsibility so that we know what was dumped in the river so that the clean up & restoration can begin.We were down at williams landing sunday up around miley lake &  had a bass (probably weighed 3 or 4 lbs) pop up by my boat..struggling to swim & covered in blisters.I cant help but wonder if the crap that was dumped in the river & killing the fish will kill the animals that eat the fish(turtles,buzzards,etc) & if animals that drink the water out the river will suffer the same fate.I wish i wouldve taken some pics to share as you did danny to show people who have not been done there how horrible it is.


----------



## jabb06

if you dont believe "a few dead fish " is something for us to be concerned about maybe you wouldnt mind if all of us ogeechee river folks loaded up all the dead fish we come across & bring them to ur house & pile them up in your yard.Im sure your neighbors wouldnt appreciate it anymore than we do.


----------



## rglinton66

Across the river does not understand "a few dead fish" is like someone burning his church down.  I go to the river and praise God for what he has made.  A few dead fish?   A carpenter built your church, god made that river!


----------



## slab_slayer

rglinton66 said:


> Across the river does not understand "a few dead fish" is like someone burning his church down.  I go to the river and praise God for what he has made.  A few dead fish?   A carpenter built your church, god made that river!



He is fighting a lost cause!  They mess with our river and us Ogeechee boys get mad!  And anyone who has never been on this river will never understand our stance on this.


----------



## BradMyers

Looks like I'll have a sad topic for next weeks show.


----------



## pine nut

I have only been privileged to fish on the Ogeechee River one time in my life, and I caught nothing as I recall, but I will never forget the experience!  I had a great time even though the river was a bit high and the fish weren't biting.  Just being there was fun and the thoughts of what I might have caught was a thrill.  My buddy and I fished three rivers in three days, the Satilla, Altamaha, and the Ogeechee.  All were beautiful and we caught some fish in the other two, but still it was a thrill to be on the Geech!  I was very disappointed to hear of this event.  I allways thought of this river as our least spoilled and least poluted river in GA.  Shame on whoever did this!


----------



## Joe "JC" Coots

pine nut said:


> I was very disappointed to hear of this event.  I allways thought of this river as our least spoilled and least poluted river in GA.  Shame on whoever did this!



I'm with you Bill. Chase and I have been planning a trip down there for the past 2-3 months after reading about the red breasts there and it's scenic qualities. Sadly, it looks like we will need to wait until it recovers....which it hopefully will.


----------



## rglinton66

News is reporting dead gators now being collected for tissue samples.


----------



## panoz11

now they found 3  alligators dead ...


----------



## slab_slayer

panoz11 said:


> now they found 3  alligators dead ...



And people are still saying its a lack of oxygen......


----------



## ngoodson

To Across The River: I have no idea where you get your info...but as someone with degrees and work experience in Environmental Science, I can tell you that DDT is in fact harmful to humans. DDT has been linked to breast cancer, lymphatic cancer, and endocrine abnormalities. There's also the fact that it has a half life of 30yrs in soil....that it thins the egg shells of birds and waterfowl which leads to huge population crashes...and that its genetic effects can be transmitted from parent to child. If you did a little homework, you'd also discover that DDT has been PROVEN to be far less effective in malaria prevention as mosquitos have become resistant to DDT application in the few African countries that still use DDT. 

While you worry about business in GA and the fact that we need jobs...which we do. You might want to consider what you're giving up....and you might think about what you'd fall back on if times ever got really bad. If our rivers are dead and waters are polluted, where would you get fish for your family or water?


----------



## huntfourfun

A retaining pond at King Finishing Plant #1 broke and released arsenic and other chemicals in the river.


----------



## Curly

where is the plant acutally located at?????


----------



## rglinton66

About two miles above hwy 301


----------



## Curly

ok it is off HWY 17, our hunting lease ajoins the property that explains all the messed up racks on the deer we see...thanks


----------



## rglinton66

huntfourfun said:


> A retaining pond at King Finishing Plant #1 broke and released arsenic and other chemicals in the river.



Where did you get this info? I can't confirm it from the news.


----------



## simpleman30

according to google earth, the plant's retaining ponds are a half mile from the river.  i don't know the terrain at that location, but i'm sure it slopes to the river pretty good and probably has a creek or 2 in between.


----------



## Curly

drops off steep above 500 yards before the RR track then flat from RR track to river


----------



## rglinton66

The local director of ogeechee riverkeeps told me yesterday that they had information that epd was on the river as early as last Thursday.  A day before the fish started turning up.  It would be criminal if people new and we were not informed until Sunday.


----------



## slab_slayer

rglinton66 said:


> The local director of ogeechee riverkeeps told me yesterday that they had information that epd was on the river as early as last Thursday.  A day before the fish started turning up.  It would be criminal if people new and we were not informed until Sunday.



I wouldnt put it past them.


----------



## slab_slayer

I just watched a video clip of Ted Wynn talking about the blisters and sores on the fish, and he said for that to be there it must have been going on for a short while.  No Sir!!  I have fished the river for the past 5 weeks, from Rocky Ford down to Morgans Bridge, and have not seen any sign of blisters or sores up until this past weekend.  They need to get on the ball!!


----------



## rglinton66

I second that.  Fished the area in question twice a week since the bite started and have not caught one unhealthy fish.


----------



## huntfourfun

rglinton66 said:


> Where did you get this info? I can't confirm it from the news.



Friend was working back near the retaining pond last week.  At first they thought the chemicals were coming from Plant #2, they came in Sunday to investigate, they were all clear.

I don't work there, so I really don't know for sure.  I'd be willing to bet it happened sometime last week and they were rushing to cover it up.  Just my .02.

Also, heard salt water fish near 204 were washing up dead.


----------



## rglinton66

huntfourfun said:


> Friend was working back near the retaining pond last week.  At first they thought the chemicals were coming from Plant #2, they came in Sunday to investigate, they were all clear.
> 
> I don't work there, so I really don't know for sure.  I'd be willing to bet it happened sometime last week and they were rushing to cover it up.  Just my .02.
> 
> Also, heard salt water fish near 204 were washing up dead.


Thanks for the follow-up.  I hate all the speculation but at this point someone knows something.  I really don't think King would be able to keep the good people who work at the facility quiet if a failure was common knowledge.


----------



## SASS249

huntfourfun said:


> A retaining pond at King Finishing Plant #1 broke and released arsenic and other chemicals in the river.



I have to call you out on this.  If you have this info and have not reported it to the EPD, EPA or anyone else then that is both irresponsible and criminal.  If you have reported it then I stand corrected.  Which is it?

It is easy to make statements but this situation is bad enough without irresponsible people making it worse.


Other people have repeatedly stated EPD was "on the river" on Thursday.  The fact is the first call to EPD regarding this situation came in after 6:00 pm on Friday May 20.

There is a lot going on here and despite what people keep saying this has to be about not only what the regulatory agencies know, but what can be proven.


----------



## rglinton66

SASS249 said:


> I have to call you out on this.  If you have this info and have not reported it to the EPD, EPA or anyone else then that is both irresponsible and criminal.  If you have reported it then I stand corrected.  Which is it?
> 
> It is easy to make statements but this situation is bad enough without irresponsible people making it worse.
> 
> 
> Other people have repeatedly stated EPD was "on the river" on Thursday.  The fact is the first call to EPD regarding this situation came in after 6:00 pm on Friday May 20.
> 
> There is a lot going on here and despite what people keep saying this has to be about not only what the regulatory agencies know, but what can be proven.



I agree with your statement, but I must say I have first hand knowledge that the DNR was collecting samples at the 301 bridge a few hours earlier.


----------



## across the river

I see you are dropping the "multiple degrees" line on me.   Look, I'm not here to argue on DDT, that isn't what the post is about.  If you want to argue about the effects of DDT, contact the scientist behind these studies.  Their references are at the bottom of these articles.



http://dwb4.unl.edu/Chem/CHEM869E/CHEM869ELinks/www.altgreen.com.au/Chemicals/ddt.html



http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/articles/summ02/DDT.html


As far as the river goes, I am in no way saying I think industry has the right to dump whatever they want into the river.  If they exceed their permit, have a release, etc.... they should pay for it.  However, several people on here have made comments above removing all plants away from water ways, putting plants out of business, and so on.   I think those are ignorant comments.   You can't have all of the "stuff" you have without industry.  Your gun, camo, scentblocker, food plot fertilizer, plastic worms, etc.... were all made at a factory.   It is like the "anti-capitalists" protesting the G-8 summit while they walk around in Nike Tennis shoes, Levi Blue jeans, and a North Face Jacket while carrying an i-phone.  You can't have all of the stuff, and then complain about the industry making it.  Look, if a plant dumps something in the river, they should be punished.  I just don't thing you drive people out of business over an accident (if the plant is really at fault).  I hate that the BP horizon rigged spewed millions of gallons of oil in the gulf, but I don't think you stop drilling.


----------



## southgaoriginal

i thought the test results were supposed to be in today?


----------



## radams1228

From a VERY reliable source (I trust the source with my life) ......dead deer are also being found close to the river.  Alligators may be eating the fish and dieing, but the deer certainly ain't.


----------



## JHB141

across the river said:


> As far as the river goes, I am in no way saying I think industry has the right to dump whatever they want into the river.  If they exceed their permit, have a release, etc.... they should pay for it.  However, several people on here have made comments above removing all plants away from water ways, putting plants out of business, and so on.   I think those are ignorant comments.   You can't have all of the "stuff" you have without industry.  Your gun, camo, scentblocker, food plot fertilizer, plastic worms, etc.... were all made at a factory.   It is like the "anti-capitalists" protesting the G-8 summit while they walk around in Nike Tennis shoes, Levi Blue jeans, and a North Face Jacket while carrying an i-phone.  You can't have all of the stuff, and then complain about the industry making it.  Look, if a plant dumps something in the river, they should be punished.  I just don't thing you drive people out of business over an accident (if the plant is really at fault).  I hate that the BP horizon rigged spewed millions of gallons of oil in the gulf, but I don't think you stop drilling.



I am glad to see a balanced opinion on this, and I heartily agree. I may have missed it if someone suggested it, but also consider the possibility that someone could have illegally dumped a significant amount of chemicals to circumvent proper disposal procedures, and done so near the plant to get attention pointed away from them. I just don't want to see an innocent company thrown under the bus if they really did not have a release.


----------



## Steve78

I ate at Loves on the Ogeechee river in Savannah this evening and their are no signs of anything that far down yet, even saw an alligator stalking the bank of a little moat and plenty of fish jumping out of the water. Wildlife still doing fine as far as I could tell.


----------



## slab_slayer

radams1228 said:


> from a very reliable source (i trust the source with my life) ......dead deer are also being found close to the river.  Alligators may be eating the fish and dieing, but the deer certainly ain't.



really?  Wow!!


----------



## Bossy70

radams1228 said:


> From a VERY reliable source (I trust the source with my life) ......dead deer are also being found close to the river.  Alligators may be eating the fish and dieing, but the deer certainly ain't.



I hope that is being reported officially!


----------



## sleepindawg

JHB141 said:


> I am glad to see a balanced opinion on this, and I heartily agree. I may have missed it if someone suggested it, but also consider the possibility that someone could have illegally dumped a significant amount of chemicals to circumvent proper disposal procedures, and done so near the plant to get attention pointed away from them. I just don't want to see an innocent company thrown under the bus if they really did not have a release.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        I am not sure but I don't believe there are any roads opposite the "kill line." Meaning it would be highly unlikely that enough chemical could have  been transported via land from that direction...I fished the area last Thursday and believe it is also highly unlikely that very much of anything could have been brought to the site from upriver or downriver... I only had fishing equipment and had to "drag" the boat several times because of low water.  If the "kill line" was as distinct as several witnesses have said, the contaminant would have most likely have at least traveled across the property of the company in question and then been deposited very near to the discharge pipe...and then they would run the risk of being seen...but I guess it's still a possibility.


----------



## huntfourfun

SASS249 said:


> I have to call you out on this.  If you have this info and have not reported it to the EPD, EPA or anyone else then that is both irresponsible and criminal.  If you have reported it then I stand corrected.  Which is it?
> 
> It is easy to make statements but this situation is bad enough without irresponsible people making it worse.
> 
> 
> Other people have repeatedly stated EPD was "on the river" on Thursday.  The fact is the first call to EPD regarding this situation came in after 6:00 pm on Friday May 20.
> 
> There is a lot going on here and despite what people keep saying this has to be about not only what the regulatory agencies know, but what can be proven.



Read my other post.........this was told to me second hand....however I might add.......I live here and can see Plant #2 out my window......I also live on well water........so I am very concerned.  I trust my friends who have worked with these plants in the past.........did I see it first hand NO.....however I certainly am a little closer to it than somebody sitting in Atlanta.

However, I have heard this from several other people.


----------



## huntfourfun

SASS249 said:


> I have to call you out on this.  If you have this info and have not reported it to the EPD, EPA or anyone else then that is both irresponsible and criminal.  If you have reported it then I stand corrected.  Which is it?
> 
> It is easy to make statements but this situation is bad enough without irresponsible people making it worse.
> 
> 
> Other people have repeatedly stated EPD was "on the river" on Thursday.  The fact is the first call to EPD regarding this situation came in after 6:00 pm on Friday May 20.
> 
> There is a lot going on here and despite what people keep saying this has to be about not only what the regulatory agencies know, but what can be proven.



I just learned of this information yesterday, all the proper authorities were well aware of the incident.


----------



## mtr3333

JHB141 said:


> I am glad to see a balanced opinion on this, and I heartily agree. I may have missed it if someone suggested it, but also consider the possibility that someone could have illegally dumped a significant amount of chemicals to circumvent proper disposal procedures, and done so near the plant to get attention pointed away from them. I just don't want to see an innocent company thrown under the bus if they really did not have a release.


 

 And the balance of that is to prosecute the responsible party.


----------



## LEON MANLEY

It's Bush's fault.


----------



## simpleman30

huntfourfun said:


> Friend was working back near the retaining pond last week.  At first they thought the chemicals were coming from Plant #2, they came in Sunday to investigate, they were all clear.
> 
> I don't work there, so I really don't know for sure.  I'd be willing to bet it happened sometime last week and they were rushing to cover it up.  Just my .02.
> 
> Also, heard salt water fish near 204 were washing up dead.



ain't no way there's any saltwater fish that far upriver.  from kings ferry to morgan's bridge is 8 miles as the crow flies and probably twice that by river.  morgan's bridge at 204 is still freshwater.  even at king's ferry (hwy 17) the water is lightly brackish at worst.


----------



## Deadduck

The big question is how does a textile plant get a permit to discharge in a pristine river like the geechee.
As a land owner on this river I hope all the other land owners can get together and file a class action law suite against the offenders, maybe we can protect our river, it seems that the government either can't or does not want to. If you hit them in the pocket book they seem to notice.


----------



## SASS249

huntfourfun said:


> I just learned of this information yesterday, all the proper authorities were well aware of the incident.



What proper authorities would that be?  Why do you believe they were aware of an unauthroized release from the pond?  Neither EPD nor EPA is aware of this.


----------



## huntfourfun

SASS249 said:


> What proper authorities would that be?  Why do you believe they were aware of an unauthroized release from the pond?  Neither EPD nor EPA is aware of this.



The authorities (maybe local) investigated Plant #2 retaining pond Sunday morning........it certainly would make sense for them to investigate #1 as well. 

If you work for the EPA or EPD, have you checked them out?


----------



## rglinton66

The statesboro herald is saying independent test show it to be caustic soda in the water.  Wonder where that came from?


----------



## rglinton66

Sodium hydroxide (sp) which I think is caustic soda. I Google caustic soda and fish kill and there are some very similar results to what happened here.


----------



## ROAM

i'm just ready to hear some 'official' reports. We were expecting them yesterday but have yet to hear anything from the lab tests.  The waiting, along with the perception of a lack of initial response, is very troubling.


----------



## Bossy70

Wikipedia:
Sodium hydroxide (NaOH), also known as lye and caustic soda, is a caustic metallic base. It is used in many industries, mostly as a strong chemical base in the manufacture of pulp and paper, textiles, drinking water, soaps and detergents and as a drain cleaner. Solid sodium hydroxide or solutions of sodium hydroxide may cause chemical burns, permanent injury or scarring if it contacts unprotected human, or other animal, tissue.


----------



## rydert

just read on wtoc website that people are reporting now that they are feeling sick from swimming and eating fish out of the Ogeechee


----------



## slab_slayer

Anyone know if the Scarboro landing is still open?


----------



## Deadduck

*wtoc*



rydert said:


> just read on wtoc website that people are reporting now that they are feeling sick from swimming and eating fish out of the Ogeechee



cant find this please provide link.

found it at 
http://www.wtoc.com/Global/story.asp?S=14722113


----------



## southgaoriginal

i have not been up that way but i think the millen landing under highway 25 was open earlier this week.  I saw some trucks turning off onto the road


----------



## rydert

http://www.wtoc.com/Global/story.asp?S=14722113

i think i did this correctly


----------



## slab_slayer

southgaoriginal said:


> i have not been up that way but i think the millen landing under highway 25 was open earlier this week.  I saw some trucks turning off onto the road



Ok cool, cause I'm itching to go fishing this weekend bad!! 4 day weekend for me!


----------



## slab_slayer

I just got back from taking some pics at the river.  Water was Gin clear, the air smelled of death and almost an acid smell.  Did see a few signs of alive fish, mudfish, a bass, a bream on the bed, and a few sucker fish under a log.  Several dead bass, redbreast, bluegill, a gar, mudfish, and a dead turtle.  Broke my heart!


----------



## huntfourfun

slab_slayer said:


> I just got back from taking some pics at the river.  Water was Gin clear, the air smelled of death and almost an acid smell.  Did see a few signs of alive fish, mudfish, a bass, a bream on the bed, and a few sucker fish under a log.  Several dead bass, redbreast, bluegill, a gar, mudfish, and a dead turtle.  Broke my heart!



I saw a man swimming at the 301 bridge this afternoon........folks are also still fishing the river at 301.


----------



## slab_slayer

huntfourfun said:


> I saw a man swimming at the 301 bridge this afternoon........folks are also still fishing the river at 301.



Some people are a few bricks shy of a load!


----------



## rglinton66

Maybe I'm wrong.  King Finishing America may not have done this, but whatever the case it has been a week! Still no test results? As a previous poster said the fist call to EPD was at 6:00 on Friday.   I guess the clock does not start until the next business day.  After all it was a weekend.


----------



## rglinton66

Test results will be in on Tuesday..... Test results are expected Wensday.... Thursday test result will be available in a few hours....   Really.  It's becoming a bad joke.


----------



## across the river

Deadduck said:


> The big question is how does a textile plant get a permit to discharge in a pristine river like the geechee.
> As a land owner on this river I hope all the other land owners can get together and file a class action law suite against the offenders, maybe we can protect our river, it seems that the government either can't or does not want to. If you hit them in the pocket book they seem to notice.



The same way the 20-30 water treatment facilities(and multiple industrial facilities)  around you and Atlanta get a permit to discharge treated waste water into the Chattahoochee.


----------



## rglinton66

Just read an article on the efingham hearold.  EPD said die off was caused by environmental stress.  Plant manager of King Finishing was quoted as saying he was mystified by die off and would like to know if they were causing it.  Also said the settlement ponds 1/2 mile from the river were a problem they had inherited from the former owners. Who else sees an end game of pass the blame underway?


----------



## Deadduck

Will someone please let us know what the heck is going on in the river!!!


----------



## jabb06

the environmental protection division should change their name to business protection division because i feel like they are covering up for somebody


----------



## jabb06

so i guess we are suppose to take the governments word that the river is safe.i want to see obama come swim in the ogeechee to prove its ok to be in just like he did in the gulf last year.


----------



## jabb06

lets have a big fish fry & invite all of the hard workin folks with the government that have busted their butts to give us what looks like a Edited to Remove Profanity ----Edited to Remove Profanity ---- answer.i bet none of them would show up & eat our fish...oh well that just makes more for us poor suckers


----------



## radams1228

report on WTOC now says that "bacteria" is to blame.  NOTE: in the article it says that "chemical" tests are still ongoing.
http://http://www.wtoc.com/global/story.asp?s=14735952


----------



## across the river

Deadduck said:


> Will someone please let us know what the heck is going on in the river!!!



Here you go.


http://www2.wsav.com/news/2011/may/26/results-fish-kill-investigation-released-ar-1894375/


For those of you don't want to read the article it was Columnaris, which is a disease caused by bacteria, not caustic soda, benzene, or red dye from the plant.  I am sure that won't be enough to convince some of you  that it wasn't in some way caused by the awful chemicals King Finishing was dumping in the river.  Could everyone please stop with the industry bashing.  I found the link on The Ogeechee Riverkeeper site, and you know they would stick it to the evil capitalists if they had a chance.  I hope this will calm some of you down and show that the facts need to be found before you start jumping to conclusions. For those of you interested in columnaris, here is an article.  Notice it says die-offs typically occur in late spring/early summer.  What a coincidence.


http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/areas/fisheries/eastmetro/columnaris.html


----------



## dawg2

across the river said:


> Here you go.
> 
> 
> http://www2.wsav.com/news/2011/may/26/results-fish-kill-investigation-released-ar-1894375/
> 
> 
> For those of you don't want to read the article it was Columnaris, which is a disease caused by bacteria, not caustic soda, benzene, or red dye from the plant.  I am sure that won't be enough to convince some of you  that it wasn't in some way caused by the awful chemicals King Finishing was dumping in the river.  Could everyone please stop with the industry bashing.  I found the link on The Ogeechee Riverkeeper site, and you know they would stick it to the evil capitalists if they had a chance.  I hope this will calm some of you down and show that the facts need to be found before you start jumping to conclusions. For those of you interested in columnaris, here is an article.  Notice it says die-offs typically occur in late spring/early summer.  What a coincidence.
> 
> 
> http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/areas/fisheries/eastmetro/columnaris.html


Columnaris deaths are attributed to stress.  Ulcers appear within 24-48 hours.  So now they need to figure out what the "stress" is/was.  Fish don't die from columnaris unless they are weakened by something else.  That something else can be many things; including both natural and man-made.  The other thing is columnaris usually does not kill all species of fish, and I have never heard of it killing gators.


----------



## mtr3333

How  about Coveruras Quickzippadalippus? It is a disease where accountability is exhausted with severe green halucinations. I think that disease hit somewhere.


----------



## mtr3333

dawg2 said:


> Columnaris deaths are attributed to stress. Ulcers appear within 24-48 hours. So now they need to figure out what the "stress" is/was. Fish don't die from columnaris unless they are weakened by something else. That something else can be many things; including both natural and man-made. The other thing is columnaris usually does not kill all species of fish, and I have never heard of it killing gators.


 There was an upper limit(upstream) established on the river, right?


----------



## jabb06

yeah the factory drain pipe is the starting point


----------



## dawg2

mtr3333 said:


> There was an upper limit(upstream) established on the river, right?



Columnaris is highly contagious.  So it makes sense for it to affect downstream quicker.  But if you follow the trail (of dead fish) and see where it started, that would be a good starting point for establishing the cause of stress be it natural or man-made.  I would be interested in seeing the final verdict on this fish kill.


----------



## Bigtimber

Columnaris...heard of it with aquarium fish.. surely no expert......but what I read around the net real quick...a few folks even  say fish infected with it are "safe" to eat.

http://www.wvpubcast.org/newsarticle.aspx?id=15156



http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/areas/fisheries/eastmetro/columnaris.html

I sure ain't eating none myself.........but seems something like that...even proclaimed "safe" for humans even.. has to be pretty bad to kill a gator...especially that quick.....seen them eat some pretty rotten nasty stuff and go on like they love it. Kinda makes me wonder myself what else is up...but maybe its just me...


----------



## mtr3333

The Columnaris attacks weakened distressed fish. I am also ready for the rest of the story. Good day.


----------



## Gaducker

Following this one.


----------



## slab_slayer

dawg2 said:


> Columnaris deaths are attributed to stress.  Ulcers appear within 24-48 hours.  So now they need to figure out what the "stress" is/was.  Fish don't die from columnaris unless they are weakened by something else.  That something else can be many things; including both natural and man-made.  The other thing is columnaris usually does not kill all species of fish, and I have never heard of it killing gators.



Very well said!!


----------



## Mangler

danbo said:


> Georgia needs a law that requires all industry/government with waste treatment facilities recycle part of the treated water back in the plant for drinking, etc...
> 
> After all many of our bottled waters are recycled water that has been purified.



Come on...you can't be serious.  EVERY manufacturing plant, hospital, school, home, etc's waste ends up back into the environment one way or another. This includes the bathroom cleaner you use to clean your toilet bowl or the grease and oil that you wash off of your hands. Manufacturing plants have to comply with very strict standards for discharging waste. Yea there will always be those idiots that try to push the limit just like the idiots that drain antifreeze out of their radiator to the ground or the sewer. Waste water treatment plants that 'clean' your drinking water have limits too. Do you trust that their testing methods or their employees are ethical. It is sad to say, but it is true that the human population and expansion has very adverse affects on the environment, but where do you go or what do you do if you don't like it besides moving out to the middle of Alaska, revert back to a horse and buggy and wear clothes made of animal hide.

I'm not, by no means, taking the side of whoever is responsible for this. They should be punished whether it was intentional or accidental, but to make a claim like yours is a little 'out there'. Would you drink the water running off of your chemically (or organically) fertilized lawn, or drink the water directly behind your little 2-stroke outboard that is putting oil and gas into this river? We as a human race and every other living thing on this earth suffers the consequences for our conveniences.


----------



## LEON MANLEY

jabb06 said:


> so i guess we are suppose to take the governments word that the river is safe.i want to see obama come swim in the ogeechee to prove its ok to be in just like he did in the gulf last year.


----------



## Creek Steward

There was a gentleman named T. Dodd who worked in a textile plant that discharged into our creek in E. Alabama. He invented a way to remove color from their water and made their water meet fish and wildlife standards at the end of their pipe. He became a friend of our water watch group and we knew him as a friend of the environment. He left this area a few years ago and I do not know where he went, but maybe this is the same man and he will do good things for your river like he did our Saughahatchee Creek.


----------



## Lightnrod

X2 with sleepndog


----------



## justfishin

1) I agree that industry is important to our economy. But accidents do happen. I know this first hand being employed by both city and county entities. Most accidents are not reported to the EPD. Counties and cities do not like to pay huge fines so they fix the problem and go on. I've seen it first hand. 2) The WTOC article states "According to the EPD, humans are not known to be affected by the disease." More questions, why is no one allowed to swim in the river yet? One, because the investigation is ongoing 3) Alligators? 4) The Ogeechee Riverkeeper has not released their test results yet. 5) I would love to see a copy of the residents lab results that came back indicating Sodium Hydroxide 6) And lastly to across the river who stated "I hope this will calm some of you down and show that the facts need to be found before you start jumping to conclusions."  Sorry, no one is going to calm down any time soon. No matter the reasons, the findings, the cause, our river has experienced a tragedy and our hearts are bleeding!


----------



## slab_slayer

justfishin said:


> 1) i agree that industry is important to our economy. But accidents do happen. I know this first hand being employed by both city and county entities. Most accidents are not reported to the epd. Counties and cities do not like to pay huge fines so they fix the problem and go on. I've seen it first hand. 2) the wtoc article states "according to the epd, humans are not known to be affected by the disease." more questions, why is no one allowed to swim in the river yet? One, because the investigation is ongoing 3) alligators? 4) the ogeechee riverkeeper has not released their test results yet. 5) i would love to see a copy of the residents lab results that came back indicating sodium hydroxide 6) and lastly to across the river who stated "i hope this will calm some of you down and show that the facts need to be found before you start jumping to conclusions."  sorry, no one is going to calm down any time soon. No matter the reasons, the findings, the cause, our river has experienced a tragedy and our hearts are bleeding!



x2!!!!!


----------



## LonePine

Below is a link to the public record environmental compliance history for King Finishing.  With regard to the Clean Water Act (CWA), within the last 5 years, they have:

-Been out of compliance in 4 of the last 12 quarters
-6 Letters of Violation/Notice of Violation of CWA
-6 CWA inspections by EPD
-1 Formal enforcement action (fine of $5k)

These numbers don't sound very good but for the industry they are in it's not the worst I've seen.  However, it does show some history of issues.  I'm not jumping to conclusions and I hope this fish kill is a natural occurance but I will be interested to see how everything plays out.

http://www.epa-echo.gov/cgi-bin/get1cReport.cgi?tool=echo&IDNumber=110000499880


----------



## mtr3333

What if it were another alleged plant and involved the Hooch? And throw in a lake like Lanier, West Point, etc. Then play wait and see. The Ogeechee deserves just as much attention.


----------



## rglinton66

As bad as I hate to say it, I've been thinking when all of this is resolved the river really needs to be closed to fishing for a while.  It would be irresponsible to take fish out when we need them to help the river recover.  Along with the fact that the pressure on the river from Rocky Ford up is going to be tremendous if all the displaced fishermen just move up stream.


----------



## simpleman30

i've been saying for years that the river ought to be closed to fishing for a year or two.  there's so much pressure on it and if the river's low, you can forget catching much of anything til next year.


----------



## fishtail

Ponder this being a natural event.
The river has reduced it's carrying capacity.
No need for closing it to fishing, the river did it for us.


----------



## slab_slayer

I cant believe they are going to open the river back up for swimming and fishing this afternoon!!

http://www.wtoc.com/global/story.asp?s=14740523


----------



## mtr3333

simpleman30 said:


> i've been saying for years that the river ought to be closed to fishing for a year or two. there's so much pressure on it and if the river's low, you can forget catching much of anything til next year.


  The problem with closing the river is that fishermen are some of the best watchmen for such an incident. Someone needs to stay on watch.


----------



## mtr3333

Within a more current story headlining bacteria this was noted.



> The Coastal Health District has had about a dozen calls from people who say they swam in the river and are feeling sick.
> 
> "You'd expect far more people if there was a sense of paranoia. The few people we have had  have seen symptoms like diarrhea and skin irritation," Bob Thornton, Coastal Health District Epidemiologist, told WTOC.



 The truth is working itself into the light.


----------



## justfishin

*Huh?!*

Now they have reopened the river to swimming. Fish consumption ban is still in force. 

http://www.wtoc.com/global/story.asp?s=14740523


----------



## treeman101

Lance45lb said:


> Below is a link to the public record environmental compliance history for King Finishing.  With regard to the Clean Water Act (CWA), within the last 5 years, they have:
> 
> -Been out of compliance in 4 of the last 12 quarters
> -6 Letters of Violation/Notice of Violation of CWA
> -6 CWA inspections by EPD
> -1 Formal enforcement action (fine of $5k)
> 
> These numbers don't sound very good but for the industry they are in it's not the worst I've seen.  However, it does show some history of issues.  I'm not jumping to conclusions and I hope this fish kill is a natural occurance but I will be interested to see how everything plays out.
> 
> http://www.epa-echo.gov/cgi-bin/get1cReport.cgi?tool=echo&IDNumber=110000499880



And they were going to fine me 25,000 for buring some hog carcasses on my own land after they had been processed.  It just does not make sense.


----------



## mtr3333

treeman101 said:


> And they were going to fine me 25,000 for buring some hog carcasses on my own land after they had been processed. It just does not make sense.


  So did you tell them to stop looking after finding one hog?


----------



## JHB141

So, as I read the most recent news article, the fish died of the bacteria, but the bacteria bloom had to be brought on by stress, which they haven't found the cause of yet. Oxygen levels are fine, but they found levels of copper, sodium, and formaldehyde. Sodium=salt, I can see that being there, especially with the low water level. Copper, mmm...., maybe a natural source, iffy though. Formaldehyde? I don't ever remeber seeing that being produced naturally by ANYTHING. I guess the fish tissue tests will tell for sure.

Oh, by the way, if anyone has fish in the freezer caught within the last month or so, get in touch with the riverkeepers. They can use that as comparison to the fish they sent in to be analyzed. I know it may sound dramatic, but that one pack of fillets in the freezer may have what they need to pin this thing down.


----------



## mtr3333

There are many salts. NaCl is only one...



> There are several varieties of salts. Salts that hydrolyze to produce hydroxide ions when dissolved in water are basic salts and salts that hydrolyze to produce hydronium ions in water are acid salts



 On the other hand caustic soda...


----------



## georgia jeff

I put in at Shearhouse landing (private) between Oliver and Steel Bridge today to try to see if I could still catch a bass (catch and release).  I figured that the news had over stated the amount of fish being killed and that the bite would be slow but figured I could catch a few. 
A friend and I fished hard for three hours without a bite.  I only saw about a dozen fish alive the entire time on the river.  Last year at this same time you would have seen hundreds.  I saw one live bass, two live red breast (one was almost dead, floating near the surface), and around 6 or so catfish.  The two species of fish that it didn't seem to affect as badly were gar and small minnows.  I saw atleast 8 gar and they were acting normal.  I found minnows in eddy pockets and they seemed normal even though some had white spots on them.
I am very depressed.  The river has been decimated!  There were dead fish everywhere:  bass, red breast, mud fish.  Every downed tree had dead fish rotting in it.  The whole area smelled of rotting fish.  Almost nothing is left alive!  Someone needs to get to the bottom of this and make the responsible party pay.


----------



## georgia jeff

For some comparison, I fished  Tuesday afternoon  (the 17th) at Williams Landing and caught bass.  You could see fish alive in the water and bass chasing minnows across the surface of the water.  

We were on the water at Shearhouse Landing around 6:40 this morning and there wasn't a single top water strike and no signs of bass chasing minnows.  The only active fish were the gar boiling the surface like they always do.

I fish the Ogeechee two the three days a week in the summer and I can't believe how bad it was out there today.  I have been in shock all afternoon.

Who ever is responsible needs to be held liable to restock the river.  Sportsman should not have to wait two or three years for the fish population to rebound.  Please encourage your local DNR or congressman to see that the river gets restocked.  Finding someone responsilbe is only half the battle.  They also need to fix the problem they caused.


----------



## georgia jeff

Has anyone else got any reports of on the water experience in the affected areas?


----------



## croaker

mtr3333 said:


> There are many salts. NaCl is only one...
> 
> 
> 
> On the other hand caustic soda...



Ding, Ding we have a winner...

NaOH...

I think closing the river to fishing would be the wrong move...
If the river were closed to fishing, how are" we" gonna know what is going on  while the river is recovering from this fish kill?


----------



## rglinton66

georgia jeff said:


> Has anyone else got any reports of on the water experience in the affected areas?


It's just as you said.  And are gar bullet proof? Everything else dies and their out there swimming around like nothings wrong.  Are they immune to kryptonite too?


----------



## sleepindawg

Wondered the same thing myself, so I did a little reading and found that they are able to use a swim bladder of sorts to take "gulps" of air at the surface and may use that oxygen in addition to what's taken in through their gills.  That trick may give them an advantage when oxygen levels are out of whack...Also found that a female can deposit so many eggs that several males often accompany one female when spawning.  I guess that's why you often see them in small groups.


----------



## slab_slayer

rglinton66 said:


> It's just as you said.  And are gar bullet proof? Everything else dies and their out there swimming around like nothings wrong.  Are they immune to kryptonite too?



I found a dead one near Oliver bridge Thursday afternoon.


----------



## georgia jeff

slab_slayer said:


> I found a dead one near Oliver bridge Thursday afternoon.



Were you fishing or just observing?  Did you catch anything?  Did you see any fish still left alive?  Very few people are talking about what the condition of the river is in now after the fish kill.  We need more updates on what is left.


----------



## slab_slayer

georgia jeff said:


> Were you fishing or just observing?  Did you catch anything?  Did you see any fish still left alive?  Very few people are talking about what the condition of the river is in now after the fish kill.  We need more updates on what is left.



I was just taking pictures.  All I saw alive was, 3 sucker fish under a log, a mudfish with sores on its back, a bream on the bed, and a small bass with a sore on its back.


----------



## slab_slayer

*A few pics*

Here is a few pics from around Oliver Bridge Thursday afternoon.  Look at the pic on the stick pile in the water, notice how clear the water is.  It was almost gin clear, kinda odd.


----------



## georgia jeff

Thats a nice bass, shame that it died.  I wrote senator Jack Hill yesterday afternoon asking him for three things...
1.  To make sure that this just didn't get swept under the rug
2.  To find the responsible party and make them pay
3.  To restock the river and not just wait for it to recover slowly over the years.

I encourage EVERYONE to do the same.  The more voices the better.


----------



## fishtail

georgia jeff said:


> Thats a nice bass, shame that it died.  I wrote senator Jack Hill yesterday afternoon asking him for three things...
> 1.  To make sure that this just didn't get swept under the rug
> 2.  To find the responsible party and make them pay
> 3.  To restock the river and not just wait for it to recover slowly over the years.
> 
> I encourage EVERYONE to do the same.  The more voices the better.



As to point 3. 
I'd prefer the river to be kept along the same bloodline of fish and not influenced from restocking unless pulled from the same general watershed.


----------



## jabb06

i put in at williams landing last sunday & after 3 hrs of hard fishing i caught one little stump knocker.im gonna put in there in the morning & have a look around.I'll fish a lil & see if anything is biting


----------



## georgia jeff

Jabb06,
Please post if you catch anything tomorrow and if you see any live fish, minnows, etc or only dead fish.  Do you bass fish or bream fish?  I like Williams and fish there alot.


----------



## jabb06

georgia jeff i fish for anything that bites.i have fished several landings on the ogeechee but the majority of my outings were at williams or at shearhouse.i got an itch after i posted earlier so i went on down & put in at williams being its only a mile or so from my house.i got in about 730 & came out around 930.i didnt see anymore floaters.i did see alot of gar,saw some minnows & turtles,one bass & a beaver dragging a cut limb.I stayed after dark & the frogs are a croakin & the bugs are a buzzin.I saw an owl up near miley lake.I didnt catch any fish.only strike i had was a gar.We are gonna put in around 8 in the morning & fish till prolly around lunch.i will post my results when i get back to the house.Anyone else having any luck in the affected areas?


----------



## mtr3333

A little about PH. A fish has its slime coat as its #1 immune system. When that beaks down, well guess...

http://www.arkansasstripers.com/fish-slime-coat.htm


----------



## Deadduck

Please do not let this issue fade away. The Ogeechee River is one of the last great rivers in Georgia. If this was the Hooch in Atlanta it would be front page news. There was barely a whisper of it in the Atlanta media. I urge you to call your government officials and representatives and keep this issue alive. The Ogeechee riverkeepers have been up to this point the best souce of information, it may  be wise to join them in looking after our river.
I hope that the land owners on the river and the people who enjoy the river pursue the cause of the stress on the river. I have been fishing and hunting on this river for over 50 years and this is the most troubling thing I have witnessed and I want an answer.


----------



## georgia jeff

jabbo6,

Thanks for the update even though it is a depressing one.  I will keep updating this thread if I fish in an area that was affected by the fish kill.  Hopefully others can do the same and we can get a good picture about what is going on in the river.  

I also agree with the statement about contacting you political representatives.  It seems like the media is only talking about the fact that there was a fish kill.  Now that they can't find a smoking gun to blame someone it seems as if the story is dying (like our fish).

Noone seems to be talking about the lasting effects that this is going to have on the thousands of people that live and fish on the Ogeechee.  This is a shame.


----------



## sleepindawg

"fade away" is exactly what those officials hope this thing will do...and it looks like some people are going to have to "lawyer up" to keep that from happening.  Whatever individual or group comes to the forefront in the coming battle will need our financial support


----------



## mtr3333

fishtail said:


> As to point 3.
> I'd prefer the river to be kept along the same bloodline of fish and not influenced from restocking unless pulled from the same general watershed.


 

 The problem will be getting a self-sustaining ecosystem restored. Sure you can stock your sport species, but nymphs, crayfish, salamanders, and on and on will need to have their balance restored as well.

 Whether ignorance or greed is the cause, the result is the same... tragic.


----------



## Deadduck

Deadduck said:


> Please do not let this issue fade away. The Ogeechee River is one of the last great rivers in Georgia. If this was the Hooch in Atlanta it would be front page news. There was barely a whisper of it in the Atlanta media. I urge you to call your government officials and representatives and keep this issue alive. The Ogeechee riverkeepers have been up to this point the best souce of information, it may  be wise to join them in looking after our river.
> I hope that the land owners on the river and the people who enjoy the river pursue the cause of the stress on the river. I have been fishing and hunting on this river for over 50 years and this is the most troubling thing I have witnessed and I want an answer.


Here is the website for the contact numbers and emails for your representatives. PLEASE contact them.
see:
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/state/main/?state=GA


----------



## Deadduck

Deadduck said:


> Here is the website for the contact numbers and emails for your representatives. PLEASE contact them.
> see:
> http://www.congress.org/congressorg/state/main/?state=GA


Here is my letter to my officals:

May 31, 2011


	On or about May 22th   there was a massive fish kill on the Ogeechee River in south Georgia. Although this is not my local district for voting I do own property in Jenkins County on the river.
	The EPA as well as the DNR has done a horrible job of responding to this incident. They took much too long in recognizing, analyzing and finally responding (as much as they have).
	I ask you as my elected officials to make sure that this incident is fully investigated. There seems to be much misinformation floating around. A finishing plant has been mentioned several times as a likely prospect for some sort of involvement. The fish kill seems to start at their discharge pipe into the river and above there the fish seem to be fine.
	The potential long term effects on the river are devastating and someone is responsible. Please make sure that responsible party makes restitution. The Ogeechee River is one of the last unspoiled rivers in Georgia, one that I have spent the last 50 + years hunting and fishing.
I am just someone who appreciates the beauty of the river and hope that it is there for the next generation.


----------



## sleepindawg

I've just heard that landowners will have a public meeting Sunday at 5:00 in Blitchton.  If anyone has any additional info please post.


----------



## justfishin

I heard the same thing from an Ellabell resident. June 5th at Dashers. Rumor has it that some politicians are suppose to attend. I along with others have asked the Ogeechee Riverkeepers on Facebook but no response yet. I'd love to know myself. If I hear, I'll post.


----------



## sleepindawg

Riverkeeper is where I got my information, but I didn't get the specific location in Blitchton.  I'd better somewhere big enough to hold a crowd.  Ms. Wedincamp tells me that Riverkeeper and interested scientists will be attending as well.


----------



## Public Land Prowler

Well I just got done reading it all...Posted some info earlier about dead gators/fish that were found by a coworker in the canoochee today 8 miles from where it joins the ogeechee..that section of the canoochee is tidal..

This is going to be covered up if people dont push hard for answers!!I'm seeing all kinds of run-a-round going on..DNR isnt giving answers,and that tells me one of two things..1-they dont have a clue,2-they do know and dont want to/were told not to tell the public.


----------



## georgia jeff

I heard from a landowner in Shearhouse landing that the meeting in Blitchton was going to be at Dasher's Landing.


----------



## across the river

Public Land Prowler said:


> Well I just got done reading it all...Posted some info earlier about dead gators/fish that were found by a coworker in the canoochee today 8 miles from where it joins the ogeechee..that section of the canoochee is tidal..
> 
> This is going to be covered up if people dont push hard for answers!!I'm seeing all kinds of run-a-round going on..DNR isnt giving answers,and that tells me one of two things..1-they dont have a clue,2-they do know and dont want to/were told not to tell the public.



I'm not saying the plant didn't spill anything, I'm just saying that  if they had released enough caustic  in the river to kill fish in a tidal stream many miles down stream, the pH would have been 13 to 14 in the river last week, and even then it is highly unlikely it would kill anything in the area described.   It wouldn't have taken a professor from Auburn or Georgia Southern to tell you what was wrong. Also all of the plant life in that section would be dead.  I agree with the last comment. It isn't that difficult.   Either something was in the water or it wasn't.   Equipment exists to detect down to the part per billion levels.  I find it hard to believe they haven't figured out anything in a week.  If it was the plant, say it was the plant and deal with the situation accordingly.  If it wasn't the plant, then say so and get everyone off of their back.


----------



## georgia jeff

As I mentioned in an earlier post I emailed Senator Jack Hill.  He emailed me back (kinda suprised) and said that the meeting was at Dashers landing this Sunday afternoon and that he was going to try to attend.  He said he had a call into the commissioners office and the EPD to try to get some answers.  He also mentioned he had a place on the Ohoopee.  He sounds like a good guy.


----------



## GobbleAndGrunt78

That was a long read, 200+ posts. I live a mile or two from the Ogeechee as the crow flies....I'm concerned. I hope we get a REAL answer and a REAL solution. Some of my best childhood memories were on the Ogeechee and Canoochie Rivers fishing and boating with my Mom, Dad, and brother.


----------



## rdnckrbby

A class action lawsuit has been filed about this situation. I know personally and have seen the arial photos of a broken dam on one of the retention ponds at the plant and know personally the person hired to fix it. Also a train conductor who runs the track in dover saw water standing all in the woods the day before the fish kill started around the plant in such dry conditions and pointed this out to landowners around that area. Justice will be served and the river will have to be cleaned.


----------



## SASS249

Have the aerial photos and first hand information been reported to EPD or EPA?  People who have this kind of information and do not report it to the regulators have no right to complain about their response.

Just saying "they already know about it, or somebody told somebody" does not get it.

Local people often get a lot more information than does someone from the outside trying to investigate these kinds of things.

Of course there was a broken pipe on one of the retention ponds about 18 months ago.  Not likely it could have caused this kill.


----------



## rdnckrbby

SASS249 said:


> Have the aerial photos and first hand information been reported to EPD or EPA?  People who have this kind of information and do not report it to the regulators have no right to complain about their response.
> 
> Just saying "they already know about it, or somebody told somebody" does not get it.
> 
> Local people often get a lot more information than does someone from the outside trying to investigate these kinds of things.
> 
> Of course there was a broken pipe on one of the retention ponds about 18 months ago.  Not likely it could have caused this kill.



This dam break occured two and a half weeks ago. They have been shown to regulators including the Riverkeeper who actually took the photos.


----------



## justfishin

The meeting is at Dasher's, June 5th at 5pm. It's on the ORK Facebook page. The media is also going to attend. A good thing.


----------



## justfishin

Also, there were 2 dead alligators at Landing 3 on the Canoochee in Fort Stewart. Both were shot, no word of any dead fish. We reported one of the dead alligators today. They were already aware of it and did not have a boat on hand last night to remove it. Looks like someone is poaching on a military base. Idiots for sure. I replied to this on another post.


----------



## fishtail

They do have a list of who's been there, just gotta go through the motions. Ain't been but 2 area's open along that point for almost a week.


----------



## georgia jeff

If thats true about the broken dam at the retention pond then it shoud be very easy to prove that it was King Finishing.  Soil tests between the retention pond and the river should prove that.  That must have been some powerful stuff to kill fish all the way to Kings Ferry!


----------



## across the river

rdnckrbby said:


> This dam break occured two and a half weeks ago. They have been shown to regulators including the Riverkeeper who actually took the photos.



And in addition to this information we have the following (http://beta.bryancountynews.net/section/97/article/13301/)"Georgia Department of Natural Resources Environmental Protection Division spokesman Keith Chambers said Monday the Screven County plant was “in order” and that there was “no reason to believe it is connected to the fish kill. We can rule out King Finishing."  Diane Wedincamp  of the Ogeechee Riverkeeper said she traced the kill "the plant’s discharge site", which would make no sense if there was water all in the woods coming from the retention pond.   If a retention pond broke and dumped caustic, ash, whatever into the river, it wouldn't take over a week to determine what chemicals were in the river.  Even the river keepers little kit would have shown more than "some sign's of caustic salts."  Way to many stories going around, and none of them seem to match up.


----------



## justfishin

across the river said:


> And in addition to this information we have the following (http://beta.bryancountynews.net/section/97/article/13301/)"Georgia Department of Natural Resources Environmental Protection Division spokesman Keith Chambers said Monday the Screven County plant was “in order” and that there was “no reason to believe it is connected to the fish kill. We can rule out King Finishing."  Diane Wedincamp  of the Ogeechee Riverkeeper said she traced the kill "the plant’s discharge site", which would make no sense if there was water all in the woods coming from the retention pond.   If a retention pond broke and dumped caustic, ash, whatever into the river, it wouldn't take over a week to determine what chemicals were in the river.  Even the river keepers little kit would have shown more than "some sign's of caustic salts."  Way to many stories going around, and none of them seem to match up.



That was an older media report. A more recent one  http://coastalsenior.savannahnow.com/news/2011-05-27/ogeechee-cleared-swimming-not-yet-fishing 
 Note the statement "after conversations with a local industry". There is only one industry on the river so we know who they are suggesting. They found copper, sodium and traces of formaldehyde. The Riverkeepers sent many of their samples to labs outside of the state. I'm sure that was to keep everyone honest. Since there has been no word as to the results of their testing, I assume they are not in yet. Also, they are a nonprofit organization butting heads with government agencies. I'm sure they are having to tread just a bit lightly before "you know" may hit the fan. Legal advise may also be in order. If everything was all clear, the fishing ban would not still be enforced. All agencies are still investigating. And yes, many stories are going around. Hopefully we will get some real answers soon.


----------



## justfishin

*?*

Question? I just read that dead fish were found all the way to the coast. http://www.gpb.org/news/2011/05/27/fish-warning-remains-on-ogeechee-river
Call me stupid.. but since the fishing warning is still effect in Chatham and Bryan, then am I to assume that it includes the entire river to the ocean? I have not seen much mention of the saltwater/brackish section of the river.


----------



## justfishin

I've posted this on another forum but just want to pass it on here. Senator Jack Hill will be attending the meeting at Dasher's. He is bringing officials from the EPD and DNR according to Holli Bragg at the Statesboro Herald. Bring your walking shoes and cooler. From the people I have spoken to, it looks as though there may be a huge turnout.


----------



## justfishin

fishtail said:


> They do have a list of who's been there, just gotta go through the motions. Ain't been but 2 area's open along that point for almost a week.


They may not have been checked in. Since they were poaching on a military installation then they were pretty brave. But they are also idiots so it would not surprise me if they were checked in. I was told by someone ( a relative) that was at Landing 3 over the weekend..some guys pulled up and said they were going out to shoot frogs.
Huh?!


----------



## croaker

JHB141 said:


> , but they found levels of copper, sodium, and formaldehyde. .



JHB,  who is the "they" you are refering to that found formaldehyde?

croaker


----------



## justfishin

croaker said:


> JHB,  who is the "they" you are refering to that found formaldehyde?
> 
> croaker


CROAKER.. Sorry, not JHB, but EPA found the formaldehyde. Here is a link..
coastalsenior.savannahnow.com/news/2011-05-27/ogeechee-cleared-swimming-not-yet-fishing


----------



## croaker

Thanks!


----------



## SASS249

Just released:


Legislators Announce Public Meeting Addressing Recent Fish Kill on the
Ogeechee River



ATLANTA - State Representatives Jon Burns (R-Newington), Ann Purcell
(R-Rincon), and Jan Tankersley (R-Brooklet), along with State Senators
Jack Hill (R-Reidsville) and Jesse Stone (R-Waynesboro), will host a
public meeting with the Georgia Department of Natural Resources and the
Georgia Environmental Protection Division on Tuesday, June 7th, at 7:00
PM in Effingham County Middle School to provide information on the
recent fish kill on the Ogeechee River.  Residents of Bryan, Effingham,
and Screven counties are strongly encouraged to attend this public
meeting addressing the numerous fish that died in the Ogeechee River.

For additional information about this meeting, please contact Rep.
Burns' capitol office at 404-656-5099.  



WHO:             Representative Jon Burns

Representative Ann Purcell

Representative Jan Tankersley

Senator Jack Hill

Senator Jesse Stone

Georgia Department of Natural Resources (DNR)

Georgia Environmental Protection Division (EPD)



WHAT:           Public meeting to provide information on the recent fish
kill on the Ogeechee River


----------



## rglinton66

So is the meeting at Dasher's Landing on the 5 still on?


----------



## justfishin

ORK just released some of their findings on Facebook. Here is their statement..

 As of right now, our samples reveal extremely high levels of sodium and sulfate, we have some more analysis to do. We have high PH levels also. The lab that tested fish came up with the same bacteria in the fish but ORK is doing further testing.


----------



## justfishin

rglinton66 said:


> So is the meeting at Dasher's Landing on the 5 still on?



ORK just asked everyone to attend the meeting June 5 at Dasher's so I'm assuming it's still on. Wayne Carrey was the organizer for that meeting. It has been in the works for well over a week. The meeting at the middle school seems to be a very recent politically organized meeting. Guess they prefer an air conditioned location versus 98 degree heat with little ol' us. I have asked ORK if they are also attending the June 7 meeting. Thanks fellas for making so much noise. It seems they must have heard.


----------



## sleepindawg

Good to know that we are getting a response from our representatvies however delayed it may be.  I know two of them personally,  and they are good, honest people...I believe that they will make an effort to try to get to the truth and see that both sides get a fair shake...however,  I'm afraid  that some people are going to have to be put under oath before we find out everything that's happened.  I will still plan to attend the earlier scheduled meeting in Blitchton, and then make a decision on attending the later one.


----------



## quailchaser

rglinton66 said:


> So is the meeting at Dasher's Landing on the 5 still on?



Yes. I drove by there yesterday afternoon and the sign is up announcing the meeting.


----------



## rglinton66

I will never get those two hours back! Epd and dnr were no shows.  No info was giving that is not on this thread.


----------



## SASS249

FYI EPD and DNR were not invited to the Sunday meeting.  That is why there is a meeting Tuesday night.  

By the time of  meeting Tuesday all the sampling data should be available and posted to the web.


----------



## athensbass




----------



## justfishin

SASS249 said:


> FYI EPD and DNR were not invited to the Sunday meeting.  That is why there is a meeting Tuesday night.
> 
> By the time of  meeting Tuesday all the sampling data should be available and posted to the web.


According to Holli Bragg, reporter for the Statesboro Herald, Wayne Carrey, the Dasher's meeting organizer, said that Sen. Jack Hill was suppose to bring DNR and EPD officials to today's meeting. I'm sure once it was well thought out, they were concerned about security. Can't blame them in light of all the mudslinging, whether justified or not. I was not able to attend today's meeting but I heard that it was pretty much a waste of time. Any thoughts?


----------



## rglinton66

Y





SASS249 said:


> FYI EPD and DNR were not invited to the Sunday meeting.  That is why there is a meeting Tuesday night.
> 
> By the time of  meeting Tuesday all the sampling data should be available and posted to the web.


You can save that for someone else.  Jack Hill new to come and epd was not invited?  I called myself and asked if they would come.  I don't know why you keep defending their actions.


----------



## rglinton66

justfishin said:


> According to Holli Bragg, reporter for the Statesboro Herald, Wayne Carrey, the Dasher's meeting organizer, said that Sen. Jack Hill was suppose to bring DNR and EPD officials to today's meeting. I'm sure once it was well thought out, they were concerned about security. Can't blame them in light of all the mudslinging, whether justified or not. I was not able to attend today's meeting but I heard that it was pretty much a waste of time. Any thoughts?



I didn't learn anything new but making your voice heard by your political representatives is never a waist of time.  I had 10 things I would have rather done tonight, but nothing more important.


----------



## georgia jeff

I was there.   The politicians all stated that they were concerned and wanted to get to the bottom of this.  The Riverkeeper stated that they found some chemicals up to levels of 500 parts per million or (billion) below King Americas discharge pipe as compared to less than 3 parts per million or (billion) above the pipe.  She also encouraged everyone to file formal compaints with the EPA and EPD and not just call because they could ingnore calls.  That was about the only good information given out.  An elderly man spoke about how he had been fighting to get the plant closed for decades and that the river wouldn't be the same until it was shut down.  Some people from the audience asked a few questions and that was about it.  

I was glad to hear Senator Jack Hill mention restocking the river.  I think that this is an absolute neccessity and I hope everyone writes their congressmen and pushes this issue.  Not only do we need to find out who did this and make sure that it never happens again but the river needs to be restored to its previous condition or better as fast as possible.


----------



## mtr3333

This looks like a meeting to "test the waters" of the opposition. Politicians are good at it. If they did not percieve a serious threat, nothing will be done. 
 G-Jeff, did you get the feeling they were taking it seriuosly? After all the River Keeper lady made her suggestion to file a formal complaint. In the company she was in, I can only think she knew something but could only make her suggestion. The court is the only place her info will help make a determination. Hopefully that complaint will be filed.
  I hope that the appeasement will not be dumping more fish in and everyone will be happy. Oh, It is probably parts per million for her data.


----------



## radams1228

Ogeechee Riverkeepers just posted the link to these results.  

http://http://www.epaosc.org/site/doc_list.aspx?site_id=6945


----------



## Southernhoundhunter

just saw the story on wtoc... The EPA is now saying they may never know what caused the kill, and now its killing mussels which are immune to the bacterial infection....supposedly formaldahyde and hydrogine peroxicide just "happened" to show up in the river.  These people are all full of crap.


----------



## bpoulin

The link is bad?


----------



## justfishin

bpoulin said:


> The link is bad?



Try this one..
http://www.epaosc.org/site/doc_list.aspx?site_id=6945


----------



## justfishin

rglinton66 said:


> I didn't learn anything new but making your voice heard by your political representatives is never a waist of time.  I had 10 things I would have rather done tonight, but nothing more important.



Oh, they have definitely heard from me! My point was that nothing was really solved nor any new information shared at the meeting. The ORK facebook page has much of the same information.
On another note, at looking at the EPA's findings, I was a bit surprised by this..
 "Formaldehyde was detected in river sediment at the outfall at 310 uglkg and again at the
furthest downstream station at 190 uglkg relative to a Dutch Intervention value for serious
contamination of 100 uglkg. EPA Region 4 does not have a screening value for formaldehyde in
sediments."  NO SCREENING VALUE?! Formaldehyde is used in flame retardant fabrics in textile miles. I would think that there should be a screening value in place for this region. Ya think?


----------



## croaker

georgia jeff said:


> II was glad to hear Senator Jack Hill mention restocking the river.  I think that this is an absolute neccessity and I hope everyone writes their congressmen and pushes this issue.




The politician(s) mention of restocking is a pipe dream at best, a terminalogical inexactitude at worst...

Since the spill killed a lot of fish, more than likely it killed a lot of invertabrates (crustatceans, mollusks, amphibians and insects).

 Even if fish were stocked, they wouldn't have anything to eat.


----------



## mtr3333

Southernhoundhunter said:


> just saw the story on wtoc... The EPA is now saying they may never know what caused the kill, and now its killing mussels which are immune to the bacterial infection....supposedly formaldahyde and hydrogine peroxicide just "happened" to show up in the river. These people are all full of crap.


 


croaker said:


> The politician(s) mention of restocking is a pipe dream at best, a terminalogical inexactitude at worst...
> 
> Since the spill killed a lot of fish, more than likely it killed a lot of invertabrates (crustatceans, mollusks, amphibians and insects).
> 
> Even if fish were stocked, they wouldn't have anything to eat.


 

 I smell something like a cover up.


----------



## Splash

This story reeks! Can't wait to hear how the meeting goes tonight. Nitrates, phosphates, ph, temperatures, mystery bacteria,...there's way too many stressors that are not part of the natural order of things. The Ogeechee makes the state money. The powers that be will not let a lil' contamination and wildlife death stop their money party. A similar issue arose around Lake Lanier several years ago. Chemical contamination to streams, and watersheds that feed the lake were contaminated by local chicken-processing plants, poor septic systems, house boat dumping, etc. That story was squashed by lake-local Chambers of Commerce and the Lake Lanier spokespeople. 

Here's some of the recent propaganda. 
http://www.thecoastalsource.com/new...geechee-fish-kill/EhdLFVj6D0ei3i-o1p9Riw.cspx

http://savannahnow.com/news/2011-06-06/epa-ogeechee-river-fish-kill-may-remain-unsolved


----------



## Splash

By the way, thank you to all who are actively able to participate in these meetings. I live in Atlanta, but grew up in S.Ga and fished quite a bit on the Ogeechee, Altamaha, Satilla, etc. Please keep pressing for the truth. We "friends of the river" are doing what we can from up here, but local involvement/grassroots is really what's needed. This is our backyard. We won't stand for this.


----------



## rglinton66

So EPD is going to have a public meeting tonight to say they don't know what killed the fish! Unbelievable.  Their report in a nutshell says we found a lot of bad stuff but not at levels that could have killed the fish.


----------



## Splash

Probably the most obvious problem with this report is the timeliness (or lack thereof) of it's collection. Any chemical concentration will disperse over time. Add dilution factors, rate of flow of the river, etc.  and like Magic! - no problem. Beyond ridiculous that this is the science that they are offering. Don't buy it even if it's free.


----------



## mtr3333

They are trying to make it easy to give up and just accept it. There is probably a web of deception that someone cannot escape. Some aspiring news investigator could probably tangle them up.


----------



## georgia jeff

The whole argument of unseansonably warm temperature and low flow rates are a bunch of bull.  I have lived in Georgia all my life and it is ALWAYS hot this time of year.  Also the Ogeechee river bottoms out around 2.5 ft on the Rocky Ford river guage EVERY year.  Sure it got down to 2.5 ft about a month early this year (usually happens in mid to late June but got low around mid May this year).  If this argument was true then a fish kill would happen EVERY year about mid June when the river got low and the weather got hot.  

King Finishing also dumps chemicals into the river EVERY year.  Therefore something had to change.  Either they dumped something different, more of it, or a combination of some natural weakness combined with what they are dumping has killed the fish.  The later is what the news and EPD want us to buy.  However, my point is that even if it is a combination of nature and chemicals that are being dumped then we need to change what we can control and make them dump less chemicals or NO chemicals at all.


----------



## LonePine

Splash said:


> By the way, thank you to all who are actively able to participate in these meetings. I live in Atlanta, but grew up in S.Ga and fished quite a bit on the Ogeechee, Altamaha, Satilla, etc. Please keep pressing for the truth. We "friends of the river" are doing what we can from up here, but local involvement/grassroots is really what's needed. This is our backyard. We won't stand for this.



I'm in the same boat.  We need to let these people know that we won't stand for this


----------



## danbo

*On the take*

It would seem that someone is on the take to protect this company. It might be wise to start a fund with the River Keeper and hire a law dawg......


----------



## georgia jeff

I read in the Statesboro Hearald today that several (atleast 3) landowners and one individual who got sick from swimming in the river are suing King Finishing.  They have hired a lawyer and have filed a court case.  I truly believe this is the only way anything is going to happen.


----------



## radams1228

I was reminded this week of something else that might have ramifications on the river.  A few months ago(November I think), a train derailed in Midville and there was a chemical spill. EPD was involved, closed the roads for miles and there was a mandatory evacuation of homes.  Clean up and clearing the tracks took about a week.  

Pure speculation on my part here, but what if that chemical made it into the river(train tracks are close enough) and have been slowly filtering down the river. These chemicals, coupled with all the other "conditions", brought about the fish kill. Then not only should King finishing be held responsible, but so should the railroad and/or clean-up crews associated with the train derailment.


----------



## georgia jeff

Those chemicals, if they got in the river, would have had to mixed with something below the pipe at King Finishing to destory the fish because no fish are dead above their discharge pipe.


----------



## Mr. Woodsman

liar liar pants on fire


----------



## simpleman30

well, i reckon i'm gonna take my chances in the river tomorrow.  me and the lady are gonna put in at meldrim and float down to morgan's bridge.  hopefully we won't come out with blisters or tails or anything else we didn't start out with.


----------



## georgia jeff

simpleman30 said:


> well, i reckon i'm gonna take my chances in the river tomorrow.  me and the lady are gonna put in at meldrim and float down to morgan's bridge.  hopefully we won't come out with blisters or tails or anything else we didn't start out with.



Simpleman30,
Please post an update to this thread or the one I started about a week ago "Ogeechee river fishing report" about how you do on the water.  I would love to know if you catch any fish, if you see live fish or dead fish.  What percentage of fish are you seeing or catching compared to before the fish kill.  Any info would be appreciated.  I posted some earlier results about my trip to Shearhouse Landing (Stilson area).  Thanks.


----------



## simpleman30

jeff, we're just going on a kayak trip, but i may try to take an ultralite rod/reel and a couple of beetle-spins.  i'll let you know what happens.  after going to the meeting at effingham middle school on tuesday, i'm fairly discouraged.  DNR claims that there is up to 80% less fish below King Finishing now than before the incident.  estimated 35,000 +/- fish killed according to DNR's findings and they say that is a low estimate.  75% of those were panfish/sunfish, i.e. redbreast, bream, bluegill, etc.


----------



## rglinton66

Jeff, I'm going to go from Rocky Ford to the Sportsman club right above 301 this weekend, camping on my way down.  That covers several miles above king and a few below.  I will post what I see.


----------



## slab_slayer

simpleman30 said:


> jeff, we're just going on a kayak trip, but i may try to take an ultralite rod/reel and a couple of beetle-spins.  i'll let you know what happens.  after going to the meeting at effingham middle school on tuesday, i'm fairly discouraged.  DNR claims that there is up to 80% less fish below King Finishing now than before the incident.  estimated 35,000 +/- fish killed according to DNR's findings and they say that is a low estimate.  75% of those were panfish/sunfish, i.e. redbreast, bream, bluegill, etc.



A lot of people do not realize when they say 35,000 plus fish that the number was what you could see, just think about the small fry and stuff that was killed.  Some fish had already spawned, that was the first to go!


----------



## georgia jeff

rglinton66 said:


> Jeff, I'm going to go from Rocky Ford to the Sportsman club right above 301 this weekend, camping on my way down.  That covers several miles above king and a few below.  I will post what I see.



That info would be great.  You will get a first hand look at the initial kill zone.  I know people are catching fish above the pipe.  But I am really curious if there are still any bass left below the pipe.  Your trip will almost be like a "before and after" experience.  Any info you can provide would be great.  Thanks.


----------



## georgia jeff

slab_slayer said:


> A lot of people do not realize when they say 35,000 plus fish that the number was what you could see, just think about the small fry and stuff that was killed.  Some fish had already spawned, that was the first to go!



I didn't make it to the meeting in Effingham County.  The one at Dashers wasn't very impressive.  This meeting sounds more informative.  Hearing that this many fish died makes me won't to vomit.  I can't believe that it wiped out that many.  

When I put in at Shearhouse landing a week or so after the kill we saw plenty of dead bass and mudfish to go along with the dead sunfish.  Sickening!


----------



## georgia jeff

I may try to hit an effected part of the river next week if I can slip away from the house.  If so I will post the details.


----------



## jabb06

i have fished below 301 bridge,williams & at oliver all in the last week with only one redbreast & 2 stump knockers caught.We did see 2 gators below oliver bridge.May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the armpits of whoever did this.


----------



## simpleman30

jeff,  we had a great time on the river today.  i didn't take a pole with me, but i did see a fair amount of fish.  i've never been in the river when it was this low so it was certainly a treat to travel downriver by kayak and enjoy the scenery.  i don't think i've ever seen the river so clear.  and i never knew the bottom of the ogeechee river was rocky!  guess it was sandstone or compacted sand or something.  we had to get out and drag the boats across a few rock flats where it was too shallow to float across.  anyhow, we saw plenty of mullet, quite a few schools of young bass and other schools of young fish.  even saw a few schools of minnows jumping, being chased by other fish i'm sure.  we saw plenty of gar between 1' and 2'+.  saw a few wood ducks too.  we did not see any dead fish or remnants of dead fish on bottom.  to be honest, everything appeared to be the same as before, but i don't know how many fish were killed as a far downriver as we were.  we made the trip from I-16 downriver to morgan's bridge in about 3 and a half hours.  the man we rented the kayaks from that runs ogeechee kayak and canoe rentals is joining the class action lawsuit and seemed very optimistic that in time the evidence would be presented and the parties involved will pay dearly.  he said there are people camping out on jackson branch where the supposed "plugged pipe" dumps into the river and watching every move made, day and night, around king america finishing.


----------



## georgia jeff

jabb06 said:


> i have fished below 301 bridge,williams & at oliver all in the last week with only one redbreast & 2 stump knockers caught.We did see 2 gators below oliver bridge.May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the armpits of whoever did this.



That was similar to my experience when I went to Shearhouse about a week after the spill.  I didn't even get a bite.  I have been fishing in the Ogeechee for years and have never failed to catch atleast one bass.  Thanks for the update.


----------



## georgia jeff

simpleman30 said:


> jeff,  we had a great time on the river today.  i didn't take a pole with me, but i did see a fair amount of fish.  i've never been in the river when it was this low so it was certainly a treat to travel downriver by kayak and enjoy the scenery.  i don't think i've ever seen the river so clear.  and i never knew the bottom of the ogeechee river was rocky!  guess it was sandstone or compacted sand or something.  we had to get out and drag the boats across a few rock flats where it was too shallow to float across.  anyhow, we saw plenty of mullet, quite a few schools of young bass and other schools of young fish.  even saw a few schools of minnows jumping, being chased by other fish i'm sure.  we saw plenty of gar between 1' and 2'+.  saw a few wood ducks too.  we did not see any dead fish or remnants of dead fish on bottom.  to be honest, everything appeared to be the same as before, but i don't know how many fish were killed as a far downriver as we were.  we made the trip from I-16 downriver to morgan's bridge in about 3 and a half hours.  the man we rented the kayaks from that runs ogeechee kayak and canoe rentals is joining the class action lawsuit and seemed very optimistic that in time the evidence would be presented and the parties involved will pay dearly.  he said there are people camping out on jackson branch where the supposed "plugged pipe" dumps into the river and watching every move made, day and night, around king america finishing.



There are many spots on the Ogeechee that have large rocky flats.  There is even a short waterfall upriver of Oliver Bridge when the river is low like it is now.  Sounds like you had a great day.  Maybe the fish kill wasn't as bad that far down river as it was closer to the discharge pipe.  
I'm glad he is joining the lawsuit.  It will take legal action to get anything accomplished unfortunately.


----------



## dadsbuckshot

Any updates?


----------



## jabb06

check out the article in todays savannah morning news.its easy to see this reporter has no idea about how we feel about the river.by the way she writes about it looks like she thinks we're all backwoods rednecks.


----------



## mtr3333

jabb06 said:


> check out the article in todays savannah morning news.its easy to see this reporter has no idea about how we feel about the river.by the way she writes about it looks like she thinks we're all backwoods rednecks.


 
 That is probably because of advertisng demographic studies. She is appealing to her audience. Her primary audience that pays the bills doesn't share the same passion for the outdoors as our micro-segment.

 Sad, but true. Like I said way back in this thread, it will have to affect the Chattahoochee, Savannah, Flint, or another river that impacts more people. That company pretty much owns everything involved, if this goes no further.


----------



## jabb06

thats the way its looking mt3333.i guess for them to understand they would have to lose a large source of enjoyment in their lives as we have.


----------



## mtr3333

12,834 views on this thread. Anyone of you moved for a call to action?


----------



## jabb06

what do you have in mind? all 12834 of show up & bathe & urinate in the pools of the offenders or people who cover this up?.


----------



## mtr3333

Should the Atlanta media go for it?


----------



## georgia jeff

mtr3333 said:


> 12,834 views on this thread. Anyone of you moved for a call to action?



As I posted earlier, I contacted senator Jack Hill and requested that this not be swept under the rug, to find the guilty party and make them pay, and to restock the river.  I also spoke with him at the meeting at Dashers landing and expressed these same points.  I probably should follow up and see if anything is going to actually be done.

I highly encourage everyone to do the same or this could easily die (like our fish).  It only takes about 5 minutes to send an email.


----------



## Deadduck

If you are a property owner or someone who was affected by swimming in the Ogeechee River the following link is the website of the attorneys that are handling the class action lawsuit. There is a link so you can see the lawsuit that was filed.

see
http://www.hallmanwingate.com/


----------



## mtr3333

georgia jeff said:


> As I posted earlier, I contacted senator Jack Hill and requested that this not be swept under the rug, to find the guilty party and make them pay, and to restock the river. I also spoke with him at the meeting at Dashers landing and expressed these same points. I probably should follow up and see if anything is going to actually be done.
> 
> I highly encourage everyone to do the same or this could easily die (like our fish). It only takes about 5 minutes to send an email.


 
Great work! My hat is off to you Sir for your perseverence.


----------



## simpleman30

here's Sunday's article from the Savannah Morning News.  Thankfully they're keeping this situation in the paper.

http://savannahnow.com/bryan-county-now/2011-06-19/ogeechee-slice-heaven-spoiled#.TgHxU1vW7Fo


----------



## georgia jeff

I told you guys I'd post an update when I went fishing in the effected area and here it is...  I went fishing at a private landing in the Stilson area yesterday afternoon.  My buddy and I caught 3 bass and we saw one more swimming in the water.  We saw about 20 or so bream and 10 or so sucker fish.  In the deep holes we saw gar and we saw plenty of minnows.  

We only got about a total of 5 bites from bass and had almost a dozen bream tapping on lures (platic worms).  In previous years it would have been nothing to have boated 15 bass in the amount of time that we fished and we would have seen many more fish swimming.  

I am relieved that there are still some fish alive but if they do not restock the river it will take atleast 5 to 7 years before things get back to "normal".  I think the DNR estimates saying that about 70% of the fish were killed is about right, maybe even 80%.  I really encourage you guys to write your Congressmen and local political officials and push for them to restock the river and to do it soon or we will be looking at hard times for many years to come.


----------



## simpleman30

today's article from the sports page of the Savannah Morning News

http://savannahnow.com/sports/2011-...echee-rivers-pristine-reputation#.TgyI-2HW7Fo


----------



## georgia jeff

Fishing update:  I fished Morgans Bridge tuesday.  A friend and I put in at 6:00 AM and quit fishing about 11:30 AM.  We caught three bass all between 1 lb. and 1 1/2 lbs.  We had two more bites but they got off.  We saw very few bass swimming around in the water.  We had a decent number of Redbreast bites while we were fishing plastic worms and saw a decent number of small bream.  We saw plenty of gar and suckers but very few bass.  From my experience fishing Morgans and the Stilson area since the fish kill it is my opinion that the bass and decent sized bream populations were hurt the most while the gar sucker populations were hurt the least.  I can not believe that the fish kill wiped out the fish all the way down to highway 204.  Is anyone else catching anything?


----------



## Deadduck

Thanks to GON for their article in the current edition. Please keep the fish kill in the news or it will simply fade away.


----------



## pine nut

Deadduck said:


> Thanks to GON for their article in the current edition. Please keep the fish kill in the news or it will simply fade away.



I agree! TTT


----------



## georgia jeff

I hope they keep running articles or this thing is going to die down quicker than the fish died.  I haven't heard any talk lately about restocking have you?  That is what everyone needs to be pushing for if you want to catch any fish in the next 5 years.


----------



## simpleman30

http://www.statesboroherald.com/section/1/article/33047/preview/

i'm not a subscriber to their online version of the newspaper so i can't view the article.  maybe someone can get the text and post the entire article.


----------



## simpleman30

and here's the same story from WTOC.  it is absolutely sickening that these folks are dumping this stuff in the river blatantly, even to the point of turning the river and its banks black and blue but yet the state refuses to do anything about it.  how is this place not shut down?

http://www.wtoc.com/story/15110435/king-america-finishing-facing-possible-new-lawsuit


----------



## rawolfee

Here's a video from the Statesboro Herald.

http://www.statesboroherald.com/multimedia/3155/


----------



## Seering

After seeing the video of the pipe pouring out crap into the river... Wonder if a giant cork and 2-3 bags of quickset concrete might help...

*rant off*

Maybe it could assist in finding where its being "leaked" from.


----------



## simpleman30

i'd like to pump something back up into the plant and light a match.


----------



## panoz11

The river can't fix it's self if they keep dumping that CRAP in our river .......


----------



## mtr3333

King America ain't skeerd.


----------



## georgia jeff

I still think that the best answer is to get rid of all of the government reguations and have just one law:  You can't dump the water into the river but instead have to pump the water back into the plants water fountains and all employees must drink it.


----------



## greencracker

mtr3333 said:


> Should the Atlanta media go for it?



As Atlanta media, I can say (alas) the story's not going to pick up here.  Newspapers are so short-staffed there's no environmental reporters anymore.  And of course Atlanta TV won't go too far from home.  Even the Savannah paper only has part of one person to cover politicians on site when they go to the state capitol.

That means you  probably wont have media holding your elected officials' feet to the fire when they get here for the legislative session (or your DNR board members) -- unless yall keep it LOUD and on the agenda.


----------



## sleepindawg

On Thursday,Ogeechee Riverkeeper filed a separate lawsuit against King America, claiming the plant continues to discharge pollutants into the Ogeechee.


----------



## georgia jeff

greencracker said:


> As Atlanta media, I can say (alas) the story's not going to pick up here.  Newspapers are so short-staffed there's no environmental reporters anymore.  And of course Atlanta TV won't go too far from home.  Even the Savannah paper only has part of one person to cover politicians on site when they go to the state capitol.
> 
> That means you  probably wont have media holding your elected officials' feet to the fire when they get here for the legislative session (or your DNR board members) -- unless yall keep it LOUD and on the agenda.



Senator Jack Hill seems to be concerned.  I know he fishes or owns a place on the Ohoopee so maybe he feels our pain.  I emailed him again and asked him if there was an active plan in place to restock the river.  He stated that a man from DNR had removed fish eggs from the river (I am assuming prior to the fish kill) and are hatching them for release back into the river possibly as early as September.  He aslo stated that a group of legislatures will be meeting with DNR and the EPd when they get back in session in August.  I am a little more optimistic now.  However, this doesn't sound like a "major" restocking effort in my opion but I don't know all of the details.


----------



## sleepindawg

I hope that Sen. Hill is also working to get King Finishing in compliance with federal guidelines...and if necessary have those guidelines reviewed and strengthened so that  a restocking effort can be successful.  Simply put, if the plant has been in compliance, and within legal limits, then those limits need to be reduced...or an event such as the most recent fish kill (or worse) is bound happen again.  That is where the politicians can be of the most help to us. They should make sure that the laws protecting the river are adequate and that they are well enforced...but the most urgent need is that the polluters be stopped immediately...and apparently they don't intend to do so until a judge demands it.  If you love the Ogeechee and haven't joined Riverkeeper you might want to rethink...that group needs financial support since they've hired lawyers to fight for our river.    Jeff, I thank you for contacting Sen. Hill...and I appreciate  Sen. Hill's agreeing to help with restocking efforts...but more actions are needed from him, Rep. Burns et al, including some that may have some political and economic aftershock.


----------



## georgia jeff

I agree with you sleepindawg, they definately need to stop the cause of the fish kill and not just fix the damage.  He mentioned that they may discuss "river classification".  Hopefully this means that they might change the classification as to not allow the dumping of chemicals.  I sure hope that they are more efficient that those lug nuts in Washington.


----------



## GA CHEROKEE

what is the world coming to


----------



## Creek Steward

Has anyone figured out if the Mr. Dodd at the textile plant is the same one who was in Alabama? And are they making any progress cleaning up the water?


----------



## georgia jeff

I can't answer the question about Mr. Dodd.  They have not done a single thing to clean up the water.  They were trying to figure out the cause but nothing is being done to clean it up because they are saying that it is a naturally occuring bacteria caused by stress.  Unfortunately the EPD won't admit that it was chemicals from King Finishing that caused the stress.  They continue to dump chemicals in the river.


----------



## mesocollins

I'm taking a kayak fishing/camping trip with a couple of friends monday/tuesday from the 204 ramp down to highway 17. Anyone know how the river's doin down river from 204? Send me a pm if anyone wants to go with us and we'll meet you there. I'll post how we fair.


----------



## mesocollins

mesocollins said:


> I'm taking a kayak fishing/camping trip with a couple of friends monday/tuesday from the 204 ramp down to highway 17. Anyone know how the river's doin down river from 204? Send me a pm if anyone wants to go with us and we'll meet you there. I'll post how we fair.




scratch that, we'll be going tuesday and wednesday


----------



## jabb06

anyone had any luck catching anything lately?


----------



## panoz11

The ogeechee  river keeper posted on facebook yesterday that fish are still dying in the river . There are not enough fish left to make it a major kill so it's not getting in the news .


----------



## Creek Steward

Where is the news of the new fish kill? I went to the Riverkeepers web site and cannot find anything.


----------



## Creek Steward

O.K. I see it was on Facebook. Is there any verification of this?


----------



## simpleman30

just saw on the Ogeechee Riverkeeper's facebook page where black liquid was dumping out of the outfall pipe again this weekend and lots more dead fish could be seen downriver from KAF.


----------



## whchunter

*Payoff*

Send me a big check and I won't say anything. need campaign funds quick...............


----------



## panoz11

the number for the man to complain to at the EPA his name is Rick 404-562-8764.... i have called it twice can't seem to get him on the phone


----------



## simpleman30

here we go again.  when is something going to be done about this?  

http://www.wtoc.com/story/15479539/ogeechee-river-swimmers-get-blisters


----------



## panoz11

now they are blaming it on drought conditions , not al the chemicals king finishing is dumping in the river . thank god a new election year is coming up . if you are voted in as a representative you better help get us some answers or we will help you out of office. i have called my reps in effingham county with no response back and left my number . no response back from john burns or ann purcell .i also called the EPA no response . posted the number on here for everybody to call .


----------



## jabb06

if you are voted in as a representative you better help get us some answers or we will help you out of office. 

 amen brother...i hope everyone remembers all this bull when they are standing in the voting booth


----------



## mtr3333

I guess when there are no more fish left to pop up dead, we will only have swimmers to use as guinea pigs.


----------



## jabb06

thats probably why they lifted the swimming ban back in the summer so that they could see what would happen to the people that went back to swimming in the river.drought conditions dont cause blisters...something that was added to the water causes the blisters.


----------



## simpleman30

http://chronicle.augusta.com/news/b...-plant-accepts-blame-ogeechee-river-fish-kill

looks like we may have some answers.  by the way, there's  a meeting saturday at dasher's landing in eden/blitchton off HWY 80.


----------



## Deadduck

Now we know what the Ogeechee River is worth, a measly 1 million dollars. This is a slap on the wrist I hope that the two ongoing lawswits will take the company down.
King finishing should never be allowed to discharge any materials in any river anywhere in the United States, that my friends would be a message.


----------



## sleepindawg

DNR began restocking today near Oliver...but it's business as usual for King Finishing.  Georgia taxpayers are really getting the shaft on this thing... but it looks good from the politicians viewpoint.


----------



## simpleman30

here's a good article from GPTV.  

http://www.gpb.org/news/2011/10/13/outrage-on-the-ogeechee


----------



## mtr3333

Deadduck said:


> Now we know what the Ogeechee River is worth, a measly 1 million dollars. This is a slap on the wrist I hope that the two ongoing lawswits will take the company down.
> King finishing should never be allowed to discharge any materials in any river anywhere in the United States, that my friends would be a message.


 


sleepindawg said:


> DNR began restocking today near Oliver...but it's business as usual for King Finishing. Georgia taxpayers are really getting the shaft on this thing... but it looks good from the politicians viewpoint.


 
 I hate to say it, but you guys are right. Shameful.


----------



## SeeinStripes

simpleman30 said:


> here's a good article from GPTV.
> 
> http://www.gpb.org/news/2011/10/13/outrage-on-the-ogeechee



That is a good article.  Wouldn't you think at least once out of the 5 years the EPD was inspecting the plant while they were discharging this fire-retardant effluent that one of the inspectors would ask the question, "Do you have any new pipes, or are you discharging any potentially hazardous materials into the river?"  

I have been on the Ogeechee a couple of times and it's a special river.  I hate it for everybody who lives there, fishes it, or is affected directly by this tragedy.  I'm hoping for a fast recovery to the fish population for you fisher guys!  However, I would be fearful that the balance of all wildlife (fish, reptiles, mammals, invertebrate, and plant) will take decades to return to the pre-accident equilibrium.


----------



## jack10

wow is there any river in east Georgia that does not have a pollution problem?  that makes you want to break your fishing pole in half.


----------



## sleepindawg

I have fished the Ogeechee, Canoochee, and Ohoopee rivers for more than five decades.  I can remember when you could see schools of mullet well over a hundred yards long. Stripers, or "rockfish" as we called them could be caught regularly along with the redbreast for which these rivers were reknowned. When the river was "right" it was common for two men to fill a 48 quart cooler with perch, jack and bass  and still have time to have a fish fry before dark. Of course those days are long gone, but I just don't believe the sportsmen who use these waters today realize how much the "biological capacity" of these ecosystems has been reduced.  The debacle with King Finishing proves how ineffective the EPD really is...and how closely aligned it is with the very industries we expect it to police.  I understand that environmental lawyers representing Ogeechee Riverkeeper are now taking action against EPD for its lack of action in regards to King Finishing.  It's about time...I sent Riverkeeper a check last week and I will continue to support them.  However, those area politicians who apparently have little or no influence with EPD shouldn't count on much support from me come election time.


----------



## Gordon

http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2011-10-27/


----------



## Deadduck

I guess you all saw that the ogeechee made number one on the dirty dozen river list. Did you notice that they were on the list twice.


----------

