# Black Panthers in Georgia???



## RBaldree

How is it that folks would dispute the word of a professional who works for the state looking at animals for a living???

http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/16556404.htm

This guy claims to have been chased by one, and apparently was scared enough that he outran it, and went swimming counting on the panther to have better sense, I guess...


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## Booner Killa

THERE AREN'T ANY BLACK PANTHERS IN GEORGIA!!!!!


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## One-shot

Booner Killa said:


> THERE AREN'T ANY BLACK PANTHERS IN GEORGIA!!!!!



ARE TOO!!!!!


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## RackNBeardOutdoors

I just saw one when I glanced out the window, but at my house, we don't pay attention to them, we have about 10 running around here in the woods


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## kevincox

*Here's one I got a pic of yesterday!*

Black Panther pic!


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## NorthGaBowhunter

Stay out of those woods kevin, is it worth killing that big 150" buck to risk your life getting mauled by the big black cat.


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## kevincox

NorthGaBowhunter said:


> Stay out of those woods kevin, is it worth killing that big 150" buck to risk your life getting mauled by the big black cat.



yes!


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## DYI hunting

> chased into the Chattooga River by a 7-foot-long panther with “jet black” fur......Fletcher might have seen a river otter or a bobcat, state wildlife officials in Georgia and South Carolina said.


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## Dub

Keep on joking away.....all the jokes will come back to you one evening when your hunt is over and you've got a two mile hike out of the woods...in the dark....with a bow in your hand.

You'll have thoughts of the wampus kitty, and Sasquatch....and various other hobgoblins lurking around in the near shadows.....then a rabbit will jump up in front of you and have your heart racing triple time.


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## Booner Killa

and that is when I throw my bow at it and say git and hiss at it.


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## Dub

Yup....never underestimate the effectiveness of a well timed HISSSSS.


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## GrunterHunter

Trust me they are in the woods in Coffee and Jeff Davis Counties.  I got close and a little to personal  with one via 454 SS Chevrolet 1500 C/K.  Took out the airdam and both fog lights.


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## Lostoutlaw

Heck we gotem down town Atlanta think that is what they call themselfs


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## GrunterHunter

Yeah, yours walks down the middle of the street carrying guns, bats, etc ...  However when the sheets meet  and march they can't have said accessories.  Justice is so blind and whap-sided!!!


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## sghoghunter

I hear ya hunter.


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## David Alan Perry

You never know what you may run up on in the Georgia woods. There is no dought that we have panthers in Georgia. It doesn't matter much to me that everyone jokes about it. I'll bet you if it was a matter of life or death that you answer correctly yes or no to panthers in Georgia all the people joking about it would quickly answer yes. As far as black ones I'm sure that occures in the cat family in the wild just as it does with deer,yots and most other animales. Saw a black yote at BF Grant one year and didnt't even think about shooting it. It came right up to me as I was hooking my stand up. I knew I wasn't going to mess up my hunt over it no matter what color he was. I never got the stand hooked up because no sooner than he left a nice buck arrived. While checking the buck in I told Harry Luke about seeing the black yote. He was not going to accept it no kinda way. He said there where no black yotes on BF Grant and I must have seen someones dog. Now theres a man that is on the property every day and was sure that Iwas seeing things just because he had not seen him before. The state will always say, no not there forget it. Thats the best thing they can say if they want to see a come back.


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## vomStokes

There is no such thing as black panthers, in general.  Black panthers are actually black leopards.  So no, there are, technically, no black panthers anywhere.

As for panthers in Georgia, there have been tracks noted in North Georgia of "panthers," or those large cats related to the "panther" family.  There are very few DNR people that will admit this, and, of course, there are several "old-timers" who will stake their life on it that there are, indeed, panthers.  

Because of their rarity, it merely goes as denied, and the sounds of panthers screaming at night in some parts of the mountains gets washed off as a wild dog or some other animal.


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## pbradley

Dub said:


> Yup....never underestimate the effectiveness of a well timed HISSSSS.



hiss my big toe...I'll scream like a little girl if I have to...


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## South

Saw one once as a kid just up from Brier Creek in Screven County. Hard to mistake one of those for a bobcat or otter.


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## 60Grit

<TABLE style="MARGIN-LEFT: auto; MARGIN-RIGHT: auto; TEXT-ALIGN: left" height=766 cellSpacing=5 cellPadding=5 width=504 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width="100%" height=32><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL><SMALL>Are US 'Black Panthers' Actually Jaguarundi?</SMALL><SMALL>
</SMALL><SMALL>*by Chester Moore, Jr.*</SMALL> </SMALL>​</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width="100%"><SMALL>"Black panthers" exist in the United States.

This isn't a theory, hypothesis or hallucination, but a verifiable, undeniable fact.

No, science hasn't discovered a new cat species or a population of melanistic (black) cougars to explain alleged "black panther" sightings. They haven't even captured a black leopard that escaped from one of those circus train wrecks skeptics of cryptozoology so often speak of.

Yes, there are "black panthers" in the United States but believing in their existence doesn't require a leap of faith. It just calls for a new look at a known species: the jaguarundi.

The jaguarundi (_Felis yagouaroundi_) is known to range from South America to Texas, New Mexico and Arizona. And although not widely known by the public, jaguarundis are prime candidates for spawning "black panther" reports.

They are a medium-sized cat with a mean body size of 102 centimeters for females and 114 for males according to Mexican researcher Arturo Caso. Other sources list them as ranging from 100 to 120 centimeters with the tail making up the greatest part of the length. 

Most specimens are about 20 centimeters tall and sport a dark gray color while others are chocolate brown or blonde. 

A large jaguarundi crossing a road in front of a motorist or appearing before an unsuspecting hunter could easily be labeled a "black panther". Since very few people are aware of jaguarundis, it's highly unlikely they would report seeing one. The term "black panther" is quick and easy to report to others.

Everyone can relate to a "black panther".

*North of the border*

Jaguarundis are known to range from South America to the Mexican borders of Texas, Arizona and New Mexico. The key word here is "known". That means scientists have observed or captured the species within those areas, however they are reported to range much farther north in the Lone Star State and perhaps elsewhere.

Texas Parks and Wildlife Department (TPWD) officials solicited information from the public and received numerous reports of the species in the 1960s, including several sightings from central and east Texas. Additional sightings were reported from as far away as Florida, Oklahoma, and Colorado 

In a study conducted in 1984, TPWD biologists noted a string of unconfirmed jaguarundi sightings in Brazoria County, which corners the hugely populated areas of both Houston and Galveston.

Brazoria County is more than 200 miles north of the counties of Cameron and Willacy, which the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (Service) has designated as being the only confirmed areas of Texas that houses jaguarundis.

This is even more interesting when considering what TPWD biologist Terry Turney has to day.

Turney is now an endangered species biologist in Kendall County but spent the early part of his career in Port Arthur, Texas managing the J.D. Murphree Wildlife Management Area (WMA). On this 30,000-acre tract of mixed coastal prairie and marsh according to Turney is a population of jaguarundis.

"While I worked the Murphree Area one of the workers had seen three of them and the ranchers around the area as well as other members of the Murphree crew saw them fairly frequently. It was "those little gray cats" to them," Turney said.

"I had two of them in my neighborhood near Houston in the late 70s and the dogs would tree them every couple of weeks. They're about the most secretive critters around," he added. 

The J.D. Murphree WMA is more than 300 miles north of the Service's estimated range. How is it that state workers are seeing these cats in Port Arthur while the official word is they're only in the southern extremities of Texas?

In my opinion this is a great oversight by federal biologists who wrongly believe this cat to only inhabit a specific type of habitat. Jaguarundis are listed as an endangered species by the Service and full under federal jurisdiction. And for the most part what the Feds say goes with endangered species.

A study conducted by Arizona and federal scientists states that jaguarundi habitat, especially in South Texas, includes dense, thorny thickets of mesquite and stunted acacias known as chaparral. It also state less than one percent of this type of habitat is left along the US-Mexican border. 

That's true but jaguarundis are known to live in a variety of habitats, including rainforests, prairie, deciduous forests and marshland. It could very well be that very few jaguarundis live in that zone because of a lack of habitat. Most of that area has been converted to farmland. The game and habitat-rich areas along the Texas coast along with the Pineywoods and Hill Country region however is housing a population of jaguarundis that have slipped under the radar screen of federal officials.

*How far do they range?*

If there's any validity to the 1960s TPWD report, sightings have been recorded in several states bordering Texas. Since TPWD biologists say the cats are present in Port Arthur, which rests on the Texas-Louisiana border then it's likely the cats also inhabit that state. It's also possible they could range into Oklahoma and Arkansas. Gauging how far they might range throughout New Mexico and Arizona is more difficult because there have been few studies conducted there. Their ability to survive in solid desert is also questionable.

Florida has a resident population of jaguarundis that were imported into that state in the 1940s. Since the cats are so secretive it's difficult to gauge their population status, but it is generally believed to be healthy.

This begs the question of how far those transplanted cats have spread? Are they now in Georgia and Alabama, two states that have frequent "black panther" sightings?

More research needs to go into this matter.

*Personal research *

My interest in the jaguarundi connection to "black panther" sightings comes from a sighting that took place in the summer of 2001 near Port Arthur, Texas. At around 9 a.m. while driving in a rural area I witnessed a long, slender, gray-colored animal emerging from the brush on the side of the road at a distance of about 75 yards. When I approached to within 30 yards the animal slowly walked in the middle of the road and crossed into a brushy area on the other side. Having worked with more than 11 species of wild cats at the Exotic Cat & Wildlife Refuge in Kirbyville, Texas and spent time observing the cats at the Texas Zoo in Victoria I immediately identified the cat as a jaguarundi.

I was shocked at what I had seen, but remembered a local minister telling me about a biologist at the J.D. Murphree WMA, (which was less than a miles from where this sighting took place) seeing jaguarundis. That biologist was Terry Turney.

I returned to the area several times and have been able to cast a number of tracks. Jaguarundis have a footpad that is slightly different from the bobcat, which also inhabits the area, and after several comparisons to bobcat casts I have made it's obvious that at least some of the tracks are of jaguarundi origin.

Several of the tracks were made in a damp area and have absolutely perfect definition so an adequate review of field guide diagrams and photos of tracks taken in Mexican was made. The footpad of some of the others is too vague for me to give a positive identification. 

The best track by the way was found less than 150 yards from where I saw the cat in 2001.

At the time of this writing a Buckshot 35 motion-sensing camera has been put on a trail where the most recent tracks were found. I'm hoping a jaguarundi will step in front of it and give photographic evidence of this fascinating feline ranging more than 300 miles from where federal managers say it lives. 

</SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><TABLE width="100%" border=0><CAPTION align=bottom><SMALL>_Chester Moore points to a jaguarundi track near the area where he 
saw one. That's a Petersen's Field Guide in his hand. Jaguarundis have a 
slightly different foot pad than bobcats and domestic cats and Moore is 
meticulous about positively identifying animal sign._</SMALL></CAPTION><TBODY><TR><TD width="100%"><SMALL></SMALL><CENTER><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL>
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





</SMALL>
</CENTER><SMALL></SMALL></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><SMALL>

*In conclusion*

Is the jaguarundi responsible for all "black panther" reports in the United States? That's not likely.

Are they the source of many sightings in the South and Southwest? There is no doubt in my mind.

Besides the obvious physical characteristics that match them to "black panther" sightings there are some habits of the species that also lend credence to this theory.

Jaguarundis are diurnal meaning they hunt mostly in daylight hours and this goes along with many reportings I have collected of "black panthers."

Several eyewitnesses insisted the cat they saw wasn't a cougar or bobcat because they saw it in the middle of the day. They said they got a good look at a dark, long-tailed cat. Bobcats and cougars are chiefly nocturnal while the jaguarundi is a daylight dweller.

Looking back it's funny that for years I lamented at never seeing one of the "black panthers" I so frequently gathered reports of. It seemed as if I was living in a Mecca for mystery cat sightings, but a glimpse of the cat itself always eluded me.

Then I saw a jaguarundi cross the road in front of me. It took a little researching and thinking time for it to sink in, but I finally figured out I had seen a black panther.

It just came in a slightly different package than I was expecting.

</SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><SMALL></SMALL><TABLE width=465 border=0><CAPTION align=bottom><SMALL>_Here's a jaguarundi track with a quarter for comparison._</SMALL></CAPTION><TBODY></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


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## WSB

I wasn't going to tell this on here cause people treat you like your crazy. I was around 13 yrs. old, my father and I would ride through Lake Russell wma in the evenings and look for deer. We came to a field that we saw deer in about everytime we went, there were no deer that evening but there was something black walking down the far tree line, and I said to dad there's a dog and he said that aint a dog. We had bin. and we each took turns looking at it, and it was a big black cat. We watched it for a few min. before it went into the woods. My fathers mother and father both grew up on the wma before the goverment took it and I remember them talking of cats being there. Now whip away.


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## rumcreek

*black panthers ?????*

Earlier this year a young man was missing and the Bibb Co. Sheriffs office and Fire Dept were searching a swamp between I-75 and Ga hwy 247 and the officers stated they were confronted by a large cat defending her young. Who knows?????  I have personally seen a large black cat with a long thick tail running across hwy 94 just east of Fargo, Ga. while driving into Fla. about 10 years ago. I know it was a cat for sure but who knows if it was a panther, cougar, or whatever?? Definitely a large black cat.


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## hunter rich

The jaguarundi doesn't work because the size is way to small to be confused w/7 foot long animal.

Description: Coat of  gray fur, slender body up to 26 inches long, with stocky cat legs.


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## Fletch_W

There are no alligators in the upper Chattahoochee either..... right?


What the forest service individual probably saw was a black bear, many of which are on the Chattooga where this sighting occured. But it's not impossible that it was a black panther. I had a neighbor in Kennesaw many years ago that had all kinds of exotic wildlife before they were shut down and thrown in the looney bin, there were some lynxs and peacocks running around west cobb for a few years that had escaped. This couple also had a black panther. I know because I fed it a squirrel I shot with a pellet gun. There's no telling what redneck psychopath moonshiner meth runner somewhere in NE GA, SC, or NC had one of these and let it go or had it escape. But it's certainly possible.


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## Condor

*Mountain lion sighting*

2 years ago I was in a hunting club which was in very steep terrain right on the Alabama border in Heard county.   We had trail cameras out and we noticed that the deer had strange rake like lines in their hides on the back.   We thought it was mange or something.   The guys in the hunting club next to us (even steeper) claimed to have a picture of a mountain lion, (brownish in color, not black) on a trail camera.    I did not see the pictures but several people I know well saw it and said it was a mountain lion.    The president of the club that the picture was taken on did not want to publicisze the pictures for fear that it would bring the Feds & endangered species program with it so they perferred not to send them to GON, etc.    

I have been reading where mountain lions are coming back in some areas where they have not been seen in a long time and that they have big home ranges.    I believe that a few individual animals could be hanging out in some  remote areas of the Appalachins.


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## RJY66

I would not be a bit surprised to learn that there are plenty of cougars in Georgia.  I bet Atlanta is full of them.  You young single guys better watch out when going bar hopping.  One might pounce on ya!  It is not at all unlikely that some of them could be black as I understand they come in all colors!


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## hunter rich

RJY66 said:


> I would not be a bit surprised to learn that there are plenty of cougars in Georgia.  I bet Atlanta is full of them.  You young single guys better watch out when going bar hopping.  One might pounce on ya!  It is not at all unlikely that some of them could be black as I understand they come in all colors!



DUDE!! that is so wrong...Uhm...What bars are you talking about..Just so I can avoid 'em ofcourse...


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## cmghunter

I believe       




not


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## Backcountry

cmghunter said:


> I believe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not



come on eddie,
you told me the other day you saw one.....that ole lady on the club has one for a pet.  haha


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## cmghunter

Steven you must have miss understood me.
 I said i caught a glimpse of something hairy and smelly.
Later on i caught a glimpse of the old hag standing side ways in the daylight in a tank top.. 
 I 'm positive what i saw was two squirrels under each arm pit.
 I'm still a little shook up though.I haven't done any yote hunting in the dark since i saw this...
   At least were a black panther free lease in dawson county ,what a relief.


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## GAdawgMd

Seen one in Appling County a few years ago. One of my friends also caught one on a trail cam on the Altamaha River.


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## BowtechRedneck

Rum Creek: said Earlier this year a young man was missing and the Bibb Co. Sheriffs office and Fire Dept were searching a swamp between I-75 and Ga hwy 247 and the officers stated they were confronted by a large cat defending her young. Who knows????? I have personally seen a large black cat with a long thick tail running across hwy 94 just east of Fargo, Ga. while driving into Fla. about 10 years ago. I know it was a cat for sure but who knows if it was a panther, cougar, or whatever?? Definitely a large black cat.
Mix the comination of city folks and anxiety who rarly venture into the woods because fear of animals small dogs snakes spiders ect .When seeing a black hog or maybe a black bear that I do recall is common here = Black Panther
in there mind.


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## Georgia Hard Hunter

I'll repeat my post on the previous thread, there are countless trail cams operating right now in Georgia and not one of these will have the first black panther picture.


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## Mojo^

Black Panthers DO exist!


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## JoeyWommack

60Grit said:


> Most specimens are about 20 centimeters tall




Thats gotta be a miss print!  Thats about 8-9 inches.


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## woody10

there in south Ga to


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## Researcher31726

No photos DOES NOT EQUAL to no black panthers in GA.  They are here!
Sue


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## ccbiggz

I saw two black cats about six foot long and running 100 MPH crossing the road between Davisboro and Sandersville one morning on the way to work. I got a good look at them because they ran into a hayfield and I could see them long enough to tell what it was.


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## southern_pride

In this weeks Tattnall County news paper there's an article of a tan colored panther(they said perhaps a Florida panther) being spotted on the local middle school baseball field. Sounds crazy, but they have pictures of tracks where it jumped the fence. The school is in the middle of town, but buts up to the state park. So who knows??


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## Stalker

I saw a large cat some years back in a Handcock Co. It was  way to big to be a bobcat, but it also had about a 3' long tail. I saw it walk out into a food plot just before dark where there has been a bunch of rabbits hanging out eating. This particular one I saw was not black. You can say what you want, but I know what I saw.


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## Researcher31726

ccbiggz said:


> I saw two black cats about six foot long and running 100 MPH crossing the road between Davisboro and Sandersville one morning on the way to work.



Wow! I'm sorry that didn't happen in Dawson.
 I have a cop buddy who would have done his level best to pull them over and given them a ticket for speeding! That would have made an interesting court hearing for me to report on! 

Sue


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## RFoxx

If there were black panthers in Georgia, a good ole Georgia boy would have already shot it and ridden around the surrounding 15 counties braggin' about it. It would have been on the front page of GON and every single local newspaper.

When Florida released those western cougars in N Florida a few years ago, several roamed into Georgia.  A couple were even shot by some good ole Georgia boys.

There is some interesting reading at this site:
Summary of Individual Mountain Lion Movements and Activities


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## Researcher31726

RFoxx said:


> If there were black panthers in Georgia, a good ole Georgia boy would have already shot it and ridden around the surrounding 15 counties braggin' about it. It would have been on the front page of GON and every single local newspaper.



You don't think a good ole Georgia boy might realize the prize he's seeing and let it walk?
Sue


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## BUCKNDUCKSLAYER

Maybe If Hank Parker Would Come Out With Cmere Panther We Would Get Some On Trail Cameras. I Have To Agree That Just Cause There Are Not Any Obvious Pics On Trail Camereas Doesnt Mean That There Not There. They Are Just Few And Far Between. I Know At One Time There Were Wolves That Were A Mans Pets In Central Ga And They Roamed The Woods At Night And Nobody Got Trail Camera Photos Of Them. They Were There Though.Years Ago There Were Alot Of Sightings In The Stockbridge Area And I Think It Was Due To Some Excaping  What I Think Was Called Lion Country Safari.I Think that there might be some confusion on panther sightings and they might actually be cougars. I hope somebody catches one on a camera this week. Just cause you dont see something coming to a pile of corn doesnt mean its not there.


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## Researcher31726

Buck,
Wise words! Aren't panthers and cougars basically the same, just different names for the same creature that exists in different parts of the country: cougar for the western animal and panther for the GEORGIA and Southern cat?
Sue


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## RFoxx

Researcher31726 said:


> You don't think a good ole Georgia boy might realize the prize he's seeing and let it walk?
> Sue



Yes, he will realize the prize he's seeing (since black panthers are mythical beings) and No, he will not let it walk. If I see a black panther that means I should stop drinking and sober up.

Any normal cougar wandering around Georgia is probably an escaped animal, especially if it is in N Georgia.  It is very possible a normal colored cougar in S Georgia could be a Florida panther.  One made it to Jacksonville in 04 or 05 before getting nuked on I-95.


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## screamincr250

So why can't there be panthers in Georgia?  I have never seen one, but I do believe there COULD possibly be some here.  Why do people say that there could be no possible way they could be here and stuff like that?  There are deer, bear, bobcats, turkeys, gators, hogs, blah blah blah.....why not a panther?


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## Researcher31726

Scream,
Go for it!  
Sue


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## screamincr250

Hey I believe in God, but I have never seen him.  I personally have not seen a bear in the wild since I have lived in GA.  Does that mean I should not believe they are here?


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## Researcher31726

screamincr250 said:


> Hey I believe in God, but I have never seen him.  I personally have not seen a bear in the wild since I have lived in GA.  Does that mean I should not believe they are here?



Very well put! Thank you!

Why should we black panther believers have to PROVE that they exist to non-believers? It should be the other way around. 

Sue


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## Doc_Holliday23

my dad saw a mountain lion walk across the driving range of Little Mountain Golf Course on HWY 155 in Ellenwood, GA, probably about 15 years ago, now.  He had 3 buddies with him and the rest of the people at the course that all saw it.  It wasn't black, but def. a cougar.

I take my digital camera with me to the stand for such occasions, bc honestly, if one walked out I doubt I'd shoot it, mainly for not knowing if it was legal to do so or not.


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## javelin225ho

i saw one 2 years ago right outside of danville.  it was around dark and i wouln't have known it was a big cat until i saw the tail.


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## Researcher31726

Doc,
Good points! Where is Ellenwood? North GA?
Sue


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## Doc_Holliday23

Researcher31726 said:


> Doc,
> Good points! Where is Ellenwood? North GA?
> Sue



southeast metro atlanta, kinda between Stockbridge and Conyers.


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## Stalker

I could have easily shot the one I saw, but I'm not going to shoot something that I would get in trouble for shooting. What do you do with it then? I can tell you I didn't want to get down out of the stand after seeing it. 

Mike


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## Researcher31726

Stalker said:


> I can tell you I didn't want to get down out of the stand after seeing it.Mike



I 'spect not! The first time we heard the one on Piney Grove Farm, there were a bunch of us in the swimming pool, after dark, but with floodlights and security lights. We were having a good ole time, until that scream turned our veins into glacial rivers.  Needless to say, we got "tired" of swimming really quick!
Sue


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## jsullivan03

I've never seen one, but I have slept in my truck over one screaming.  I agree, that sound will turn your blood to ice.  I was in NORTH GA camping with some buddies one fall just outside of Blairsville and we heard it.  It was close.  Don't know if it was black, white, purple, or red, but there are definitly cats in N. Ga.

-Jamie


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## GoldDot40

I'm not sure everyone got to see my post in the other "panther" thread, but it's some very usefull and interesting info in big cats in the east.
http://forum.gon.com/showthread.php?t=82669&page=2...look for my 2 posts toward the end of the tread.


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## Hi-tech Redneck

*i saw a LION in GA*

there are lions in ga. too! been to the zoo lately? if one got out and confronted me in the woods i wouldn't care who did or didn't get a pic of it on their trail cam. point is he's there. we even have penguins in the aquarium now! who woulda thunk them penguins like the georgia heat?


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## SHOOT FREAK

this booner killa guy must not be from goergia!!!!! i remember one time with my grandad we went out side with his 35 rem and were shooting coons out of a tree and saw a big ol black panther, bout 4 feet tall trying to eat are chikens.


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## hicktownboy

I know most of these posts are about black panthers, but there were a few about mountain lions.  We had some abnormally large bobcats in greene county, so we asked some of the guys that had lived down there their entire life.  One said, "Someone brought some mountain lions down here about 40 years ago and DNR says they crossbred with bobcats and that makes them between 45 to 55 pounds."  That was what I was told.  Is it a possibly on some of these creatures people are seeing that panthers and mountain lions crossbred?  Just a question for thought, I am no biologist.


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## Nicodemus

I don`t think it`s possible for a bobcat and a cougar to breed.


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## jklaus

Black panthers in ga? I thought it was the naacp


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## Researcher31726

nicodemus said:


> I don`t think it`s possible for a bobcat and a cougar to breed.



If Mr. Nic says he doesn't think it's possible, than what he really means is it aint possible. Inter-species crossbreeding isn't documented positively, and that's what it would be.

Sue


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## joefishin

A rural friend of mine swears to have seen a panther several times in the same area of south Crisp County. It's a big, dark cat with a long tail. Bigger than any bobcat. We've talked about setting up a trail camera pointing between 2 live chickens tied to a stake. (so the chicken movement wouldn't set it off) 

There are quite a few documented cases of species interbreeding. Mules for one (horse and donkey). Here's an interesting website with bobcat crossbreeding.

http://www.messybeast.com/genetics/hyb-lynx-bobcat.htm


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## jharrell

I think black panthers are a mith. I have seen a cam-tracker picture of a couger or whatever you want to call it. The DNR took the picture from a local outdoor store in our home town (Coffee County), the picture actually came out of Atkinson County.


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## hicktownboy

nicodemus said:


> I don`t think it`s possible for a bobcat and a cougar to breed.



Your right, that's why I said MOUNTAIN LION, not cougar.


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## Nicodemus

hicktownboy said:


> Your right, that's why I said MOUNTAIN LION, not cougar.



They`re the same thing, along with a multitude of regional nicknames. Maybe some subspecies, just as whitetails have, but basically the same critter.


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## brownhounds

I have seen one in Effingham County.  Its a weird looking animal


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## swamphawg

I saw a black panther two years ago in Burke County on the Savannah River down in the swamp. I had a buddy with me who saw it as well. We were about 70-80 yards from it and got out after it crossed the road and sure nough found a big cat track. When I say big I don't mean like a big bobcat track, I mean bigger than a big dog track. I bet he weighed at least 120 pounds. Was jet black and his tail was every bit of three feet long. I know there's panthers in Georgia. I seen a regular brown colored last summer not far from where I seen the black one matter of fact. Anyways, in my book we have black whitetails, black coyotes, black bobcats, etc. Their what we call melanistic. I don't see why there can't be a black panther. None of them are obviously that common, but they exist. Perhaps "seeing is believing". Take it or leave it.


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## MCBUCK

Gotta get in on this one.....
There are no black panthers in Georgia.
Perhaps there are some scattered "mountain lions/cougars" but there are no black panthers in Georgia.
Trail cam pics? No.  There would be. They would target the feeders, because that is where the deer are. 
Bears ? Yes.  Just because you haven't seen one.....come on man...be real.  I have seen quite a few in the wild, but more importantly, there have been some really good harvest on them the last few years.  Bears....Yes
Hogs. Same rule applies. Too many other people have killed them.
How about this one....Elk?  No there are no Elk in Georgia....sort of.  A few years back a truck crashed in Cheroke county, releasing  a half a dozen or so.  They were subsequentially all shot.
That is a good segway to the next point... Would they even be legal to shoot ?  Yes.  There is no season on them . Just as there is no season on coyotes.  They are a non-game specie in the state of Georgia.  Axis deer ? Same deal.  Have you ever seen an axis deer in Georgia ? probably not. But they have been known to escape from enclosures/deer farms, and when they do.....they becom a non-native specie, and are open to removal from the habitat.  I had a buddy kill one several years ago in Floyd county.  And the bonus is .....You don't have to tag one !  How about an emu ?!?  I have seen several post about members seeing emus.....they all let them walk, but according to the DNR, they need to notify the owner if possible.  If the owner can't be contacted, or the animal be caught and put under control, then the animal needs to be "dispatched"....WHY ???  it is stealing food from native species.....deer, bear, hog, coons etc..
How many hunters would knowlingly let an animal that isn't a non native walk, if you knew that animal was detrimental to your deer herd?  I shoot yotes every chance I get , because I believe they are a detriment to the herd.  I know they are to turkeys...they will destroy a nest !
Ok ok......so I said ther may be some spattering of "cougars" in some remote areas. ie Cohutta Wilderness for example.  But if I saw one.....bang.  flip out the phone.." Hey, Mr. DNR man !  guess what I just shot? The way I have interperted the game regulation of this state.....I am perfectly legal.  I know there are etter hunters than me out there. I know there are many more who are worse  But the bottom line is " Show me the money" With all of these people that have "seen" a black panther, why has no one pulled the trigger ? Why does no one have a valid photo ?
 I have heard too many bobcats scream in the woods.  I know what a bob sounds like.  I have never heard a "panther" scream....I don't know what they sound like.  I have heard bears growl, roar, grun and groan. I know what they sound like. Buck grunts, doe bleats, hoot owls, squirrils bark, youte yip, you name it.  I have heard it. I have seen bear poo, deer poo, yote poo,pig poo, and even coon poo.  I know what it looks and smells like. I have walked out of Cohutta from many miles deep, and many feet steep, and have never ben scared of what the night may hold.  God made man , and gave him dominion over all the creatures of the earth. I respect the creatures, but have no fear of them.  
I will not believe ther are black panthers in Georgia, or any where in the southe for that matter until somebody brings one to the check station and says.." You ain't gonna believe what I got in the back of the truck"


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## linebacker

i personaly have never seen one but my philosphy is dat i belive 0% of what i hear and 50% of what i see.


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## linebacker

i personaly have never seen one but my philosiphy is i belive 0% of what i here and 50% of what i see.


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## dawg2

MCBUCK said:


> Gotta get in on this one.....
> There are no black panthers in Georgia.
> Perhaps there are some scattered "mountain lions/cougars" but there are no black panthers in Georgia.
> Trail cam pics? No.  There would be. They would target the feeders, because that is where the deer are.
> Bears ? Yes.  Just because you haven't seen one.....come on man...be real.  I have seen quite a few in the wild, but more importantly, there have been some really good harvest on them the last few years.  Bears....Yes
> Hogs. Same rule applies. Too many other people have killed them.
> How about this one....Elk?  No there are no Elk in Georgia....sort of.  A few years back a truck crashed in Cheroke county, releasing  a half a dozen or so.  They were subsequentially all shot.
> That is a good segway to the next point... Would they even be legal to shoot ?  Yes.  There is no season on them . Just as there is no season on coyotes.  They are a non-game specie in the state of Georgia.  Axis deer ? Same deal.  Have you ever seen an axis deer in Georgia ? probably not. But they have been known to escape from enclosures/deer farms, and when they do.....they becom a non-native specie, and are open to removal from the habitat.  I had a buddy kill one several years ago in Floyd county.  And the bonus is .....You don't have to tag one !  How about an emu ?!?  I have seen several post about members seeing emus.....they all let them walk, but according to the DNR, they need to notify the owner if possible.  If the owner can't be contacted, or the animal be caught and put under control, then the animal needs to be "dispatched"....WHY ???  it is stealing food from native species.....deer, bear, hog, coons etc..
> How many hunters would knowlingly let an animal that isn't a non native walk, if you knew that animal was detrimental to your deer herd?  I shoot yotes every chance I get , because I believe they are a detriment to the herd.  I know they are to turkeys...they will destroy a nest !
> Ok ok......so I said ther may be some spattering of "cougars" in some remote areas. ie Cohutta Wilderness for example.  But if I saw one.....bang.  flip out the phone.." Hey, Mr. DNR man !  guess what I just shot? The way I have interperted the game regulation of this state.....I am perfectly legal.  I know there are etter hunters than me out there. I know there are many more who are worse  But the bottom line is " Show me the money" With all of these people that have "seen" a black panther, why has no one pulled the trigger ? Why does no one have a valid photo ?
> I have heard too many bobcats scream in the woods.  I know what a bob sounds like.  I have never heard a "panther" scream....I don't know what they sound like.  I have heard bears growl, roar, grun and groan. I know what they sound like. Buck grunts, doe bleats, hoot owls, squirrils bark, youte yip, you name it.  I have heard it. I have seen bear poo, deer poo, yote poo,pig poo, and even coon poo.  I know what it looks and smells like. I have walked out of Cohutta from many miles deep, and many feet steep, and have never ben scared of what the night may hold.  God made man , and gave him dominion over all the creatures of the earth. I respect the creatures, but have no fear of them.
> I will not believe ther are black panthers in Georgia, or any where in the southe for that matter until somebody brings one to the check station and says.." You ain't gonna believe what I got in the back of the truck"




Funny thing is, I was once like you  Tought those folks were crazy, probably one of those Harris County Black Dogs.

 Then 2 yrs ago...

Then one morning, I pull out my driveway and see the BIGGEST BLACK DAWG I have ever seen easing down the side of the road, not 50 yards away.  But the longer I watch this "DAWG" I start thinking, that thing is bigger than my neighbor's Rotty (named Bear).  Then I see the long black tail curled up at the end just a twitchin' as it walks.  I have a Glock 26 and a single shot shotgun under the seat (with #4 for snakes) and no rifle IDIOTIDIOTIDIOT! so I floor my truck.  I think NO-ONE WILL BELIEVE THIS UNLESS I RUN IT OVER.  

That thing took off like a bat out of Hades.  Never could get close and it jumped in the woods.

Went back later and made 9 plaster casts.  3 DNR guys look at them.  Two (One biologist from Fort Valley)say yes, yes, yes, BIG CAT.  One (the other biologist) never said.  He siad they don't exist in GA.  I said fine, when I see it again I'll shoot it and call you.  He says you can't they're protected.  I ask how can they be protected if they don't exist?  He says they used to be in GA.  The Jaguars range went all through the Southeast YEARS AGO.  It is still their range, just not as many.
Needless to say , some of my state buddies (no names or departments mentioned)have asked that if I do shoot it call them, they want to see what made those tracks.

One more question for you:  IF a cat that has ranges in the hundreds of miles, with legs that long and astounding speed, and almost exclusively nocturnal (JAGUAR), why can't it be here when one of its main prey /foods  almost exclusively nocturnal with three inch legs, and a whopping speed of 15 MPH all out (ARMADILLO) is here?

I have seen.  Therefore I NOW believe.


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## swamphawg

AMEN! I know a lot of people don't believe in them cause they haven't seen one but I have heard a panther scream before, in the woods and on the internet to confirm what I heard. I've seen a black one and a brown one. I've seen their tracks before. Take a big bobcat track and multiply it by three and you got what I seen. We've found deer killed and then concealed like a big cat does. You tell me then what I'm seeing. 120-130 black cat, ain't a bobcat, ain't a house cat, ain't an otter.


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## dawg2

swamphawg said:


> AMEN! I know a lot of people don't believe in them cause they haven't seen one but I have heard a panther scream before, in the woods and on the internet to confirm what I heard. I've seen a black one and a brown one. I've seen their tracks before. Take a big bobcat track and multiply it by three and you got what I seen. We've found deer killed and then concealed like a big cat does. You tell me then what I'm seeing. 120-130 black cat, ain't a bobcat, ain't a house cat, ain't an otter.




Never seen Brown, only black.  And I have seen it when I was with a surveyor as well.

And yes, this cat pulled a mature doe up under a snag on my property and covered it with sticks and leaves, just like a big cat does.


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## basslure

If there are "Black Panthers" even though there is no distinct species of wild cat called a Black Panther. With so many cameras in the woods and so many cars on the highway why hasnt someone at least run one over . I mean thats the only animal to have never been hit by a car . There are black bobcats and black coyotes, but i dont believe that there is a Black Panther


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## basslure

Other than a house cat , Melanistic coloration is very rare meaning people would see a how lot more of brown ones than black ones but all i ever hear about are "Black Panthers"


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## dawg2

basslure said:


> Other than a house cat , Melanistic coloration is very rare meaning people would see a how lot more of brown ones than black ones but all i ever hear about are "Black Panthers"



The American Cougar does not have a black phase.  Latin American Jaguars and African Leopards do have a black phase, and they have spots.


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## basslure

so what you saw was black so it wasnt a american cougar


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## dawg2

basslure said:


> so what you saw was black so it wasnt a american cougar



It was black and looked like a Black Jaguar about 160lbs. DNR guy said he thought it would be more like 180 lbs based on the tracks.   They are in Mexico and so are armadillos.

He said it was probably a pet that someone let go.


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## basslure

10-4


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## GoldDot40

_With officials refusing to acknowledge its existence in the wild, the Eastern Puma risks losing protection under the endangered Species Act while fragile ecosystems of the eastern U.S. hang in the balance. 

Fast Facts Pumas were eliminated from most of eastern North America by the turn of the 20th century due to uncontrolled hunting and trapping, habitat fragmentation and destruction, and decline in their main food supply - the white-tailed deer.

During the 20th century, the white-tailed deer has made a dramatic comeback in the east. Without sufficient predators such as the puma, deer overpopulation is becoming a serious problem in many eastern states. History has shown that without sufficient predators in an ecosystem, those species whose numbers have not been controlled will become vulnerable to diseases that could threaten their entire populations and ultimately destroy the ecosystem. 

Through the research and hard work of organizations such as the Nature Conservancy, the Conservation Fund, and the Appalachian Restoration Campaign, habitats capable of supporting pumas remain throughout the central and southern Appalachians and in the North Woods of New England.

Despite hundreds of puma sightings reported each year to organizations such as the Eastern Puma Research Network, many wildlife officials "vehemently deny or refuse to acknowledge panther sightings north of Florida and east of the Rockies, even ones with documented evidence." -John Lutz (Director, EPRN)

**Description**
Eastern pumas are usually reddish brown-tan in color. They have white fur on the belly and under the chin. Black markings are apparent behind the ears, on the face, and on the tip of the tail. (Note: On a different website I found that some eastern pumas can have light grey or charcoal colored coats.....AKA Black Panthers) On average, they weigh between 65 to 130 pounds and grow to be 6 ft in length. Their western counterparts can grow up to 170 pounds because of availability of larger prey. Many eastern pumas have an upward turn or kink at the end of the tail and a swirl or cow lick in the middle of the back. Puma cubs are pale with spots and have rings around the tail. They lose their spots and rings at approximately six months of age. 

The largest of the purring cats, the puma is also the largest cat that cannot roar. Rather, they make three distinctive sounds described as "chirping like a bird, crying like a baby, and screaming like a woman". They are known to survive in various environments including mountain forests, grasslands, swamps, and seacoasts. They can adapt to extremes of temperature as well. In addition to deer, they prey on beaver, porcupine, bobcat, rabbit, raccoon, opossum, and even fish. In the west, pumas also eat lynx and young elk or moose. 

Primarily nocturnal, they are most active one hour before sunset to two hours before sunrise. This combined with their elusive nature makes proving they exist almost impossible.

**History, Distribution and Controversy**
Also known as cougars and mountain lions, pumas once boasted the most extensive range of any land mammal in the Western Hemisphere. From the southern tip of Chile to as far north as the Yukon, pumas once inhabited both North and South America from the Atlantic to the Pacific. By the turn of the 20th century, however, pumas were eliminated from most of eastern North America due to uncontrolled hunting and trapping, loss or fragmentation of habitat, and mass slaughter of their main food supply the white-tailed deer. 

At this time, the only documented eastern pumas in the wild exist in south Florida where they are known as the Florida Panther. The remaining documented eastern pumas are found in sanctuaries and captive breeding facilities such as ours. In 1973, the United States Fish and Wildlife Service had placed the eastern puma on the U.S. Endangered Species List, affording it protection from its former persecution. However, some federal and state officials now would like to see this cat removed from the list, arguing that the puma is already extinct in the east except for Florida.

There once were believed to be 32 subspecies of puma in North and South America. In 1999, a landmark study of puma genetics by Melanie Culver indicated that no significant genetic distinction exists among all pumas living north of Nicaragua. Unfortunately, another argument for removing the eastern puma from the Endangered Species List could be based on the results of this study. By categorizing all pumas as one species, one could assert that the eastern puma is not endangered because plenty of pumas still survive out west. This is a dangerous premise because it does not consider the critical need to preserve ecological balance throughout the east.

During the 20th century, the white-tailed deer has made a dramatic comeback. Without sufficient predators such as the puma, deer overpopulation is becoming a serious problem in many eastern states. History has shown that without enough predators in an ecosystem, those species whose numbers have not been controlled may suffer starvation and become vulnerable to diseases which could threaten the entire population and ultimately destroy the ecosystem.

Several conservation groups have been investigating the puma in eastern North America for many years. The Eastern Cougar Foundation (ECF), the Eastern Puma Research Network (EPRN), and the Cat Specialist Group of the World Conservation Union's Species Survival Commission are among the most prominent. The EPRN has documented more than 5100 sightings throughout the east since 1965. The ECF reported more than 165 sightings in WV, VA, NC, PA, and NY during the year 2000. Other reported sightings in 2000 occurred in AL, IL, ME, KY, MA, WI, LA, NJ, MD, VT, OH, NH, TN, IN, AK, MI, FL, CT, MS, DE, SC, MO, GA, Ontario and New Brunswick, Canada.

Despite numerous sightings over the years, only a dozen were accompanied by sufficient field evidence to be confirmed by biologists. To confirm a sighting, evidence in the form of a live or dead animal, body part(s), scat, hair samples, tracks preserved in plaster, or video/photos is needed. While proof exists that pumas still survive in the east, the challenge is to prove they are reproducing in the wild. Until a confirmed sighting of a cub occurs, officials will continue to deny there are reproducing populations of pumas in the eastern U.S. Rather, they will claim the sightings are more likely to be of escaped or released captives.

Conservation groups such as the Appalachian Restoration Campaign, the Nature Conservancy, and the Conservation Fund are working to ensure the preservation of appropriate habitats and corridors throughout the eastern U.S. Research and habitat analyses to date indicate that good cougar habitat remains in the central and southern Appalachians and in the North Woods of New England. In their 2000 paper entitled Field Evidence of Cougars in Eastern North America, Chris Bolgiano, Todd Lester and David Maehr of the ECF stated, "Given the well-known regrowth of forest cover and resurgence of deer herds across the east, it's likely that human rather than biological constraints will limit the establishment of viable cougar populations". _

Also, as posted in the other panther thread, I posted a reply from an email I had sent to a cousin who is a former DNR officer. We have talked since that email and I brought the subject up again. He said that there have been a few cougars that were shot and killed which were confirmed by state biologists. Any cougar in captivity is tagged for identification. He said there are some that have been killed that have never been tagged which obviously means they were wild. Pumas with the darker coats are usually (but not always) reported below or in the lower piedmont region of the state were swamps and low lands are more common. He said his superiors ordered them all to keep the subject on the down low. I asked "Why?", and he wouldn't tell me. He also said killing one carries about the same penalty as killing an eagle or hawk....not a good idea to shoot one.

The puma's scientific name is Felis Concolor Cougar....which is not the same as the bobcat (Lynx rufus). By the way, if this animal didn't exsist in GA, it wouldn't be on GA's Endangered Special Concerned Animals list.
http://georgiawildlife.dnr.state.ga.us/content/specialconcernanimals.asp


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## Researcher31726

Bassquatch,
Thanks for the 411! I talked with a DNR fella one day after one of my contacts had called me to report a sighting in his area. The officer cleared his throat and said, "It's not a good idea to report in a newspaper article that one's been sighted.You'll open yourself up to a lot of junk." (Basically, that's what he said.)
Sue


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## Throwback

Had to bump this up. 

good grief. 

T


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## fishfryer

Why is this subject so interesting?Is there some psycological reason that humans conjure up images of black panthers?Does there exist some primal fear of terrible beasts from our distant past,which is passed along to us by instinct?Do people need a booger man to explain things they can't explain any other way?OR,do black cougars,leopards,or jaguars really live in our woods and fields?So far as I know,(there are many things in this category)there is no physical evidence that would hold up in court to prove their existance.But, there are many good, decent,honorable,folks amoung us, who tell stories of personal encounters with these animals. I have never seen anything in the woods that I couldn't explain to myself,at least after thinking about it,later.A few people,whose opinions I value,have assured me they saw a big(bigger than a big housecat)black cat with a long tail.I've been hearing stories for over fifty years about "black panthers".Those stories were from Georgia to Louisiana.Where are the stories coming from,the mind,or reality?In a way,I hope black panthers are never proved, or disproved.I wouldn't mind seeing or hearing one myself,though.What about that,Throwback?


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## JamesDalton

*Black Panthers in Georgia*

Of course there are black panthers in Georgia! There are also lynx in Georgia. Back in the 1970's my cousins shot and killed one in Jesup, Ga. that was trying to get into their dads quail pen. I saw it and touched it! Way bigger than a bobcat!!!
Black Panthers are very, very rare and even harder to see from the seat of a green game warden pickup!


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## Artfuldodger

fishfryer said:


> Why is this subject so interesting?Is there some psycological reason that humans conjure up images of black panthers?Does there exist some primal fear of terrible beasts from our distant past,which is passed along to us by instinct?Do people need a booger man to explain things they can't explain any other way?OR,do black cougars,leopards,or jaguars really live in our woods and fields?So far as I know,(there are many things in this category)there is no physical evidence that would hold up in court to prove their existance.But, there are many good, decent,honorable,folks amoung us, who tell stories of personal encounters with these animals. I have never seen anything in the woods that I couldn't explain to myself,at least after thinking about it,later.A few people,whose opinions I value,have assured me they saw a big(bigger than a big housecat)black cat with a long tail.I've been hearing stories for over fifty years about "black panthers".Those stories were from Georgia to Louisiana.Where are the stories coming from,the mind,or reality?In a way,I hope black panthers are never proved, or disproved.I wouldn't mind seeing or hearing one myself,though.What about that,Throwback?



I've often wondered that myself. It was popular among my friends in the late 60's early 70's. I guess it's just a part of folk lore that get's passed down from generation to generation. It has enough mystique  or whatever to keep it alive and interesting.
Kinda like seeing a fireside chat or a barn dance.


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## abcmh

saw one on gum swamp in dodge county in 1987 was black for sure watched it for several min. drinking water less than 40 feet away across the creek so dnr can lie if they want


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## redneck_billcollector

Not for nothing, there has NEVER, not once, been a single cougar, catamount, painter, panther, mountain lion or any other localized name for Puma concolor documented that was black, not once from Patagonia to the Yukon.  Not a single pelt, not a single body, nor a single one ever caught.  For that matter, not a single confirmable picture either.  There was a dark brown one killed in South America almost 100 years ago, but he was not black.  One morning back in the early 80s I for a second thought I saw one, would have sworn on a stack of bibles it was one, it was about two hours before sunrise on Ft. Stewart.  I noted where I saw it by the road, came back that afternoon, and found tracks real fast, right where they should have been....they were canine tracks. It was more than likely a mangy black coyote/brush wolf.  Apparently every other person on this forum has seen one, so please tell me, why are there literally hundreds of tawny colored panthers documented killed in GA (the colony and state both had bounties on them) but not a single black one? Did the bounty hunters hounds only run normal colored ones? That can be said for everywhere in their range. There was a melanistic jaguar killed for a bounty in western Louisiana in the early 19th century, the only record I could find of any melanistic cat turned in for a bounty anywhere in the US.


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## ryanh487

abcmh said:


> saw one on gum swamp in dodge county in 1987 was black for sure watched it for several min. drinking water less than 40 feet away across the creek so dnr can lie if they want



Black panthers don't exist anywhere in the western hemisphere. It's not a DNR lie, it's a biological fact.


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## Throwback

I want to see an albino black panther. That would be a sight!


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## abcmh

Apparently biologist have not seen what I'v seen and to say something does not exist for a fact is like saying their are no pythons in north america


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## redneck_billcollector

abcmh said:


> Apparently biologist have not seen what I'v seen and to say something does not exist for a fact is like saying their are no pythons in north america



There have been thousands of pythons caught or killed in North America in the few decades since they were set loose in the early 90s. There have been zero black panthers caught or killed in North America in the more than five centuries since Europeans have hunted and killed every predator they could in both North and South America.


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## rydert

I wish i could see one........


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## redneck_billcollector

As someone else has pointed out, there are jaguarundis in the southwest and there is now a feral population in Florida.  They can appear almost black and have a long tail like a cougar...but they are much smaller than a cougar. At one time in the near past they were popular pets amongst those who keep exotic pets.  But there have been none that I know of that have turned up in traps in GA, though they show up in traps every once in awhile in the Southwest.


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## NCHillbilly

I think it's telling that the Indians nor early explorers (who went into great detail describing the animals they saw and heard about from the Indians, ) never mentioned black panthers, ever. The older members of my family when I was a kid who were alive when panthers were still common here in the mountains never mentioned black ones either, just tawny-colored ones. Black panthers seem to be a recent phenomenon, started in the 50s and 60s by the black "panthers" in movies. Folks who had never saw a real one just assumed that they're black.


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## NCHillbilly

ryanh487 said:


> Black panthers don't exist anywhere in the western hemisphere. It's not a DNR lie, it's a biological fact.



There are melanistic jaguars in the Amazon Basin of South America, but they are extremely rare even there. Ditto with black leopards in Asia and Africa. The melanism (black) gene is recessive. So-even if two captive black panthers somehow managed to escape and find each other in the woods of Georgia, 99% of any offspring they produced would be spotted, normally colored jaguars or leopards. But, strangely, enough, nobody ever sees those.


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## bulldawgborn

For the folks who have seen a black panther:  Any chance it was just a normal panther that was wet?  Making it look darker?  

I'm fairly interested in cryptozoology, but I can't get on board with believing in melanistic Puma concolor.  I used to believe in black panthers, but I have come to believe that a good deal of the sightings must be mistaken identity.

For what it is worth, I have actually seen a panther in Georgia.  It was a normal, tawny brown panther.  It was 2002 or 2003 in Treutlen County.


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## Backlasher82

What if black panthers are just regular panthers that have been in Florida so long they just have a really great tan?


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## shakey gizzard

Guess ima just have to catch one!


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## hayseed_theology

Throwback said:


> I want to see an albino black panther. That would be a sight!



My uncle saw one once. It was late one night, and he was out shining rabbits up in undisclosed portion of Dawson county. One ran in front of his F100 across the dirt road right be a creek. It scared him so bad that after that he wouldn't go to the outhouse without a lantern and a whooping stick. He still tells the story about that albino melanistic phase _puma concolor_. He got a real good look at it, so he knew for sure that's what it was. Said it practically did the macarena there in the amber glow of his old Ford headlights. After it crossed the road, he heard it scream like a woman so you know it had to be some sort of cougar. He called the DNR and told them.  Warden said they'd gotten a lot of calls about that one. They'd named him the ghost of the black panther, but they couldn't do anything about it and the state biologist wouldn't listen no how.


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## NE GA Pappy

rydert said:


> I wish i could see one........



On November 8th, go to a voting precinct in Philadelphia.

I hear they show up there regularly.


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## ryanh487

NCHillbilly said:


> There are melanistic jaguars in the Amazon Basin of South America, but they are extremely rare even there. Ditto with black leopards in Asia and Africa. The melanism (black) gene is recessive. So-even if two captive black panthers somehow managed to escape and find each other in the woods of Georgia, 99% of any offspring they produced would be spotted, normally colored jaguars or leopards. But, strangely, enough, nobody ever sees those.



But that's a jaguar, not a panther.  And they'd have to travel a heck of a long way to make it to GA.


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## ryanh487

abcmh said:


> Apparently biologist have not seen what I'v seen and to say something does not exist for a fact is like saying their are no pythons in north america



It's a well known fact that there is a python problem in Florida.

Regular panthers in GA?  Sure, there is the occasional wanderer from the Florida swamps.  

Black panthers? No.  There are no black panthers.  Rare Black jaguars down in the Amazon, yes.  But no black panthers.


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## bulldawgborn

ryanh487 said:


> But that's a jaguar, not a panther.  And they'd have to travel a heck of a long way to make it to GA.



Mountain lions (or whatever you want to call them), jaguars, and leopards are all considered panthers.  Jaguars and leopards are in the genus Panthera


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## NCHillbilly

ryanh487 said:


> But that's a jaguar, not a panther.  And they'd have to travel a heck of a long way to make it to GA.



There is no official "panther." "Panther" is a generic common name used all over the world for medium-sized slinky big cats like leopards, jaguars, and pumas. 

By the way, the only two big cats known to have one pop out occasionally in the black color phase (leopards and jaguars,) physically cannot "scream." They are roaring cats, like all the cats in the Panthera genus. Mountain lion/puma/painter/cougar is in the genus Puma, and there has never in hundreds of years of recorded history been a black one confirmed. There are no black panthers in Georgia, or anywhere else in North America outside of a zoo, period. A young dispersing male puma/painter/mountain lion/cougar is liable to pop up anywhere in the country, but there is no evidence of any breeding population of them in the east outside of Florida, and perhaps western Tennessee.


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## saltysenior

If folks would just put some game cameras in the woods we would have an answer...


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## Throwback

saltysenior said:


> If folks would just put some game cameras in the woods we would have an answer...



Maybe a government trail camera subsidy is in order for research purposes


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