# Christian's divorcing and remarrying



## Hunting Teacher (Feb 14, 2005)

OK her goes,
  First off I am not looking to stir up controversy! I am asking for help. 
I never before put a lot of thought into this issue because I knew it would never affect my wife and I and it won't.But it has come close to home as my brother and best friend both had their wives leave them.
Here's what I am asking. I know where those of you who say it is wrong to remarry find your reasoning scripturally. Mathew 5:32, Mark 10:11-12.
I am in no way saying that is incorrect. Kind of hard to dispute Jesus words.
Yet, I see many Christian remarriages that it is very obvious that God is blessing and He is being honored by the way they are living their lives for Him daily. I see no evidence that God is being sinned against each time these two people "become one flesh." Just the opposite. I see their marriages furthering His kingdom.
Those of you who like myself, believe there must be some cases where God accepts remarriage please give me scripture that you feel support your stand. I have some of my own, but I am very interested to know other scripture that you would use.
No disrespect intended to anyone but I'm not looking for "your opinion" on this subject.( Because God is not interested in my opinion.) I'm interested in *God's Word * that supports your view.
Respectfully In Christ's Love,
Mitch


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## HT2 (Feb 14, 2005)

*Mitch........*

Well finally somethin' I can relate to.........  

In all seriousness though......

My wife chose to divorce me just about 2 years ago.......For what reason?????  Well, at the time I wasn't to sure, but seeing how she got re-married around 5 months after the divorce was final, I guess it's pretty evident......

In today's society the word "marriage" unfortunately is just a word in most cases......Not, in all cases, but "most"........

I know that one day my ex-wife will be held accountable for the "choice" she made.....Just as I will for all the mistakes I have.....But, I can be assured that I will not be guilty of not being a good husband......Was I perfect???? Heck No!!!!!!!!  But, I did nothin' and I mean nothin' to warrant a divorce......It's just so much simpler nowdays to get a "quickie" divorce instead of tryin' to work through hard times and difficult issues.....

So, Do I think "re-marriage" is O.K. is "GOD'S" eyes?????

I think it's fine.....

But, rest assured.........I can guarantee you this........I will never, ever be married again...........

I gave my heart to a woman that I loved with all my heart, and I got burned......It "WILL NOT HAPPEN AGAIN"..........

Sorry for the long post....


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## mpowell (Feb 14, 2005)

i'm not married and haven't been so i don't pretend to be an expert on marriage.  however, i have some thoughts on this subject as i've seen some of my friends get divorced.

i think it's great if you can remarry and find the kind of marriage you probably hoped for the first time (or second, or third--just kidding).


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## No. GA. Mt. Man (Feb 14, 2005)

*Re:*

Read about King David. He saw a woman bathing, lusted after her, had what we would call an affair, sent her husband into the heat of battle to get him killed, they had a child and GOD took the child as payment for their sin, and he BLESSED THE SECOND MARRIAGE WITH A CHILD THE WISEST MAN THAT EVER LIVED KING SOLOMAN AND GOD SUMMED UP DAVID'S LIFE BY SAYING HE WAS A MAN AFTER GOD'S OWN HEART!


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## Al33 (Feb 14, 2005)

I struggled with this issue for a long time as it relates to the divorce part. I had always assumed that in Mat. 5:32 Jesus was referring to adultery as unfaithfulness, but while in the midst of my struggle, it occurred to me that ufaithfulness is not restricted to adultery alone. A revelation of sorts in that I suddenly realized that abandonment of a marriage, for whatever reason, constitutes unfaithfulness. I felt such relief and had peace about this passage that once held me captive in a situation I had little control over.

I'm not sure if I will ever remarry or not, but if I do, I will have peace about it. God knows my heart, and I count on that a lot. If I am wrong, I am sure He will deal with me accordingly. I do not understand why things have turned out like they have, but I do understand I have to keep the faith knowing He knows what's best.

Al


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## one_shot_no_mor (Feb 14, 2005)

In Matthew 19:9, Jesus says "I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, EXCEPT FOR MARITAL UNFAITHFULNESS, and marries another woman commits adultery".

I am personally opposed to divorce.  That's my PERSONAL conviction.  I will NEVER be unfaithful to my wife.  If my wife (of 29 years) ever made a choice to leave me ("Marital unfaithfulness") I don't feel there would be scripture-based reason not to remarry...


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## pottydoc (Feb 14, 2005)

HT2, I know exactly how you feel. My wife decided after 25 years of marrige that she wanted a "change". No warning, nothing. Just "I don't love you anymore, and I don't want to be married anymore". That was it. I loved her with all my heart and soul and would have given up everything, excepting only my own salvation for her. I didn't think I would ever be able to love anyone again. God had other plans, however, and put an awesome, fantatic Chistian girl in my life, and then He gave me the ability to love her just as much as my first wife. There's a part of my heart that will always belong to her, but just a large a part that only belongs to the gal I'm married to now. Don't shut out any chance of re marrying, leave the door open for God to put someone new in your life if that's His will. I KNOW how you feel bud. I've been there. Folks who haven't cannot know how it feels and how bad it hurts, even if they try. I know beyound any doubt that God meant for me to meet and then marry Teresa. He shows me that more and more each day. I'll be praying for you, bud. I hope God brings you someone just as awesome as he did me.


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## dbodkin (Feb 14, 2005)

Till death do us part.....


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## shotgun (Feb 14, 2005)

Pottydoc has given some great advise couldn't have said it any better. Been there done that and its been 21 years and I've never been happier.


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 14, 2005)

*Irony*

I had a story related to me just today by the relative of the husband in a young couple.  As of just two months ago they were just beginning, and very excited to try and have a child.  Wife calls husband at work and says "come home for lunch, I've got something I want to tell you."  He's about besides himself with excitement thinking this is the thing they've been wishing for, a child!  He goes home and wife says "Get your stuff, I'm changing the locks, I don't want to be married anymore."  TODAY, on Valentine's day.  How do you like them apples?  I've known too many people in UNHOLY unions that ruined lives of kids and adults (and I'm talking about SERIOUSLY ruined them) that stayed in them because of their convictions.  I've known too many people like in the above situations that moved on to live complete lives in GODLY unions.  Yes, divorce is taken way too lightly.  Yes it is way too easy.  Yes, God gave us a way to move on and UP with our lives in certain situations.  It is spelled out.  This is one of many situations I will not judge having not walked a mile myself and praying constantly I never have to.  
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## Foxfire (Feb 14, 2005)

*Marriage/Divorce*

Bible References.

Matthew 19:5-6
1 Corinthians 6: 16-20, Chapter 7
1 Timothy 5:14
Hebrew 13:4
Romans 7:2-3

May be of assistance.

Foxfire/Y2KZ71


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## pottydoc (Feb 15, 2005)

dbodkin said:
			
		

> Till death do us part.....



When I married my first wife, I meant that part of the vows, and every other part of them. She made the CHOICE to leave me and my kids. I had ZERO say in what she did, period. For all you guys that think "it would NEVER happen to my wife and I", I got news for you: If it could happen in my marrige, it can happen in ANY of yours. And I'll tell you something else. I know beyond any shadow of doubt that God put Teresa (my wife now) and I together. I know that he meant for us to be married. None of the scripture posted so far deals at all with a spouse that just walks away. I didn't divorce my wife. She divorced me. I didn't file, refused to sign the papers, every thing else I could think of to keep our marrige together. All of it did nothing to stop her. She was done, and that was it. In Florida, you can't even contest a divorce. If one party says they're done, the judge signs the decree and it's done. I hope you guys never go through what HT2, myself, and some of the other guys on here have. It hurts worse than anything you can imagine. But if you believe it can't/won't happen to you, you're wrong. I thank God every day for Teresa. She's the light of my life, and I praise him for putting the two of us in each others life.


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## dbodkin (Feb 15, 2005)

With the divorce rate greater then 50% .. Makes me wonder why... When Tina and I got married we were just kids (Both 18)  We are in our 36th year and our love is a strong a when we met.   Nearly everyone in my family has been divorced. My own father was widowed to my Mom and then remarried and divorced 3 times...    I know there are many reasons and many many times it is a one sided situation.


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## Dudley Do-Wrong (Feb 15, 2005)

I know that there are some who are married that it would have been better if they had not been.  Almost every divorce is unique and there are always “justifiable” circumstances.  Justifiable in the human, worldly sense; but what does God say about it.

First, a marriage is supposed to be “till death do you part”.  Romans 7:2, "By law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage."

Second,  Christ recognizes only one valid ground for divorce. It's in the Bible, Matthew 5:32, "But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery."

Third,  If a spouse leaves a marriage for a reason other than adultery they must remain single. I Corinthians 7:10-11,. "Now, for those who are married I have a command, not just a suggestion. And it is not a command from me, for this is what the Lord Himself has said: A wife must not leave her husband. But if she is separated from him, let her remain single or else go back to him. And the husband must not divorce his wife."

Forth, what does marriage and divorce mean in the eyes of God? Malachi 2:14-16, "Why has God abandoned us?" you cry. I'll tell you why; it is because the Lord has seen your treachery in divorcing your wives who have been faithful to you through the years, the companions you promised to care for and keep. You were united to your wife by the Lord. In God's wise plan, when you married, the two of you became one person in His sight. And what does He want? Godly children from your union. Therefore guard your passions! Keep faith with the wife of your youth. For the Lord, the God of Israel, says He hates divorce and cruel men. Therefore control your passions—let there be no divorcing of your wives."


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## Kansashunter (Feb 15, 2005)

To me divorce would be against my beliefs. What I have taken from the Bible says that there or only two reasons for divorce. One is adultery and the other "if they are a non believer and want to leave. lYou may let them go". I can't see where if you divorce you can't remarry. But unless your first wife dies you would sin if you slept with your new wife. That is what I have taken from the bible. 

My Dad, Mother, sister, 2 sister inlaws, 1 brother inlaw have all been divorced. Do I judge them for that? No it's not my place. Our Church just recently changed their qualification for Deacon. It used to be that if divorced you could not be a Deacon. They changed it so now my Dad is a Deacon again. When I ask him about how he felt. He stated that he wished they had not changed the rule. But since they did and the church elected him. That he would serve. And he has done a great job doing it.

So can you divorce and remarry? God forgives you for your sins. so I guess you can if you recieved his forgiveness. It will be between you and God whether this will work for you.


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 15, 2005)

Why are women and men treated differently in Scripture regarding divorce?  Or are they?  
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## Dudley Do-Wrong (Feb 15, 2005)

Phil,
I noticed the way it was worded myself and wondered the same thing as you.  Does not the “rule” apply to both man and woman?  I think circumstances such as this require further examination and cross-examination of Scripture.  When we see Scripture that seemingly apply to just men or just women, we need to make certain that our understanding does not conflict with our understanding of other Scripture or to the Bible as a whole.

Take, for instance, some of the Scripture I previously quoted.  Romans 7:2 seems to apply a rule to women while Matthew 5:32 applies to men.  Yet, examination of Scripture tells us that men and women are treated equally in the eyes of God.  That is putting it very basic and this could be a very deep study which requires the examination of a lot of Scripture.  The Scripture in Malachi says, in marriage, 2 become 1 in the eyes of God.  There is no separation, in fact, quite the opposite; there is actually a joining.  If you believe the 2 becomes 1 then there is no separation to how the “rules” are applied.

This could make for a great Bible study session which could take weeks to conclude.  So, if everyone could meet at my house on Thursday nights……..


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 15, 2005)

David Mills said:
			
		

> This could make for a great Bible study session which could take weeks to conclude.  So, if everyone could meet at my house on Thursday nights……..


You making the cookies...   
I assume when you mean "man and woman are treated equally in the eyes of God" you are just talking about in regards to marriage?  Otherwise we're back to the "women in ministry" thread....
I personally find the concept that there is ANY difference at all between something so insignificant as what sex a person is born into, to have something to do with their 'standing' in God's eyes (either on this earth or after) as counter to and in conflict with, His teachings in so many areas.  
I completely understand there were cultural differences in the roles of men and women in biblical times.  Look at middle (and far) eastern cultures today.  
My head hurts...   
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## 6wheeler (Feb 15, 2005)

*I noticed*

that all of us agree that adultery is a scripturally sound basis for divorce. 

I am curious to know where you stand on abuse? Should a man or woman be forced to remain in a marriage at the risk of his/her personal well being? Further, if that man/woman divorces the abuser are they then unable to remarry? 

One other thought. If what GOD hath joined together let no man put asunder, how do we know if a marriage was blessed by GOD? Could not a marriage be for reasons of man (i.e. a man/woman marrying a wealthy spouse for the money) and such a union not be blessed by GOD? Does the scripture admonitions regarding remarriage apply should one of the parties decide that the marriage was indeed for the wrong reasons and they decide to seek out a marriage based on all the right reasons?

Man what a fantastic thread going on here.


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## Randy (Feb 15, 2005)

I am against it even though I have done it.  Thank God I am forgiven!


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 15, 2005)

6wheeler said:
			
		

> I am curious to know where you stand on abuse? Should a man or woman be forced to remain in a marriage at the risk of his/her personal well being? Further, if that man/woman divorces the abuser are they then unable to remarry?
> One other thought. If what GOD hath joined together let no man put asunder, how do we know if a marriage was blessed by GOD? Could not a marriage be for reasons of man (i.e. a man/woman marrying a wealthy spouse for the money) and such a union not be blessed by GOD? Does the scripture admonitions regarding remarriage apply should one of the parties decide that the marriage was indeed for the wrong reasons and they decide to seek out a marriage based on all the right reasons?


6, many will say there is no Scriptural basis for divorcing based on abuse.  Considering that it is often life threatening, I say there are multiple scriptural references to the sanctity of life that over rides that.  That is referencing physical abuse obviously.  I also am very close to a couple where the man verbally/mentally abuses his wife and shamelessly.  It has caused numerous severe diagnosed  mental issues for their kids and to be honest I'm not sure how they are all still here today.  To me, God has not deemed it necessary for that union to stay together but it has, and the whole family has paid the cost.  Of coures there could be some 'greater good' that I'm not seeing but there sure is plenty of very evident bad.  If my God had condemned that woman for leaving that man, then I'm in likely in big trouble for countless things.  But no, that type situation does not appear to be addressed by scripture other than saying how a spouse SHOULD treat another spouse.  
Your second point I have often pondered and hope it's not a 'cop out', but if a union is not blessed by God then no I do not believe Scripture is relevant regarding divorce.  
How do we know if it is?  I guess we don't.  I was initially married to my wife by a justice of the peace (long story about why, too much to type).  On my anniversary three years later I traveled to Louisiana for the sole purpose of being married by a priest in my childhood church.  I didn't feel "before God" when I initially was married.  Was I then 'really' married for those three years?  I was in my heart.  Would I have been 'ok' to get divorced during those three years?  I suspect that scriptural would have come into play in my mind.  If I felt married in my heart, then why did I need the validation of the church ceremony?  Because I felt I wanted it.  One reason was, for whatever reason, I wanted to be married again in church before we had kids.  Not sure I can explain it more than that.      Perhaps irrelevant but a personal experience none the less.  
There is no question in my mind the thought of divorce, for me today has some serious spiritual conseuqences (beyond all the nightmares associated with it in this earthly life).  It will be 10 years in May.  I pray I will never have to ponder this subject on a more personal level than discussions like this....
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## Dudley Do-Wrong (Feb 15, 2005)

> I assume when you mean "man and woman are treated equally in the eyes of God" you are just talking about in regards to marriage? Otherwise we're back to the "women in ministry" thread....



Marriage and other things Phil.  I don’t think God places more value on a man over a woman.  I believe His laws apply equally, the same as salvation is equally accessible.  I don’t want to get into the female pastor thing, it’s 2 different issues.

I want to clarify something I mentioned in another post.  I said something about God making the Bible easy for us to understand.  There is a limitation to that.  I believe he makes a lot of the Bible easy to understand, especially those things He has determined that we NEED to know.  What’s important is that we remain obedient despite what we (as fallible humans) may think the way things should be.  If God made all things known to us, what would be the point in faith.  Faith is based on trusting and obeying Him in the things we don’t know.  God doesn’t have to give us a reason why, He’s God and doesn’t really owe us anything and the only thing we deserve is to burn.

BTW, I don't allow alcohol in my home.  I can make the cookies but you'll be sorry


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 15, 2005)

David Mills said:
			
		

> Marriage and other things Phil.  I don’t think God places more value on a man over a woman.  I believe His laws apply equally, the same as salvation is equally accessible.


Me either.  That would suggest there is a difference in souls.  
I ain't afraid of your cookies!!!    
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## Hunting Teacher (Feb 16, 2005)

Foxfire said:
			
		

> Bible References.
> 
> Matthew 19:5-6
> 1 Corinthians 6: 16-20, Chapter 7
> ...


Thanks Foxfire,
Scripture is what I want. I am judging no ones opinion or what they *know* the Holy Spirit has spoken to their heart. 
But I want to back up what I say with what God says on the matter.
Teach


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## Hunting Teacher (Feb 16, 2005)

No. GA. Mt. Man said:
			
		

> Read about King David. He saw a woman bathing, lusted after her, had what we would call an affair, sent her husband into the heat of battle to get him killed, they had a child and GOD took the child as payment for their sin, and he BLESSED THE SECOND MARRIAGE WITH A CHILD THE WISEST MAN THAT EVER LIVED KING SOLOMAN AND GOD SUMMED UP DAVID'S LIFE BY SAYING HE WAS A MAN AFTER GOD'S OWN HEART!


NGMM,
Thank You!!!
I hadn't even considered David. How absolutely evident that God can use us even after such trechery as David commited. If God accepted David marrying Bathsheba, and still could use David like he did, then He obviously can forgive us *if we truly repent* for our part in a divorce.
Now did David still have to pay the consequences of his actions. You better believe it!! Just as anyone who divorces will be paying for it for the rest of their lives. Even if it is their spouce who commits the sin, they are still going to suffer the consequences.
Thanks for those scriptures!!
Mitch


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## woody116 (Feb 16, 2005)

I dont have scripture to back it, but the catholic church blessed our marriage. My wife was married twice before, neither in the catholic church. We went to our priest, and it was brought before the area bishop. The church annulled (sp?) both of her prior marriages and we were allowed to be married in the catholic church.
There may have been special circumstances in our situation, which I wont go into, but they blessed us.


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 16, 2005)

woody116 said:
			
		

> I dont have scripture to back it, but the catholic church blessed our marriage. My wife was married twice before, neither in the catholic church. We went to our priest, and it was brought before the area bishop. The church annulled (sp?) both of her prior marriages and we were allowed to be married in the catholic church.
> There may have been special circumstances in our situation, which I wont go into, but they blessed us.


Good point woody.
I guess that does go exactly to some of these posts.  If a person was not married in church before (eyes of God) or if the previous marriages ended for the scriptural justifications already mentioned here, the Catholic church will annul that 'marriage'.   It's (rightfully) a fairly involved process.  
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## HT2 (Feb 16, 2005)

*pottydoc........*

Thanks for the nice words......

But, I'm really not even thinkin' of anything like this in my future......

I feel I gave my all to one woman and she "dumped" on me.......I am not willing to go thru that again.......

I'll just die an old lonely man with two beautiful daughters that I gained from the marriage.....


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## reylamb (Feb 16, 2005)

What the Catholic Church does or does not do, outside of the commands of Scripture, is really immaterial.

God allowed one cause for divorce, adultery.  It is clearly defined in Scripture.  Having said that, is that God's perfect will or is it God's pemissive will?  God's perfect will was that the nation of Isreal never have a human ruler, and yet he allowed it.  Why?  Hiss permissive will.  God's perfect will is that man never divorce, yet he allows us to do so in the case of adultery.  Why?  God's permissive will.

What we believe is immaterial.  What the Word says is what matters.

The example of the perfect marriage that we are shown in the New Testament is the relationship with Christ and the Church, when I say Church here it is the body of believers and not a specific denomination or local place of worship, rather the body of believers as a whole.  In God's perfect plan our earthly marriages would be based upon the perfect example of Christ and the Church.  Does Christ divorce the Church?


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 16, 2005)

reylamb said:
			
		

> What the Catholic Church does or does not do, outside of the commands of Scripture, is really immaterial.


Rey,
Since it was referenced, I was only attempting to explain the formal practice of a SCRIPTURAL following by a church I know from previous postings, most here are not familiar with.  
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## reylamb (Feb 16, 2005)

Phil, just curious, what is the scriptural practice and justification for anullment?


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 16, 2005)

*Process or act?*



			
				reylamb said:
			
		

> Phil, just curious, what is the scriptural practice and justification for anullment?


I may not understand exactly what your asking but for the 'process'?  Nothing.  Just like there's no scriptural reference for plenty of other practices/customs churches go through.  
For the act (which I assume is what you are really asking)? Scriptures already mentioned governing adultery.  It's a formal acknowledgement by the church that prior marriage was invalidated for documented reasons but more importantly the new marriage is acceptable (meaning, scripturally justifiable).  It's a piece of paper.  Little more.  As you may be aware (or may not be), the Catholic Church is big (too big in some instances) on custom and formality.  Some of it is actually kind of nice though.  Reality is, it's done for the recipient, not the church.  You could go get married anywhere if you wanted.   But if you are to be married in the Catholic church and had a prior marriage, they will insure it is scripturally justifiable.  This is an acknowledgement by the church you go to that your (new) marriage is blessed.  
Hopefully that makes sense?  Or maybe that's not what you're asking at all?    
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 16, 2005)

reylamb said:
			
		

> Phil, just curious, what is the scriptural practice and justification for anullment?


OK, I read your question again.  Scriptural 'practice' = NOTHING (obviously).  Scriptural 'justification' what I said above.  
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## reylamb (Feb 16, 2005)

I am very familiar with the customs and practices of the Catholic Church, and although I do not put any sanctity in some of them, some of them I have no issues with.  Correct me if I am wrong, but an anullment is in effect, a statement by the Church that a prior marriage never happened?  It is also my understanding that anullments may be granted for several reasons, some being adultery, marriage outside of the Church, marriage prior to becoming a Catholic, or marriage to an individual that is not Catholic.  Again, if not the case please correct me.

Having said that, the custom of anullment is one I have never been able to justify with Scriptures.  Nowhere is Scripture is anullment taught, or even hinted at.  

My question was a little more basic, although the clarity was lacking.  Simply put, where in Scripture can I find the doctrine of anullment?  Does it exist or is it simply a custom?  If it does not exist in Scripture then the anullment, and any subsequent marriages after the anullment, mean nothing and are outside of Biblical doctrine.

Please do not take this as an attempt to bash Catholics or the Catholic Church in general.  It is simply a question of one of the doctrines of the Catholic Church, as it pertains to this particular thread, where I have never found Scriptural doctrine to backup the custom.

Many denominations have customs that are outside of doctrine.  That in and of itself is not a bad or dangerous thing.  Every Christmas our church puts a decorated tree on the platform and during the Christmas service the kids in the church bring wrapped presents for Jesus.  The presents are money or items to be sent to missionaries.  No where in Scripture is there any doctrine of birthday presents fro Jesus, so it is purely a custom.  The difference being, our custom is not used to supercede Biblical doctrine.  In all of my studies, I do not read anywhere in Scripture where God has provided for marriages to be annulled.  In this case the anullment doctrine supercedes Biblical Doctrine.

As I said, if there is Scripture I can go to to verify and justify the teaching and doctrine of annullment that has been adopted by the Catholic Church, please let me know where it is, as I have been misinterpreting for quite a while.


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## Hunting Teacher (Feb 16, 2005)

Now I going to break my own rule and ask for opinions;  
If you believe that there is never justification for remarriage of Christians explain David to me. How can a "man after God's own heart" be commiting adultery every time he lies with his wife, yet be shown blessing in abundance, write one of the greatest books in the bible, and have Saul from that union?
Another question for you.
Why is it  man can who claims he has  a relationship with Jesus can chase around every woman he comes in contact with when he's young, sleep with many different women, (which means they became one flesh,) but yet truly repent of that lifestyle later in life ,  and decide to marry. I've never heard of one pastor refuse to marry that man because of mistakes he made previously and was truly repentant of. How come he isn't held accountable and told that he should stay single all his life?
Are you saying it's better to live like that because then later you can be forgiven, marry and live happily?
That's more righteous than a man whose wife leaves him, does everything in his power to make his marriage work, and truly asks God for forgiveness for his part in the divorce?
 He doesn't want to spend the rest of his life alone so he seeks God's will in finding the right partner to spend the rest of his life with. 
That man is held accountable for all his natural life and yet the former is not?
Sorry, but that doesn't even make sense.
Mitch


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## reylamb (Feb 16, 2005)

Hunting Teacher said:
			
		

> Now I going to break my own rule and ask for opinions;


It is dangerous to ask for opinions, what we should ask for is Scripture and what the Bible says.



> If you believe that there is never justification for remarriage of Christians explain David to me. How can a "man after God's own heart" be commiting adultery every time he lies with his wife, yet be shown blessing in abundance, write one of the greatest books in the bible, and have Saul from that union?


Little typo there, it was Solomon, not Saul.  Now, David lived under the law, not under grace.  He did not have the New Testament from which to go by.  The example of marriage that we have is of Christ and the Church, at the time of David there was no Church.

I am not implying that God can not use a second marriage for blessings.  However, the New Testament is clear on the issue of divorce.



> Another question for you.
> Why is it  man can who claims he has  a relationship with Jesus can chase around every woman he comes in contact with when he's young, sleep with many different women, (which means they became one flesh,) but yet truly repent of that lifestyle later in life ,  and decide to marry. I've never heard of one pastor refuse to marry that man because of mistakes he made previously and was truly repentant of. How come he isn't held accountable and told that he should stay single all his life?


Sorry, you lost me here.  Was the man ever married?



> Are you saying it's better to live like that because then later you can be forgiven, marry and live happily?
> That's more righteous than a man whose wife leaves him, does everything in his power to make his marriage work, and truly asks God for forgiveness for his part in the divorce?
> He doesn't want to spend the rest of his life alone so he seeks God's will in finding the right partner to spend the rest of his life with.
> That man is held accountable for all his natural life and yet the former is not?
> ...


I do not think I implied that anywhere did I?  In God's eyes there is no difference in sin, sin is sin, whether murder, lying or anything else, it is all sin in God's eyes.  Man puts values on sins.  Once again, I think I may not be fully understanding what you are asking.


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## GeauxLSU (Feb 16, 2005)

reylamb said:
			
		

> Please do not take this as an attempt to bash Catholics or the Catholic Church in general.


Rey,
I'm not.  
But since this is getting really off topic now perhaps I should start another thread or answer you by PM?  
Very short answer is, it's custom and a documented verification of the scriptural requiments of divorce (in it's simpliest form) but yes (depending on reason for the annulment), it can also be a documentation of the church's requirments (not scriptural) for them to perform a marriage.  The longer answer is in regards to the sacraments of the church which are all scripturally based.  
ALL customs are scripturally based.  Whether they are 'requred' acts or not is of course open to discussion.  For example, those kids bringing gifts are obviously emulating the scripture of the three wise men.  
Shoot me a PM if you want probably more info (all MY perspective by the way, I'm NOT an official of the church) than you care for or I can start a thread if anyone really cares to discuss.  

Teach,
What do you do when your students break your rules?    
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil


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## reylamb (Feb 16, 2005)

Phil,
I think another thread may be worthwhile as others may have some knowledge to share on the subject.

Teach,

What does Jesus have to say about divorce?
3The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? 

   4And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 

   5And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 

   6Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. 

   7They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? 

   8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. 

   9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. 

   10His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. 

   11But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. 

   12For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.


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## pottydoc (Feb 17, 2005)

reylamb said:
			
		

> I am not implying that God can not use a second marriage for blessings.  However, the New Testament is clear on the issue of divorce.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Hunting Teacher (Feb 18, 2005)

reylamb said:
			
		

> It is dangerous to ask for opinions, what we should ask for is Scripture and what the Bible says.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Reylamb,
You're right of course,
I let my emotion get the better of me and started typing off at the mouth instead of sticking to scripture. Yes there is a slight difference between Saul and Solomon. 
I could make more clear what I was getting at, but it was simply my opinion which isn't worth squat so I won't even waste your time.
I'll stick to what matters from now on. What God says.
Peace,
Mitch


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## reylamb (Feb 18, 2005)

Teach,
Emotions and opinion are neither bad things, as long as they are founded within Biblical doctrine.  I would like to have some clarity on what you were getting at, opinion or not, the only way we will ever discover if our opinion is founded upon Biblical Truth is to discuss it.  We may discover though the discourse with Christian brothers that our opinion is in fact based upon Truth.  I should have been a little clearer on my response, it should have read to ask for opinion based upone Scripture.  I did not mean to imply that opinions are worthless.

Doc, that is a slightly different discussion.  The New Testament is explicitly clear on the issue of divorce, "what God have put together let no man tear assunder."  However, what if one partner has no control over the issue?  What then does the Bible have to say about the issue?  If a man remarries after his wife leaves him, and he has not committed adultery, and he then remarries is he committing adultery with his new wife?  If so, upon whom does the sin fall?


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## matthewsman (Feb 18, 2005)

*There are some things worse than remarrying*

In ITimothy 5 considering taking care of widowed women it speaks of letting the younger widows remarry so they won't be tempted by desire.......Paul said it is better for a man to marry than burn.......Jesus didn't condemn the adulterous lady about to be stoned,but instead questioned the self-righteous that were about to stone her......Many people had more than one wife in biblical times,even though he divorced one,he had more.......If a woman was divorced she was damaged goods,her family couldn't get a dowry on her again,and furthermore had to support her lest she become a burden to the community. Most women did not have the ability to support themselves back then.The husband could keep his wife but display his affections to his other wife, an option we do not legally have now!!!

Anyway,Mitch,you asked for scripture........I'm afraid verses about God's love and all encompassing forgiveness are to numerous to list here.The teaching of not remarrying is no more condemning than any other sin we have committed from murder to white lies.Jesus did not come to condemn the world but to save it,to give life more abundant,from a loving spouse,to the dispensation of Grace....The New Testament has not been as known for it's legalism,but for his Grace and forgiveness....

Even though many people mentioned David and his affair with Bathsheba and the blessings he received later being in the Old Testament and later quoting New Testament Scripture to describe God today,I would like to remind everyone God is the same God all the time..........He is compassionate,he knows your needs,and all things work together for good for those who love the Lord.....He has proven many times,maybe even through th marriages of your friends,that his ways are not our ways.If God is working in their life now to bring people to him,who are we to question how he does it,or is it okay....It's obvious it is if he is blessing it now,Let God be God and hopefully he will continue forgiving our sins,whatever they are,and keep blessing his children in spite of our earthly circumstances,donnie


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