# Anger builds over short Gulf Snapper season



## slabhunter (Feb 2, 2012)

Competing interests, the EnviroWackos vs. the Citizens, is about to manifest itself: 

http://blog.al.com/live/2012/02/shortest_snapper_season_ever.html

The bureaucrats who are beyond the reach of the vote decide the fate of millions of folks whose living is based upon the longtime culture of the Gulf and the South Atlantic. This is as much a way of life issue as anything else Washington insists upon interfering with but that isn't the worse of it.

The damage ABOUT to be done by fiat will all but wipe out an entire generation of the fishing industry. Not so unlike the Family Farm, political interests smell easy money with no work by them to obtain it other than a little bitty line in the Federal Register.

Just as the children from the Farms crowd our Cities today in the search of work, so too will they be contending with millions from the Coastlines. While killing all of it off will sure allow the stocks to rebuild, the only ones benefiting will be Chinese and Japanese motherships.


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## Parker Phoenix (Feb 2, 2012)

“Yeah, we’re doing something wrong,” said Roy Crabtree, the fisheries service official in charge of setting the annual catch limit. “We’re giving (recreational anglers) too many days... The only thing to do when we keep going over (the harvest limit) is to give them fewer days.” 

This ought to show you the mentality of the people who are running OUR resourses. This all links to Obama, and his campaign to rule by regulation instead of legislation, once he has embedded his enviromental Nazi's in NOAA, there is hardly any way to irradicate them. There for they spread like cancer and take control of the fisheries and we can do nothing.


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## d-a (Feb 2, 2012)

Yep, did you notice the mention of fish tags? Sounds like catch shares to me. 

d-a


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## Parker Phoenix (Feb 2, 2012)

d-a said:


> Yep, did you notice the mention of fish tags? Sounds like catch shares to me.
> 
> d-a



They have plans for us, and it isn't gonna be good.


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## Dustin Pate (Feb 2, 2012)

Notice they are shutting Trigger fish down also? That is the most corrupt and idiotic group of people around. I hate it for the people that depend on these seasons. I also don't buy it for one second that the commercial guys aren't taking more than the recs are.


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## jdgator (Feb 2, 2012)

Marine fisheries council has always been rotten. The members are appointed by congress. A few southern conservative congressmen from Alabama, Mississippi, and Louisiana have been taking nice donations for years in exchange for appointing council members who will side with commercial fishing interests.


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## jdgator (Feb 2, 2012)

Senastor Jeff Sessions and Senator Shelby of Alabama are of particular blame on this. They accept the money from a few large commercial fishing interests in order appoint counselmen who favor commcerial over the recreational fishing industry.

Fella named Dr. Roy Crabtree is the counselman advocating the season closure for recreational fhsing in order to give more catch share to commercial intersts.


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## Parker Phoenix (Feb 2, 2012)

“Yeah, we’re doing something wrong,” said Roy Crabtree, the fisheries service official in charge of setting the annual catch limit. “We’re giving (recreational anglers) too many days... The only thing to do when we keep going over (the harvest limit) is to give them fewer days.” 



We know all about Mr. Crabtree, wish I had something good to say about him , but I don't. So I'll say nothing, you can read his on words and make up your own minds.


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## XTREME HUNTER (Feb 2, 2012)

I was reading on thehulltruth that Texas told them (the government) where to go and they have a open season all year (in state waters) do any of yall know if this is true?


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## Fletch_W (Feb 2, 2012)

Paraphrased from article:

"The system is set up to be a no-win for anglers. If we catch bigger fish, the season gets shorter. If we catch small fish, the population must be stressed and the season gets shorter."

Pretty good way to sum it up there. Will Mitt Romney fix this?


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## Gulfin (Feb 2, 2012)

All they are doing is creating a whole new group of outlaws.

It's flat out rediculous what these people are doing and no one can tell them anything.


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## Bryannecker (Feb 2, 2012)

These folks just do not know when and where to stop.  They do not read or know any modern history.  Tryants have, also,  overstrepped their bounds and suffered the consequences.  Some suffer revolution and civil war, but these current folks will collapse our economy,  and then not have a job.  They are in concert with all of the minions out there even though they do not think so.  

Bad economy + stress on citizens and their "pursuit of happiness" and their livelyhood+overregulation is a prescription for the total collapse of our society as we know it.  

But do no believe me, just ask any Roman citizen you encounter.  Well, maybe not since the Roman Empire did collapse from within.  So did the Soviet Union in more recent times and we are headed there, too.  

We are being led by a pack of FOOLS right over a cliff.  Founding Fathers Where are YOU!

Capt. Jimmy


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## d-a (Feb 2, 2012)

XTREME HUNTER said:


> I was reading on thehulltruth that Texas told them (the government) where to go and they have a open season all year (in state waters) do any of yall know if this is true?



Gordon its been that way for years. It's nothing new. Most of the state water snappers are down towards Corpus Christie where the water is deeper near the coast. 

There year round estimate of red snapper caught are taken right off the top of the total allowable catch. I've been told but don't know how accurate it is that all of Texas's state water snapper only cost the other 4 states one day of the snapper season. 

The federales can only set the limits in there waters. The states has control over there water. Fla and Texas are the only two with a 9 mile state water zone. 

d-a


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## XTREME HUNTER (Feb 3, 2012)

d-a said:


> Gordon its been that way for years. It's nothing new. Most of the state water snappers are down towards Corpus Christie where the water is deeper near the coast.
> 
> There year round estimate of red snapper caught are taken right off the top of the total allowable catch. I've been told but don't know how accurate it is that all of Texas's state water snapper only cost the other 4 states one day of the snapper season.
> 
> ...



Well then....Why does FL not help there own economy and open it up.  Man I kill me how smart I am I just solved there whole problem


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## XTREME HUNTER (Feb 3, 2012)

I have plenty of numbers less than 9 miles


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## d-a (Feb 3, 2012)

XTREME HUNTER said:


> Well then....Why does FL not help there own economy and open it up.  Man I kill me how smart I am I just solved there whole problem



Gordon

I would imagine its about funding. I'm sure FWC gets some funding from the federal govt for programs like artificial reefs.  Texas doesn't need the assistance since they have all the oil money coming in plus every oil well is an artificial reef. 

d-a


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## Parker Phoenix (Feb 3, 2012)

You know, it's amazing how our elected officials almost run from getting involved in this fight. I have yet to find a congressman or senator that is serious about getting involved in this on the fishermens side. They write a nice letter, but that is where it ends.


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## d-a (Feb 3, 2012)

Parker Phoenix said:


> They have plans for us, and it isn't gonna be good.



Do you want to read there plans for us? 

Read page 17, the Prefered state In 2020.
http://www.nmfs.noaa.gov/ocs/documents/Vision_2020_FINAL-1.pdf

d-a


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## Parker Phoenix (Feb 3, 2012)

Holy Cow, I feel like I just read the communist manifesto!!!!!!!!!!!


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## jdgator (Feb 3, 2012)

d-a said:


> Do you want to read there plans for us?
> 
> Read page 17, the Prefered state In 2020.
> http://www.nmfs.noaa.gov/ocs/documents/Vision_2020_FINAL-1.pdf
> ...



Its says if there is anything left over after the commercial industry is satisfied, they might let us have fish. Thats the attitude, commerical fishing is numero uno.


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## slabhunter (Feb 3, 2012)

d-a said:


> Gordon
> 
> I would imagine its about funding. I'm sure FWC gets some funding from the federal govt for programs like artificial reefs.  Texas doesn't need the assistance since they have all the oil money coming in plus every oil well is an artificial reef.
> 
> d-a



The root of all local evil: Funding from Washington. It is how business is conducted, you contribute to elect and they redistribute tax dollars in return. Thomas Jefferson has been dead a long time but he was right as rain back then about what ails us today.

The fix is as simple as FL telling NOAA to pound sand: cut off the money. When enough are fed up...


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## d-a (Feb 3, 2012)

jdgator said:


> Its says if there is anything left over after the commercial industry is satisfied, they might let us have fish. Thats the attitude, commerical fishing is numero uno.



You need to remember that the head of NOAA Jane lubechno has deep roots with groups like PEW and EDF. They only think Commercial fishing is the allowable fishing since it feeds the country as a whole.  

d-a


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## d-a (Feb 3, 2012)

Most people don't know this, but you can legally keep 1 1/2 pounds of filets a day per everyone on the boat. All you have to do is be able to cook it while your on the water. If you want fresh fish, catch them, fillet them and cook them while anchored. 

Gas grill rebellion? It's already happening. 

d-a


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## Parker Phoenix (Feb 3, 2012)

Funny how this came to a boil earlier, many folks wrote letters, got active. Then its just like it went away, no just remission, and they are now coming back with a vengence.


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## Bryannecker (Feb 3, 2012)

*Assumptions debunked*



Parker Phoenix said:


> Holy Cow, I feel like I just read the communist manifesto!!!!!!!!!!!



Actually, it is more like a five year plan of the old Soviet regime, but expanded to an eight year plan-2012-2020, as a target date.  It is the very essence of a planned economy, which is part and parcel of all communist economic plans.  

What is so telling about this report is the 10 assumptions that it is predicated upon.  One is that even it the assumed overfishing is curtailed, demand will still outstrip supply. 
NO:  If the current world wide economic crisis continues, then demand will have to decline as an outgrowth of economic limitations on consumers.  The same is true of increased pressure from recreational fishermen.  Increased regulations have already resulted in a shift from this activity based on a lack of funding by recreational fishermen.  Where are all the boat builders and dealers?  

I could go on and on to debunk the basic assumptions as presented on a line by line basis for all ten of them, but why should I since they do not listen to us,  since it would be against their vested interests to do so.  With the faulty assumption that demand will continue past elimination of overfishing, they are setting the stage for the next phase of curbing demand.  That will assure them of a job for years to come and that is why they will not listen.  

Folks, we are in the grasp of another great depression and decline.  Read you economic news and you will see that we are, but the regulators have totally ignored that fact of our current situation and continue to contribute mightily to that decline by their faulty assumptions and actions.  

So, Mr. Parker, you are totally correct, in that this is an outgrowth of the communist manifesto repackaged in a five or eight year plan for a controlled economy.  

It is centralized planning at it's finest.  That type of economy has never worked and never will.  Old Tom Jefferson said something else too:  " Every now and then a little revolution is good."  That time is very near.  

Capt. Jimmy


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## slabhunter (Feb 3, 2012)

Big 10-4 Captain Jimmy!

An election year like no other. I have flooded the emails and voice mailboxes of my folks, not that I would expect any of them to sympathize since they are all Obamites but one does what one can.

I vote with my wallet too. Amazing how intertwined some of this stuff is once you investigate just a smidgen! As such, the list of entities I will trade with shrinks whenever I discover or am informed of supporting Anti-American causes.

Guys I grew up with losing their boats and even the guys who were smart have little fallback given this unbelievably horrific and inexcusable economic outhouse hole created by Washington. Destin Harbor will look very different by this October.


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## XTREME HUNTER (Feb 3, 2012)

d-a said:


> Most people don't know this, but you can legally keep 1 1/2 pounds of filets a day per everyone on the boat. All you have to do is be able to cook it while your on the water. If you want fresh fish, catch them, fillet them and cook them while anchored.
> 
> Gas grill rebellion? It's already happening.
> 
> d-a



Just make sure you throw any thing not eaten over board before you come back in, per regulations


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## jamessig (Feb 4, 2012)

For anyone who wants to enjoy some fresh fish on the water and is hesitant to have an open flame on their boat, there is always ceviche.
http://southamericanfood.about.com/od/appetizersfirstcourses/a/ceviche.htm


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## Bryannecker (Feb 4, 2012)

Back on topic:  Does anyone else wonder why the Gulf has a nine mile state waters limit and the Atlantic has a mere three mile state waters limit?  Why do commercial fishermen have shorter size limits for BSB than do recreational fishermen?  These are the type questions we should be considering for the councils. 

These question are posed in the context of the "Vision 2020" final report as outlined above.  And they are on topic of this posting!

Capt. Jimmy


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## Parker Phoenix (Feb 4, 2012)

Do they use traps or hooks on the sea bass? In the gulf they trap them, wipes them out. Doesn't take long either. I hate a freakin' black sea bass trap, it breaks off it kills untill it rust apart. Snapper and grouper are allowed to be shorter for commercials so it would lesson the by kill. Might be the same for black sea bass.


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## d-a (Feb 4, 2012)

Parker

Fish traps are illegal in federal waters. Fla allows traps for BSB in state waters. 

Bryannecker

The state waters have to do with mineral rights. The state claimed them in the 40's and the supreme court over ruled them. This led to Submerged land act in 1953. It was never intended for fisheries manegment. 

d-a


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## MudDucker (Feb 5, 2012)

Sportsmen were warned that Obummer would back this, but none wanted to believe.

We need change and we need it now!


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## Bryannecker (Feb 5, 2012)

*Miles, leagues and state waters short changes???*



d-a said:


> Parker
> 
> Fish traps are illegal in federal waters. Fla allows traps for BSB in state waters.
> 
> ...



Thanks, 
From that information, I figured out how the Gulf States got a nine-mile area of state waters. The Gulf States got more since they asked for leagues: (three marine leagues for Texas and the Gulf coast of Florida).  

The definition of a league is: On land, the league was most commonly defined as three miles (about 4.8 km), although the length of a "mile" could vary from place to place and at different times. At sea, a league was three nautical miles (about 5.6 km).

So 3x3=9 Nautical miles. For the Gulf States.

Bummer, we should have gotten the three leagues, too. We would have nine miles of state fishing waters instead of the paltry three. That is why words are so important in legal documents: Leagues vs. Miles!  

And thanks for the comments on the purpose of the SLA

Acronym: SLA
Citation: 43 U.S.C. §§1301-1315 (2002).

Legislative Purpose:
In passing the Submerged Lands Act, Congress sought to return the title to submerged lands to the states and promote the exploration and development of petroleum deposits in coastal waters.

As usual the fish managers jumped on that to pervert the legislative intent of Congress. 

Again, thanks for your input and knowledge.

   Capt. Jimmy


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