# PGA / Saudi League



## James12 (Jun 4, 2022)

What a mess.  I think players should be able to choose, but like BASS/MLF, they should have to re-qualify to re-enter the PGA if they step away. After reading into a bit more, The PGA is starting to sound like the NCAA in the ordeal.


----------



## TomC (Jun 4, 2022)

Kevin Na just resigned so pace of play should pick up a bit on the PGA Tour


----------



## Hunter922 (Jun 4, 2022)

Shocked Dustin chose to go thay way. Lots of money but if the PGA holds to their word he is taking A big chance..
As a golfer myself saying the words you can never play the Master's again would have been enough for me to say no way..


----------



## James12 (Jun 4, 2022)

I think DJ is saying “remember that coca-cola suspension you gave me a few years back?”
?


----------



## formula1 (Jun 5, 2022)

PGA thinks too much of itself.  Most players saying right thing and staying are being paid to do so! But  it is broken and need of repair. I look for this new league to last just long enough to change to PGA and everyone will come running back!


----------



## FootLongDawg (Jun 5, 2022)

Lots of European golfers are signing up.  Just too much money not to join.  There is a faux "wokeness" factor working here with the  American golfers staying true to the PGA.  They crucified Phil over this


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Jun 6, 2022)

Tiger gave up a nine figure payday with the saudis…nine figures…sheesh


----------



## James12 (Jun 6, 2022)

Mickelson now in, dang.


----------



## mrs. hornet22 (Jun 7, 2022)

James12 said:


> Mickelson now in, dang.


Saw that this mornin. dang.


----------



## James12 (Jun 7, 2022)

DJ’s presser was pretty clear.


----------



## The Original Rooster (Jun 7, 2022)

So it looks like one unethical golf tour run by the Saudi's is messing up another unethical golf tour run by the PGA and the golfers are making their decision based on the money. These millionaire golfers are all about talking about ethics until the money comes calling and then we see what they're really about.


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Jun 8, 2022)

It’s not a bed set up…teams against teams…I’m guessing not a scramble but a total of the 4 players scores against the other 4 man teams…should be pretty interesting to watch…they got team names and all.. ?


----------



## Lindseys Grandpa (Jun 8, 2022)

Hunter922 said:


> Shocked Dustin chose to go thay way. Lots of money but if the PGA holds to their word he is taking A big chance..
> As a golfer myself saying the words you can never play the Master's again would have been enough for me to say no way..


The Masters haven't taken a stand publicly on this . The PGA has nothing to do with who does or doesn't play there .As a former champion I expect him and Mickelson will be able to play could be wrong . They paid him 100 million dollars just to join . Gonna be interesting.


----------



## The Original Rooster (Jun 8, 2022)

Lindseys Grandpa said:


> The Masters haven't taken a stand publicly on this . The PGA has nothing to do with who does or doesn't play there .As a former champion I expect him and Mickelson will be able to play could be wrong . They paid him 100 million dollars just to join . Gonna be interesting.


Yep, Augusta National has always done pretty much what it wanted to and I suspect it always will. It's a invitational tournament with some conditions so they really can invite whoever they like.


----------



## alphachief (Jun 8, 2022)

It’s golf…who cares?  I can take a nap just as easily to a Saudi tournament!


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Jun 8, 2022)

alphachief said:


> It’s golf…who cares?  I can take a nap just as easily to a Saudi tournament!




you cared enough to click on and respond


----------



## alphachief (Jun 8, 2022)

ATLFalconsfan80 said:


> you cared enough to click on and respond



I know…slow morning for interesting posts!


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Jun 8, 2022)

alphachief said:


> I know…slow morning for interesting posts!


.. very true


----------



## treemanjohn (Jun 8, 2022)

Tiger turned the Saudis down. Supposedly it was a 9 figure deal. The success of professional golf was built on Tiger


----------



## benellisbe (Jun 9, 2022)

PGA Tour suspended all 17 PGA Tour players who are competing in LIV, including not allowing players that resigned to not come back.  Looks a lot like the NCAA.


----------



## jiminbogart (Jun 9, 2022)

Hunter922 said:


> As a golfer myself saying the words you can never play the Master's again would have been enough for me to say no way..



The golfers on the LIV tour can still play in the 4 majors. They are not PGA events.


----------



## jiminbogart (Jun 9, 2022)

James12 said:


> Mickelson now in, dang.



He got a 200 million dollar signing bonus. 

He "only" made 90 million in 30 years on the PGA tour. 

The man's gotta eat.


----------



## TomC (Jun 9, 2022)

Gotta eat...........and gotta gamble!!


----------



## Whitefeather (Jun 9, 2022)

jiminbogart said:


> He got a 200 million dollar signing bonus.
> 
> He "only" made 90 million in 30 years on the PGA tour.
> 
> The man's gotta eat.



So is all this money a guaranteed contract and winning a tournament is just for bragging rights?  
I don’t fully understand how this works with all these players being paid. It seems to me that the LIV is more of a competing team vs a competing league/tour


----------



## FootLongDawg (Jun 9, 2022)

jiminbogart said:


> He got a 200 million dollar signing bonus.
> 
> He "only" made 90 million in 30 years on the PGA tour.
> 
> The man's gotta eat.




Phil Mickelson had a net worth of 400 million dollars before all this new league started.  Top players in any sport don't get mega rich just playing ball.  Michael Jordon didn't get mega rich playing basketball.  He got mega rich selling Nike shoes along with all the other various endorsements.


----------



## James12 (Jun 10, 2022)

Saudi’s are rich and now they’re paying what is change to them, to golfers.


----------



## jiminbogart (Jun 10, 2022)

FootLongDawg said:


> Phil Mickelson had a net worth of 400 million dollars before all this new league started.  Top players in any sport don't get mega rich just playing ball.  Michael Jordon didn't get mega rich playing basketball.  He got mega rich selling Nike shoes along with all the other various endorsements.



Yep.

I was addressing what he was paid by each tour. He had 200 million reasons to join the LIV tour.


----------



## jiminbogart (Jun 10, 2022)

James12 said:


> Saudi’s are rich and now they’re paying what is change to them, to golfers.




Just like a told my wife when she was surprised Elon Musk gave Amber Heard an 80k Tesla(she binge watched the Dep/Heard trial).

That's like me giving someone a fraction of a penny.


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Jun 10, 2022)

Whitefeather said:


> So is all this money a guaranteed contract and winning a tournament is just for bragging rights?
> I don’t fully understand how this works with all these players being paid. It seems to me that the LIV is more of a competing team vs a competing league/tour




So I'm guessing its their contract money. The tournament their playing in London right now has a $25 million purse. $20 million to the players, last place gets like $150k, and then $5 million is split between the top 3 teams. 

Its more money than they've ever played for, I kind of like this setup


----------



## FootLongDawg (Jun 10, 2022)

I bet the loyalty of more PGA players will be severely tested as time goes on.  I don't know what all the marginal players are waiting on to make the move.  Lots of money over there and not near the competition.


----------



## mark-7mag (Jun 14, 2022)

I would love to see Mickelson swn the US Open this weekend


----------



## benellisbe (Jun 21, 2022)

Being reported that Brooks Koepka is headed to LIV


----------



## Dustin Pate (Jun 21, 2022)

benellisbe said:


> Being reported that Brooks Koepka is headed to LIV



Wouldn't doubt it one bit. He has always been a all in for the majors type guy. A reduced schedule and big time money is tailor made for him.


----------



## Outlaw Dawgsey Wales (Jun 21, 2022)

Plus, they only play 54 holes on the Saudi Tour.


----------



## James12 (Jun 22, 2022)

He won’t be the last


----------



## DannyW (Jun 22, 2022)

Don't know much about the financials of the LIV tour, just that they have deep pockets. But I don't see long term viability for the tour unless they can get some TV deals.

Showing exhibition golf on youtube just doesn't seem like a sound business model.

They may have tremendous financial backing but even ultra-rich Saudis will grow tired of throwing millions down a dry hole after a few years.


----------



## James12 (Jun 22, 2022)

The NCAA, I mean the PGA  is already discussing a similar schedule and bracket.


----------



## James12 (Jun 22, 2022)

Hard to believe the PGA just lost 4 of its biggest names so quickly.   People an say say what they want, but those guys are their draw on weekends.  Koepka, DJ, DeChamb, Mickleson, etc….  

And Rory, well he sounds just like Rory.


----------



## DannyW (Jun 22, 2022)

FWIW...I found out what LIV stands for. It's not an acronym. It's the Roman numeral for 54. They play 54 holes, and a 54 is considered to be a perfect stroke score.


----------



## kingfish (Jun 22, 2022)

All I know is that no matter what happens, the best golfers are going to play in the Masters every year and the Masters can't be bought.  Why ?  Because they are the Masters and they don't care !!!  Man I love that.


----------



## James12 (Jul 28, 2022)

FootLongDawg said:


> I bet the loyalty of more PGA players will be severely tested as time goes on.  I don't know what all the marginal players are waiting on to make the move.  Lots of money over there and not near the competition.



The PGA has taken a major hit now, period.  Many of the Tour’s top attractors have left - what a list and what a mass exodus! Bubba Watson being the latest big name.


----------



## James12 (Jul 31, 2022)

Who’s watching the PGA today?


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 9, 2022)

Looks like Cameron Smith going to LIV

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/unfortunately-yeah-gone-pga-tour-130616566.html


----------



## TomC (Aug 9, 2022)

I like Smith. Hope they actually start playing REAL competitive golf. Nothing more than a Monday pro-am / outing format right now.


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 9, 2022)

TomC said:


> I like Smith. Hope they actually start playing REAL competitive golf. Nothing more than a Monday pro-am / outing format right now.



I like the set-up…the teams and individual aspect of it…


----------



## TomC (Aug 9, 2022)

That ain't real competitive golf.......not even close. 4 rounds, a cut, LOSE THE MUSIC and silly team names and the whole team thing entirely. Golf has "tradition" and it needs to stay that way at the highest levels. Shotgun start, REALLY????? There is a place for that type of golf such as celebrity pro-ams and Monday outings but that is not how the best in the world should be playing.

I don't blame the guys for taking that kind of money, just start playing REAL GOLF!!


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 9, 2022)

TomC said:


> That ain't real competitive golf.......not even close. 4 rounds, a cut, LOSE THE MUSIC and silly team names and the whole team thing entirely. Golf has "tradition" and it needs to stay that way at the highest levels. There is a place for that type of golf such as celebrity pro-ams and Monday outings but that is not how the best in the world should be playing.
> 
> I don't blame the guys for taking that kind of money, just start playing REAL GOLF!!



They are playing real golf… players still shooting 11-12 under par for the day…the pros must feel it’s real enough to accept the pay day…


----------



## TomC (Aug 9, 2022)

It might be "real golf" for those that don't know the game or its history but its not for those that do, and that's OK I guess. We are losing the "tradition" aspect everywhere you look these days, why not golf? SAD!


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 9, 2022)

TomC said:


> It might be "real golf" for those that don't know the game or its history but its not for those that do, and that's OK I guess. We are losing the "tradition" aspect everywhere you look these days, why not golf? SAD!



“OK”

So what rule changes have they made for an actual round of golf? They get mulligans? Do they play best ball? Do they hit from the whites? Oh but they play music during warmups and driving range time…and the players are actually interacting with the fans…”it’s killing the tradition”….it’s not killing tradition…what do kids watch nowadays? YouTube right…YouTube is huge in golf right now…so many golf channels that kids are subscribing to at a record pace…and their getting excited and interested in golf and going out and playing…I’m a member at Bentwater golf club in Acworth…I see kids more and more every week..and YouTube just so happens to show the LIV tournaments live streamed…heck my own kid wants me to take him now because of “Good Good Golf” YouTube channel…it’s finally doing something to attract a younger crowd..


----------



## formula1 (Aug 9, 2022)

They play 54 holes. Winning come from bonus pay.  The big names get big money, basically a retirement account. So it’s different. 

I like the PGA but they needed this to change their monopoly.  But the PGA is a far better pure golf league.


----------



## TomC (Aug 9, 2022)

ATLFalconsfan80 said:


> “OK”
> 
> So what rule changes have they made for an actual round of golf? They get mulligans? Do they play best ball? Do they hit from the whites? Oh but they play music during warmups and driving range time…and the players are actually interacting with the fans…”it’s killing the tradition”….it’s not killing tradition…what do kids watch nowadays? YouTube right…YouTube is huge in golf right now…so many golf channels that kids are subscribing to at a record pace…and their getting excited and interested in golf and going out and playing…I’m a member at Bentwater golf club in Acworth…I see kids more and more every week..and YouTube just so happens to show the LIV tournaments live streamed…heck my own kid wants me to take him now because of “Good Good Golf” YouTube channel…it’s finally doing something to attract a younger crowd..



Yes, a younger crowd and apparently a fair amount of older ones too who apparently know little or maybe I should say have little appreciation of the game's history, its traditions and the format of what "competitive" golf is. That's OK though as this is the audience LIV is marketing their entertainment product too.


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 9, 2022)

TomC said:


> Yes, a younger crowd and apparently a fair amount of older ones too who apparently know little or maybe I should say have little appreciation of the game's history, its traditions and the format of what "competitive" golf is. That's OK though as this is the audience LIV is marketing their entertainment product too.



We appreciate the history and traditions of it…and it’s still competitive…


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 9, 2022)

formula1 said:


> They play 54 holes. Winning come from bonus pay.  The big names get big money, basically a retirement account. So it’s different.
> 
> I like the PGA but they needed this to change their monopoly.  But the PGA is a far better pure golf league.



I like the PGA to…always have and always will…I agree…they needed some competition and they got it…it’s actually good for the game


----------



## TomC (Aug 9, 2022)

I'm just a dinosaur, worked in the business, played competitive golf when woods were still made out of wood and the British Open was still called the British Open (the correct name IMO). Maybe it will evolve into a format that every other tour in the world plays, then it would have some amount of legitimacy and we won't have to watch players' noses grow as they stand in front of a microphone talking about it being "good for the game".


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 10, 2022)

TomC said:


> I'm just a dinosaur, worked in the business, played competitive golf when woods were still made out of wood and the British Open was still called the British Open (the correct name IMO). Maybe it will evolve into a format that every other tour in the world plays, then it would have some amount of legitimacy and we won't have to watch players' noses grow as they stand in front of a microphone talking about it being "good for the game".



You like “competitive” golf but don’t like the PGA having competition…makes sense


----------



## TomC (Aug 10, 2022)

Yep, you are 100% correct. Makes about as much sense as the the NFL having another professional football league who bought off the NFL's best players and then playing against them at the same time on Sunday afternoons in the fall. But maybe they play a version of football, maybe flag or touch football in shorts and only 2 quarters and call it a competitive game.

After fighting and scratching and climbing the mountain on the mini and other tours there is one place where the best go to play, the PGA Tour and the 4 majors.........not some glorified exhibition match!


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 10, 2022)

TomC said:


> Yep, you are 100% correct. Makes about as much sense as the the NFL having another professional football league playing against them at the same time on Sunday afternoons in the fall.




They may in the future.... Its worked for AEW/WWE and now LIV/PGA....


"want competition but not competitive brands"


----------



## killerv (Aug 10, 2022)

ATLFalconsfan80 said:


> Tiger gave up a nine figure payday with the saudis…nine figures…sheesh



they offered his son 34 mil a year for a 4 year contract


----------



## killerv (Aug 10, 2022)

TomC said:


> I like Smith. Hope they actually start playing REAL competitive golf. Nothing more than a Monday pro-am / outing format right now.




You pay me that kind of money i dont care how someone describes this type of play.


----------



## killerv (Aug 10, 2022)

Well, most that have left I didn't care for, reed, watson, keopka, I was coming around on dechambeau.

All these good golfers leaving and Henley still couldn't pull one out last sunday. Sundays and Henley dont mix.


----------



## Snookpimpin (Aug 10, 2022)

Saudi money back in American pockets is fine by me.


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 10, 2022)

Snookpimpin said:


> Saudi money back in American pockets is fine by me.



“But… But…But… the tradition” 

If it was true tradition they wouldn’t have graphite shafts with an extra stiff shaft with a 4° loft (Bryson)…they wouldn’t have tee’s, just a mound of dirt or sand…

They would be playing with a 1 & 2 irons and not hybrids….

“But…But ….But…the tradition”


----------



## James12 (Aug 10, 2022)

Again, the PGA could’ve found middle ground, just like the NCAA could’ve with NIL. Same exact thing happened with B.A.S.S. and MLF.  However they didn’t and drew a line in the sand (trap) and this is the crazy result.   They’re contractors not employees.  I think what you’ll see next is like with BASS where they’ll create some loophole or makeup a rule that allows guys back that want to come back.


----------



## Cool Hand Luke (Aug 10, 2022)

Most of these guys already have more money than they'll ever need. IMO, they turned their back on what got them there.


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 10, 2022)

Cool Hand Luke said:


> Most of these guys already have more money than they'll ever need. IMO, they turned their back on what got them there.



So you would turn down $100 million signing bonus if offered?


----------



## The Original Rooster (Aug 10, 2022)

James12 said:


> Again, the PGA could’ve found middle ground, just like the NCAA could’ve with NIL. Same exact thing happened with B.A.S.S. and MLF.  However they didn’t and drew a line in the sand (trap) and this is the crazy result.   They’re contractors not employees.  I think what you’ll see next is like with BASS where they’ll create some loophole or makeup a rule that allows guys back that want to come back.


Yep, all true. However, there's no doubt in my mind that this Saudi backed golf league is just a heavy handed attempt to clean up their image. I know we have to do business with some bad folks like China and the Saudi's but I don't think I could get into bed with them and accept money from them, especially with the fact that the guys accepting payoffs have already made fortunes on the PGA and European tours. 



ATLFalconsfan80 said:


> So you would turn down $100 million signing bonus if offered?


Since as a professional golfer I'd have already made millions upon millions anyway, yes I'd turn it down. Like I said, we may have to buy oil from them and use them to stabilize the Middle East, but I wouldn't let them use me as a tool to make their image look better.


----------



## TomC (Aug 10, 2022)

I hope Augusta is installing some loud speakers at strategic locations around the course to thump some hip hop, maybe some Back in Black for when Gary Player takes his honorary tee shot on Thursday morning to cater to this "new" generation of golf fan. It shocks me that Tiger, Jack, Augusta, the RNA and PGA want to preserve the yes TRADITIONS of the game and play 4 rounds of golf with a cut only open to players who ACTUALLY qualify via merit. They are soooo behind the times!!!!!


----------



## Cool Hand Luke (Aug 10, 2022)

ATLFalconsfan80 said:


> So you would turn down $100 million signing bonus if offered?



That's dirty money IMO. 

All these guys were made multi-millionares by playing on the PGA Tour anyways. How much money does a man need? 

Lost a lot of respect for Mickelson.......


----------



## James12 (Aug 11, 2022)

American athletes making millions off China and other similar ordeals. What’s the difference?


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 11, 2022)

Cool Hand Luke said:


> That's dirty money IMO.
> 
> All these guys were made multi-millionares by playing on the PGA Tour anyways. How much money does a man need?
> 
> Lost a lot of respect for Mickelson.......



Didn’t answer my question…cause you know you wouldn’t…nobody in this forum would…you would say you would to hold the appearance of having these morals that y’all claim y’all have..but at the end of the day every one on here would take that $100 million…y’all are all the same on here…like an echo…but in the end you know deep down y’all would take that money and run…y’all just scared to admit it ?


----------



## Cool Hand Luke (Aug 11, 2022)

ATLFalconsfan80 said:


> Didn’t answer my question…cause you know you wouldn’t…nobody in this forum would…you would say you would to hold the appearance of having these morals that y’all claim y’all have..but at the end of the day every one on here would take that $100 million…y’all are all the same on here…like an echo…but in the end you know deep down y’all would take that money and run…y’all just scared to admit it ?



Don't pretend you know me. If I was already worth over $100 million, what I need another for? How much money does one man need? These guys done pretty well on the PGA Tour and now turning their backs on what got them there. They got rich playing a game, must be rough. It's about greed. 

 Yea, some of us on here have morals, including loyalty.


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Aug 11, 2022)

Cool Hand Luke said:


> Don't pretend you know me. If I was already worth over $100 million, what I need another for? How much money does one man need? These guys done pretty well on the PGA Tour and now turning their backs on what got them there. They got rich playing a game, must be rough. It's about greed.
> 
> Yea, some of us on here have morals, including loyalty.



?…not pretending…how much money does one man need? As much as I can get..same as you ?


----------



## The Original Rooster (Aug 11, 2022)

Cool Hand Luke said:


> Don't pretend you know me. If I was already worth over $100 million, what I need another for? How much money does one man need? These guys done pretty well on the PGA Tour and now turning their backs on what got them there. They got rich playing a game, must be rough. It's about greed.
> 
> Yea, some of us on here have morals, including loyalty.


Yep, plus the fact that when you accept a few hundred million from the Saudi's you are considered bought and paid for as far as they're concerned. That means you come when you're called, sit when and where you're told, and say what they tell you to.


----------



## mrs. hornet22 (Sep 4, 2022)

So why is everybody poo pooing the golfers going to LIV and nothing is said about the US Open tennis that Emirates Airlines is sponsoring? Anybody


----------



## TomC (Sep 4, 2022)

I don't have a problem with LIV golf or where the $ comes from and you can't blame the players for ignoring that kind of ridiculous money. I have a problem with the LIV golf format. Play the same format as the other tours, get your world ranking points and let's see how it all shakes out.

Don't need a limited field with team play, shotgun start, music and other silly circus antics to try to appeal to and attract a "new" generation who would be better off........much much better off if they actually understood and appreciated golfs' traditions and the way the best golfers have always competed.

I'm just an old fogey traditionalist. That's why I'll always appreciate going to Augusta. Players playing the way it ought to be played and Patrons (that's fans for the new generation) acting the way fans are suppose to act on a golf course. Old school traditional golf at its best! The way it ought to be!


----------



## ATLFalconsfan80 (Sep 4, 2022)

TomC said:


> I don't have a problem with LIV golf or where the $ comes from and you can't blame the players for ignoring that kind of ridiculous money. I have a problem with the LIV golf format. Play the same format as the other tours, get your world ranking points and let's see how it all shakes out.
> 
> Don't need a limited field with team play, shotgun start, music and other silly circus antics to try to appeal to and attract a "new" generation who would be better off........much much better off if they actually understood and appreciated golfs' traditions and the way the best golfers have always competed.
> 
> I'm just an old fogey traditionalist. That's why I'll always appreciate going to Augusta. Players playing the way it ought to be played and Patrons (that's fans for the new generation) acting the way fans are suppose to act on a golf course. Old school traditional golf at its best! The way it ought to be!



Reading this… I can respect and understand where your coming from..and a few points you made I can agree with..I’m not fully sold on keeping it fully traditional..heck even the pga is going a non traditional route come 2024 with the whole Tiger and Rory experiment…I would never want to see the Masters played LIV style…but there are several PGA tours I would rather see LIV set-up…


----------



## LEGHORN (Sep 4, 2022)

There are many golfers on LIV that haven’t made millions and millions on the PGA. It’s easy if you’re Rory or Tiger to say no way you’d leave and to bash it, if you do have 100s millions. But for some of these guys, it’s generational wealth for them and their families. I don’t blame any of them for going. I’m actually sick of the PGA, MLB, NFL, etc getting so deep into politics. I was done with PGA when they moved the tournament that was to be held at Trumps course. I hope this LIV stuff hurts them bad.


----------



## James12 (Sep 22, 2022)

Anyone by chance see the lineups for the Presidents Cup? Man LIV Golf has impacted that far greater than most realize.  Wow.


----------

