# River jet boat



## kbad

Ok for all you river guys.
I am toying with the idea of getting me a jet boat for some river fishing, but know exactly nothing about them.

I could use some help and info on brands and styles to look at,must have items and nice to have items, bottom thickness ect.

I am thinking in the 18 foot range with a 115 or 90 hp.
Budget will be like 16k or under.

What say you all help me out please.  thanks Kevin

The G3 1860ccj looks enticing.


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## Showman

Jets are a lot of fun in Skinny Water conditions.  They are also not very fuel efficient (typical loss of 30% of HP).  Since you plan on running in shallow water where anything could jump up and whack a hole in the part that is supposed to keep you dry, I would go with at least a 0.100 thickness for the bottom (or 0.125 if you can get it).  Tunnels hulls, whether for a Jet or Prop drive tend to draw a smidge more draft when sitting still in the water than traditional hulls do.  Even so, a tunnel hull will better protect your jet unit since it is riding in a pocket created by the tunnel instead of anything actually protruding below the bottom of the hull that can come in contact with a tougher, non-movable object.  Jets also will suck up anything in their way.  Grass, sand, plastic bags will wear one out in a hurry.  Tunnel Prop's are far more efficient.  You may need 6" of water then instead of 2" with a Jet but you will use less fuel, won't need to oversize the power to get the same results, and might not ventilate as bad in rough water.

Just my views (Just Say'n in other words).


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## 1gr8bldr

Hello Kbad, If you fish lots of different places, a jet has lots of limitations. Showman knows what he is talking about. They are loud. Use lots of fuel, Take an extremely heavy motor in comparrison to a prop to get the same speed. Will suck up anything in it's path. Are hard to get on plane when loaded heavy. Tunnels are good but when sitting, actually cause you to set deeper in the water. So you have to decide if your jet will be designed for "on plane" or for off plane. I built mine for off plane. In other words, the balance of mine is set level. I can putt through 5 inches of water. I have a level epoxied into my console. I watch it constantly. When going through the shallows, If I have passengers, I might have to ask one of them to come up front with me. My console is at the very front. I can drive standing in the bottom of the boat for normal driving. I stand on the platdform for most river driving in shallow water. My steering wheel is horizontal so I can drive standing in front of my console. This allows me to see the bottom. A jet built for "on plane" does not factor any of these issues. Console at the back gets it on plane easy. My first jet was a learning experience. My next one was built in my head first. I hardly ever fish anywhere except behind the dam. They cut the turbines on and off. But when I go up on the lake for a tournament, I don't need a jet. Jets do handle great as opposed to props. I can make turns and thread the needle between rocks that a canoe would have trouble with. The reason is that the motor is always in foward with a jet. When changing from foward to reverse, I don't have to wait because I am only changing the gate direction. While most steer in foward. I pull the rear around as much as I go foward. Very much like a car with four wheel steering. A jack plate is nice for shallow water. When I get in 6 inches of water, I raise it up to keep it from picking up everything in the river. Tilting it up just don't work for that kind of water. So, maybe I have given you some things to think about. Decide if you want a jet to get from point a to b or if you want it to navigate extreme shallow water. When they cut our turbines off, I go from hole to hole until I find the fish. Most times they are all together. Super exciting to sliter through 5inches of water to the next pool and as you arrive it looks like bombs being set off under water with so many fish.


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## T.P.

I adore the jets. Most fun you can have with your britches on.


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## fish bum

*Jet boat*

Good stuff!! Just add a couple things.
1st get all the power you can.  Under power a jet boat and you will hate it.  I think I would advise a used rig for your 1st.  Get something you can get out of if you find it is not for you.  A tunnel is good but not necessary
I just sold my 1860 tracker. It had a 150 with a jet foot
The thing with more power is you will find yourself in a place that you only have 20 yards to get on plane or can't go!   Think t.p is getting ready to build a new boat?
I am ordering a new hull today.  1966  190 bottom. It will have a 200 on it.  A slight v in the rear is. Better than flat.
I am a dealer for outboard jets if you need a pump or parts


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## 1gr8bldr

fish bum said:


> Good stuff!! Just add a couple things.
> 1st get all the power you can.  Under power a jet boat and you will hate it.  I think I would advise a used rig for your 1st.  Get something you can get out of if you find it is not for you.  A tunnel is good but not necessary
> I just sold my 1860 tracker. It had a 150 with a jet foot
> The thing with more power is you will find yourself in a place that you only have 20 yards to get on plane or can't go!   Think t.p is getting ready to build a new boat?
> I am ordering a new hull today.  1966  190 bottom. It will have a 200 on it.  A slight v in the rear is. Better than flat.
> I am a dealer for outboard jets if you need a pump or parts


Is your rig 2stroke or 4 stroke. When I built mine, you could not get a 150 4stroke jet so I had to get my foot from California jet, the same place that Yamaha gets theirs. Only they had not started selling it that way at the time. I guess what I am asking, can you get a bigger than 150 4stroke outboard now?


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## 1gr8bldr

TP, you getting ready to build a new rig?


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## 1gr8bldr

Fish bum is right, an underpowered jet will "barge" when loaded. My first jet did great until I filled my bait tank. My second jet, I planned to overpower. I have not had it loaded to the point that I could even tell the difference. That is what you want.


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## 1gr8bldr

Fished a tournament a couple weeks ago. The lake eventually turns back into a normal river. We call this area the "shoals". Sometimes, but not always, some good fish come from upriver above the shoals. It is a rocky area that runs all the way across the river. When the horn sounded for takeoff, I was just a we bit slower than a couple of the prop boats. I never lost sight of them. Nearing the shoals, they had to come off plane and try to pole through the 400yds of shallow water. I passed them and never let up. I anchored just the other side of the shoals. Baited 12 rods and fished for 30 minutes before they made it across. Quite comical as they got frustrated, lots of four letter words. But they made it through. That crowd crossed 4 states a few days later to pick up a jet. Moral of the story, they have advantages and disadvantages and neither of us placed in the weight in


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## 1gr8bldr

You can see my rig under "good time" in the bowfishing forumn.


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## fish bum

*Outboard jet*



1gr8bldr said:


> Is your rig 2stroke or 4 stroke. When I built mine, you could not get a 150 4stroke jet so I had to get my foot from California jet, the same place that Yamaha gets theirs. Only they had not started selling it that way at the time. I guess what I am asking, can you get a bigger than 150 4stroke outboard now?



The motor I have is 2 stroke.   I don't know if yamaha sells a bigger jet. Outboard jets makes them.   I don't like 4 strokes but have only had the smaller ones.  Mercury 
Makes a few jet ready motors. They leave off the lower unit!   I had a 115 etec on a 1760 that ran good but still wanted more hp


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## T.P.

fish bum said:


> Think t.p is getting ready to build a new boat?


T.P. finished a new hull pattern today.... Aluminum will be here next week.


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## 1gr8bldr

T.P. said:


> T.P. finished a new hull pattern today.... Aluminum will be here next week.


Are you making it or designing it?


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## 1gr8bldr

fish bum said:


> The motor I have is 2 stroke.   I don't know if yamaha sells a bigger jet. Outboard jets makes them.   I don't like 4 strokes but have only had the smaller ones.  Mercury
> Makes a few jet ready motors. They leave off the lower unit!   I had a 115 etec on a 1760 that ran good but still wanted more hp


I'm out of touch as far as 2strokes go. The fourstrokes are sooo heavy. If you could build a quieter 2stroke, that would be ideal. Are they as loud as they used to be?


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## 1gr8bldr

Some of the guys in my area run "pods" on the back. Any jets in georgia running pods?


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## 1gr8bldr

T.P. said:


> T.P. finished a new hull pattern today.... Aluminum will be here next week.


I remember building my rig. It consumed me. Every night until midnight running wires or steering, spending all my money like a drug addict. Man was it exciting


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## fish bum

*2 strokes*



1gr8bldr said:


> I'm out of touch as far as 2strokes go. The fourstrokes are sooo heavy. If you could build a quieter 2stroke, that would be ideal. Are they as loud as they used to be?


Not many left,  etec is very quite not as much with merc


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## MagSPot

i believe smaller is better and the lighter the better. i have 15 and half foot jet boat I go places most jet boats cant. uhmw is a must if you are going to be really fishing the river in shoals not just driving over 6 inches of water. but i am more of a extreme river fishing person. you dont want a big heavy boat and be alone and stuck on a shoal that you cant move boat off all alone.


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## 1gr8bldr

MagSPot said:


> i believe smaller is better and the lighter the better. i have 15 and half foot jet boat I go places most jet boats cant. uhmw is a must if you are going to be really fishing the river in shoals not just driving over 6 inches of water. but i am more of a extreme river fishing person. you dont want a big heavy boat and be alone and stuck on a shoal that you cant move boat off all alone.


I would love to have 2 boats, one being a small boat with a jet. A light boat will raise up when it hits a rock. A big heavy boat dents


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## MagSPot

exactly small light boat uhmw equals fishing where others cant.


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## Dirk

I don't have UHMW on my boat, and I assure you I go places others would not dare try. BUT I have beaten the bottom of my boat to where there is not a flat spot more than a couple inches...   I run on plane ALL the time through rapids and usually wide open (which is only about 25 mph with bait tank full, 3 batteries, etc...). On plane my boat (16' Lowe Roughneck tunnel hull, 75 hp Etec jetdrive) can run in 2-3 inches, and even over dry ground for a little way. The thickness you need on the bottom is directly affected by how many stringers you have supporting the bottom. My boat is only .100 aluminum bottom but LOTS of bottom support and I have hit literally hundreds of rocks and only punctured the hull once with a small hole (lower Etowah/Euharlee area which is treacherous when they are not generating).

Honestly gentlemen, I worry much more about getting stuck on a 1 inch deep sandbar of mud flat than I do puncturing hull and I run rivers with lots of LARGE rocks. If I am on plane and the rock is under water, my boat is light enough that it will just bounce over it, and not puncture hull unless it is really sharp, which is rare in rivers (except lower Etowah). Getting stuck/running aground is what will really ruin you day, even if you have buddies that will come help winch it off.

I ran aground on Lanier once during drought and the lake was falling 6+ inches a week, and it was just at dawn and wet mud looked like water... 







If a big rock or stump is completely out a foot or so and you hit it at high speed it can change your hull design though, much worse than if you have UHMW. I almost broke a tooth out of my poor boat once...






UHMW is great, but it is expensive, heavy, and hard to attach well to aluminum. All in all there is no right or wrong answer on what jetboat is best. It depends on what rivers you run, how you want to run boat (on plane or not) and HUNDREDS of other variables. My biggest regret was getting the 75 hp instead of atleast a 90 hp, and even better a 115. 3 good sized men and a full bait tank in my boat and it will barely get on plane. If I had a 115 I would attach UHMW to the bottom though so I wouldn't wince as bad when I hit a rock...


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## woods&water

I'm with Magspot. Light is the way to go. Fast on plane,  quick to manuever, and easy to get unstuck. Mine is only 16 feet, but when I put it together I stayed away from consoles and anything I didn't have to have. It has a lot more room in it than any 18 foot I've seen, and is way lighter meaning you don't have to have a big motor to feed(THESE THINGS ARE VERY THIRSTY COMPARED TO A PROP). I put stick steering up front to see where your going and have never regretted it. It works very well with a Jet.


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## henryc

kbad said:


> I could use some help and info on brands and styles to look at,must have items and nice to have items, bottom thickness ect.
> I am thinking in the 18 foot range with a 115 or 90 hp.
> Budget will be like 16k or under.
> The G3 1860ccj looks enticing.



The 1860 G3 is an excellent choice. If you keep your eyes open on Craigs list you will eventually find one. New they sell for slightly over $20k loaded and out the door (trolling motor, fishfinder etc...) I saw 2 and 3 yr old used ones a couple years ago for an asking price of $12.5k. I have been in a few of them and the 90/65 Yamaha Jet is an excellent engine that will push your rig 30mph. I run a 1656 G3 and as Dirk said in his post, being underpowered is a tough pill to swallow. My 1656 has a 60/40 Yamaha on it and with 2 guys it runs fine with a top spped of 25mph. Once I get 3 in the boat, she is a dog and I wished they'd put an older 75hp 2-stroke converted to a jet on it. That would really help.


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## skinny river

I don't agree with everything that has been said. I bought a brand new jet in March and it was the best money I ever spent. Jet boats are loud-wrong- I have a 115/80 Optimax the guy I fish with has a 90 Optimax and mine is not a bit louder. Jets use more gas-wrong- is only going to use as much gas as a 115 or what ever the powerhead is just keep your rpm down. My boat is a stock Triton JT-17 it is 17 ft 60in bottom, it will run low to mid 30's. With 3 guys, full tackle, and live well full it still jumps on plan 2-3 mph slower. I also have a 101 minn Kota so I have 4 batteries and 18 gals of gas. The biggest thing is weight distribution, I had to move my tm batteries under my front deck so that it float level. I average over 4 mpg with 2 guys and full equipment. I would suggest taking a ride I a jet before buying one, I did not the first time i got in a jet it was mine. It is not the same as driving a prop boat, they perform their best in straight lines.


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## T.P.

Dirk, that's a heck of a ding.


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## kbad

Thanks guys.
Ok I guess I will be looking at the 16 footer instead of the 18.

Is .100 thick enough for the bottom?


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## striper commander

Where will you be fishing. I would not want a boat unless it had atleast a .190 bottom. I have a sportjet that jumps on plane with a 40 gallon bait tank and three people. It drafts shallow also. If your wanting a outboard jet I would look into rhino jets. A sportjet boat works great in rivers and lakes and has plenty of power and will not get clogged up like a outboard jet does all the time. What kind of money are you wanting to spend on one.


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## Alan in GA

*motors...*

ETECs are QUIET! Friend has one [prop].
This jet boat topic is very interesting, and something comes to mind that I've wondered about as far as 2 stroke vs. 4 stroke, and that is, which is operating at more 'stress' when run WOT?
My 2006 Merc 40 EFI 4 stroke is my first 4 stroke outboard. It's a prop drive on my stick steer 16' Triton.
It is VERY QUIET, and uses so little fuel that I take extra trips to ethanol free fuel depots because my fuel stays so long in the tank!
The BIG difference in 4 and 2 stroke is the level power band...the 4 stroke does not 'peak out' with torque at the mid range as 2 strokes do. I've experienced this in motorcyles as well having had 2 and 4 stroke bikes.
I am not used to the idea of running a valve train [4 stroke] at wot though, with most 4 stroke motors running comfortably at 1/2 to 3/4 throttle. However I talked to one Mercury mechanic and he said to run my 4 stroke Merc at FULL THROTTLE if I wanted to because the Mercury OUTBOARDS were designed to be run WOT if desired. 
The way jet outboards work, I would guess a 4 stroke would be right at home EXCEPT for the extra weight?
I was also suprised that the recommened RPM of my 4 stroke...I figured it would be lower than 2 strokes..not so!
They wind 'em right up there with 2 strokes!
I really like my Merc 40 EFI 4 stroke...but it's a prop, not a jet.
Thanks for the pictures guys, makes this forum much more interesting!.......I like the one of the boat resting on a sand bar....funny now but probably a pain then!


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## kbad

I have a 20 foot Triton with a 250 for the lakes.
This will be used for running up Chatahooche, south.yellow, etowa ect. 

Budget is 16k or less.


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## 1gr8bldr

kbad said:


> Thanks guys.
> Ok I guess I will be looking at the 16 footer instead of the 18.
> 
> Is .100 thick enough for the bottom?


Something to consider, I know exactly what goes with me when I fish. Rods, cooler, etc. It adds up to more weight than a 16ft boat can float "high". Most small boats you see are overloaded. This causes the boat to set lower, counterproductive for a jet. So buy a big enough boat. I know of a 16ft jet that has been owned by at least 6 people. Everybody that buys it, upgrades the next spring.


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## GARoughneck

Kbad,

Here are some things to think of:

Production Jet boat or custom?

Production: G3, Lowe, SeaArk, Tracker ect.

Custom: James River, Rhino, Snyder, RockProof

Tunnel or Not?

Power: 2 stroke or 4 stroke (newer 2 strokes are not real loud or burn as much gas, I have a 115/80 Optimax and fish all day with 4-5 gallons of gas)

Length and Width: example 1656 G3 = 16 ft x 56" wide at the bottom.

Position of helm, front center, mid center, or side console.

Bottom line there are many things to factor and what you are doing by asking actual owners of jets is the best thing you can do. I have had two boats my first was a 1654 Tracker Grizzly SC with a 4 stroke 60/40 and it was a good little starter boat for me to learn the rivers with and not feel bad about beating it, but fishing 3 guys plus 30 gallon bait tank plus gear was not the best. My new boat is a Lowe 1760 CJ tunnel with an Optimax 115/80. I have no issues getting on plane quick and still big enough to fist 3 guys comfortably! The bad news is 2011 was last year Lowe built this model:-( I really like the tunnel as it allows me to go over logs and shoals that I would hit my foot without, as for draft it has a lot to do with bottom width and balance, my new boat is bigger and heavier but floats in less water.

Good luck and be safe out there regardless of what you get!

SC


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## kbad

Thanks for the input guys.

I am thinking about geting a forward console tunnel, probably production.

I really like the the look of the G3 forward console but am not sure about the bottom only being .100.

Really will only be fishing 1 or 2 people in the boat.

Am pretty much set on either a 90 or 115 outboard.
Have not put alot of thought into 2 stroke or 4 stroke.


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## GARoughneck

Kbad,

If it makes you feel better there is YouTube of a guy hitting every rock in the river with a G3 1860 and from what I can tell it did not sink. Search G3 River Run on YouTube.

SC


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## kbad

GARoughneck said:


> Kbad,
> 
> If it makes you feel better there is YouTube of a guy hitting every rock in the river with a G3 1860 and from what I can tell it did not sink. Search G3 River Run on YouTube.
> 
> SC



Ok thanks.

Will check it out.


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## kbad

Oh man watching that video made me cry.

Maybe this river boat thing aint for me


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## T.P.

GARoughneck said:


> Kbad,
> 
> If it makes you feel better there is YouTube of a guy hitting every rock in the river with a G3 1860 and from what I can tell it did not sink. Search G3 River Run on YouTube.
> 
> SC



Good Lord! That was painful to watch!


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## MagSPot

That shoal he stopped at i go over all the time he could of ran that whole river with out hitting anything. cool video though


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## GARoughneck

MagSPot,

What do you run, a RockProof Jet?

SC


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## ss go devil

A shorter boat can plane just as good as a longer one.  It's all about the rake on the front of the boat. Look at some of the boats made for surface drive mud motors. They look a lot like and airboat hull.  I think 17 foot is the magic number for weight carrying ability and getting on plane.  Might be helpful to look at the mud boats bulls for some ideas. They also have heavy gauge hulls as well with stringers running front to back which helps get over obstacles, the stringers running side to side cause the boat to stick and also hook which cause turbulence at the front of the motor effecting propulsion.


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## 1gr8bldr

G3 is a good company. All my welds on the back of my transom started breaking. We did not know why. They paid to have it rewelded, no questions asked. A few months later, they all did the same thing. They told me to bring it back and get a new boat. Thanks but what about all my custom rigging, custom camo job, etc. They said no problem. They rigged it up for me identical. When the time came for me to go switch the boats out, we were standing talking about it and looking. I saw a thin non painted area, something had shifted. Looking closer, the main brace that went from the floor to the transom had never been welded. I still took the new boat, but the owner of the boat place welded that brace and kept it for himself. I never once had to hagle over this issue. They were 2 steps in front of me the whole time.


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## fairweatherfisherman

MagSPot said:


> i believe smaller is better and the lighter the better. i have 15 and half foot jet boat I go places most jet boats cant. uhmw is a must if you are going to be really fishing the river in shoals not just driving over 6 inches of water. but i am more of a extreme river fishing person. you dont want a big heavy boat and be alone and stuck on a shoal that you cant move boat off all alone.



The point that MagSPot makes about weight is very important for anyone new to river running.  My fishing buddy and I got stuck once on a gravel bar with my big heavy 20 foot jet boat once (despite 100s of river trips between us) and we would have been stuck there until the following days power generation had a couple of guys not come along in a jon boat to help push us off.  I think a light training boat is a great idea for those new to river fishing.  Learn what you like and don't like and how to read the river.  By the time you tear that boat up, maybe you can afford a River Pro.


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## 1gr8bldr

fairweatherfisherman said:


> The point that MagSPot makes about weight is very important for anyone new to river running.  My fishing buddy and I got stuck once on a gravel bar with my big heavy 20 foot jet boat once (despite 100s of river trips between us) and we would have been stuck there until the following days power generation had a couple of guys not come along in a jon boat to help push us off.  I think a light training boat is a great idea for those new to river fishing.  Learn what you like and don't like and how to read the river.  By the time you tear that boat up, maybe you can afford a River Pro.


For sure, learn the river in a disposable boat. reading the river is an art, yet can be misread. I have passed a many of rock that were not showing the typical boil. And when the wind is blowing, reading the river is almost guess work.


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## j_seph

Could one if you guys start a thread on how to read the river?


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## 1gr8bldr

j_seph said:


> Could one if you guys start a thread on how to read the river?


It probably sounds like more than it is. "reading" the river is dodging underwater obstructions based on the boil of the water. No current, no boil. It would be an interesting thread


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## j_seph

1gr8bldr said:


> It probably sounds like more than it is. "reading" the river is dodging underwater obstructions based on the boil of the water. No current, no boil. It would be an interesting thread



Yea SOS and I jumped a tree/log with my Carolina skiff at altamaha one year. It was not visible, luckily it we hit long ways like a rail.


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## Alan in GA

*jet river boat....*

after watching the G3 Jet video I think I'd HAVE TO have a hull designed to be strong enough TO hit river rocks....plenty of the plastic material to absorb 'hits' AND a hull thick enough AND a motor with enough horsepower to sludge thru shallow mud.

Might have to just stick with what I've got and keep to the 2' depths or more....idle speed..etc.

Many years ago I watched an AIRBOAT run up and down Bull Sluice at Roswell's Azalea Drive Park....until a city worker/park ranger[?] told him he was not allowed on the water...because of 'noise pollution'. I talked to the airboat owner and checked out his rig...had a Lycoming aircraft engine but did not sound that loud to me. Probably a non geared prop that made prop tips supersonic and giving off that loud popping noise. Newer ones have more blades, increased pitch and gear boxes to keep prop tips subsonic.


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## T.P.

Fast water= easy read!

Slow water= bent boat!


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## 1gr8bldr

T.P. said:


> Fast water= easy read!
> 
> Slow water= bent boat!


choppy water from wind, russian roulet


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## T.P.

1gr8bldr said:


> choppy water from wind, russian roulet



True!


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## catfish11

Get a good boat like a  Phantom jet boat you will have no problem>>>>>


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## Mudbug 03

*you need to come back to westpoint*

Hey man I have just what your looking for! 1860cc jetdrive G3. If you and your buddy want to ride to westpoint I'll be glad to carry you guys out on a trip. I've been real happy with it so far. One thing I've noticed about it is you do more damage and hit harder if you try to be gentle and float over the top of things instead of running and gunning. Boat sits alot deeper in the water and you have little control of the stearing when your not on plain. Just my 2cents worth.


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## Millberry

I agree with the smaller the better on the jet boat. I definitely want uhmw. Can you steer me toward a dealer?


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## Alan in GA

I saw a 40 jet stick steer almost like my 16' Triton prop 40 stick steer. 
I'm a slow glide over type, preferring to keep my hull even and not like the surface of a golf ball.
With me up front [weight] and stick steer I could almost see myself in a turn...
Thought about swapping the lower unit for a jet drive....


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## Terribleted

When I lived in Alaska, we got a 22' jet stranded on a gravel bar when we camped overnight while salmon fishing.  We made camp that evening on an island in the Big Susitna river and the river dropped 6 or so feet by dawn. The transom was about 6 feet from the water. There were 3 of us. Only took us about 2.5 hours to get it back in the water.  Logjam wood for pry bars and rollers and lots of gear loading and unloading. In that spot we could have been there for a number of days before anyone might happen by, and then there was no guarantee they would see or help you.  No cell service there

  I vote for the lightest boat that will meet your needs


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## brett30030

Terribleted said:


> When I lived in Alaska, we got a 22' jet stranded on a gravel bar when we camped overnight while salmon fishing.  We made camp that evening on an island in the Big Susitna river and the river dropped 6 or so feet by dawn. The transom was about 6 feet from the water. There were 3 of us. Only took us about 2.5 hours to get it back in the water.  Logjam wood for pry bars and rollers and lots of gear loading and unloading. In that spot we could have been there for a number of days before anyone might happen by, and then there was no guarantee they would see or help you.  No cell service there
> 
> I vote for the lightest boat that will meet your needs



Did you vote on which one of the group you were going to eat first if you didn't get out? You don't have a lot of meat on your bones. Note to self: Always take a fat guy with you when fishing in Alaska


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## little rascal

*Ya'll forgot to mention*

that he will have to grease his jet foot often and sharpen his impeller and adjust and shim to keep it at optimum performance.


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## Jetjockey

There is a LOT of misinformation on this thread.  If you want a jet, get a well built jet boat made in the Northwest.  G3 boats are nothing more than tin cans with a motor. Many of the real jetboat manufactures are beginning to ship all over the US because of the demand.  We've been running heavy gauge aluminum boats in the NW for years.  This isn't a bash towards Southern jet boat manufactures.  But I wouldn't buy a bass boat made in The Northwest, and I wouldn't buy jet boat made in Missouri.  Google Alumaweld, North River, Willie Boats, and even Edge Marine, to see what a jet boat is supposed to be, and everything they are capable of doing.  A good quality welded aluminum boat will last a lifetime, and won't open like an aluminum can when you hit a rock!


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## snapdog

Here are some real jet boats for those with unlimited budgets. Outlaw boats and Firefish boats. Tanks on the water. Search this video on youtube.       No water.AVI


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## striper commander

You ever get those anchors hung on bottom.


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## LTZ25

Jet jockey if you got 45 grand to spend on an inboard jet I agree with you , also like the Riverpro .


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## Jetjockey

You don't need $45 grand to get into a well built jetboat.  Willie, Edge, Alumaweld, Wooldrige, Rogue, etc all make well built open boats with outboards for far less than $45 grand, and thats not even considering the used market.  There's a saying among jetboaters, It's not IF you hit, it's WHEN you hit.  If your running skinny water the last thing you want is a boat that will peel open like a tin can.  You could buy a used open boat, have it shipped, and be much better off than running a cheap boat that might kill you the first time you hit a submerged rock or a stump you didn't see.  G3's have a .100 hull thickness. The least you'd see on an actual jet oat made for sholliw water is .160, and many are .190.  I wouldn't run a .100 bottomed boat in any water where I might touch, scratch, rub, or heaven forbid, actually hit something.  That's not a bash against G3 boats, but I think it's dangerous for them to tout jet boat capability and shallow running ability in a boat built so thin it will open up like a can of Coke if you hit something.


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## declemen

*boats*

I think a jet boat is nice, but it can get heavy, got to have lots more motor for the same boat.This is my tunnell hull.I really like it and it runs real skinny.


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## catfish11

I have a Phantom jet boat with a 200 merc . It was built in the north west , It has UMHW on the bottom . Its like 4x4 on the water Mainly fish the rivers .


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## fishbum

*Jet INFO*

Lots of fun,  Have had a number of outboard jets and have been in several inboards, I love the power and everything about the inboards except the big back deck doesn't work well with how I use my boat.  I have a bad habit of loading my boat with everthing I might need for a 3 week trip on a afternoon run. so I keep getting bigger and bigger, The hull I have right now is 18' 66" on the bottom 27" sides
3 1/6 bottom and just added full 1/2" uhmw to that.
It is a tank but runs out good (about 40mph)  of course that is with the Merc 200 on it,  The cool thing is I run about 29-31 at 4000 rpm and that gets better gas mi. than some 115 boats I have had.  I have about $11500 in the hull and trailer.


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## LTZ25

Catfish that's the type I was talking about, how much do they sell for ?


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## Jetjockey

catfish11 said:


> I have a Phantom jet boat with a 200 merc . It was built in the north west , It has UMHW on the bottom . Its like 4x4 on the water Mainly fish the rivers .



Now that is a well built boat!  Your sides are thicker than all these others boats bottoms.  Plus your bottom is .190.  You can take a rock, and punch it right back, without your boat peeling like a coke can!   There's a lot of boat manufactures in Clarkston WA, where your boat comes from!


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## striper commander

Phantoms are made in china. They look good though. Check out this link. I wonder who thus guy is. It says he's for cumming. 
http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/phant...-fabrications-phantom-jet-boat-did-not-751917


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## Jetjockey

striper commander said:


> Phantoms are made in china. They look good though. Check out this link. I wonder who thus guy is. It says he's for cumming.
> http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/phant...-fabrications-phantom-jet-boat-did-not-751917



Um, NO they aren't!!!  My guess is that's a fake report due to the feud of the 3 guys who started Phantom boats.  In the PNW, almost all the aluminum welded boats are custom built.  The buyers typically visit the factory's several times to watch their boats get but in the various stages.  There are no boats built in China.....  And if Phantom was such a crappy company, the complaints would come from people in Alaska and the PNW, not from a random person in GA, where there is probably only 2-3 Phantom boats in existence.


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## striper commander

I just looked again. It looks like the sjx is made in china and it is a knockoff of the phantom. I remember there was one for sale on Craigslist a while back and I thought it might of been the guy from cumming that made the report.  There is still talk of the phantom being made in china but after looking it seems like its just the sjx. There are a lot of company's copying that design.


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## Jetjockey

striper commander said:


> I just looked again. It looks like the sjx is made in china and it is a knockoff of the phantom. I remember there was one for sale on Craigslist a while back and I thought it might of been the guy from cumming that made the report.  There is still talk of the phantom being made in china but after looking it seems like its just the sjx. There are a lot of company's copying that design.



As far as I m know, the SJX is made in Orofino, even the hulls. It was a rumor that they were built in China.  Jetboaters are a REAL selective bunch. Chances are the guys buying them have buddy's, or know someone, who is building them.  Like I said, 90% of the guys buying jet boats want a hand in building their boat.  And 90% of jet boats are custom order, custom built boats.  When my dad built his, everything was to his exact specs.  All the way to the custom swim step that the manufacture had never built before.  Most builders also have a 6 month to 1 year wait for a boat.  Believe me, if you want a custom built boat built specifically for fishing in GA, you can get it.  But you will pay for it.  They aren't cheap, but they hold their value incredibly well, and last a lifetime.  My dream boat is a 23ft Edge with 78 inch bottom and the super charged 6.2 pushing over 500hp. Edge will build anything I want, but they will charge me for it.  For $70-$80 grand, I should get EXACTLY what I want....  Even a friggen custom painted UT Longhorn symbol to make my wife happy.  BUT, if I get what I want the first time, I will never need another boat.  And that's priceless.


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## striper commander

There is a YouTube video talking about the sjx being made in china so who knows. Look it up it's pretty funny.


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## Jetjockey

There's also videos of them doing some insane "jumps" in Those boats.  The PNW jet boat market is a funny market.  If you don't build a boat that can handle PNW water, company's go by by.  Again, not a bash towards G3, or any of the others, but well built jetboats are a thing of beauty.


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## catfish11

Thats right Phantom jets are american made in Clarkston Wa .  the guy from Cummings is an idiot he wanted to be a dealer in the south. He got me to bring my boat to a boat show and demo it .Because his has not been finished.  So I did put it in the water first thing he wanted me to do is run over a rock bar sticking out of the water 1.5 ft with sharp rocks . My boat will go over rocks . But let's not be stupid.  I love the Phantom jet boats  I think its the best  one for the money . If you want to spend that kind of money.


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## woods&water

As someone said on this thread, there is a lot of misinformation on here. When it comes to a jetboat, lighter is better. The lighter the boat, the more it will skid over something instead of knocking a hole through the hull. I run a 0.1 hull and a 60/40 outboard that was put together by me to weigh as little as possible. There is not much that I haven't hit. Rock, gravel, stumps, sand, steel from a bridge, and a lot of unknown things. I have NEVER knocked a hole through the hull much less opened it up like a coke can. It looks like I towed it down the road without a trailer, but it has never sprung a leak (yea I know I am jinxing myself) Thick hulls and thick plastic coatings mean you need a big motor that adds even more weight, and the weight means you hit harder and will not give like a lighter combo. 
A light rig also planes at a lower speed and lets you navigate at a lower speed which gives you more reaction time to keep from hitting things. A light rig is faster to maneuver and easier to "thread the needle" than a heavier one.  When you do run up on something (like a sandbar in these muddy Georgia rivers) you can get out and push it off instead of needing a cumalong to move a heavy tank of a boat. Trust me I've done it many many many times by myself. If you need a "tank" of a boat in the PNW, that's great. Here in Georgia, I'll take my coke can boat every time. I can buy 4 or 5 of them for what the "tank" 4X4 boats cost. It just depends on whether you want to go fishing, or brag on where you can go and what you can hit.


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## Jetjockey

I think we have a much different idea of what jetboats are capable of.  IMO, most people have no idea.  I expect a jetboat to be able to hit sandbars, logs, some rocks, and beaver dams, and keep on going like it didnt happen.  Jump a .100 thickness boat once or twice and then tell me what the hull looks like.  Light is good, but not at the expense of strength.  There's plenty of light boats that are built extremely well and aren't dangerous.  When I get to a computer, ill post some YouTube videos of boats jumping logs, sandbars, and even sliding across exposed gravel bars with no water, to get to other braids in the river.  Big heavy boats, and smaller more agile boats.  They all can do it if built properly.


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## snapdog

*Jet Boat Beast*


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## striper commander

That boat was built in the same shop mine was I bet. Some or all of those boats are built in Missouri by a heck of a boat builder. He builds boats for a lot of different company's. I know he had fire fish listed as one of the company's he builds for. I need to put uhmw on mine so I wont hurt mine so bad when I run over rocks like that.


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## Dustin Pate

Jetjockey said:


> I think we have a much different idea of what jetboats are capable of.  IMO, most people have no idea.



I don't think it has anything to do with capable. It has to do with cost. Not everyone can afford a high dollar jet boat. Folks make do with what they can afford.


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## striper commander

This man builds great boats for a lot less.



Miracle Marine, Inc
10175 Black Road
Potosi, MO 63664-8336 
Phone: (573) 436-4302

In a long, rusty, metal chicken shed northeast of Potosi, a Canadian aeronautics engineer and crew build custom all-welded aluminum-hulled fire and rescue boats that save lives on the Ohio River and fishing boats that provide safe, pleasurable transportation on Ozarks lakes and rivers.

The engineer-owner is Curtis S. Dzuba, who brought his computer-assisted manufacturing skills to Missouri ten years ago as a partner in Potosi-based Scorpion Watercraft Inc. Dzuba bought the company after one of the partners died, and all the dust settled. The Scorpion brand still exists, but is represented in adjusted design by other current dealers. The CNC (computer-numerical-controlled) plasma cutter that Dzuba set up then is now cutting boat hulls from heavy aluminum in the former Silvey Egg Company facility on Route E, northeast of town. His company is Miracle Marine & Manufacturing, Inc.

Dzuba’s passion lies in larger jet-propelled commercial craft, but has designed and builds a sub-20 ft. outboard for the areas recreational boat dealers. But, fabricating fire/rescue and patrol craft pays the bills.

The fire and rescue boat business began during the Scorpion Watercraft days when a battalion chief from the Evansville (Indiana) Fire Department came to the plant with a napkin drawing of a boat he wanted built for himself. Dzuba designed and built one boat for him and had the local fire department put it through sea trials, with a excellent report. Evansville Station No. 3 also purchased one of the fireboats. Today, you can see it and many others like it, on duty at the annual “Thunder on the Ohio” racing event.
Miracle Marine has delivered many fireboats from New York to Wisconsin, and North Carolina and Texas. One model, the Water Rescue Strike Team Asset, is advertised as having the ability to maneuver 5,000 lbs. under power in 24 inches of flood water. It is ideal for doing door-to-door and structure sweeps with adequate room for crew and passengers.

The boats may be fitted with a 4,000 gallon per minute water pump for fire-fighting, a landing craft-style power front gate for equipment loading and handicapped access, and a hardened hull structure to withstand collisions and to deal with floating debris.
Miracle Marine custom produces all-welded marine hulls and subcomponents for independent original equipment manufacturers and dealers. Hull and component customers include: Gator Jet Boats of Cuba, MO., Troutt and Sons, St. James MO., Shoal Runner Boats , Doolittle MO., NoMad Houseboats, Lebanon MO., and R&L Marine of Piedmont, MO. Out of area customers include: SVI Fireboats of Colorado, Firefish, Inc. of Alberta, Canada, and Carns Alaskan Marine.

Like many Ozarks businesses, Miracle Marine is a family operation. Curtis serves as chief executive officer and marine design engineer. His wife, Syleasa, keeps the books. Sons Jesse and Mathew Caron and son-in-law Randy Sholts work in the plant.

His equipment includes Autocad/Inventor 3-D CAD-CAM software, CNC posting and nesting software, an 8 ft .x 30 ft. Sabra 3000 CNC plasma cutter and marker, a 16 ft., 150-ton custom press brake and various other bending, forming and welding devices.
“Aluminum,” says Dzuba, “has no friends. It doesn’t like to be cut, formed, welded, or especially, painted.”

Painting is done in Potosi at Bohannon’s Body Shop’s heated booth with a curing oven. Upholstery is provided by Bennie Dunn, Potosi. Trailers are built at Rivercraft in Van Buren.
In addition to the 17,500 sq. ft. fabricating plant, Dzuba has a new 5,000 sq. ft. finishing operation on the acreage where he lives.

“Miracle Marine, as far as I know today, is the only all-welded aluminum boat with a 150 horsepower outboard rating and 1,100 lb. capacity that’s been tested in Maryland by the U.S. Coast Guard and has achieved a green file,” said Dzuba. “The green file means we passed our inspection on our JTS 1860 for 150 hp rating and 1100 lb. capacity placard.”
Dzuba took a JTS 1860 to the Coast Guard’s facilities in Maryland, where it was tested and passed the USCG’s level floatation requirements for outboards under 20 feet long. JTS stands for Joe Troutt Special, Troutt being one of Miracle Marine’s dealers.
Dzuba is adamant on two points about boat-building: He wants his boats to be the strongest and the safest, period.

With huge current manufacturing capabilities, he said “we need as many sales reps as possible to maintain a full crew of 12, capable of 500 hulls per year.” Fabrication responsibilities require all of his time, leaving no time for sales. He states “we cannot sell direct to the public and maintain a loyal OEM and dealer network.”

His safety focus may come from his aviation background. As an aeronautics engineer by training, now a marine design engineer, he worked for a company building gyroplanes in his hometown of Red Deer, Alberta, Canada. This is where he began experimenting with Mercury Marine engines. They worked well in aircraft because, at the time, they provided the most horsepower with the lightest weight of any engine on the market. The relationship with Mercury led to work for Outlaw Marine, a jet boat builder in Red Deer that sold hulls to Missouri boat dealers.

“Coming from the aircraft industry, where every nut, bolt and washer can be the basis for a lawsuit, I want to protect customers and myself” he said.

More important is the safety factor. “USCG requires a sub 20-ft. outboard powered boat to remain afloat, ‘level’ after an accident or sinking, thus greatly reducing the chance of loss of life due to drowning. I want everybody to know that just to save a buck, your commercially rated john boat will sink. It’s not worth it,” he said.

Dzuba says Missouri is awash in recreational boats labeled by dealers or vendors for commercial use because they can be sold more cheaply.

That’s a violation of the law and a risk to boaters, he said. While some purchasers believe a boat built for commercial use is more rugged and thereby safer than a recreational boat, the facts are otherwise, according to Coast Guard literature, Boats rated commercial under Coast Guard regulations do not have to comply with the federal standards set for recreational boats. Such boats can be built and sold for less money, so there’s a temptation to sell them to recreational users.

Dzuba says Miracle Marine will not be a party to that, because “we do not want to risk the customer or end users’ safety, and because it is illegal.”

Dzuba said he has worked for boat manufacturers who compete with dealers by selling boats directly to the public, but he doesn’t like to do business that way.

He’s happy running a family boat building operation and leaving the sales to dealers.


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## Ben Athens

Beware of Tom Snyder and Snyder Jet Boats.... That's all I have to say.

Ben.


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## Dirk

I have taken my lightweight outboard tunnel hull jet places that no Phantom or ANY inboard jet could go. It all depends on the waters you are running, and in north GA the rivers are small with not much water and a small light-weigh boat that doesn't slide is way better than a tank. Tank boats might not get damage to the bottom when they hit rocks but if you are in a tight turn in 3" of water and if boat slides just a foot or 2 you will hit a car-sized rock and smash is the side and possibly flip the boat over, then you don't need a tank, you need a lightweight jeep... 

Even if I could afford one of the heavy inboard jets I would not want one as most the waters I run are very small rivers and creeks and I would end up either hurt, or trying to winch the boat out of the woods. Those 360's the inboards can do look really cool until you are in less than 6" of water and try it and you suck up gravel into the intake and loose complete control of the boat, which then comes off plane and then you are stuck... 

Bottom line is that different boats are good for different situations. I have a friend with a very heavy inboard jetboat that is a tank but weighs over 2000 lbs fully loaded and he gets stuck often in areas I would have went through easily without touching. On the other hand in a larger river with heavy current his 200 hp Sportjet can take him through rapids I couldn't clear and his boat would put mine to shame. 

There is no right or wrong as to what the perfect jetboat is in my opinion, as every river and creek is different and various jetboats are better at some things than others. Just like with prop boats a skiff might be perfect in some situations but a deep v is better in heavy surf and so on.....


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## Alan in GA

Very I interesting. I love to explore in my [prop] boat and my method is just enjoying my trim/tilt for SLOWLY slipping over and thru the shallows.
I've enjoyed driving a friend's 18' center console jet Jon 2 times- once below Morgan Falls Dam and also a trip up in Bull Sluice. I've never forgotten the experience and have thought a LOT about getting a jet since. I forget the manufacturer but the name starts with a 'W' and it was custom made out west. It has what I believe to be a hull thicker than the 0.100" commonly found.

However, I've also thought a lot about the same things discussed here, dented or pierced hulls, damaging a nice boat [tearing up an expensive purchase]. I decided that a G3 in the 18' version would suit me fine except for a few small concerns - no rod lockers-not related to the discussion here but I'll offer up thoughts about the boat I've had. I also don't care for the 'adapted' transom of the 16' version but I've heard so much recommendations about underpowered CCJ's that the 18' seems to be the only choice in the G3.
I've also seen a same length boat as mine [16'] with stick steering [as mine is] with a 40 hsp jet on local rivers. That boat did not seem to have any special setup at the transom or boat bottom. The center console I got to drive had a small tunnel that allowed a Yamaha 60 to not even project down below the main hull bottom, as well as a 'splash plate' that extended horizontally back from the boat's bottom. It appeared to be UHMV, about 6" wide and all across the rear of the boat.

FOR MY USE I think I could 'preserve' a jet hull boat as I like to "slow glide" over shallows. I also like to run on plane in rivers, fearing ONLY what "wasn't there last time".  I think a jet would provide an extra measure of clearance [safety] on my river runs as it would only take one hit on a large log or rock to make my prop drive outboard a bottomless motor!

I think a RIVERPRO would be a great boat. I do wonder if it would cause me to take more chances in my river runs though.
Until then I have to say I LOVE my Mercury 40 4 stroke and how it seems to run in only about 8" of water if I GO SLOW and keep an eye on the cooling water stream. I'm running a http://piranha.com/ prop and really like it so far. I'm hoping to preserve my lower unit using it, and it seems to be about 95% as efficient as my aluminum factory prop that now serves as the spare as well as replacement blades for the Piranha.
I'm enjoying this read!


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## catfish11

Dont know why everyone thinks a Phantom jet is a tank. Never been stuck ,It handles very well in turns . It only 1300lbs .It can go any where a out board jet can go and more . Dont talk  bad about it till you have been in one .


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## Dirk

I didn't talk bad about anything if you are referring to me... And no, i am very certain it will not go anywhere my 660 lb outboard jet boat will go, and I will never believe otherwise till I see one go up the Etowah to the hwy 9 bridge or up the Chestatee to the Hwy 60 bridge when they are flowing less than 200 cfps. Thats not badmouthing just my experience having been in many jeboats both inboard and outboard. 

I was not talking bad about any boat or person so I hope my post was not misconstrued. My point was just that different boats are more suitable than others in different types of waters.


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## catfish11

Its all Good ,


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## MagSPot

i am with dirk i take my small light weight boat places $50,000 boats can not go. lighter is always better.


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## Jetjockey

I have horrible cell coverage where Im fishing right now for the next few days.  However, when I get back to civilization I'll break down many of the differences in outboard jets, inboard jets, and sport jets.  And I'll also kill many of the myths being spread about outboards vs inboards, flat bottoms vs semi V's or radius hulls, and turning vs "sliding".   I'll also explain why an inboard can turn so much sharper and quicker than an outboard, and why you can jump sandbars and logs with an in lard and not worry about ripping off your out drive like you will an outboard.  I'll also explain zero thrust steer and turn radius in outboards vs inboards.   In the mean time, I'm getting ready to head back out and spend another day chasing salmon on one of those big heavy non maneuverable inboard jet boats.   ;-)


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## catfish11

That would be great if you would do that . Just to let you know , Its hard to teach people something new when they know it all.!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Dirk

catfish11 said:


> That would be great if you would do that . Just to let you know , Its hard to teach people something new when they know it all.!!!!!!!!!!!



That is very true, just some people need to look in the mirror... I am a certified teacher myself and am very willing to learn new stuff as well as share what I have been taught and learned on my own. Some people think they know everything and its there way or wrong, and those are the "know it all's" and I think most who have followed this thread know who they are...

Also if you are going to discuss  *ALL* the factors in a jetboat you forgot to mention several very important ones like the chine, bottom design, and strakes on the bottom which all can add lift and make the boat run shallower, tunnel designs, weight distribution,  speed required to run in less than 3 inches of water, distance boat can run in <3 inches without clogging intake, fuel consumption, maintenance required, initial cost, and literally HUNDREDS of other factors involved with someones decision on which jetboat to purchase.

I like to step back and take emotions or pride out of the equation and think rationally. Having said that I think I am 100% correct in saying that no one jetboat is better than all others in all situations. I think that is an UN-deniable truth and anyone who is not being defensive and really is being truthful will agree with that statement. Also the fact that the boat above was described as weighing 1300 lbs (boat and motor), and the boat I described weighs about 660 lbs (boat and motor) we should all be in agreement that 1300 lbs is much heavier than 660 lbs. Since that keeps being brought up, I think there is no further reason to keep giving our opinions on the matter, when an easy to see fact can't even be agreed upon...


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## Good Advice

I like really simple and light boats.  I live in Auburn, AL and want to fish the rivers around here for stripers.  I typically fish with light tackle and fly rods.   Anyone know of a good hull with a bit of a front deck for a Jet using a tiller?  My thoughts are to have a grab bar forward and an extension on the tiller arm.


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## T.P.

Looks like there's only one way to settle this.


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## Dirk

Quote "I like really simple and light boats. I live in Auburn, AL and want to fish the rivers around here for stripers. I typically fish with light tackle and fly rods. Anyone know of a good hull with a bit of a front deck for a Jet using a tiller? My thoughts are to have a grab bar forward and an extension on the tiller arm." 

Since you are from Auburn, you might want to consider this boat as it is simple, basic, has decent sized front deck, and is designed for a tiller steer motor. I have never ridden in a War Eagle but the specs look good and it will probably do great for you in water down to 5 or 6" deep (on plane) or 10-12" deep at low speed. If you want to go shallower than that with a tiller steer outboard jet you really need to have the jet tunnel to get your intake higher than the hull bottom. On an outboard jet a good tunnel hull will allow you to run 2-3" shallower and protect your intake from getting cracked if you go over a rock. 

Certainly not trying to direct you to any boat in particular and I am in no way affiliated with War Eagle, just might be a basic, reasonably priced boat that might meet your needs. Just be sure the transom height is right for your motor. I had to get a "transom riser" to raise my motor but that didn't cost much.

Also the War Eagles are VERY reasonably priced and you can probably get one like in the 2nd picture below with trailer for $4000 or less... The one in the 1st picture has some options so it will be a little more $.











If you want a tunnel hull you might be able to get them to make you a boat with one if you special order. If not you can go with one of the more common aluminum boat manufacturers that have tunnel models available like SeaArk, G3, Lowe, and probably some others. The brands I just listed will almost certainly be much more money though.

Marietta Marine has a nice one with floor, etc. ready to bolt on motor and go for less than $5000. Not sure what your motor size/HP is and all that but interesting to look at atleast.

http://www.mariettamarine.com/Page....ails/2013-War-Eagle-Fishing-Boat-548-LDV.aspx


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## mikeys250

Since this is the shallow water central, does anybody know the weight per unit volume of UHMW?


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## Necedah

UHMW has a density less than water and actually adds bouancy to the boat. Another value of UHMW is hull preservation. A boat with a .100 hull can run over a rock without punching a hole, but it can 't do it repeatidly without grinding through the bottom, especially at the transom. Another thing UHMW does is slide the boat over rocks. It is self lubricating. This is particularly helpful when drifting down river.
I 'm with Dirk on smaller lighter boats for our smaller, technical Southern rivers. Some of the places I go with my jet would be impossible if I couldn't get out and push.
I put my jet together myself for $6000. It 's a 16X48, 90hp, 1/2" UHMW with stick steering and pods.

Dave


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## Alan in GA

War Eagle boats....they look really nice to me. If I had not found my Triton in new condition but at half price of a new rig I would have looked at War Eagles very closely. They look like a super design and layout for stick steering fans. Wonder if they make a jet or jet/tunnel, or prop/tunnel hull?

I have been asked about 'stick steering' a few times....the questions make me aware that most have never tried one. My Triton 1653SS is my SECOND stick steer fishing boat. Had a TideCraft many years ago as well. Worst aspect is rough water. Next time you run down the lake and see your trolling motor bouncing up and down,...imagine that is YOU! 
However for SEEING what is ahead in the shallows of a back flat or in the river, an 'up front' stick steer boat is the best design I know of. There is no 'moving around' when you get to a fishing spot, you're already IN your fishing chair, and your buddy and all his tackle is in the back of the boat with no moving around necessary for him or her either.

No one has mentioned prop tunnel hulls here, but it seems that the ultimate is a jet drive....why go 'half way' with a prop tunnel when a jet seems to be the best for the shallows.


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## woods&water

Jet boats are like 4X4 vehicles, you can spend as much or as little as you want to. The harder they are to get stuck, the harder they are to get unstuck. If a boat weighs more than you can physically move then you have a problem. I have run up on many things in rivers that "wasn't there last time". All boats have there limitations and you have to be able to get your boat out of what you got it into.
Like my 4X4 truck, I use my boat as a tool to get where I NEED to go. Using your head a little bit instead of your ego can save a lot of wear and tear on your equipment. There is usually a way around most things instead of over them. Keeping the "HEY YA'LL WATCH THIS" syndrome out of it will save a lot of time and money on repairs. The harder they are to break, the more expensive they are to repair and they will all break.
I've been running jets on remote water a long time and so far I have rode back out every time instead of having to walk to get help.
To each, his own.


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## Jetjockey

Since I've got 4 hrs on this flight left, figured Id talk a little about the different designs, and dispel some myths.  Like was said above, not all jet boats are created equal.  Some are designed for huge white water and are built like tanks, some are built for shallow water, and built like tanks, and some are built without any regard to structural strength, and passed off as well built jetboats.  There are basically 3 types of power for jetboats.  Inboards, sportjets (still inboards), and outboards.  All have their strengths and weaknesses.  However, it is a myth that an outboard can automatically run shallower because its lighter.  Inboards and SJ's have their intake up under the boat and they are flush with, or actually conclaves from the bottom of the boat.  The jets themselves are mounted up on the back of the boat so nothing hangs below the hull.  That means if the hull can clear, the jet can clear.  This is very important when running really shallow water because you don't need to worry about the intake protruding below the hull and taking an impact instead of the hull.  Tunnel hulls reduce the distance the intake on outboards hangs below the hull, but it still hangs.  The two big things to think about here is that yes, a light outboard will most likely draft an inch or two less water, but they cannot be slid across sandbars, jumped over logs, or taken anywhere that the intake might grab and rip right off the boat.  That's why you dont see many videos of outboards being slid across rocky sandbars, being jumped off sandbars, and jumped over logs.  The impact takes place on the intake, rather than the hull like an inboard.  Here's a pick of what Im talking about in regards to an inboard jet.  You can see the intake and the jet drive mounted well above the bottom of the hull. That allows the boat to ride over obstacles, even if the water is too shallow to float.  






With an outboard, you lose the option of sliding over significant sandbars and logs.  The other thing people need to realize is that SJ's built properly are extremely strong, and fairly light.  Thy also maneuver much better since most are built with only 3/4 lock to lock steering.  That means a little over a quarter of a turn either way on the wheel leads to almost a full rate turn.  Since your only turning a small nozzle, and not a complete heavy motor, you can turn much quicker.  BTW.  The picture above is of a 21ft inboard with a 6.0 liter pushing 375 hp.  I can run that boat all day long in 6 inches of water, and when I need it, I can typically clear 4 inches for short distances.  When that still isn't enough, nothing says jetboat like tons of throttle, lots of speed, and sliding over sandbars (which I've done).  Btw.  The boat weighs 5500lbs on the trailer fully loaded for fishing. 

Another myth is that a flat bottom will run shallower than a semi-v.  This is true only if the semi-v or radius hull isn't built correctly.  Then it really is a tossup because they can both run incredibly skinny water.  Here's a picture of the same boat that has a radius hull.  The picture is of lifting and turning strakes.  When the boat is on plane, it displaces water to the side, the water is pushed out and hits the lifting strakes lifting the boat as the water is deflected.  Notice the strakes are vertical on the right side?  As the boat turns left the tail wants to slide right.  The turning stakes act as fins not allowing the boat to slide right.  Thus the boat corners instead of slides.  This boat has 3 strakes on each side, and corners like its on rails.  Flat bottom boats don't have lifting/turning strakes, and this will slide when turned.  There is no way around it.  Many manufactures will place ribs down the bottom, but the still don't work nearly as well since they aren't verticle like a semi-v's turning strakes.  Strands also aid in the strength of the hull.

A well built boat will also have a well built chine. The chine is where the hull and the sides of the boat meet.  Some boats dont even have a chine, and all the do is cut  a one piece sheet of aluminum large enough for the hull and the sides.  The problem is that the chime is often where hits are taken and needs to be built extremely solid and reinforced.  A good chime will build strength, aid in turning, and hold the hull and sides together if a big hit is taken.  In this picture you can see how the hull and sides are fitted into a very string chine.  The hull and sides are then welded into the chime on the inside creating a ridiculously strong joint that can take a brutal hit and not destroy the boat.  


Unfortunately I'm on a plane and Gogo inflight Internet isn't working very well, so I can't seem to upload pictures very well.  But when I get a chance, I'll show some pictures of different ways to build a hull.  The war eagle boat pictured above is probably safe for running shallow water where the worst thing you might hit is a soft sand bar, but it has absolutely no structural hull support allowing it to hit anything with any significance without peeling open.  Again, if your running rivers without any rocks, that's probably not a problem, but if you run anywhere that hitting something is a possibility, that boat is dangerous.


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## Jetjockey

Ok, it looks like it did download a few pictures.  The last picture is of the chine.  Here's a picture of the strake, notice how the bottom is actually at at angle away from the hull?  When the water slides up the hull the strakes deflects the water back down creating lift.  You can also see the outside strake in this picture.


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## Jetjockey

Here's a picture taken from the side towards the pump.  It shows pretty accurately how deep the boat runs when in plane.  There's only about 4 inches difference between the bottom of the hull, and where the hull meets the sides.  On this boat, the chime is basically at water level when on plane.  That leaves about an inch or two clearance between the hull and the river bottom when running.  You can also really see the side of the strake in this picture.  If you look at the 3 inch line on the tape measure, you can see how flat the strake is.  It might not seem like much, but when you add 3, 1 1/2 inch strakes, your essentially creating  a 4 1/2 inch fin that runs 2/3's of the way up to the front of the hull.  That's a pretty darn big fin, and doesn't include the side or bow chine that help control the boat track as well.


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## Jetjockey

The thing to remember is like guys said, all jets are built for different things.  The ultimate shallow water boat is a lightweight Sport Jet with a UHMW bottom. They will be the best combination of weight, performance, and you can jump sandbars, logs, and rocks when you run out of water.  You can't do that with an outboard.  However, SJ's are horrible at hauling any kind of load and suck in white water since they spin out and cavitate.  They also lack the slow speed control of a true inboard because they don't have zero thrust steer with "nose point steering".  In the big inboards the reverse bucket doesn't turn.  You always steer the nose where you want it to go.  Reverse is backwards steering from normal.  This can have huge performance advantages when you need to use the reverse "brakes" in "oh crap" situations.  On the other hand, if you do get stuck, a lightweight outboard is going to be much easier to get free.  They are also easier for one person to handle if you need to jump out and manhandle the boat.  Performance wise though, they will never compete with an SJ or true inboard.  When I get to a computer, I'll post some pretty ridiculous shallow water, and no water, videos.  I'll also lost some huge power V-8 inboards running water that will really open your eyes.  My iPhone wont embed YouTube videos though.


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## jaybro28

Good post, I agree with most of what you said except for a bit about outboard jets and tunnels.  If your running a properly designed tunnel, with the motor properly rigged, the foot will not be hanging below the hull.  I slide sandbars all the time in mine.  I also jump logs (I have pods to protect the foot).  Occasionally I try and slide a sandbar and misjudge the distance.  Example below =}  Also, yeah I have a jack plate but don't use it.  In fact I'd like to remove it to reduce engine set back.  As it sits my jet nozzle 'could' catch a limb when I'm jumping logs.  Removing that set back would mostly mitigate that risk.


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## Jetjockey

The problem with tunnel hulls is cavitation.  I'm not saying your does, but flat bottom boats with a tunnel can be a cavitation nightmare.  From the looks of that picture, your intake is out of the water.


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## willholl79

Great info Jetjockey.  Keep it coming.


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## jaybro28

Jetjockey said:


> The problem with tunnel hulls is cavitation.  I'm not saying your does, but flat bottom boats with a tunnel can be a cavitation nightmare.  From the looks of that picture, your intake is out of the water.


I would agree with cavitation being a problem on many jet tunnel hulls.
Yup the intake is out of the water, cuz the boat is stranded high and dry.  Was the best pic I had to demonstrate the foot being above the bottom of the boat.


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## Dirk

My lowest part of my outboard jet intake is about an inch above the bottom of the hull in the tunnel. For this reason I have jumped many sandbars and logs, some of which were several inches out of the water. Next time I see a log I will record my boat jumping it as it does so easily and on plane the intake clears the log before it has a chance to hit. Saying that an outboard jet cannot jump logs and run over dry ground is untrue as I have done it MANY times. The key is a good tunnel hull that gets your intake higher than the bottom of the boat. Not trying to argue or anything, but since we are dispelling myths then we need to be sure the things we are saying are true. My buddy Robert Smith (deputy Hall Co Sheriff's Dept) also has outboard jet (his is a RockProof)that easily jumps logs and has a pretty much indestructible bottom with .190 bottom and 3/4 inch of UHMW. A big log a FOOT out of the water is childsplay for some outboard jets...


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## striper commander

My sport jet reverse bucket does not turn just the nozzle and all sportjets are like that. What brand boat do you have jetjockey.


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## Grey Ghost

Jetjockey said:


> Here's a picture taken from the side towards the pump.  It shows pretty accurately how deep the boat runs when in plane.  There's only about 4 inches difference between the bottom of the hull, and where the hull meets the sides.  On this boat, the chime is basically at water level when on plane.  That leaves about an inch or two clearance between the hull and the river bottom when running.  You can also really see the side of the strake in this picture.  If you look at the 3 inch line on the tape measure, you can see how flat the strake is.  It might not seem like much, but when you add 3, 1 1/2 inch strakes, your essentially creating  a 4 1/2 inch fin that runs 2/3's of the way up to the front of the hull.  That's a pretty darn big fin, and doesn't include the side or bow chine that help control the boat track as well.



What you say is true, you can RUN in 3" or 4" water IF you stay on plane. But if you stop for any reason, get out the come-a-long or winch.


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## Triton Mike

I just wanted to say awesome post.  Good to hear different sides on perceived pro's and cons especially from our local guys on our local waters.  One day I would like to get a jet for myself.


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## willholl79

Does anyone here run a jet boat on the Ocmulgee River north of Macon?


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## Jetjockey

striper commander said:


> My sport jet reverse bucket does not turn just the nozzle and all sportjets are like that. What brand boat do you have jetjockey.



It's the predecessor to Edge.  It's my dads boat, not mine.  When I move home I'll be ordering a 22 or 23ft X 78 with the LSA motor.  

I'm still not at a good computer where I can link YouTube videos, but when I can, I'll show the difference between a lot of the boats mentioned.  I pulled up the demo video of Rockproof boats, and I'll use that as an example vs Edge.   I'll then post a sprint boat and you will be able to see the fat extremes of boats that don't maneuver, and those that do.  I was kind of surprised at The demo of rock proof boats.  Just from the video, I can see they don't corner at all and slide like crazy.  I used to drive a boat like that.  It was actually an 18 ft inboard made by Duckworth (one of the old ones still made by Ernie).  Nice boat but didnt corner worth beans and could get you in trouble quick if you weren't careful.  Even it didn't slide nearly as much as the boat in the rock proof video.


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## striper commander

The sprint boats have a lot of dead rise and turn great. But they will sit deep in the water. My boat has a six degree dead rise but does not draft much. Where do you plan on using the boat your talking about.


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## Jetjockey

striper commander said:


> The sprint boats have a lot of dead rise and turn great. But they will sit deep in the water. My boat has a six degree dead rise but does not draft much. Where do you plan on using the boat your talking about.



Exactly, but you can see the how hull design affects performance.

Im from Seattle, so when I move home I'll be using it out there.  However, Id still order one and have it shipped out here if I was staying.  I'd change one or two things and probably add UHMW if I was staying here, but besides that, the boat would be nearly identical wether I was run ing it out west or here in GA.  I'm fortunate enough to know a lot of people who own jetboats.  Even have a family friend who used to demo jetboats.   I've been lucky enough to drive Wooldriges (tunnel hull out boards and the Classic models), Duckworths, North Rivers (full inboards and sport jets), Alumawelds, Boice Jets, and several others.  Still haven't driven a stick steer though.  That's on my bucket list.  And Im not talking a tiller, I'm talking full on stick steer big river white water boat like an HCM or Precision Weld.


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## woods&water

Another little tidbit for those learning about jets. They will suck up everything that gets near the intake, leaves, moss, sticks, trashbags whatever. Especially if you are not on plane. An outboard is much easier to clean off. Tilt the motor up and it is usually an easy quick job but sometimes you need some tools to dig it out. I got a trashbag inside the intake one time instead of over the grate. It was a real PITA to get out and I was a good 10 miles from the truck. Not sure how you would do this if the intake was under the boat where you can't see it.


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## Jetjockey

Most inboards come standard with a grate cleanout.  It's the greatest invention since sliced bread and Kentucky Whiskey!  Different jets do a better or worse job of chewing up garbage.  Hamiltons will chew up everything, and work very well in turbid white water, but they are not a great pump for top end.  Some of the "performance" pumps are great for top end, but suffer in white water and don't chew garbage up well at all.  Out boards are the worst for chewing up garbage and getting plugged, but they can be tilted and cleaned out easier by hand if you don't have a grate cleanout.  Pump design really is a case of give and take, and unlike prop boats, you can't simply change impellers for different requirements.


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## woods&water

Grate cleanouts I've seen did no more than you can with your hand or a screwdriver and are expensive options. This is no help when the clog gets in the impellor past the grate. If it's on the grate it is easy to remove.


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## Jetjockey

I said Id post some videos when I got to a computer, so here they are.  Ill post a few videos from big water rediculous, to small water out of control..  It was said above, but Ill say it again, not all jetboats are created equal.  And these guys are crazy!  Hopefully 1200HP in a 26 ft boat is enough!  haha   Even these boats are agile as heck though.



Theres a misconception that big inboards can't run shallow.  That is not true.  Heres a cool video of guys who picked the wrong channel in their big inboard.  Gotta love the sound of a big V-8.


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## Jetjockey

Heres another video moving to smaller boats and shallower water.  This video might not seem like much, but watch the boats turn, there is very, very little sliding.  Notice some of the sandbars as well.   These boats will run all day long in 6 inches, down to 3-4 if you need, and after that, they build a rockhopper bottom that is built specifically for what the name says.  Those boats have .250 inch bottoms with UHMW.  They are still built like tanks, but they are agile as heck.  Most of these boats are running either the 375HP 6.0, or the LSA Super Charged 6.2 pushing over 500 HP.  



Heres the same basic boat "jumping".  You just can't do this in a boat thats not extremely well built.


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## Jetjockey

Not sure if this is shallow enough for you shallow water guys, but don't try this at home.  haha..  Especially with your outboards.  Notice the guard protecting the jet from impacts?  These are all inboard sport jets built to run the shallowest of shallow water, and even no water at times. 






As you can see, there's all types of boats for all types of conditions.  You won't take a Jetcraft up the Snake river with an SJ, and you won't take an HCM, Precision Weld, or other white water boats up the braided rivers of the coasts.  The medium sized inoards can do a little of both, but they tend to be better shallow water boats than white water boats.  With the Rockhopper bottom, Edge marine inboard V-8's  can jump and slide just like the lighter SJ's.  Here in GA, Id have no problem running an inboard SJ up any river you can run a small outboard. They are the ultimate shallow water jetboat.


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## Alan in GA

Couldn't help but think while watching the Murry beaver dam jump, that IF he had gotten 'caddywahmpus' on the jump and angled towards the boat with kids...... !
Cool videos otherwise.


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## Tarpfisher

Alan in GA said:


> Couldn't help but think while watching the Murry beaver dam jump, that IF he had gotten 'caddywahmpus' on the jump and angled towards the boat with kids...... !
> Cool videos otherwise.



You and me both...my thoughts as well.





Very cool videos...but none of those boats would be worth a darn to fish out of.  The original poster was looking for info about a boat for fishing our rivers.

If it were me i would be lookin for a jet that was lighter in weight and designed to fish out of.


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## Jetjockey

That's he wonderful thing about aluminum jetboats.  If you want it, you can have it.  You want a15 ft open boat with a SJ?  Done!  How about the same boat with tiller steer, and the SJ mounted halfway out on the swim platform for more room?  Done.  How about a low sided SJ with center steer, front and rear fishing platforms with casting seats, complete with auto pilot trolling motor linked to your GPS, a forward mount electric trolling motor just like a bass boat, and a removable windshield with camper top canvas for when your trolling and its cold?  Done!   How about a 13 ft center stick steer with a 650 cc Kawasaki jet ski motor that will do 35 mph, plane with 4 people, and only weighs about 700lbs?  You got it!!

http://www.motionmarine.com/lilmojet.asp


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## Alan in GA

kbad said:


> Ok for all you river guys.
> I am toying with the idea of getting me a jet boat for some river fishing, but know exactly nothing about them.
> 
> I could use some help and info on brands and styles to look at,must have items and nice to have items, bottom thickness ect.
> 
> I am thinking in the 18 foot range with a 115 or 90 hp.
> Budget will be like 16k or under.
> 
> What say you all help me out please.  thanks Kevin
> 
> The G3 1860ccj looks enticing.




I like your choice, too. [G3 1860CCJ]. I don't care for the jack plate 16' version and the 18' transom looks better to me. Light duty  yes, but I don't try to 'scram' over rocks and prefer to keep a hull in one piece.
That said, just having a 'jet boat' might bring out some Evil Kenevil in a guy and more throttle and poor river route choices than first thought wise.... : O

I think the 16' would also be underpowered.


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## Rgd

I had a g3 1860ccj and it would go a lot of place with no problem. I put more dents in the bottom of drifting back down the rivers fishing than running up them at 30mph.


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## Millberry

*Pros and Cons for Gergia jet boats*

Inboard (say 4.3L Mercruiser) with jet drive
VS
Outboard with jet prop
VS
Jet Ski inboard
VS
an outboard built inside as an inboard w/ jet drive



ALSO Tunnel Vs no tunnel

ALS Pods vs no pods

     Thanks everyone----trying to learn.


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## The Longhunter

Anyone notice that one of the crews on Swamp People (new season last night) is using an inboard jet boat.


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## Millberry

I want to know if any aluminum jet boat type manufacturer makes the bottom of their hulls with NO ridges? Or someone near Georgia that custom builds so I can get a smooth bottom? Thanx


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## Nicodemus

If I didn`t have so much hydrilla to deal with, I might think about one. From what I hear, hydrilla will shut one down.


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## LTZ25

I like all of them ,but I still like the inboard jets more. That Phamtom is sweet. I don't want to buy one myself, but there are a few guys at West Point that do very good in the tournaments with them. Of course there not actually fishing West Point lake but it doesn't matter.


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## T.P.

Millberry said:


> I want to know if any aluminum jet boat type manufacturer makes the bottom of their hulls with NO ridges? Or someone near Georgia that custom builds so I can get a smooth bottom? Thanx


I'm sure they do, but may I ask why you wouldn't want any strakes?




Nicodemus said:


> If I didn`t have so much hydrilla to deal with, I might think about one. From what I hear, hydrilla will shut one down.


I've never run in hydrilla, but no doubt it wouldn't run far in it. I've had mine stop up and clean it out to find a rock or stick the size of a quarter wedged in the grate. It doesn't take much to completely stop a jet.


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## Dustin Pate

LTZ25 said:


> I like all of them ,but I still like the inboard jets more. That Phamtom is sweet. I don't want to buy one myself, but there are a few guys at West Point that do very good in the tournaments with them. Of course there not actually fishing West Point lake but it doesn't matter.



LOL. They aren't far from fishing in Atlanta!


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## fish bum

Millberry said:


> I want to know if any aluminum jet boat type manufacturer makes the bottom of their hulls with NO ridges? Or someone near Georgia that custom builds so I can get a smooth bottom? Thanx



Already told you!   I can get you one!

I am getting ready to build a new boat again!
I am really thinking about inboard sport jet vrs outboard this time. I have had several outboard jets but never an inboard.  I happen to have a 175 sport jet motor and pump
That can go it it. Thinking of 1866. Just 5-6 deg dead rise
I guess just to say I did it.  The last boat had a 200 merc outboard jet and would run about 40. 
Got to make up my mind. Want to start next week!


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## Millberry

"I'm sure they do, but may I ask why you wouldn't want any strakes?
.....so I can add umhw


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## Millberry

If I have a 15 footer FLAT bottom and remove the strakes (to add umhw) will I kick myself when I try to turn at high speed? (900 Kawasaki )


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## Hill202

LTZ25 said:


> I like all of them ,but I still like the inboard jets more. That Phamtom is sweet. I don't want to buy one myself, but there are a few guys at West Point that do very good in the tournaments with them. Of course there not actually fishing West Point lake but it doesn't matter.



Sounds like a guy I know, they call him buckethead.


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## T.P.

Millberry said:


> If I have a 15 footer FLAT bottom and remove the strakes (to add umhw) will I kick myself when I try to turn at high speed? (900 Kawasaki )



Can you post a picture of the bottom of it?


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## roadkill82

Stumbled across this old post. Any of you fish the Hooch south of Johns Creek?  I finally bent the prop shaft on my boat and am looking into the jet powered wprld.  I would love to ride with someone if possible this weekend.  PM me if anyone will be in the area!

Thanks!


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## fishbum

*Hooch*

Might. Depending on weather and muddy water!


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## Flaustin1

Heres my homemade river boat.  Powered by a 717 (85hp) Bombardier Rotax.  Runs 42 with one man and in the mid 30s loaded.  Ive taken it through as little as 3" of water while on plane.  It don't like the grass and small gravel though.


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