# felling a leaning tree



## Ed in North Ga. (Aug 3, 2010)

Whos the resident tree cutter, need some advice-

I got a wateroak thats decided to lean over my house..and the lean is getting progressive- its not a huge wateroak, but still, its big enough to do some damage--

anywho, without the necessary funds to hire a treeguy, whats the trick to getting a tree to fall away from the direction its leaning? Ive roped it off, I guess I could top it from the roof and let the top swing from the rope-- but is there a trick to just felling away from the lean?


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## shakey gizzard (Aug 3, 2010)

Ed in North Ga. said:


> Whos the resident tree cutter, need some advice-
> 
> I got a wateroak thats decided to lean over my house..and the lean is getting progressive- its not a huge wateroak, but still, its big enough to do some damage--
> 
> anywho, without the necessary funds to hire a treeguy, whats the trick to getting a tree to fall away from the direction its leaning? Ive roped it off, I guess I could top it from the roof and let the top swing from the rope-- but is there a trick to just felling away from the lean?


Ive used a comealong or the truck on leaners. How big is it?


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## Ed in North Ga. (Aug 3, 2010)

shakey gizzard said:


> Ive used a comealong or the truck on leaners. How big is it?



decent size- just not huge- base is maybe 20in thick, little less, problem is the bottom is rotten on one side, hence the lean-
 I thought about trying a come-along, but dont want to put that much stress into the trunk -- these wateroaks tend to pop explosively for some reason when pulled and cut at the same time-an Im too far from the local sew up man to get popped.

Last one I took out in the front yard was a monster- she was at least 30 in thick at the base- I wish they still sold detcord- that`d make this job a breeze. Toothpicks in seconds.


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## JustUs4All (Aug 3, 2010)

A come along probably will not keep enough tension on the rope for a long enough time.  The pull of the come along is probably not long enough.

I would not try this if the lean over the house were too bad.  There is a danger that the base of the tree will break and there not be enough pulling force to keep the tree off the house.

If I were going to try it, I would put a tensioning rope on the tree well above the height of the roof.  
I would run the tensioning rope through a snatch block anchored in the direction I wanted the tree to fall, then on to a 4x4 truck or tractor.
I would notch the tree deeply toward the direction of fall.
Then I would coordinate two people one to keep tension on the rope and one to cut the tree just above and opposite the notch at a downward angle.  
The object would be to pull the tree down gently with the assistance of the cutting.  Using constant pressure on the tensioning rope increasing as the cut progresses.  
There will come a "point of no return".  At that point the pull should be "hammer down" and the tensioning rope must be strong enough to hold.

At least that is how I did it with a 48 inch pecan beside my house.


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## Doyle (Aug 3, 2010)

If you put a tensioning rope on it, could you climb up into the crown and limb it out?   I did that on one that was blown over in a storm.  Luckily, it hung up on another tree before it hit the house.   I limbed it out from the inside of the crown until I got it to where it was only a bare trunk.


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## wharfrat (Aug 3, 2010)

If it's a wateroak and it's over your house, I'd find a pro. Those trees are timebombs. If you or a friend are climbers, and are careful, and you have other trees to work off of, you may be able to cut from the top, in Small pieces. Just rope the piece off from a higher tree, cut, and tether them down softly.


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## GONoob (Aug 3, 2010)

I had this problem with a pecan tree and I decided to just cut it down.


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## JustUs4All (Aug 3, 2010)

Doyle said:


> If you put a tensioning rope on it, could you climb up into the crown and limb it out?   I did that on one that was blown over in a storm.  Luckily, it hung up on another tree before it hit the house.   I limbed it out from the inside of the crown until I got it to where it was only a bare trunk.



That would be wise if you could keep the limbs from falling on the house.


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## jimbo4116 (Aug 3, 2010)

JustUs4All said:


> That would be wise if you could keep the limbs from falling on the house.



See if you can't get a tree surgeon to take it down and then you handle the clean up and disposal.

You are going to need a couple of good anchor trees, block and tackle, lot of heavy rope(cable would be better) and a prayer for good luck.

You need to weigh the cost of fixing your roof and the exterior wall of you home to a few hundred to get the tree on the ground.  An insured, bonded( and check his references and insurance) is the way to get it on the ground.


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## Twenty five ought six (Aug 3, 2010)

jimbo4116 said:


> See if you can't get a tree surgeon to take it down and then you handle the clean up and disposal.
> 
> You are going to need a couple of good anchor trees, block and tackle, lot of heavy rope(cable would be better) and a prayer for good luck.
> 
> You need to weigh the cost of fixing your roof and the exterior wall of you home to a few hundred to get the tree on the ground.  An insured, bonded( and check his references and insurance) is the way to get it on the ground.




Yep.

Keep in mind if things go south, and you are the one doing the cutting -- no insurance coverage.


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## Dead Eye Eddy (Aug 3, 2010)

I would advise against doing it yourself.  Your homeowner's policy probably won't cover damage that you cause, and it can happen too quickly and easily.  I tried JU4A's method last summer, and the rope broke just as my buddy floored the truck and the tree began to fall.  Fortunately, it missed everything but the corner of the garage, and the only thing damaged was my buddy's aluminum ladder that was laying on the ground beside the garage.


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## Ed in North Ga. (Aug 3, 2010)

yeppers, the more I think about it (an read), a skylight through the kitchen, living room, and dining area probably wouldnt go over real well with Mr Insurance agent- might look good though, and let the heat out....

time to call in a pro with a little insurance policy backing and a cherrypicker!
 thanks guys-


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## JustUs4All (Aug 3, 2010)

I think you have made a good decision.


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## Nicodemus (Aug 3, 2010)

Very wise decision. That could be a dangerous undertakin`.


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## merc123 (Aug 3, 2010)

We fell a pine using rope that I used my tree stand to attach high up.  Don't use rope.  Rope stretches.  Chain or a strong cable is the only way to go.  We attached it to his truck ball and I pulled as he cut.  It almost went toward the house though with the rope stretch.


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## Todd E (Aug 3, 2010)

If you do not have any experience in tree surgery, just get a pro. If you have some exp, you can rent towable aerial lifts from a rental place. That would enable you to get up into the tree and limb it out. 

Oh, if I would have only had a cam with me to show you some of the stuff I've seen them tree svc guys do...........and some of it being done off of a set of hooks.


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## ellaville hunter (Aug 3, 2010)

I have had to finish taking down trees that the homeowner tried to do his self. Do not make a deep notch and do not make the back cut at a downward angle this will turn out bad


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## Buckbuster (Aug 4, 2010)

Have a tree service give you a price to just get it on the ground if your funds are real tight. You can save a lot that way. 70-80% of tree work is the cleanup and hauling off.


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## JustUs4All (Aug 4, 2010)

ellaville hunter said:


> I have had to finish taking down trees that the homeowner tried to do his self. Do not make a deep notch and do not make the back cut at a downward angle this will turn out bad



Although not a professional, I have been doing this for a long time.  The cuts I describe above are designed to create a hinge that allows the tree to be felled in a particular direction under control.  The paragraph below is from the OSHA site on how to safely fell trees.  The undercut referred to is the bottom cut of the notch or face cut.

An undercut must be made in each tree being felled. The undercut must be of a size so the tree will not split and will fall in the intended direction. [1910.266(h)(2)(v)]
A backcut must be made in each tree being felled. The backcut must leave sufficient hinge wood to hold the tree to the stump during most of its fall so that the hinge is able to guide the tree's fall in the intended direction. Except in Open Face felling, the backcut must be above the level of the horizontal facecut in order to provide an adequate platform to prevent kickback.  (www.osha.gov/SLTC/etools/logging/manual/felling/cuts/cuts.html)


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## NCHillbilly (Aug 4, 2010)

I've done a lot of tree work over the years, and I would still hire somebody else to take one down that was leaning over my house. (Insurance.) Especially if it was rotten at the bottom, makes it really hard to control the direction of fall if you can't get a solid hinge. We took one like that down yesterday, cut it down and lowered it in pieces from the top, then pulled the trunk with a big tractor while the felling cut was made.


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## germag (Aug 4, 2010)

I've seen this sort of thing turn out really badly. Wise decision to hire a pro.


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## JustUs4All (Aug 4, 2010)

I agree again.


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## 242outdoors (Aug 4, 2010)

JustUs4All said:


> A come along probably will not keep enough tension on the rope for a long enough time.  The pull of the come along is probably not long enough.
> 
> I would not try this if the lean over the house were too bad.  There is a danger that the base of the tree will break and there not be enough pulling force to keep the tree off the house.
> 
> ...



this is probably your best bet. good friends with a guy that does this type of work. tractor hooked to the tree will get the job done or a big enough truck. cut the tree the way justus4all said to and the tractor should pull the top on out. then go back and cut the bottom. you can rent a stump grinder or something to get rid of the stump or a tractor to get it out. good luck. if i was near ya i'd just bring the track cutter by and cut it down for ya


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## Big Texun (Aug 4, 2010)

NCHillbilly said:


> I've done a lot of tree work over the years, and I would still hire somebody else to take one down that was leaning over my house. (Insurance.) Especially if it was rotten at the bottom, makes it really hard to control the direction of fall if you can't get a solid hinge. We took one like that down yesterday, cut it down and lowered it in pieces from the top, then pulled the trunk with a big tractor while the felling cut was made.




If the tree is safe to climb, a pro will climb it and take it down from the top. If the trunk is decayed to the point that it is leaning, my guess is that they will not deem it safe to climb. In that case, they'll probably have to take it from the top using a bucket truck, etc.


Although I don't climb trees for a living, I am a certified arborist... There is absolutely no way I would attempt to take out that tree (if the conditions are as you describe) on my own. I don't have the right equipment.

Forget the insurance issues... people can and have DIED trying stuff like you are contemplating.

PS: Editing to add... I would, in no circumstance, allow anyone to walk under that tree on the "under-lean" side. If it is decayed to the point that it is leaning, it could literally go at any time.


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## ellaville hunter (Aug 4, 2010)

JustUs4All said:


> Although not a professional, I have been doing this for a long time.  The cuts I describe above are designed to create a hinge that allows the tree to be felled in a particular direction under control.  The paragraph below is from the OSHA site on how to safely fell trees.  The undercut referred to is the bottom cut of the notch or face cut.
> 
> An undercut must be made in each tree being felled. The undercut must be of a size so the tree will not split and will fall in the intended direction. [1910.266(h)(2)(v)]
> A backcut must be made in each tree being felled. The backcut must leave sufficient hinge wood to hold the tree to the stump during most of its fall so that the hinge is able to guide the tree's fall in the intended direction. Except in Open Face felling, the backcut must be above the level of the horizontal facecut in order to provide an adequate platform to prevent kickback.  (www.osha.gov/SLTC/etools/logging/manual/felling/cuts/cuts.html)


Yes you do have to leave some hinge wood but you do not make a  deep notch and you do not make the back cut at a angle this I am sure of


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## deadend (Aug 4, 2010)

ellaville hunter said:


> Yes you do have to leave some hinge wood but you do not make a  deep notch and you do not make the back cut at a angle this I am sure of



Yes, the back cut should not be at a downward angle and the notch should be no more than a third of the way into the trunk.  The hinge thickness should be about 10% of the diameter of the trunk.  Downward back cuts and deep notches work against the physics a cutter is trying to employ to get the tree to fall to its lay.

I much prefer to use rope and mechanical advantage to coax a tree to its lay.  Trucks, tractors, chains, cable, low attachment points, and heavy right feet often make for a dangerous situation and lost property and life.


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## ellaville hunter (Aug 4, 2010)

You are correct I have been doing tree work for over 20 yrs. I am a certified arborist utility specialist certified tree worker. I also instruct classes for the isa on tree climbing and tree felling and how to make proper notches and back cuts. And you are dead on


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## deadend (Aug 4, 2010)

ellaville hunter said:


> You are correct I have been doing tree work for over 20 yrs. I am a certified arborist utility specialist certified tree worker. I also instruct classes for the isa on tree climbing and tree felling and how to make proper notches and back cuts. And you are dead on



10-4! 19 yrs of treework here and teach treeclimbing and chainsaw/felling classes as well.


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## j_seph (Aug 4, 2010)

We had 5 cut and they never climbed a one, they used a scissor lift and took it down 4 ft at a time from the top


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## deadend (Aug 4, 2010)

j_seph said:


> We had 5 cut and they never climbed a one, they used a scissor lift and took it down 4 ft at a time from the top



A scissor lift?  Like one you change lightbulbs in a warehouse with?


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## Chris S. (Aug 5, 2010)

Call Sunbelt and get a big backhoe or excavator and push it away from the house..........400 bucks a day...or less..after cutting it up you have a means to its disposal...and anything else you can find to be done.


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## Brassman (Aug 5, 2010)

I like the idea of going with a properly insured professional.  The only other suggestion I have is to get several estimates.


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## j_seph (Aug 5, 2010)

deadend said:


> A scissor lift?  Like one you change lightbulbs in a warehouse with?



Not really like that, it was 4 wheel drive with offroad tires and had a boom that the bucket was on. It would reach up and out.


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## 7Mag Hunter (Aug 5, 2010)

Your Home Owners ins company will pay $500.00 toward having
dangerous tree removed...


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## Buckbuster (Aug 5, 2010)

7Mag Hunter said:


> Your Home Owners ins company will pay $500.00 toward having
> dangerous tree removed...



That is correct, I forgot about that. Call a tree service and have them put it on the ground and you do the rest. You may have money left over depending on how big and difficult it is.


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## tree cutter 08 (Aug 5, 2010)

im just over the mountain from ya in habersham. if you havent got it cut yet i will be glad to look at it for ya. got all the equipment plus insurance. shoot me a pm if your interested


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## rip2k3 (Aug 5, 2010)

If you were closer to Blairsville, I would say to call Dell Jackson. He just removed one leaner and five pines from my cabin and hauled for $125. I think that Wesley wrestled the leaner to the ground single handedly.


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## 7Mag Hunter (Aug 6, 2010)

tree cutter 08 said:


> im just over the mountain from ya in habersham. if you havent got it cut yet i will be glad to look at it for ya. got all the equipment plus insurance. shoot me a pm if your interested




Best solution !!!!!


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## FishingAddict (Aug 6, 2010)

Ed in North Ga. said:


> yeppers, the more I think about it (an read), a skylight through the kitchen, living room, and dining area probably wouldnt go over real well with Mr Insurance agent- might look good though, and let the heat out....
> 
> time to call in a pro with a little insurance policy backing and a cherrypicker!
> thanks guys-



Good idea.

If you change your mind for some reason, make sure you video tape it, for a chance to win some of the money back from the damage it causes.

Just kidding. AFV NEVER, ever chooses videos to nominate to win that have situations involved that someone might have been hurt.

Again...just make sure the person you hire is bonded, and as someone else said- after they give you a quote, see how much less it will be for you to handle the remains.


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## FishingAddict (Aug 6, 2010)

rip2k3 said:


> If you were closer to Blairsville, I would say to call Dell Jackson. He just removed one leaner and five pines from my cabin and hauled for $125. I think that Wesley wrestled the leaner to the ground single handedly.


 

How big were the trees?  That's unbelievably cheap!  I have 5 BIG pines that I need to take eventually, however, it will be tricky since they can't just let them fall.


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