# Why Do You Never Take Just One Baptist Fishing?



## Big Texun (Apr 16, 2008)

He'll drink all your beer. Take two and they won't touch a drop.

Note: I did NOT intend to offend anyone with this joke. If I did, I apologize up front. 

Seriously, from a scriptural basis, is it sinful to have a beer or two every now and then? I am very curious to your interpretations on this issue.

Let the games begin,
Big Tex


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## PWalls (Apr 16, 2008)

Big Texun said:


> Seriously, from a scriptural basis, is it sinful to have a beer or two every now and then? I am very curious to your interpretations on this issue.



No, it is not sinful to have one or two every now and then. What is sinful is to be drunk. What is sinful is to get in your vehicle after having a few and driving somewhere (drunk or not - based on blood alcohol level).


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## KDarsey (Apr 16, 2008)

I want even go into the offending part.... 

  But my belief is the key word is 'abuse'.
That said anything would be sinful if you abused it, even 'tater salad!
 If you want to have an occaisonal drink I see no problem, and I am a Baptist and a lot of people won't agree with me and I can't go fishing with you this weekend, I have already made plans and I don't really care what 'they' think.......


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## crackerdave (Apr 16, 2008)

Same here - Jesus never said I couldn't enjoy a beer or two.He DID say not to be a drunk and not to cause others to stumble with my actions.

 Funny joke,BigTexun - I'm not offended at all.Sounds like one my preacher might even laugh at!


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## Twenty five ought six (Apr 16, 2008)

My father was about as good a Baptist as there ever was.  Every year his men's Sunday School class would take a golfing weekend to Ocmulgee State Park in McRae.

One year, the church got a new preacher, and he wanted to be one of the "boys", so he went along on the golfing trip.

Because Dad had been the class teacher, for 20 years, the preacher thought it right and fit that he "honor" Dad by playing golf with his group.  My father (and his golfing buddies) were ever so sad because they had to leave all the beer in the cooler.

The second day, they pointed out to the preacher that it would be "prideful" of them not to share his company with some of the other golfers.


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## Branchminnow (Apr 16, 2008)

Twenty five ought six said:


> My father was about as good a Baptist as there ever was.  Every year his men's Sunday School class would take a golfing weekend to Ocmulgee State Park in McRae.
> 
> One year, the church got a new preacher, and he wanted to be one of the "boys", so he went along on the golfing trip.
> 
> ...


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## THREEJAYS (Apr 16, 2008)

be careful , you might cause me to stumble


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

I like beer.  Nothing wrong with it....but drinking until you puke or passs out would be excessive...


Everything in Moderation.


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## Hooked On Quack (Apr 17, 2008)

I like to drink beer and listen to Neil Diamond.


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## Big Texun (Apr 17, 2008)

THREEJAYS said:


> be careful , you might cause me to stumble



Causing a brother to stumble seems to be the prevailing reason that church leaders hold fast to this doctrine.

IF we didn't proclaim it sinful from the pulpit, which I believe to be scripturally inaccurate (and most of you seem to agree), how would we be causing a brother to stumble?

The joke I told at the beginning is, in my view, pretty funny. It is also pretty accurate. It is also pretty sad when you stop and think about it.... and leads me to this question.

Why do sincere, well meaning, men of God, who KNOW the bible inside and out, insist on continuing to hold fast to this "man-made" law / tradition? In my view, it sets the Baptist church up to look extremely hypocritical... and certainly detracts from OUR ability to reach the lost.

Big Tex


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## Twenty five ought six (Apr 17, 2008)

> The joke I told at the beginning is, in my view, pretty funny.



Yeah, the Baptists are getting so liberal, they nod to each other in the liquor store.


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## GonePhishn (Apr 17, 2008)

thats a good one !!!


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## JohnK3 (Apr 17, 2008)

You know why Baptists won't have sex standing up?

They're afraid people might think they were dancing.

(I'm Baptist and was married in a Baptist church by a Baptist minister.  My parents paid for the church rental and the fellowship hall for the reception.  My mother was deathly afraid I might dance with my new bride in the fellowship hall.  Not in the sancturary, but in the fellowship hall.  This joke was meant in good fun, not to denigrate any Baptists out there.)


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## Vernon Holt (Apr 17, 2008)

*Drinking Alcohol*



KDarsey said:


> "*But my belief is the key word is 'abuse'.*
> *That said anything would be sinful if you abused it, even 'tater salad!" *


 

How many on here have heard of someone who had partaken too heavily of potato salad and then as a result had to be extracted from a mangled auto that smeared blood and glass all over the highway??


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## Wild Turkey (Apr 17, 2008)

Eat some of my motherinlaws potatoe salad and youll crap your intestines out in the car. That would most certainly cause a wreck.
We call it a good colon cleansing. The surgean general says dont eat and drive within 3 hours.


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## crackerdave (Apr 17, 2008)

Big Texun said:


> Causing a brother to stumble seems to be the prevailing reason that church leaders hold fast to this doctrine.
> 
> IF we didn't proclaim it sinful from the pulpit, which I believe to be scripturally inaccurate (and most of you seem to agree), how would we be causing a brother to stumble?
> 
> ...



I think [warning - opinion ahead!] that Paul was inspired by God to write what he did about causing someone to stumble because of the fact that if a new believer in my church that was acquainted with me well enough to know that I am a somewhat "mature" believer SAW me coming out of a store with a six-pack,he or she could be someone who is trying desperately to overcome the bondage that is alcoholism and they might think "Well,I guess it's OK for HIM to drink,then it must be OK for ME to drink." I have thereby committed the sin Paul wrote about.There also are those who would rush to proclaim me a "hypocrite."


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

Vernon Holt said:


> How many on here have heard of someone who had partaken too heavily of potato salad and then as a result had to be extracted from a mangled auto that smeared blood and glass all over the highway??



People can do that huffing paint or nail polish too.


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## crackerdave (Apr 17, 2008)

dawg2 said:


> People can do that huffing paint or nail polish too.



Or talking on cell phones.


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## funandgun (Apr 17, 2008)

I feel you can ruin your witness by being seen by a nonbeliever drinking or even buying the product.  This can be considered "causing one to stumble" in my opinion.


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

funandgun said:


> I feel you can ruin your witness by being seen by a nonbeliever drinking or even buying the product.  This can be considered "causing one to stumble" in my opinion.



What about a divorcee?


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## funandgun (Apr 17, 2008)

in what context?


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## FX Jenkins (Apr 17, 2008)

funandgun said:


> I feel you can ruin your witness by being seen by a nonbeliever drinking or even buying the product.  This can be considered "causing one to stumble" in my opinion.



I'm going to take it a step further and suggest that this is true mainly because the scriptures were over extended to begin with, that is, we have given the churched and un-churched community an opportunity to judge us by what we've corporately condemned.... in some parts of this great nation, alcohol is not nearly as big an issue in the Christian community as it is in the bible belt.   And I'd venture to say gossip does more damage to ones testimony and the church at large than a hard working man enjoying a few beers on a fishing trip...

The best personal reason for temperance I ever heard was simply " I've never seen anything good come out of it" but then the same could be said of watching TV.....

No offense taken Big Tex...If you want to have a beer, I'll have one with you, if you ain't comfortable with it, I ain't either...now lets catch some fish

tight lines boys...


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

dawg2 said:


> What about a divorcee?





funandgun said:


> in what context?



This context:

What about a DIVORCEE?

I know some Protestants quote an "out" for that according to the bible....BUT it would be VERY hypocritical to go that route in the context of THIS debate, as the Bible allows one to drink in moderation.


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## funandgun (Apr 17, 2008)

You have to remember that in biblical days there was no such thing as sweet tea or clean drinking water.


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

funandgun said:


> You have to remember that in biblical days there was no such thing as sweet tea or clean drinking water.



I am aware of that.  SO did it damage their witness back then, all those people "drinking?"


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## widowmaker1 (Apr 17, 2008)

i've had a beer with my preacher, and i did call him on it. he quickly pointed out to me that noah passed out drunk in his tent ,and one of his sons laughed at him while the other covered him up. the blessing was given to the son who covered him up,nothing mentioned of noah being drunk.i peresonally don't drink but maybe 10 beers a year ,but got nothing against alchohol. alcohol is just like guns ,its the person handling it that is reponsible for its results.


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## funandgun (Apr 17, 2008)

Did they particularly have a choice "back then"?  Bringing it back home though.......like the commercial I heard the other day said, "it's easy to know when you have had a few to many, but not so easy to know when you have had just one to many"......think about it.


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## Branchminnow (Apr 17, 2008)

dawg2 said:


> I like beer.  Nothing wrong with it....but drinking until you puke or passs out would be excessive...
> 
> 
> Everything in Moderation.



i dont like beer.


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

funandgun said:


> Did they particularly have a choice "back then"?  ...



SO at what point in history did alcohol become a stumbling block?


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## funandgun (Apr 17, 2008)

"Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise." Proverbs 20:1


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

funandgun said:


> "Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise." Proverbs 20:1



Believe it or not, I am familiar with the Bible, but at what point did consumption of alcohol (not getting "fallen down drunk") become a stumbling block.  I would say a divorcee would be just as bad.


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## widowmaker1 (Apr 17, 2008)

funandgun said:


> Did they particularly have a choice "back then"?  Bringing it back home though.......like the commercial I heard the other day said, "it's easy to know when you have had a few to many, but not so easy to know when you have had just one to many"......think about it.



very true= thats why i wouldnt drive even if i had drank one.


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## funandgun (Apr 17, 2008)

When ice cold sweet tea was invited!!


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## crackerdave (Apr 17, 2008)

Yeah,let's let this one die - we all know it's going nowhere.


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## funandgun (Apr 17, 2008)

yep, that was my point.  Thanks.


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

rangerdave said:


> Yeah,let's let this one die - we all know it's going nowhere.



Thread killer


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## Lowjack (Apr 17, 2008)

Big Texun said:


> He'll drink all your beer. Take two and they won't touch a drop.
> 
> Note: I did NOT intend to offend anyone with this joke. If I did, I apologize up front.
> 
> ...




Yep Commandment 101 thou shalt not drink beer, LOL


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## PJason (Apr 17, 2008)

Sounds like some folks have been reading Carrie Nation's Bible.


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## PJason (Apr 17, 2008)

Vernon Holt said:


> How many on here have heard of someone who had partaken too heavily of potato salad and then as a result had to be extracted from a mangled auto that smeared blood and glass all over the highway??



Just like a liberal to overlook personal responsibility


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

Branchminnow said:


> i dont like beer.



I bet you're a closet whiskey man


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## jason4445 (Apr 17, 2008)

You're killing me with these Baptist jokes, that one about standing up was the first time in a month I laughed out loud.  

My favorite drinking Baptist story is about a couple who were friends of my parents.  He was a big church goer to the First Baptist, and she went occasionally.  They were well off and every year wrote a fairly hefty check to the church.  He was the nicest guy - friend to all, but he definitely really enjoyed his alcoholic beverages, and was, by rumor, known to participate in a couple of other sins as well.

Then about 20 years came and went and he was never made a Deacon at the First Baptist because of the above, and she finally got tired of it.  He was up for Deacon again, so the afternoon before the big appoint new Deacons meeting she had a conference with the Minister informing him that while her husband was the big church goer, she was the one who wrote the checks, and if he did not make Deacon this time, she might forget to put a couple of zeros at the end on the amount of the next years check.

Two days later they got the good news he had been appointed a Deacon of the Church, and he never knew what she had done.


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## dawg2 (Apr 17, 2008)

jason4445 said:


> You're killing me with these Baptist jokes, that one about standing up was the first time in a month I laughed out loud.
> 
> My favorite drinking Baptist story is about a couple who were friends of my parents.  He was a big church goer to the First Baptist, and she went occasionally.  They were well off and every year wrote a fairly hefty check to the church.  He was the nicest guy - friend to all, but he definitely really enjoyed his alcoholic beverages, and was, by rumor, known to participate in a couple of other sins as well.
> 
> ...



That happens in every church


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## jason4445 (Apr 18, 2008)

Oh, I know, not the reason, but one of the reasons I quit going to church years ago.  In any church the big money people run things.  And in these times of diminishing church attendance and withering funds they are gaining more and more power.

A good example is the First Methodist I use to attend.  One of the biggest money people died, and in his will he left a great amount of money for stained glass windows to be installed in the very large Sanctuary.  Ten two story arched windows 12 feet wide.

Historically you never saw a Methodist Church with stained glass because it was the opinion of Methodist to keep their churches humble, and any extra money available to "garnish" the church be given to those in need.  Of course, this has been put aside in recent times.

So it was the voice of the Minister and many church members to ask the family if they would just give the money to the church to be used for more pressing projects and gifts to those in need.  And also once the windows were installed their future upkeep would add a financial burden to the Church.

The family said no, it was stained glass windows, of course with with big plaque stating who gave the windows to the Church, or nothing.

Committees were formed and meetings held, and the family of the big money man contacted other big money members. So against the Minister and others, they gift was accepted and the windows installed.

They are beautiful things, but as the Minister said in a sermon afterwards, he wondered how many poor those windows could have fed.


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## Branchminnow (Apr 18, 2008)

dawg2 said:


> I bet you're a closet whiskey man



My folks made whiskey in the woods not the closet.


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## PJason (Apr 18, 2008)

Branchminnow said:


> My folks made whiskey in the woods not the closet.



I've had that kind of whiskey before.  It made me blind for two weeks and I thought it tasted more like varnish then whiskey. Your mamma makes some strong lightening.


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## Branchminnow (Apr 18, 2008)

PJason said:


> I've had that kind of whiskey before.  It made me blind for two weeks and I thought it tasted more like varnish then whiskey. Your mamma makes some strong lightening.



You musta notta had the good stuff, we keep that in the well house.


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## Twenty five ought six (Apr 18, 2008)

> They are beautiful things, but as the Minister said in a sermon afterwards, he wondered how many poor those windows could have fed.



Probably not as many as his salary would have.


Three ministers and their wives have been to an ecumenical conference, and on the way home, they are in a terrific, tragic wreck, and everyone is killed.

So they all show up at the Pearly Gates, looking to get admitted by St. Peter.

First up is the Episcopalian, and St. Peter looks in the Book of Life, then says, " I can't let you in, you  have coveted money all your life.  You cherish money so much, you married a woman named "Penny" ".

Next up was the Methodist.  St. Peter looked in The Book of Life, and says, "I can't let you into heaven.  All your life you've craved alcohol and been a secret drinker.  In fact you lust after alcohol so much, that you married a woman named"Sherry".

About that time, the Baptist turns to his wife and says "Come on, Fanny, we may as well leave".


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## dawg2 (Apr 18, 2008)

25.06  That reminds of the three religious truths:

1) The Jewish Faith does not recognize Jesus Christ as their "Lord and Savior"

2) The Catholics Recognize the Pope as the leaderof the Christian Church.

3) Baptists don't recognize each other in a liquor store.


But seriously, why is it the Baptists have the biggest problem with alcohol?


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## gnarlyone (Apr 19, 2008)

*scripture says...*

It is not what goes into a man that defiles him...but that which cometh out.
That would bout say it all for me....


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## crackerdave (Apr 19, 2008)

You're right,gnarlyone.Drinking too much will make lots of bad stuff come out,spoken AND hurled!


Baptists have the biggest problem with alcohol - as in drinking it or objecting to drinking it?


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## dawg2 (Apr 19, 2008)

rangerdave said:


> Baptists have the biggest problem with alcohol - as in drinking it or objecting to drinking it?



But why is that?


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## Israel (Apr 20, 2008)

Vernon Holt said:


> How many on here have heard of someone who had partaken too heavily of potato salad and then as a result had to be extracted from a mangled auto that smeared blood and glass all over the highway??




I'm pretty sure the cardiac cath lab is full of folks that have had a love affair with certain foods (or just foods in general). Not to say there aren't many that have fallen victim to genetics. And I don't think that the intent was to equate physical danger to others with tater salad. 
The intention, as I see it, was to call attention to gluttony as being just as much a stumbling block, and just as much a bondage, as excessive affection for anything of this world.
A man should have all his appetites under control and not be ruled by any of them.
But my apologies to the original poster if I have misunderstood his meaning.


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## Big Texun (Apr 20, 2008)

funandgun said:


> I feel you can ruin your witness by being seen by a nonbeliever drinking or even buying the product.  This can be considered "causing one to stumble" in my opinion.



There is no doubt that you can! Therein lies the entire point of this thread. WHY do we (Baptists) corporately condemn it? THAT's why it causes people to stumble or label us hyprocritical.

In my view, the stumbling one potentially causes by purchasing alcohol is the chicken. The non-scriptural condemantion of alcohol in moderation, is the egg.  In this case, the egg came before the chicken.

IF, on the other hand, Baptists did not condemn alcohol, you could take a non-believer fishin' with ya... and say, let's have a few beers and talk about the Lord! If he or she said, "You are being kinda hypocritical there ain't ya buddy?"... you could say, "Nope. There is NOTHING in the bible that prohibits you from having a beer or two; God just expects us not to abuse it.  Most people think that being a Christian means that you must never have fun again. Let me tell you what: those people are WRONG."


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## crackerdave (Apr 20, 2008)

dawg2 said:


> But why is that?



I was trying to understand what you meant when you said Baptists have the biggest problem with alcohol.


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## crackerdave (Apr 20, 2008)

Big Texun said:


> There is no doubt that you can! Therein lies the entire point of this thread. WHY do we (Baptists) corporately condemn it? THAT's why it causes people to stumble or label us hyprocritical.
> 
> In my view, the stumbling one potentially causes by purchasing alcohol is the chicken. The non-scriptural condemantion of alcohol in moderation, is the egg.  In this case, the egg came before the chicken.
> 
> IF, on the other hand, Baptists did not condemn alcohol, you could take a non-believer fishin' with ya... and say, let's have a few beers and talk about the Lord! If he or she said, "You are being kinda hypocritical there ain't ya buddy?"... you could say, "Nope. There is NOTHING in the bible that prohibits you from having a beer or two; God just expects us not to abuse it.  Most people think that being a Christian means that you must never have fun again. Let me tell you what: those people are WRONG."



I agree 100%!


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## kw5891 (Apr 20, 2008)

*open the door*



Big Texun said:


> He'll drink all your beer. Take two and they won't touch a drop.
> 
> Note: I did NOT intend to offend anyone with this joke. If I did, I apologize up front.
> 
> ...


why open the door to alcohol either you will control it or it will control you my father started  with one beer when he die he was drinking rubbing alcohol i do know this one day when the devil come in like a flood what will you pick up ? the bible tell us to speak to that mountian but what happen we pick up alcohol to help us deal with storms and then the alcohol becomes a moutian


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## Big Texun (Apr 21, 2008)

kw5891 said:


> why open the door to alcohol either you will control it or it will control you my father started  with one beer when he die he was drinking rubbing alcohol i do know this one day when the devil come in like a flood what will you pick up ?



KW, I am very sorry to hear about your dad. Situations like that are indeed, often pointed to as the "reason" for holding fast to this non-scriptural view by Baptist pastors and leaders. 

As a matter of fact, I know a pastor here in Georgia whose father also had a major problem with alcohol. Because of this, he goes "above and beyond" to openly preach the sinfulness of alcohol. He beats the "don't cause a brother to stumble" drum with a sledge hammer.

Meanwhile, he lives in a 3/4 million dollar home and drives a  garage full of very expensive cars. I don't judge (or begrudge) him for the home he lives in, or the cars he drives, or the very expensive clothes that he and his wife adorn themselves with... quite frankly, he is a TERRIFIC pastor and I think he earns every penny. I also know that he does a lot of good with his income through tithing, charitable donations, etc...  Nonetheless, I also know that his high end lifestyle causes a lot of stumbling from people that conclude that "He just wants my money." 

I love the Baptist church. As is the case with any church, there seems to always be "something" that doesn't line up. In my case, this is it for me. I just don't like being made to feel as though I'm a hypocrite for doing something that is not wrong.


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## kw5891 (Apr 22, 2008)

*your right*



Big Texun said:


> KW, I am very sorry to hear about your dad. Situations like that are indeed, often pointed to as the "reason" for holding fast to this non-scriptural view by Baptist pastors and leaders.
> 
> As a matter of fact, I know a pastor here in Georgia whose father also had a major problem with alcohol. Because of this, he goes "above and beyond" to openly preach the sinfulness of alcohol. He beats the "don't cause a brother to stumble" drum with a sledge hammer.
> 
> ...


we christian beat each other over the head with what we think is wrong while the devil laught  i stop drinking 15 years ago why because i could not control the drinking i did not want to be any thing like my dad   ps it never enought  people tell me i am going to Edited to Remove Profanity ----Edited to Remove Profanity ----Edited to Remove Profanity ----Edited to Remove Profanity ---- because my wife left me you cant even join some churches if you had a divorce  . the way we treat people cause alot of people to sin there shaking there finger and they were the cause of the falling of a brother or sister into sin  even on this form there alot of people who cause people to stumbe  . last night and and today i had to repent because of member be littleing me.  get this the sin of the anger i had  was because of member on this site  God bless


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## crackerdave (Apr 23, 2008)

kw5891: Don't let anybody make you feel "belittled." If,as you said,you are handicapped and someone looks down on you for the way you communicate,they are setting themselves up for some serious chastising from God.He just might give 'em a little demonstration of what it's like to walk in your shoes.
To be honest,when I first read your posts I wasn't sure you were for real,and this being the internet,you can't EVER be sure somebody is who or what they say they are.  GOD knows!


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## kurt aquino (Apr 23, 2008)

*looky what i found*



Big Texun said:


> He'll drink all your beer. Take two and they won't touch a drop.
> 
> Note: I did NOT intend to offend anyone with this joke. If I did, I apologize up front.
> 
> ...



Proverbs 31:6-9 
Give strong drink unto him that is ready to perish, and wine unto those that be of heavy hearts. Let him drink, and forget his poverty, and remember his misery no more.


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