# Tell me something good



## turtlebug (Jun 23, 2008)

Please!?!? 

My new High Speed came in, of course I tore the box to pieces getting it out. 

First thing I checked, limbs.  PERFECT! 

Could not believe how beautiful this bow still is after these years.  She's gorgeous! 

Then, upon further inspection, I see this "scratch".   Then I notice that's it right on the line between two pieces of wood on the riser.  The "scratch" stops near the top of the riser.  Flip her over and down a little ways said "scratch" starts again between the same two layers.   It's not deep and when I flex the limbs, it doesn't get worse.  It almost looks like where someone found a slight groove and started picking at it or something. 

Anyway, here's some pics.  The string won't be here til probably Wednesday.  Just tell me that she's safe to shoot and that she's not gonna blow up in my face.  I know it's hard to tell from the pics and like I said, when I put pressure on either side, the "scratch" doesn't get worse.  

You ever just opened that package and knew there was magic in there?  Just had that feeling that everything was gonna be right with the world when you finally got the contents in your hand?  That's the way I feel about this bow, more so than my Widow.  She's the one I've been searching for and if I have to pay someone to make her better, I will, no questions asked. She's worth it to me.   

BUT, if she turns out to be nothing more than a wall-hanger, then I'm done for good with ebay and I'll send Brandon Stahl a deposit and let him start on my Roseoak Dream. 

Even if she can't be shot, I'm hoping Bam-Bam can at least take a closer look for me on Saturday. 

Pics......





















How often do problems with risers separating occur?  Or am I just freaking out over a slight "flaw" in the riser? I've just had Doublestuf Oreos and milk, I can take anything now.


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## Redbow (Jun 23, 2008)

I bought a Ben Pearson and it came to me the same way, same problem you have! The guy I took it to at the local archery shop told me to super glue it and forget it! I did, it still shoots nice !

I have no idea if this will work for you or not! Darn shame to buy something that is or might be defective! I am sure someone will chime in who can give you much better advice than I can!

Good luck...


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## Apex Predator (Jun 23, 2008)

At that draw weight, you probably have nothing to worry about.


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## Al33 (Jun 23, 2008)

I am going to have to defer to the bowyers on this one for expert advice. Certainly, it appears to be a stress fracture where a lamination of the riser wood was glued up. Absolutely no way of telling for sure if it will hold up and for how long. 

However, if it were mine I would take the finish off, saturate the fracture with super glue and let it cure overnight, buff the seam down real good with steel wool then refinish it. If the fracture goes completely through the riser from side to side I might even put some insurance in it by tapping holes from the rear and securing it with counter sunk wood screws. I would then plug the holes with a similarly colored hardwood. Again, wait for the pro's to weigh in on this one and good luck.

I would certainly let the seller know of your discovery and might even give him a little bad feedback if he didn't mention the fracture.


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## turtlebug (Jun 23, 2008)

Well, Mr. T-Bug just took a good long look at her and yep, it's stress in the riser. 

I've cried (yes, I'm a girl, I'm allowed to cry over something like this cause this bow meant a lot to me, I'm a die-hard Damon Howatt fan ) and pitched my fit.

First order of business is to give the seller "what-for" cause the ad absolutely says "NO STRESS LINES OR CRACKS". 

Second order of business is to send the pics to Bow-Doc and get him to lemme know what he might can do.  I'm not even gonna attempt to do this myself, would rather pay him the vault and get her good as new. 

I just can't explain it, this bow means a lot to me and I want her fixed.   So, I'll do what I can for her.

Third is to email Brandon and get prices and deposits set cause even Mr. T-Bug said "No more, go ahead and pay the man and get yourself a brand new one". 

One thing Mr. T-Bug pointed out to me (and this is why Jack needs to stop RV'ing and get back on here ) is that this is a "Howatt" and not a "Damon Howatt".  Obviously the quality isn't that of the earlier models? 

Either way, no more used bows unless I can hold them in my hand and inspect them for myself. 

Thanks guys, I guess it'll be me and Esmerelda this weekend, which is fine, she'll always be my first love.


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## dutchman (Jun 23, 2008)

Al33 said:


> I would certainly let the seller know of your discovery and might even give him a little bad feedback if he didn't mention the fracture.



That's the thing, right there. I'd lay the wood to the seller AFTER I gave them the chance to make it right. If they chose not to do so, it'd be "Katie, bar the door."


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## turtlebug (Jun 23, 2008)

Okay, well I might have been off on the price, I really don't know yet, but this is what I sent to the seller.

_I received the bow today.  I'm going to quote your information from the ad,* "up for auction is this nice recurve bow made by damon howatt.its a 35# rh damon howatt marked hi-speed in nice condition with your every day minor wear from use.no stress lines, limbs are good and tips are good  buying what u see in the pics ask? before u bid"*.  This bow is not in "NICE" condition and this is not "everyday minor wear".  This bow doesn't have "stress lines" but a major stress LINE right through the center of the riser.  This bow is absolutely dangerous to even attempt to shoot at this point.  Bow is NOT without stress lines.  the riser is completely separating.  Due to the fact that I am a HUGE Damon Howatt fan and the affection that I have for this bow, I am going to spend the $300+ to have the separation fixed and have the bow refinished so that it will be restored to it's original glory and beauty, but I thought you needed to know that you did sell a bow with a major stress fracture.

Lea_

We'll see what he says.


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## dutchman (Jun 23, 2008)

Girl, you're letting him off way too easy. You need a full refund, shipping included.


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## Darcy (Jun 23, 2008)

dutchman said:


> Girl, you're letting him off way too easy. You need a full refund, shipping included.



seriously, thats what i was thinking. 


ebay has a thing about misrepresenting a product and I think will defend the buyer in such a case.


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## turtlebug (Jun 23, 2008)

Guess I toned it down too much then huh? 

I didn't wanna sound TOO ugly, but at the same time, I guess I should have.

I guess the way I'm looking at it is that I'm more disappointed than mad.  I only paid $99 for her and yes, I could've done a lot of things (read: more deposit to Roseoak for a brand new custom) with that money, but she's my "Charlie Brown Christmas Tree" and I feel somewhat of an obligation to save her and love her. 

Jack has always told me, a bow is worth what you're willing to put into it.  Well, I guess she's touched a soft spot in me and I'm willing to put a bit into her to make her right.  It's really hard to find good Howatt bows, shorter little powerhouse bows in lighter poundage and bows that just kind of "move your soul".  She's all three of these to me.

I wouldn't be upset or complaining one bit if she had been represented with a stressed riser, but he lied, just flat out lied. 

Oh well, live and learn, have a yard sale to raise money, send to BowDoc, have her fixed, get her home, string her up and shoot her like she was meant to be shot.


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## Apex Predator (Jun 23, 2008)

Before I spent $300 I would return it to the seller.  It ain't worth that.  Another will come along that is not damaged.


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## SOS (Jun 23, 2008)

I would simply have said, it has a stress crack along a glue line in the riser, contrary to what your ad on Ebay said.  Then see if what he did....then rate him accordingly.

That said, where it is, don't think it is a problem - JMHO.  Have shot bows with lines in the finish along the glue lines.

Steve


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## turtlebug (Jun 23, 2008)

SOS said:


> I would simply have said, it has a stress crack along a glue line in the riser, contrary to what your ad on Ebay said.  Then see if what he did....then rate him accordingly.
> 
> That said, where it is, don't think it is a problem - JMHO.  Have shot bows with lines in the finish along the glue lines.
> 
> Steve



Who all is coming to HC this weekend? 

I'm bringing her, we'll see how she does.


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## Allen Oliver (Jun 23, 2008)

*Question*

What is HC this weekend???


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## YankeeRedneck (Jun 24, 2008)

Tb go to stickbow.com and ask over there , one of the guys over there is Howattman and seems to know alot about them.


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## belle&bows (Jun 24, 2008)

Tbug, I agree with yankee redneck. howattman on leatherwall seems to be the "go to" guy with any and all howatt questions. You might want to give it a shot. You may be fretting over nothing


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## turtlebug (Jun 24, 2008)

Well, the seller offered me my money back plus my cost to ship it back to him but I'm gonna contact Howattman and wait to hear from BowDoc as well before I make any decisions. 

Like I said, I really want to keep her and have her fixed unless someone else knows of a 35# High Speed for sale anywhere?


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## puredrenalin (Jun 24, 2008)

That sux girl...I know you had your hopes up for that one...Hope ya get it straightened out...


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## returntoarchery (Jun 24, 2008)

TB,

All I can say is you've got the worst case of traditionalbowitis of anybody I've ever seen. I know it'll hurt you but I'd send the bow back and order yourself a good custom takedown bow that can be upgraded with new limbs later if you want to increase your draw weight. There are a bunch of really fine shooting and looking custom bows out there and you'll feel all better when you get one in your hands.

RTA


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## BkBigkid (Jun 24, 2008)

turtlebug said:


> Well, the seller offered me my money back plus my cost to ship it back to him but I'm gonna contact Howattman and wait to hear from BowDoc as well before I make any decisions.
> 
> Like I said, I really want to keep her and have her fixed unless someone else knows of a 35# High Speed for sale anywhere?




Send it back and get the custom Ordered! 
You will always worry about this Bow no matter Who fixes it, If I was in your shoes with the spouse's approval already for a custom, that bow would have been packaged already and be on the way back to the seller. 

I know you were wanting this one but Keep looking and one will come along somewhere in Better shape, NO sense Worrying about this one going KAboom on ya.  


Get the Custom that you really want!


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## choctawlb (Jun 24, 2008)

T-Bug
Send the bow back, the guy has sold you a bill of goods.  He needs to make it right or suffer the consequences. If the bow was without flaw that would have been a good deal, but the way it is it's only a wall hanger.  Just My Thoughts.
Ken


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## turtlebug (Jun 24, 2008)

Thanks everyone.  The string for it came in today.  

I just got an email from Brandon Stahl of Roseoak and he's got my plans down pat so I'm gonna be sending him a deposit and finalizing everything for my first custom. 

I'm still so up in the air about this Howatt. 
But then again, you know how women are..........


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## ccbunn (Jun 24, 2008)

T-Bug, I agree that you should send it back for a full refund. I've been burned a couple of times myself, but can't seem to make myself stay away from the bay. I just looked at the sellers profile, feedback and other items he has sold and is currently selling. He doesn't seem to sell many bows at all; just any type item he can buy right and then resell. His only neg. in the last 12 months was later followed up on by the buyer, and the buyer admitted that he/she was mistaken in leaving negative feed back. I doubt if he was trying to be deceptive. Probably didn't know what to look for other than what he could read in other peoples descriptions. I think you did the right thing by not leaving hasty, emotionally fed negative feedback for him. I also think he did the right thing by offering a full refund plus the shipping. Good on you both.
Sorry for your disappointment, but hang in there; another Hi-Speed to your specs. will show up. 
Oh yeah, order the Roseoak while you're waiting on another DH to show up!!!


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## Just BB (Jun 24, 2008)

I say wees guys, me, Big Al, Jack Da Ripper and Fingers Flintlock goes and does a numba on dis fella. After wees ruff hem up real good like, wees take all his bows and leaves him wit nuttin!


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## hogdgz (Jun 24, 2008)

Tbug, I hate that for ya, I could only imagine how bad you were let down. Good Luck!!!!


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## turtlebug (Jun 25, 2008)

Negative Feedback isn't even an option anymore from what I'm reading on ebay now.  They've changed the way they're allowing Feedback to be left. 

Anyway, the guy is really nice and like ccbunn said, he's not an archer so he didn't know (he does now though) what to look for.  I'm gonna try and settle this with him in a nice way, no hard feelings cause apparently he scavenges Estate Sales and then sells them on eBay. 

I wouldn't pay more than $50 for a wallhanger so if he'll refund 1/2, then I'll keep it or if he won't then I'll send it back for a full refund.  

Thanks for all the replies, I'm very appreciative of all the help I've gotten from everyone here.  Brandon said he didn't have a big list for customs right now, so it shouldn't take him more than three months maybe to make my new "theme" bow........

Wanna know what it is? I ain't telling, but I'll give you a hint, he's got a new movie coming out on July 11.


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## returntoarchery (Jun 25, 2008)

turtlebug said:


> to make my new "theme" bow........



Lemme guess Pink....


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## turtlebug (Jun 25, 2008)

returntoarchery said:


> Lemme guess Pink....



NO WAY!


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## returntoarchery (Jun 25, 2008)




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## ccbunn (Jun 25, 2008)

I know! You're gonna name it Hellboy. LOL.


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## turtlebug (Jun 25, 2008)

ccbunn said:


> I know! You're gonna name it Hellboy. LOL.



 WHO TOLD YOU?


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## ccbunn (Jun 25, 2008)

Are you serious? Just a guess cause my son was talking about wanting to see it on the 11th after we watched a commercial about it last night. Dang good name for it in my book! If you don't use it, I just might. 

Chuck


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## turtlebug (Jun 25, 2008)

ccbunn said:


> Are you serious? Just a guess cause my son was talking about wanting to see it on the 11th after we watched a commercial about it last night. Dang good name for it in my book! If you don't use it, I just might.
> 
> Chuck



Picture it...

Charcoal Dymondwood with Purpleheart and Bloodwood stripes, Charcoal Dymondwood laminate over the limbs, a hand-painted pic of "Baby Hellboy" on the lower limb near the riser and then the letters to spell out "HELLBOY" down the top limb. Brandon's wife is being commissioned for a fee to do the artwork. 

The plans have been laid, the deposit is being gathered. 

Hellboy and T-Bug will be ready to do some clean-up next year!


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## dutchman (Jun 25, 2008)

Full refund + shipping sound right!

Do it! You can get wall hangings at the local DU Banquet.


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## ccbunn (Jun 27, 2008)

It's gonna be awesome T-bug. What about getting Brandon's wife to change that bada_ _ glove to an archery glove and add a recurve to his left hand? Nocked arrow with Devil's pitchfork broadhead!


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## PAPALAPIN (Jun 27, 2008)

I did a whole disertion on your Hi-Speed and got knocked off line before I could hit post.

Bottem line.

The NE PLUS ULTRAS are great shooting, collectors items.  The lable tells me early '60's.  Definitely a Damon Howatt even though it only says "Howatt.  The Hunters, Hi-Speeds, and several other models were normally made with less exotic hardwood risers.  When they made one with fine rosewood, the marked them "NE PLUS", and the finer ones were marked "NE PLUS ULTRA".  At $120.00 including shippind, you got a bargain.  I have seen some in worse shape go for $250-$300.  With the exception of the two flaws, the finishe looks supburb.  Even with the flaws, I still see a solid bow.  Early '60's  makes it a 45 year old bow.  Lots older than the Bug herself.

I disagree with everyone that said "Send it back"  You got a great deal.

As far as the guy that sold it, he is the kind of seller that I "WANT" to buy from.  The fact that he offered full refund including return shipping says a lot.  Many ebay sellers pick up recurves at garage and estate sales and they know nothing about them.  When I think of "stress cracks" I am thinking longitudial cracks in the finish of the limbs,  not the riser.  This guy did not have a clue, but he was not intentionlly beng dishonest either.

I have made some great buys from guys like this.  I have made a few bad buys too, but not many.  Don't scold him, thank him for his cooperation, and be glad he did not know what he had.  If I had that bow, I would have given a full descripotion of all faults and praised its good points and listed it as a collectible solid shooter with a couple of issues that would not have effected shooting ability.

Ya did good bug, as I am sure BowDoc will tell ya.


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## PAPALAPIN (Jun 27, 2008)

Just an added note:

My comments above are based on my limited knowledge of Howatt bows.  I certainly do not pretend to know more than Howattman.

He is the authority as far as I am concerned.

I am confident enough to put my money where my mouth is.  If that Hi-Speed does not hold up, I will give you Esmarelda.

I don't think it is even worth sending it to bowdoc.  A little steel wool, and spot refinish is all it needs.  That is some of the most beautiful figured rosewood that you will ever see in a bow.


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## turtlebug (Jun 27, 2008)

Jack, you are my hero!  

I knew something was telling me to keep her.  When I pulled her out of the box, I just knew she was special and I could not for the life of me find the heart to send her back, some little voice (a rough Cajun voice) kept telling me to keep her. 

I really wanted to hear from you before I made my decision, but when he offered me 1/2 back, I knew she was SUPPOSED to be mine.  

Mr. T-Bug wrapped the riser with electrical tape the other night and we strung her up and shot her.  I was absolutely amazed at how smooth and forgiving she is for such a short bow.  She is by far... "Da Bomb".  I shot her and just looked down at her like something was wrong.  Mr. T-Bug asked "WHAT?" and I told him she was like shooting a 64" bow, I just couldn't believe the liquid feel of her.  This bow is truly amazing and a work of art.

Bow-Doc's price that he quoted me for fixing the riser and a complete restoration is very reasonable and I'll have less than $250 in her after all is said and done.  

With that said, thanks Jack!  You just made my day!


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## turtlebug (Jun 27, 2008)

Oh yes, and I did apologize to the seller and explained to him that I was a very emotional female and to please accept my apologies and I thanked him graciously for the partial refund and left him excellent feedback.


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## PAPALAPIN (Jun 27, 2008)

Hey, it's a Howatt

Nuff sed


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## returntoarchery (Jun 28, 2008)

PAPALAPIN said:


> I disagree with everyone that said "Send it back"  You got a great deal.



Given what you said about the bow, I'll be the first to admit I gave incorrect advice regarding sending that bow back. Good call PAPALAPIN.


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## PAPALAPIN (Jun 28, 2008)

*Just My Opinion*

270

Just my opinion.  I would be interested to see what Howattman would say.


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## returntoarchery (Jun 28, 2008)

PAPALAPIN said:


> Just my opinion.



But one based on more knowledge of vintage Damon Howatt than mine. Hence my concession. No offense taken.


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## PAPALAPIN (Jun 28, 2008)

My limited knowledge is based on the fact that I have been around as long as Damon Howatt bows; almost.


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## returntoarchery (Jun 28, 2008)




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