# Info on new Broadheads



## bam_bam (Sep 28, 2009)

Hey guys, I was doing some arrow experiments this weekend with Mr. Dutchman and we found out that my bow/arrow combo shoots 200gr points the best. I mean the fly great. So Who make a good 200gr broadhead??? I looked at the vantage point archery 3 blade screw ins, any news on those?


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## Apex Predator (Sep 28, 2009)

It's easier for me to buy 125grain glue-ons.  There are a ton of choices in that weight.  I just use the 75 or 125 grain steel screw-on adapters to make just about any head a 200 or 250 grain broadhead.


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## SOS (Sep 28, 2009)

Muzzy Phantoms can be had at that weight .  Grizzlies and big snuffers are close.  I'm with Apex - use either brass inserts or the steel screw-in adapters to get your weight of choice with your favorite broadhead - or both.


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## PAPALAPIN (Sep 28, 2009)

If you can find 'em, you can also use weight collars between the head and the arrow.  Of cours this is on screw on heads with RPS inserts assuming you are not using wood shafts.


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## LanceColeman (Sep 28, 2009)

VPA terminators come in about any size glue or screw on you can ask for. they're working on a 300grainer right now.

Absolutely outstanding broadhead.

















Peak over on the right of the pic and you can see my climber on the base of a tree. Thats as far as she made it.


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## dutchman (Sep 28, 2009)

LanceColeman said:


> VPA terminators come in about any size glue or screw on you can ask for. they're working on a 300grainer right now.
> 
> Absolutely outstanding broadhead.
> 
> ...



Bam Bam, these are the heads I was telling you about. I gotta try me some of these...

Also Tusker makes a 200 grain head called the Aztec, I believe it is. You can find them at Braveheart Archery. Google it...


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## LanceColeman (Sep 28, 2009)

*IF* I were to ever return to a 2 blade head it would be the 200gr ace super express.

But I only shoot 51-59# bows (this one is 54#s) I shoot roughly 10grains per pound and these 3:1 type cut on contact 3 blades do NOT STAY in deer. the ONLY time I've left an arrow in the deer I find, broken legs, pinned shoulder blades, severed spines, etc etc. I cut through the back side of this ol girls shoulder blade and you can still see a real pretty exit wound. The entrance shows there's no way for that piece of skin to fold over and cover the wound.


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## Sharptop (Sep 28, 2009)

I just bought some of the Vantage 200 screw ins. Missed the target and hit a half rotten log and the tip snapped off as I worked it loose. Surprised me but I like the heads. Pretty easy to sharpen with a thick file and a diamond stone.


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## bam_bam (Sep 28, 2009)

PAPALAPIN said:


> If you can find 'em, you can also use weight collars between the head and the arrow.  Of cours this is on screw on heads with RPS inserts assuming you are not using wood shafts.



Correct it is 5575 gold tips.


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## bam_bam (Sep 28, 2009)

dutchman said:


> Bam Bam, these are the heads I was telling you about. I gotta try me some of these...
> 
> Also Tusker makes a 200 grain head called the Aztec, I believe it is. You can find them at Braveheart Archery. Google it...



I looked at them also, do they come sharp or do you sharpen them? I have never done any sharpening on a 3blade, is it hard? The tuskers look good too.....I cant decide


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## LanceColeman (Sep 28, 2009)

I've tested alot of broadheads. No offense but I've broke way too many tuskers for my likings.

3 blades are simple to sharpen and do a great job on deer and bear sized game. Only truly BIG 2 blades I prefer are zephyr sasquatches and 200gr ace supers.


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## bam_bam (Sep 28, 2009)

LanceColeman said:


> I've tested alot of broadheads. No offense but I've broke way too many tuskers for my likings.
> 
> 3 blades are simple to sharpen and do a great job on deer and bear sized game. Only truly BIG 2 blades I prefer are zephyr sasquatches and 200gr ace supers.



Good info about the tuskers, I figured that being spring steel they would be tougher than that. What is your method of sharpening the three blade.


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## LanceColeman (Sep 29, 2009)

Bam, Bam,

Here's a copy and paste from the broad head design thread last week.

The key on terminators, vanguards, snuffers, G5s and Woodsmans is firstly a smooth straight bevel (magic marker it and make sure when you run a file down it it all shines and there's no spots of black left. If it looks wavy?? You need to either do one of two things, get uppity and return them demanding a straight correct bevel, or take them to a belt sander and smooth them out straight.*IF* you try and file them straight you will work yourself to death, remove more metal than need be, and with your toil your patience will waiver and it's every bit as likely that you worsen the problem instead of fixing it. So get them on something flat like a belt sander to get it right. Just keep a cup of water near you and bare finger the up pointing blade. That way when you feel it getting too hot you can quench it in the water. And if you taker that advice and cut yerself?? I'm not liable! 

After this the first step is a GOOD file. read that fellas a GOOD file as in a grobet or a brand spankin new nicholsan. And not no tiny lil 6" you keep in you day pack or quiver as atoucher upper. an 8-14" big boy. Now take you new file and go to your kids room and find the sidewalk chalk or chalboard chalk and chalk the file. Rub it with the chalk until it's the same color as the chalk all over. This "floats" the metal shaving you cut away from the head with the file out and away instead of letting them fall or jam in between the teeth of your file. You need to rechalk every time you sit down to rework your edge or bevel. (note thats not touch ups with your little field file. I'm talking when you are about to sit down the night before the hunt and clean up heads thats been rained on or shot in to stuff.

Now you will "feel" this file cutting as you run it across the head the usual "2 blades at once way". Here's what you want to do. there's 3 sides of the head. you want to start at 12 strokes per side, then turn then 12, then turn then 12. Now drop to 10 strokes per side, then to 8, then to 6. Now from 6 you drop only one per side . You count should go 12x3,10x3,8x3,6x3,5x3,4x3,3x3,2x3,1x3,

Here's the key. get LIGHTER with your pressure each time you drop down a number. By the time you reach one? You should be basically just pushing the file with nothing but it's own wieght across the blades.

This head should now already shave hair from you. At this point you can go to DMT stones, strops, arkansas, or what ever you prefer if you are looking for a more polished fine edge. Tom Lagatol uses different grits of jewelers paper wrapped around a piece of 3" PVC pipe to create a hollow ground edge on his. But Toms pretty persnickity about his edges. I don't think you can buy a silver flame sharper than what Tom gets his heads.


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## dutchman (Sep 30, 2009)

LanceColeman said:


> I've tested alot of broadheads. No offense but I've broke way too many tuskers for my likings.
> 
> 3 blades are simple to sharpen and do a great job on deer and bear sized game. Only truly BIG 2 blades I prefer are zephyr sasquatches and 200gr ace supers.



Good information on the Tuskers. 

Lance, in your testing of various broadheads, do you only test in the field on various game or is there some other method that you use? I'm sure you shoot targets to see how well various broadheads fly, but is there other testing that you can do in the yard as opposed to in the field?


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## bam_bam (Sep 30, 2009)

dutchman said:


> Good information on the Tuskers.
> 
> Lance, in your testing of various broadheads, do you only test in the field on various game or is there some other method that you use? I'm sure you shoot targets to see how well various broadheads fly, but is there other testing that you can do in the yard as opposed to in the field?



Great Question Dutch


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## LanceColeman (Sep 30, 2009)

Dutch,

flight characteristics and over all craftsmanship is the first thing I examine. untrue bevels, shoddy brazing, weak or un supported tips get frowned upon from the get go. Flight characteristics are next. I start with big honkin banana fltecth, then 5.5 shields then work my way down. good performing and designed BHs that make it all the way to 3" feathers and 4" plastic vanes get big smiles from me (yes I love plastic vanes of recurves with elevated rests. they'll group BHs as true in the rain as they do in the sunshine)

Next is medium n soft tissue testing. Ballistic gelatin, silicon base blocks, closed cell foam and multiple wet hides compacted together. Then hard density testing, bones first, then ply wood, then wood, then cement and steel plates.

In my honest opinion this is all drastic overkill. See some of the toughest heads out there are some of the worst performing heads out there as far as penetration goes. And when it comes to deer?? They're still enough. I have a broadhead here that started life as a 165gr glue on snuffer. It's actually been through a total test battery, and also been shot through close to 9 whitetail from recurves of less than 60#. That head probably only wieghs 130grs now.  But although it's one of the best bloodttrail and wound channel type heads. It's also the worse case in penetration type heads. But placed broadside on deer it still goes all the weay through and in to the dirt on the offside.

A properly tuned arrow shot from a properly tuned 40# recurve will send pretty much each and every tradtional type head out there (PROVIDED IT'S RAZOR SHARP) completely through a whitetails ribcage and out the other side every time .

It's when we demand or expect or desperately NEED nore that we hope our broadhead will save us.

Like when we hit too far back. We all a sudden wish to change our 190gr grizzly in to a 160 gr snuffer or 135gr magI with bleeders installed for more soft tissue damge.

Or when we hit too far forward and encounter scapulas and leg bones. We want that elgrande grizzly back.

My suggestion to everyone is to find a happy medium that builds confidence in them and stick with it regardless of the head they choose. No one single head will do everything we all want it to do. You have to find one that suits the most of your needs and learn that head and what it will do for you.

Thats why I like the terminators. I don't get little 2 blade entrance and exit wounds. But I can still snap spinal columns and go through scapulas with it.

I don;t get grizzly penetration, but I don't get tiny wound channels like grizzlies either. I don't get massive wound channels like snuffers, but I go through alot more bone and hard tissue with them than is possible with a snuffer.


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## dutchman (Sep 30, 2009)

LanceColeman said:


> Dutch,
> 
> flight characteristics and over all craftsmanship is the first thing I examine. untrue bevels, shoddy brazing, weak or un supported tips get frowned upon from the get go. Flight characteristics are next. I start with big honkin banana fltecth, then 5.5 shields then work my way down. good performing and designed BHs that make it all the way to 3" feathers and 4" plastic vanes get big smiles from me (yes I love plastic vanes of recurves with elevated rests. they'll group BHs as true in the rain as they do in the sunshine)
> 
> ...



Lance, 

Many thanks for your answer. Makes really good sense.


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