# I thought there was no cougars in the south...



## mike bell

I thought there were no cougars in the south?











http://www.wlf.state.la.us/news/?id=1130


----------



## chevyguy

I have never seen a brown/tan one but have seen 3 black ones in South Carolina. One of them was pretty dang big. You wouldn't want to have him backed into a corner.. that's for sure

A fella at work told me he seen one in his yard and he lives in Burke County. Another person reported seeing one in Columbia county years ago, in the early 70's and another one in the late 90's in Wilkes County. All of these mountain lion/cougar

How can anyone say that we have seen a bobcat? They don't know that theres a HUGE difference.

If that one got on your tail you'd know it!!


----------



## chevyguy

Also a woman reported, to me, seeing a large black cougar (panther) in Columbia County a few weeks ago. There was an article in the Augusta Chronicle about it. The location in the newspaper was not right...


----------



## Milkman

_"Southern"_ Montana has plenty


----------



## chevyguy

Milkman said:


> _"Southern"_ Montana has plenty


So does "Southern" Georgia


----------



## GAX

> The department receives many calls reporting sightings of cougars throughout Louisiana. The vast majority of these reports cannot be verified due to the very nature of a sighting. These animals can move through an area and leave little or no evidence to be found.





> The significant lack of physical evidence leads the department to conclude that Louisiana does not have an established, breeding population of cougars. In states that have verified small populations of cougars, physical evidence can readily be found in the form of tracks, cached deer kills, scat and road kills





> Cougars that occur in Louisiana are protected under state and federal law. Penalties for taking a cougar in Louisiana may include up to one year in jail and/or a $100,000 fine



contradictions, imagine that...


----------



## doenightmare

That ain't no bobcat - was that in Wayne County??


----------



## Paddle

GON had a article years ago about some radio collared cougars from Fla. that roamed up into Ga. One even got as far north as HWY 16. I think they captured that one and took it back.

 The thing is, it has not and will not and cannot be proven that the "Black Panther" is out there.   

 Monster Quest did a show on the “Black Panther”. It should be mandatory watching for everyone that has seen a “Black Panther”. 

 No pictures. There are hundreds of thousands of game cameras in the woods and NOTHING. No dead ones EVER found side of the Millions of miles of highways.

 People do see things. Black hogs, Black Labs, Black HOUSE cats, Black Cows, Black Horses, and other things in their minds.   

 I believe in Santa but not “Black Panthers”. I’ve seen Santa. I’ve sat in his lap.


----------



## LLove

awwww!!! i want the kitty.. 


also, my dad walked up on a cougar in the north GA mountains just a few years ago. Still has pix somewhere.


----------



## Gary Mercer

Back in the late 50s, my brother and I walked up on one with a dead doe back in our swamp during a squirel hunt.  
It was sorta dunn colored, not black.  My .22 felt awful small at the time.  We skeedaddled!  That cat didn't want to leave the doe.  We didn't go back for a couple of weeks, and never saw any sign after that.
That Swamp tied into the Four Hole Swamp, and the great Santee Swamp.  So anything could have been in there.
We had an old colored man that had lived on the place since he was born.  (A Slave by the way.) 
And, he told me about the panthers that lived in the swamp.  He said they we black and some were tan.
That old man taught me to fish from a dugout canoe, and hunt deer with a shotgun.  And, he never lied to me once.
He was sorta like having a very special grand-pa to a youngster.


----------



## chevyguy

Gary Mercer said:


> Back in the late 50s, my brother and I walked up on one with a dead doe back in our swamp during a squirel hunt.
> It was sorta dunn colored, not black.  My .22 felt awful small at the time.  We skeedaddled!  That cat didn't want to leave the doe.  We didn't go back for a couple of weeks, and never saw any sign after that.
> That Swamp tied into the Four Hole Swamp, and the great Santee Swamp.  So anything could have been in there.
> We had an old colored man that had lived on the place since he was born.  (A Slave by the way.)
> And, he told me about the panthers that lived in the swamp.  He said they we black and some were tan.
> That old man taught me to fish from a dugout canoe, and hunt deer with a shotgun.  And, he never lied to me once.
> He was sorta like having a very special grand-pa to a youngster.


He didn't lie to you, they do exist. Keep believing what he told you...

I was talking to an older gentleman this weekend about panthers, he's a Marine. He never thought anything different than they do exist, and could not believe their existance is denied.


----------



## longears

why hasnt anyone killed the great black panther?  they have been reported from the Fla line to the north Ga mountians and no one has put lead in one yet. heres yo sign.


----------



## chevyguy

longears said:


> why hasnt anyone killed the great black panther?  they have been reported from the Fla line to the north Ga mountians and no one has put lead in one yet. heres yo sign.


When you see one it only lasts for a few seconds, that's why the native americans thought they were ghosts or evil spirits. 

I think they have heightened senses that we cannot imagine, supersenses. You pose a valid question.. why hasn't anyone provided proof? They are a lot smarter than we are, it's that simple

There are enough people just on here that admits seeing one, that's not enough proof for you?

Whats the fine for killing a mountain lion in Georgia? If someone did see a black panther, could they even legally shoot it if they have a chance?


----------



## chevyguy

This is silly even arguing if they are real or not, of course they are

A native american perspective.. a little far fetched. or is it?
http://wolfs_moon.tripod.com/blackpantotem.html


----------



## chevyguy

Read this, maybe if you see enough you'l halfway think it's true. thats a start...
http://www.michigancougar.com/black.htm


----------



## Nicodemus

chevyguy said:


> This is silly even arguing if they are real or not, of course they are
> 
> A native american perspective.. a little far fetched. or is it?
> http://wolfs_moon.tripod.com/blackpantotem.html




A little farfetched, I`d say.............


----------



## irishleprechaun

Gary Mercer said:


> Back in the late 50s, my brother and I walked up on one with a dead doe back in our swamp during a squirel hunt.
> It was sorta dunn colored, not black.  My .22 felt awful small at the time.  We skeedaddled!  That cat didn't want to leave the doe.  We didn't go back for a couple of weeks, and never saw any sign after that.
> That Swamp tied into the Four Hole Swamp, and the great Santee Swamp.  So anything could have been in there.
> We had an old colored man that had lived on the place since he was born.  (A Slave by the way.)
> And, he told me about the panthers that lived in the swamp.  He said they we black and some were tan.
> That old man taught me to fish from a dugout canoe, and hunt deer with a shotgun.  And, he never lied to me once.
> He was sorta like having a very special grand-pa to a youngster.



I hunted just north of the santee river swamps for several years.  One guy I hunted with said he had one chasing a doe right past his stand.  I never took him for one to lie...if you ever been in those swamps you'd know there is a lot of ground probably never been touched since the ol' swamp fox outsmarted the brits back in the day....


----------



## Slug-Gunner

*Don't Ask.... Don't Tell ....*



longears said:


> why hasnt anyone killed the great black panther?  they have been reported from the Fla line to the north Ga mountians and no one has put lead in one yet. heres yo sign.





> Cougars that occur in Louisiana _are protected under state and federal law_. _Penalties for taking a cougar may include up to one year in jail and/or a $100,000 fine_.



This might have something to do with it. Why would someone talk/brag about killing a mountain lion/panther if they are a federally protected species in some areas? Not unless they're VERY STUPID and/or VERY RICH!  Now that's a 'sign'.

Slug-Gunner


----------



## BigBurke

I live about 15 miles out of waynesboro and i can safely say there are black panthers in the area.   My mother was the first to see one about 7 years ago running across the field at there house. I didnt believe her for years until i had my own panther experiance during a bow hunt  2 years ago. i saw a 100 percent black panter.   I personally know atleast 6 people who have spotted them.  O yea they are breeding i saw a yearling panther this summer.


----------



## chevyguy

Yeah theres panthers all around, I cant figure out why someone cannot produce proof... I have seen 3 panthers and I guarantee I have no way of proving it.

I'm sure there have been DNR employees that have seen them also but they are too afraid to admit it because people would say they were liars


----------



## Throwback

Dear god. 


T


----------



## Throwback

BigBurke said:


> I live about 15 miles out of waynesboro and i can safely say there are black panthers in the area.   My mother was the first to see one about 7 years ago running across the field at there house. I didnt believe her for years until i had my own panther experiance during a bow hunt  2 years ago. i saw a 100 percent black panter.   I personally know atleast 6 people who have spotted them.  O yea they are breeding i saw a yearling panther this summer.



I think I see one in the background of your avitar about to jump on that buck and kill him. 

T


----------



## Nicodemus

This is gettin` borderline ridiculous.  


I think I stated something like this before, but just for fun, I`ll post it again.   

If anybody can bring me a BLACK (not BROWN or TAN) panther, and prove to me, without a doubt, that it originated in the wild, right here in Georgia, or in any neighborin` state, I will take it to the courthouse yard in Leesburg Georgia, build a hand drill friction fire, skin said varmint with a flint flake, roast it over the fire, and eat it, then use one of the claws for a toothpick.     

Don`t tell me. Show me, prove it to me.


----------



## ToLog

balvarik said:


> Nic,
> Look's like someone has been into the Peyote to me.
> 
> Mike



If'n ol Al Franken can be a Senator, then pant'rs can live in the South, can't they?


----------



## ToLog

balvarik said:


> Foul!
> Cheap shot!
> We had "Jessie the idiot" and that was way too much!!!
> 
> Norm Coleman has my vote!
> 
> Mike



to keep costs down, in hard economic times every shot should be made as cheaply as possible.


----------



## chevyguy

balvarik said:


> Melanistic phase cougars.
> 
> There are no authenticated cases of truly melanistic cougars. Black cougars have been reported in Kentucky and in the Carolinas. There have also been reports of glossy black cougars from Kansas, Texas and eastern Nebraska. These have come to be known as the North American black panther. None have ever been photographed or shot in the wild and none have been bred. There is wide consensus among breeders and biologists that the animal does not exist and is a cryptid
> (The search for animals that fall outside of taxonomic records due to a lack of empirical evidence, but for which anecdotal evidence exists in the form of myths, legends, or undocumented sightings).
> Sightings are currently attributed to errors in species identification by non-experts, and by the memetic exaggeration of size.
> 
> 
> Mike


I would buy that except for the fact that I have seen one on three separate occasions, the tail was as long as their body and all 3 were jet black. One of them, I know, was a very large cat. The other 2 were big cats but not as big as the first

Theres a radio station in Allendale, SC that is called"Big Dog" and a lot of people several years ago were calling in reporting seeing panthers. One of them, I believe, said they had a picture of one

I don't have anything to prove, I know what I have seen. do you have any proof that they DO NOT exist?


----------



## chevyguy

Watch this and give us your conspiracy theory

http://www.thejump.net/multimedia/cougar/black-panther.htm


----------



## Nicodemus

The absence of tangible physical evidence, even a photo, echoes loudly from the Atlantic to the Pacific.

I stand by the post I made above.


----------



## RackNBeardOutdoors

Isn't it against the law in Georgia to drink alcohol while hunting in the deer stand?


----------



## GAX

I've seen some Black and Blue Dawgs running around today.


----------



## chevyguy

New species of animals are discovered fequently, it would be nothing new


----------



## SHMELTON

Didn't the monster quest guys have proof that black Jaguars have moved into Arizona?  I think they did, I was flipping back and forth can't remember for sure, but I thought they moved up through Mexico into Arizona.  I know Arizona is a long way from Georgia, but they could have made it into Texas possibly LA.


----------



## BigBurke

Say what you want to, but  Burke county Georgia has a small population of black panthers. Somebody may have turned there pet panther lose and they multiplied. I dont know??? Its as big of  a mystery  to me as it is to all.   Iv converted my deer camera's to panther cameras so hopefully ill get a picture of one soon.


----------



## chevyguy

balvarik said:


> In the Jaguar (Panthera onca),melanism is a most common instance of occurrence!
> 
> I've seen them in Honduras,Panama and Columbia in the wild.
> 
> Of the possibility of a Black Cat,a Jaguar is a 100% possibility but a Cougar(Puma concolor)is a negative in terms of a melanistic phase color.
> 
> Jaguar may range into Arizona,Texas and north possibly into Arkansas or east to Mississippi.
> 
> Mike


But the cats I have seen were so rude they would not stop for a second for me to get a DNA sample. 

No manners whatsoever 

You people are taking us so literal when we say "panther", thats the only name we know to call it.

Are Jaguars fairly large? a lot bigger than a bobcat for sure....


----------



## chevyguy

A black cougar IS a black panther. well sort of...

http://www.bigcatrescue.org/cats/wild/jaguar.htm
Jaguar:  Panthera onca 

Common Name: Jaguar 


Jaguar is an Indian word

This is wrong. We ahve been seeing enough of them for proof that they are here, and abundant

"Distribution: Once found here in the United States (California, New Mexico, Arizona, Texas, Florida), this cat was hunted to extinction here in the late 1940s. Today, it is found in Mexico, but swiftly declining and Central America, and the strongest populations being found in the Mato Grosso, Brazil; The Pantanal, bordering Brazil, Bolivia and Paraguay; Chiapas State, Mexico; and the Yucatan Peninsula/northern Guatemala/Belize.  "

The jaguar is protected in the US, even though none are supposed to exist here. Thats convenient..

"Status: CITES: Appendix I. IUCN: Near Threatened.  The jaguar is fully protected at the national level across most of its range, with hunting prohibited in Argentina, Brazil, Colombia, French Guiana, Honduras, Nicaragua, Panama, Paraguay, Suriname, United States, Uruguay and Venezuela, and hunting restrictions in place in Brazil, Costa Rica, Guatemala, Mexico and Peru. The species also occurs within protected areas in some of its range. "

http://www.bigcatrescue.org/cats/wild/florida_panther.htm


----------



## Throwback

WOW you mean you CAN get a picture of one? They DO eat road kill? They WILL stay still long enough to get their pictures taken? 



T


----------



## firebouy

I had a black panther or jagurandi follow me out of the woods
at camp blanding. I hit a dirt road,went to my truck and when I was loading my tree stand in the back,I saw him laying flat in the road where I had come out.
 Now this is in or near jax. fl. I was going to shoot him but
it is a violation. Watching him watching me was very spooky
got a feeling like one gets just before the gooks ambush you.
I went to the checkout station and reported my sighting.
 I was told ther was a circus animal retirement home about twenty
miles from blanding,and they were notorious for letting there animals(escape) Hey.I don't know if these things can breed with
domestic panthers,but if so this and other black panther(pets)
may be the reason we have seen them.Thsi was 30 years ago
when I was fresh out of the army. I know what I SAW.Firebouy


----------



## Ol' Red

Nicodemus said:


> This is gettin` borderline ridiculous.
> 
> 
> I think I stated something like this before, but just for fun, I`ll post it again.
> 
> If anybody can bring me a BLACK (not BROWN or TAN) panther, and prove to me, without a doubt, that it originated in the wild, right here in Georgia, or in any neighborin` state, I will take it to the courthouse yard in Leesburg Georgia, build a hand drill friction fire, skin said varmint with a flint flake, roast it over the fire, and eat it, then use one of the claws for a toothpick.
> 
> Don`t tell me. Show me, prove it to me.



X2....You can take what Nic says to the bank.  Oh, I'll join him on the court house steps.  Moving that way in about 3 weeks and I'll be in need of a good time!



firebouy said:


> I had a black panther or jagurandi follow me out of the woods
> at camp blanding. I hit a dirt road,went to my truck and when I was loading my tree stand in the back,I saw him laying flat in the road where I had come out.
> Now this is in or near jax. fl. I was going to shoot him but
> it is a violation. Watching him watching me was very spooky
> got a feeling like one gets just before the gooks ambush you.
> I went to the checkout station and reported my sighting.
> I was told ther was a circus animal retirement home about twenty
> miles from blanding,and they were notorious for letting there animals(escape) Hey.I don't know if these things can breed with
> domestic panthers,but if so this and other black panther(pets)
> may be the reason we have seen them.Thsi was 30 years ago
> when I was fresh out of the army. I know what I SAW.Firebouy



So you watched him watch you as if he might ambush you and you didn't shoot?  Hmmmmmm.  Not calling you out, but I don't buy it.  Violation or not, the money you would make of off shooting the one and only black panther in the SE would far outweigh the fine.....

I tell you what, I'll pay the fine and bail you out of jail if you shoot him and bring him to me.

Red


----------



## firebouy

*panther*

Didn't get on here to tell fairy tales my friend.
Like I said I watched him watch me.Wasn't five steps away
he was closer to 100 or so. If you'll read what I said,
i hit a dirt road and walked to my truck.
 It wasn't even illegal for me to shoot this thing according to the gate guys,he was turned loose not local.
  If I ever write something whether it is bought or not
It will be the truth.Firebouy


----------



## howie_r

Wait wait I am a little confused here so are we saying there are no Panther's in Georgia or Pumas? and if someone brings Nic a Pather or Puma shot in Georgia he will eat it? And if said animal is Eaten do you also tan the hide and give it back to the person or keep it?


----------



## Keebs

Ol' Red said:


> X2....You can take what Nic says to the bank.  Oh, I'll join him on the court house steps.  Moving that way in about 3 weeks and I'll be in need of a good time!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Red




You gonna be in "my neck o' the woods!?!?!"


----------



## chevyguy

howie_r said:


> Wait wait I am a little confused here so are we saying there are no Panther's in Georgia or Pumas? and if someone brings Nic a Pather or Puma shot in Georgia he will eat it? And if said animal is Eaten do you also tan the hide and give it back to the person or keep it?


They are claiming panthers do not exist AT ALL

They havent seen one, so it's not true

Panthers may not exist but there are some big stealthy black cats out there running loose, jaguar or whatever they are


----------



## Ol' Red

howie_r said:


> Wait wait I am a little confused here so are we saying there are no Panther's in Georgia or Pumas? and if someone brings Nic a Pather or Puma shot in Georgia he will eat it? And if said animal is Eaten do you also tan the hide and give it back to the person or keep it?



That's what I read.....Heck, I'll help him clean it....I aint really into eating cat, but in this case I might make an exception.



Kebo said:


> You gonna be in "my neck o' the woods!?!?!"



Yep.



chevyguy said:


> They are claiming panthers do not exist AT ALL
> 
> They havent seen one, so it's not true
> 
> Panthers may not exist but there are some big stealthy black cats out there running loose, jaguar or whatever they are



Prove it.....I don't think that that is asking too much or calling those that "claim" to have seen them liars.  A picture, dead one, something.  I believe there are tan panthers/cougars in GA.  I'll give you that.  They've been seen all over SE and SW GA.  Black ones?  Nope.

Red


----------



## chevyguy

heres a big black cat in captivity for ya


----------



## chevyguy

Published in the Macon Telegraph

GSP seen one and some cubs. Call the person that wrote the article. His number is at the bottom

"Posted on Tue, Feb. 20, 2007

Search for missing man called off
22-year-old still missing; investigators re-interviewing people
By Liz Fabian and Tim Sturrock
TELEGRAPH STAFF WRITERS

A team of searchers Monday called off the hunt in the Tobesofkee Creek area for a missing 22-year-old Macon man, authorities said.

Jeremy Thomas was reported missing at 2:20 p.m. Sunday after he was last seen Saturday about 3:30 p.m.

"We feel like we have searched the area as well as we can at this point," said Lt. George Meadows, Bibb County sheriff's spokesman. "We are hoping that he has left the area and that he is somewhere else."

Monday rescuers retrieved some personal items from an abandoned boat about 700 yards from Ga. 247, Meadows said.

"There is nothing to indicate that there is a body in the area," Meadows said, "We don't have any reason to suspect foul play at this point, but we are not ruling out anything and we are not speculating."

Meadows said investigators are re-interviewing people to try to determine his whereabouts.

Searchers combed the creek Sunday afternoon and evening while a Georgia State Patrol helicopter hovered overhead.

A "moving hot spot" detected about 7 p.m. Sunday by a Georgia State Patrol helicopter turned out to be a large cat, possibly a panther-type animal protecting her young, authorities said.

Shortly after 11 a.m. Monday, searchers put boats in the water from Interstate 475 and Ga. 247 in south Bibb County near the seven bridges about a half mile from the Houston Avenue fork.

The crews worked toward each other from both ends of the two-mile search area.

"It's going to be a very slow process due to it's a swamp area and a lot of debris and stuff across the creek so we're going to have to remove to make contact from one side to the other," Donnie Mercer, Macon-Bibb County Fire Department training chief, said Monday.

Thomas' mother and stepfather, Carol and Buck Herring, said it was unusual for Thomas to be gone so long.

"He's never gone out and stayed like this, never," said Buck Herring. "If he was planning on even an overnight trip, no one was aware of it, not even his live-in girlfriend, the mother of his children."

"He had just gotten this little boat, and I guess he was going out to try it, but we don't know because the last time I talked to him was Wednesday, which was Valentine's Day," Carol Herring said.

"We wish he would come on home or they would find him whatever the situation may be," Buck Herring said.

According to the initial missing person's report, Thomas and a friend, Ryan Borders, put the boat in the water about 8:30 p.m. Thursday, and Thomas let Borders out at the bridge over Ga. 247 Saturday afternoon, Meadows said.

"We interviewed (Borders) and he said he just got tired of fishing, got tired of being cold and wanted to go home," Mercer said. Borders told investigators he last saw Thomas heading back up the creek.

Bibb County Sheriff Jerry Modena said searchers had to maneuver around fallen trees across the creek by taking their boats out of the water and carrying them around the debris.

By mid-afternoon Monday, searchers fanned out from the abandoned boat and walked the marshy land trying to find any sign of Thomas.

To contact Tim Sturrock, call 744-4347 or e-mail tsturrock@macontel.com"


http://www.macon-bibb.com/EPE/Panther.htm

I guess everybody are liars and because you havent seen one, they dont exist. Sure


----------



## Ol' Red

chevyguy said:


> Published in the Macon Telegraph
> 
> GSP seen one and some cubs. Call the person that wrote the article. His number is at the bottom
> 
> "Posted on Tue, Feb. 20, 2007
> 
> Search for missing man called off
> 22-year-old still missing; investigators re-interviewing people
> By Liz Fabian and Tim Sturrock
> TELEGRAPH STAFF WRITERS
> 
> A team of searchers Monday called off the hunt in the Tobesofkee Creek area for a missing 22-year-old Macon man, authorities said.
> 
> Jeremy Thomas was reported missing at 2:20 p.m. Sunday after he was last seen Saturday about 3:30 p.m.
> 
> "We feel like we have searched the area as well as we can at this point," said Lt. George Meadows, Bibb County sheriff's spokesman. "We are hoping that he has left the area and that he is somewhere else."
> 
> Monday rescuers retrieved some personal items from an abandoned boat about 700 yards from Ga. 247, Meadows said.
> 
> "There is nothing to indicate that there is a body in the area," Meadows said, "We don't have any reason to suspect foul play at this point, but we are not ruling out anything and we are not speculating."
> 
> Meadows said investigators are re-interviewing people to try to determine his whereabouts.
> 
> Searchers combed the creek Sunday afternoon and evening while a Georgia State Patrol helicopter hovered overhead.
> 
> A "moving hot spot" detected about 7 p.m. Sunday by a Georgia State Patrol helicopter turned out to be a large cat, possibly a panther-type animal protecting her young, authorities said.
> 
> Shortly after 11 a.m. Monday, searchers put boats in the water from Interstate 475 and Ga. 247 in south Bibb County near the seven bridges about a half mile from the Houston Avenue fork.
> 
> The crews worked toward each other from both ends of the two-mile search area.
> 
> "It's going to be a very slow process due to it's a swamp area and a lot of debris and stuff across the creek so we're going to have to remove to make contact from one side to the other," Donnie Mercer, Macon-Bibb County Fire Department training chief, said Monday.
> 
> Thomas' mother and stepfather, Carol and Buck Herring, said it was unusual for Thomas to be gone so long.
> 
> "He's never gone out and stayed like this, never," said Buck Herring. "If he was planning on even an overnight trip, no one was aware of it, not even his live-in girlfriend, the mother of his children."
> 
> "He had just gotten this little boat, and I guess he was going out to try it, but we don't know because the last time I talked to him was Wednesday, which was Valentine's Day," Carol Herring said.
> 
> "We wish he would come on home or they would find him whatever the situation may be," Buck Herring said.
> 
> According to the initial missing person's report, Thomas and a friend, Ryan Borders, put the boat in the water about 8:30 p.m. Thursday, and Thomas let Borders out at the bridge over Ga. 247 Saturday afternoon, Meadows said.
> 
> "We interviewed (Borders) and he said he just got tired of fishing, got tired of being cold and wanted to go home," Mercer said. Borders told investigators he last saw Thomas heading back up the creek.
> 
> Bibb County Sheriff Jerry Modena said searchers had to maneuver around fallen trees across the creek by taking their boats out of the water and carrying them around the debris.
> 
> By mid-afternoon Monday, searchers fanned out from the abandoned boat and walked the marshy land trying to find any sign of Thomas.
> 
> To contact Tim Sturrock, call 744-4347 or e-mail tsturrock@macontel.com"
> 
> 
> http://www.macon-bibb.com/EPE/Panther.htm
> 
> I guess everybody are liars and because you havent seen one, they dont exist. Sure




Nobody has said panthers don't exist in GA....BLACK PANTHERS DON'T EXIST IN GA.  Hope that clears it up for you.  Read your own link.....

Red


----------



## chevyguy

Ol' Red said:


> Nobody has said panthers don't exist in GA....BLACK PANTHERS DON'T EXIST IN GA.  Hope that clears it up for you.  Read your own link.....
> 
> Red


You read it again. Several of those people reported seeing black cats


----------



## Nicodemus

chevyguy said:


> You read it again. Several of those people reported seeing black cats



Just bring me the cat, and the proof I asked for. I have the flint flake, and the fire........................................


----------



## The Original Rooster

Nick, 

While you're at it why don't we have some bigfoot gumbo and loch ness stew?


----------



## meateater

Unfortunately Ol' Red you are mistaken stating 

"Nobody has said panthers don't exist in GA....BLACK PANTHERS DON'T EXIST IN GA. Hope that clears it up for you. Read your own link.....

Red "

Lots of folks on this forum have said "there are no panthers, cougars, mountain lions in Georgia". 

We all know that the Florida Panther, or Mountain Lion, same animal, knows where the state boundary line is and the big Cats know better than to cross it ! Makes sense right?  Makes no sense at all. With all the developement going on in Florida these big cats have no place to go but north. The Florida wildlife commission would have one believe that most of the cats are down in the everglades. Check out how many road kills have occurred in Osceola County, near Disney, and farther North. I saw a big cat on my families farm in Brooks County back in the early nineties. My Mom and Dad did not believe me until the cat jumped out of one of our Pecan tree in front of them as they took their morning walk. I watched the cat through a 50mm scope after seeing it while tractoring some haybails to our cows. I could have shot at it, why would I do that? First its illegal, second, why? Why didn't I take a picture. All you doubters, next time you see a automobile accident happen, as it happens, take a picture and then I'll believe you saw it happen. Our farm butts up against an almost nine thousand acre private plantation. Prove to me theres no panther there ! Those Panthers know better than to cross State boundary lines don't they?


----------



## Nicodemus

For the record, I`m talkin` about a BLACK one.................And I will now hush, until I have a handful of black panther hide in one hand, and my flint knife in the other.


----------



## Ol' Red

chevyguy said:


> You read it again. Several of those people reported seeing black cats



Don't care...They're aren't any black cats in GA...period.  It doesn't matter what somebody "thinks" they saw.  Prove it.....I will gladly pay the fine, bail you out of jail, and hire the attorney to represent you in court if you decide to shoot one.  You've got nothing to lose.



meateater said:


> Unfortunately Ol' Red you are mistaken stating
> 
> "Nobody has said panthers don't exist in GA....BLACK PANTHERS DON'T EXIST IN GA. Hope that clears it up for you. Read your own link.....
> 
> Red "
> 
> Lots of folks on this forum have said "there are no panthers, cougars, mountain lions in Georgia".
> 
> We all know that the Florida Panther, or Mountain Lion, same animal, knows where the state boundary line is and the big Cats know better than to cross it ! Makes sense right?  Makes no sense at all. With all the developement going on in Florida these big cats have no place to go but north. The Florida wildlife commission would have one believe that most of the cats are down in the everglades. Check out how many road kills have occurred in Osceola County, near Disney, and farther North. I saw a big cat on my families farm in Brooks County back in the early nineties. My Mom and Dad did not believe me until the cat jumped out of one of our Pecan tree in front of them as they took their morning walk. I watched the cat through a 50mm scope after seeing it while tractoring some haybails to our cows. I could have shot at it, why would I do that? First its illegal, second, why? Why didn't I take a picture. All you doubters, next time you see a automobile accident happen, as it happens, take a picture and then I'll believe you saw it happen. Our farm butts up against an almost nine thousand acre private plantation. Prove to me theres no panther there ! Those Panthers know better than to cross State boundary lines don't they?



Well then I disagree with those folks too....I've never seen one, but I won't doubt folks have seen big TAN cats in GA.  There is no such thing as a wild black panther in GA.  End of story.

Red


----------



## chevyguy

Ol' Red said:


> Don't care...They're aren't any black cats in GA...period.  It doesn't matter what somebody "thinks" they saw.  Prove it.....I will gladly pay the fine, bail you out of jail, and hire the attorney to represent you in court if you decide to shoot one.  You've got nothing to lose.


You want us to poach an animal for you? TIP should be getting a phone call about right now


----------



## Ol' Red

chevyguy said:


> You want us to poach an animal for you? TIP should be getting a phone call about right now



Go ahead and call them...no law against shooting a BLACK panther in GA.  I tell you what, while you're calling them, mention that I offered a reward for a unicorn and the tooth fairy....


Red


----------



## Throwback

chevyguy said:


> You want us to poach an animal for you? TIP should be getting a phone call about right now




1-800-241-4113


T


----------



## The AmBASSaDEER

Red if I ever see one I will shoot'em fer ya.....that goes fer bigfoot too rite?


----------



## tuffdawg

Quick...... I got bigfoot in my freezer!


----------



## buggs

i can't say much for georgia but i have seen them here in ky a tan one and a black one on seperate acasions i do know the black one was not a house cat because it was as big as or bigger than the tan one just started seeing the tan one but the black one has been here for 3 years now since i first seen it and i have seen it again this year. i can speak for those that have seen one they are unmistakeable


----------



## chevyguy

buggs said:


> i can't say much for georgia but i have seen them here in ky a tan one and a black one on seperate acasions i do know the black one was not a house cat because it was as big as or bigger than the tan one just started seeing the tan one but the black one has been here for 3 years now since i first seen it and i have seen it again this year. i can speak for those that have seen one they are unmistakeable


They have never seen one, DNR told them they don't exist so the sheep will listen to what they're told.

You're right, no matter what anyone else says, when you see him you'll know it. No doubt about it. 

This is just like when someone reports seeing a bear out of "bear country" DNR tries to publicly make the person look like any idiot by saying they seen a large dog. 

If there are dogs running around out there that big, THEY need to be hunted down!!!  

There are a LOT more sightings of panthers and bear than anyone reports. Ever since talking about seeing panthers, plenty of people have told me that they never knew anybody claimed they did not exist. 

Funny thing is, the DNR claim they don't exist. If they get a report they really never do very much to find out what it really was. They don't even leave their trucks. What do they think, the animal is going to come back out because they are an officer of the law? 

When they get a report they need to go there with some dogs and track him. 

Nah, they might get mud on their boots that way


----------



## Ol' Red

The AmBASSaDEER said:


> Red if I ever see one I will shoot'em fer ya.....that goes fer bigfoot too rite?



Yeah, sure.




chevyguy said:


> They have never seen one, DNR told them they don't exist so the sheep will listen to what they're told.
> 
> You're right, no matter what anyone else says, when you see him you'll know it. No doubt about it.
> 
> This is just like when someone reports seeing a bear out of "bear country" DNR tries to publicly make the person look like any idiot by saying they seen a large dog.
> 
> If there are dogs running around out there that big, THEY need to be hunted down!!!
> 
> There are a LOT more sightings of panthers and bear than anyone reports. Ever since talking about seeing panthers, plenty of people have told me that they never knew anybody claimed they did not exist.
> 
> Funny thing is, the DNR claim they don't exist. If they get a report they really never do very much to find out what it really was. They don't even leave their trucks. What do they think, the animal is going to come back out because they are an officer of the law?
> 
> When they get a report they need to go there with some dogs and track him.
> 
> Nah, they might get mud on their boots that way



Great!  Join the challenge shoot a BLACK one and prove us all wrong.    I have seen pictures of panthers in GA( know where they were taken.)  There is no such thing as a wild, BLACK panther in GA.  

Red


----------



## turkey foot

I have seen two panthers in Ga.not black but tawny color,could have shot one but didn't.
But if one was to shoot a panther in Ga. would that be legal or since they don't exist ,, no problem?


----------



## dwhee87

Wonder if it'll taste like sea turtle or spotted owl?


----------



## germag

I can't believe you'd advocate killing the tooth fairy.  What kind of person are you? 

Although, I'll admit that I tried to figure out a way to trap him/her once when I was a kid. I wasn't going to kill her/him....I just wanted to see what the tooth fairy really looked like. I actually caught my mom instead though. It didn't work out well.


----------



## Throwback

I guess since Ol Red was banned, the black panther challenge is officially cancelled. 


T


----------



## shakey gizzard

Genetic drifts and mutations accure daily! Pesonally,I got to see it to believe it!


----------



## Nicodemus

My offer still stands...


----------



## ArmyTaco

I have a black cat..her name is Sweety.

Nic I thought you said your were done here?


----------



## gaspur1

If you guys don't have the money to back up your claims re: paying all  fines and providing a lawyer you shouldn't be doing it. Some young fella will be expecting you to get him out of some major legal troubles and you will be liable . These animals although not seen daily are under Federal and State protection


----------



## Beartrkkr

Here's the "big picture" of verified cougar/panther/mt. lion sightings.   

Discuss...

http://www.cougarnet.org/bigpicture.html


----------



## germag

Who said that? I've never seen anyone say that there are no cougars in the southeast in these forums. What has been stated is that there are no reproducing populations or native cougars in Georgia.....big difference. Certainly there have been sightings and even cougars killed in Georgia but they weren't from Georgia populations. They were either staggler Florida Panthers or escaped western cougars.


----------



## NCHillbilly

Gerald, you might as well give up on people understanding the difference between transient males and established breeding populations. 
You could actually add several more confirmations to the map above, but they don't show up because they were determined to be released/escaped captives. There were two killed in eastern NC a while back, one had a tattoo in its ear. A couple killed in Va/WVa in the last few years, too, but they were tame and had South American DNA. The most interesting one was a small cub roadkilled in eastern KY a few years ago-the only confirmation of breeding in the East outside FL. The only problem with it was that it had 50% South American DNA, which means that at least one of its parents was a captive. It's unknown whether it was born in captivity and was released, or was born in the wild. Last couple of years has brought a couple confirmations from Louisiana, so they may be starting to spread east from Tx. There was a confirmed trail cam photo in LA a few weeks ago.


----------



## NCHillbilly

gaspur1 said:


> If you guys don't have the money to back up your claims re: paying all  fines and providing a lawyer you shouldn't be doing it. Some young fella will be expecting you to get him out of some major legal troubles and you will be liable . These animals although not seen daily are under Federal and State protection



An escaped or released nonnative animal isn't protected by law. A black jaguar or leopard in Georgia would be the same scenario as the lions, cheetahs, giraffes, and such that were released and killed in Ohio a few days ago. Jaguars are protected in the US where they might be expected to occur naturally, such as Arizona, Texas, or New Mexico, but Georgia is thousands of miles away from the historic or present native range of jaguars, and across the ocean from the native range of leopards. Also, you won't see a black jaguar in Arizona, Texas, or New Mexico, which are all within the outer fringe of historic jaguar range. All the jags there have been normal spotted ones. The black ones are very rare even where there are a lot of jaguars, and so far have been found naturally only in the Amazon Basin of South America. If there is a black jaguar in Georgia, it didn't get here on its own, somebody turned it loose. There have been only two confirmed jags in the US in many years, both were in Arizona right on the Mexican border, and both were spotted, not black. 
On the other hand, a native cougar/panther/whatever you want to call it, which are not black, would definitely be protected by law. But, they aren't black. Nor are they black.


----------



## feathersnantlers

Plenty of Cougars and Turkey Vultures in Buckhead. Can be seen on Sat Nites.


----------



## Throwback

Beartrkkr said:


> Here's the "big picture" of verified cougar/panther/mt. lion sightings.
> 
> Discuss...
> 
> http://www.cougarnet.org/bigpicture.html





they should cross reference that with cougars held by permit, or cougars found to be held illegally. 



T


----------



## DLS

Nick. I can put you on one. But you gotta shoot it, it will take a dedicated lion hunter, to pack in that deep..- if you can- I am getting to old to hunt that deep in the swamps. Thats why deer hunters never SEE any cougars, tracks, or get pix on trail cams.. They just never come that close to populated areas in ga.
 I really ain't shure of a black one. but take a shot at a regular cat first


----------



## Nicodemus

DLS said:


> Nick. I can put you on one. But you gotta shoot it, it will take a dedicated lion hunter, to pack in that deep..- if you can- I am getting to old to hunt that deep in the swamps. Thats why deer hunters never SEE any cougars, tracks, or get pix on trail cams.. They just never come that close to populated areas in ga.





Read up on my challenge.


----------



## DLS

Nicodemus said:


> Read up on my challenge.




 I'll wach you eat it fer shure But you are young & healthy . you go & pop it might take a couple weeks in the swamp. They are not easy like deer. Pack a lunch(weeks worth) to find sign. 4 to 6  + week cycle on the territory of preditors like this


----------



## mmwiley1040

I hunt with a couple of wildlife biologist and family owns property on the Ga. Fla line. We have out 20 cameras for 5 years now. Some in the swamp others just in timber. Not once have we had a cougar on camera. Thought I saw one about ten years ago but still no pics. Also it is genetically impossible to have a black cougar. Never been one will never be one. There are black jaugars but not in the states unless a captive cat gets out. Really, dont you think with everyone having cameras out if there were any panthers out there we would have pics. There are some in the okeefanokee (not sure about spelling) and maybe one or two scattered around Ga. but they are tan. I will eat crow when someone post a GOOD pic of one.


----------



## BobKat

Florida panther is a sub species of the mountain lion. No melanistic phase in eithe bobcat do


----------



## Redbow

Gary Mercer said:


> Back in the late 50s, my brother and I walked up on one with a dead doe back in our swamp during a squirel hunt.
> It was sorta dunn colored, not black.  My .22 felt awful small at the time.  We skeedaddled!  That cat didn't want to leave the doe.  We didn't go back for a couple of weeks, and never saw any sign after that.
> That Swamp tied into the Four Hole Swamp, and the great Santee Swamp.  So anything could have been in there.
> We had an old colored man that had lived on the place since he was born.  (A Slave by the way.)
> And, he told me about the panthers that lived in the swamp.  He said they we black and some were tan.
> That old man taught me to fish from a dugout canoe, and hunt deer with a shotgun.  And, he never lied to me once.
> He was sorta like having a very special grand-pa to a youngster.



My Grandmother was raised on the fringes of the Great Dismal Swamp in northeastern NC right after the turn of the 20th century. When I was a boy she told me many times about seeing what she called Black Panthers in that swamp where her and her Dad hunted for food. She also told me you could hear them calling at dusk and they sounded a lot like a baby crying...I still believe what my Grandmother told me about the Panthers. I could not care less if others don't believe it..


----------



## Georgia Terrapin

*I don't understand the negativity . . .*

So they're not native to GA, or not the right color, or whatever.  All it takes is one circus animal going astray, and making friends with another one or a native of a slightly different species, and then Friday night comes and drinks and a movie . . . .

Next thing you know they're as thick as Burmese Pythons in the Everglades.

A 6' alligator crawled out of the Potomac River in Maryland, right across from Mt. Vernon, in the 90's when I lived there.  A couple of blocks from where I grew up.  But they can't possibly survive up there, so it must have been an unwanted pet that had been flushed down a [really big] toilet.  Never mind that the Potomac had recently been cleaned from a continuous fish-kill into a clean fishing-guide hot spot thanks to planting hydrilla and putting oxygen back into the water (so suddenly there was food for alligators to eat).

Then the two mythical "monsters" in Lake Accotink and Four-Mile Run that had been vexing children and pets for decades turned out to be real monsters (caymans).  

Anyway, mountain lions have been sighted more than once in Cherokee County.  Twice recently by a friend and his family, and once a few years ago by my own son (followed by some other non-definitive evidence of its presence), none of whom are prone to panic or tell tall tales.  Not to mention other anecdotes told by nearby residents.

But they can't exist because they won't pose for photographs.

So suit yourselves, but I enjoy knowing they're here and I try to keep it in mind when I'm in the woods.


----------



## T.P.

I have seen black panthers on two occasions also, missed one at 40yards with a bow back in 2005. They do exist.


----------



## The Original Rooster

Sorry guys, but in the nearly 500 years that Europeans have been on this continent, there has never been one, not one, black cougar found. There are black jaguars and black leopards, but not a single black cougar. You may see a dark colored cougar, but it ain't black.


----------



## Throwback

I saw an albino painter once. It had a long tail and a swayed back

T


----------



## NCHillbilly

T.P. said:


> I have seen black panthers on two occasions also, missed one at 40yards with a bow back in 2005. They do exist.



That was a feral monkey.


----------



## Atlanta Dawg

I saw a very attractive Cougar at Publix the other day!  (Ooops-Wrong kind of Cougar  !!  )


----------



## vowell462

Early fall of 2001 I caught a glimpse of a tan colored animal ( not a deer ) moving through the brush about 100 yds from me while I was perched 20ft in a tree with a bow. I can remember specifically noting a long tail as it swayed through the sapplings with thick, but not long hair. Very " cat like". The size of the animal and the few characteristics I did see told my mind that the only explanation was a cougar. Ten Years later, Im reading in GON about a man who shot and killed one in West Point just 15 miles north of where I was hunting at the time.
I cannot sit here and say with 100% certainty that what I saw was a cat. Your eyes can deceive you in the deep dark woods, no matter how experienced you are. I remember spring turkey hunting once and saw a turned over stump in a field, and as I got closer the said stump turned around and was strutting. I didn't kill that bird, because my eyes played tricks on me.
Are there cougars that roam through Ga? Im sure there are. Not many, but no doubt the Florida strain comes through every now and then. Black ones? I need to see evidence. Just like I need to see evidence about the Rugaru or El Chipicabra. There is evidence that tan/brown cougars exist. Black? Absolutely no credible evidence at all. 
Trusting what others say they saw ive found generally doesn't work out. And its not that they meant to lie, Its just that they saw something they didnt identify correctly. Black dogs are mistaken for bears all the time. Every water snake to a lot of bass fisherman is a cottonmouth. Heck, A guy at a previous hunting club of mine claimed to kill a big timber rattler at camp. When I saw the snake it was just a large rat snake. The guy claimed that a lot of rattlesnakes don't have rattles, but that one was for sure a rattler. I didnt have the heart to tell him it was a rat snake, as he claimed to be an authority on the subject.


----------



## Gary Mercer

Still seeing them Cougars hanging around Starbucks in Peachtree City.  If I was younger, I would try to bait one.
Just sayin...


----------



## Artfuldodger

Gary Mercer said:


> Still seeing them Cougars hanging around Starbucks in Peachtree City.  If I was younger, I would try to bait one.
> Just sayin...



Those do come in various colors.

I'm just guessing. I'm too old for a Cougar too.


----------



## Gary Mercer

There seem to be a lot of variations in pigmentation in the Peachtree City Cougars, which, I suspect, makes them unique to the breed.
We, indeed, have black ones here in this little West Ga town, as well as red, dun, blonde or palomino, and a somewhat strange variation that appears to have stripes running thru it.  (I guess we could call this variation "skunk.")  They seem to roam in packs, as well as alone.  (The ones that hunt alone seem to be the most alert to an opportunity to feed.  They may represent the top of their food chain.)
Would appreciate any input from all the wildlife experts on whether these are Florida strain or true mountain lions as found out west?
Thanks,
Gary


----------



## jbird1

Gary Mercer said:


> There seem to be a lot of variations in pigmentation in the Peachtree City Cougars, which, I suspect, makes them unique to the breed.
> We, indeed, have black ones here in this little West Ga town, as well as red, dun, blonde or palomino, and a somewhat strange variation that appears to have stripes running thru it.  (I guess we could call this variation "skunk.")  They seem to roam in packs, as well as alone.  (The ones that hunt alone seem to be the most alert to an opportunity to feed.  They may represent the top of their food chain.)
> Would appreciate any input from all the wildlife experts on whether these are Florida strain or true mountain lions as found out west?
> Thanks,
> Gary



Yes, I have heard of a breeding population in that area, no doubt.


----------

