# North Korea - Heaven on Earth



## atlashunter (Feb 21, 2011)

Look at how these people have been brainwashed to give the great leader credit for anything good that happens to them, even when it comes from the hands of another man. Interesting isn't it? I think it is no different from a psychological standpoint from what theists do when they credit God with the works of men.


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## vowell462 (Feb 21, 2011)

Great Post.


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## ambush80 (Feb 21, 2011)

I can understand how the Koreans have been coerced into their submission.  It's the people who when faced with the uncertainty of life, will latch on to fantastic notions in order to not have to face the possibility of oblivion.


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## JFS (Feb 21, 2011)

Hey, at least people have actually seen Kim Jong Il


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## Thanatos (Feb 21, 2011)

You guys...you post stuff like this and then want Christians to think you are objective critical thinkers. You claim to be the ones with open minds, but you are lacking some serious rational thinking skills if you think this is a good analogy.


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## atlashunter (Feb 21, 2011)

Don't see any parallels Thanatos?


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## Thanatos (Feb 21, 2011)

Sure! I psycotic dicator rules over his people the same way the creator of the universe and time rules over us...yea i see all the parallels! Crystal clear!


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## atlashunter (Feb 21, 2011)

Look at it from the perspective of the worshipers.

You've got,

fear
submission
self deprecation
vows to kill in support of the ruler
praise and worship given for the works of someone else
promises that your children will serve and be faithful


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 21, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Sure! I psycotic dicator rules over his people the same way the creator of the universe and time rules over us...yea i see all the parallels! Crystal clear!



How about the great flood, drowning the earth's inhabitants and what not...that register at all?


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## Thanatos (Feb 21, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> How about the great flood, drowning the earth's inhabitants and what not...that register at all?



Your poking your stick at the wrong Christian. Every single man, women, and child that has been maimed, raped or murdered has been done so under God's will. I DID NOT SAY GOD DID THIS!!! It was done under his will. No man nor demon trumpts God's will. 

What all of you guys fail to grasp, or more than likely dont care about is that you are unimaginabley tiny in the process and flow of time and all the events and actions that incomass said process. 

I pray for you guys daily. All you need to do is let go of your pride.


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 21, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Every single man, women, and child that has been maimed, raped or murdered has been done so under God's will. I DID NOT SAY GOD DID THIS!!! It was done under his will. No man nor demon trumpts God's will.



You're arguing for God with this?


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 21, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Look at it from the perspective of the worshipers.
> 
> You've got,
> 
> ...



The only difference is they don't have authorities to go to in order to report people not loyal to the almighty.   If the Christian Taliban ever seizes power here, I will just have to make the most of my time in the gulag.


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> The only difference is they don't have authorities to go to in order to report people not loyal to the almighty.   If the Christian Taliban ever seizes power here, I will just have to make the most of my time in the gulag.



What the heck are you talking about?


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> You're arguing for God with this?



I have been in your shoes before and will be again in the future. I hope one day you realize that God is not something you can wrap up into a pretty box that you can use human perception and knowledge to understand. Ask your self this. If there is an omnipotent God, how much more knowledge would he have about all things created and destroyed in the past, present, future than you posses? If a being like this did exist wouldn't it be silly to sit here and writeh and shake your fist at him when things happen you can not comprehend or understand happen? 

I know this means nothing to you because it is from a "fairy tale" book. But when I think like you do (it happens too often) I am glad I found this verse to read. 


Psalm 131

A song of ascents. Of David.

 1 My heart is not proud, LORD, 
   my eyes are not haughty; 
I do not concern myself with great matters 
   or things too wonderful for me. 
2 But I have calmed and quieted my soul, 
   I am like a weaned child with its mother; 
   like a weaned child I am content. 

 3 Israel, put your hope in the LORD 
   both now and forevermore.


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> You're arguing for God with this?



I want to make sure that you understand one thing. God did not guide a child molester to his victims. God did guide a murder to kill. God did not want a women to be raped. GOD IS NOT THE AUTHOR OF SIN. God's and man's will are intertwined together. There have been many books written about this. If you truly want answers to these questions read some books instead of asking people on a hunting forum why God created (place painful expierece here). If you truly want ansers instead of trying to argue something from ignorance that is what you will do. Even then you will be left with questions, but reading a thealogon's book about freewill is 1000 times more effective than aguing with someone like me who has limited answers. Or, you can sit here and respond with snarky comments and put pictures with words on them that I saw in 1999. Your choice.


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> I want to make sure that you understand one thing. God did not guide a child molester to his victims. God did guide a murder to kill. God did not want a women to be raped.



No he just created the molester, rapist, and murderer with the knowledge of what they would do and then sits by and watches while they do it. Why does he do that if it isn't the outcome that he wants?




Thanatos said:


> GOD IS NOT THE AUTHOR OF SIN.



He is the author of all things including sin if he created everything and had the foreknowledge of what the results would be and the power to change it.


You should consider the possibility that the people on this forum are very well versed in your scriptures and that is what leads them away from the position you take.


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## stringmusic (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> He is the author of all things including sin if he created everything and had the foreknowledge of what the results would be and the power to change it.



The above statement is Pantheistic, not Christian. God gave us the free will to redefine good and evil, sin did not originate from God.


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Let's not confuse the idea of god as everything (pantheism) with a belief in a god that created everything (christianity).

According to christians god created everything including satan and satans nature and he did it knowing the outcome. If this is true then he is the author of that outcome.


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## pnome (Feb 22, 2011)

Looks like I can't add much more to this discussion.  So, I'll just use this opportunity to post my favorite North Korea meme:






Can't have a North Korea thread without it.


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## stringmusic (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Let's not confuse the idea of god as everything (pantheism) with a belief in a god that created everything (christianity).


I dont have the two confused.



> According to christians god created everything including satan and satans nature and he did it knowing the outcome. If this is true then he is the author of that outcome.


I cant give you a sufficient answer on this, I can give you my opinion, which could very well change with more knowledge on the subject. God created satan, just like you and I, with the free will to redefine good and evil. The redefinition of good and evil is the sin, which we were not forced to do. Knowing the outcome of the situation does not mean that God enforced the decisions that you,me, or satan made. God is the author of life, and humanity, but not the author of sinful decisions that we make.


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

I don't think free will helps you. If God knows what satan is going to do before he creates him or what Hitler would do before he created him, and had a choice of whether or not to create them, and having that knowledge chose to create them then it originates with him and he is responsible.

It would be like putting a gun to someones head and pulling the trigger knowing what the result will be and then saying "It's not my fault! The bullet did it!".


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 22, 2011)

pnome said:


> Looks like I can't add much more to this discussion.  So, I'll just use this opportunity to post my favorite North Korea meme:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well in that case I'll play my favorite propaganda hymn, er, uh video.  The comments at the beginning....I'll just let everyone decide if that sort of dialogue rings familiar in any way.  The song itself though...if you have to convince everyone that it's wonderful there, the women are beautiful, some stray dogs really are still alive, taters are plentiful, etc, that leads the non-gullible to believe just the opposite.  Seems kind of similar to hymns in a way.


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> I want to make sure that you understand one thing. God did not guide a child molester to his victims. God did guide a murder to kill. God did not want a women to be raped. GOD IS NOT THE AUTHOR OF SIN. God's and man's will are intertwined together. There have been many books written about this. If you truly want answers to these questions read some books instead of asking people on a hunting forum why God created (place painful expierece here). If you truly want ansers instead of trying to argue something from ignorance that is what you will do. Even then you will be left with questions, but reading a thealogon's book about freewill is 1000 times more effective than aguing with someone like me who has limited answers. Or, you can sit here and respond with snarky comments and put pictures with words on them that I saw in 1999. Your choice.



Great, but you're answering a question I did not ask.

Why did your deity drown the inhabitants of the planet?


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> Great, but you're answering a question I did not ask.
> 
> Why did your deity drown the inhabitants of the planet?



Because he hated what they became and the choices they made with their free will. So he killed all of them.


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> No he just created the molester, rapist, and murderer with the knowledge of what they would do and then sits by and watches while they do it. Why does he do that if it isn't the outcome that he wants?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You being well versed in scripture is like myself saying I understand mexican soap operas...


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> According to christians god created everything including satan and satans nature and he did it knowing the outcome. If this is true then he is the author of that outcome.



Wrong again. You do a lot of assuming and BSing to be well versed in the scripture.


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Which part of that do you think is wrong?


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Because he hated what they became and the choices they made with their free will. So he killed all of them.



If he knew the choices they would make and how he would respond why not just not create them in the first place and spare them the suffering and himself the displeasure? Plus do you really think every man woman and child on the planet (not to mention all the animals) except for one family deserved drowning?


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> If he knew the choices they would make and how he would respond why not just not create them in the first place and spare them the suffering and himself the displeasure? Plus do you really think every man woman and child on the planet (not to mention all the animals) except for one family deserved drowning?



Atlas i hear ya man. Your looking at these problems and occorances as if you have all the information needed to pass judgement on God. You do not and can not have that type of knowledge.


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Which part of that do you think is wrong?



Satan's nature.


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Satan's nature.



Really? God created satan but didn't give him his nature? Where did it come from then?


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Atlas i hear ya man. Your looking at these problems and occorances as if you have all the information needed to pass judgement on God. You do not and can not have that type of knowledge.



That cop out isn't going to fly with me. I'm going off the information given in the bible. God did have the choice to not create the people he knew he would murder. He chose the course of mass murder. That's what the book says.


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> That cop out isn't going to fly with me. I'm going off the information given in the bible. God did have the choice to not create the people he knew he would murder. He chose the course of mass murder. That's what the book says.



You are 100% right. But do you know what would have happened if he did not kill them? Yea, neither do I.


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Really? God created satan but didn't give him his nature? Where did it come from then?



Exactly! Now your getting it.


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Exactly! Now your getting it.



Where do his creations get their nature from then? Did he know what satan's nature would be before he created him?


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> You are 100% right. But do you know what would have happened if he did not kill them? Yea, neither do I.



He knew BEFORE he created them. So why create them just to turn around and murder all of them? And how are modern humans any less evil?


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Where do his creations get their nature from then? Did he know what satan's nature would be before he created him?



Our's comes from within. 

Satan was an angel. He was the grandest pharasie. 

Ezekiel 28

A Prophecy Against the King of Tyre

 1 The word of the LORD came to me: 2 “Son of man, say to the ruler of Tyre, ‘This is what the Sovereign LORD says:

   “‘In the pride of your heart
   you say, “I am a god;
I sit on the throne of a god
   in the heart of the seas.”
But you are a mere mortal and not a god,
   though you think you are as wise as a god.
3 Are you wiser than Daniel[a]?
   Is no secret hidden from you?
4 By your wisdom and understanding
   you have gained wealth for yourself
and amassed gold and silver
   in your treasuries.
5 By your great skill in trading
   you have increased your wealth,
and because of your wealth
   your heart has grown proud.

 6 “‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign LORD says:

   “‘Because you think you are wise,
   as wise as a god,
7 I am going to bring foreigners against you,
   the most ruthless of nations;
they will draw their swords against your beauty and wisdom
   and pierce your shining splendor.
8 They will bring you down to the pit,
   and you will die a violent death
   in the heart of the seas.
9 Will you then say, “I am a god,”
   in the presence of those who kill you?
You will be but a mortal, not a god,
   in the hands of those who slay you.
10 You will die the death of the uncircumcised
   at the hands of foreigners.

   I have spoken, declares the Sovereign LORD.’”

 11 The word of the LORD came to me: 12 “Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of Tyre and say to him: ‘This is what the Sovereign LORD says:

   “‘You were the seal of perfection,
   full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden,
   the garden of God;
every precious stone adorned you:
   carnelian, chrysolite and emerald,
   topaz, onyx and jasper,
   lapis lazuli, turquoise and beryl.*
Your settings and mountings[c] were made of gold;
   on the day you were created they were prepared.
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
   for so I ordained you.
You were on the holy mount of God;
   you walked among the fiery stones.
15 You were blameless in your ways
   from the day you were created
   till wickedness was found in you.
16 Through your widespread trade
   you were filled with violence,
   and you sinned.
So I drove you in disgrace from the mount of God,
   and I expelled you, guardian cherub,
   from among the fiery stones.
17 Your heart became proud
   on account of your beauty,
and you corrupted your wisdom
   because of your splendor.
So I threw you to the earth;
   I made a spectacle of you before kings.
18 By your many sins and dishonest trade
   you have desecrated your sanctuaries.
So I made a fire come out from you,
   and it consumed you,
and I reduced you to ashes on the ground
   in the sight of all who were watching.
19 All the nations who knew you
   are appalled at you;
you have come to a horrible end
   and will be no more.’”*


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## Thanatos (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> He knew BEFORE he created them. So why create them just to turn around and murder all of them? And how are modern humans any less evil?



You are trying to understand something men and women have spent their whole lives trying to solve. If you find the answers please send them over to me. If you truly want an answer get off these hunting forums and read some theology books on the subject.


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Our's comes from within.



Who created our "within"?


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## atlashunter (Feb 22, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> You are trying to understand something men and women have spent their whole lives trying to solve. If you find the answers please send them over to me. If you truly want an answer get off these hunting forums and read some theology books on the subject.



Which is it? Something people spend their whole lives trying to figure out in futility? Or something that a theology book can answer? And if you've read those answers why can't you just provide them here? The question I have asked is straight forward and simple. If God knows the destiny of one of his creations and it isn't according to his will why does he create it? If he didn't want people to burn forever then why did he create the hot place and create people he knew would be sent there?


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## StriperAddict (Feb 22, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Which is it? Something people spend their whole lives trying to figure out in futility? Or something that a theology book can answer? And if you've read those answers why can't you just provide them here? The question I have asked is straight forward and simple. If God knows the destiny of one of his creations and it isn't according to his will why does he create it? If he didn't want people to burn forever then why did he create the hot place and create people he knew would be sent there?



I understand your question(s), but they put the blame on God.  
Shouldn't every person be held to account for His decisions, the free choice to believe or not?  Also consider:
*Romans 9:20*:  Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, “Why have you made me like this?”

For the record, I'm less concerned about the Lord knowing ahead of time about the choice a person (loved one, for example) makes about God and more concerned that he/she sees the gift of life for what it is, and what power it has to set worn out sinners free.  

Also, for clarification, I would be lying if I said I didn't have objections over things I see in scripture, and in life as well.  The one beauty of believing faith for me is that grace didn't toss _all _my objections out, they just became _smaller_... especially as they are put beside the greatest love I have ever known.

Sorry for any derail...


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## Thanatos (Feb 23, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Who created our "within"?



Great question. Someone else could answer it better than me. Here is my feeble attempt. We were created to be perfect and walk WITH God. The same as Lucifer was created as the perfect angel. Through the perfection GOD GAVE HIM he became prideful and believed he was a God too. Some time before our creation Lucifer fell. God created the earth and us to show Lucifer that he is still God of all the heavens. Some how Lucifer poisoned us. Lucifer DOES NOT make us sin! Yet, he is there whispering in our ear to be like him. He tells us we need to make CHOICES like him to be rid of God because God is weak and  he is not omnipotent and all powerful. Others will be able to provide a better description, but that is a rough one you can start with.


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## Thanatos (Feb 23, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Which is it? Something people spend their whole lives trying to figure out in futility? Or something that a theology book can answer? And if you've read those answers why can't you just provide them here? The question I have asked is straight forward and simple. If God knows the destiny of one of his creations and it isn't according to his will why does he create it? If he didn't want people to burn forever then why did he create the hot place and create people he knew would be sent there?



I am sorry I did not make it clear in that post. No book you will read will give you the answer so that means I sure dont have one. But, if you truly want to get closer to a truthful objective answer get off this internet forum and find some books on the subject and read them. You will either harden your heart even more or you might get lucky and see God where you had not before...like me.


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## stringmusic (Feb 23, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Which is it? Something people spend their whole lives trying to figure out in futility? Or something that a theology book can answer? And if you've read those answers why can't you just provide them here? The question I have asked is straight forward and simple. If God knows the destiny of one of his creations and it isn't according to his will why does he create it? If he didn't want people to burn forever then why did he create the hot place and create people he knew would be sent there?



You ask questions that nobody on this earth can answer, what do you do after that, sit back and think, those dumb Christians, they don't have every answer in the world to the questions that I have, if they dont have ALL the answers that are acceptable for me, what they believe cant possibly be true?

Is this about how it goes?


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## stringmusic (Feb 23, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Because he hated what they became and the choices they made with their free will. So he killed all of them.


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 23, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Because he hated what they became and the choices they made with their free will. So he killed all of them.



Pregnant women, children, and babies too?  At any rate, when the party hates what you've become and the choices you make in North Korea, you and your entire family are placed in gulags and/or executed.  So again, I'm not getting a clear distinction between Christianity and North Korean citizenship.


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## Thanatos (Feb 23, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> Pregnant women, children, and babies too?  At any rate, when the party hates what you've become and the choices you make in North Korea, you and your entire family are placed in gulags and/or executed.  So again, I'm not getting a clear distinction between Christianity and North Korean citizenship.



Just the little difference of a totalitarian dictator versus the creator of the universes. Thats all. 

The greatest, funniest thing to me is that if God did not wipe these people out it would have changed history and you and I would not exist. Nothing like arguing to not exist!


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## ambush80 (Feb 23, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Just the little difference of a totalitarian dictator versus the creator of the universes. Thats all.
> 
> The greatest, funniest thing to me is that if God did not wipe these people out it would have changed history and you and I would not exist. Nothing like arguing to not exist!



You think that their existence directly effects your existence?

Hmm...Any evidence to support that notion, anecdotal or otherwise?  And if you can make some kind of argument that one effects the other, would it not be irrelevant to a God?

I find it so interesting that you want to make a logical argument, flawed though it may be, and mix it in with the notion of the supernatural.


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## Thanatos (Feb 23, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> You think that their existence directly effects your existence?
> 
> Hmm...Any evidence to support that notion, anecdotal or otherwise?  And if you can make some kind of argument that one effects the other, would it not be irrelevant to a God?
> 
> I find it so interesting that you want to make a logical argument, flawed though it may be, and mix it in with the notion of the supernatural.



Like I have told you before. I come from a rational, objective background. The difference is that I humble my thoughts and perspective and understand I am in no place to question my God, my Father. 

No proof of what would happen or not happen, but with ever action an object with mass makes their is a reaction no matter how simple or complicated that action is. Now add in millions of humans who are still on earth instead of dying off...im sure the coarse of history changed significantly.


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## ambush80 (Feb 23, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Like I have told you before. I come from a rational, objective background. The difference is that I humble my thoughts and perspective and understand I am in no place to question my God, my Father.
> 
> No proof of what would happen or not happen, but with ever action an object with mass makes their is a reaction no matter how simple or complicated that action is. Now add in millions of humans who are still on earth instead of dying off...im sure the coarse of history changed significantly.



Maybe if they lived dragons would have bubbled up from a volcano and burned the Earth with their fire breath.


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## Thanatos (Feb 23, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> Maybe if they lived dragons would have bubbled up from a volcano and burned the Earth with their fire breath.



Now that would have been cool! I would have been blaring Metallica while riding my scaly stead through the air and it was breathing fire on everything.

Come on Ambush...


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 23, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> The greatest, funniest thing to me is that if God did not wipe these people out it would have changed history and you and I would not exist. Nothing like arguing to not exist!



Whoah whoah whoah....Jeremiah 1:5 - Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart.  So your existence is not one massive game of plinko over the eons, if you believe the above verse.  God had you planned out since the beginning of time.  Who all drowned in the flood is irrelevant, by that rationale.  







At any rate, if I'm wrong there the other possible interpretation of your post is that it's good that everybody that died when and where they did because you were born.  Does it get more egocentric than that?


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## ambush80 (Feb 24, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Now that would have been cool! I would have been blaring Metallica while riding my scaly stead through the air and it was breathing fire on everything.
> 
> Come on Ambush...



But if it said in the Bible that fire breathing dragons existed you would believe it.......


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## stringmusic (Feb 24, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> But if it said in the Bible that fire breathing dragons existed you would believe it.......



And if the Bible stated that fire breathing dragons didnt exist, would you believe it?


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## vowell462 (Feb 24, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> And if the Bible stated that fire breathing dragons didnt exist, would you believe it?



Fire breathing dragons do exist and they are from New Jersey. Ever seen Rosie O Donnel? Proof right there.


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## ambush80 (Feb 24, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> And if the Bible stated that fire breathing dragons didnt exist, would you believe it?



I would say that based on all the other information available that the Bible got that one correct. 


Now you answer my question.  If the Bible said that fire breathing dragons existed would you believe it?


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## stringmusic (Feb 24, 2011)

vowell462 said:


> Fire breathing dragons do exist and they are from New Jersey. Ever seen Rosie O Donnel? Proof right there.



 Thats just plain funny right there.


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## stringmusic (Feb 24, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> I would say that based on all the other information available that the Bible got that one correct.


Why would you "say that"? 




> Now you answer my question.  If the Bible said that fire breathing dragons existed would you believe it?


Yes


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## ambush80 (Feb 24, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Why would you "say that"?



I would "say that" as a statement of fact.




stringmusic said:


> Yes




Knowing that, I just don't see how I can ever take you  seriously.


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## Thanatos (Feb 25, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> Whoah whoah whoah....Jeremiah 1:5 - Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart.  So your existence is not one massive game of plinko over the eons, if you believe the above verse.  God had you planned out since the beginning of time.  Who all drowned in the flood is irrelevant, by that rationale.



First, I was only answering Ambush's question. Second, who says there are not alternate universes where different actions and reactions are committed resulting in a different reality?


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## Thanatos (Feb 25, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> At any rate, if I'm wrong there the other possible interpretation of your post is that it's good that everybody that died when and where they did because you were born.  Does it get more egocentric than that?



Again, I was only pointing out the obvious to Ambush post but come on....every action and reaction that has happened since the dawn of time has put you in the position you are sitting or standing in reading this post right now.


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## Thanatos (Feb 25, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> But if it said in the Bible that fire breathing dragons existed you would believe it.......



Multiple versus in Revelations refer to a dragon. Wither God is using symbolism, or He actually meant a fracking dragon with 7 heads will show up...I am not sure. Personally I take it as the author of Revelations using symbolism as other authors have done in other books of the Bible.


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## Six million dollar ham (Feb 25, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> Again, I was only pointing out the obvious to Ambush post but come on....every action and reaction that has happened since the dawn of time has put you in the position you are sitting or standing in reading this post right now.



So you discount the Jeremiah verse as false.  God's plan was not at work?


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## Thanatos (Feb 26, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> So you discount the Jeremiah verse as false.  God's plan was not at work?



Before God created "time" he knew he would flood earth. Your verse is true.


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## JFS (Feb 26, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> who says there are not alternate universes where different actions and reactions are committed resulting in a different reality?



I hope there is one where people don't really believe Jewish folklore as fact.


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## Thanatos (Feb 26, 2011)

JFS said:


> I hope there is one where people don't really believe Jewish folklore as fact.



You are living in that one, or one of them.


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## atlashunter (Mar 6, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> You ask questions that nobody on this earth can answer, what do you do after that, sit back and think, those dumb Christians, they don't have every answer in the world to the questions that I have, if they dont have ALL the answers that are acceptable for me, what they believe cant possibly be true?
> 
> Is this about how it goes?



The questions are difficult because all of the claims about God don't hold up under close scrutiny. That doesn't make you dumb. It's less a matter of intelligence than a willingness to go where inquiry leads even if it is scary or discomforting.


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## Thanatos (Mar 6, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> The questions are difficult because all of the claims about God don't hold up under close scrutiny. That doesn't make you dumb. It's less a matter of intelligence than a willingness to go where inquiry leads even if it is scary or discomforting.



What part of your beliefs SCREAM God does not exist? Is it the thought of having faith in someone you can not see? Are you married or do you have a girl friend? Does she love you? Where is your proof?


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## atlashunter (Mar 6, 2011)

Thanatos said:


> What part of your beliefs SCREAM God does not exist?



Quite a lot. I've detailed a fair bit of it in various threads on this forum.


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