# disc harrow choice for food plots question



## sea trout

hello!!!!!!!!
I'm callin on all tractor implement knowledgeable folks who would like to share expertise with a soon to be first time tractor buyer and implement buyer!!

I want to buy my own disc harrows soon, very soon!

I'm gonna be buyin my own tractor later this fall. I will buy a 4x4 in the 38 to 44 horse power range.

Right now to work on food plots we use a FRIENDS 37HP KUBOTA 4X4 AND ANOTHER FRIENDS 42HP MAHINDRA 4X4.

BOTH TRACTORS WORK WELL WITH THE 5FT HARROWS WE BORROW. THEY HAVE A FRONT ADJUSTABLE ROW OF CUTTIN DISC AND A REAR ADJUSTABLE ROW OF CUTTIN DISK.

THEY WORK GOOD. EXCEPT FOR IN THICK BERMUDA GRASS

I'VE BEEN SHOPPIN ON CRAIGS LIST FOR MY OWN. THEY ARE USUALLY IN THE 600 DOLLAR RANGE.

I LOOKED  AT TRACTOR SUPPLY TODAY. THEY HAD A 6FT SET. The front row were cutting disc with adjustable angles.
The rear row were smoothin disk with kinda but not really adjustable angles.

So my question's are, long pre question story I know, sorry.
Is the harrows at tractor supply good, fair or poor quality?
If our food plots get plowed for spring and fall plots every year is the cutting disk up front and smoothin disk in back a good idea?
What would the difference be with two rows cutting disk and the ones with cutting front row and smoothin back row be if you were cutting new plots in new hard or grassy ground?

Thanks for any input!!!!!!!!!!
Please add anything I need to know to help me this fall!!!!


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## Rackbuster

I have a 6 ft. Taylor Way harrow with my 40 hp ferguson. I personally like the double set of scallop disc as opposed to the smooth on back. You get in rough land or grassy dirt you will appreciate the back row cutting also. I worked on a farm most of my life and we always went with scallop on all. Both sections of mine will adjust to get very aggressive and at times it is needed.


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## drawedback

If your looking at the box frame harrow at tractor supply, they look pretty well built, however I havent used one so couldn't tell you for sure. The angle framed harrow is not a good choice, it is very light duty, and probably wouldn't last many years, and definately wouldn't be heavy enough to plow up thick grass. I know your already looking at a substantial investment, but I would suggest you look at buying a sprayer as well if you have a lot of thick grass, like bermuda. I have a 20 foot cutting harrow that won't cut thick bermuda in without several passes. You won't believe how much better you can plow the ground after the grass has been burned off with a good herbicide application. The front cutting disc  on a harrow should break the ground, and let the back disc get in the ground. I have a 12 foot taylor way that I run smooth disc on the rear gangs, and it cuts just as well, the difference is in smoothing, The smooth disc can leave the field smooth as a babies behind.


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## sea trout

thanks for the info guys that I will be thinkin and talkin about!!!!!

I love to learn stuff like killin that Bermuda grass before we go over and over and over it with the harrows, thanks very much!!!


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## Forest Grump

Wow, you got a little learning curve ahead of you, but that can be a very interesting time.

TSC harrows: OK, not a bad choice for a starter set, tend to rust, decent angle adjustments, can buy them early & trade up later if you wish. Better always to buy American; but it costs more. Look for auctions, lurk on www.tractorbynet.com; learn, learn, learn. You will get a smoother result with notched front, smooth rear: TSC has that set up, but notched front & rear will work too. 

Nothing harrows grass, Brother: grass was the reason John Deere developed the plow! Little advice: Kill the grass with roundup or clethodim, 2-4 weeks before you harrow.

Angle determines aggressiveness of your disk; start with steep angles, back gangs 1 setting less than front; then straighten the Rear gangs to smooth. You MUST have a drag behind the harrow, or your result will look like crud. 

Something else: one of the most important things is WEIGHT: you need box beam construction, don't buy angle iron harrows: they will dance across the surface & you'll never get a decent seedbed.

I would buy the Kubota if you can afford it: there is a reason Kioti & Mahindras are vastly cheaper: if you rarely or lightly use them you may never know it.

Master the basics, & we'll work on refining your techniques.


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## The Longhunter

I would characterize the TSC harrows as light duty.  I bought a similar set brand new, and the u-bolts kept stretching and breaking.

Also, you will find that most harrows that you run across are light duty garden harrows.  The best harrows are an older Taylor Way or Rome Plow or such.  The will have a solid frame.

Then plan on rebuilding it with some new bearings and discs.  We have two heavy duty harrows, and we have all scallops (which we rotate every year to even out wear).  We may change the angles if we have time, but mostly we leave them in the cutting mode.  IMO smoothing discs are only good for well prepared soil where you need a good bed.


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## jesnic

I have a set of older set of Taylor Way cultivator discs with scalloped discs. Never had a problem plowing up Bermuda or any other grass. Speed is your friend. The faster I can pull it, the more grass it rips and plows under. Takes a few passes, but I have done many yards this way for new sod and many gardens, food plots this way and the grass always loses. The set I have weight approx. 500 or 600 lbs. Just remember, if you disc under grass, it will grow back, unless you kill it first. I have found that the older, heavier, uglier implements work better than new, lightweight, pretty ones.


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## Pudd82

We just got a kubota mx4700 2 wd 46 up, and a land pride dh1572(6 ft hair) in February. We've used the hair to prep about 8 acres between me and my uncle. The disc is a rock, very well built strong frame. My uncle is78 yrs old and farmed since he was a kid, he was very impressed with the how solid it was built. He was also impressed with the tractor too while rippin his garden and he's a green tractor guy. Each row of the hair is adjustable to 3 or 4 positions(can't remember),and locks in with a pin instead of a nut and bolt(saves time). It was a bit more than Craigslist stuff but when you buy new you know what your getting. Bought it from the kubota dealer for$1775. Cost alot but good piece of metal.


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## bull0ne

Serious tillage equipment...........check specs for weight. These are heavy.  But will cut up hard pan like nothing I've seen.  


http://www.brownmanufacturing.us/catalog/6


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## treehugger49

You might want to take a look here:

http://www.everythingattachments.com/

They offer some moderately priced, box-frame disks with jackscrew-adjustable gangs in several sizes.

I purchased their 7'/20 disk unit earlier this year and it pulls easily with my Kubota MX4700 4WD tractor. The disk weighs just under 800 pounds. It has seen limited use thus far, but it seems well suited to maintain my relatively small food plots and firebreaks.

Also, no "MADE IN CHINA" parts!

BTW, they also have some very informative videos for folks (like me) that could use some edumacation on implements and such.


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## chefrific

Forest Grump said:


> there is a reason Kioti & Mahindras are vastly cheaper: if you rarely or lightly use them you may never know it.



What is the issue(s) with Mahindra?


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## Ihunt

Something you may want to look into is a tiller. You have to run them slower than the harrows but they make pretty dirt.


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## grouper throat

Occassionally you will find a good quality set at farm auctions. Brown makes a good set. I like the heavier duty tuflines too.

You can cross-cut and heavily offset the harrows and get alot more of that bermuda. I use to have to deal with patches of it alot in my fields. If nothing else, gas it with the offset and throw a layer of soil over it lol


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## Crakajak

Ihunt said:


> Something you may want to look into is a tiller. You have to run them slower than the harrows but they make pretty dirt.



This is what i did.


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## 7mmMag

I use a howsk scalloped 16 disc behind 30 horse 4x4 new holland. It will tear up anything I drag it across. Best money I have ever spent on a plow.


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## DEERSLAYERJOHN

chefrific said:


> What is the issue(s) with Mahindra?



 x2


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## sea trout

Thanks very much for the info everyone!!!!!!!
Sounds like there's some good brands of box harrows out there....i'll try to find them!

So, the 37 horse Kubota 4x4 we have the fortunate luxury of borrowing sometimes has no problem pulling the 5 ft box harrows that we are also so fortunate to borrow at times.
The cutting disk on the harrows are angled aggressive and the 37 horse tractor pulls them at 2900 to 3000 rpm's very easily, with no strain. (in my not very experienced thinking that's what it appears)

So how much difference would 6 ft harrows make on a tractor that size??
The tractors I'll be choosing from this fall is a used john deere 1070 4x4 with 39hp. That's my first choice but I won't know if it's avail until sept. ( my customer has it, and if a land deal goes through for him in sept he's gonna get a bigger cab tractor)
If I cant get his my next choice would be a new Kubota L3800 or a used Kubota L4400.
How would these tractors fair with 6ft box harrows compared to 5ft?
Or would it be best to stay with 5 for any other reason?

Thanks for all the help!!!

And yes, one of the tractors we occasionally get to work on the club is a Mahindra, It works like a amazing tank!!!
Problem with them, (according to it's owners) is shops and mechanics.


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## grouper throat

Look at the difference in total weight of the harrows for a comparison. A set of 6' harrows can range alot like 800-1900 lbs.


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## mbrowland

With that horsepower you can use a 5 or 6 foot disc.    I currently have a Kubota GL3940 and use a 600 lb disc made by dirt dawg.   I got this from Mason tractor.    Do as Forest Gump suggested and spray Gly 4, the let sit for 2 weeks to disc.


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## papachaz

one thing to remember about tractors too is the tractor weight. heavier pulls implements better. go watch the everythingimplements video on pulling plows, he says in that video he'd do better pulling that double bottom plow with an 8n than with the lightweight new kubota with the hybrid ag tires he's using. 

as for width on a box blade, for what you use a box blade for, 5 ft would be ok, something like a disk or a tiller, you either want it offset to cover one of the tire tracks as you work, or wide enough to cover both, just my preference from experience. basically, don't disk with a 4 ft disk if your rear tires are 6 feet wide.......


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## elfiii

sea trout said:


> Thanks very much for the info everyone!!!!!!!
> Sounds like there's some good brands of box harrows out there....i'll try to find them!
> 
> So, the 37 horse Kubota 4x4 we have the fortunate luxury of borrowing sometimes has no problem pulling the 5 ft box harrows that we are also so fortunate to borrow at times.
> The cutting disk on the harrows are angled aggressive and the 37 horse tractor pulls them at 2900 to 3000 rpm's very easily, with no strain. (in my not very experienced thinking that's what it appears)
> 
> So how much difference would 6 ft harrows make on a tractor that size??
> The tractors I'll be choosing from this fall is a used john deere 1070 4x4 with 39hp. That's my first choice but I won't know if it's avail until sept. ( my customer has it, and if a land deal goes through for him in sept he's gonna get a bigger cab tractor)
> If I cant get his my next choice would be a new Kubota L3800 or a used Kubota L4400.
> How would these tractors fair with 6ft box harrows compared to 5ft?
> Or would it be best to stay with 5 for any other reason?
> 
> Thanks for all the help!!!
> 
> And yes, one of the tractors we occasionally get to work on the club is a Mahindra, It works like a amazing tank!!!
> Problem with them, (according to it's owners) is shops and mechanics.



"Big Green" is over priced IMHO. Look at Kubota next and if that's still too big for your wallet look at New Holland and MF. I have a New Holland TC35D. I have 5 miles of internal roads and about 5 acres total in food plots to maintain. It gets the job done in style.

For a tractor that size you will be better served with a 5' set of discs. No matter how much HP you got, the steeper you set the angles on the gangs the harder the harrow is going to be to pull, not to mention you will be putting a lot of stress on the harrow at really steep cutting angles, especially if your soil has a high clay content. You'll know the angle was too steep once you start busting bolts and bending hitch pins. When the bolts break, replace them with Grade 8 bolts. You'll figure out why. Keep in mind the tractor will most likely have a Category 1 3 point hitch so all the Cat 1 implements are going to be lightweight and won't take much abuse no matter how well they are made.

I always turn my dirt first with a middlebuster and I turn it deep and then come back with the discs. I don't have to set the angle of the gangs on the harrow near as steep to get the desired results and the job goes much faster. If the discs aren't cutting deep enough you can always throw some weight on the frame to make them "sit down" deeper. I have my front gang set moderately steep to bust up the clay clods but the back gang is almost straight. What I get as a result is dirt that is almost "seed bed" quality. I go over that with a drag harrow and I'm ready to put down seed and fertilizer.

90% of food plot success is tied directly to seed bed preparation. Nobody can convince me otherwise.

I agree TSC's implements are all light duty gear. You would be better served to take the money you save on not buying the "Big Green" tractor and spend that money on good quality implements. "Top 'O the Line" in disc harrows would most likely be Brown. Taylor-Way (now Taylor Pittsburgh) King Kutter and Howse are pretty good too.


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## Crakajak

elfiii said:


> "Big Green" is over priced IMHO. Look at Kubota next and if that's still too big for your wallet look at New Holland and MF. I have a New Holland TC35D. I have 5 miles of internal roads and about 5 acres total in food plots to maintain. It gets the job done in style.
> 
> For a tractor that size you will be better served with a 5' set of discs. No matter how much HP you got, the steeper you set the angles on the gangs the harder the harrow is going to be to pull, not to mention you will be putting a lot of stress on the harrow at really steep cutting angles, especially if your soil has a high clay content. You'll know the angle was too steep once you start busting bolts and bending hitch pins. When the bolts break, replace them with Grade 8 bolts. You'll figure out why. Keep in mind the tractor will most likely have a Category 1 3 point hitch so all the Cat 1 implements are going to be lightweight and won't take much abuse no matter how well they are made.
> 
> I always turn my dirt first with a middlebuster and I turn it deep and then come back with the discs. I don't have to set the angle of the gangs on the harrow near as steep to get the desired results and the job goes much faster. If the discs aren't cutting deep enough you can always throw some weight on the frame to make them "sit down" deeper. I have my front gang set moderately steep to bust up the clay clods but the back gang is almost straight. What I get as a result is dirt that is almost "seed bed" quality. I go over that with a drag harrow and I'm ready to put down seed and fertilizer.
> 
> 90% of food plot success is tied directly to seed bed preparation. Nobody can convince me otherwise.
> 
> I agree TSC's implements are all light duty gear. You would be better served to take the money you save on not buying the "Big Green" tractor and spend that money on good quality implements. "Top 'O the Line" in disc harrows would most likely be Brown. Taylor-Way (now Taylor Pittsburgh) King Kutter and Howse are pretty good too.



Very good advice!!!
Implements, when taken care of an used properly, doesn't break often.


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## sea trout

yes lots of good advice!!!!

thank y'all very very much!!!!


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## Milkman

Since you are in Commerce you may want to start attending the big auction sale at Carnesville every year.  It is the first Saturday in March and October annually.  I have been going for years and have purchased and sold lots of equipment there in past years.

Its at Franklin County high school at 9 AM on the days I listed above.


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## Forest Grump

elfiii said:


> "Big Green" is over priced IMHO. Look at Kubota next and if that's still too big for your wallet look at New Holland
> 
> ...spend that money on good quality implements. "Top 'O the Line" in disc harrows would most likely be Brown. Taylor-Way (now Taylor Pittsburgh) King Kutter and Howse are pretty good too.



Athens harrows are at least as good as Brown, but both will set you back multiple thousands of dollars & likely will be too heavy to pull & to lift with a small tractor. 

Oh, & King Kutter makes the Countyline equipment for TSC;   
The steel is Chinese & the welds are rough to keep the cost low, thus it is an inferior grade, but KK & howse are not much better. Kinda depends on your budget & what you are going to ask it to do. 

I'd get a Taylor-way if you can afford it, or the aforementioned www.everythingattachments.com harrow from Ted; it's well designed, & the screw adjustment for the gangs has to be used to be appreciated for how useful & ingenious it is. 



Milkman said:


> Since you are in Commerce you may want to start attending the big auction sale at Carnesville every year.  It is the first Saturday in March and October annually.  I have been going for years and have purchased and sold lots of equipment there in past years.
> 
> Its at Franklin County high school at 9 AM on the days I listed above.



Dirt dog mfg in Commerce makes some decent equipment, locally manufactured. Where they get their steel I don't know, it might come from China too, but I don't think so.

As you collect equipment, and you will--it's addictive, look for older American-made farm implements: they don't make anything anymore like they used to.


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## Stroker

After farming thousands of acres for many years I prefer the smooth disc front and rear for all field harrows, they cut sod or stubble much better and produce a much better seed bed. If it is/was newly cleared ground a bush and bog harrow with the notched blades does a better job of cutting up the roots and small saplings but we would put enough weight on it that the disc axles would drag if you let it eat. No matter on your choice but make sure it has adjustable gangs.


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## grif

Do yourself a favor and get a tiller.  I own both and have not hitched up to my harrow since I got a tiller.


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## wacknstack

PTO driven tiller. poisen and till.


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## sea trout

thanks y'all!!

I just bought my tractor this afternoon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Kubota L4600 4x4! they'll get the bucket on it and everything else ready this week and i'm gonna pick it up Saturday!! and put it straight to work!

I can still borrow harrows for now.
i'm considering the tiller over harrows for my purchase of my own.
I like the soft seed bed the tiller leaves behind.
My only concern is....if we stay at this club forever..then our plots will be fine with tiller.
If we ever change clubs and have to break new ground for plots then the cutting harrows may be needed.

I talked to a local land pride dealer and he carries nice harrows made by land pride, they are made in kansas


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## Pudd82

Congrats and welcome to orangeville. If you go with land pride you won't be disappointed. Again congrats on the purchase.


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## Forest Grump

sea trout said:


> thanks y'all!!
> 
> I just bought my tractor this afternoon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> Kubota L4600 4x4! they'll get the bucket on it and everything else ready this week and i'm gonna pick it up Saturday!! and put it straight to work!
> 
> I can still borrow harrows for now.
> i'm considering the tiller over harrows for my purchase of my own.
> I like the soft seed bed the tiller leaves behind.
> My only concern is....if we stay at this club forever..then our plots will be fine with tiller.
> If we ever change clubs and have to break new ground for plots then the cutting harrows may be needed.
> 
> I talked to a local land pride dealer and he carries nice harrows made by land pride, they are made in kansas



Landpride is excellent, very high quality equipment, & been around a good long while. Landpride has a very nice tiller too (tillers are pretty much all made in Italy). Be sure you keep the air filter clean in that orange tractor, maintain it like they recommend, & it should serve you well.

A tiller is easy to use, & makes a smooth seedbed. It has 2 drawbacks: it has limited depth and that fluffy seedbed is full of air & subject to a lot of settling. It has very little learning curve and low HP requirement, & I think is a great choice. Be sure to get one with a slip clutch to protect the driveline and if possible reverse tines, as they cut finer & bury rocks instead of leaving them on top. You can break new ground with a tiller, it's just slow.


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## Trigabby

sea trout said:


> thanks y'all!!
> 
> I just bought my tractor this afternoon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> Kubota L4600 4x4! they'll get the bucket on it and everything else ready this week and i'm gonna pick it up Saturday!! and put it straight to work!
> 
> I can still borrow harrows for now.
> i'm considering the tiller over harrows for my purchase of my own.
> I like the soft seed bed the tiller leaves behind.
> My only concern is....if we stay at this club forever..then our plots will be fine with tiller.
> If we ever change clubs and have to break new ground for plots then the cutting harrows may be needed.
> 
> I talked to a local land pride dealer and he carries nice harrows made by land pride, they are made in kansas



Great choice!!  I love my L4600 and I'm thankful for this thread because I'm in the market for a harrow, too.... 

Here's mine :


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## papachaz

I bought this 6 ft J-bar disk harrow today off craigslist for $375. My ole 55 Ford 850 is gonna work this un just fine  

here's a couple pics, the harrow, and a pic of me I didn't know my son in law took after we mowed one of our food plots today


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