# Ohh neat, our own forum...sort of....



## pnome (Sep 27, 2010)

So, why is "Apologetics" allowed here? 

The Christians get their own forum where we can't disagree, but we get our forum, where they can come to disagree.  Seems like we're getting the short end of the stick here... 

Tell ya what though.  I think I prefer it this way.

Yes.   Christian Apologists!  You are welcome to come here and try your best arguments.  

We don't need a place to hide.
We don't need a "safe room".
We don't want an echo chamber.


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## jmharris23 (Sep 27, 2010)

pnome said:


> So, why is "Apologetics" allowed here?
> 
> The Christians get their own forum where we can't disagree, but we get our forum, where they can come to disagree.  Seems like we're getting the short end of the stick here...
> 
> ...




Just a few return volleys back at ya. The Christian "safe room" will see it's share of arguments I am sure. But they will be among people who at least have some type of common ground. 

I guess it depends on what side of the fence you're on as to whether you're getting the short end of the stick....

While the Christians will undoubtedly disagree from time to time, there are many who still enjoy fellowship among like minded people without someone "more intelligent" coming in and telling them how stupid they are for having blind faith. Because that happened so regularly it was my feeling that they were getting the "short end."

The separation of the forums is designed so that someone who believes can have a discussion with another beliver without that happening... on that you are correct. 

The reason Apologetics is allowed in here is so the few of you who don't believe would have somethign to do

I am glad you like it though


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## pnome (Sep 27, 2010)

jmharris23 said:


> I am glad you like it though



I really do.  I'm not just saying that.


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## earl (Sep 27, 2010)

I don't suppose you have the stats ,in the SF , of how many Christians got banned vs how many agnostics and atheists ? Pretty telling .


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## jmharris23 (Sep 28, 2010)

earl said:


> I don't suppose you have the stats ,in the SF , of how many Christians got banned vs how many agnostics and atheists ? Pretty telling .



I do not... but it wouldnt matter anyway. There are way more believers than non believers in the forum so the chances are greater simply based on percentages.


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## earl (Sep 28, 2010)

Well...........OK.


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## dominantpredator (Oct 3, 2010)

earl said:


> I don't suppose you have the stats ,in the SF , of how many Christians got banned vs how many agnostics and atheists ? Pretty telling .



Banned from where? Here? I would be more worried about being banned from God and living eternity seperated from those I loved and that have loved me. If I am wrong than so what.....if you are wrong than....well, I guess we will see. I do not believe for a second that all of creation was an accident. Where did all these marvelous things come from? I am not so much into religion anymore. I will never lose my faith in my creator. I firmly believe that I will see my grandfather again. And my daddy will be there too. And it will all come to be, this is a promise from our Father.


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## ambush80 (Oct 3, 2010)

dominantpredator said:


> Banned from where? Here? I would be more worried about being banned from God and living eternity seperated from those I loved and that have loved me. If I am wrong than so what.....if you are wrong than....well, I guess we will see. I do not believe for a second that all of creation was an accident. Where did all these marvelous things come from? I am not so much into religion anymore. I will never lose my faith in my creator. I firmly believe that I will see my grandfather again. And my daddy will be there too. And it will all come to be, this is a promise from our Father.



Why are you not afraid to go to Samsara, the He11 of the Buddhists or to the He11 of the Muslims.  Because you think they are full of it, right?  That's how I feel about all of them.

I am soooo not afraid of your He11 any more than anyone else's.  You guys sound like scaredy cats.


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## earl (Oct 3, 2010)

There are a few differences of opinion on whether you will even recognize your loved ones . You are supposed to be spending all your time worshiping God aren't you ?

My comment on banning was a jab at the temperament of Christians . You must have missed my post re humor.


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## jason4445 (Oct 4, 2010)

Mark Twain visited Hawaii and commented on what a delightful happy people they were - that they lived and died for thousands of years knowing nothing of he!!


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## AbnormalEKG (Oct 4, 2010)




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## ted_BSR (Oct 5, 2010)

earl said:


> I don't suppose you have the stats ,in the SF , of how many Christians got banned vs how many agnostics and atheists ? Pretty telling .



Yeah, the truth will get you banned.  The bible says we will be outcast, made fun of, persecuted.  Thanks for the affirmation!!!


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## atlashunter (Oct 12, 2017)

jmharris23 said:


> Just a few return volleys back at ya. The Christian "safe room" will see it's share of arguments I am sure. But they will be among people who at least have some type of common ground.
> 
> I guess it depends on what side of the fence you're on as to whether you're getting the short end of the stick....
> 
> ...



^Sounds like a safe space to me. But I don't begrudge them that if that is what they need. And the apologists are welcome down here with the more intelligent.


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## Israel (Oct 13, 2017)

atlashunter said:


> ^Sounds like a safe space to me. But I don't begrudge them that if that is what they need. And the apologists are welcome down here with the more intelligent.


 

LOL...now that's funny, no matter who you are.

My intelligence almost took affront, it was surely ready to...

Thanks for the heads up.


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## Browning Slayer (Nov 8, 2017)

pnome said:


> Seems like we're getting the short end of the stick here...



Atheists should be used to getting the short end of the stick. You all do in the end.


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## pnome (Nov 9, 2017)

Browning Slayer said:


> Atheists should be used to getting the short end of the stick. You all do in the end.



Atlashunter neco-posted this old thread from long long ago.  I'm not even an atheist anymore.


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## j_seph (Nov 9, 2017)

pnome said:


> Atlashunter neco-posted this old thread from long long ago.  I'm not even an atheist anymore.


Please do tell


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## SemperFiDawg (Nov 9, 2017)

pnome said:


> Atlashunter neco-posted this old thread from long long ago.  I'm not even an atheist anymore.



Yes.  Please share.


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## formula1 (Nov 9, 2017)

*Re:*



j_seph said:


> Please do tell



Yes, please!  Curious how far down the road you have gone!


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## pnome (Nov 15, 2017)

We had a big old thread about it a long time ago:

http://forum.gon.com/showthread.php?t=616115


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## atlashunter (Nov 15, 2017)

So are you speaking in tongues now?


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## pnome (Nov 21, 2017)

atlashunter said:


> So are you speaking in tongues now?



No, I only communicate through interpretative dance now.... and keyboards.


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## Artfuldodger (Nov 21, 2017)

pnome said:


> No, I only communicate through interpretative dance now.... and keyboards.



Have you developed a belief in a particular God such as the God of Abraham?


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## pnome (Nov 27, 2017)

Artfuldodger said:


> Have you developed a belief in a particular God such as the God of Abraham?



No.


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## Israel (Oct 26, 2018)

pnome said:


> So, why is "Apologetics" allowed here?
> 
> The Christians get their own forum where we can't disagree, but we get our forum, where they can come to disagree.  Seems like we're getting the short end of the stick here...
> 
> ...



I guess there was a time before the Earth cooled that there was no provision for A/A in the "spiritual forum". Pnome, who has "gone on" in whatever measure, was at the time a little puzzled as to the inclusion of the third "A".

Be that as it may, whether there be three "A"s or more, I cannot help but wonder upon what grounds any A/A would either find place for umbrage, or place for plea of inclusion to what they appear to nominally refute...the matter of spirit.

I think I could understand some agitation for a separate "Non-Spiritual" forum, or an "Anti-Spiritual" forum (though I understand that could well incite the response "we are not anti anything, we do not set ourselves to be "antis" to what we _a priori_ do not accept as extant) 

But, to be truthful...if anyone on here has ever told the truth...that's not the truth either. For almost to a man, each who participates as the first 2/3 of the AAA, has some claim to once being a part of what they now claim to _not be _"anti" to, just no longer a part of a thing that "doesn't exist" as a true thing; and that being of "the household of faith". (So maybe a 4th A is indeed called for...Apostates) It is not derogatory, I truly don't recall interacting with anyone who has said "I have been an atheist since birth". 
I don't know all the mental gymnastics required to hold that "once I too was very deceived and held completely in a lie...but _I got myself_ out of it" Is that by "anti-divine intervention"?

But of course apostates wouldn't see themselves as such...they are merely...enlightened.

But I also understand some provision could be argued for the "Spiritual Atheist/Agnostic" section of a specifically spiritual forum. After all, if you Google "the spiritual atheist" there are a few entries. But then I imagine, would come those who could argue some departure from the one "true anti-faith" to deride those who claimed to be _spiritual_ in whatever measure.

Some have had a laugh at what goes on in the "upstairs" in a seeming divisiveness leading to argument, and I don't think it takes a great deal of imagination what flood gates could be opened among those who would claim to be "spiritual atheists/agnostics" when seeking to either maintain that assertion or explain to a _truer atheist _(or one who at least sees himself as such) the validity of their occupation. Seems the spectrum could then become at least as varied as some seem to find in_ that_ "upstairs".

Assertions meet with much derision. The old "I have proof for what I say, you are simply asserting something...and that emptily" No, not really. You are simply asserting a refutation to assertion in delusion to what you believe to be "weight" on your side...which ultimately is shown to be nothing more that the weight of multiple opinion...asserted.

But this is always so. Assertion comes and then answer to it. The "science" that is much touted is indeed touted to this _particular practice_ continually, being willing to always "test" previous assertions. But science doesn't really do that, at all, men do. (is that too fine a point? Too subtle for some?) Men use "a" science ( does that "a" become too subtle?) to their discoveries. So that even "in science" (to whatever persuasion that "a" conforms ) there exists, and is said, "such and such is good science...while there exists such that is bad". Science...in whatever form then has taken on its own notions of purity and self admittedly can only approach a _notion of purity _at best_ if submitting_ in truth always to its own testing. That is where the "purity" notions clash among all sciences (and what may be discerened then as "good" or "bad")...what leaves itself always open to all testing to its foundation for a non biased disclosure of its essence, (if you will, spirit) letting the chips fall where they may.

I submit/assert all men's "science", (my own no less included) is response to first assertion made. But then, if my assertion is true that "science" of itself does nothing...but is merely a tool in a man's hand that he uses "to know"...then the man will find that as his science is tested...it's not really the tool being examined...but himself.

So, the tool of the A/A/A forum that men _presume_ in use to expression, is its foundation...faulty? Let the chips fall where they may. Are you...a "spiritual atheist"?

If so, then your spirit/essence...is for the examination and disclosure no less than any "found upstairs".

Is your "science" faulty? Then know where the fault is really being found.

I assert a covering for that.
And my own, no less.


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## SemperFiDawg (Oct 26, 2018)

pnome said:


> We don't want an echo chamber.



Apparently you’re new here because that’s all that this place is, a graveyard of thoughtless , empty, dead memes.   Ooops.  Old thread .  Pnome isn’t an atheist anymore.  Welp, there goes another couple memes.


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## pnome (Oct 26, 2018)

SemperFiDawg said:


> Apparently you’re new here because that’s all that this place is, a graveyard of thoughtless , empty, dead memes.   Ooops.  Old thread .  Pnome isn’t an atheist anymore.  Welp, there goes another couple memes.


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## ambush80 (Oct 27, 2018)

pnome said:


>



Is that funny to you for the same reason that it's funny to me?


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## 1eyefishing (Oct 27, 2018)

Although I don't consider myself an atheist (more agnostic/searcher, but would refer to myself as 'christian'), I am very spiritual.
I wounder if after i die, it will be alot like before I was born.
I have the hope, try to maintain the faith, lookiing for belief, but have a hard time believing without evidence. Won't have the knowledge til after I get there.


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## 1eyefishing (Oct 27, 2018)

Can an atheist not believe in life after death?
Could be some kind of scientific possibility...


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## gemcgrew (Oct 27, 2018)

1eyefishing said:


> Can an atheist not believe in life after death?
> Could be some kind of scientific possibility...


Some do. Their belief is usually based upon anecdotal evidence.


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## WaltL1 (Oct 27, 2018)

1eyefishing said:


> Can an atheist not believe in life after death?
> Could be some kind of scientific possibility...


I would think that as long as you don't believe that life after death is connected to a god in any way, then yes.
Atheism is a lack of belief in gods. The End.


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## pnome (Oct 27, 2018)

ambush80 said:


> Is that funny to you for the same raeson that it's funny to me?




I don't know.  It was the "Apparently you're new here" that got me to giggle.


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## Artfuldodger (Oct 27, 2018)

WaltL1 said:


> I would think that as long as you don't believe that life after death is connected to a god in any way, then yes.
> Atheism is a lack of belief in gods. The End.



Yes if one thought it related to the energy that he came from at creation. They he would return to that energy. 
I've heard people think that but I don't know if they believe they will retain their identity.

What good would eternal life be if you didn't live as who you are?


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## Artfuldodger (Oct 27, 2018)

pnome said:


> I don't know.  It was the "Apparently you're new here" that got me to giggle.



Care to share your spiritual progression? I think many Christians are glad you've made the first step. That now that you are no longer an Atheist, you may one day transcend to a belief in Christianity. Your conversion will be easier now. Maybe.
At the very least you are no longer one of "them."(lol)


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## Israel (Oct 27, 2018)

Artfuldodger said:


> Yes if one thought it related to the energy that he came from at creation. They he would return to that energy.
> I've heard people think that but I don't know if they believe they will retain their identity.
> 
> What good would eternal life be if you didn't live as who you are?



If identity is a given thing, not an assumed thing...then is not our faith that the Giver of identity is truly the only one ever securing it?


I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Is Paul, a spiritual man, experiencing that? A simultaneous and _seeming_ loss but only to a further establishment?

I don't think it's "_mere_" poetry to be "lost in love". Neither do I believe that one who has had even the slightest taste (even if only of earthen matters) doubts the power of it.

Yet, how much more then...is the love of God...when revealed to that discovery to be "first" toward a man? All that the Father speaks to (and of) His Christ...is heard inside the Christ. And so then is all response from that inside.

Deep calls to deep.


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## ambush80 (Oct 27, 2018)

1eyefishing said:


> Can an atheist not believe in life after death?
> Could be some kind of scientific possibility...



I had an idea for a movie once.  The premise was that a guy was about to die violently, maybe shot or in a car crash and some kind of "Quantum Event" happened at that moment and he was able access other dimensions of the Multiverse.  I didn't get much further on the script, but imagine if that story were 5,000 years old.  Would people be more likely to believe it?


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## 1eyefishing (Oct 27, 2018)

1eyefishing said:


> Can an atheist not believe in life after death?
> Could be some kind of scientific possibility...



...If in fact there is life after death, could it have a scientific explanation? Just a scientific reality that hasn't been 'discovered' yet?
Wouldn't THAT be the ultimate revelation and reconsiliation of both science and religion.
But how do we find out?
Until we do, the argument will continue...


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## ambush80 (Oct 27, 2018)

1eyefishing said:


> ...If in fact there is life after death, could it have a scientific explanation? Just a scientific reality that hasn't been 'discovered' yet?
> Wouldn't THAT be the ultimate revelation and reconsiliation of both science and religion.
> But how do we find out?
> Until we do, the argument will continue...



I'd be happy to see people trying to explain resurrections scientifically.


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## 1eyefishing (Oct 27, 2018)

ambush80 said:


> I'd be happy to see people trying to explain resurrections scientifically.


They prolly already do, but from a religious viewpoint.
I'd be more interested in the scientific viewpoint.


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## ambush80 (Oct 27, 2018)

1eyefishing said:


> They prolly already do, but from a religious viewpoint.
> I'd be more interested in the scientific viewpoint.




Me too. I wonder why nobody does it?


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## pnome (Oct 28, 2018)

Artfuldodger said:


> Care to share your spiritual progression?



I still haven't made it to an "Interventionist God" yet.   Though, I do think much more highly of Christianity then when I first made this post.


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## Artfuldodger (Oct 28, 2018)

pnome said:


> I still haven't made it to an "Interventionist God" yet.   Though, I do think much more highly of Christianity then when I first made this post.



Thanks for sharing. Perhaps God as Creator. He got the ball rolling by creating and then turned it over to free will and happenstance.

Also maybe God as providing a dwelling place for his created beings once they leave this world.


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## Israel (Oct 29, 2018)

pnome said:


> I still haven't made it to an "Interventionist God" yet.   Though, I do think much more highly of Christianity then when I first made this post.





Artfuldodger said:


> Thanks for sharing. Perhaps God as Creator. He got the ball rolling by creating and then turned it over to free will and happenstance.
> 
> Also maybe God as providing a dwelling place for his created beings once they leave this world.



If intent/purpose _is established_ in "rolling the ball" what in the creating/creation _is ever _apart from that?
So, either way...


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