# Israel war with Iran this summer?



## BeenHuntn (Mar 2, 2010)

is war coming soon? or is the iran prez just a complete maniac?  IF this were to actually happen... would it lead to WW3 ? or would it just be a regional war between neighbors?

War Council Convened In Damascus Past Friday To Prepare For Israeli Strike, Iran President Expects War "Between Spring And Summer"
Submitted by Tyler Durden on 03/01/2010 12:22 -0500

Abu Dhabi Iran Israel Middle East Newspaper 

Abu Dhabi Media website The National has disclosed some rather disturbing news about peace "prospects" in the middle east. 

It appears this past Friday saw a war council convene in Damascus, between Syrian president Bashar al Assad, Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hizbollah chief Hassan Nasrallah to "devise counterattack plans and assign tasks in the event of an Israeli offensive on one or all parties, wrote Abdelbari Atwan, the editor-in-chief of the pan-Arab newspaper Al Quds al Arabi." And more troublingly, "the Iranian president said he expects war to break out somewhere between spring and summer of this year. 

Meanwhile, the Hizbollah chief vowed to strike the Israeli capital, its airports and power stations if Israel dared to attack Beirut’s critical infrastructure."Let's recall that Goldman's most recent 2010 and 2011 WTI estimates call for prices to rise to $90 and $110/bbl, respectively.

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/wa...re-israeli-strike-iran-president-expects-war-


a similar article...

Jerusalem teeters on the brink of violent explosion!

http://www.israeltoday.co.il/default.aspx?tabid=178&nid=20659


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## Lowjack (Mar 2, 2010)

In The Fall, so says the Gematria of the year 5770.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 2, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> In The Fall, so says the Gematria of the year 5770.



in the fall this year??  please explain lj, if you would please. i, being redneck instead of jewish...  dont know about this gematria stuff...  help out a redneck would ya?  

hopefully your gematria stuff is a little more accurate than hitler and muhammad being the beasts...


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## Lowjack (Mar 2, 2010)

5770 Spells in Hebrew, "Path of The Messiah"The date is found in Deuteronomy(Corrected By "Israel") 32 , it shows 5770 as a troubling year for the World and for Israel as a war year beginning in the fall of 5770, it reads as Disasters, wars and Conflicts.
Cannot be read in English only in Hebrew.
There are some Parashats by Rabbis such as Maimonides that lived a very long time ago and he explains it.

Then The Messiah comes.

Praise be Abba as we count the hours.

Can wait for the skeptics comments.
Keep waiting for the last antichrist as we do war with him, yet some of you are so blind you can't see him.


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## creation's_cause (Mar 3, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> 5770 Spells in Hebrew, "Path of The Messiah"The date is found in Leviticus 32 , it shows 5770 as a troubling year for the World and for Israel as a war year beginning in the fall of 5770, it reads as Disasters, wars and Conflicts.
> Cannot be read in English only in Hebrew.
> There are some Parashats by Rabbis such as Maimonides that lived a very long time ago and he explains it.
> 
> ...



Not sure how helpful that was for "rednecks" or anyone else


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## thedeacon (Mar 3, 2010)

All I can say is WOW and hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


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## Israel (Mar 3, 2010)

I don't see a Leviticus 32.
Maybe Deut? or another of the Pentateuch?


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## possum steak (Mar 3, 2010)

That is one thing that none of us want, even here. Liberal Michael Moore made the statement concerning Iraq that the U.S. should let Israel send some jets over to Iraq & let them take care of them. Little does the fat guy know that his scenario would set off an even BIGGER world war.

History, I'm sure you all know or at least be reminded:

Gulf War, 1992. Hussein kept sending the scud missles to Israel. Why you ask? 
Simply, the coalition had nations such as Syria, Egypt, Saudi Arabia & more Muslim dominated nations in the mix.

Hussein KNEW if he could draw Israel into retaliating against Iraq, that it would offset the coalition BECAUSE the number 1 denominator of ALL of Muslim countries, is there hatred of Jews. 

Dad Bush pleaded with Israel to let the coalition to let us set up Patriot Missles in Israel & let us man them. This of course as history testifies, worked very well.


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## earl (Mar 3, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> 5770 Spells in Hebrew, "Path of The Messiah"The date is found in Leviticus 32 , it shows 5770 as a troubling year for the World and for Israel as a war year beginning in the fall of 5770, it reads as Disasters, wars and Conflicts.
> Cannot be read in English only in Hebrew.
> There are some Parashats by Rabbis such as Maimonides that lived a very long time ago and he explains it.
> 
> ...





It is truly a shame when a representative of one of the sectors of the world's population is unable and apparently incapable of finding the words to express his opinions. An otherwise interesting discussion is lost on 99 % of the world . Whether it is a lack of education , limited vocabulary,arrogance , or  simply laziness the speaker cannot or will not put the required effort into converting his thoughts into easily understood words.  
Even sensory deprived children , some as deprived as the famous Hlen Keller ,who could neither speak or see ,have learned to communicate their thoughts, wants ,and desires ,through different methods. Deaf mutes are capable of living productive ,useful lives today due to some one else being able to find and refine a means of communicating their language to them. ASL , and Braille are just two of thesee methods. You do not need to be highly educated ,or study for years to understand and use them. They can be taught to very young children. They can be taught to children that have other developmental problems.
It is unbeleibvable that God ,Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit all speak in a language that can not be thoroughly understood by 99% of the world. It is beleivable that a false prophet would attempt to lead you to beleive what he preaches because only he has the ability to tell you what God wrote only for Hebrew eyes,ears , and minds.

Isn't it wonderful that LJ takes the time to keep this forum straight ,not only on what the bible says , but what it's words mean. Thank you LJ. Without you ,we would be lost.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 3, 2010)

earl said:


> It is truly a shame when a representative of one of the sectors of the world's population is unable and apparently incapable of finding the words to express his opinions. An otherwise interesting discussion is lost on 99 % of the world . Whether it is a lack of education , limited vocabulary,arrogance , or  simply laziness the speaker cannot or will not put the required effort into converting his thoughts into easily understood words.
> Even sensory deprived children , some as deprived as the famous Hlen Keller ,who could neither speak or see ,have learned to communicate their thoughts, wants ,and desires ,through different methods. Deaf mutes are capable of living productive ,useful lives today due to some one else being able to find and refine a means of communicating their language to them. ASL , and Braille are just two of thesee methods. You do not need to be highly educated ,or study for years to understand and use them. They can be taught to very young children. They can be taught to children that have other developmental problems.
> It is unbeleibvable that God ,Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit all speak in a language that can not be thoroughly understood by 99% of the world. It is beleivable that a false prophet would attempt to lead you to beleive what he preaches because only he has the ability to tell you what God wrote only for Hebrew eyes,ears , and minds.
> 
> Isn't it wonderful that LJ takes the time to keep this forum straight ,not only on what the bible says , but what it's words mean. Thank you LJ. Without you ,we would be lost.




earl, stop hanging out with dio...  
and lowjack is not your enemy... satan is...


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## Randy (Mar 3, 2010)

I don't know, I can't control any of it so why do I even care or worry?  God is in control, I am a Christian and I am going fishing until God calls me home.


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## earl (Mar 3, 2010)

BeenHuntn said:


> earl, stop hanging out with dio...
> and lowjack is not your enemy... satan is...





While not agreeing with all he says , I think Dio is quite interesting and you have to admit ,he has a way with words.
I hope LJ is not my enemy ,nor do I feel he is mine. His arrogance is his enemy  imho. I take it you bought his Mohammed and Hitler revelation .


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## earl (Mar 3, 2010)

In plain ,nonderogatory English ...
5770 is the year starting on Sept.18 2009 and ending on Sept. 18 2010. It is like the Mayan 2012. See this link for an English language site .
http://www.gawkk.com/world-war-3-to-start-in-hebrew-year-5770-2009/discuss

It is just one of many that you can read and understand in plain ENGLISH


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## centerpin fan (Mar 3, 2010)

Randy said:


> God is in control, I am a Christian and I am going fishing until God calls me home.



Words to live by.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 3, 2010)

earl said:


> While not agreeing with all he says , I think Dio is quite interesting and you have to admit ,he has a way with words.
> I hope LJ is not my enemy ,nor do I feel he is mine. His arrogance is his enemy  imho. I take it you bought his Mohammed and Hitler revelation .



he does have a way with words... dio could be israel's unsaved little brother...


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 3, 2010)

earl said:


> In plain ,nonderogatory English ...
> 5770 is the year starting on Sept.18 2009 and ending on Sept. 18 2010. It is like the Mayan 2012. See this link for an English language site .
> http://www.gawkk.com/world-war-3-to-start-in-hebrew-year-5770-2009/discuss
> 
> It is just one of many that you can read and understand in plain ENGLISH



some prophet lowjack is... he knew wwIII was starting in a few months and he hasn't even warned anyone...


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## earl (Mar 3, 2010)

1 Corinthians 13
 1Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 

 2And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing


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## The Original Rooster (Mar 3, 2010)

earl said:


> In plain ,nonderogatory English ...
> 5770 is the year starting on Sept.18 2009 and ending on Sept. 18 2010. It is like the Mayan 2012. See this link for an English language site .
> http://www.gawkk.com/world-war-3-to-start-in-hebrew-year-5770-2009/discuss
> 
> It is just one of many that you can read and understand in plain ENGLISH



Thank you earl! A date in plain English is what I want.

I guess now we'll see if this stuff is prophetic or not. Frankly, I don't believe anyone knows the day of the second coming, future wars, etc...


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## Lowjack (Mar 3, 2010)

Israel said:


> I don't see a Leviticus 32.
> Maybe Deut? or another of the Pentateuch?



Yes Thank You, I was thinking of something else in Leviticus, but I'll leave it at that , since no one comprehends how we read the bible in the original language, metaphysicaly and multidimensionaly.


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## Lowjack (Mar 3, 2010)

earl said:


> It is truly a shame when a representative of one of the sectors of the world's population is unable and apparently incapable of finding the words to express his opinions. An otherwise interesting discussion is lost on 99 % of the world . Whether it is a lack of education , limited vocabulary,arrogance , or  simply laziness the speaker cannot or will not put the required effort into converting his thoughts into easily understood words.
> Even sensory deprived children , some as deprived as the famous Hlen Keller ,who could neither speak or see ,have learned to communicate their thoughts, wants ,and desires ,through different methods. Deaf mutes are capable of living productive ,useful lives today due to some one else being able to find and refine a means of communicating their language to them. ASL , and Braille are just two of thesee methods. You do not need to be highly educated ,or study for years to understand and use them. They can be taught to very young children. They can be taught to children that have other developmental problems.
> It is unbeleibvable that God ,Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit all speak in a language that can not be thoroughly understood by 99% of the world. It is beleivable that a false prophet would attempt to lead you to beleive what he preaches because only he has the ability to tell you what God wrote only for Hebrew eyes,ears , and minds.
> 
> Isn't it wonderful that LJ takes the time to keep this forum straight ,not only on what the bible says , but what it's words mean. Thank you LJ. Without you ,we would be lost.



I guess I'm not as educated as you are in these manners, so we need someone like you to explain what a Book written not in your language says.
How about it why don't you enlighten us, instead of being a critic , why don't you teach us, How Hebrew is written and read in Multifaceted and Numerology, Start by telling us how God instructed Moses into Writing the Torah in a Metrix, that should be simple enough for a man with your wit.


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## Ronnie T (Mar 3, 2010)

Randy said:


> I don't know, I can't control any of it so why do I even care or worry?  God is in control, I am a Christian and I am going fishing until God calls me home.



Praise God and pass the bag of flukes.


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## Lowjack (Mar 3, 2010)

BeenHuntn said:


> some prophet lowjack is... he knew wwIII was starting in a few months and he hasn't even warned anyone...



The Sooner you understand that Israel Is the Apple of His Eye and that his revelations are for Israel and Israel is God's Calendar and Clock, the better your understanding will become.
Doesn't say anything about World war 3, that is humanistic Theology, it says Conflicts and wars, disasters.


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## thedeacon (Mar 3, 2010)

Jesus Comforts His Disciples  John the 14th chapter

1“Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in Goda; trust also in me. 2In my Father’s house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. 3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. 4You know the way to the place where I am going.” 

Jesus the Way to the Father

5Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?” 

6Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7If you really knew me, you would knowb my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” 

8Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.” 

9Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves. 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. 14You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it. 

Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit

15“If you love me, you will obey what I command. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will bec in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him.” 

22Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?” 

23Jesus replied, “If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. 24He who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me. 

25“All this I have spoken while still with you. 26But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. 27Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid. 

28“You heard me say, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I. 29I have told you now before it happens, so that when it does happen you will believe. 30I will not speak with you much longer, for the prince of this world is coming. He has no hold on me, 31but the world must learn that I love the Father and that I do exactly what my Father has commanded me.

“Come now; let us leave.
*****************************************************
I read this and it comforts me as to what is to come, especially when Jesus says.

"Let not your heart be troubled"  sometimes I think we are to busy looking for the terrible we fail to see the beauty.

The Scribes and the Pharisees Looked back at the law and thought they had all the answers amd look at what Jesus had to say about them. 

I look back at the Jews and they don't have that good a track record of understanding or even obeying what God wants them to do.

Just because you are raised a Jew doesn't mean you have an insight to the future or a bigger mansion in heaven. In fact I think maybe it may be a detriment. God says I will come as a thief in the night and people all over the world are just looking over that scripture. They have figured out when they are going to be robbed. Well the way I see it, it won't be robbery it will be a gift.

I am sure some here that think they have a greater insite on this and can look through what God said and read the signs and wonders and give us all insight to what is in the mind of God. 

But frankly " I myself doubt that" 

Is there going to be war in Israel this summer, this fall, next spring or any other time?

HELLO

Has Israel not been fighting someone in the middle east for many many years. 

So you go ahead and stand on the street corner and shout out your prophecies and speak in tounge's that we don't understand and then call us "ignorant rednecks" which I am not, call us "lazy" which I am not", or "incapable" of finding the words to "express" his "opinions". which I can very well, "thank you". An otherwise interesting discussion is lost on 99 % of the world . Come on "99% of the people do not understand how to be saved".

"Whether it is a lack of education , limited vocabulary,arrogance , or simply laziness the speaker cannot or will not put the required effort into converting his thoughts into easily understood words."

Where does the arrogance end.

Who is calling the kettle black.

I think that what we have forgotten is, even though there is a lot in the written word of God that is hard for the common man to understand, God does not look as us as lazy and "ignernt". He has given us all we need that is so simple that even a little chiled can understand it.

If God has already decided when Israel is going to fight, maybe just maybe we should be putting our effort into NEW TESTIMENT CHRISTIANITY, instead of spouting prophesies about the plight of modern Israel.

As for me, I will serve the Lord and trust that if I follow him as a christian I can be assured that Christ was talking to me just as he was talking to his apostles when he said

LET NOT YOUR HEART BE TROUBLED because I cannot and would not want to change the plan of God.


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## earl (Mar 3, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> I guess I'm not as educated as you are in these manners, so we need someone like you to explain what a Book written not in your language says.
> How about it why don't you enlighten us, instead of being a critic , why don't you teach us, How Hebrew is written and read in Multifaceted and Numerology, Start by telling us how God instructed Moses into Writing the Torah in a Metrix, that should be simple enough for a man with your wit.



 My friend ,I have never claimed to be an authority on the Hebrew language. My point is that if any man can understand it, any other man can learn it. To say something can not be understood in English can be interpreted as an inablity to communicate , a desire to appear superior and mysterious , or just plain arrogance. Do you really think that the Creator of all things would speak in a language that only a few can understand ? 
 For a man who claims the benefits of a foreign language to ''hide his light under a bushel'' is an affront to God if I read 1 Corinthians 13 and James 3 correctly.
Christ had a problem with the priests of his day with the superior attitude that they alone knew the words of God. Or did I missinterpret that also ?
 Perhaps you may want to review a few verses on how ''aliens ''are to be treated. Bible gateway is an excellent resource.


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## Lowjack (Mar 3, 2010)

earl said:


> My friend ,I have never claimed to be an authority on the Hebrew language. My point is that if any man can understand it, any other man can learn it. To say something can not be understood in English can be interpreted as an inablity to communicate , a desire to appear superior and mysterious , or just plain arrogance. Do you really think that the Creator of all things would speak in a language that only a few can understand ?
> For a man who claims the benefits of a foreign language to ''hide his light under a bushel'' is an affront to God if I read 1 Corinthians 13 and James 3 correctly.
> Christ had a problem with the priests of his day with the superior attitude that they alone knew the words of God. Or did I missinterpret that also ?
> Perhaps you may want to review a few verses on how ''aliens ''are to be treated. Bible gateway is an excellent resource.



Well do you understand the Original Language ? if so how was it written, can it be read in several ways ? why did God take the time to dictate the scripture in a metrix that took 5 thousand years to come up with an invention of a machine that uses this type of metrix style of writing.
Thus discovering that Hebrew can be read either left to right , or up and down or corner to corner, thus revealing that one book is NOT one but many books in one, but I guess you knew that, you just kept it to yourself.

I find your objections very envious and the only arrogance around here is yours.


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## Lowjack (Mar 3, 2010)

thedeacon said:


> Jesus Comforts His Disciples  John the 14th chapter
> 
> 1“Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in Goda; trust also in me. 2In my Father’s house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. 3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. 4You know the way to the place where I am going.”
> 
> ...



Many words just to tell me Jews don't understand the scriptures, I believe Jews do have more insight on the word than you can ever begin to have, now as far as interpretation according to the church theology , I'm sure they don't understand as much as you might, but a Jew who has Christ and has the holy Spirit is not the same as a Jew or "Christian that uses the Bible for a paper weight.
Frankly, I think is better if I don't try to teach anymore in here, Jesus told his disciples to go into Cities and teach the gospel if they are well receive to bless the place, if they are not well receive to dust the feet and leave, so I'll leave you all to your own interpretations, and may you find peace.
Frankly a Spiritual discussion site , with non spiritual people allowed to mock is not a place I want to be.
Just like in heaven there is no place for them either.

Shalom


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 3, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> The Sooner you understand that Israel Is the Apple of His Eye and that his revelations are for Israel and Israel is God's Calendar and Clock, the better your understanding will become.
> Doesn't say anything about World war 3, that is humanistic Theology, it says Conflicts and wars, disasters.



ww3 would be a war. you're being technical...

i think it would be  more accurate had you said, "israel (the people of) was the apple of His eye..."  it is an impossibility to be the apple of God's eye and reject His Son...  Jesus would not have called the jewish leaders, snakes, vipers, hypocrites, etc, if they were the apple of His eye...

also, His revelations are for Christians, either jew or gentile. there are not 2 ways to heaven... John 10:1


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## christianhunter (Mar 3, 2010)

The Bible codes are a Miracle,and some may be missing your point.The Codes they are discovering give days,dates,and names to go with the events.They are only in The Hebrew text,and are specific.So confirming THE HOLY WORD Of GOD is a Living WORD.You do give us cliff hangers Brother,but with the attacks you get,I can understand your frustration.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 3, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> Many words just to tell me Jews don't understand the scriptures,
> 
> 
> 
> ...




not if they reject Christ...  insight on the Word, means nothing if you're on your way to helll.


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## Bottle Hunter (Mar 3, 2010)

Praise be Abba as we count the hours.

Gods a Swedish rock group?


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## christianhunter (Mar 3, 2010)

Bottle Hunter said:


> Praise be Abba as we count the hours.
> 
> Gods a Swedish rock group?



A little childish don't you think?
Abba Father is in Scripture,it is a closer way to say Father.Something like Daddy in English,if I'm not mistaken.


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## Israel (Mar 3, 2010)

christianhunter said:


> A little childish don't you think?
> Abba Father is in Scripture,it is a closer way to say Father.Something like Daddy in English,if I'm not mistaken.



yes.

And back to the original question and some of the topics of the following posts.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6200P620100301

I will not speculate, nor will I claim prophetic revelation of these matters...but I do watch with interest...not fear, not worry.

Can I imagine a scenario in which China...now loathe to meet us openly "head on" with preemptive aggression could try to take advantage and provoke us if hostilities were to break out in the Middle East...that, I can easily see.

And so I watch.
For the Lord.
And when he brings certain things before my eyes...I leave them with him, to either have him dismiss as my own imaginings...or further illuminate.


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## Bottle Hunter (Mar 3, 2010)

Childish no. In fifty years of attending church I have never,  I repeat never heard God called Abba.

I just tried to call my 80 yo Mamma to see if shes ever heard the "Abba" reference, but she's at church.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 3, 2010)

going to church is not a substitute for knowing the Word of God...  we will be judged by the Word (John 12:48)...   not how many times we went to church.

Mark 14:36
And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.

Romans 8:15
For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

Galatians 4:6
And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.


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## Bottle Hunter (Mar 3, 2010)

So I just Googled "Abba" and not a word comes up about God.

So I Google "Abba God"..........and what do I find out. 

It's used a total of three times.

Wow, I'm a bad Christian for not knowing.

Yall people need to get a grip and find a little humor.


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## Bottle Hunter (Mar 3, 2010)

Your right going to church and knowing the Bible will not get you anywhere. 

I know that.

It's just like knowing every word in the Bible and coming here to tell others how much you know and  how others how they don't know squat or the correct interpretation. 

That won't get you in the Pearly Gates either.


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## Lowjack (Mar 3, 2010)

Only Those that have the Spirit can call him Abba, Baruch Hashem Adonai.


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## thedeacon (Mar 3, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> Many words just to tell me Jews don't understand the scriptures, I believe Jews do have more insight on the word than you can ever begin to have, now as far as interpretation according to the church theology , I'm sure they don't understand as much as you might, but a Jew who has Christ and has the holy Spirit is not the same as a Jew or "Christian that uses the Bible for a paper weight.
> Frankly, I think is better if I don't try to teach anymore in here, Jesus told his disciples to go into Cities and teach the gospel if they are well receive to bless the place, if they are not well receive to dust the feet and leave, so I'll leave you all to your own interpretations, and may you find peace.
> Frankly a Spiritual discussion site , with non spiritual people allowed to mock is not a place I want to be.
> Just like in heaven there is no place for them either.
> ...



So if someone disagrees with you they are wrong and do not understand the scriptures. WOW

So if someone challanges you and resents being called smaller in the eyes of God, you are going to pick up and leave.

I am also the apple of Gods eyes, no Jew, no chritian jew or just plain christian can surpass that as I cannot surpass them. God is NOT let me repeat that, God is not a respector of persons!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Itray atthet onthey orfa orfa izesa


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## thedeacon (Mar 3, 2010)

Israel said:


> yes.
> 
> And back to the original question and some of the topics of the following posts.
> 
> ...





Very well said. Excellent, excellent, excellent


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## packrat (Mar 3, 2010)

*Special Delivery*



Bottle Hunter said:


> Childish no. In fifty years of attending church I have never,  I repeat never heard God called Abba.
> 
> I just tried to call my 80 yo Mamma to see if shes ever heard the "Abba" reference, but she's at church.



Mark 14:36
And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.

 Romans 8:15
For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 

 Galatians 4:6
And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.


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## thedeacon (Mar 3, 2010)

Jesus Christ’s use of the Aramaic “Abba” made such an impression on His disciples in that it was a unique instance in 1st Century Jewish piety; this explains why it stamped the apostles’ memory. Moreover, it was an exclusive use to the extent that the early Church was aware that, only through Jesus and in His Spirit, one could utter that word, that is, she was aware that its use was ultimately reserved to Christ Himself. This explains why the early Christians considered it daring to call God “Father” and prayed not to be condemned for such boldness.

      But why? Why all this fuss about a simple Aramaic word? Well, it is because — and modern biblical research has convincingly shown that —“Abba” actually means “Daddy”! Shocking even to the most remote and possibly unused grey call of the coolest and most objective human brain: A young man of 1st Century Palestine called God “Daddy.” Unbefitting, scandalous, blasphemous, crazy, unreal!  …  Maybe! But he did it, he did call the Almighty One “Daddy”! He addressed God as a child his own father!

Kinda sweet don't you think!!!


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## Diogenes (Mar 4, 2010)

Wow!  

LJ states – “ . . . since no one comprehends how we read the bible in the original language, metaphysicaly and multidimensionaly.”

Boy, you’re not kidding, right there!  Your metaphysics include an ontology and an epistemology that is truly original!  And it is hard to find fault when you are actually multi-dimensional, and dealing in the surety of incarnations of the eleventh dimension of reality that even the curvature of space hasn’t reached yet.  

But I’m still waiting for you to send me that copy you alone seem to have of the bible in the original language.  C’mon.  Help us poor unenlightened folks out by sharing that, would you?

And that Numerology thing?  I say it is 42.  Douglas Adams agrees, and that is good enough for me . . . 

Then LJ hangs himself – “Thus discovering that Hebrew can be read either left to right , or up and down or corner to corner, thus revealing that one book is NOT one but many books in one, but I guess you knew that, you just kept it to yourself.”   Utter nonsense.  Sir, you could not support that statement under any circumstance, and purely invented that conceit out of whole cloth.  Passion for your religious position is one thing, but inventing mysteries out of language problems that serve only to elevate yourself is going to take some demonstration . . . 

But you can’t, of course, so the cowards exit – “Frankly a Spiritual discussion site , with non spiritual people allowed to mock is not a place I want to be. Just like in heaven there is no place for them either.”   

Be serious.  If disagreement bothers one, it is generally only because one cannot back up their position, and despairs of the failure of the bully pulpit to create followers . . . But, in a sense, the instinct to move on to a less enlightened congregation that will swallow every word without a bit of incredulity might be a good one . . . . 

But, still, to the OP – the political analysis suffers from a bit of wishful religious overtone.  Smart money says that Israel will probably continue to be unilaterally hostile, and will probably ignore everyone’s best advice yet again and launch another air-raid into the sovereign space of yet another nation under the excuse of over-arching paranoia.  We’ve gotten used to that sort of thing.  Might cross an apologist’s mind that waking up with U.S. sponsored Israeli Bombers overhead, with no real check on them or repercussions,  is the sort of thing that causes the other folks to be a bit on edge also.  Sober, serious minded and deeply thinking folks are somewhat less volatile than that, and so the whole world is stuck focusing on our misbehaving children when we have far better things to do.  

Will an Iran/Israel War break out, and draw us all into the Apocalypse so fondly craved?  Um.  No.

Sorry.

Neither country, in any context and in any independent view could mount much more than some saber-rattling, and the rest of the world would swat them on their collective behinds if they bothered to try. WWIII?  No.

Couple of immature idiot nations still caught up in religious nonsense?  Yeah.

(And here I thought that ‘Abba’ meant the female name for ‘Thursday,’ when they tell me on the help line “Please Hold, Abba right with you.”)


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## Israel (Mar 4, 2010)

Dio, seems you know less of politics than of the Lord, even.
Archduke Ferdinand. 
From small beginnings, mighty conflagrations grow.

You'd almost be amusing if you didn't take yourself so seriously. 
And as for the "paranoia" of which you diagnose Israel.
Tell you what ...go break into a neighbor's home, drag his family outside and slaughter them before his eyes.
But let him live.

Then a few years later, after this guy has remarried and finally has some more children...watch and see what he does when another neighbor now threatens him with the same. Especially when this neighbor makes a show of sharpening swords in his backyard but then protests to the world he only plans on using these at dinner as steak knives.


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## WTM45 (Mar 4, 2010)

Although religious writings are most often so vague as to be easily manipulated by interpretation, I submit a challenge.

Lowjack, if the remainder of the year goes by WITHOUT WWIII starting, will you give up this nonsense of a "deity approved" pro-war religious belief system?

Freedom FROM religion.  Man, you should try it!


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## tell sackett (Mar 4, 2010)

Freedom in Christ. Man, you should try it!

 P.S. Where did lj predict WW III? Hint: see post #22


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## WTM45 (Mar 4, 2010)

tell sackett said:


> Freedom in Christ. Man, you should try it!
> 
> P.S. Where did lj predict WW III? Hint: see post #22



He flip-flops like a fish out of water.  His very first post presumes world strife and a MAJOR war between Iran and Israel BEFORE the end of that particular calender.

I personally label such an event as a MAJOR war, since both are in posession of mass destruction weaponry technology.

When it does not come to fruition, as hoped by most, will the proponents of it doubt the accuracy of their resources or just simply chalk it up to another missed interpretation of vague prophesies?


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## tell sackett (Mar 4, 2010)

Talk about flip flopping, you've gone from "...WITHOUT WWIII starting.." to "...a MAJOR WAR..."


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## WTM45 (Mar 4, 2010)

tell sackett said:


> Talk about flip flopping, you've gone from "...WITHOUT WWIII starting.." to "...a MAJOR WAR..."



One in the same to me, as the entire world will be involved and at risk of negative results stemming from such.
On that fact, there is no indecisiveness or varied opinion coming from me.

Call it what you wish, I don't care.


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## tell sackett (Mar 4, 2010)

We are in agreement on one thing: if that flare goes up, it's probably going to get real ugly real quick.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 4, 2010)

the second israel and their enemies go at it, for real.... rest assured our war hungry country will be right in the middle of it.. how else will Bush and Cheney get richer???  they need the price of oil to go back to $150 a bbl and Haliburton needs more projects...  yes, it will lead to wwIII.  guaranteed.


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## WTM45 (Mar 4, 2010)

tell sackett said:


> We are in agreement on one thing: if that flare goes up, it's probably going to get real ugly real quick.



True.  True.

If ever there existed a strong reason to appeal to one's deity for intercession, I'd think this would be a good one.
I can not see how anyone could wish for such a major conflict to occur, even if it "proved" or "hastened the day," simply to fullfill some prophesy.

I'm old enough to remember a full church on its knees with an elderly minister (who had been awarded a Silver Star in WWII) appealing in prayer for a swift end to the Vietnam conflict and for a complete relaxation of tensions in the Middle East.  ICBM's were pointed east and west at that very point in history.  
I remember vividly he gave some very compelling reasons for his appeal.


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## gtparts (Mar 4, 2010)

FWIW, I'm good to go, either way.


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## Israel (Mar 5, 2010)

FWIW= for what it's worth?


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## gtparts (Mar 5, 2010)

Yep.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 5, 2010)

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1153558.html

"Do not strike" is what the Americans are telling Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. "Let's first try sanctions on Iran." 

"Do not strike" is what Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is saying to Netanyahu. "If you go crazy and go to war, it will be the end of the Zionist regime." 

Netanyahu managed to convince the world that Israel is on the verge of a preemptive war to try to foil Iran's nuclear program. His speeches on a second Holocaust and Amalek, the acceleration of military preparations, the exercises on the Home Front, the distribution of gas masks and even the stockpiling of dollars by the Bank of Israel all suggest that Israel is preparing to strike Iran, as it did when it attacked the nuclear plants in Iraq and Syria. 
 	Advertisement
The preparations for war give Israel unprecedented international significance. U.S. President Barack Obama, who kept his distance at the beginning of his tenure, is now airlifting senior officials to ask Netanyahu to hold back. When he wanted to deal with the Palestinian problem, Obama made do with a retiree without authority in the form of George Mitchell. 

It turns out that the Israeli threat to spark a regional war is bothering the administration a lot more than the occupation and the West Bank settlements. Not only are the politicians troubled, representatives of global investment firms are curious to know "when they will attack," as a way of gambling on oil prices. It turns out that Israel's economic significance is buried in its ability to cause trouble - not in high tech, start-ups or the Bamba snacks the Israelis pride themselves in. 

Netanyahu will certainly argue that his assertive stance is what convinced Obama to take a tougher line on Iran. But the prime minister's approach is risky: What will happen if diplomacy and sanctions fail, as they are expected to, and Ahmadinejad continues on his nuclear path? Will Netanyahu then be able to pull back from his heated statements and announce that the Iranian threat is not so bad? Or has he already burned the bridge for a withdrawal and will have to go to war? 

Netanyahu is playing poker and hiding his most important card: the Israel Defense Forces' true capabilities to destroy Iran's nuclear installations. If he attacks, he is risking a war of attrition in which Tel Aviv will be hit by missiles and Ben-Gurion International Airport will be closed. And the longer the violence continues, the more international firms will leave the country; the talented and wealthy will abandon it, too. 

Netanyahu sees the same danger, but from the other side. He believes that if Iran goes nuclear, the elites and high tech will leave and the economy will be destroyed, so an Iranian bomb must be prevented. 

Ahmadinejad is also playing poker, and in recent weeks he upped the ante when he posed the destruction of the Zionist regime not merely as a religious-ideological ambition, but as a practical goal. Defense Minister Ehud Barak, who is functioning as a super-adviser to Netanyahu for national security affairs, said in response that "the clock for the Iranian regime's downfall is ticking." 

Israel and Iran are gambling that only one of them will survive the confrontation. Is this threat serious? History suggests it is. In the Six-Day War and the War of Attrition, Israel defeated Nasserism, which, like Ahmadinejad today, preached the wiping of Israel off the map of the Middle East. The price was high and cost Israel the Yom Kippur War, but the Arabs became convinced that the Jewish state is not a passing phenomenon. 

The third player, Obama, holds the weakest hand. This is so because of domestic political weakness and because he can't seriously threaten Ahmadinejad or Netanyahu. Obama doesn't want to attack Iran himself and will find it hard to restrain Israel at the moment of truth. 

What will he do? Will he turn off the American early warning radar in the Negev and announce that there will be no airlift and no diplomatic support, and as far as he's concerned Tel Aviv can burn because Israel acted against his advice? It's hard to imagine that Obama will abandon Israel to its fate. He can only complain and signal to Netanyahu that American support is not guaranteed for any Israeli action. 

Before war breaks out - if indeed it does - the real hands the leaders are holding will not be seen. But in the meantime the stakes are constantly rising with the expectations that one of the players will recognize his weakness, blink and leave the table.


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## earl (Mar 5, 2010)

Let her rip. It will beat all the trash talk from one side or the other. If Obama keeps us out of it completely , his reign will be worth it.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 5, 2010)

earl said:


> Let her rip. It will beat all the trash talk from one side or the other. If Obama keeps us out of it completely , his reign will be worth it.



you think he will keep us out?   

just like he was gonna bring our troops home?    

osama is a puppet. just like bush. just like slick willy.

our soldiers are in over 70% of the worlds countries...

the usa doesn't know the meaning of "keeping out".  the law will come throw you in jail for accidentally stepping on your neighbors land... yet we "occupy" the majority of the earth.  what a joke.


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## earl (Mar 5, 2010)

OK ,you probably got me there. Should we as a ''Christian'' nation encourage Israel to ''nuke 'em'' to hasten the end of times ?


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 5, 2010)

earl said:


> OK ,you probably got me there. Should we as a ''Christian'' nation encourage Israel to ''nuke 'em'' to hasten the end of times ?



earl, you are in rare form tonite..... we're not a Christian nation. Jesus said His Kingdom was not of this world...  our country is "of this world"...

the end times are here and have been. God has wrote the end from the beginning.  its all planned out by a sovereign God... He already knows how it will all take place. whether we push for iran to get nuked or not has no bearing on when or if it will actually take place. it will take place when the sovereign God has planned it, if He has...  just like there is nothing we can do to usher in Christs' return... God has it all planned out to bring glory to Himself...  He's a mighty God...


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## earl (Mar 5, 2010)

OK .I'll concede the point for debate's sake. Our involvement or lack of it has no bearing on anything ? I thought it was a sign of the end .


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## Lowjack (Mar 5, 2010)

http://www.aolnews.com/world/article/israels-new-and-bigger-drone-capable-of-attacking-iran/19367888

Israel has obtained a go ahead from Egypt and Israeli Navy ships are now in the Suez Canal.
Israel has go ahead from Saudi Arabia to use Saudi Air space and practice flights have taken place.
Jordan offers Emergency landing to Israel's planes, seems no one wants Iran with Nuclear capability.
In The End It doesn't matter what Obama Wants, it is what is written that will happened, Teheran will be in ruins and home to the owls and the Chacal.
Too bad for the youth of Iran do not want this.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 5, 2010)

earl said:


> OK .I'll concede the point for debate's sake. Our involvement or lack of it has no bearing on anything ? I thought it was a sign of the end .



like lj said, events will transpire just as the Word tells us, and perfectly... i dont think we can alter or change anything that is already planned and written. who are we to change history that is foretold by prophecy...?


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## earl (Mar 5, 2010)

Wait a minute ! What happened to the Egyptians,Arabs,and Jordanians hating Jews worse than Americans. In fact ,what happened to the whole Muslim world having it in for the Jews ? Some body changed gears I do believe.


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## Israel (Mar 5, 2010)

We are entering the time of no restraint. God will allow men to do what is in their hearts to do...for those who desire murder and mayhem, God's hand will allow them to bring to themselves the sorrow they wish for others...


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## earl (Mar 5, 2010)

Israel said:


> We are entering the time of no restraint. God will allow men to do what is in their hearts to do...for those who desire murder and mayhem, God's hand will allow them to bring to themselves the sorrow they wish for others...





It has always been that way has it not ? No restraint /Free will.


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## WTM45 (Mar 6, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> In The End It doesn't matter what Obama Wants, it is what is written that will happened, Teheran will be in ruins and home to the owls and the Chacal.
> Too bad for the youth of Iran do not want this.



If offensive military action occurs, it better be precise and limited to a show of force against Iranian nuclear development.

Wanton blitzkreig on the civilian population of Iran will put Israel into the same catagory as Nazi Germany.


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## Lowjack (Mar 6, 2010)

WTM45 said:


> If offensive military action occurs, it better be precise and limited to a show of force against Iranian nuclear development.
> 
> Wanton blitzkreig on the civilian population of Iran will put Israel into the same catagory as Nazi Germany.



I'm no longer a member of the IDF as I'm too old, but I'll pass on your wish!


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## WTM45 (Mar 6, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> I'm no longer a member of the IDF as I'm too old, but I'll pass on your wish!



What wish?
If anything I wish for peaceful negotiation and sanction before any military offensive.  Then, if it comes down to an offensive move, focus on the nuclear locations rather than the population centers.


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## Lowjack (Mar 6, 2010)

WTM45 said:


> What wish?
> If anything I wish for peaceful negotiation and sanction before any military offensive.  Then, if it comes down to an offensive move, focus on the nuclear locations rather than the population centers.



OK I told Beyamin Nathanyahu a little while ago what you said.
He said OK, Israel will only use firecrackers to scare Iran.


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## WTM45 (Mar 6, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> OK I told Beyamin Nathanyahu a little while ago what you said.
> He said OK, Israel will only use firecrackers to scare Iran.



Most sane people do not find any humor in war.


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## earl (Mar 6, 2010)

WTM45 said:


> Most sane people do not find any humor in war.



There you go.


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## Lowjack (Mar 6, 2010)

The Humor is not in war, it is in what you said.
Like Israel needs our Council.
Israel will be let by the Spirit of God and will pay just retribution to the enemy of God , The False Prophet.


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## earl (Mar 6, 2010)

Who knew ? Now instead of that silly goal keeping ''Jesus saves '' Tshirt we can finally get a new one ''Jesus nukes ''


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## WTM45 (Mar 6, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> The Humor is not in war, it is in what you said.
> Like Israel needs our Council.
> Israel will be let by the Spirit of God and will pay just retribution to the enemy of God , The False Prophet.



"Holy" war.
Have we heard this before?
Replace "God" with "Allah" and how does it sound?

Extremism.  It is found in many camps.


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## Lead Poison (Mar 6, 2010)

WTM45 said:


> "Holy" war.
> Have we heard this before?
> Replace "God" with "Allah" and how does it sound?
> 
> Extremism.  It is found in many camps.



Lowjack is right. 

God has ALL authority. In heaven AND on his earth...like it or not. 

So much for extremism. Nothing is extreme when it is the will of the true and living God.

And for the record, God's name isn't Allah!


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## Lowjack (Mar 6, 2010)

WTM45 said:


> "Holy" war.
> Have we heard this before?
> Replace "God" with "Allah" and how does it sound?
> 
> Extremism.  It is found in many camps.



Have you read Holy war in any of my posts ?

War is not Holy, War Is destruction and an evil necessity if you want to survive,In The Kingdom there will be no more wars , tanks and missiles and rifles will be melted and turned into agricultural tools.
Israel does not want war, it is the Muslims from day one of Israel's birth as a nation that have being at war with Israel.


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## Lowjack (Mar 6, 2010)

Iranian Website: Iranian Nuke = End of Israel 

by Chris Schang


Israel National News is currently running an article that reports that an Iranian website called "Asr-e Iran" is stating that the development of an Iranian nuclear weapon would equal the end of Israel. The Iranian website makes the claim that even if a nuclear weapons is developed and never used, that there will be a mass exodus of Jews out of Israel which would effectively be the end of Israel. The INN articles reports: 

The MEMRI organization reports that the popular Iranian website Asr-e Iran posted an editorial last week stating that Iran's possession of nuclear weapons will threaten Israel's existence and lead to its elimination - even if they are 'never used'. Once Iran possesses nuclear weapons and shifts the balance of power in the Middle East this will be the end of Israeli society, said the editorial. 
"Iran's possession of such weapons will sow in Israel a sense of insecurity - and this sense alone will be enough to shatter the glass palace of this illegitimate regime in the Middle East. An Iran with nuclear weapons means an end to the dream of 'secure Israel' - and this means the exodus of most of the residents."

As many students know from Bible prophecy, God has declared that in the end times he would call the Jews back into the land a second time never to be dispersed or destroyed again. This prophecy was recorded in Isaiah 11:11-12: 

Isa 11:11 And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.


Isa 11:12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

And from Ezekiel 37:21-23: 

Eze 37:21 And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land:

Eze 37:22 And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all:


Eze 37:23 Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwelling places, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God

As we can see here there will ultimately be a showdown between the satanic evil forces of Islam who will try to rid the world of Israel and the God of Israel. My bet is on the Word of God as he can't lie and his Word has been true 100% of the time. The Islamists are definitely playing with fire, and they don't even know it. Satan has deceived the Islamists into thinking that they can develop a nuclear weapon and wipe Israel off the map. Somehow I believe that God is not going to allow this to happen, for His Word says that Israel is once again back in the land for good. So, somehow the Islamic hordes who are lined up against Israel will taste yet another bitter defeat at the hands of the True Living God! 

Another interesting report that came out is that a recent Gallup poll indicates that American support for Israel is at a 20 year high!! This is an encouraging sign in that despite all the rabid anti-semitism being displayed across the world community, that the United States' people are still standing proudly with Israel. Israel National News reports: 

American sympathy for Israel in the Arab-Israeli conflict has surged, with 63% of Americans saying they side more with Israelis than with Palestinians, according to a new Gallup poll. In 1996 and 1997, support for Israel hovered at a lowly 38%. Support for Palestinians is currently 15%, down from 23% a few years ago, according to the poll, which was conducted February 1-3.
Further: 

The last time Israel enjoyed such high popularity in the United States was almost 20 years ago in January 1991, just after Israel was attacked by Iraqi President Saddam Hussein with Scud missiles during the First Gulf War. Support from Republicans stands at a towering 85%, up from 77% in recent years, with Democratic and Independent support remaining about the same. A whopping 67% of Americans are doubtful that a time will ever come in which Arab nations and Israel will "settle their differences" and live in peace. Politically, Democrats (39%) were more inclined to think this scenario would occur than independents (26%) or Republicans (25%).
As we can see here the Israelis are enjoying a tremendous popular support from the conservative Republican party with 85% supporting Israel in the current Israeli-Arab conflict. While the poll did not reveal the exact percentage of support for Israel from Democrats, the poll did reveal that nearly 40% of Democrats thought the Israeli-Arab conflict could be resolved. To me this is just an incredible amount of people who are living in a political fog. Time and time again we have seen the Arabs refuse to make peace with Israel. The Gaza experiment is a miserable failure and just goes to show that the entire "land for peace" theory is silly and absurd at best. I believe the root of the difference between how Democrats and Republicans see the Israeli-Arab conflict resolves around knowledge of the biblical prophecies that we are very close to seeing. Conservative Republicans are much more likely to believe and follow a literal interpretation of scriptures than the liberal and secular Democrats, many of whom support anti-godly movements such as abortion, gay marriages, and other failed socialist ideals. 

In the end, Genesis 12:3 comes to mind as God says he will bless those who bless Israel, and that he will curse those who curse Israel. 

Gen 12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.
Keep looking up, our redemption is drawing nigh!! 

God bless.


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## Lead Poison (Mar 6, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> Iranian Website: Iranian Nuke = End of Israel
> 
> by Chris Schang
> 
> ...



Great post.


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## BeenHuntn (Mar 6, 2010)

Lead Poison said:


> Great post.



yep, the Word of God is awesome...


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## Israel (Mar 7, 2010)

On this board, just as in the world, folks watch for the waxing and waning of their own support relative to positions others take.
None of us want to be left "hanging out there all alone".
Fortunately, Jesus was willing to do the right thing at the cost of all the world's approval...and for those with eyes to see, it becomes evident who was in Christ suffering for the sins of the world.
Now, we are told to go to him outside the camp, and bear his reproach.

Israel may act, as indeed Caiaphas himself spoke by the Holy Spirit...in accord with the will of God.
That does not benefit them anymore than those into whose jaws the Lord places a hook and draws them out.
God's will...will be done.

National survival may indeed be an avenue of benefit if, at the end, there is repentance.
Just as God has allowed many things in my life to bring me to my knees in submission to the acknowledgment of Jesus as Lord...when I, in ignorance, opposed his will.
What is coming for the people is a time of great sorrow...and even for Israel itself, it will not be a time of great national victory...but a time of shame and abasement that they have trusted in the arm of flesh as deliverer...but it will be out of that trial that many hearts will be turned, out of that crucible of fire many souls will be tried, and those that awaken to the righteousness of God in his choosing of a peculiar people for himself, to be in the world, but not of it...that recognition of their, our Messiah will come.
This will not be "Israel kicking Iran's butt" nor will it be the Lord vindicating a country or even a people.
It will be the Lord's vindication of his own name and word, and a testimony to his own faithfulness, and not the righteousness of any religion or group regardless of how much those members of that religion may have suffered down through the ages.

This is a hard word for any soul that takes its stand on its natural inheritance, but so be it.

Joshua learned.

Jos 5:13  And it came to pass, when Joshua was by Jericho, that he lifted up his eyes and looked, and, behold, there stood a man over against him with his sword drawn in his hand: and Joshua went unto him, and said unto him, _Art thou for us, or for our adversaries? _
Jos 5:14  And he said,_ Nay; but as captain of the host of the LORD am I now come._ And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him, What saith my lord unto his servant? 
Jos 5:15  And the captain of the LORD'S host said unto Joshua, Loose thy shoe from off thy foot; for the place whereon thou standest is holy. And Joshua did so. 

And Zechariah saw:

Zec 12:9  And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. 
Zec 12:10  And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. 
Zec 12:11  In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon. 
Zec 12:12  And the land shall mourn, every family apart; the family of the house of David apart, and their wives apart; the family of the house of Nathan apart, and their wives apart; 
Zec 12:13  The family of the house of Levi apart, and their wives apart; the family of Shimei apart, and their wives apart; 
Zec 12:14  All the families that remain, every family apart, and their wives apart. 

This mourning will turn to joy...

For the present "christian"  believer who casually dismisses the people who "rejected Christ" there is a humbling coming also.

God has allowed blindness in part, so that the gospel might go to the gentiles. Do not boast against the natural vine. Unless you present a faith to provoke a man to jealousy for what he sees you have of Ha Shem, you still remain darkened in your own understanding. You have been saved to be an instrument fitting for their salvation. If you prove unfit, God is not unable to place you back on the pottery wheel.

Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. 

They are enemies of the gospel _for your sakes._
The only reason any gentile has had the gospel extended to him was due to God's willingness to blind His own, in part.

_but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. _

God made promises to "the fathers"...or as we often call them, the Patriarchs...

And just as each of us has children "according to our flesh" whom we love and for whom we earnestly desire God's favor...these children of Abraham's flesh, the children of promise, (of whom some of us also now are...) will not be cast away.


  I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. 
Rom 11:12  Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness? 
Rom 11:13  For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office: 
Rom 11:14  If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them. 
Rom 11:15  For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead? 
Rom 11:16  For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches. 
Rom 11:17  And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; 
Rom 11:18  Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 
Rom 11:19  Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. 
Rom 11:20  Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 
Rom 11:21  For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. 
Rom 11:22  Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.


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## WTM45 (Mar 7, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> Have you read Holy war in any of my posts ?
> 
> War is not Holy, War Is destruction and an evil necessity if you want to survive,In The Kingdom there will be no more wars , tanks and missiles and rifles will be melted and turned into agricultural tools.
> Israel does not want war, it is the Muslims from day one of Israel's birth as a nation that have being at war with Israel.



I have to question that statement.  Without any proof of nuclear capability a simple bit of "saber rattling" coming from the greatly unsupported Iranian leader has Israel issuing gas masks and preparing for conventional warfare.

They love it.  It gives them attention on the world stage.
It is the "we are being oppressed" stance.
It is not flying with most of the truly knowledgeable.

Those who choose to leave Israel do so because they are sick of the bickering, fighting and discord that is constantly going on within the region.
Israel is guilty of its share of the problem.


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## earl (Mar 7, 2010)

Israel, biblicaly speaking, I think you may have nailed it .


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## Lead Poison (Mar 7, 2010)

WTM45 said:


> I have to question that statement.  Without any proof of nuclear capability a simple bit of "saber rattling" coming from the greatly unsupported Iranian leader has Israel issuing gas masks and preparing for conventional warfare.
> 
> They love it.  It gives them attention on the world stage.
> It is the "we are being oppressed" stance.
> ...



I totally disagree with you. There is substantial evidence pointing to Iran and their nuclear ability. Israel CAN'T wait.


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## earl (Mar 7, 2010)

Lead Poison said:


> I totally disagree with you. There is substantial evidence pointing to Iran and there nuclear ability. Israel CAN'T wait.





If God is capable of ANYTHING , why can't they wait ?


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## Lead Poison (Mar 7, 2010)

earl said:


> If God is capable of ANYTHING , why can't they wait ?



Because God does things his way in his time.


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## Lowjack (Mar 7, 2010)

Time after Time In History God has Used Israel as His Vehicle to teach other nations a lesson or two.
The Very Name Israel carries God's name, one can philosophy as much as one cares to, that doesn't mean that philosophy is correct.
To say that Israel Enjoys World attention is the furthest thing from the truth I have ever heard, that comes from someone that doesn't know the Israeli people 1 on 1 , never being to Israel even as a tourist ?
I'll tell you what Israel and its people really want , is for no one to bother them, they wish to live in peace and let them do what they have done up to now even with the aggression of many countries around, that is to develop the Israeli people to their full potential and be left alone and in peace.
If the name Israel wasn't mentioned in Newspapers they will be very happy.

Given that Jews comprise a mere 1/4 of 1% (13 million) of the world's population (6 billion) and that 99% of the world is non-Jewish, the following list of accomplishments by Jews is quite impressive.

Of the 660 Nobel prizes from 1901-1990, 160 have been won by Jews. Jews have won more Nobel prizes than any other ethnicity. They have won 40 times more than should be expected of them based upon population statistics.

Great Thinkers
Albert Einstein, the most famous scientist of the 20th century, proposed a groundbreaking theory of relativity (including his famous equation e=mc²). Einstein's work laid the foundation for much of modern physics and had a profound impact on everything from quantum theory to nuclear power and the atom bomb.
Dr. Sigmund Freud, an Austrian physician, was the founder of psychoanalysis and father of psychiatry. He theorized that the symptoms of hysterical patients represent forgotten and unresolved infantile psychosexual conflicts. His psychoanalytic theories profoundly influenced 20th-century thought.
Science and Medicine
Dr. Jonas Salk created the first Polio Vaccine.
Dr. Abraham Waksman coined the term antibiotics.
Casmir Funk, a Polish Jew, pioneered a new field of medical research and coined the word "vitamins."
Dr. Simon Baruch performed the first successful operation for appendicitis
Dr. Paul "magic bullet" Ehrlich won the Nobel Prize in 1908 for curing syphilis.
Dr. Abraham Jacobi is considered America's father of pediatrics.
Dr. Albert Sabin developed the first oral polio vaccine.
Business and Finance
Haym Solomon and Isaac Moses are responsible for creating the first modern-banking institutions.
Jews created the first department stores: The Altmans, Gimbels, Kaufmanns, Lazaruses, Magnins, Mays, and Strausses became leaders of major department stores.
Julius Rosenwald revolutionized the way Americans purchased goods by improving Sears Roebuck's mail order merchandising.
Hart, Schaffner, Marx, Kuppenheimer and Levi Strauss became household names in mens' clothing.
Isadore & Nathan Straus - "Abraham & Straus," eventually became sole owners of Macy's, the world's largest department store, in 1896. 
The fortunes of English-Jewish financiers such as Isaac Goldsmid, Nathan Rothschild, David Salomons, and Moses Montefiore helped England become an empire.
Armand Hammer (Arm & Hammer) was a physician and businessman who originated the largest trade between the U.S. and Russia.
Louis Santanel was the financier who provided the funds for Columbus' voyage to America.
Levi Strauss invented durable pants first used by Forty-niners during the Gold Rush. These "wonderful pants of Levi's" were made of a heavy blue denim material called "genes" in France. The pants he created, called levis or jeans, have become an emblem of the American West and an emissary of the Western lifestyle -- egalitarian, utilitarian, independent -- around the world.
Entertainment Industry
Samuel L. Goldwyn & Louis B. Mayer (MGM) produced the first full-length sound picture, "The Jazz Singer."
European Jews are the founding fathers of all the Hollywood Studios.
Adolph Zukor built the first theater used solely to show motion pictures.
George and Ira Gershwin & Irving Berlin are three of the most prolific composers of the 20th century
Harry Houdini (Weiss) is considered the father of Magic.
Sherry Lansing of Paramount Pictures became the first woman president of a major Hollywood studio.
Flo Zigfield of "Zigfield Follies" is the creator of American burlesque.
Steven Spielberg is the most successful filmmaker since the advent of film.
Invention
Theodor Judah was chief architect and engineer for the American Transcontinental railroad.
In 1918, Detroit, Max Goldberg opened the "first" commercial parking lot.
In 1910, Louis Blaustein and his son opened the "first" gas station, eventually founding AMOCO OIL.
In 1909, four Jews were among the 60 multi-cultural signers of the call to the National Action, which resulted in the creation of the NAACP.
Emile Berliner developed the modern-day phonograph. The machine he patented was called the gramophone. Berliner made possible the modern record industry. His company was eventually absorbed by the Victor Talking Machine Company, now known as RCA.
Jewish Louis B. Mayer (MGM) created the idea for the Oscar.
Art and Literature
Marc Chagall (born Segal, Russia) is one of the great 20th century painters. 
The famous poem of Jewish Poet Emma Lazarus - "give me your tired...your poor...your huddled masses," - appears as the inscription on the Statue Of Liberty.
If you know of other great accomplishments by Jews that should be added to this list, please email them to me at judaism.guide@about.com so I can add them to this list.


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## WTM45 (Mar 7, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> To say that Israel Enjoys World attention is the furthest thing from the truth I have ever heard, that comes from someone that doesn't know the Israeli people 1 on 1 , never being to Israel even as a tourist ?





Making some awfully big assumptions there, Professor.

Israel revels in world attention, reaps the rewards of international support and has continued to strain relations in the Middle East through their high and mighty stance supported by their religious dogmas.

They are not alone in that respect, as many other nations hold exclusivism beliefs too.

But on the issue of killing innocent civilian populations and starting a confilct over simple words and religious beliefs, I do not see they have garnered much support for such an act.

What you are missing in my posts is my desire for peaceful outcome.  I have never questioned the soverignity of Israel, nor have I stated anywhere their peoples worldwide have not made fantastic contributions to the world as a whole.
I simply support the doctrine of diplomatic negotiation and sanction as a counter to open offensive military action against a purely vocal agressor.

Sending the bombers will bring on some bad ju-ju for the entire region, and the repercussions will be felt worldwide.


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## WTM45 (Mar 7, 2010)

Lead Poison said:


> I totally disagree with you. There is substantial evidence pointing to Iran and their nuclear ability. Israel CAN'T wait.



Yes they can.

Once the international community and the intelligence services verify the presence of nuclear weaponry the potential destruction of that ability should be decided upon.
Until then, it is pure diplomacy.
Let the intelligence services do their jobs first.

Lil Kim in N. Korea is at the seventh grade level in nuclear ability, Iran is still half days pre-kindergarten.

Going to guns and attacking population centers just because you THINK they MIGHT have an ability to attack you would be akin to kicking in your neighbor's door because you THINK he has a handgun and he did not laugh at your jokes at last year's homeowner's association bar-b-que.

The idea that "God" wants someone to bomb a population of people is no different than those who feel "Allah" wants them to crash planes into buildings.


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## Lowjack (Mar 7, 2010)

With Reports Like this who can detain a war ?

Iran begins production of cruise missiles
           – This photo released by the Iranian Defense Ministry, alledgedly shows a Nasr1 (Victory) missile in a … 
By NASSER KARIMI, Associated Press Writer Nasser Karimi, Associated Press Writer – 18 mins ago
TEHRAN, Iran – Iran announced Sunday that it has started a new production line of highly accurate, short range cruise missiles, which would add a new element to the country's already imposing arsenal.

Gen. Ahmad Vahidi told Iranian state TV that the cruise missile, called Nasr 1, would be capable of destroying targets up to 3,000 tons in size.

The minister said the missile can be fired from ground-based launchers as well as ships, but would eventually be modified to be fired from helicopters and submarines.

Western powers are already concerned about Iran's military capabilities, especially the implications of its nuclear program. The U.S. and some of its allies, as well as the International Atomic Energy Agency, fear Iran is trying to produce nuclear weapons, a charge Iran denies.

The West is considering stiffer sanctions against Tehran to try to force it to halt uranium enrichment, a process that has civilian uses but can be also used for nuclear arms if the uranium is enriched over 90 percent.

Iran also boasts an array of short and medium-range missiles capable of hitting targets in the region, including Israel, U.S. military bases in the region and much of Europe.

Tehran frequently makes announcements about new advances in military technology that cannot be independently verified.

Gen. Vahidi said the production of the cruise missiles, which took two years to develop, showed that sanctions on Iran have failed. He said the cruise missiles would strengthen Iran's naval power.

Cruise missiles are highly advanced, usually subsonic rocket-powered weapons that can hug the ground and hit targets with great precision. The U.S. used large numbers of cruise missiles in its attack on Baghdad in 2002, launching most of them from warships in the Persian Gulf.

Iranian state TV showed a video of boxes in a warehouse containing several missiles. It also showed footage of Iran's cruise missile test in 2007. That missile was apparently imported.

Tehran began a military self-sufficiency program in 1992, under which it produces a large range of weapons, including tanks, missiles, jet fighters, unmanned drone aircraft and torpedoes.


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## WTM45 (Mar 7, 2010)

So, we are gonna hold their press releases as fact.
That's smart.
Ever heard of "bluffing" or "poker face?"
Even if true, that is FAR from being a nuclear threat.

I say let the great one (Obama) bring the two leadership teams together at the Greenbriar for a round of golf.
We'll see who has the smoothest swing, drives for show and puts for the dough!
Even "Jimmuh" Carter accomplished more than O has so far.


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## Lowjack (Mar 7, 2010)

WTM45 said:


> So, we are gonna hold their press releases as fact.
> That's smart.
> Ever heard of "bluffing" or "poker face?"
> Even if true, that is FAR from being a nuclear threat.
> ...



I suppose you have an intelligence connection that is telling you all this things about Iran ?

Let me ask you, if you had a neighbor that began to pass the word around , he is going to kill you and this happens over and over, even shows you pics of his snipper rifle and one day you are walking and you see the neighbor on his side of the property aiming at your head, what do you do ?
Do you stop and ask him to show you if he has bullets ? or do you get down and shoot ?


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## WTM45 (Mar 7, 2010)

Lowjack said:


> I suppose you have an intelligence connection that is telling you all this things about Iran ?
> 
> Let me ask you, if you had a neighbor that began to pass the word around , he is going to kill you and this happens over and over, even shows you pics of his snipper rifle and one day you are walking and you see the neighbor on his side of the property aiming at your head, what do you do ?
> Do you stop and ask him to show you if he has bullets ? or do you get down and shoot ?



Very poor analogy, and you know it.
When he shows me his, I'll show him mine, then I'll offer to go shoot them together, share a six pack and burgers afterward and I'll find out just what the issues are between us.  We'll work it out.
If not, then we will agree to disagree and keep ourselves prepared for self defense.  That gives me no right to burn down his house, murder his family and do harm to his pets.

Iran has made some offending statements.  Yes, that has focused the international spotlight on them, and the world is investigating their capabilities and their abilities.
They have thrown nothing but words.  No punches.

If Israel wants to go after a bully that is a block away, they must remember what can result if the threats are found to be unsubstantiated and empty.
They will appear to be the aggressor.  Taking the bully pulpit has major repercussions.

It will take clear thinking level heads to handle the negotiations and the international relationship, not a hasty draw of the sword.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/05/world/middleeast/05mideast.html?ref=world



The link BH posted in the OP is junk.  It is a fraud, posted on a flimsy site by a person using "Tyler Durden" as their name.
Bogus.

Now, the second link has a little more relavency.  It addresses the Israel/Palestinian situation.  That's an ongoing fisticuff.

PS:  Beautiful avatar picture, Lowjack!  What a cutie!


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## earl (Mar 7, 2010)

Lead Poison said:


> Because God does things his way in his time.





So they can wait if that's what God wants instead of doing what THEY want. Interesting concept you have .


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## Lowjack (Mar 7, 2010)

earl said:


> So they can wait if that's what God wants instead of doing what THEY want. Interesting concept you have .



You are forgetting God has a time line, he has set the days in which you were to be born and die, he also set the day and hour when the messiah was to come, the day he died the day he resurrected and the day he will come back.
Just as well he has set the day when all things are to be when he will judge the nations, how much more time should God allowed to wicked nations ?6,000 more years ?


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## Israel (Mar 7, 2010)

It is very difficult at times, indeed impossible without the intercession of the Holy Spirit, for any of us to wait on God's time.
We see wrong...and we want it righted.
We see suffering, and we want it alleviated.
We see contradiction, and we want truth manifest.
We see death, and we want it swallowed immediately by life.
We often forget these very desires are God born, and God breathed, but we never know until the spirit reveals, just how much of the resolution we want done in our time and our way.
Only after the Lord has dealt with our own impatience and carnality that we so casually throw in the mix, can we really appreciate the truth of mercy triumphing over judgment.
When mercy is, as seen in Christ, the withholding of all the legitimate things he could have said and done...but didn't, just to keep a soul from perishing, we then begin to see the forbearance of God is neither weakness nor ignorance, but Christ continuing to be the minister of all grace on our behalf.
God knows how to rightly destroy enemies...and by mercy and grace, often makes them His friends.


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