# So how more so than why do folks buy these new pickups?



## j_seph

A $60k pickup for 5 years 0%, that is $1000 a month not counting insurance. Is there that many folks got that high of a paying job? I won't even get into the teens and 20-30 year olds I see driving them. I just cannot comprehend. Just looked up a used F-250, 2017 -2019 and even them are $54k to $72k


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## coolbreezeroho

still driving a 2003 ford ranger here...300,000 plus miles on the motor


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## northgeorgiasportsman

5 year used to be the standard long-term loan.  These days, 6,7 and even 8 years aren't uncommon.  That $60k truck probably ends up costing $100k by then.


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## HD28

I scratch my head bout this every day.

Folks must be making serious scratch theses days!

I honestly don't know how they do it, but good for them!


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## ChidJ

The people who can't afford them buy them because they make it easy. Easy to sign your soul away to these doggone automotive swindler shops. 

Drive a paid off vehicle and buy a gun a month instead! After 8 years, your gun room's contents will still be worth what you paid!


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## Nicodemus

New trucks cost more now than what I paid for my house and homestead.


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## specialk

must be nice.....


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## campboy

They can have em


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## CurLee

I saved up and put down half on a new F250. Payments are $460/mo but I send $500.

Up until then I had a 1969 C-10 and a 1995 Jeep(still do). Never bought a new vehicle for myself, just kept the wife in one.


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## Nicodemus

Debt and interest will eat you alive, if you don`t keep it under control.


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## trad bow

When I retired I bought myself a new truck(Tacoma off road) a fishing boat and a utv. Paid cash and will still be driving them all when my time on earth be done. Those were the only vehicles and boats I ever bought myself new.


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## Whitefeather

New truck and new SUV sitting in the driveway of a new $350,00 house with a $60,000 bass boat in the garage and a $30,000 camper are getting real common around here. I’ve been doing something wrong for 30 years. 

Good for them I guess but, I don’t know how they’re doing it.


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## Railroader

I must be doing it all wrong...

I'm 52, drive crap, own my house, and owe nobody nothin'...

1k truck payment??

Puh-leeese!!!


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## BassRaider

Saved money, invested wisely to pay off all debts since retired 11 years ago. Today, paid cash for new truck after trading 13 yr old truck. Got lucky I guess?


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## Milkman

I bought a new 1973 F100 Ranger V8 automatic when I graduated from high school. It looked very similar to the attached picture. I think I paid $400 down and $120 a month for 36 months.  Things sure have changed.


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## Havana Dude

Drive a 1992 Toyota 4x4, and have a 2001 F250, 7.3 diesel, to pull my 2005 fifth wheel. All bought used. Wife drives a 2013 suburban, only because her 2003 suburban, in immaculate condition, was totaled  in a high speed rear end crash. She was the one rear ended. Bought it in 18. I can’t swing a new vehicle payment period. I don’t get it either.


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## nc dawg

thats why I work..I promise ya,ya ain’t takin it with ya..


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## nrh0011

Price of used trucks ain't much cheaper...


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## 4HAND

To each his own, but we buy used.
I've owned 1 new vehicle. 1987 Chevy 4x4. Quickly realized you can save $1000's by buying slightly used .


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## The Original Rooster

New trucks are overpriced. I don't know how anyone can afford them anymore. I haven't bought a truck in over 10 years but when I do I'll buy one of the work truck models and I'll buy used.


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## killerv

northgeorgiasportsman said:


> 5 year used to be the standard long-term loan.  These days, 6,7 and even 8 years aren't uncommon.  That $60k truck probably ends up costing $100k by then.



folks these days only worry about the monthly payment. 

Yeah, you can find 0% up to 72 months, but you wont get all the rebates along with it. Some times you save more money taking the 1.9 percent finance and all the rebates, then just paying it off as quickly as possible. My friends do this but they have the money to pay it off within a couple months.


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## killerv

I just went through all this having not bought a truck since 2006. New prices will hurt your feelings. The difference between new and used just isn't that much unless you are looking at something with high mileage. But I am one that will run one until is just not economical to keep it. I looked at chevys, fords, gmc....would have entertained the Tundra but gas mileage seems to be the worst in those.

A friend of mine with a 760 credit score couldn't get the 0% at ford, they told him you had to be 780 or higher.


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## KS Bow Hunter

You think trucks are bad, go look at the new Yukon XL or Suburban with the 6.2l engine!  We buy both new and used but I normally buy me used or demo, and buy my wife new...but not often...drove the last MDX 13 years and 140K miles...just became too expensive to maintain at that age...bought a new Subaru with 1.9% and making double payments and will pay it off in about 1.3 years...

Plan to keep driving my paid for 2011 Yukon XL until I can find a deal on a 6.2l Suburban...

I live at the intersection of Brookhaven, Buckhead, and Sandy Springs...so I see these families with $1.2MM houses and 2 new BMWs or MBs in the driveway around here...or Range Rovers...

America is a consumption economy, fueled by a payment mentality...


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## killerv

I looked at the 6.2 really hard...but you have to run premium in them. 6.2 is a 2500 dollar option. But if you can drop 75k on a vehicle, whats the extra 75cents a gallon for premium.


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## treemanjohn

60 months?  Most now are financed for 84


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## Taco4x4

Havana Dude said:


> Drive a 1992 Toyota 4x4, and have a 2001 F250, 7.3 diesel, to pull my 2005 fifth wheel. All bought used. Wife drives a 2013 suburban, only because her 2003 suburban, in immaculate condition, was totaled  in a high speed rear end crash. She was the one rear ended. Bought it in 18. I can’t swing a new vehicle payment period. I don’t get it either.


Dude if you ever want to sell that Yota please give me first shot. I had a 92 bought new for 13 grand and drove it for 15 years and totaled it in an accident. 22RE 5 speed I really miss that little truck. Let me know


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## ShortMagFan

Get myself One of those new new trucks every 4-5 years then trade on a new one. Have never financed a car. When I trade on a new one I generally get about 60pct of the value of the new one

Work hard, save your sheckles and you can spend your money however you’d like


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## bassboy1

treemanjohn said:


> 60 months?  Most now are financed for 84



84 months?  

I know people that are financing the $11k anniversary edition bass tracker for 120 months.


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## Havana Dude

Taco4x4 said:


> Dude if you ever want to sell that Yota please give me first shot. I had a 92 bought new for 13 grand and drove it for 15 years and totaled it in an accident. 22RE 5 speed I really miss that little truck. Let me know



Will try and remember that.


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## bullgator

I bought a ‘19 High Country with the 6.2L in April of ‘19. They gave an extra $9000 off to finance thru GMAC. All I had to do was stay with them 4 months and then got new vehicle financing thru a local credit union at 3.5%. I retired this April and sold my old house in May. Truck is paid off as is my wife’s ‘16 Q5. We also pay extra every month and that helps with credit scores.


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## hipster dufus

Im actively truck shopping now. No fun at all. Low inventory. No bargains.i buy new and keep em till they die. Not much difference in price between new n used unless it is high miles used. All the finance guys say buy used, but if u can find a 2 or 3, even 4 yo vehicle w lo miles u gon pay a premium.


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## hipster dufus

I liken it to a financial advisor, who sits behind a desk, telling u till work till full retirement age. He isnt crawling around machinery outdoors or indoors w bad eyes and muscle aches.


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## Waddams

Mine's a 2003 Nissan Frontier. It's in great shape, I bought it used about 3 years ago for $6000 cash. I recently put new tires on it. The place tried to find other things to say "you need this, you need that" - they came up with nothing. It's turning out to be a very wise purchase. Insurance on it is dirt cheap too. Add a 250 lbs of sandbags over the rear axles and it's been able to negotiate it's way through some pretty nasty mud bogs as well. 

It's hauled several mulch and slate chip loads to the house so we could do our backyard landscaping the way we wanted it, and somehow we always come up with truck loads of crap to haul to metal recycling, electrical recycling, the dump, etc. I'm getting much more than my $6000 value out of it.

Can't say I wouldn't buy a new vehicle again, but at the moment, if I had to be looking for one, I'd be looking in the used category and I'd be looking at every used car review website looking for which ones have bad histories so I know what to avoid.


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## rattlesnake1

bullgator said:


> I bought a ‘19 High Country with the 6.2L in April of ‘19. They gave an extra $9000 off to finance thru GMAC. All I had to do was stay with them 4 months and then got new vehicle financing thru a local credit union at 3.5%. I retired this April and sold my old house in May. Truck is paid off as is my wife’s ‘16 Q5. We also pay extra every month and that helps with credit scores.


I have been looking at the 6.2 , is there a big power difference over the 5.3? does it tow good? what kind of fuel mileage? thanks.


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## Triple C

If it weren't for guys buying new trucks then we wouldn't have used ones to choose from.  Keep buying!


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## jiminbogart

Taco4x4 said:


> Dude if you ever want to sell that Yota please give me first shot. I had a 92 bought new for 13 grand and drove it for 15 years and totaled it in an accident. 22RE 5 speed I really miss that little truck. Let me know




I bought a '92 Extra Cab 4x4 22RE 5speed new. Sold it in '97.

My sister bought the same truck. She wants me to come get it but she lives in San Angelo, Tx. Too far to drive for me to drive, even for a free truck.


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## bullgator

rattlesnake1 said:


> I have been looking at the 6.2 , is there a big power difference over the 5.3? does it tow good? what kind of fuel mileage? thanks.


Can’t answer the towing question because all I pull is a 6 x 10 utility trailer with a mower or UTV........nothing big.
The 6.2 accelerates much better than the 5.3 from a dead stop or passing. On the open road I get better mileage from the 6.2 but my old 5.3 might have the edge in stop and go areas. You pay for a heavy foot on the 6.2 but if you can resist that I actually get a little better mileage overall.


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## Jim Thompson

It blows my mind how we continue selling trucks and the large SUVs with the price now and there's definitely no end in sight.

But we keep on selling cause folks keep on buying.  GM just had it's best Tahoe sales in a September since 2004.

Most of the people buying them are financing for 72-84 months and the majority are not rich.  Our average TRUCK buyer that finances is making 60-75k a year with a household income between 100-130k.

I am in farm country and we also have a large number of farmers who are generally cash buyers.


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## Deer Fanatic

I buy new ones because i generally put 60k+ miles a year on one. If I buy a used truck with 85k miles on it, I'm gonna double that number in 18 months. My last 4 trucks were an '06- traded for a '15 with 554k on it. '15-traded for a '18 with 212k on it. My '18 was totaled in Dec'19 with 85k on it. We shall see how many I can put on the '19 before it gives up the ghost!


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## livetohunt

Nicodemus said:


> Debt and interest will eat you alive, if you don`t keep it under control.



Especially on high dollar loans like a house or buying land. If you look at how much interest people pay on a 30 year home loan it is staggering.


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## Beenslayin

I drive a 2003 Ranger FX4 with the 4.0. I have had it since new. It gets horrible gas mileage.  It needs new tires and ball joints. I have 220000 on it. I have been shopping around but just cant pull the trigger. Especially with having lost over 50 percent of my income since July. I am supposed to get at least 25% of my salary back in January but I am not counting on it with the virus surging again.  I have a down payment for more than half of a Sierra SLT and my credit score is excellent, but every time I get close to a new truck I start feeling like I am going to throw up. I sat down and looked at the numbers and thought I was going to have a panic attack. I really just don't get how they are selling them or who is buying them.  Even when I was making my full salary, which was pretty darn good, the prices scared me away. I guess I am just worried about the future or what might happen with all of this uncertainty. But then I see people who are my age (mid 50's) pinching pennies and saving a huge nest egg only to pass away out of the blue and never got to get any enjoyment out of their money. I have gotten up twice this week, got ready to go buy that truck only to come to my senses to wait. I keep thinking they will be cheaper maybe next month... I know it sounds petty but I would really enjoy a new ride right now so I am kind of driving myself crazy about it. Think I will just put it out of my mind for now. Phew there I got that out of my system.


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## Marsupial

I bought a $60,000 truck in 2018, was a 100% tax write off so didn’t cost me anything. I traded it in last month, same dealer, another new truck and they gave me $48,000 for it. They put it up for sale on lot at $58,000.


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## 7 point

I drive a 04 f150 with 73k miles my mother bought it new in 04 I bought it from her 3 years ago with 40k on it paid 10,000 for .I dont see the need for a new truck plus I dont really like most of them.


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## nix03

We have people were I work that make less than 100k combined with spouse that have new Tahoe, crew cab 4 wheel drive diesel truck, camper, skeeter boat and at least a 250k house. I have no clue how they do it but he said all they have is payments.


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## 7 point

As long as I have a dependable truck a full belly and some woods to play in I'm satisfied


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## egomaniac247

I really lucked out by finding in 2019 by finding a 2016 F250 Lariat with only 10k miles on it listed at 40-something....and I traded in a jeep with under 50k miles on it so I ended up financing about $20k on the truck.

I don't know what the dealership was thinking b/c today they have 3 to 4 year old F250's with lesser packages and 75k miles on them for the same price that I got this one with 10k miles on it.  I expected to maybe find something wrong with this one but 2 years in and I haven't.


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## glynr329

Traded my 2004 Tacoma in bought a new 2018 Chevy 4 wheel drive. It sit in garage with 4000 miles. Still have not figured out why I did it. Toyota had 40 or 50,000 miles. I still drive my 94 Toyota everyday.


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## 7 point

glynr329 said:


> Traded my 2004 Tacoma in bought a new 2018 Chevy 4 wheel drive. It sit in garage with 4000 miles. Still have not figured out why I did it. Toyota had 40 or 50,000 miles. I still drive my 94 Toyota everyday.


It's hard to beat toyota I still have my ole tacoma 4wd 220k still good as new . If I did bite the bullet a get a new truck most likely it will be a tacoma 4wd v6


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## Ihunt

I’m 52 and just this year, finally bought me a 3/4 ton diesel. Yep, it’s terribly expensive but I tow A Lot and it does so much better than my 1/2 ton did. I fully expect to drive this one for at least 10 years. Maybe longer. At that point, I’ll probably get another and it will take me to the grave.


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## hawkeye123

I have never spent more than 17k on a truck until 2018 bought a 4X4 Tundra, almost 3 years old w/ 80k miles already, I drive a lot, paid 50k for it , made a lot of double payments, payment is 733 a month, owe 17, its worth 35 still , resell on Tacomas & Tundras is unreal, can get a lot for one w/ 150k on it, wife has a 2005 Forerunner w/ 80K miles on it got 3 or 4 buddies that want it bad... will drive both til we have 400k on em!!


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## hopper

My 2003 F250 FX4 V10 just bit it at 295,000 miles. Looked at new trucks? I have a new reman V10 motor on the way. No payments just the way I like it.


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## 7 point

hawkeye123 said:


> I have never spent more than 17k on a truck until 2018 bought a 4X4 Tundra, almost 3 years old w/ 80k miles already, I drive a lot, paid 50k for it , made a lot of double payments, payment is 733 a month, owe 17, its worth 35 still , resell on Tacomas & Tundras is unreal, can get a lot for one w/ 150k on it, wife has a 2005 Forerunner w/ 80K miles on it got 3 or 4 buddies that want it bad... will drive both til we have 400k on em!!


Toyota is the only way to go I've had 3 of them and they will easily go 400k


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## patsam

I owe nothing, pay nothing cept utilities. Don't have to have the fanciest truck around, though they ARE pretty. My house cost way less than the new trucks these days!!


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## Fletch_W

nix03 said:


> We have people were I work that make less than 100k combined with spouse that have new Tahoe, crew cab 4 wheel drive diesel truck, camper, skeeter boat and at least a 250k house. I have no clue how they do it but he said all they have is payments.




Zero savings. No 401k, no HSA, no IRA, no cash savings, no college savings for kids, no life insurance. You'd be surprised at all the nice things you can afford if you spend every single penny you earn. I have extended family that does this.


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## doenightmare

I have a 2002 Tundra 4x4 with 150K on it. It's been paid for and I'll drive her til she goes belly up. Spending 60K on a new truck - Nah. I could buy 20 acres for that money.


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## 7 point

I thought about a newer truck just for better gas mileage but that thought was short lived I could buy a lot of gas for 50k


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## gma1320

Unfortunately my wife's Honda element and my silverado are both getting close to being up for renewal.  My silverado burns amd leaks oil as fast as I pour it in these days. New vehicles are expensive.  Low mileage uses ones aren't much different.  Still cost a bunch.


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## nix03

Fletch_W said:


> Zero savings. No 401k, no HSA, no IRA, no cash savings, no college savings for kids, no life insurance. You'd be surprised at all the nice things you can afford if you spend every single penny you earn. I have extended family that does this.


I’m pretty sure that is what is going on with the one I mentioned.


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## OleCountryBoy

I see these f250/2500 asphalt queens running around town, these boys are dumber than dirt.  80K truck, 5K in wheels/tires burning diesel just to look cool.  

Average 5 year depreciation is 50%.  

A new 60K truck will cost over 5 yrs:

Tax - $4200
5yr 4.5% interest - $7K
Depreciation - $30K

$41K plus 12K fuel (100K miles), 5K insurance, 2K maintenance.

Roughly $60K total for 100K miles(20K annual).  60 cents a mile.

My 2012 F150 runs great, cost me new $38K out the door cash. 8+ yrs old gonna last me another 6-8 or so and I don't think I'll ever buy another brand new one.

When lusting over that new truck, stop and do the math!


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## natureman

After driving pickup trucks for 40 years and watching prices go thru the roof I said to heck with this.  Bought a new Subaru Outback and couldn't be happier.


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## Lilly001

I’m in the market for a new to me truck. 
I would like NOT to have the constant repairs.
But I’m going to keep my old one for camp. It’s a 2001 Silverado and isn’t worth squat for trade in.
I could buy new outright, but I won’t. 
I can’t stomach taking that kind of cash out of my accounts.
I’ll probably go 5 year or so used, but even those are pricey.
I’ve been in this mode for over a year and can’t pull the trigger.
I’ve even been to 5 dealers and looked at thousands of adds.
I guess I’ll eventually find something, or my current ride will die and force my hand.


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## nix03

Lilly001 said:


> I’m in the market for a new to me truck.
> I would like NOT to have the constant repairs.
> But I’m going to keep my old one for camp. It’s a 2001 Silverado and isn’t worth squat for trade in.
> I could buy new outright, but I won’t.
> I can’t stomach taking that kind of cash out of my accounts.
> I’ll probably go 5 year or so used, but even those are pricey.
> I’ve been in this mode for over a year and can’t pull the trigger.
> I’ve even been to 5 dealers and looked at thousands of adds.
> I guess I’ll eventually find something, or my current ride will die and force my hand.


I’m in the boat with you.


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## Jim Thompson

Lilly001 said:


> I’m in the market for a new to me truck.
> I would like NOT to have the constant repairs.
> But I’m going to keep my old one for camp. It’s a 2001 Silverado and isn’t worth squat for trade in.
> I could buy new outright, but I won’t.
> I can’t stomach taking that kind of cash out of my accounts.
> I’ll probably go 5 year or so used, but even those are pricey.
> I’ve been in this mode for over a year and can’t pull the trigger.
> I’ve even been to 5 dealers and looked at thousands of adds.
> I guess I’ll eventually find something, or my current ride will die and force my hand.





nix03 said:


> I’m in the boat with you.





IF our inventory levels get back to normal over the next 6 months to a year the price of used will stabilize again and drop.  Although you're not talking dropping 10s of thousands, you may be talking 2-3k.  The current book on used amazes us every day right now, but it also scares us pretty bad as well.  We are having to put blood in them on trade (and for those buying at auction) and if the market levels out too quickly we will be sitting on that blood in 6 months.


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## Wifeshusband

I've got a cousin who's a manger at a GM Dealership. I could get a "deal" if I contacted him. But today, a "deal," is no "deal."  I think you have to be a little wacko to spend $50,000 on a truck.  I've probably wasted more money on new vehicles than most of the forum members, beginning with a 1974 Camaro.  Finally, as I got older and learned to appreciate things, I started hanging onto vehicles. Here is a picture of my hunting truck, a 2003 Tacoma. Miles driven, 216, 000. Deer hauled, unknown. I say, let the good times roll. I also have a '98 Nissan Frontier, which is my fishing truck.


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## doenightmare

Kia needs to come out with a truck.


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## madsam

I bought a 2020 f250 new of the lot. I want have too buy another truck
for 10-15 yrs. I keep my vehicles at least 10 yrs. before purchasing another.
I love that new truck smell !!!!


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## Wifeshusband

I'll take the old truck smell with no monthly (mortgage) payments.


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## aabradley82

I make my living with my trucks. Still hurts my feelings to spend 50k+ for a new truck. ‘14 has 310k in it pulling hard. The 18 I bought last October as a new leftover is almost out of warranty. Kept them serviced and they’ll last a long time. Remember, only buy a diesel if you absolutely need it; the base models have all the bells and whistles the fancy trucks had 10 years ago and a 4x4 is cheaper new than used.


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## NCHillbilly

I went with my wife to the Nissan place to get her car serviced yesterday, she's got free regular maintenance for three years. I was walking around out on the lot, and the new Titans were averaging about $64k list price. I don't see how folks afford them.


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## Buck70

Me either. That is more than I paid for my house.


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## Jim Thompson

Buck70 said:


> Me either. That is more than I paid for my house.



If it matters, I've heard that exact same statement about 43,812 times since I sold my 1st truck back in the late 80s. They've always been expensive for sure.

Nowadays they are really really expensive


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## OleCountryBoy

”The Ford F150 makes a gross profit margin of $10,000 to $13,000/vehicle. It sells 800,000 F150s each year, for a profit of $8 _billion_ or more on just the F150s.”

If Ford got out of the car and suv business and solely built trucks, they would have a market cap triple what it is today.


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## Triple C

Always remember...Takes all the boys buying new trucks to supply the used truck market.  Tip you hat to every good ol boy you see driving a new truck.  It'll prolly come on the used market in the next year to 18 months.


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## Jim Thompson

OleCountryBoy said:


> ”The Ford F150 makes a gross profit margin of $10,000 to $13,000/vehicle. It sells 800,000 F150s each year, for a profit of $8 _billion_ or more on just the F150s.”
> 
> If Ford got out of the car and suv business and solely built trucks, they would have a market cap triple what it is today.




Although you may already know this (and didnt allude to it being different) most folks dont or wont believe it, but that profit is to Ford not to the dealer.  Dealers work on a much less profit margin on new vehicles.  On a 50k Chevy truck we are somewhere around 5k from sticker to dead net including holdback and advertising.  Course it's different on every truck depending equipment etc, but thats close.

Including cars, SUVs and trucks, last month we ran 1174.54 a copy on 118 new GMs.  Manufacture money was $400 a copy.  So we ended up at 1574.53 a ride.  Best front end gross we have run in the 5 years or so before covid.


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## mallardsx2

Same way people are buying $400,000 homes. They are financing it and crossing their fingers.


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## killerv

mallardsx2 said:


> Same way people are buying $400,000 homes. They are financing it and crossing their fingers.



why are they crossing their fingers?


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## mallardsx2

lol Seriously?


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## OleCountryBoy

Jim Thompson said:


> Although you may already know this (and didnt allude to it being different) most folks dont or wont believe it, but that profit is to Ford not to the dealer.  Dealers work on a much less profit margin on new vehicles.  On a 50k Chevy truck we are somewhere around 5k from sticker to dead net including holdback and advertising.  Course it's different on every truck depending equipment etc, but thats close.
> 
> Including cars, SUVs and trucks, last month we ran 1174.54 a copy on 118 new GMs.  Manufacture money was $400 a copy.  So we ended up at 1574.53 a ride.  Best front end gross we have run in the 5 years or so before covid.



Exactly, why would they share new vehicle margins when they don't have to.  You are just a warehouse and a service partner.  You have to sell their new products even at a loss at times to get the benefit of servicing them and selling a few used vehicles, that's where you make your money.


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## Jim Thompson

OleCountryBoy said:


> Exactly, why would they share new vehicle margins when they don't have to.  You are just a warehouse and a service partner.  You have to sell their new products even at a loss at times to get the benefit of servicing them and selling a few used vehicles, that's where you make your money.




Correct although the margins on used are much much less than in the past as well.  Same month 86 used at 2024.60 a copy.  December is generally a new car month which is why new was higher volume than used.  We normally run about even.  All of our new vehicle invoices and costs are available on the web.  Just most folks dont believe they are real numbers lol.

Money is also made in parts, service and on the financing, business office side.

Definitely not poormouthing, because there's money to be made but most never believe we run on as tight of margins as we do.  We as dealers and the manufactures created the crazy way of buying cars and the trust issues with the buying public.  Thankfully the perception is changing as newer folks get into the market to buy and dealers lose their advertising games

All that being said, vehicles are too danged expensive.  They've always been too expensive and it only gets worse.  Gotta be a bottom to it somewhere


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## nix03

I saw a used truck that was $60k and had over 100k miles on it. Just don’t see how people are paying those prices.


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## 1eyefishing

I tried to do this with my 2013 ram 1500. But no way.  I couldn't haul a boat like that off the lot (much less back-and-forth to Florida over a dozen times a year) without a new truck. I had to move up to the F250. Couldn't get my hands on a gas burner Dodge 2500.  Paid down payment so that monthly is under $500. Same for the boat.
With 2 other campers, gotta have it.
Took me 60 years to get here. Couldn't do this when I was working for a living and paying for family.


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## huntersluck

I have thought several times about buying something else but can’t bring myself to do it.  I have a 97 f150 that I have had for 13 years this year.  I have 11k in the cost of the truck ,new engine from ford and trans rebuild.  I think less than 1000 a year is pretty good investment.


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## Railroader

It's a funny thing.  Since I have been driving around that nice little 23 year old Toyota I just bought, several guys with a big ol new truck and big ol truck payment are pestering me trying to buy it....

Go figure.


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## Redbow

Railroader said:


> It's a funny thing.  Since I have been driving around that nice little 23 year old Toyota I just bought, several guys with a big ol new truck and big ol truck payment are pestering me trying to buy it....
> 
> Go figure.


You would be surprised how many times people have approached me about buying my old '86 Chevy silverado when I get out in it. I always tell them to see my Wife when the undertaker is through with me.  Selling it before then ain't gonna happen, $20,000 would not get me to sign the title over to anyone.


----------



## tree cutter 08

Redbow said:


> You would be surprised how many times people have approached me about buying my old '86 Chevy silverado when I get out in it. I always tell them to see my Wife when the undertaker is through with me.  Selling it before then ain't gonna happen, $20,000 would not get me to sign the title over to anyone.


Those old chevys are fetching a nice chunk now.


----------



## Mattval

2002 Chevy Silverado. Regular cab to!  At one time my truck was a full-sized truck. I can't believe people drive these huge trucks now a days.


----------



## Crakajak

Whitefeather said:


> New truck and new SUV sitting in the driveway of a new $350,00 house with a $60,000 bass boat in the garage and a $30,000 camper are getting real common around here. I’ve been doing something wrong for 30 years.
> 
> Good for them I guess but, I don’t know how they’re doing it.


I do a lot of work in those type homes.......not a lot of furniture and decorations in a lot of them and  credit cards maxed out.


----------



## Redbow

tree cutter 08 said:


> Those old chevys are fetching a nice chunk now.


Had a chance a while back to buy an '84 silverado with a new engine and updated cab with new seat for $1800. Still kicking myself that I let that one slip away. Body was good also with minimal rust. The truck needed brake work and I was 100 miles from home. Darn good deal on that old Chevy.


----------



## Foxfire

Dealer offered $33,000.00, 9600 miles, 2018, Silverado 4X4 LT. Trade on 2021 Trail Boss.

Foxfire


----------



## killerv

Foxfire said:


> Dealer offered $33,000.00, 9600 miles, 2018, Silverado 4X4 LT. Trade on 2021 Trail Boss.
> 
> Foxfire




let us know when that rear window starts leakin


----------



## Foxfire

killerv said:


> let us know when that rear window starts leakin



Why should the rear window leak, never been opened !!!


----------



## killerv

Foxfire said:


> Why should the rear window leak, never been opened !!!



nothing to do with it being opened....there are 204 pages on the subject on the gm forums. GM refuses to address the issue. I personally know of 4 gm trucks 2019 and newer that had the leak. One guy had his truck bought back with the Ga lemon law due to its 3rd leak. His new 6.2 just started leaking also after 7k miles.


----------



## Ray357

j_seph said:


> A $60k pickup for 5 years 0%, that is $1000 a month not counting insurance. Is there that many folks got that high of a paying job? I won't even get into the teens and 20-30 year olds I see driving them. I just cannot comprehend. Just looked up a used F-250, 2017 -2019 and even them are $54k to $72k


It's crazy. I know a lot of folks financing them 10 years. My wife told me about how we could buy a $60k Expedition for "just" so much a month. I told her (unallowed words) No!


----------



## zedex

I know guys that worked in the Alberta oilsands and make serious bank... I'm talking $125/hr and 12 hour days, 7 days a week for 3 straight weeks,  one week off and back to the oil camps. Overtime was paid after 8 hrs rather than over 37.5.

They had money to burn. Many drove $100K trucks. Some drove their new Mercedes to camp. They bought million dollar homes.

Then, Trudeau shut down a lot of the drilling.  Contracts cancelled,  jobs lost.


----------



## Dutch

2018 Z71 and a 2013 Tracker Pro Team 175 TF. Paid $17800 for the Tracker in 2013 and $38000 f0r the Z71 in 2018. Boat was paid for before I bought the truck. Truck will be paid for at the end of the year. 

Our house and land is paid for, no huge credit card bills. I and the wife make good money and do not live a extravagant lifestyle.

Its all about choices and not trying to keep up with the Jones's.


----------



## WishboneW

Redbow said:


> You would be surprised how many times people have approached me about buying my old '86 Chevy silverado when I get out in it. I always tell them to see my Wife when the undertaker is through with me.  Selling it before then ain't gonna happen, $20,000 would not get me to sign the title over to anyone.



Bet they are thinking they can get it for 5k or less though


----------



## Redbow

WishboneW said:


> Bet they are thinking they can get it for 5k or less though


Oh, they want it cheaper than that, like $2000 or less.


----------



## WishboneW

Redbow said:


> Oh, they want it cheaper than that, like $2000 or less.


When people ask me if I want to sell my 84 I always  say sure if you can find me an affordable replacement. Can be any truck that will tow my tractor. Have yet to get any one to come up with an alternative. My wife hauling fertilizer as I spread it on the lease


----------



## Todd E

Only thing to add...............

Do not try and keep up with the Jones's. 
They are broke.


----------



## killerv

There sure are a lot of assumptions in this thread about others and how in the world they pay for things. We don't know. We need to worry about ourselves. Half this nation worries about the others pocket book, class envy, etc...dont let it rub off on you.

Someone wants to spend every last nickel they make, go for it. Joker may die tomorrow, who am I to tell him how to enjoy his/her life.


----------



## hipster dufus

We all sound like a buncha grumpy old men! Get off my lawn!


----------



## Concrete Pete

j_seph said:


> Is there that many folks got that high of a paying job?



I’m blessed with what many would consider an above average income (thank God) and I am genuinely curious about this.

I don’t begrudge anyone with a nice new truck. I just know what the median household income in the US is and wonder how people are making these payments.


----------



## glynr329

I paid my 2018 chevy 4x4 off a few months ago sitting in garage 4000 miles. I realized that was a very bad decision.


----------



## Raylander

Concrete Pete said:


> I’m blessed with what many would consider an above average income (thank God) and I am genuinely curious about this.
> 
> I don’t begrudge anyone with a nice new truck. I just know what the median household income in the US is and wonder how people are making these payments.



Tax incentives as a business owner and/or self employeed


----------



## Concrete Pete

glynr329 said:


> I paid my 2018 chevy 4x4 off a few months ago sitting in garage 4000 miles. I realized that was a very bad decision.



Congrats on paying it off. I don’t know that it’s a bad decision. You probably made a smart choice given that you’ve got it paid off.

Looking at inflation right now and the avg rates of return from the stock market we’ll be seeing, it might have been smarter to just buy a new vehicle and pay for it vs investing.


----------



## Concrete Pete

Raylander said:


> Tax incentives as a business owner and/or self employeed



That bonus depreciation is awesome. Full value of the purchase price * your effective tax rate (so not a 100% reduction in the tax bill, but still much better than forking it over to Uncle Sam).

So if you’re paying a 20% effective tax rate and you buy a truck for $45k, you’re getting a $9K discount on your taxes. So it’s like paying $36k.

Unless there’s a credit I don’t know about that let’s you offset your tax bill dollar for dollar for the full price of the truck. That’d be a better deal.


----------



## Mattval

j_seph said:


> A $60k pickup for 5 years 0%, that is $1000 a month not counting insurance. Is there that many folks got that high of a paying job? I won't even get into the teens and 20-30 year olds I see driving them. I just cannot comprehend. Just looked up a used F-250, 2017 -2019 and even them are $54k to $72k


J me and you both must be doing something wrong!


----------



## 660griz

Not sure how others, including teens and 20-30 somethings, are doing it but, for me...40+ years of hard work, and smart choices, to get where I am. I deserve a few bad choices now.   I find that if you set the bill pay to automatic, that $1000+ payment doesn't hurt as bad.


----------



## 4HAND

4HAND said:


> To each his own, but we buy used.
> I've owned 1 new vehicle. 1987 Chevy 4x4. Quickly realized you can save $1000's by buying slightly used .


Thought I should correct this. 
We recently bought a new truck. The market is so messed up right now, we could buy a new one for about what used ones were going for. It's crazy.


----------



## HermanMerman

4HAND said:


> Thought I should correct this.
> We recently bought a new truck. The market is so messed up right now, we could buy a new one for about what used ones were going for. It's crazy.



I’m in the same boat right now. Looking to replace my 2008 Ram with 220k miles on it… was planning on a slightly used one but at this point I’ll either keep driving the one I have until things are half way normal again or bite the bullet and just buy a new one.


----------



## killerv

4HAND said:


> Thought I should correct this.
> We recently bought a new truck. The market is so messed up right now, we could buy a new one for about what used ones were going for. It's crazy.



yep, when only talking a 3 grand difference or less between new and used....I'm going new everytime, getting the 0% or lower interest rate than used rates, and all the incentives offered, etc....unlike used vehicles.


----------



## 4HAND

HermanMerman said:


> I’m in the same boat right now. Looking to replace my 2008 Ram with 220k miles on it… was planning on a slightly used one but at this point I’ll either keep driving the one I have until things are half way normal again or bite the bullet and just buy a new one.


Yep. Our problem was my wife's Tahoe was our primary vehicle. 2012 w/183,000 miles on it. Nothing wrong with it, but getting a little heavy on mileage. 
We couldn't find a decent deal on a Tahoe so we bought the truck.
In a year or so when the market gets back to normal (hopefully) we'll buy her a Tahoe & this truck will roll down to me.


----------



## lonewolf247

My son just bought a new Chevy Trail Boss. All trucks are overpriced now, including this one, but the used ones, with 30,000-50,000 miles were selling for the same price?

My truck is a 2015 GMC 2500HD, and the book value is just about the same price as I paid for it back then?  Seems tempting to trade it, but, it's paid for and I don't want another note.  Going to put a little money into any maintenance and repairs needed, and drive it another 4-5 years!


----------



## Robert28

lonewolf247 said:


> My son just bought a new Chevy Trail Boss. All trucks are overpriced now, including this one, but the used ones, with 30,000-50,000 miles were selling for the same price?
> 
> My truck is a 2015 GMC 2500HD, and the book value is just about the same price as I paid for it back then?  Seems tempting to trade it, but, it's paid for and I don't want another note.  Going to put a little money into any maintenance and repairs needed, and drive it another 4-5 years!


The only way to get a new truck these days is order it. I think Ford was doing a $1500 rebate on orders this month if I remember right. Worst time I can ever remember to buy a truck right now with the chip shortage the way it is. I would keep your truck too.


----------



## ucfireman

killerv said:


> yep, when only talking a 3 grand difference or less between new and used....I'm going new everytime, getting the 0% or lower interest rate than used rates, and all the incentives offered, etc....unlike used vehicles.


Haven't shopped in a while but used to be you could choose the 0% or the incentives but not both. Have things changed?


----------



## Son

One thing for sure. I wont be buying a new vehicle of any kind. Pricing has gone absolutely stupid. And check out used vehicle prices, they are off the chart too. Best to keep patching up what you have and keep rolling. Evidently those we see driving new pickups around, have some means of writing em off. Really turns my head when I see teenagers driving new trucks these days. Last 3/4 ton 4x4 I bought in 74 cost 5700.00 bucks and it was a Ranger XLT full time four wheel drive. with a 360 in it. New Oldsmobile bought in 1964 cost 2670.00, The new prices definitely hurts those of us on a fixed Social Security income. In fact, if were not for my own retirement income, I would probably be homeless if SS was all I had. Just taxes would take me down and get our home.


----------



## Son

Last truck bought, Nissan SV 4x4 2011, and it's still going. Even though I've put some dents and lots of mud on it. Has the towing package and  a sick cylander motor


----------



## Buford_Dawg

JT or anyone else in the Truck sales business, is there any light at the end of the tunnel?  My current truck is getting some age and some minor but expensive things are cropping up.  Would like to buy something new or less than a couple years old, but it is really expensive at the moment.  When a basic Chevy or Ford crew cab truck costs 50k or more out the door, it is tough on the common guy.


----------



## KS Bow Hunter

Buford_Dawg said:


> JT or anyone else in the Truck sales business, is there any light at the end of the tunnel?  My current truck is getting some age and some minor but expensive things are cropping up.  Would like to buy something new or less than a couple years old, but it is really expensive at the moment.  When a basic Chevy or Ford crew cab truck costs 50k or more out the door, it is tough on the common guy.


This is the new normal.  The manufacturers are going to keep inventories low and prices high.  They've publicly said that.  So used car prices are going to increase, and new car prices are going to stay at MSRP.  My credit union has a car buying service, 2 full time people, and they are saying that MSRP is the new normal.  Above MSRP on in demand models isn't out of the question. 

I just bought a "new" 2005 NISSAN TITAN from my Dad because I am not going to pay the new prices.  It's only got 52K on it...and 1K of those was me driving it home from Kansas to Georgia yesterday.


----------



## Dutch

Buford_Dawg said:


> JT or anyone else in the Truck sales business, is there any light at the end of the tunnel?  My current truck is getting some age and some minor but expensive things are cropping up.  Would like to buy something new or less than a couple years old, but it is really expensive at the moment.  When a basic Chevy or Ford crew cab truck costs 50k or more out the door, it is tough on the common guy.


 I hear you.
Carvana offered my $36000 for my 2018 z71, thought about selling it as that was what I paid for it.
Looked at current truck prices and decided to keep it.


----------



## KS Bow Hunter

There is my "new" truck...52K on it and always garaged...it will be a great hunting and fishing vehicle...


----------



## Dutch

KS Bow Hunter said:


> There is my "new" truck...52K on it and always garaged...it will be a great hunting and fishing vehicle...
> View attachment 1119434


Good looking ride.
I am thinking of buying a "beater" to use for hunting and fishing trips.


----------



## KS Bow Hunter

Dutch said:


> Good looking ride.
> I am thinking of buying a "beater" to use for hunting and fishing trips.


Thanks.  It's not a beater really.  52K on it, always garaged, fully loaded leather etc.  My dad takes great care of cars.  I bought the last one from him too...his '96 Chevy single cab short bed when he bought this one in 2005.  It had 50K on it when I bought it.  Should have kept it but sold it be cause we had kids and car seats don't do well in a single cab pickup!  I am going to level this one and replace the tires with something more aggressive at some point but it will last the rest of my hunting life I'd guess...


----------



## Dutch

KS Bow Hunter said:


> Thanks.  It's not a beater really.  52K on it, always garaged, fully loaded leather etc.  My dad takes great care of cars.  I bought the last one from him too...his '96 Chevy single cab short bed when he bought this one in 2005.  It had 50K on it when I bought it.  Should have kept it but sold it be cause we had kids and car seats don't do well in a single cab pickup!  I am going to level this one and replace the tires with something more aggressive at some point but it will last the rest of my hunting life I'd guess...



Sorry, I wasn't referring to your truck as a beater...just what I was looking for to run around on dirt roads and such, to keep the wear and tear off my "newer" truck.

I want a late 90's to mid 2000's truck.


----------



## 7 point

KS Bow Hunter said:


> This is the new normal.  The manufacturers are going to keep inventories low and prices high.  They've publicly said that.  So used car prices are going to increase, and new car prices are going to stay at MSRP.  My credit union has a car buying service, 2 full time people, and they are saying that MSRP is the new normal.  Above MSRP on in demand models isn't out of the question.
> 
> I just bought a "new" 2005 NISSAN TITAN from my Dad because I am not going to pay the new prices.  It's only got 52K on it...and 1K of those was me driving it home from Kansas to Georgia yesterday.


I bought a 04 f150 with 45k miles on it garage kept from my mother.


----------



## KS Bow Hunter

Dutch said:


> Sorry, I wasn't referring to your truck as a beater...just what I was looking for to run around on dirt roads and such, to keep the wear and tear off my "newer" truck.
> 
> I want a late 90's to mid 2000's truck.


No offense taken at all...at it's age, you'd think it would be a beater...but it is pristine condition...


----------



## KS Bow Hunter

7 point said:


> I bought a 04 f150 with 45k miles on it garage kept from my mother.


Man that's even lower miles than mine!  Nice!


----------



## 7 point

I paid 10k for 4 years ago .still better than buying a new one.


----------



## 7 point

Here


----------



## killerv

Is that Tailypo in the above pic?


----------



## Son

I've been shopping for a used Nissan Frontier 4x4 SV, one owner, no accidents. Found a few that looked good, but the prices are too high for the mileage, 2015 or newer. And nobody will haggle price these days. Some are paying extreme prices for used vehicles to resale. I hope they have to eat them. I own a 2011 with only 115K on it, 4x4 sv towing package etc. Very nice ride and great in the woods.


----------



## Big7

Last one I bought new was. Ram 1500 Sport.
New in 1998.
Lost to fire in 2018. Running like a champ.

It had all the bells and whistles.
A little under 25k with 2/10th of a mile on it.

I won't be buying a new one prob ever again.


----------



## Son

Only folks I see buying new vehicles around here are the farmers who claim to go broke every year. Maybe that's why?....lol


----------



## menhadenman

Owning a business makes a big difference. I lived under the poverty line until my 30s and qualified as an orphan when I went to school. Drive a high roller Duramax these days but sure miss my old 5 speed W/T with no AC in the low country, pulling gillnets and living in a shack!


----------



## Buford_Dawg

Went 2 weeks back to look at a new 2021 Chevy 1500 crew cab 4x4, liked it, had brief discussion with Sales Manager, truck was their custom model, on the low end of their 1500 line, but it has about what I want, I would add leather seating.  Sticker was like 46k, dealer added 5k premium mark up as they called it so we at 51k for one of their cheapest levels.  I loved the truck just couldn't see myself paying that for a basic truck.  I'll keep driving my 2104 truck until things come down or dealers at minimum stop adding these crazy "premium" fees.  I can understand paying MSRP in this economy, but adding that much to it doesnt work for me.  And it may never come back down, who kjnows, this may be the new norm if you want to buy a new truck.


----------



## Railroader

One of the keys to having a pocket full of play money is realizing that it's cool to daily drive a well maintained "beater"....


----------



## 7 point

Diddy always told me you either have money or new things you cant have both .lol


----------



## killerv

Son said:


> Only folks I see buying new vehicles around here are the farmers who claim to go broke every year. Maybe that's why?....lol



Write offs, and after a few years when the write off gets less and less due to depreciation, go out a get a new one and start the process all over again.


.... and they spend all their money at gun shops. I knew a dairy farmer, nice as can be, but always complained about being broke and farming not making him any money, but always had nice accessorized trucks, restored old broncos, and always buying the newest deer rifle and scopes, sending them off to be accurized, hunting trips out of country, etc....he was broke though.


----------



## killerv

Buford_Dawg said:


> Went 2 weeks back to look at a new 2021 Chevy 1500 crew cab 4x4, liked it, had brief discussion with Sales Manager, truck was their custom model, on the low end of their 1500 line, but it has about what I want, I would add leather seating.  Sticker was like 46k, dealer added 5k premium mark up as they called it so we at 51k for one of their cheapest levels.  I loved the truck just couldn't see myself paying that for a basic truck.  I'll keep driving my 2104 truck until things come down or dealers at minimum stop adding these crazy "premium" fees.  I can understand paying MSRP in this economy, but adding that much to it doesnt work for me.  And it may never come back down, who kjnows, this may be the new norm if you want to buy a new truck.



Wasnt Woody Folsum was it? Buddy needed a basic work truck and they added 5k over sticker, he told them to shove it. This was in the last week or two.

GM just sent out a letter to dealers concerning the crazy markups and that its against their contracts between them and the dealership. The new Corvettes are seeing 25k markups.


----------



## Son

Any You Goes left? Alstate motor scooters?


----------



## Buford_Dawg

killerv said:


> Wasnt Woody Folsum was it? Buddy needed a basic work truck and they added 5k over sticker, he told them to shove it. This was in the last week or two.
> 
> GM just sent out a letter to dealers concerning the crazy markups and that its against their contracts between them and the dealership. The new Corvettes are seeing 25k markups.


No, northeast Ga Chevy dealer with a good reputation, bought from them before...


----------



## poohbear

Buford_Dawg said:


> Went 2 weeks back to look at a new 2021 Chevy 1500 crew cab 4x4, liked it, had brief discussion with Sales Manager, truck was their custom model, on the low end of their 1500 line, but it has about what I want, I would add leather seating.  Sticker was like 46k, dealer added 5k premium mark up as they called it so we at 51k for one of their cheapest levels.  I loved the truck just couldn't see myself paying that for a basic truck.  I'll keep driving my 2104 truck until things come down or dealers at minimum stop adding these crazy "premium" fees.  I can understand paying MSRP in this economy, but adding that much to it doesnt work for me.  And it may never come back down, who kjnows, this may be the new norm if you want to buy a new truck.


All the fees is why I don’t by at a dealer.


----------



## GTMODawg

Folks have lost their minds LOL....Jeep Grand Wagoneer.  $111,000 if you can find one LOL.  A Jeep.  Made by the same company that builds Fiats and Chryslers LOL.  You gotta be out of your cotton picking mind to buy a Fiat at any price......


----------



## Big7

GTMODawg said:


> Folks have lost their minds LOL....Jeep Grand Wagoneer.  $111,000 if you can find one LOL.  A Jeep.  Made by the same company that builds Fiats and Chryslers LOL.  You gotta be out of your cotton picking mind to buy a Fiat at any price......


Sister bought a Grand Cherokee about 6 months ago. 2WD 55k.

Mama has a Grand Cherokee 2010.
Daddy bought it. In good shape. She don't drive much except for grocery store and church.
Ain't got a scratch on it. Less than 100k miles.
Prolly last her the rest of her life. I know my Daddy well enough to know he wouldn't get ripped off. He was kinda' tight. ?

My BIL has one.
Both my nephews have one.
One has a Grand Cherokee.
The other has a suped up 4WD but it ain't a Grand Cherokee.

We are kind of a Jeep family.
I even had a Grand Cherokee with wife #2.

Great vehicles.
But I ain't paying what they are going for now.

And.. A decent 250 or 2500 truck- they have lost their mind on. You can buy half a house for that much.

I'd do a George Jones and change a few belts on a riding mower and ride that first. ?


----------



## Dutch

2022 GMC Denali 2500...$85K

2022 Chevrolet 1500 4WD...$65K

I paid $34k for my 2018 Z71 in April 2018.

Just bought the wife a 2022 Subaru Forester Limited...$44K


----------



## deers2ward

Paid $56K for my 2500 Duramax High Country in 2016. Only got 75K miles on it right now, so hope to have it awhile, but guessing when I do have to get another truck they will be close to $150K by then! Especially with how the value of our dollar is going down like a rock in the ocean


----------



## Big7

Dutch said:


> 2022 GMC Denali 2500...$85K
> 
> 2022 Chevrolet 1500 4WD...$65K
> 
> I paid $34k for my 2018 Z71 in April 2018.
> 
> Just bought the wife a 2022 Subaru Forester Limited...$44K


I might get close to that Z71 but the rest of them are to rich for my blood.

Last brand new truck I bought was a 98 Ram 1500 Sport. Best vehicle I ever had. 20 years.

Long story, but it was still in great shape and ran like a sewing machine.

I was in a coma for 2 months in 2018.
They done give me up for dead except the X wasn't having that.

Anyhoooo... My Uncle took it out to our farm and let it sit. Was going to move it one day to cut the grass.
Squirrels and Chipmunks must have chewed the gas likes. Soon as he rolled it over, it basically blew up and burnt to the ground. If his help hadn't been there to get him out he prolly would have burned to death.

Melted everything. Even the frame.

All the bells and whistles 24k
Made me sick when I found out. That was my primary vehicle. ?


----------



## Dutch

The Subaru was my wife's retirement gift. 

Her Company paid for half of it.


----------



## Big7

Best 24k I ever spent. Odometer quit about the first 10 years. Had almost 200k on it then.

I wouldn't be surprised of it had over 400k when it burned up. I loved that truck like a part of me.


----------



## DOUG 281

Beats me. 75,000 truck and a 100.00 dog now we are huntin


----------



## earlthegoat2

I’m loving the 2005 Jeep Liberty I bought 5 months ago for $4900. Parts can be gotten anywhere. You can fix it yourself because it is not that complicated and there is a YT vid for every problem ever on them. Mechanically, that are very close to Wranglers which I hear are marginally popular…….so there are hundreds of similar vids for those.

I never knew how simple and reliable and easy to work on an older Jeep was. I still roll my eyes at some “Jeep people” but have respect for the vehicles. My brother, who is a quasi-Jeep guy, told me there is always someone at a mechanic shop who drives a Jeep because they are so easy and cheap to repair. Now, I am that guy. 

The things I like about it most:

Manual turn dial HVAC controls-simple, reliable, and cheap
Manual 4x4 shift-same
Manual transmission shifter (it is an auto trans though)- same
Full size rear mounted spare-perfect out of the way spot with easy access
Normal electronically shifted 4 sp transmission- no CVTs or a zillion gears and shift points or nonsense like that
No modern EVAP nuisances- simple canister, vent, solenoid, gas cap.
Throttle cable
No driver assist “features”
Basically nothing forced upon us by the govt or manufacturers in the last 12 or so years.

Things I don’t like:

Gas mileage -it is bad but the low purchase price will make it so it will takes several decades for that to matter
No Bluetooth…..yet


----------



## Big7

DOUG 281 said:


> Beats me. 75,000 truck and a 100.00 dog now we are huntin




Don't forget the $350.00 for a half day shooting, notice iI said "shooting" NOT hunting, pen raised quail put out the night before.

Then you know you are in "high cotton".


----------



## 7 point

Back in 2018 my mother bought a brand new toyota Tacoma 4 door paid 28k for it she said its gonna be her last vehicle shes 71 now .you cant touch that truck new today for under 35k vehicles have gotten out of sight.


----------



## 1982ace

7 point said:


> Back in 2018 my mother bought a brand new toyota Tacoma 4 door paid 28k for it she said its gonna be her last vehicle shes 71 now .you cant touch that truck new today for under 35k vehicles have gotten out of sight.


Just priced a new Tacoma SR5 4 door ……41k. Pretty much a basic truck with not much add ons. Still sitting on the lot


----------



## John Cooper

Bought my 2002 Jeep TJ for $6000.00 few years ago, turned down $9500.00 for it a few months ago. Easy to work on, no payments and could easily double my money if I was inclined to sell it!


----------



## buckpasser

I like this thread!  My wife just asked me yesterday how I think people our age are doing it. She said “You work two jobs and I do too.  We’re debt free and still aren’t really getting ahead.  How are these people driving new trucks/cars and buying big new houses right now?”

I honestly don’t know. I’d love to know the average salary of someone my age around here.  I’m 38. 

I drive a 2003’ z71 ($7000 used) and a 2018 Mahindra Roxor ($15.500 used). My wife drives a 2018 Mazda CX-5 ($26ish bought new).


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## Buford_Dawg

My wife and I wonder same thing, how are people affording this marked up homes and vehicle prices.  We sitting here waiting to build our retirement home, but keep putting it off and same with buying a newer vehicle.  I am really starting to think this is the new normal prices for vehicles.  And alot of people building up tons of debt that they will never be able to pay off.


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## Concrete Pete

What’s the towing capacity on one of those?



John Cooper said:


> Bought my 2002 Jeep TJ for $6000.00 few years ago, turned down $9500.00 for it a few months ago. Easy to work on, no payments and could easily double my money if I was inclined to sell it!
> View attachment 1143474View attachment 1143474


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## John Cooper

Concrete Pete said:


> What’s the towing capacity on one of those?


I think they say 2000 lbs, I don't need a truck for towing anymore. Me and my dad have a 99 F150 for the occasional lowes run and things like that. 

I used to think I needed a 3/4 or a 1 ton truck and have owned several over the years. Now I just enjoy living the Jeep life and if I can't tow it, I must not need it.


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## Concrete Pete

I’m just looking at vehicles. I want something that can pull an inflatable drift boat / raft. Thankfully those boats light.


John Cooper said:


> I think they say 2000 lbs, I don't need a truck for towing anymore. Me and my dad have a 99 F150 for the occasional lowes run and things like that.
> 
> I used to think I needed a 3/4 or a 1 ton truck and have owned several over the years. Now I just enjoy living the Jeep life and if I can't tow it, I must not need it.


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## Dutch

Buford_Dawg said:


> And alot of people building up tons of debt that they will never be able to pay off.



This right here.
84 month car loans, 30 year boat loans and 50 year mortgages.  Alot of the guys I work with are so far in debt, they will never see the end of it.

Its sad.


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## 7 point

The have nots trying to keep up with the haves


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## earlthegoat2

John Cooper said:


> I think they say 2000 lbs, I don't need a truck for towing anymore. Me and my dad have a 99 F150 for the occasional lowes run and things like that.
> 
> I used to think I needed a 3/4 or a 1 ton truck and have owned several over the years. Now I just enjoy living the Jeep life and if I can't tow it, I must not need it.



Tow capacity is the one thing I really don’t like about Jeeps. My Liberty has the tow package which supposedly puts it at 5000lbs. I’m not towing more than 2-3000 with it ever though. I have an F250 for any of that.  Paid $4500 in 2015 for it. Not bad for a V10 with 4wd.


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## normaldave

Dutch said:


> This right here.
> 84 month car loans, 30 year boat loans and 50 year mortgages.  Alot of the guys I work with are so far in debt, they will never see the end of it.
> 
> Its sad.


I saw an example yesterday, that I had forgotten about, since we live in a paid-for home.

Home equity lines of credit and especially cash-out refinancing gives folks the ability to buy things way above the capacity of their annual income.

Home worth $ 250,000 several years back appraises for $ 500,000 today. Seemingly attractive refinance for $ 500,000, pull out about $ 200,000, buy a bunch of stuff that they would never normally be able to buy, on a home that will likely be worth $ 300,000 in reality after the market "corrects", but they will still owe the $ 500,000.

Then bankrupt or bailout, and we're left holding the bag. (again).


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## Buford_Dawg

I can see alot of that happening Dave with this younger society.


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## Robert28

normaldave said:


> I saw an example yesterday, that I had forgotten about, since we live in a paid-for home.
> 
> Home equity lines of credit an especially cash-out refinancing gives folks the ability to buy things way above the capacity of their annual income.
> 
> Home worth $ 250,000 several years back appraises for $ 500,000 today. Seemingly attractive refinance for $ 500,000, pull out about $ 200,000, buy a bunch of stuff that they would never normally be able to buy, on a home that will likely be worth $ 300,000 in reality after the market "corrects", but they will still owe the $ 500,000.
> 
> Then bankrupt or bailout, and we're left holding the bag. (again).


The ONLY way I would ever pull out equity of my house is if it was going to be spent improving the house, major remodeling, etc. Any other way would scare me to death. My house is older but it’s paid for and I can’t bring myself to take out a equity loan. I’m too chicken.lol I have about $15,000 left I owe on my ‘21 F150 and think I’m going to ride this one out for a few years and see what the market is like.


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## Concrete Pete

Robert28 said:


> The ONLY way I would ever pull out equity of my house is if it was going to be spent improving the house, major remodeling, etc. Any other way would scare me to death. My house is older but it’s paid for and I can’t bring myself to take out a equity loan. I’m too chicken.lol I have about $15,000 left I owe on my ‘21 F150 and think I’m going to ride this one out for a few years and see what the market is like.




Never, ever, ever pull equity out of the house.

At least not for a vehicle you aren’t making money with.


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## Robert28

Concrete Pete said:


> Never, ever, ever pull equity out of the house.
> 
> At least not for a vehicle you aren’t making money with.


No way in the world I’d do that. I just happen to buy my F150 before the market went full on stupid. If I was ever going to pull money out of my house, it would be for a complete remodel or something like that.


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## Concrete Pete

Robert28 said:


> No way in the world I’d do that. I just happen to buy my F150 before the market went full on stupid. If I was ever going to pull money out of my house, it would be for a complete remodel or something like that.



Right. You’d be surprised at how people treat their equity in their homes. Scary.


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## nix03

Buford_Dawg said:


> I can see alot of that happening Dave with this younger society.


It’s not just the younger generation!


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## Buford_Dawg

Did some quick Pricing research yesterday on Ford 150 and Chevy 1500 trucks.  Prices still way out of my league, I thought at some point we would start seeing price adjustments downwards, but they appear to continuing to be going north.  On well, will continue driving my old Ford.  Starting to get up in miles but it is working just fine.


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## JonathanG2013

Buford_Dawg said:


> Did some quick Pricing research yesterday on Ford 150 and Chevy 1500 trucks.  Prices still way out of my league, I thought at some point we would start seeing price adjustments downwards, but they appear to continuing to be going north.  On well, will continue driving my old Ford.  Starting to get up in miles but it is working just fine.



I agree. New trucks are super high.  Last year I bought a 2017 F150 King Ranch last year for $40,000. I built a 2022 with everything my 2017 king ranch has.  The 2022 would cost me $74,200.


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## OwlRNothing

I think there are two things at play here ( at least for some of us older folks).

1. The older you get the more things seem incredibly expensive. That's because we remember when a new truck was $22,000. So, 70K sounds absurd to us. That said, kids don't remember when a truck was 22K, so the 70K to them? As the kids like to say: "It is what it eeeeees."
2. Any excuse to add profit onto an increase in costs. There's probably not a business out there that doesn't do this. Maybe some bargain chains, IDK. - but when the media reports "costs for shipping and parts are up" - I'm going to bet about 95% of businesses, companies, etc. hear " JACK UP THOSE PRICES, BOYS!"

And they do. And here we are, talkin' about it. I mean, there are legit cost increases across the board - but (for example) when gas prices fall 20 cents per gallon the on July 5th? Don't tell me that's not just jacking up prices. I'm not telling most of you guys anything you don't already know.


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## transfixer

OwlRNothing said:


> I think there are two things at play here ( at least for some of us older folks).
> 
> 1. The older you get the more things seem incredibly expensive. That's because we remember when a new truck was $22,000. So, 70K sounds absurd to us. That said, kids don't remember when a truck was 22K, so the 70K to them? As the kids like to say: "It is what it eeeeees."
> 2. Any excuse to add profit onto an increase in costs. There's probably not a business out there that doesn't do this. Maybe some bargain chains, IDK. - but when the media reports "costs for shipping and parts are up" - I'm going to bet about 95% of businesses, companies, etc. hear " JACK UP THOSE PRICES, BOYS!"
> 
> And they do. And here we are, talkin' about it. I mean, there are legit cost increases across the board - but (for example) when gas prices fall 20 cents per gallon the on July 5th? Don't tell me that's not just jacking up prices. I'm not telling most of you guys anything you don't already know.



   Shipping cost are obviously up ,, and material costs are up also,  we're paying significantly more for parts now to rebuild transmissions than we did 3 yrs ago,  problem is we can't increase our prices the same amount ( if we did many customers couldn't afford to fix their vehicles)  so we're absorbing a lot of the increases,  although trying to increase prices where we can,   the shop I work for is number 1 in the southeast for total repair sales among the other franchises,  yet the owner I work for isn't making any more net income than he was 3 yrs ago,  

   many customers obviously still price shop, and will go where they are quoted the lowest price usually,  even though they may regret it later when the repair doesn't last ,,  but in the current economy I can't blame them for being frugal. 

   I don't know where the automotive industry is going to end up,, but it isn't looking good !  Newer vehicles are significantly more costly to repair than those 10 or 20yrs old,  and people don't seem to consider that when buying one ?  only to find out later how much something costs to repair or replace ,,,


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## OwlRNothing

transfixer said:


> Shipping cost are obviously up ,, and material costs are up also,  we're paying significantly more for parts now to rebuild transmissions than we did 3 yrs ago,  problem is we can't increase our prices the same amount ( if we did many customers couldn't afford to fix their vehicles)  so we're absorbing a lot of the increases,  although trying to increase prices where we can,   the shop I work for is number 1 in the southeast for total repair sales among the other franchises,  yet the owner I work for isn't making any more net income than he was 3 yrs ago,
> 
> many customers obviously still price shop, and will go where they are quoted the lowest price usually,  even though they may regret it later when the repair doesn't last ,,  but in the current economy I can't blame them for being frugal.
> 
> I don't know where the automotive industry is going to end up,, but it isn't looking good !  Newer vehicles are significantly more costly to repair than those 10 or 20yrs old,  and people don't seem to consider that when buying one ?  only to find out later how much something costs to repair or replace ,,,



That's some good insight from someone "on the ground." Thanks.


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## Robert28

I think dealerships aren’t mostly surviving on service for now, especially those that can’t get cars to sell regularly. The local ford dealership sends me something every week about “being your truck in for service!” but I haven’t reached the 5,000 mile interval yet since the last time they serviced it. They’re also sending me letters about buying extended warranties through them, I’ve gotten a ton of those.


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## Havana Dude

I’ll buy a new vehicle when I win the lottery. First order of business is to play the lottery. Been 31 years since I bought my first, and likely my last, “new” vehicle. Had nothing but problems even then.


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## paulito

They had on the news last night that that the AVERAGE, yes AVERAGE, cost of a new vehicle in the US was now just a shade under $50,000. The highest its ever been. Thats just crazy.


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## buckpasser

paulito said:


> They had on the news last night that that the AVERAGE, yes AVERAGE, cost of a new vehicle in the US was now just a shade under $50,000. The highest its ever been. Thats just crazy.



If everyone was as tight as me, I can assure you, the average would not be that high.


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## Robert28

paulito said:


> They had on the news last night that that the AVERAGE, yes AVERAGE, cost of a new vehicle in the US was now just a shade under $50,000. The highest its ever been. Thats just crazy.


I read that too. The average payment is over $600 I think too. Insane. My highest truck payment I’ve ever had was $450 and I liked to had a heart attack at that.


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## Railroader

Still driving my 21 year old 4runner, 24 year old Tacoma, and rarely my 08 F250XL, Ex Georgia Power truck.

In 2018, I bought The Wife a '17 RAV4, with 19k on the Odometer.

Most expensive vehicle I ever bought at 20K...


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## Havana Dude

This was my first and probably last new truck purchase. Payment was 270/ month for 6 years if I remember right.


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## king killer delete

j_seph said:


> A $60k pickup for 5 years 0%, that is $1000 a month not counting insurance. Is there that many folks got that high of a paying job? I won't even get into the teens and 20-30 year olds I see driving them. I just cannot comprehend. Just looked up a used F-250, 2017 -2019 and even them are $54k to $72k


I got one . Love it to but it’s Chevy.


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## king killer delete

Got to pay them Credit cards off and if you got one you got to pay it off every month.


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