# Forge knife making questions



## sea trout (Feb 26, 2017)

So what happens to different steel properties during heating, forging and cooling?
 If we heat a horseshoe and forge a blade then cool it in peanut oil. Then grind it,  sandbelt it, and buff it while dipping it in water to keep it cool during the grinding, sanding, and buffing.....does it still have the same properties as its horseshoe state?

So what if we did the same thing with (same process) with model A Ford leaf springs......or a farriers rasp. Do their properties return to their original state before we started? Or does it turn into a steel with less desirable hardness properties?

Forgive me if some of my terms are incorrect. Still learning! Basically wondering....like a horseshoe I beleive is mild steel from mild barstock. (I think, IDK) Maybe less desirable blade material than a farriers rasp.
So what I'm asking is if you heat and forge and quench both a horseshoe and a rasp is the rasp still more desirable at the end of the same process?

Thanks if ya have any input!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Anvil Head (Feb 27, 2017)

I understand what you are asking, so will try to keep it simple.
There are a lot of simple and complex steels out there and each was developed for specific reasons/uses. Each will have it's perspective heattreating "recipe" to get the best results for that steel. Some are relatively simple to master but more are very complex and require special equipment to get good to optimum results. You will be best served to research and "study-up" just a bit so you can ask more specific questions and get better answers. Even better find a bladesmith near you and spend some time with him/her - all will be greatly beneficial to your learning curve.

I know you want to have fun with this and it is a great adventure, just be sure to do things safely.

All that being said - yes, the horseshoe will still be a horseshoe shaped like a knife. There are ways to make it a little harder but it will never be more than a novelty knife like object. Still....folks really like them.  
Farrier's rasp can be all over the page on quality and steel composition. Unless you know the mfgr. specs or know how to conduct some reasonably simple testing and comparison work, it's going to be a crap shoot. Some of the rasp are actually casehardened soft/mild steel and not worth the bother, but quite a few have decent potential to be made into blades that will function well. Make sure you grind the teeth off the leading edge (what will be the cutting edge) and 1/4" to 1/2" up each side. Other wise you will be force/forging stress cracks into the blade's cutting edge.....not good.
Bottom line is the rasp has potential to make a real knife the horseshoe does not.

ps- come up to Trackrock next month, and if I have a few minutes I will show you a few tricks to determine potential of rasps.


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## cwa1104sab (Mar 7, 2017)

Anvil head   Along the same lines.... I've seen knives made out of railroad spikes. Along the way (barn sales etc) I've gotten 3 of the railroad spikes. I've watched a bunch of you tube videos but I was wondering how much of a "quality" knife could be made ? Or is it more like a novelty knife ? Thanks for your input

Sab


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## Anvil Head (Mar 8, 2017)

RxR spikes rarely exceed .3%-.3% carbon (and those are the ones marked HC which many believe indicates high carbon - relative term). Quality forgable blade steels usually start, low end at .6% - 5160 in leaf springs, etc.  Most are higher in the range of .8%+ going up into the 1.5% and more. Alloying plays an important part in how the steel will thermal cycle and perform as a cutting instrument as well. Each steel has it's own "Recipe" for best resulting performance. Way too much to cover on a forum of this nature. There is plenty of info out here on the web, just do a search, but be prepared to be overwhelmed.
All that being said, you can with a proper quench, get some RxR spikes to perform as well as a Walmart paring knife and will hold an edge similar. 
Though I cannot speak for all responsible bladesmiths, the ones I do know consider RxR spike knives to be novelty cutlery. They will not come close to what is possible with even the simplest of forgable cutlery steel. They sell well because of their novelty status not their performance. Not telling you which way to go, lots of folks make them and is thought to be good practice as well. 
However, my Pop always drilled into me practice does not make perfect......perfect practice makes perfect. Learn with the materials you intend and can be the best with.
I do use a lot of recycled steels, but I have taught myself, researched, and experimented/tested enough over the past many years to be confident in my results. You won't get there over night even with the right help.


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