# Best shelter for a month of primitive living



## wilber85 (Oct 17, 2013)

I have decided that I am going to take on a personal experiment to see if I can live in the outdoors for a month.  I will still have to go to work and function during the day as a regular person but other than that I will do my best to live as primitive as I can.  I am going to build my shelter before I begin and I am wondering what is the best to build.  I think it makes sense to find out what natives would have lived in in our area of the country.  I live in North Georgia foothills.  As I understand a tipi is mostly build for the midwestern regions and not for my area.  I have also thought about a wigwam.  That seems possible but my land is mostly hardwoods and not many saplings.  Also the elm bark or birch bark is not available.  I have mostly oaks and hickory.  Does anyone have any suggestions as to which might be the most comfortable shelter I can build to live in for a month?  I would really like a large indoor area with fire inside as well as a place to keep my gear.  A completely enclosed shelter would be great.


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## HossBog (Oct 17, 2013)

Sounds like fun! I don't know what would be good, but you must keep a log and photos of ye adventure.


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## wilber85 (Oct 17, 2013)

Hoss,  I definitely will be documenting the whole thing.

How does this look for a semi permanent shelter?  It doesnt require so many saplings and I do have a large cedar tree in my pasture.  You have to kill more trees which I am not crazy about but some trees will be necessary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g78H4si8ZpU


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## RBM (Oct 17, 2013)

If you're in North Georgia, whatever you decide it had better be a warm and dry one this time of year. I know there are not Navajo in Georgia (as far as I know) but try a Hogan or an Earth Lodge.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hogan

If that is too much trouble for a month, then go with a wooden wikiup or wigwam and plug the gaps.

You might consider having an inside fire pit but don't burn the thing down doing it and good ventilation. Make sure your inside fire is out before leaving for work. Wash up in a stream nearby (downstream of where you drink), your fellow workers will appreciate it.


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## White Horse (Oct 18, 2013)

I have done what you are planning, and it will be a life changing experience.

I used to have access to a 14,000 acre wilderness. In 1990-91 I left my tipi set up there for several months, and lived in it for periods of time between responsibilities in the modern world. The longest stretch of time I was there without leaving was nine days.

A tipi is a little too open in the top for the heavy rains in Georgia, but if you take precautions and set up the tipi carefully you can minimize the dripping to right in the center, just under where the poles cross, even in a downpour that lasts several days. And, the great advantage of the tipi is that it's warm even in very cold temperatures. It got into the teens in January of '91 where I was but I was fine in my lodge with a small fire. 

The wigwam such as was built in the Northeast and Great Lakes areas also makes a snug dwelling. You can substitute canvas for bark or mats, and though it doesn't look as good, it's more waterproof. The smoke hole at the top along with a door on one side will keep the smoke drawing well, though the fire has to go out in the rain because you have to cover up the smoke hole. I have camped in a couple of those that friends built.

Good luck, keep us posted, and take pictures.


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## David Parker (Oct 18, 2013)

Are you eating primitive or packin in?  If you're gonna be foraging and stuff for food, I'd start by downing a few earthworms and grubs just to establish that I can do it.  Now if the area where you are buggin out to is teaming with opportunity for fishing and varmints, bugs and stuff may not be necessary.


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## chehawknapper (Oct 18, 2013)

If you want to be historically correct you should build a wattle and daub house but it is the wrong time of year. New housing was usually built in the spring or summer when bark will strip easily. Tulip poplar bark was the most common shingle material for housing in your area. Gabled roofs with open ends allowed fires on the inside. Tipis were not used east of the Mississippi but are great shelters. You will need to learn how to adjust your smoke flaps according to the wind and weather conditions. Wigwams need to be built taller than most people realize. They don't draw smoke  very well and make sure you don't have flat spots in the roof or they will leak. Small earth lodges are easy to build with very little adjustment to the natural materials gathered. Good luck and have fun.


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## wilber85 (Oct 18, 2013)

David Parker said:


> Are you eating primitive or packin in?  If you're gonna be foraging and stuff for food, I'd start by downing a few earthworms and grubs just to establish that I can do it.  Now if the area where you are buggin out to is teaming with opportunity for fishing and varmints, bugs and stuff may not be necessary.



I have not decided what I am going to do for food yet.  A big problem is I still have to go to work during the day.  That is going to cut down my food prep time by a lot.  I wont even get home until dark most nights so I am thinking I am going to have to bring food in with me.  I am doing this on my own farm so it shouldnt be too difficult.  I want the experience to be as real as possible, and on the weekends I will do my own gathering, but I dont think I can truly gather all of my food with the short amount of time I will have after work.



chehawknapper said:


> If you want to be historically correct you should build a wattle and daub house but it is the wrong time of year. New housing was usually built in the spring or summer when bark will strip easily. Tulip poplar bark was the most common shingle material for housing in your area. Gabled roofs with open ends allowed fires on the inside. Tipis were not used east of the Mississippi but are great shelters. You will need to learn how to adjust your smoke flaps according to the wind and weather conditions. Wigwams need to be built taller than most people realize. They don't draw smoke  very well and make sure you don't have flat spots in the roof or they will leak. Small earth lodges are easy to build with very little adjustment to the natural materials gathered. Good luck and have fun.



I am not so big on being historically correct this time around as long as what I am building keeps me dry and warm.  I do not want to build it with any manufactured materials such as canvas or tarp.  I am leaving my options as open as I can to make this work the first time around, and maybe someday if I do this again I can change things up a bit or become more historically accurate.


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## The Original Rooster (Oct 18, 2013)

I appreciate your sense of adventure. Best of luck!


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## Killdee (Oct 18, 2013)

I would try to plan some vacation for such as this,even if only a week,working and such wont leave much time to really experience such a interesting experiment. Good luck with it.


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## wilber85 (Oct 18, 2013)

I already take a week off every year to do this, however I wanted to spend an extended amount of time outdoors, and I dont feel like a week is long enough.  I know its lame having to go to work and all, but I can only do what I can do with what I have.  Maybe someday if I ever manage to retire, I can go for a couple of months, but by then I think the entire world will be covered with cities.


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## NCHillbilly (Oct 19, 2013)

Chehawknapper gave you some good info. The Cherokee in N Ga lived mostly in wattle-and-daub houses. Set four corner posts with smaller posts between, weave cane between them, and cover in clay mud and let it dry. They were usually roofed with tulip poplar bark, which peels better and comes in much bigger pieces than birch bark. You need to peel it in the summer when the sap is up, though. 

The Cherokee also made what were called hot houses or winter houses, which were semi-earth shelters. They were built by excavating a pit into a bank, then logs were stood upright around the edge of the pit to make walls. 

 The Siouan tribes in the southeast usually made round wigwams framed with saplings and covered with poplar bark. They were sometimes insulated with grass thatch. A lot of tribes made temporary shelters for hunting trips and such by making a wigwam frame and covering it with woven mats made from cattails or rushes. You can make a fairly servicable roof by overlaying multiple thick layers of evergreen limbs like spruce, hemlock, or pine like shingles.


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## HossBog (Oct 19, 2013)

Sounding good wilber. Just the kind of thing I'd like to do some day, even at my geezer hood age. That wiki thingamajig YouTube was interesting. Whew, I'd want to be careful of fire! I can see me house going up in flames! Guess what I'd worry about most though? Red bugs. And ticks, mosquitoes. Them little devils are what can get to ye! An old timer I used to work with in the National Forest Service told me that Indians used French mulberry leaves for repellant. We used it too. Take the limbs with leaves and beat them all around ye body and clothes. Worked!


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## wilber85 (Dec 3, 2013)

I wanted to provide an update to this thread as I have found a new solution.

I was recently given a book called "Two Winters in a Tipi" by Mark Warren.  His house was struck by lightning and was burned to the ground, and so he constructed a tipi where he lived for two years.  I am wondering if some of you may know Mark Warren as he performed this experiment in North GA, and actually just a few miles from where I live now.

Anyways, he was a student of native cultures and he opted to live in a tipi even though it was not necessarily traditional of the eastern tribes.  I was my own experiment to go as successful as possible, and so I too have opted to go the tipi route.  I believe I will be much more successful than building a crude mud hut or wigwam from leaves.  Maybe down the road after I have some experience under my belt but my first venture into outdoor living I would like to not be so extremely miserable.

Since I have decided to go with a tipi I will also try to extend my stay in the tipi for much longer than a month.  I hope to stay in it as long as I possibly can in 2014 and I think it will be much easier to accomplish considering I still have to work 50 hrs a week.  I am getting an 18' tipi made by Colorado Yurt Company tomorrow.  6' liner and ozan, the whole deal.  Some true bushman may consider this too spoiled but it is a good compromise for me I think.

Anyways just wanted to keep you guys updated.  I will post pics of the construction and as I go.  Looking forward to moving outside.


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## Killdee (Dec 3, 2013)

I'll look forward to seeing your updates


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## Nicodemus (Dec 3, 2013)

You`re gonna love your tipi.


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## The Original Rooster (Dec 3, 2013)

Yes, we definitely want to see how this goes. I imagine we'll all learn something from your experience.


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## oldways (Dec 4, 2013)

Best of luck we'll be following your progress


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## Redbow (Dec 24, 2013)

Nothing like a good ole outdoors adventure, good luck with yours...I have a friend in Tennessee that does this. He just disappears at times into the woods by himself for a few days. Its his way of relaxing with nature..


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## Fletch_W (Mar 26, 2015)

Updates?


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## Fletch_W (Mar 27, 2015)

Just to keep this in one thread, I just ran across this link, an excellent step by step pictorial demonstration of an authentic Cherokee Wattle and Daub house, at Etowah. 

http://gastateparks.org/item/160828


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## Artfuldodger (Mar 27, 2015)

Besides the tipi build a Seminole Chickee for the hot summer nights.

Your pretty close to Etowah, maybe they'll let you pitch your tipi on top of the mound.


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## Artfuldodger (Mar 27, 2015)

Fletch_W said:


> Just to keep this in one thread, I just ran across this link, an excellent step by step pictorial demonstration of an authentic Cherokee Wattle and Daub house, at Etowah.
> 
> http://gastateparks.org/item/160828



They must have had more time than we do. That looks really cool. I wonder if it would be hot in the South Georgia heat? Maybe the dried mud would keep it cool.
If I was to build one of those it would have to be on some property I was gonna keep for awhile.


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## OneCrazyGeek (Mar 27, 2015)

Fletch_W said:


> Just to keep this in one thread, I just ran across this link, an excellent step by step pictorial demonstration of an authentic Cherokee Wattle and Daub house, at Etowah.
> 
> http://gastateparks.org/item/160828



It is my understanding the Etowah Indian mounds are NOT
Cherokee.

I have seen the hut, it is pretty neat.


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## Fletch_W (Mar 27, 2015)

I know the Etowah Mounds weren't built by Cherokee. But the type of house they build in the link is a kind of house Cherokee also built, with native materials they would have used, and had a half-Cherokee volunteer help them, and that land is also land that Cherokee did occupy at one point or another. 

But as you said, Cherokee didn't build the Etowah Mounds.


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## Fletch_W (Mar 27, 2015)

Artfuldodger said:


> I wonder if it would be hot in the South Georgia heat? Maybe the dried mud would keep it cool.



I was reading about the construction, and some blog or another said they would sprinkle water around the inside and as the water evaporated on the inner walls and floor, it would have the same evaporative cooling affect that sweat has on your skin. The chimney or "smoke hole" wasn't just for smoke, but in the summer, hot air rises, and brings in a draft from outside, along with the evaporative cooling, would keep the structure cool inside. Or swamp gas etc.... some kind of Cherokee Black Magic.


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## dtala (Mar 27, 2015)

Fletch_W said:


> Updates?



maybe a bear ate him?????


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## Fletch_W (Mar 27, 2015)

May be time to start a thread on the on-topic board.


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## Fletch_W (Mar 28, 2015)

> Cartersville resident Corey Lightfoot who is part Cherokee joins posts to the roof rafters with hemp rope.




I found a problem. Hemp is not native to this continent. Maybe the Cherokee used it post-1500 AD.


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## Artfuldodger (Mar 28, 2015)

Fletch_W said:


> I was reading about the construction, and some blog or another said they would sprinkle water around the inside and as the water evaporated on the inner walls and floor, it would have the same evaporative cooling affect that sweat has on your skin. The chimney or "smoke hole" wasn't just for smoke, but in the summer, hot air rises, and brings in a draft from outside, along with the evaporative cooling, would keep the structure cool inside. Or swamp gas etc.... some kind of Cherokee Black Magic.



I didn't know about sprinkling water but wondered if the mud might stay wet enough from rain to get an evaporative cooling affect.

I've researched "Florida Cracker Houses" because of the free cooling effect of the cupola in the rooftop. It worked along the same prinicipal, air being pulled in through windows/doors and out through the hole in the roof.(cupola)

http://www.solaripedia.com/13/59/524/florida_solar_cracker_house_cupola.html


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## Fletch_W (Mar 28, 2015)

On TV years ago I saw a special where they remade a house that a SW indian would have made, I forget the specific tribe or time period, but same concept. Tall clay "chimney" that would get 200+ degrees in the hot sun, heating the air inside the chimney, which would rise aggressively, pulling in outside air to the living quarters. Obviously in low-humidity air, in the shade, with a breeze, it would have been very comfortable, even in the desert heat. 

It looked something like this, but the chimney was much taller... more pronounced...


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## Artfuldodger (Mar 28, 2015)

Wasn't there two different settlements at Etowah, one around 1250AD and another one more recent? 
I wonder what the housing was like for the original civilization at 1250AD?


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## 308-MIKE (Mar 31, 2015)

I've always wanted to try this. But reading the op my first thought was living primitive and working? From reading and watching videos of people do something similar,  I got the impression that such an adventure is a full time job in itself. Building and maintaining a structure, the procurement of food and cooking, protecting oneself from the elements and other critters in the woods? Sounds like a full time job. Someday, I'll take off a week and do this,  probably in late fall.


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## waddler (Apr 1, 2015)

I have thought extensively on this type venture over the years. I have a host of questions concerning the OP.

What time of year? What location? How you gonna bathe and shave, wash clothes, have transportation, etc. so you will be accepted at your job, are you going to build this structure BEFORE you go there to stay?
What are you trying to simulate? A "bugout" adventure to a prepared location, a "lost hunter" experience, a series of 30 one night sleepouts, a true "live off the land" adventure? The answers to these questions and more will determine not only the "best" structure, but also what structures are possible.


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## NCHillbilly (Apr 1, 2015)

Fletch_W said:


> I found a problem. Hemp is not native to this continent. Maybe the Cherokee used it post-1500 AD.



The Cherokee at that time would have used cordage/rope made from basswood bark, tulip poplar bark, or dogbane (Indian hemp) for this kind of thing, or more likely, strips of rawhide or stripped uncorded basswood or hickory bark. The Cherokee also started building log cabins pretty soon after contact with Europeans and obtaining metal tools. 



Artfuldodger said:


> Wasn't there two different settlements at Etowah, one around 1250AD and another one more recent?
> I wonder what the housing was like for the original civilization at 1250AD?



There have probably been diverse groups of people living or at least camping on that site off and on for the last 15,000 years or so. A good site is a good site, and most historic tribal towns were built on the settlements and camps of older peoples from the Archaic period. Most excavations of major Mississippian-era sites find artifacts at the lower layers dating back to the early Archaic, or sometimes, Paleo periods.


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