# Used catalytic converter  from pull a part



## SarahFair (Jan 13, 2012)

House divided.
The Guy at the shop has quoted me $650 for the rear and $530 for the  front. This is off the same car with 56k miles and a 6 month warrenty
The SO has decided this is too high and wants to go to a pull a part because he thinks it will be drastically cheape and have his brother put it on..

I'm just scared of a random pull a part part.


Anyone have advice or gone this route?


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## RNC (Jan 13, 2012)

I would NOT buy a used converter ....

Try finding some universal fit ones maybe .... since the brother is gonna install ...


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## SarahFair (Jan 13, 2012)

He quoted me new ones for over a grand each
I've read online and my dad was strongly advised not to use after market


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## RNC (Jan 13, 2012)

What kind of car are we talking about ?


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## SarahFair (Jan 13, 2012)

2002 mazda tribute

I don't have to have emissions out here ...and while I know its rude to pollute...
Could I just go without them?


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## RNC (Jan 13, 2012)

SarahFair said:


> 2002 mazda tribute
> 
> I don't have to have emissions out here ...and while I know its rude to pollute...
> Could I just go without them?



Has only one shop told you they were bad ?


If you dont have to have emissions in your county and you dont put them back its your business ...


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## SarahFair (Jan 13, 2012)

Yeah only one shop. I trust the guy though. He's specialized in mazdas since 1985 and I've known him as a family friend since the mid to late 90s
They've gone over a bunch other stuff and currently there is $400 worth of stuff already done to it and he says it will now idle good but will not accelerate


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## SarahFair (Jan 13, 2012)

Yeah only one shop. I trust the guy though. He's specialized in mazdas since 1985 and I've known him as a family friend since the mid to late 90s
They've gone over a bunch other stuff and currently there is $400 worth of stuff already done to it and he says it will now idle good but will not accelerate


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## RNC (Jan 13, 2012)

sent you a pm


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## 00Beau (Jan 13, 2012)

Go to TJ`s Muffler behind Mr. Jeff`s BP at Hwy 81/ Centerhill Church RD.


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## 7Mag Hunter (Jan 13, 2012)

SarahFair said:


> Yeah only one shop. I trust the guy though. He's specialized in mazdas since 1985 and I've known him as a family friend since the mid to late 90s
> They've gone over a bunch other stuff and currently there is $400 worth of stuff already done to it and he says it will now idle good but will not accelerate



If you can drop the cat and drive the car without it to test
acceleration, it would help you determine which one is bad..
How many oxygen sensors does it have????
Bad 02 sensors can also cause fuel mgt (no power)
problems....
If it were mine, and I did not have to get emissions, I would
take them off, or use aftermarket for replacement....


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## westcobbdog (Jan 13, 2012)

while being quoted over 1k today by a really good muffler shop on Cobb Pkwy for a 2002 4 runner, the owner and I discussed the people who are lucky enough to live in counties where this test is not required to drive legally, I would bank the $$ for a rainy day fund if i were you and keep the car tuned up, minimizing problems.
The after market stuff, either the whole part all as one or in sections, carries a 2 year 24k mile warranty,fyi.


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## GoldDot40 (Jan 13, 2012)

SarahFair said:


> 2002 mazda tribute
> 
> I don't have to have emissions out here ...and while I know its rude to pollute...
> Could I just go without them?



4 cylinder or 6 cylinder?

Most cars after 1996 have an O2 sensor both before and after the catalytic converter. If you delete the converter and just have a pipe welded in, the rear sensor won't read correctly and your fuel economy will suffer tremendously....plus your 'check engine' light will always be on. You can do PCM modifications to 'fool' the car in thinking the rear sensor is reading just fine....but finding a person who CAN and/or is willing to do it would be tough.


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## SarahFair (Jan 13, 2012)

Im not sure how many O2 sensors 
and its a 6 cylinder


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## vcd1363 (Jan 13, 2012)

Pull a Part will not sell the cat converters, they cut em out and sell them in bulk,,


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## SarahFair (Jan 13, 2012)

Someone told the SO today that its illegal to sell them used


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## quinn (Jan 13, 2012)

SarahFair said:


> Someone told the SO today that its illegal to sell them used



they are probably taking them to the scrap yard.they pay big bucks for them.I think it was platnium i heard was in them.


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## harryrichdawg (Jan 13, 2012)

No way I'd put a cat back if I didn't have to have emissions in my county.


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## Mossy78 (Jan 14, 2012)

Bassquatch said:


> 4 cylinder or 6 cylinder?
> 
> Most cars after 1996 have an O2 sensor both before and after the catalytic converter. If you delete the converter and just have a pipe welded in, the rear sensor won't read correctly and your fuel economy will suffer tremendously....plus your 'check engine' light will always be on. You can do PCM modifications to 'fool' the car in thinking the rear sensor is reading just fine....but finding a person who CAN and/or is willing to do it would be tough.



It doesn't have to run badly, I gutted mine years ago.
I simply removed the converter, took a broom stick and beat the innerds out of it, reinstalled it.

I then add this bad boy, http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Oxygen-se...pt=Race_Car_Parts&vxp=mtr&hash=item3a6ea8d3ac

What it does is raise the 02 sensor out of the exhaust flow, which in turn it still picks up the heat from the exhaust, but not the actual emissions so it tricks the computer into thinking everything is still ok with the converter.

Best part is, there is still what looks like a cat converter under my truck and if it's put on an emissions machine, there are no codes and it will pass, if they ever do tests around here.


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## Dr. Strangelove (Jan 14, 2012)

My 97 Jeep Wrangler started making a noise like a bunch of bunch of ball bearings rolling around in the exhaust about six or seven years ago.

I went to all the corporate places, they wanted $800+, happened to see a "speed/performance shop", and stopped in. Guy sold me a generic "high flow" cat for $180 + $20.00 to weld it in.

I asked "when can you do it", he said, "you got an hour or so to spare"?

I paid them the $200.00, slipped the welder guy a $20 bill, and was on my way.

Shop around.


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## Backlasher82 (Jan 14, 2012)

http://www.summitracing.com/


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## Mangler (Jan 14, 2012)

I'd go without it. Have your brother-in-law pull the old one out and either have him rod it out with a piece of pipe or have your local muffler shop weld in a replacement pipe (this one is probably the easiest). It will run fine. Did this with a Toyota Tacoma and the thing ran even better. Your local muffler shop should be able to help you out. Find an independent shop...not a commercial one.


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## SarahFair (Jan 14, 2012)

So if I ask the guy at the shop to just put a replacement pipe on it he should? Or does it vary by shop?


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## Backlasher82 (Jan 14, 2012)

http://www.epa.gov/compliance/resources/policies/civil/caa/mobile/exhsysrepair.pdf

Under federal law, catalytic converters may not be removed
and replaced with "converter replacement pipes' by any person.
The 1990 Clean Air Act Amendments even prohibit private
individuals from installing "converter replacement pipes" on their
own vehicles. Anyone who installs such pipes would violate section
203(a)(3)(A) and (B) of the Clean Air Act (Act).

If you look at the prices on Summit, they have universal fit converters for about $70. They also have specific fit models for more $. 

You probably won't find a shop willing to remove the converter due to fear of the EPA. You're probably going to have to find somebody with a welder and not much to lose if you go that route.


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## SarahFair (Jan 14, 2012)

Ohhhhh....
Ill check out summits.

The SO just left to look at a pull a part off memorial drive ...I think


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## merc123 (Jan 14, 2012)

They have a 100k warranty by the way. Got mine replaced on a 99 cougar with 90k miles under warranty


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## modern_yeoman (Jan 14, 2012)

Don't let whoever replaces it keep the old one.


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## SarahFair (Jan 14, 2012)

I guess we are just goin to get them replaced..

Just talked to the SO and he said all the mazdas usually get bought by the insurance companies


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## GoldDot40 (Jan 14, 2012)

SarahFair said:


> I guess we are just goin to get them replaced..
> 
> Just talked to the SO and he said all the mazdas usually get bought by the insurance companies



If you end up having to buy new one(s)....I'm thinking your car might have 3 converters. 2 at each exhaust manifold and 1 after the "Y" where the two pipes join into one. Get on RockAuto.com and see if you can find a affordable solution. I just looked and they do sell them for your vehicle a LOT cheaper than what you were quoted.


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## DAVE (Jan 14, 2012)

If you have federal emissions on your vehicle then you can get by with an after market or universal converter. If you vehicle has California emissions which most late model cars have you will have mil light problems and it will not pass emissions if ever required.


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## zedex (Jan 16, 2012)

Factory converters have a 10 year/100,000 mile warranty by federal law. Go to the dealership and have them test the converters. If proven defective, they are required to replace them at no cost to you. Of course,  a shady dealership will try to charge you.

 If replaced under warranty, you cannot take the converter with you when you leave. If aftermarket, those converters are yours and even as bad parts, worth big bucks. Get them and sell them to any recycling center. But first call around to get an idea as to how much you should expect.

 If you remove the converters and install bypass or eliminator pipes, the engine will still run, however, not as it should. 

Cat converters are used to burn off any unburned fuel in the exhaust and this cuts polution. The O2 sensors work in the back pressure zone to get a proper reading of the amount of unburned fuel. They send message to the main computer in the car and that computer changes the air/fuel mixture to the proper specs {usually 14:1 air:fuel}. In the absence of proper back pressure from which it reads, the message to the computer will be inaccurate. That means the fuel mixture ratio will be inaccurate. 
This can cause the engine to run too lean {not enough fuel} or too rich {too much fuel} improper fuel mixtures can be life threatening to the engine. Lean conditions can cause the pistons to become too hot and melt, internal rubber components to solidify, burned valves, excessive engine temps and those temps can cause oil sludging and/or solitification whereas too rich can cause the excess fuel to "wash" the residual oil from cylinder walls {massive damage can result}, carbon buildup on valves, spark plugs....etc.

 Install universal converters {new} and be sure to pay attention to direction of flow. NEVER !!! Never, ever, ever, ever buy used converters. They could be carbon fouled and this can cause major damage. ONLY install new. And, buy the converters yourself. Most places have a 75% or greater markup on them because they are required by law.
 Your new converters will come with a warranty registration paper. Fill it out. Most aftermarket converters are required to have a 5 year warranty. Keep your papers.

 Now, here is a little help about deciding if your converters really are bad or if the shop needs your help from Christmas overspending:

 When cool to touch, use a fist and pound on the converter. Does it rattle? Yes?.... replace it. It is broken internally.

 Does it glow red after idling for 15 minutes or longer? Yes?... replace it. It is overheating.

 Does your car lose speed/power after driving 30 mintues or so? Yes, while it could be a fuel delivery problem, you may have a plugged converter. If no loss of power/speed is found, it is not plugged {carbon fouled}


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## shakey gizzard (Jan 18, 2012)

Option 5! Cut it all off and run open headers!


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## secondseason (Jan 18, 2012)

merc123 said:


> They have a 100k warranty by the way. Got mine replaced on a 99 cougar with 90k miles under warranty



Merc is exactly right, if your car has less than 100k miles on it call a Mazda dealer and have them replace it under warranty.


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## SarahFair (Jan 19, 2012)

Well he replaced the rear one and did something with the manifold.
He gave me the catalytic converter and the piece he replaced on the manifold so I can scrap them and get some money back.


My car is still running a little funny but Im hoping it will straighten itself out


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## rjcruiser (Jan 19, 2012)

SarahFair said:


> Well he replaced the rear one and did something with the manifold.
> He gave me the catalytic converter and the piece he replaced on the manifold so I can scrap them and get some money back.
> 
> 
> My car is still running a little funny but Im hoping it will straighten itself out



I'd take it back if I were you and complain.  If it isn't running right now, I don't think it will "straighten itself out."


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## SarahFair (Jan 19, 2012)

Well, I was told by a couple people the computer may need time to adjust. 

I havent driven it (cant drive right now due to pain meds) so Ill have to ask the SO when he gets home how its doing.


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## zedex (Jan 20, 2012)

SarahFair said:


> Well, I was told by a couple people the computer may need time to adjust.
> 
> I havent driven it (cant drive right now due to pain meds) so Ill have to ask the SO when he gets home how its doing.



The ECM on a car autocorrects within the first 20 minutes. To verify it has completed this, disconnect the battery for a couple hours and reconnect. If anything needs recalibrating, drive it for 20 minutes or so. 

If the issue still persists, go back to the stealership and have the put it on diagnostics and manually reset it. THe longer the car runs with a system fault, the more damage can occur.

 Note that a car cannot heal itself. They require help and you would be amazed at how many times, I have heard people complaining that another shop told them "give it time". All that means is they don't know what to do to correct it.


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## SarahFair (Jan 22, 2012)

I went back and read the receipt and it said the check engine light may come back on due to something with the manifold.
Another $530 part.
The cars running for now. Not perfect but after the $1500 we just dropped on it, its going to have to wait.


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## Gaducker (Jan 22, 2012)

zedex said:


> Factory converters have a 10 year/100,000 mile warranty by federal law. Go to the dealership and have them test the converters. If proven defective, they are required to replace them at no cost to you. Of course,  a shady dealership will try to charge you.
> 
> If replaced under warranty, you cannot take the converter with you when you leave. If aftermarket, those converters are yours and even as bad parts, worth big bucks. Get them and sell them to any recycling center. But first call around to get an idea as to how much you should expect.
> 
> ...





Dude  did you copy and paste all that or do you actually know all that stuff???


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## hoochfisher (Jan 22, 2012)

Sarah, come on into winder and see the fellow at the mighty muffler.  

Take hwy 11 into winder, right at mcdonalds, shop is on the right. 

He's a good guy and will not rip you off. Ive had multiple trucks and motorcycles done there.


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## SarahFair (Jan 22, 2012)

Thanks! Ill keep them in mind when we go in for round 2


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## steeleagle (Jan 22, 2012)

According to the information, manufacturers are required to warranty catalytic converters for 8 yrs or 80000 miles. Should your car be under the threshold, your repair should be free.


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## zedex (Jan 22, 2012)

Gaducker said:


> Dude  did you copy and paste all that or do you actually know all that stuff???



I know this stuff. I was, for many years, a "salvage manager" for a major chain. I went in and rebuilt {or had shut down} stores in financial crisis. Unlike most managers, I was a working manager and often times, terminated every exsisting employee so I worked by myself estimating, selling, and completing jobs, then cashed out customers. Great job, great pay and I traveled and lived, if only for a short time, all over the US.


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## zedex (Jan 22, 2012)

Sarah,

 You are saying they have done something to the manifold, but which one? Most folks, myself included, would think the exhaust manifold, but with modern cars, even mods to the intake can cause problems. Also, if the exhaust the one, there is really nothing you can do to it short of gasket replacement. It cannot be "tuned" or recalibrated. 

If there is a slight leak at the gasket/head mating or seating area, the cold air entering could cause the exhaust to burn hotter as this provides a fresh air induction. Cooler fresh air increasing the temps can burn a converter and O2 sensor causing erratic running.  Remember what I said about O2 senor readings telling the ECM to change mixture ratios. Fresh air will lead the O2 senor that not enough fuel is in the mixture, thus the computer will send more fuel and less air. This is called running "rich".

 As stated before, go find out precisely what is wrong with the converter. From there, the problem can be worked down to it's source.


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## Gaducker (Jan 23, 2012)

steeleagle said:


> According to the information, manufacturers are required to warranty catalytic converters for 8 yrs or 80000 miles. Should your car be under the threshold, your repair should be free.



This is correct.


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## Gaducker (Jan 23, 2012)

zedex said:


> I know this stuff. I was, for many years, a "salvage manager" for a major chain. I went in and rebuilt {or had shut down} stores in financial crisis. Unlike most managers, I was a working manager and often times, terminated every exsisting employee so I worked by myself estimating, selling, and completing jobs, then cashed out customers. Great job, great pay and I traveled and lived, if only for a short time, all over the US.



I do this "STUFF" day in and day out every day and theres only about one eighth of any of these responses above that are actually factual.  Most "Auto Mechanics" have no idea what it takes to make a car pass emmisions when faced with a p0420 or 30 code.  Most respond with,  it needs a converter.   Theres plenty of aftermarket converters out there that will keep the mil out so long as the problem that made the first converter go out in the first place is addresed.  just changing converters is asking for a comeback.

What are your o2s doing on the scanner at any givin time?

Ladies who dont know what they are being told are an easy target at most repair shops so beware.

And to answer your original question  its against the law for recylers to sale and for muffler shops to install used converters.


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## zedex (Jan 23, 2012)

I do this "STUFF" day in and day out every day and theres only about one eighth of any of these responses above that are actually factual. 
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Correct. But rather than argue with people, I just let them think as they may
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 Most "Auto Mechanics" have no idea what it takes to make a car pass emmisions when faced with a p0420 or 30 code. 
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A major reason being that, by comparison, few places require emissions testing. Another aspect is that "cars don't need that junk" on them. Those that are of that mindset do not realize today's cars last much longer, get better fuel economy, make the same {if not more} power than ever before and that modern automobiles have many subsystem computers and sensors and removing one element is the same as removing just one part of a person's brain and expecting full capacity results.
********************************************** 
Most respond with,  it needs a converter.   Theres plenty of aftermarket converters out there that will keep the mil out so long as the problem that made the first converter go out in the first place is addresed.  just changing converters is asking for a comeback.
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Yup. A new one may get you through aircare, but you only put a bandaid on a gunshot wound. The defect must be addressed first. Anything less is called repeat business for all the wrong reasons.
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What are your o2s doing on the scanner at any givin time?
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The sensors constantly monitor exhaust output of burned and unburned fuel and sends the information via electrical means to the ECM { electronic control modual}. These electronic signals relay the burned/unburned ratios as well as detect fuel type by composition. Based on information recieved, the ECM will reprogram the injection system to deliver the right amount of fuel for the "ideal" mixture at any given speed, load, incline, altitude, humidity factor...... far too many to list, but you get the idea. The MAP/MASS sensor also sends information based on airflow and temp. If the entire system is working as it should, you will have an equal amount of performance, economy and longevity. It something ain't right, all three suffer.
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Ladies who dont know what they are being told are an easy target at most repair shops so beware.
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Believe it or not, I've always made sure my customers knew what is happening and, if they did not just drop the car and leave, I always took them into the shop and showed them the findings, how that system worked and what needs to be done. That is my personal policy.  But many women and some men, just brushed it aside and did not want to know details, "just fix it". People need to learn so they don't lose money, usage of vehicle, or time trying straighten out a "patch job". Comebacks are bad for image {with I take very personal} and create tension between the techs and customers.

 It ain't worth the hassle. Do it and do it right the first time and everyone wins. Maybe a few bucks more today, but alot less tomorrow.
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And to answer your original question  its against the law for recylers to sale and for muffler shops to install used converters.
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I was going to point that out, but I know some folks would tell me I am wrong because their buddy Bubba owns a boneyard he sold them a used converter. 
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## Gaducker (Jan 23, 2012)

I was going to point that out, but I know some folks would tell me I am wrong because their buddy Bubba owns a boneyard he sold them a used converter. 
*****************************************[/QUOTE]

Everybody seems to know at least one of them bubbas who has bought one.


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