# "Good Enough" bothers me?



## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

Why oh why does it though? 

Every year, I see folks at the last minute sighting in a bow, trying to get their archery prowess in tact at the  last minute. 

Why is it, when I see someone, a week before bow season opens, repeatedly shoot in the black, but never drill a dead center, pack their gear up with a "GOOD ENOUGH", do I want to pop them over the head with a stabilizer and scream... NO! It's not "GOOD ENOUGH".  

Enough mistakes are made when a target walks out and nerves kick in, why would you risk being "mediocre" at a time like this? 


You better believe, I will shoot and tune until my fingers bleed if I have to, to make sure my bow is 100% spot on before Saturday morning. There's a hundred other things going on during a hunt to think about without having to wonder, is my bow's accuracy "GOOD ENOUGH?". 

If you can't drill dead center at least ONCE in over 20 shots with a compound or crossbow with a sight, at an indoor range with no distactions, I don't wanna be in the same woods with ya.  


Sorry, I've just seen a lot of pure nonsense in the past  few weeks.  

Okay, I feel better.


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 6, 2011)

Amen


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## XJfire75 (Sep 6, 2011)

Werd


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## T.P. (Sep 6, 2011)

Peace


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## chenryiv (Sep 6, 2011)

turtlebug said:


> Why oh why does it though?
> 
> Every year, I see folks at the last minute sighting in a bow, trying to get their archery prowess in tact at the  last minute.
> 
> ...



x2.  just talked to a guy, who thought that he could screw on a mech. broadhead and hunt without first sighting his bow in.


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## Scrub Buck (Sep 6, 2011)

Didn't you shoot a pig in the rear a few years ago?  Some people can kill animals dead all day long.  They don't have a dot on them.  Good enough is good with me.  I have target panic and have had it for about 5 years now.  I've seen alot of nonsense to.  I don't claim to be able to shoot a dot anymore.  But, I can sure kill deer.

Okay, now I feel better


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

BIGRNYRS said:


> Amen





XJfire75 said:


> Werd





T.P. said:


> Peace



Prayers sent.


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## T.P. (Sep 6, 2011)

Scrub Buck said:


> Didn't you shoot a pig in the rear a few years ago?  Some people can kill animals dead all day long.  They don't have a dot on them.  Good enough is good with me.  I have target panic and have had it for about 5 years now.  I've seen alot of nonsense to.  I don't claim to be able to shoot a dot anymore.  But, I can sure kill deer.
> 
> Okay, now I feel better



Can you kill a pig deader?

 Some people can wound deer all day long too.


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## jamie1231 (Sep 6, 2011)

Scrub Buck said:


> Didn't you shoot a pig in the rear a few years ago?  Some people can kill animals dead all day long.  They don't have a dot on them.  Good enough is good with me.  I have target panic and have had it for about 5 years now.  I've seen alot of nonsense to.  I don't claim to be able to shoot a dot anymore.  But, I can sure kill deer.
> 
> Okay, now I feel better



Amen....i know when my bow is "good enough" just like i know when my rifle is "good enough"...if i can drill a squirrel @ 25yrds with it "good enough"....i can kill a deer


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

Scrub Buck said:


> Didn't you shoot a pig in the rear a few years ago?  Some people can kill animals dead all day long.  They don't have a dot on them.  Good enough is good with me.  I have target panic and have had it for about 5 years now.  I've seen alot of nonsense to.  I don't claim to be able to shoot a dot anymore.  But, I can sure kill deer.
> 
> Okay, now I feel better




That was last summer.  


That's kind of my point, too many variables, so you're not embarrassing me one bit. 


Too much can happen. Why would someone wait til the last darned minute to try?


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

jamie1231 said:


> Amen....i know when my bow is "good enough" just like i know when my rifle is "good enough"...if i can drill a squirrel @ 25yrds with it "good enough"....i can kill a deer





But can you at least get within a quarter's width of center under controlled conditions, inside, no distractions?


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## Scrub Buck (Sep 6, 2011)

I am just answering her question about shooting a target.  Seems she thinks you have to hit nothing but bullseyes in order to hunt with a bow.  She can hit bullseyes and shoots pigs in the rear.  I don't pass judgement, just call it as I see it.  Good Day!


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

Scrub Buck said:


> I am just answering her question about shooting a target.  Seems she thinks you have to hit nothing but bullseyes in order to hunt with a bow.  She can hit bullseyes and shoots pigs in the rear.  I don't pass judgement, just call it as I see it.  Good Day!




Isn't being able to at least hit a "bullseye" a good start before you start running through the woods shooting at live targets?  


Everybody misses, except bowanna maybe  but when you can't even get near zero, why wouldn't you at least TRY a little harder?






Good day to you too.


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## jamie1231 (Sep 6, 2011)

turtlebug said:


> But can you at least get within a quarter's width of center under controlled conditions, inside, no distractions?



i thought you had a challenge for me....this is my 1st yr ever shootin a bow....i can put six shots around the bullseye that you could cover with a dip can while my son is talking in my ear and twins are the porch screaming with a train blowing the horn 300 yrds from my house and ppl driving by..but thats the conditions i shoot in....the key is no distractions...when i shoot its me,the target,the sight and the trigger....anything not in my line of sight doesnt get to me like it does some ppl...and if someone is comfortable with "good enough" then they know what they can do...kinda like the "ethical shot" debate if you know can then its an ethical shot....if your not sure then its not ethical


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## PineThirty (Sep 6, 2011)

Got to give you credit there. It frustrates me to see people wait until last minute to check there equipment also, but thats just looking at It from the way I like to do things. I really prefer to dial my equipment In and shoot everyday I can all year long but everyone has there way of doing things. Every hunter has there own view on what Is "good enough".



Scrub Buck said:


> I am just answering her question about shooting a target.  Seems she thinks you have to hit nothing but bullseyes in order to hunt with a bow.  She can hit bullseyes and shoots pigs in the rear.  I don't pass judgement, just call it as I see it.  Good Day!


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## kmckinnie (Sep 6, 2011)

You will be proud to know everyone on team Killem & Grillem can hit the dot at 20ty 30ty & 40ty ! Now all we need it a live target, and a little luck! Can't beat some good luck! 






Our dots are about 4" at 40ty lols

Man I feel better now! Wheeew!


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

jamie1231 said:


> i thought you had a challenge for me....this is my 1st yr ever shootin a bow....i can put six shots around the bullseye that you could cover with a dip can while my son is talking in my ear and twins are the porch screaming with a train blowing the horn 300 yrds from my house and ppl driving by..but thats the conditions i shoot in....the key is no distractions...when i shoot its me,the target,the sight and the trigger....anything not in my line of sight doesnt get to me like it does some ppl...and if someone is comfortable with "good enough" then they know what they can do...kinda like the "ethical shot" debate if you know can then its an ethical shot....if your not sure then its not ethical






Did you go out and buy a new bow and all the gear last week and draw your first arrow Friday just so you could bowhunt? My guess is no and that's a good thing.


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

kmckinnie said:


> You will be proud to know everyone on team Killem & Grillem can hit the dot at 20ty 30ty & 40ty ! Now all we need it a live target, and a little luck! Can't beat some good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Hush up you.        


It's them bifocals.


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## DouglasB. (Sep 6, 2011)

Turtlebug... normally I am with you 100 percent. 

On this one... not so much. 

I've never been a target shooter. I'll never brag about my groups. I can work on my sites day in/day out and I'll never hit the bullseye over and over again. 

There is a BIG difference in a bullseye the size of a half dollar and the kill zone of a deer that is relatively the size of a piece of notebook paper. 

Yes, there are ALWAYS variables. I don't shoot in 3D tournaments simply because I can only hold steady for a certain amount of time. 

Hitting the bullseye doesn't mean a hill of beans. Whenever I target shoot... my FIRST shot is always the best... and in my bow hunting experience... the First shot is all you are garaunteed. 

So yes.... when I hit the heart on my 3D target the first time, every time..... 

that's good enough.


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## Scrub Buck (Sep 6, 2011)

Not in all cases.  I guess you have never had target panic?  If you ever experience it you will be hard pressed to ever hit a bullseye.  I paint all my targets one solid color to over come it.  I aim dead center.  Animals don't have bulleyes on them either.  I shoot one arrow at a time and hit exactly where I aimed.  I've been shooting bows, leagues, and tournaments for over 30 years and have come to find people can kill animals consistantly without ever hitting a bullseye.


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## fulldraw74 (Sep 6, 2011)

DouglasB. said:


> Turtlebug... normally I am with you 100 percent.
> 
> On this one... not so much.
> 
> ...



Well said....


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## bucks n does (Sep 6, 2011)

So I shouldn't wait until Friday to shoot and sight my bow in?


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## PineThirty (Sep 6, 2011)

No you should wait until Friday evening about 20 minutes before dark. Low light Is the best time to sight In a bow.



bucks n does said:


> So I shouldn't wait until Friday to shoot and sight my bow in?


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

DouglasB. said:


> Turtlebug... normally I am with you 100 percent.
> 
> On this one... not so much.
> 
> ...





To each their own and if you're happy with it then more power to you.  


I didn't say it was WRONG, I said it bothers me to watch multiple people not try a little harder. 

I'm not satisfied with not having my bow hitting dead center when I leave the house with it. Maybe that's just me. My butt-shot hog still bothers me so I have a hard time with anything less than a perfectly tuned bow. Then again, since the first time I picked up a bow, I've wanting nothing less than to perfect my passion. 



Obviously most of the folks that post on this board CARE, the "I don't care" attitude that I've seen lately in person, is for the birds though.   And believe me, I've seen quite a few that think they're Fred Bear after shooting six poorly placed shots in the last two weeks.


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

Scrub Buck said:


> Not in all cases.  I guess you have never had target panic?  If you ever experience it you will be hard pressed to ever hit a bullseye.  I paint all my targets one solid color to over come it.  I aim dead center.  Animals don't have bulleyes on them either.  I shoot one arrow at a time and hit exactly where I aimed.  I've been shooting bows, leagues, and tournaments for over 30 years and have come to find people can kill animals consistantly without ever hitting a bullseye.



I actually started showing signs and changes were made and I never fully had an issue with it.

I do know several people who have it though and can still drill at least one or two shots out of three dozen. 





fulldraw74 said:


> Well said....




Would never expect you to agree with me even if I said it was raining during monsoon season.  





bucks n does said:


> So I shouldn't wait until Friday to shoot and sight my bow in?




I'd say just shoot a few from your stand before daylight Saturday morning and you'll be fine.


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## DouglasB. (Sep 6, 2011)

You also have to keep in mind range time.

I live in the middle of the city on the third floor of one of the largest apartment complexes in my city. The closest bow shop with a range is 70 miles away, and you couldn't PAY me to step foot in that shop. 

I have a target set up out back at work, but I'm only at my office once or twice a week, and the guys in the shop wouldn't look to highly on my out back shooting while they are busting hump to get me paid. 

We all don't have the luxury of a range in our backyards, or even a range nearby. 

Sometimes it's not so much about whether or not we care, it's about not having the option. When I leave for work... it's dark.... when I get home.... it's dark.... So even if I had the opportunity to shoot at home... I wouldn't be able to.


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 6, 2011)

I think its less work to be good enough, than to constantly get better. I WORK at being a hunter and an archer. I shoot, I run, I lift, and then shoot more. I want to be the most effective hunter I can be. "I'm not a tournament shooter so I don't have to shoot that good to hunt" that's just backwards. I work harder on my hunting set up than I do tournament set up. All my tournment bow has to do is hit the same place twice. My hunting bow has to deliver a perfectly flown arrow to a small area under pressure. It takes a life of an nimal and it is important to me it does it well, but more important I do it well. If you are okay with just okay, I say you are taking the easy way, the lzy way out.


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## Wack&Stackn08 (Sep 6, 2011)

I under stand the point that bug was trying to make. I bought a rifle several years back. The guy that owned the place told me that the guy that bought it new, had them bore sight it on Friday afternoon and he missed a "Big Buck" with it the next Saturday morning. He brought it back and traded it on another gun.

There will always be people like this. Everyones opinon of "good enough" is  different. My opinion of "good enuff" is hitting what I am aiming at. If I am aiming at a 3" bullseye and can't hit it, that is NOT good enough for me. With that being said, most people can't do that with out practicing. Weather or not its due to lack of time, or laziness, I believe thats why some people settle, or say "thats good enough".


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## drawedback (Sep 6, 2011)

I agree and disagree, I agree that if you are going to bow hunt you should get the lazy bone out and shoot for atleast a few weeks, you should be comfortable with your equipment and be able to draw, and hold it. As far as hitting the bullseye, some folks just ain't very good at shooting targets. Same goes for rifles, I know several people who have their rifles sighted in by someone else because they are no good at shooting paper. Like you, I do get annoyed at people who pull the bow out the day before season, shoot three arrows,and say, I think I'm good.


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## PineThirty (Sep 6, 2011)

This Is true also. Before I moved last Nov. I could go out In the yard and shoot anytime I wanted. I used to shoot 100+ arrows a day. Now I have to drive 15-20minutes to the range. I only shoot 2-3times a week now. For some thats still alot, but like I said thats half the shooting time I used to have.



DouglasB. said:


> You also have to keep in mind range time.
> 
> I live in the middle of the city on the third floor of one of the largest apartment complexes in my city. The closest bow shop with a range is 70 miles away, and you couldn't PAY me to step foot in that shop.
> 
> ...


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 6, 2011)

DouglasB. said:


> You also have to keep in mind range time.
> 
> I live in the middle of the city on the third floor of one of the largest apartment complexes in my city. The closest bow shop with a range is 70 miles away, and you couldn't PAY me to step foot in that shop.
> 
> ...


Just a suggestion, if you can. Set up a block xbow target in th living room or kitchen. It may only be 7 - 10 yards. Execute your form 10 arrows a night and every morning. That's 20 arrows a day, 140 a weel. Form makes accuracy.


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## DouglasB. (Sep 6, 2011)

I have thought about it time and time again, believe me.... I could seriously sneeze across this apartment. All I need is for SOMETHING to screw up and send an arrow through my paper thing walls into the neighbors dog.... or neighbor. 

Variables happen. 

I just ranged it.... the longest straight shot I have is from my living room to bathroom with the door open.... it's 7.5 yards. If there was a screw up I'd be sending an arrow into my bathroom sink. 

I only say this because I've had a release break on me before and sent the arrow I was holding WELL away from where I'd intended on hitting. Variables.... even when you think ya have them all figured out, something can happen.


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 6, 2011)

DouglasB. said:


> I have thought about it time and time again, believe me.... I could seriously sneeze across this apartment. All I need is for SOMETHING to screw up and send an arrow through my paper thing walls into the neighbors dog.... or neighbor.
> 
> Variables happen.
> 
> ...



Hey you can only do what is possible in your situation. I think I would put the target on an outside wall and take a chance on the release breaking. My point above was the difference in some one working to get better and be better and saying "good enough" after not putting full effort. I generally believe they are saying the minimal effort was good enough for them.


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## Scrub Buck (Sep 6, 2011)

One or two out of thirty-six?  Heck, I can still hit ten or fifteen out of thirty-six when I shoot a dot once a month. Guess, they need to practice more?   Not like it used to be though, but good enough.


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

BIGRNYRS said:


> Hey you can only do what is possible in your situation. I think I would put the target on an outside wall and take a chance on the release breaking. My point above was the difference in some one working to get better and be better and saying "good enough" after not putting full effort. I generally believe they are saying the minimal effort was good enough for them.



One of the best hunters I know, also a tournament archer, will set up a block in his living room or hotel room and shoot blind bales for a minimum of 30 minutes before he competes or hunts. 






Maybe I'm just a perfectionist?  

Maybe the cooler temps gave me a brain freeze? 

Maybe these last four days are killing me. 


Maybe they're killing yall too since there's way too many people looking at this thread instead of sharpening broadheads and checking fletching.


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## PineThirty (Sep 6, 2011)

Hey I still got 39 more days so you cant get onto me.



turtlebug said:


> One of the best hunters I know, also a tournament archer, will set up a block in his living room or hotel room and shoot blind bales for a minimum of 30 minutes before he competes or hunts.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 6, 2011)

Turtle, wanna get pumped for hunting seasom. Go to youtube and search "cameron hanes til I collapse". Get back with me after. Bet you go to the gym tonight!


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## whitehunter (Sep 6, 2011)

funny you mention this, yesterday I went to my dads house to show off y new youngin to some family that havent seen him, and as usual i took my bow with m just in case he wanted to shoot. And dad says to me, son i was messing with my crossbow and knocked the scope loose and the sight are off, do you mind re sighting it in for me. So naturally I was much oblidged too. After hitting bottle cap size groupings at 40yds. I went inside and told him your all ready to go. Well the rain started drizzling a little and he said are you going to shoot your bow and I said nah its starting to rain I know its "good enough" but something told me hey knuckle head go and get wet for a while so I did. And after hitting the 10 ring a handfull of times I said ok it is good enough. Even though I knew it was on I still had to prove to myself that it was, plus my uncle was there and didnt believe that I was as acurate with my compound as I was with my dads x-bow! But you are very correct, there is way too many people out there that have that "It's good enough attitude"


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## T.P. (Sep 6, 2011)

turtlebug said:


> Maybe they're killing yall too since there's way too many people looking at this thread instead of sharpening broadheads and checking fletching.



Done sharpened my heads til they been whittled down to 50 grains each. Done put 8 different color fletchings on so far, think I'm gonna settle on pink and lavender.


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## coon hunter (Sep 6, 2011)

I aint so bad with a bow but with a rifle i cant hit a piece of paper to save my life but you put some hair in front of me and i dont miss. i thnk this is true with some bow shooters. I have been shooting a bow for years and still dont drill the target right where i want to but i know that my setup will put it where it needs to be if i do my part.


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## Skyjacker (Sep 6, 2011)

I find myself getting slack the more shots I take and developing bad habits.  My first 3 shots out of the case are typically my best.  So about three times prior to the season, I take three shots.  I have in the past taken over 100 shots in a session.  I stopped doing that a couple of years ago.  I get my bow tuned regularly and I shoot it in front of a professional, feel comfortable and leave.  Then I'll open the case maybe two to three times before the season and I don't take anymore than 3 shots.  All done with the broadhead of choice.  

I don't want to make bow hunting like golf.  You can over analyze your shot just like a golf swing, and the next thing you know your in your head too much shanking it.

That said, I understand what you are saying and partly agree.  But I'm happy when I group 3 arrows in a circle the size of the top of a coke can at 25-30 yards.  If I hit one outside that.  I put the bow up and shoot again the next day.


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## alligood729 (Sep 6, 2011)

I agree 100% with you Tbug..... I do however, realize that there are those among us, that can make a good kill shot on an animal that never shoot at a dot or a bullseye on a target. Some folks are natural shots....my Dad would take his Rem. 1100 out of the cabinet opening day of dove season, having not shot it since the last season, and proceed to kill 18-20 birds for every box of shells.....still makes me ill that I can't.... And before you say "that's more than the limit!!".....well, all I can say is my Dad grew up in the depression, and lessons learned then were not soon forgotten. He was shooting for food, and we ate what he killed, over the limit or not...so just leave that one alone...lol

Tim Knight is one that comes to mind also. I've heard him say many times...." I couldn't hit a dot on the wall if I tried, but put something with hair in front of me, and it's had a bad day". Well, I for one know he could hit a dot, I shot with him just yesterday, I know how he shoots!!!

I know tho, exactly what you are talking about. I have been in the shop on Friday afternoon before opening day, and have a customer walk in an hour before closing and ask for a complete setup so he could hunt the next morning! 

Now, any of you guys that have hunted for a while know what she meant too...."good enough" in a lot of cases just ain't....."good enough"...And as far as the kill zone being roughly the size of a piece of notebook paper, well......as long as it's the center of the piece of paper...lol  At 20 yds, if I can't hit a 50cent piece 4 out of 5 times, I'm not happy, but that's just me. I've only lost one deer in the last 5 yrs, out of 15 or so I killed, and that was of course, my own fault, hit the deer high, and just skipped off her back. I've had target pan....well you know, and have at least beaten it back if not eliminated it.....

The guys that proclaim "that's good enough" will be back on here in a few weeks, blaming a broad head failure on the fact that they made a "perfect shot" and didn't get any blood, or the "perfect shot" that only penetrated 4-5" and fell out....
Mark my words, it will happen...


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

BIGRNYRS said:


> Turtle, wanna get pumped for hunting seasom. Go to youtube and search "cameron hanes til I collapse". Get back with me after. Bet you go to the gym tonight!



I ran down 140 patients today and held down 8 screaming kids so they could get jabbed with needles. I've had my workout.    

I better not watch it tonight, I've gotta go in at 5 and I'm already so pumped I doubt I'll sleep for the next four nights. My coworkers are ready to throw me out the door.  I'll watch it tomorrow and get back with ya though. 


Now where's that Alligood to stoke the fire while I catch some zzzz's?


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 6, 2011)

If that don't work try "cameron hanes singularity of purpose"


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## turtlebug (Sep 6, 2011)

T.P. said:


> Done sharpened my heads til they been whittled down to 50 grains each. Done put 8 different color fletchings on so far, think I'm gonna settle on pink and lavender.



I got some leftover pink I can send ya. They'll really bring out your eyes  I went with blue this year.  






alligood729 said:


> I agree 100% with you Tbug..... I do however, realize that there are those among us, that can make a good kill shot on an animal that never shoot at a dot or a bullseye on a target. Some folks are natural shots....my Dad would take his Rem. 1100 out of the cabinet opening day of dove season, having not shot it since the last season, and proceed to kill 18-20 birds for every box of shells.....still makes me ill that I can't.... And before you say "that's more than the limit!!".....well, all I can say is my Dad grew up in the depression, and lessons learned then were not soon forgotten. He was shooting for food, and we ate what he killed, over the limit or not...so just leave that one alone...lol
> 
> Tim Knight is one that comes to mind also. I've heard him say many times...." I couldn't hit a dot on the wall if I tried, but put something with hair in front of me, and it's had a bad day". Well, I for one know he could hit a dot, I shot with him just yesterday, I know how he shoots!!!
> 
> ...





Oh, there you are. 


Dang David!  

I said stoke it, not throw kerosene on it.


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## alligood729 (Sep 6, 2011)

turtlebug said:


> I ran down 140 patients today and held down 8 screaming kids so they could get jabbed with needles. I've had my workout.
> 
> I better not watch it tonight, I've gotta go in at 5 and I'm already so pumped I doubt I'll sleep for the next four nights. My coworkers are ready to throw me out the door.  I'll watch it tomorrow and get back with ya though.
> 
> ...



Look up above hunney....


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## solocam678 (Sep 6, 2011)

Yep...I see this alot to. I shoot dots in my yard. When im huntin I try an pick a spot on the deer...not jus the 10 ring. If I focus on the smallest spot I can find on the animal it gives me alil room for error.


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## hogman1 (Sep 6, 2011)

Im shooting 2 inch groups at 20 and 30 and around 3 to 4 inch groups at 40 and 50. consistantly. I think thats good enough. I agree on not picking up a bow friday afternoon and going for a quick sight in. but hey, good enough is what it means...good enuf.


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## K80 (Sep 6, 2011)

T I know what you are saying and a lot of those guys that I know that do that miss or hit a deer poorly more times than not.  They are also the ones that think those that put in the  extra effort lie about how good they shoot or lie about not missing or making poor shots because the don't know what it is like to work that hard at what you love to do.  However, this year I will be one of those good enough hunters since having two little kids younger than 15 months and a wife the works retail that often closes leaving me at home with the kids by myself in the afternoons doesn't leave much time to shoot.  Because I've been shooting a bow since I was 6 years old and at one point I could shoot my friends knocks off at will it'll be ok.  I will not take a questionable shot though as I know my odds of a miss hit will be higher than years gone by and I doubt I will take a shot over 20 yards until I can put in more range time.


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## robert carter (Sep 7, 2011)

I can`t shoot good groups at 30 yards. I can shoot decent ones at 20 maybe 2-3". but I have killed well over a 100 deer at 15. Thats why I keep my shots at 20 or less and I know thats good enough for me.
 I know what Tbugs talking about. The local archery shop will be filled with folks buying bowhunting stuff for Sat. morning on Friday evening.Most pulled their bow out sometime that week and realized something was wrong. I can get my bow off the rack walk out on the front deck and throw it like a boomarang across the yard then go pick it up and shoot 2-3" groups at 20 yards and bust nocks at 15.But the key is the very first shot will be on the money and thats the one that pays. Thats good enough because I am disiplined enough to not shoot past my effective range. Wait a few days and I`ll show you proof.RC


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## alligood729 (Sep 7, 2011)

robert carter said:


> I can`t shoot good groups at 30 yards. I can shoot decent ones at 20 maybe 2-3". but I have killed well over a 100 deer at 15. Thats why I keep my shots at 20 or less and I know thats good enough for me.
> I know what Tbugs talking about. The local archery shop will be filled with folks buying bowhunting stuff for Sat. morning on Friday evening.Most pulled their bow out sometime that week and realized something was wrong. I can get my bow off the rack walk out on the front deck and throw it like a boomarang across the yard then go pick it up and shoot 2-3" groups at 20 yards and bust nocks at 15.But the key is the very first shot will be on the money and thats the one that pays. Thats good enough because I am disiplined enough to not shoot past my effective range. Wait a few days and I`ll show you proof.RC



In your case, your "good enough" is good enough....its the ones that say "good enough" when they hit somewhere in the vicinity of the kill zone with no more thought about it. I was the same way once.....hit a pie plate at 25yds, I'm good! After I started 4yrs ago with the 3d stuff, I figured out right quick, pie plate accuracy ain't accurate at all.


----------



## fulldraw74 (Sep 7, 2011)

turtlebug said:


> Would never expect you to agree with me even if I said it was raining during monsoon season.
> 
> 
> 
> :



Then this should not have been a surprise  for you then..... don't appear i was the only one either...


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## B Kirkpatrick (Sep 7, 2011)

Mines " good enough"


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## Huntinfool (Sep 7, 2011)

Good enough bothers me too....but it's going to have to be a "good enough" year for me this year.

Why?

Well, I work 52 miles from my house.  I have three kids under the age of 4.  I have a wife who needs my help.  I have things that have to get done.

Shooting the bow waits till all that other stuff is taken care of and, right now, that means the bow doesn't get as much attention as it needs for me to be 100% confident as I have been in the past.

Why good enough this year?  There are things that are higher and more important priorities.  I don't hunt with a rifle anymore.  So "good enough" is going to have to be good enough this year.  I'm relying on years of shooting and a bow that was dead on last year and appears to be pretty much the same this year.


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## alligood729 (Sep 7, 2011)

B Kirkpatrick said:


> Mines " good enough"



 Your definition of good enough ain't the same as what Tbug is referring to, and I think you know that...lol


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## MUSICMAN257 (Sep 7, 2011)

Huntinfool said:


> Good enough bothers me too....but it's going to have to be a "good enough" year for me this year.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...



I feel you there I have 2 tho.  I do have a feeling you have forgotten more about slinging sticks than many bowhunters are yet to learn though. Some people's good enough will far surpass others and so on.  We can hammer on this for ever. Lets just hope the "Not Quite Good EnuFFs" are far from me in the woods and that will be "Good EnuFF" for me


----------



## alligood729 (Sep 7, 2011)

MUSICMAN257 said:


> I feel you there I have 2 tho.  I do have a feeling you have forgotten more about slinging sticks than many bowhunters are yet to learn though. Some people's good enough will far surpass others and so on.  We can hammer on this for ever. Lets just hope the "Not Quite Good EnuFFs" are far from me in the woods and that will be "Good EnuFF" for me


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## Nicodemus (Sep 7, 2011)

Everybody just remember a couple of things. There are different levels of competency. And this is not Medieval England.


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## Bell_Man (Sep 7, 2011)

In my mind "Good Enough" is not "Good Enough".  I strive for perfection when in my equipment and myself when I know Im going to use it to attempt to harvest a animal.  All animals we hunt either no matter what the weapon deserve our respect.  I think we all owe it to the animals we hunt to make clean ethical kills.


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## Huntinfool (Sep 7, 2011)

> I feel you there I have 2 tho. I do have a feeling you have forgotten more about slinging sticks than many bowhunters are yet to learn though. Some people's good enough will far surpass others and so on. We can hammer on this for ever. Lets just hope the "Not Quite Good EnuFFs" are far from me in the woods and that will be "Good EnuFF" for me



I've slung a bunch of arrows at targets.  That's for sure.  Forgot more than most know?  Probably not.  It does kill me knowing that I'm not "ready" like I want to be.  

I've got my first ever trip to Kansas scheduled for early Nov this year.  So there will most definitely be good practice hours between now and then and I agree with most...good enough for some is better than many will ever be (not including myself in that).

There are lots of folks who definitely HAVE forgotten more than most will ever know.  For those...if they said "good enough", I'm not worried about them whatsoever.

I think T-bugs point is that there are lots of guys who never even think about their bows and accuracy.  For them, bowhunting is just an extra month to kill deer.  It's not about archery.  It's about getting extra time to kill.

For those guys, there is no thought to accuracy or clean kills.  An arrow in the deer will do.  I don't think we have many of those around here.  But they are definitely out there...and in big numbers.


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## FlipKing (Sep 7, 2011)

I practice a good bit and this will be my first year bow hunting. I plan to keep all shots under 20 yards and will stick to that. I am however shooting a 20 year old PSE and it wont do groups like I would prefer, but I can do 3 and four arrow groups that are around the size of my hand at 20 yards and I do consider that "good enough". Though I'll be practicing more and more.


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## B Kirkpatrick (Sep 7, 2011)

alligood729 said:


> Your definition of good enough ain't the same as what Tbug is referring to, and I think you know that...lol



Oh I know, I meant its good enough to send a 430 gr arrow into the chest of a unsuppesting animal hitting it like thors hammer handing out dirt naps and free rides to the cooler. I'm ready


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## siberian1 (Sep 7, 2011)

BIGRNYRS said:


> Turtle, wanna get pumped for hunting seasom. Go to youtube and search "cameron hanes til I collapse". Get back with me after. Bet you go to the gym tonight!



I work at being a hunter as well.  Lots of running, lifting,shooting.  Glad to see there are others!!


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## Corey J (Sep 7, 2011)

I'm guilty!


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## MCNASTY (Sep 7, 2011)

Im willing to bet those who are bow only arent dusting off their bow this week.  It has been in full time service all summer.  Some take it more serious than others, but practice is the only cure for remembering the anchors in the heat of the moment.  Im not tournament shooter and I dont have kids but I have a full time job while in college and still find time 3-4 times a week to shoot.  You make time if bow hunting is what you do.


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## DouglasB. (Sep 7, 2011)

I'll tell ya what.... 

I'll let my results say what good enough is this year. 

So far in the last 3 years I've killed 5 turkeys and 7 deer using nothing but my "good enough" bow.

I've missed one turkey.

I haven't lost an injured animal.

Maybe I'll miss or lose this year... but so far, history has shown that my idea of "good enough" is just that.


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## Taylor Co. (Sep 7, 2011)

*Turtlebug, I know exactly what you mean*

To all of those that don't have time to practice or resources...I'm calling bull..How have you got time to hunt?

I agree with Alligood, these are the same folks that made a perfect shot on a deer with no blood, and the broadhead ain't no good, and blah, blah, blah.

Target Panic, yeah, I have had it several times. Work through it. That's what I did. Good Luck to you.


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## Y.T. (Sep 7, 2011)

"Good enough" sounds like different things for different people.  Some seem to resent the idea of "good enough" all together.

For all, hunting comes with responsibility.  Better make sure that "good enough" translates to a quick and ethical kill- be honest with yourself and recognize your limitations.


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## secondseason (Sep 7, 2011)

Pete Shepley says "Perfect practice makes perfect"  flinging for the sake of flinging or when you are tired makes you change things when they shouldn't be changed.


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## DouglasB. (Sep 7, 2011)

Taylor Co. said:


> To all of those that don't have time to practice or resources...I'm calling bull...How have you got time to hunt?



I bust my absolute rear end in the off season so that I can rearrange my schedule during the season. 

How is it your place to call anything until you've lived a day in my shoes? 

Off season... Monday through Friday.... 

Easy days...

4AM - Wake up
5AM - Leave for office or out of state clients
8AM - First customer visit
1PM - Lunch
1:20PM - Back on Highway
8PM- Home to do paperwork

Hard Days...

7AM - Wake UP
(follow the rest of previously scheduled events)
9PM - work security at second job
(second job is so that I can have extra savings to blow during time off during season)
Get home about 2:30 AM.... hours sleep and then back on the easy schedule. I MAY get a nap during the day if I have a free hour without customers.

Saturdays - 

Open bar. Bartending shift 12 hours. I MAY get a chance to shoot if I can manage getting out of bed on only about 20 hours of sleep Monday through Friday.

Sunday - 

Wake up.
Clean house (I don't have a significant other to help with that)
Wash clothes
Focus on hunting land cleanup, scouting, or visit family.

During the season -

3 weeks of saved vacation time.
Due to my seniority where I do security I move my scheduled nights to one night a week. I give up Saturday opening bar/bartending shifts meaning I'll lose about 200 bucks per week. Thank God for all those extra hours during the off season.

I'll gladly show you pay check stubs, or even let you stay with me for a week to prove said schedule. Just try and keep up, won't you.

Next time you call bull on something, I'd highly suggest you know the facts. Everyones life isn't country and easy. I bust my hump to hunt. Simple as that.

So if the fact that I'm "good enough" makes me lazy... come live a week in my life. We'll see who's lazy.


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## Taylor Co. (Sep 7, 2011)

DouglasB. said:


> I bust my absolute rear end in the off season so that I can rearrange my schedule during the season.
> 
> How is it your place to call anything until you've lived a day in my shoes?
> 
> ...



No thanks, pal! You can have all of that.


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## DouglasB. (Sep 7, 2011)

I think we edited it at the same time Nicodemus. My mistake.


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## Nicodemus (Sep 7, 2011)

DouglasB. said:


> I think we edited it at the same time Nicodemus. My mistake.





No problem. Ya`ll just keep it civil and clean.


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## alligood729 (Sep 7, 2011)

Y.T. said:


> "Good enough" sounds like different things for different people.  Some seem to resent the idea of "good enough" all together.
> 
> For all, hunting comes with responsibility.  Better make sure that "good enough" translates to a quick and ethical kill- be honest with yourself and recognize your limitations.



That last statement is a bingo! Perfect summarization to this whole thread......


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## Taylor Co. (Sep 7, 2011)

alligood729 said:


> That last statement is a bingo! Perfect summarization to this whole thread......



Yep. Group Hug!


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## MUSICMAN257 (Sep 7, 2011)

DouglasB. said:


> I bust my absolute rear end in the off season so that I can rearrange my schedule during the season.
> 
> How is it your place to call anything until you've lived a day in my shoes?
> 
> ...


Heck after that schedule I would wanna kill something too


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## DouglasB. (Sep 7, 2011)

MUSICMAN257 said:


> Heck after that schedule I would wanna kill something too



My friend, it's well worth it when that first sunrise hits my camo painted face!!!


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## GeorgiaGlockMan (Sep 7, 2011)

I tend to go in the opposite direction a couple of weeks before the season.

I've shot plenty up til now and cut way back hoping that I won't jack something up  with my bow. 

It's never happened but I'd be a wreck if my bow wasn't right before the opener.  It would become my 100% focus at the detriment of everything else in my life. (knocking on wood)


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## Taylor Co. (Sep 7, 2011)

MUSICMAN257 said:


> Heck after that schedule I would wanna kill something too



I agree. Life is full of choices. We make them,  good or bad we get the repercussions.


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## robert carter (Sep 7, 2011)

Mcnasty hit the nail on the head I think as well as Bowhuntingfool.
 I apoligize if I offended anyone but I hunt bow only and do because I love too. Sometimes I take it for granted that everyone with a bow in the woods has the same mindset and they don`t. I have no desire to shoot anything with a gun but have nothing against those who gunhunt. There just ain`t nothing like seeing them yellow feathers disappear through deer ribs. Good luck hunting fellers and Young Lady. The weather shore has changed for the better.RC


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## 100hunter (Sep 7, 2011)

I believe that good enough defines your confidence level and not you shooting ability. I've always believed that everything matters when it comes to bowhunting.  Practice, broadheads, tracking ability, scent control, camo, hunting partners, stand location, wind, barometric pressure,etc. etc.  You first must know how good you need to be before you can say Good enough.  Until you've had to take a shot between the fork of a tree, or shoot at a buck in a six inch space between brush you wont know how good you need to be.  I expect every mature buck to be elusive enough to present only marginal shots, thats why its never good enough for me.  When I was only hunting does and yearlings it didn't matter as much as it does now.  I now understand that every animal deserves an human kill.  I have to remind myself that some guys good enough is better than my busting tail work ethic, and at their worst they are still better than me.  However we all share the responsibility to be the best that we can be.  Some people are procrastinators but excellent at their craft, some work hard and are still not that good.   I took three guys hunting with me last season.  One shot over a doe at 20 yds and he shoots competition,  One shot under a buck at 5 yds and he shoots all the time, and the other guy drilled a buck at 30 yds and he shot less than 100 arrows through his bow.  I personally wont go hunting with anyone who I know is not proficient.  Ladybug I know where you're coming from, but don't let some of these old school, sand bagging professionals fool you with that good enough attitude, because they are deadly.  And for those who believe that hitting a pie plate is good enough, wait till you miss that buck of a lifetime and have it haunt you for 20 yrs.  I know because it happened to me.


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## alligood729 (Sep 7, 2011)

100hunter said:


> I believe that good enough defines your confidence level and not you shooting ability. I've always believed that everything matters when it comes to bowhunting.  Practice, broadheads, tracking ability, scent control, camo, hunting partners, stand location, wind, barometric pressure,etc. etc.  You first must know how good you need to be before you can say Good enough.  Until you've had to take a shot between the fork of a tree, or shoot at a buck in a six inch space between brush you wont know how good you need to be.  I expect every mature buck to be elusive enough to present only marginal shots, thats why its never good enough for me.  When I was only hunting does and yearlings it didn't matter as much as it does now.  I now understand that every animal deserves an human kill.  I have to remind myself that some guys good enough is better than my busting tail work ethic, and at their worst they are still better than me.  However we all share the responsibility to be the best that we can be.  Some people are procrastinators but excellent at their craft, some work hard and are still not that good.   I took three guys hunting with me last season.  One shot over a doe at 20 yds and he shoots competition,  One shot under a buck at 5 yds and he shoots all the time, and the other guy drilled a buck at 30 yds and he shot less than 100 arrows through his bow.  I personally wont go hunting with anyone who I know is not proficient.  Ladybug I know where you're coming from, but don't let some of these old school, sand bagging professionals fool you with that good enough attitude, because they are deadly.  And for those who believe that hitting a pie plate is good enough, wait till you miss that buck of a lifetime and have it haunt you for 20 yrs.  I know because it happened to me.


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## DaddyPaul (Sep 7, 2011)

I sold the sight off my Alphaburner last night.  Somehow by 9/17 I'll be ready though...(missing GA opener due to son's travel ball tournament).


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## DouglasB. (Sep 7, 2011)

100hunter said:


> I believe that good enough defines your confidence level and not you shooting ability. I've always believed that everything matters when it comes to bowhunting.  Practice, broadheads, tracking ability, scent control, camo, hunting partners, stand location, wind, barometric pressure,etc. etc.  You first must know how good you need to be before you can say Good enough.  Until you've had to take a shot between the fork of a tree, or shoot at a buck in a six inch space between brush you wont know how good you need to be.  I expect every mature buck to be elusive enough to present only marginal shots, thats why its never good enough for me.  When I was only hunting does and yearlings it didn't matter as much as it does now.  I now understand that every animal deserves an human kill.  I have to remind myself that some guys good enough is better than my busting tail work ethic, and at their worst they are still better than me.  However we all share the responsibility to be the best that we can be.  Some people are procrastinators but excellent at their craft, some work hard and are still not that good.   I took three guys hunting with me last season.  One shot over a doe at 20 yds and he shoots competition,  One shot under a buck at 5 yds and he shoots all the time, and the other guy drilled a buck at 30 yds and he shot less than 100 arrows through his bow.  I personally wont go hunting with anyone who I know is not proficient.  Ladybug I know where you're coming from, but don't let some of these old school, sand bagging professionals fool you with that good enough attitude, because they are deadly.  And for those who believe that hitting a pie plate is good enough, wait till you miss that buck of a lifetime and have it haunt you for 20 yrs.  I know because it happened to me.



Very well said sir. Very well. Hats off to ya.


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## GTBHUNTIN (Sep 7, 2011)

Tbug,

Great point, I see those type every year asking what arrows or what broadheads a week before the season when that should all have been done weeks ago.

The animals we pursue be it a squirrel or a 150" class deer don't deserve someone shooting at them that has a "good enough" setup and shooting mentality.  These are the hunters that gives us all a bad name.  

I will be the first to say that I am not the best archery shot but I can at least say that my setup and shooting abilities are the best that I can produce.  With that said its because of all the practice I do I  know my limitations which allows me to be an ethical hunter and not just another guy flinging whatever arrows in the general direction of an animal.

gtbhuntin


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## Taylor Co. (Sep 8, 2011)

*My opinion and I am entitled to it*

If this thread offended anyone and they felt the need to defend themselves...perhaps they should practice some more. The thread was a part of feelings that a responsible bowhunter felt while observing complacent hunters. I share her disdain.


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 8, 2011)

Lift, Run, Shoot
Train Hard Hunt Easy
Cameron Hanes


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## storeman (Sep 8, 2011)

I agree 100%. Talked with two different people this week who are bowhunting this weekend and they have not even pulled out their bow since last year.


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## gtgeorge (Sep 8, 2011)

Well I just broke mine out on Sunday and couldn't hardly pull it back LOL. But once I was able to draw this old bow I was in the black out to 45 yards so "Good Enough"  

But seriously I have still shot some each day since. While it is good enough, I am getting used to different angles and shots between my three pins. As well as building my shoulders etc back to where it is easy and smooth.


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## RMelton (Sep 8, 2011)

Well as stated earlier, some of us have other things that take priority over shooting everyday. I work at least 10 hours a day. Sometimes more. Then it is home to my wife and two sons. 2 and 4 months. My wife has been home with them all day so I try to spend as much time with them as I can before getting them to bed. After all that it is dark. I started shoot a week ago and I actually shot a little bit a lunch today. Stacking arrows in a 4" group at 40 yards on my 4th shooting session, and the exact words out of my mouth were "thats good enough". As for not having the time to shoot, but having time to hunt. I spend as much time at work and home during the off season so I can get out to hunt. Might want to think about other peoples situations before you go spouting of at the mouth.


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## yellowhammer73 (Sep 8, 2011)

my wife and i both hunt and we shoot just about 3 days a week... all year. not for any other reason than we enjoy shooting. has it made us a better shot? sure it has. but we dont look down or talk down to anyone who doesnt shoot or enjoy the same things we do. as well we dont sugggest anyone not practice with thier equiptment. gun, bow, and heck knife if thats what you use. but as stated above life has a funny way of changing what we all want to do. i just hope that everyone who goes hunting this weekend has enough confidense in the bow they are shooting to make a clean kill. as with all things in life we should try to be the very best we can be at whatever we try to do. good luck this weekend and i hope all of you guys and gals bring home a pope.


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## T.P. (Sep 8, 2011)

My youngest girl just turned one year old, I've shot while she sat in her stroller since she was just a few months old. I shoot one arrow then push her to the target and pull my arrow then repeat. Her stroller also makes a great bow caddy.

Kids like to go outside too.


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## Jake Allen (Sep 8, 2011)

Taylor Co. said:


> If this thread offended anyone and they felt the need to defend themselves...perhaps they should practice some more. The thread was a part of feelings that a responsible bowhunter felt while observing complacent hunters. I share her disdain.



I don't share anyone's disdain. I see an opportunity to
help someone if I can; with equipment, information or 
even more of an understanding of what we are doing here,
and why.
Maybe to even help them become more motivated to
learn about, and be more dedicated to the sport, both hunting and 3d.


----------



## Jake Allen (Sep 8, 2011)

T.P. said:


> My youngest girl just turned one year old, I've shot while she sat in her stroller since she was just a few months old. I shoot one arrow then push her to the target and pull my arrow then repeat. Her stroller also makes a great bow caddy.
> 
> Kids like to go outside too.





But, you have to practice. What shooting without a sight, or
release, or stabilizer, or let off, or a 1600 plus feet per second arrow.   :


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## Taylor Co. (Sep 8, 2011)

Jake Allen said:


> I don't share anyone's disdain. I see an opportunity to
> help someone if I can; with equipment, information or
> even more of an understanding of what we are doing here,
> and why.
> ...


I am a Level III Instructor and help people all of time. It's hard to help folks that don't want to help themselves. Common sense tells you that you should know your effective range and PRACTICE! It's really not worth discussing. Y'all have a great season.


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## RMelton (Sep 8, 2011)

T.P. said:


> My youngest girl just turned one year old, I've shot while she sat in her stroller since she was just a few months old. I shoot one arrow then push her to the target and pull my arrow then repeat. Her stroller also makes a great bow caddy.
> 
> Kids like to go outside too.



They sure do. But trying to concentrate on proper form while watching a 2 yr old making sure his not running in the street or playing in poison ivy.... is not very productive. Just creates bad habits.


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## Kool Hand Luke (Sep 8, 2011)

Helping somebody would not be not encouraging them to practice.
I love to here the phone ring about
Dark (I need your dog)I hit him perfect but can't find him. Don't practice work has been slow need the money. 





Jake Allen said:


> I don't share anyone's disdain. I see an opportunity to
> help someone if I can; with equipment, information or
> even more of an understanding of what we are doing here,
> and why.
> ...


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## Sixes (Sep 8, 2011)

I guess I should rethink bowhunting this year since my 30 yard groups didn't center punch the tape.


I really thought my shooting was "good enough" to bowhunt, but I guess not according to some.

Oh well, I'll keep killing deer and then,  I'll focus on hitting circles some other time


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## turtlebug (Sep 8, 2011)

Lots of comments on this and everyone has their opinion. Some posts make a good point, some make excuses and a few weren't even relevant to my original comment. (Imagine that)


And FWIW, when I made the statement, what I was envisioning was your firearms only hunter who (seems to be worse this year down here now with the passing of the baiting bill) can't wait for rifle season so they're sitting on the couch thinking about their corn piles and have a revelation.... OOOH! I can hunt with a bow in 7 days if I go buy one and can fling an arrow in the general direction of a deer.

So, within 7 days, they're a "proficient" bowhunter but when they walk out, they've still got 40 questions on how to tune and operate their equipment. 


Saw a guy the other day, his brand new Z7 was shooting a little high, next thing I hear is click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click...... like a danged sewing machine. The result? He shot even higher, way higher. He didn't have a clue on which way to adjust or to take it in small steps. Broadheads shot into a brand new $600 indoor target, what weight broadheads should I be shooting and how do I tune them, do I need to change any settings on my bow to shoot a broadhead and the list goes on and on of questions I heard in just two visits to the shop. 

Are those folks "prepared" to be in the woods with a bow? If they think they are, more power to them and maybe they'll learn and get better and hopefully not get so frustrated that they give it up. 

I've always wanted to hunt with a bow. It took me one and a half years of shooting 3D which I used as a way to become knowledgeable about my equipment and learn as much as I could about weather conditions and what effects arrow flight, proper tuning, compensation, being left eye dominant and switching over to left handed shooting, before I even considered taking my bow into the woods. It's been a hard road and guess what, I still consider myself a newbie and am still soaking up as much as I can and learning every day. I was given a wonderful opportunity to work with an incredible coach who is also a top notch hunter. I've learned from folks that I never even would have dreamed of talking to and for that, I am forever thankful. I am even a Level II archery instructor but I only use that for kids, I don't feel I'm at the level to instruct anyone past the basic knowledge of proper form and safety. 

My true bowhunting passion lies with traditional archery. However, although I'm a pretty good shot on a target, I'm just now considering taking my stick into the woods later on this year. 

I'm not passing judgement or looking down on anyone. What I am doing is sitting in amazement at the "I can do it half-behinded" folks who think bowhunting is easy.

That's all. I've got camo to wash and de-scent cause I got a tree to be in at 5:30 Saturday morning. 

Good luck.


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## alligood729 (Sep 8, 2011)

turtlebug said:


> Lots of comments on this and everyone has their opinion. Some posts make a good point, some make excuses and a few weren't even relevant to my original comment. (Imagine that)
> 
> 
> And FWIW, when I made the statement, what I was envisioning was your firearms only hunter who (seems to be worse this year down here now with the passing of the baiting bill) can't wait for rifle season so they're sitting on the couch thinking about their corn piles and have a revelation.... OOOH! I can hunt with a bow in 7 days if I go buy one and can fling an arrow in the general direction of a deer.
> ...



There you go again, upsetting folk's applecart....... You are right though, some understood what you meant, some didn't, some got their feathers ruffled, some didn't. Your point was well made in this post, if there is misunderstanding now, well.....they's just bein' difficult.

Good luck to you Saturday!!!!!


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## nhancedsvt (Sep 8, 2011)

I reckon I'm good enough


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## T.P. (Sep 8, 2011)

RMelton said:


> They sure do. But trying to concentrate on proper form while watching a 2 yr old making sure his not running in the street or playing in poison ivy.... is not very productive. Just creates bad habits.



Tell 'em to sit down.


----------



## T.P. (Sep 8, 2011)

Jake Allen said:


> But, you have to practice. What shooting without a sight, or
> release, or stabilizer, or let off, or a 1600 plus feet per second arrow.   :



You wouldn't believe how much I have to practice.


----------



## hound dog (Sep 8, 2011)

Hmmm.


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## K80 (Sep 8, 2011)

Taylor Co. said:


> To all of those that don't have time to practice or resources...I'm calling bull..How have you got time to hunt?
> 
> I agree with Alligood, these are the same folks that made a perfect shot on a deer with no blood, and the broadhead ain't no good, and blah, blah, blah.
> 
> Target Panic, yeah, I have had it several times. Work through it. That's what I did. Good Luck to you.


It is going to be tuff and I'm not going to get to hunt nears as much as I'd like BUT some is better than none. For example, for this weekend I told my wife she didn't have an option to work.  Hopefully I'll be able to count on my mom and inlaws to help out.



T.P. said:


> My youngest girl just turned one year old, I've shot while she sat in her stroller since she was just a few months old. I shoot one arrow then push her to the target and pull my arrow then repeat. Her stroller also makes a great bow caddy.
> 
> Kids like to go outside too.



Last year when it was just E I could do that however this year with a 15 and 3 month old on diff sleep, eating, fit pitchin and bm schedules it is not near as easy.


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## K80 (Sep 8, 2011)

I did get to slip outside to shoot for the first time this year.  Here is a pic of  my first group which was at 20 yards, looks good enough.

The first two shots stacked on top of each other, the third I snatched the release a bit and it jerked high to the right, the fourth shot was a typical flyer of mine, and the last shot was the first time shooting my rage practice head that I just opened tonight...

Until I get more time on the range 25 yards or so which just happens to be the longest I've ever had to stretch a shot our to.

Good luck sat.


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## 100hunter (Sep 8, 2011)

The point that Ladybug was trying to make, probably didn't apply to 99 percent of the guys on this forum.  If your avatar is on this site you are most likely a serious archer who has a pretty good idea of what archery is about.  The people she's referring to are most likely not on this site, so don't get offended if you don't have much time to practice, you bought a new bow or you are trying out new broadheads or something.  I do understand what good enough means.  You cant expect a borrowed bow to be tuned as good as your own, but you know after shooting a few times if its good enough to take out on an evening dream hunt.  Don't mean to wish anyone any bad luck, but if this does apply to you then time will tell.  Just be man enough to admit it when someone ask you what happened, and don't fill this forum up with unnecessary excuses.


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## gsp754 (Sep 8, 2011)

I tell you what bothers me......Its people that think the way they do things is the only way it should be done. Or people who get on forums and start threads demonizing anyone who doesnt prepare or get ready the way they do. 
I honestly cant see why anyone would care what or how another person does something as long as it isnt hurting anyone. No matter how last minute someone waits id be willing to bet it wont impact you or your hunt.


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## Taylor Co. (Sep 8, 2011)

100hunter said:


> The point that Ladybug was trying to make, probably didn't apply to 99 percent of the guys on this forum.  If your avatar is on this site you are most likely a serious archer who has a pretty good idea of what archery is about.  The people she's referring to are most likely not on this site, so don't get offended if you don't have much time to practice, you bought a new bow or you are trying out new broadheads or something.  I do understand what good enough means.  You cant expect a borrowed bow to be tuned as good as your own, but you know after shooting a few times if its good enough to take out on an evening dream hunt.  Don't mean to wish
> anyone any bad luck, but if this does apply to you then
> time will tell.  Just be man enough to admit it when
> someone ask you what happened, and don't fill this forum up with unnecessary excuses.


Dang you did it dude! You explained what I was trying to say perfectly. Thanks. Y'all have a great season. I'm out of here for awhile.


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## K80 (Sep 8, 2011)

100hunter said:


> The point that Ladybug was trying to make, probably didn't apply to 99 percent of the guys on this forum.  If your avatar is on this site you are most likely a serious archer who has a pretty good idea of what archery is about.  The people she's referring to are most likely not on this site, so don't get offended if you don't have much time to practice, you bought a new bow or you are trying out new broadheads or something.  I do understand what good enough means.  You cant expect a borrowed bow to be tuned as good as your own, but you know after shooting a few times if its good enough to take out on an evening dream hunt.  Don't mean to wish anyone any bad luck, but if this does apply to you then time will tell.  Just be man enough to admit it when someone ask you what happened, and don't fill this forum up with unnecessary excuses.


I know exactly what T is talking about, I've got some cousins that is what she is talking about.  They very seldom pull out the bow till the week of season, all arrows are diff weights and lengths, they wound deer year after year, they hunt for 10 plus years without killing a deer, and those that do kill deer wound several a year before they get lucky and kill one.  That is the type of this she is talking about.  The only reason I mentioned mine is because I'm of the mind set of most here and feel that my lack of practice even given my years of experince is not really acceptable.  I've yet to wound a deer with a bow but I know tha this year my odds of doing so is  greater than at any other time that I've taken a bow into the woods which is why I'll be waiting on a unspooked close range deer.  My luck the biggest deer I've ever seen will walk by at 45 yards and while I have equipment that is capable of reaching out there I'm not prepared to do so.  I'll be one sick puppy if that happens.


gsp754 said:


> I tell you what bothers me......Its people that think the way they do things is the only way it should be done. Or people who get on forums and start threads demonizing anyone who doesnt prepare or get ready the way they do.
> I honestly cant see why anyone would care what or how another person does something as long as it isnt hurting anyone. No matter how last minute someone waits id be willing to bet it wont impact you or your hunt.



I wouldn't take that bet if I were you.


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## Kendallbearden (Sep 9, 2011)

I can tell you right now, if a deer steps out saturday morning, i am 100 percent sure that i will make a good shot. I won't pull that trigger on the release unless i know i'm dead on. I start shooting right after gun season. I've shot thousands of arrows over the summer. To me, good enough is when i can shoot a gnat off of a fly while they're flying in the air. Until i can do that, i will keep practicing.


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## Bucky T (Sep 9, 2011)

I shoot quite a bit.  I love to shoot period.  It's fun and relaxing.  At the same time it's practicing too.  But I don't look at it as practicing.  I look at it as something enjoyable to do after I get home from work, get the kid fed and off to bed.

There are some veteran hunters out there who may not need to practice every day.  They can probably pull their bow out right before the season, shoot it a few times to make sure everything is okay, climb up in a stand on opening day and zip a deer.  

And yes...  I have seen the guy at the bowshop who's never bowhunted and is there spending a lot of money on a new bow a week before the season opens...


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 9, 2011)

Here is a funny story. SouthGaHunter and I were in a Walmart store, and as you do we could not help but to breeze through the hunting section and look at the junk. There were two rather inbreed looking fellows looking at the arrows. This was the Thursday or Friday before opening day. One of the rather scruffy looking fellows grabbed up about six made in Korea Carbon Ex-something arrows and said to the other semi-toothed fellow, "You rekon these will be some good huntin arras?". To which the other fellow said "I bet thems 'il be some good flyin arras right there." then they started to walk away when ol' semi-tooth says "Wait man, you gone need some practice arras!" So inbred looks down and grabs 3 - 4 of the super cheap Korean made Carbon Ex-something arrows and says "You rekon these'll be aight to practice with?" To which semi-tooth said "Yeah man, thats all you need for practice, you'll prolly lose them any way."
 SouthGaHunter and I almost past out from laughing as they walked away. Then we thought I hope that I never find myself hunting close to those guys. 
eeesh


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## Mcgaughey5 (Sep 9, 2011)

I think you are talking about my dad.  He will shoot his bow the evening before opening day about 10 times and can hit what he calls good enough.  The thing is he has killed more deer with his bow than I will ever kill.  I think the reason for that is that he knows how to get close to the deer.  He will not take a shot over 20yds.  This brings the percentage way up.  A lot can happen past 20yds even if you can hit a bullseye every shot.


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## GASeminole (Sep 9, 2011)

What he said.


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## Scrub Buck (Sep 9, 2011)

The point your trying to make may not have received as much attention if someone else posted it.  Many, many people can shoot a target....However, they could not hit an elephant at two steps.  Paper and live animals are two different demons.  I applaud your concern....sometimes things are hard to swallow, but...your better off leaving your opinion/concern of it in your head.


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## gtgeorge (Sep 10, 2011)

turtlebug said:


> Why oh why does it though?
> 
> Every year, I see folks at the last minute sighting in a bow, trying to get their archery prowess in tact at the  last minute.



Okay TB, I must hang my head in shame now. My good enough, was not really good enough. I started this evening with my first deer with a bow, while she dropped to the ground when the arrow struck, the arrow hit in the middle of the hind quarters. Thankfully it dropped her right there. Then the next two shots at two more missed low. Could have been a threefer but was not to be as I choked.

So I wish to apologize and wish I had more time in with my bow.


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## The Arrow Guru (Sep 11, 2011)

gtgeorge said:


> Okay TB, I must hang my head in shame now. My good enough, was not really good enough. I started this evening with my first deer with a bow, while she dropped to the ground when the arrow struck, the arrow hit in the middle of the hind quarters. Thankfully it dropped her right there. Then the next two shots at two more missed low. Could have been a threefer but was not to be as I choked.
> 
> So I wish to apologize and wish I had more time in with my bow.



There aren't many things more noble than when a man admits when h is wrong. It happens to the best of us but the difference is when we learn from mistakes and correct them. Bravo! I am not very stron.g compared to some other guys I go to the gym with. When I run I have a lot of hip problems from a nasty car accident in 95. However I lift weighs 5 days a week and run with 40lbs in my eberlestock pack. I shoot a lot all year. Prolly more than I need to do but yeasterday when that big nanny goat was standing at 8 yards, can you guess how easy the moment of truth was? She went down in sight.


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## Robert Warnock (Sep 11, 2011)

Good Point, TB.


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## turtlebug (Sep 11, 2011)

Scrub Buck said:


> The point your trying to make may not have received as much attention if someone else posted it.  Many, many people can shoot a target....However, they could not hit an elephant at two steps.  Paper and live animals are two different demons.  I applaud your concern....sometimes things are hard to swallow, but...your better off leaving your opinion/concern of it in your head.



Not gonna keep going at it with ya. You can dig at me til the ends of time, you're not bothering me. Putting you on ignore actually shortens the number of posts I have to weed through. 

Good luck to you this season. 






gtgeorge said:


> Okay TB, I must hang my head in shame now. My good enough, was not really good enough. I started this evening with my first deer with a bow, while she dropped to the ground when the arrow struck, the arrow hit in the middle of the hind quarters. Thankfully it dropped her right there. Then the next two shots at two more missed low. Could have been a threefer but was not to be as I choked.
> 
> So I wish to apologize and wish I had more time in with my bow.




No need to for an apology to me.  Choking is one thing, as one individual wants to keep implying, when I shot the hog in the low spine, it was all ME, not my equipment. My bow was spot-on, it was my nerves that I couldn't control and I allowed the hog to take another step or two and make a bad shot. It happens. I still feel horrible about it but I do know that it wasn't my bow. Then again, I am glad that it happened on a nuisance hog rather than a deer.  Congrats on the score though.    



Not knowing your bow before you go into the woods is not acceptable in my opinion. Animals running around wounded with arrows sticking out of them does nothing but give anti-hunters more ammunition to look down on hunters. At least know that your bow is sighted in and that you can tell the difference between 20 and 45 yards. That's all. I don't understand why that concept bothers so many folks.  


Then again, after waking up to the tragedy that took place in my neighborhood and knowing a 12 year old's life will be impacted forever and trying to console my neighbor in the middle of the street, a sighted in bow or being in a tree today is the least of my worries. 

Yall hug the ones you love and be thankful you wake up to see them every day.


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## Scrub Buck (Sep 13, 2011)

Sometimes the truth hurts?  It's easy to ignore, yet hard to except reality.  Shooting a target is one thing?  Shooting an animal is another.  Some can do one good, some can do the other good, some can do both.  I know where I fit and don't pass judgement on others especially in a bow shop where everyone thinks they know what is best for others.


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## wcg2 (Sep 13, 2011)

I take you have never coached county recretion youth sports or you would be in a mental ward by now ...what with the parents showing up on the day of tryouts(or first game) with a new glove(or maybe no glove) thats so hard that the kid can't get it to close, cleats(or maybe tennis shoes) , no helmet, doesnt know home plate from first base and say little Suzie or Lil Johnny is ready to play some ball. Good Luck to you this year and may all your shots hit bullseye !


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## Skyjacker (Sep 13, 2011)

The bottom line is everyone has their own opinions about right and wrong.  You can practice all you want to and you can practice as long as you NEED to.  What you NEED is different from what someone else needs.  

I agree with the guy above who said that his Dad takes 10 shots the day before bow season and still has killed more deer than all of us.  Probably true.  He's also smart in that he puts the scouting and the thought into the actual deer hunting which allows him shots at less than 20 yards.  That increases his success.  Not practicing 7 days a week trying to ensure that they can make a 35 yard shot.  

I rather put more time in scouting to get close to a deer to ensure that I take shots at under 25 yards.  I personally don't think anyone should take a shot at a Southeastern Whitetail with a bow at over 35 yards.  Anyone who thinks they control that situation with perfect placement is a fool.  So if you want to practice 7 days a week to make sure you are good at 40 yards.  Good for you.  

You see people on this forum that can shoot a target at 40-50-60 yards.  Good for them. Those shots work on big slow game like Elk and Moose.  40-45 yards would be max for a big midwestern whitetail.  30 yards would be max for an eastern whitetail. They're just a higher strung animal with the ability to jump a shot taken with todays bows over 30 yards.  

If you're practicing for that situation you are as irresponsible as the guy who takes 5 shots the day before bow season.


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## Derek Snider (Sep 14, 2011)

Well I guess I'm guilty as charged. Coaching, work, and a six month old baby have cut into my practice time considerably this year compared to other years. That said, based on years of experience and muscle memory I would still feel ethical and fully confident that I was gonna make a kill shot shooting at a deer 30 yards out or less. Most people don't practice from a tree or with the clothes on that they will hunt in, ie. gloves, face mask, jacket, etc, and I suppose that some assume their point of impact won't change when put in hunting conditions compared to practicing so diligently in the backyard standing on the the ground with shorts and a t-shirt on....I do what works for me based on my years of experience.


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## alligood729 (Sep 14, 2011)

Skyjacker said:


> The bottom line is everyone has their own opinions about right and wrong.  You can practice all you want to and you can practice as long as you NEED to.  What you NEED is different from what someone else needs.
> 
> I agree with the guy above who said that his Dad takes 10 shots the day before bow season and still has killed more deer than all of us.  Probably true.  He's also smart in that he puts the scouting and the thought into the actual deer hunting which allows him shots at less than 20 yards.  That increases his success.  Not practicing 7 days a week trying to ensure that they can make a 35 yard shot.
> 
> ...



That last statement is your opinion and you are most certainly entitled to it, but it's just that, YOUR opinion. I'd rather keep my shots to 30 and less too, but we all know that just ain't the case sometimes. I practice to 50-60 yds just so that the 40-45 yd shot that MAY present itself, is just as familiar as the 20 yd shot. Takes some cojones to come on here and call some of us a fool and irresponsible just because we take the time to get to know our equipment better than others, or not necessarily that, but that the practice we put in is for a reason, not just to say that we can make a long shot. You shoot your way, I'll shoot mine.....I haven't spent the last 32 yrs studying and killin'em for nothing.....and if you think that 30 yds and out is the magic # for a whitetail to jump the string, you are wrong again.....

And Tbug, it's obvious that your point is still being missed......


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## T.P. (Sep 14, 2011)

Her point is not missed by all, only by some.


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## alligood729 (Sep 14, 2011)

T.P. said:


> Her point is not missed by all, only by some.


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## pasinthrough (Sep 14, 2011)

alligood729 said:


> ...and if you think that 30 yds and out is the magic # for a whitetail to jump the string, you are wrong again.....


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## alligood729 (Sep 14, 2011)

pasinthrough said:


>



The speed of sound is 1126fps......I don't even think my Evo can match that....last time I checked it was a foot or two short and that was only 61lbs with a 785gr arrow....


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## pasinthrough (Sep 14, 2011)

Yep, back in 88 I had one duck under a Browning wood riser bow shooting all of 180 fps at 14 yards.  I know it can be done, and at much less distance than 30yds.

In recent years, I've hunted places where a rifle hasn't been fired at them in over 20 years and when the conditions are right, you can smoke one at distances way over 30.  Ask me how I know...


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## kg4ghn (Sep 14, 2011)

Derek Snider said:


> Well I guess I'm guilty as charged. Coaching, work, and a six month old baby have cut into my practice time considerably this year compared to other years. That said, based on years of experience and muscle memory I would still feel ethical and fully confident that I was gonna make a kill shot shooting at a deer 30 yards out or less. Most people don't practice from a tree or with the clothes on that they will hunt in, ie. gloves, face mask, jacket, etc, and I suppose that some assume their point of impact won't change when put in hunting conditions compared to practicing so diligently in the backyard standing on the the ground with shorts and a t-shirt on....I do what works for me *based on my years of experience*.



TB is not talking about you.  She is talking about people who DON'T have years of experience that just buy a bow and some arrows and assume they are capable of hunting with a bow.

This is my first year bowhunting.  I bought my bow last spring and have shot and practiced as much as I could find time for.  I feel comfortable now taking a shot on a deer at 30 yards or less.  The first week or two I shot I absolutely was not ready for that.


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## Skyjacker (Sep 14, 2011)

alligood729 said:


> That last statement is your opinion and you are most certainly entitled to it, but it's just that, YOUR opinion. I'd rather keep my shots to 30 and less too, but we all know that just ain't the case sometimes. I practice to 50-60 yds just so that the 40-45 yd shot that MAY present itself, is just as familiar as the 20 yd shot. Takes some cojones to come on here and call some of us a fool and irresponsible just because we take the time to get to know our equipment better than others, or not necessarily that, but that the practice we put in is for a reason, not just to say that we can make a long shot. You shoot your way, I'll shoot mine.....I haven't spent the last 32 yrs studying and killin'em for nothing.....and if you think that 30 yds and out is the magic # for a whitetail to jump the string, you are wrong again.....
> 
> And Tbug, it's obvious that your point is still being missed......



I think you're taking me too literally.  I was just making a point with the OP that everyone views being a responsible hunter in differetn fashions.  I really don't care what others choose to do.  I was just making a point as to my own criteria.  

As for shots over 35 yards.  Its been a hot subject that even if you have perfect aim and arrow flight,  At 300 fps an eastern whitetail deer can still react within that time that can make your shot miss or not hit the intended target.  Chuck Adams did an interesting article on this years ago.  I'll have to find it.  He separated whitetails by region as to what is considered a good distance to take a shot.  Midwestern Whitetails and Canada bucks were out to 50-60 because they're not very reactive.  But he also classified southeastern whitetails as being extremely highstrung animals and spoke specifically about distances being greatly reduced because of their ability to react to a bow.  But like I said, that's just my criteria.  No offense intended.


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## pstrahin (Sep 14, 2011)

We owe it to ourselves, other hunters and the animals that we hunt to be as good as we can be when we go into the woods.  If you hunt long enough you will make a bad shot.  You might even wound an animal and not be able to find it.  It is obvious that we all are not going to agree on what is "Good Enough".  There have been a lot of great opinions posted in this thread, lets just agree to disagree and go on have a great hunting season.  I hope yall get a good un.


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## spinefish (Aug 29, 2012)

Yeah. Maybe. I don't know.


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## stick_slinger (Aug 29, 2012)

turtlebug said:


> Isn't being able to at least hit a "bullseye" a good start before you start running through the woods shooting at live targets?
> 
> 
> Everybody misses, except bowanna maybe  but when you can't even get near zero, why wouldn't you at least TRY a little harder?
> ...




Nope, Lee misses too.. He has a video up where he missed, luckily he got a second shot at it right under his stand.. Misses happen, you just have to do everything you can to make sure you aint makin it a habit.

CJ


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## Cab (Aug 29, 2012)

If you start putting requirements on "Good enough" then you would have to draw a line SOMEWHERE. You drew it at "... at least hitting a bullseye, once...". The problem with that is...if everyone agreed with you then there would then be a test for weapons like there is for cars. Don't pass the test, don't get your license! How many driving violations have you made and still held onto your license?


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## riskyb (Aug 29, 2012)

I'm with you guys and gals I spend a lot of time picking and tweeking till mine is as perfect as can be


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## HuntinDawg89 (Aug 29, 2012)

DouglasB. said:


> I live in the middle of the city on the third floor of one of the largest apartment complexes in my city. The closest bow shop with a range is 70 miles away, and you couldn't PAY me to step foot in that shop.



If you live in Peachtree City like your profile says, the closest archery shop with a range is a WHOLE LOT closer than 70 miles away.

I don't know whether you need more practice or not, but that is a weak excuse assuming you live in P'tree City.  Even if you lived in downtown Atlanta you wouldn't be 70 miles from the closest archery range...

EDIT:  Dang, I got suckered in to posting on an OLD thread


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## Tank1202 (Aug 30, 2012)

HuntinDawg89 said:


> If you live in Peachtree City like your profile says, the closest archery shop with a range is a WHOLE LOT closer than 70 miles away.
> 
> I don't know whether you need more practice or not, but that is a weak excuse assuming you live in P'tree City.  Even if you lived in downtown Atlanta you wouldn't be 70 miles from the closest archery range...
> 
> EDIT:  Dang, I got suckered in to posting on an OLD thread



Yes you did, but it still was a good point you made....


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## dixiecutter (Aug 31, 2012)

hey a perfect shooter who's upset with the not perfect shooters. please dont knock me over the head. maybe there's a "im a perfect shooter" forum out there on the www


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## alligood729 (Aug 31, 2012)

dixiecutter said:


> hey a perfect shooter who's upset with the not perfect shooters. please dont knock me over the head. maybe there's a "im a perfect shooter" forum out there on the www



I know this thread is a year old, but you are way off on your perspective of the original poster's meaning, as are a lot of the responses....read the whole thing.....


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## 3darcher (Aug 31, 2012)

Please tell me this thread hasn't come back to life......


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## TrailBlazer999 (Sep 1, 2012)

BIGRNYRS said:


> Just a suggestion, if you can. Set up a block xbow target in th living room or kitchen. It may only be 7 - 10 yards. Execute your form 10 arrows a night and every morning. That's 20 arrows a day, 140 a weel. Form makes accuracy.



Oh wow. I don't even want to THINK about my wife's reaction. One arrow through the living room during wrestling and I'll be moving to your place for awhile. 

Still, might be fun to make the suggestion and watch her face.


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## Nastytater (Sep 1, 2012)

I know exactly what you mean. I've got a buddy of mine that doesn't even bother to pull his 20+ year old Pearson Bow out to practice with it until 2 weeks before the season opens. When he pulled it out this year,he found it was shooting 1 foot to the right. He asked me,reakon thats good enough?...I almost smacked him. He then attempeted setting his pin sights and was setting them all wrong,so I basically took the bow out of his hands and set it up for him.  I also watched his form and gave him a few pointers and now he's hitting center mass almost every shot. He asked me how I knew so much about shooting a Bow,and i told him it's all about passion and what your actually trying to achieve with that passion. 

When i started Bow hunting,I had nobody around that has ever hunted with a Bow to teach me. So I studied long and hard,on every site,every video and everyone that I could to pick up tips and tricks along my 26 year journey. My cousin is just getting into hunting this year and he's starting off with a new Bow. He just don't realize how fortunite he is to have me as a guide to help him out. We are both Passionate about this season. 1 Week left.


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## Mako22 (Sep 1, 2012)

I close my eyes when I shot my bow and I always hit something.


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## BreamReaper (Sep 1, 2012)

BIGRNYRS said:


> There aren't many things more noble than when a man admits when h is wrong. It happens to the best of us but the difference is when we learn from mistakes and correct them. Bravo! I am not very stron.g compared to some other guys I go to the gym with. When I run I have a lot of hip problems from a nasty car accident in 95. However I lift weighs 5 days a week and run with 40lbs in my eberlestock pack. I shoot a lot all year. Prolly more than I need to do but yeasterday when that big nanny goat was standing at 8 yards, can you guess how easy the moment of truth was? She went down in sight.



 Switching topic to-pics of said nanny goat!


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