# Quail on WMAs



## Take'em Down (Feb 13, 2009)

Has anyone had any luck finding quail on the WMAs this year?  I went once, didn't have a dog and of course didn't scare up any quail.  Just wondering if anyone had killed or even seen any?


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## BirdNut (Feb 13, 2009)

I have seen a few...but less than in previous years...I am also hunting less on WMA now in the past 3 years, plus one of my dogs is laid up on injured reserve since early January


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## Jim P (Feb 13, 2009)

Found a few covies on a couple of WMA'S down here in the south, but only hunted them a few times.


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## Beagle Stace (Feb 13, 2009)

*WMA Quail?*

Finding a few but really pounding the ground for them on several WMA's   Definitely not in it to just shoot birds.


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## Model 11 (Feb 13, 2009)

Been to 2 WMAs and the Oconee National Forest and havent seen quail in years. Theres none on the Oconee National Forest, none on Redlands, and very few on Cedar Creek (only on the Plum Creek Land). I for one am hoping that WMA Biologists and the Federal Biologist over the National Forests declare the Bob White Quail in N GA , "endangered" and treat quail like they do the  Red Cockaded WoodPecker and designate the whole forest management plan around the quail. Because thats what they have done with the RCW on Redlands, Cedar Creek, and the Oconee National Forest. For years now the USFS has refused to cut pines down b/c of the RCW along with the lawsuits of environmental wackos that I have yet to see plying around the forest "birding". Thus hundreds if not thousands of acres of mature pine trees that are to big to be handled by saw mills any more,  all designed to enhance the habitat of the RCW. And with OBAMA in now, it will only get worse!!!!!!


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 14, 2009)

Model 11 said:


> Been to 2 WMAs and the Oconee National Forest and havent seen quail in years. Theres none on the Oconee National Forest, none on Redlands, and very few on Cedar Creek (only on the Plum Creek Land). I for one am hoping that WMA Biologists and the Federal Biologist over the National Forests declare the Bob White Quail in N GA , "endangered" and treat quail like they do the  Red Cockaded WoodPecker and designate the whole forest management plan around the quail. Because thats what they have done with the RCW on Redlands, Cedar Creek, and the Oconee National Forest. For years now the USFS has refused to cut pines down b/c of the RCW along with the lawsuits of environmental wackos that I have yet to see plying around the forest "birding". Thus hundreds if not thousands of acres of mature pine trees that are to big to be handled by saw mills any more,  all designed to enhance the habitat of the RCW. And with OBAMA in now, it will only get worse!!!!!!



Actually, land manage for the RCW is better for quail. The woods can't be too dense. If they are, you aren't going to find any woodpeckers. BUT, small scale clear cuts and small fields in the woods provide the best habitat for quail and neither will be found in the woods managed for RCW.


Here is a stand of Longleaf Pine at the Conecuh NF in S. AL that's managed for RCW. 












Adam


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## redneck_billcollector (Feb 14, 2009)

I agree with coveyrise, management for RCW requires open woods, there is a trend now to start summer burns on those lands to keep the hardwood understory gone, which is good for legumes.  At Ft. Stewart where they manage for those the quail population is making a strong come back.


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## Luke0927 (Feb 14, 2009)

found one nice covey in January...as long as i don't get stuck with some work in the morning im going down again.....when the birds flushed they split in 2 smaller coveys  and were lit in tree's....so they must be smart and probably the only birds around and thats probably why.....


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## Jim P (Feb 14, 2009)

Coveyrise, them are some nice looking places, that kind of land helps all small game, there are some places like that by me, but the owners won't let you set foot on the land.


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## BirdNut (Feb 17, 2009)

Beautiful pics Coveyrise


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 17, 2009)

It was beautiful place. Hope to get down there again next week. Here are a couple more photos from that hunt.


Longleaf Pine clear-cut (almost anyway)





Point. My britt, Rusty, in foreground with Val the pointer in background.





Val on point.





Val's first retrieve to hand.





Pointing a live bird while retrieving a dead one.





Philip's GSP... can't remember his name.





Philip's oldest dog, Sugar.





The fruits of our labor.


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## redneck_billcollector (Feb 17, 2009)

Great pics, I reckon I am gonna have to get some 'bama licsense and go check that place out.


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## Rebel's Dad (Feb 17, 2009)

Coveyrise--those are some terrific pictures--looks like a great day!


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## Luke0927 (Feb 17, 2009)

Nice pics!

I found a covey of about 15 birds on Sunday and 2 singles on public land....Didn't even fire a shot......


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 17, 2009)

Thanks everyone! The place is beautiful and pretty large... 83,000 acres. Most hunt from the road so we got off it and hunted on foot. We hit the wildlife openings which had been planted in a variety of plants (food and brood cover) by the Quail Forever chapter. We also hit the big pine woods and clear cuts. Found 2 coveys, one single, and one woodcock seen in the last picture. Success usually varies between 0-3 coveys but I have heard of 5 and 6 covey days.... pretty rare I'm sure.

I'll call up Philip and see how things have been going this year. 

Till then.

Adam


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## Model 11 (Feb 17, 2009)

coveyrise90 said:


> Actually, land manage for the RCW is better for quail. The woods can't be too dense. If they are, you aren't going to find any woodpeckers. BUT, small scale clear cuts and small fields in the woods provide the best habitat for quail and neither will be found in the woods managed for RCW.
> 
> 
> Here is a stand of Longleaf Pine at the Conecuh NF in S. AL that's managed for RCW.
> ...



Problem is up here on the Oconee, Redlands, and Cedar Creek the land doesnt look anything like that. At least nothing that amounts to much acreage....We have vast tracts of pinetrees, big pine trees along with dense packs of smaller pines that never get thinned. Theres nothing in there. Pine straw doesnt feed anything. Acres and acres of pine straw farm habitat. A few rabbits, no quail.....and deer on the edges. 
The Feds have really neglected forest management up here due to the RCW and the lawsuites logging or thinning brings from the environmental groups. 
The closest we have to any clear cutting is that in the last 2 years the Forest Service has done pine beetle salvage operations. Other than that, business as usual, alot of nothing and prescribed burns every 5 years.


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 17, 2009)

Model 11 said:


> The Feds have really neglected forest management up here due to the RCW and the lawsuites logging or thinning brings from the environmental groups.



Just goes to show how little these environmental groups know. Thinning out the younger trees, opening the canopy, and allowing sunlight to reach the forest-floor is necessary for quality RCW habitat. BUT, the forest service manages much of the timber by harvesting the older trees and then allowing the younger age class to grow. When the younger class matures, they cut it and allow the next age group to move up. This way, you always have trees. The forest is self sustaining. You never have to clearcut unless you get greedy. However, unless you leave some of the older trees, you take way the woodpecker habitat. I remember Philip did say something about the treehuggers trying to stop logging at Conecuh but they have unsuccessful. They do clear-cut sometimes which I don't like.... at least on a large scale. I think they'd be better off giving it a heavy thinning and then sporadically (and sparingly) plant longleaf. Or allow it to grow naturally. 






This way, you still have the appearance of woods (or pine savanna) but you get most of the timber. But with this you cut the oldest trees, thereby taking the RCW habitat away.... so what. Screw the woodpecker and the treehuggers! The quail are more important!  

Adam


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 17, 2009)

Most public land here is on a 3-year burn rotation. The "quail emphasis" areas are usually on a 2 year rotation. 

If they would change their burning regime, I believe the quail populations would increase.

Their fires are too hot, intense, and large-scale (sometimes covering over 1000-2000 acres) for quail. They need to break up the burning blocks to a few hundred acres or less and burn more often.

Adam


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## Model 11 (Feb 19, 2009)

coveyrise90 said:


> Most public land here is on a 3-year burn rotation. The "quail emphasis" areas are usually on a 2 year rotation.
> 
> If they would change their burning regime, I believe the quail populations would increase.
> 
> ...


They (the forest service; state and federal?) torch the woods up here really badDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!  Quail are nonexistent so we started hunting rabbits. They will take a block of land that has large pine trees on it with an understory starting to grow (thus rabbits start moving in) and will just flat out burn the heck out of it setting it back several years. My complaint is that they do nothing......there are a few areas on the south part of the Oconee that they have managed for RCW and they do look like a pine savannah but for the most part they do NOTHING! and let it all grow. Very little timber management......... by a  stroke of good fortune the Pine Beetle started munching away which forced them (the USFS)  to cut 1500 acres of mini clear cuts over the last 2 years. Frankly I wish they'd buzz the whole place and thin it really good for RCW which as a by-product would be good for deer, rabbits and maybe we'd see some quail up here! Instead they use it as an excuse to do.....


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## mecicon (Feb 19, 2009)

coveyrise90 said:


> Most public land here is on a 3-year burn rotation. The "quail emphasis" areas are usually on a 2 year rotation.
> 
> If they would change their burning regime, I believe the quail populations would increase.
> 
> ...



Great pics. And you are right about the size of the burn plots.


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 20, 2009)

Model 11 said:


> They (the forest service; state and federal?) torch the woods up here really badDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!



"They" in this case is the U.S. Forest Service. But much of the public land that consist of the open pinewoods, whether it be state or federal, is managed the same way or at least close. And they know how to make a fire hot. I have seen mature pines burnt at the crown from the fires getting so large and hot.

Adam


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## redneck_billcollector (Feb 20, 2009)

I have found birds on Chickasawhatchee, Doerun and Elmodale wmas this year, and hoping to find some both saturday and sunday.  Doerun is predominately longleaf pine/wiregrass and has a stray covey or two. Ok, tried to load some pics of doerun and I aint got the slightest idea of how to.

Thought I figured out how to load a pic, got something from the forum administrator says a need a security token, whatever that is.


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## Luke0927 (Feb 21, 2009)

redneck_billcollector said:


> I have found birds on Chickasawhatchee, Doerun and Elmodale wmas this year, and hoping to find some both saturday and sunday.  Doerun is predominately longleaf pine/wiregrass and has a stray covey or two. Ok, tried to load some pics of doerun and I aint got the slightest idea of how to.
> 
> Thought I figured out how to load a pic, got something from the forum administrator says a need a security token, whatever that is.



easiest way is to go open you a  photobucket account and upload your pics then just post IMG  link right in the thread and it will show up


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## Jim P (Feb 21, 2009)

Them are some good looking dogs, but one really stands out, I love the britt.


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## redneck_billcollector (Feb 21, 2009)

Has anyone hunted Pine Log wma in the florida panhandle?  Looks like it might hold a covey or two.


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## BirdNut (Feb 21, 2009)

We ought to all plan some trips next year...I have 3 pointers, 2 of which are decent and the one will be healed up by then.  Apalachee WMA in FL is supposed to be good.  With 5-6 dogs we could keep fresh dogs out at all times and cover some ground.


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## redneck_billcollector (Feb 21, 2009)

I am game on us doing a hunt down there, I have been thinking bout hunting down there, along with Pine Log between Ebro (which I like, I play poker) and Panama City Beach.  Back in the late 70's and early 80's I found a couple of coveys where Carrillion Beach is now, and used to get quiet a few red heads and blue bill in Lake Powell along with teal and black ducks in all the lil ponds that were around there.  Course it is all condos, asphalt and yankees now, and ya cant hunt there anymore, I miss the old redneck riviara all ya heard was country and southern rock and everyone had dog boxs in the back of their trucks.  Now it is all rap with strange looking little cars with wheels that still spin when the car aint moving. If ya can't tell, I aint one for too much change, my significant other has the gall to call me a dinosaur, but I aint, I am just an old Georgia/Florida cracker (spent bout half my life in wakula county fla.  had alot of kinfolk there at one time).


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## Luke0927 (Feb 21, 2009)

BirdNut said:


> We ought to all plan some trips next year...I have 3 pointers, 2 of which are decent and the one will be healed up by then.  Apalachee WMA in FL is supposed to be good.  With 5-6 dogs we could keep fresh dogs out at all times and cover some ground.




Im up for it......


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 22, 2009)

Jim P said:


> Them are some good looking dogs, but one really stands out, I love the britt.



Yeah. Something special about those lil hamsters! 

Adan


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 22, 2009)

BirdNut said:


> We ought to all plan some trips next year...I have 3 pointers, 2 of which are decent and the one will be healed up by then.  Apalachee WMA in FL is supposed to be good.  With 5-6 dogs we could keep fresh dogs out at all times and cover some ground.



Hunted there 3 weeks ago. We hunted 4 hours.... 1 find. Birds flushed wild and we didn't get a shot. They run like crazy there late season. My dad and I are going to try it again next season but in the beginning before the birds smarten up too much. 

I talked with several others there and this is how they did:

-One group found 2 coveys and killed 3 birds (they were hunting from horseback). They hunted about 2 1/2 hrs.
-One man found 1 covey and killed 2 birds. Hunted about 3 hrs.
-One group found no coveys but 3 singles. They killed no birds. Hunted about 4 hrs.
-Another group found no birds. Not sure how long they hunted.
-One man and his wife found one covey, killed one bird. Hunted about 3 hrs.

All of the coveys still had 10-15 birds.



Weather started in the upper 30's but warm to 62. Had a 5-10 mph wind.

Great habitat. The best on ANY public land in the South that I am aware of. Most of the place is covered in Longleaf Pine woods, pine/oak mix woods, wiregrass and broomsedge understory, small ponds and swamps everywhere (and gators!), and small fields scattered about. 

There were a lot of birds but they were SMART! We located at least 3 or 4 more coveys but they ran like crazy and we couldn't get them pinned. I had never hunted birds that were this smart... and neither had Rusty. It was the end of the season and the birds had seen plenty of hunters and they knew how to evade them. That's the biggest problem with Apalachee... it gets hammered by hunters! There normally aren't that many folks there but this was the closing weekend and there 21 hunters in there. It was hard to find a field or patch of woods that didn't have hunters in it.


Adam


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 22, 2009)

redneck_billcollector said:


> I am game on us doing a hunt down there, I have been thinking bout hunting down there, along with Pine Log between Ebro (which I like, I play poker) and Panama City Beach.  Back in the late 70's and early 80's I found a couple of coveys where Carrillion Beach is now, and used to get quiet a few red heads and blue bill in Lake Powell along with teal and black ducks in all the lil ponds that were around there.  Course it is all condos, asphalt and yankees now, and ya cant hunt there anymore, I miss the old redneck riviara all ya heard was country and southern rock and everyone had dog boxs in the back of their trucks.  Now it is all rap with strange looking little cars with wheels that still spin when the car aint moving. If ya can't tell, I aint one for too much change, my significant other has the gall to call me a dinosaur, but I aint, I am just an old Georgia/Florida cracker (spent bout half my life in wakula county fla.  had alot of kinfolk there at one time).



I am too young but from what I hear, N. FL aint what it used to be. Too bad. 

I have driven past Pine Log. I didn't look particularly special. I'm sure it holds a few coveys though. If it were me though, I would hit Apalachee WMA, Blackwater WMA , Apalachicola National Forest, or Eglin Air Force Base first. I have heard better things from them than Pine Log. 

That's one good thing about FL. There is so much public land!

Adam


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 22, 2009)

Luke0927 said:


> Im up for it......



Me too!

Adam


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## coveyrise90 (Feb 22, 2009)

By the way, I took pics of Apalachee WMA. I'll post some later.

Adam


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## mecicon (Feb 22, 2009)

BirdNut said:


> We ought to all plan some trips next year...I have 3 pointers, 2 of which are decent and the one will be healed up by then.  Apalachee WMA in FL is supposed to be good.  With 5-6 dogs we could keep fresh dogs out at all times and cover some ground.



I am all in, with at least one good dog maybe the second will be up to snuff by then.


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## Jim P (Feb 22, 2009)

Count me and my old Britt in.


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## redneck_billcollector (Feb 22, 2009)

What an interesting change, Georgians going to florida to hunt.  Might prove interesting.  Well, I am in, gonna start looking for snake boots...and muzzel cover for my puppy especially if we go early in the year 'fore all them birds get educated.


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## Jim P (Feb 22, 2009)

Us Georgians will go any place for a chance at a bird.


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