# Religion



## JOEBIALEK (May 1, 2005)

With the passing of Pope John Paul ll, perhaps some reflection on religious beliefs is appropriate.   Religion is defined as a set of beliefs concerned with explaining the origins and purposes of the universe, usually involving belief in a supernatural creator and offering guidance in ethics and morals.  It also consists of any of several institutions with their own beliefs, rituals, and teachings.  Throughout history and even still today, most religions claim to be the one true religion and all others are considered either phony imitations or some sort of heretical sacrilege.   It is a sad reality that most people do not recognize the benefit of what can be learned from other religions along the way of their spiritual journey.   If one studies the major religions of today such as Christianity, Buddhism, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism etcetera they will find more similarities than differences.   They are guides for how to live and grow spiritually.  Some would argue that religion has been one of the biggest causes of humanity's problems but others counter that it is the misinterpretation of religious tenets that causes strife.  Still further, many people see religion as a form of control over the masses whereas others see it as a necessary shield against evil influences.

I had the opportunity to read a book recently concerning near death experiences {NDE}.  The book was a compilation of individual testimonies by those who left their bodies temporarily and returned to tell about their experience.  The author characterized their stories and then pointed out the large similarities and small differences in each of the NDE's.  Two personal friends of mine have had an NDE and shared their experience with me.  I've also communicated with a deceased friend by way of a psychic medium.   All three sources agreed that upon death of the body, we travel through a tunnel toward a bright, warm and loving light.  Upon entering the light, we are given a life review.   During the life review, we re-experience all the thoughts, words and actions that came from us.   Anything negative is re-experienced as though we are the person on the receiving end of our negativity.  For example, one of the contributors to the book re-experienced the event where he had severely beaten another man although this time, he felt the blows he had administered.   The whole premise for experiencing the light appears to be an opportunity to examine what we have learned along our spiritual journey.   In conclusion, it appears that Moses, Jesus, Mohammed, Confucius, and Buddha were all very wise men who made a significant impact on humanity teaching spirituality as it applied to a specific civilization.   Perhaps if humanity could somehow integrate all these religious belief systems toward the goal of one spirituality with God, we could finally begin to see the emergence of world peace.


----------



## Lead Poison (May 1, 2005)

There is only one true God and because of this fact this could never happen. The bible tells us no man can serve two masters. It would have as much chance of working as a one world government and we all know that would never work.

There is only one God, and that God sent his only son (Jesus) to die on a cross of the salvation of the world. He would not have done that if there had been any other way for sinners to receive salvation.

Sorry, one God, one way to salvation, only one true religion.


----------



## AAADawg (May 1, 2005)

Lead Poison said:
			
		

> There is only one true God and because of this fact this could never happen. The bible tells us no man can serve two masters. It would have as much chance of working as a one world government and we all know that would never work.
> 
> There is only one God, and that God sent his only son (Jesus) to die on a cross of the salvation of the world. He would not have done that if there had been any other way for sinners to receive salvation.
> 
> Sorry, one God, one way to salvation, only one true religion.




If there is only one God why does the first of the ten commandments say:

"1. I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt have no other gods before me."


Evidently God knew there were other Gods.....the bible is lousy with references to multiple Gods...some of them went to earth and slept with human women. It is a relatively knew phenomenom for humans to be monotheistic....up until just a few hundred years ago mankind worshipped many Gods...even the catholic church recognized more than one god i its beginnings....almos all other cultures on earth beside the western accepts that there are many gods...even the western version of the christian bible mentions polytheism on many occasions but somehow the western religions have decided that there is only one God and it is the one they worship.....


----------



## Lead Poison (May 1, 2005)

AAADawg, you're missing the point again. Note I said there is only one "true" God.

Yes, others have claimed to be, but the fact is there is only ONE.

Believe it or not BTW, this is the basis for salvation and that's not according to me, but God.


----------



## matthewsman (May 1, 2005)

*Aaa*



			
				AAADawg said:
			
		

> If there is only one God why does the first of the ten commandments say:
> 
> "1. I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt have no other gods before me."
> 
> ...




Due to generally disagreeing with you on so many points I'd get bored typing the responses,I've decided that inspite of your religious views,or lack thereof,I would post a response to your reply so that it does not go unanswered leaving a casual observer to believe no one cares...

The Bible is also "lousy "with references that the Lord our God is one,is a jealous God,is a The true God,the living God,The God of wrath,and the God of love depending on the circumstance.for you,a non-believer,and psuedo-intellect try to use a book about a diety you don't believe in as a reference to prove the lack of Him is ineffectual, insulting, and hopefully even you will realize the ignorance in that.......It would be like attempting to prove the lack of a bumper to bumper unlimited warranty by using a warranty book that simply states 3yr 36000unlimited warranty.

You answer your own question...Mankind worshipped,and still does,many different gods.......You know we refer to the Living God,not Thor,the sun or redheaded woodpecker god........

Believe in him or not AAA ,he sent his son to live and die for you too......If there is a god???There is a God,evidence of him is all around you,and it is appointed to man,every man ,to die.....Near death expieriences may be a psychological phenomonon,or a peek at the afterlife.....Your after death expierience is what should concern all of us....I refuse to waste my time in a futile attempt over the internet in a public forum arguing with you over a God or lack of one,or a whole flock of them.....Instead,I and others will pray that something happens in your life and searches to ignite the smallest flicker of hope,that there is something better in your afterlife than worms and darkness and faded memories of an abrasive identity..........with all the love of a God you don't believe in,donnie


----------



## jason308 (May 1, 2005)

AAADawg, The Ten Commandments does not refer to the acceptance of many gods, but that anything we put before the ONE true GOD can become a god to us. The Lord had provided for the Israelites and had been their substinence, yet they chose to put other gods before Him. The Bible is in no way lousy, and as Matthewsman said we will pray that you find understanding and come to know the one true God. His love for you and me and all of us is in no way conditional, it is His will that no one should perish, thus He sent His Son Jesus to take our place (John 3:16) on the cross so that we can have everlasting life through Him.


----------



## Howard Roark (May 1, 2005)

I am going to move this thread to the spirital thread a little later and leave a redirect on this page.  It seems it will fit better there.



			
				AAADawg said:
			
		

> If there is only one God why does the first of the ten commandments say:
> 
> "1. I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt have no other gods before me."



Little g.  Anything can be a god which is equivalent to an idol.


----------



## Howard Roark (May 1, 2005)

AAADawg said:
			
		

> the bible is lousy with references to multiple Gods...some of them went to earth and slept with human women.



You are mixing the Bible and mythology.


----------



## AAADawg (May 1, 2005)

>"Due to generally disagreeing with you on so many points I'd get bored >typing the responses,I've decided that inspite of your religious views,or lack >thereof,I would post a response to your reply so that it does not go >unanswered leaving a casual observer to believe no one cares..."

There wasnt any chance on earth that this thread was not going to be responded to....as a matter of fact it had already gotten a response before yours....

>"for you,a non-believer,and psuedo-intellect try to use a book about a diety >you don't believe in as a reference to prove the lack of Him is ineffectual, >insulting, and hopefully even you will realize the ignorance in that"

When have I ever tried to prove that there isn't one god or many gods? I have said exactly the opposite of that ....I have said I have no proof that there is a God nor any proof that there isn't...I would never try to convince anyone one way or the other and to suggest that I have is, as you say, inneffectual and insulting. I have never said there was no God....I have asked if there is only one God why does the bible, a book that I am completely capable of reading and understanding (and, by the way, have done so from cover to cover) continually mentions multiple Gods and then pointed out that we havent been a montheistic culture for very long in the over all scheme of things....

I have a question...why did you find it necessary to refer to me as a "Pseudo intellectual"??? I no intellectual of any stripe be it a real one or a make beleive one...I have opinions and I am curious about things and so I ask questions and make points...I dont do so trying to convinice anyone I am right and they are wrong...And I also try not to do so in a manner that insults anyone are cause anyone to resort to name calling. I personally find that I learn a lot from reading these messages and responding to them. I would never presume to claim that anyone's beleifs were wrong....but it is very interesting to me how much difference there is in the bible and what most christians think is in the bible.....


----------



## AAADawg (May 1, 2005)

Howard Roark said:
			
		

> You are mixing the Bible and mythology.




No sir...the Bible tells of Gods who came to earth and laid down with human women. I am of the opinion that the bible is mythology......even if your religion teaches that the bible is the inspired word of God or the actual word of god you gotta admit that man has interpreted in from so many different languages and so many different times that some of it could be myth....


----------



## jason308 (May 1, 2005)

AAA- can you show me where in the Bible it says that gods came to Earth and slept with human women?


----------



## AAADawg (May 1, 2005)

jason308 said:
			
		

> AAA- can you show me where in the Bible it says that gods came to Earth and slept with human women?




I am looking for the pasage even as we speak!!!


----------



## matthewsman (May 2, 2005)

*I wasn't calling you names*



			
				AAADawg said:
			
		

> 1....
> 1...........There wasnt any chance on earth that this thread was not going to be responded to....as a matter of fact it had already gotten a response before yours....
> 
> 2....the bible, a book that I am completely capable of reading and understanding (and, by the way, have done so from cover to cover)
> 3....I have a question...why did you find it necessary to refer to me as a "Pseudo intellectual"???


1..It was answered,responded to while I was typing....
2...Reading from cover to cover does not imply complete understanding,only that you showed some interest...
3...Generally I see you repeat the views of others,whether it be straight down Dem. party lines,or the "I'm too smart for religion handbook"I believe if your mind was looking for answers out of curiosity rather than an argument, you would more receptive than debating small points in posts of people that don't believe like you,or people that are less informed than you.......after all you have read the Bible through...........I wasn't calling you names,I was referring to "pseudo-intellectuals"as a group,and including you with them as you seemed to be a thinker,although not as original as you would lead one to believe.......
Again,I will pray for you,to the God you don't believe in,that the argumentative spirit I see clearly in you,will leave you alone so your mind will be freed........those of you that don't understand this,that's ok,those of you that do,pray with me........donnie


----------



## Eshad (May 2, 2005)

Matthew 14:6,  Jesus speaking to Thomas, 


"Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. "

That pretty much sums it up. NO OTHER WAY than through Jesus Christ.  Praise be to God the He loved us all enough to make a way.  It's just up to us to accept it.  I will be praying.


----------



## JOEBIALEK (May 2, 2005)

*replies*

some good points...perhaps someday religion will evolve into spirituality


----------



## Howard Roark (May 2, 2005)

AAADawg said:
			
		

> I am looking for the pasage even as we speak!!!



Any luck yet?


----------



## Eshad (May 2, 2005)

JOEBIALEK said:
			
		

> some good points...perhaps someday religion will evolve into spirituality



Unfortunately Satan would love that.  It's not about "religion", it's about a relationship with a God who loved us enough to send His only Son to die and pay for our sins.  John 3:17 says that He came not to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.  Joe and AAADawg, I pray that God would show you the way in your heart, and that you both, and anyone reading this who don't know Christ as their personal saviour, would come to eternal salvation through Jesus Christ our Lord.  He said if He be lifted up, He would draw all men unto Him.  He also promised that His Word would not return void.  I claim that promise, and pray His Word would become reality on our lives. 

Eshad


----------



## jason308 (May 2, 2005)

I find the term "religion" to be somewhat confusing at best. As EShad posted, it is about a growing relationship with God, not just a set of rules to preach by. Jesus wasn't much on religion either. He set the "religious" leaders of that day (the Pharisees) straight and taught us not to accept any and everything that is taught and believed anywhere, but to go by His teachings in the Word of God. So "religion"- not for me. Having a relationship with the one True God and knowing that one day I will fellowship with Him eternally in Heaven, that's what its all about. He desires the same for us all. Praise be to God for His gift to us.


----------



## No. GA. Mt. Man (May 2, 2005)

Religion Won't Get You Anywhere But Salvation Will Get You To Heaven.


----------



## gordon 2 (May 2, 2005)

*The idea that*

Different religions account for evil in the world is a bit overated in my view. All men regardless of culture are religions or spiritual to some extent. Some of these are good people, some are not. And that goes for people of all religions, cultures, nationalities etc.

People have been born "in the world" since before Abraham and continue to do so as we speak. All who deem it an important responsibility that is their spiritual life, need to be born again into a new world of light, if they are to fully realize what it is to be human. Some chose to seek, others don't.  For all who seek, mankind's fullness, indeed the fullness of  life itself,  is in  relationship with God--a spirit or Gods--spirits.

Now the Bahai religion is much in the line of what you speak about as in the commonality of all doctrines and religious similarities. Life good and evil goes on however. Like saying if women ran the world things would be good. NOT!

For christians what is evil about the world is the absence of God, in the aspect of  his will, goodness and love. School play grounds, religions groups and individuals in our own communities, indeed aspects of ourselves remind us everyday of good and evil regardless of religion, culture and nationality .The cause of strife rests in the heart of people not in religious organizations per say. People pull the trigger, call the shots, with and without religion.

AAA's quote about Gods laying with women is in fact in the Old Testament. My take on it is ,  and if a man  takes a wife  and has God in his heart does not God lay with them both?  Genesis 6:1-4 is perhaps what AAA got in mind. In any event I believe it speaks of the naisent events of God's echo in the heart of man...the echo of what was before the fall and what would  be in the world then and to come. New beginnings sort of the One God and the One Man. God was grooming his man and man began slowly, again, walking his way. He is still teaching.


----------



## BANDERSNATCH (May 3, 2005)

"Religion"     Man trying to earn favor with God
"Christianity"    God freely offering his favor through Christ.

Bandy


----------



## Arrowslinger (May 3, 2005)

AAADawg said:
			
		

> ...even the catholic church recognized more than one god i its beginnings....



I've never heard or seen this What is your source.


----------



## Dudley Do-Wrong (May 3, 2005)

> It's not about "religion", it's about a relationship with a God



As I read through this thread, I was hoping someone would say what Eshad said.  AMEN


----------



## PWalls (May 3, 2005)

Me too.

It is all about the relationship with God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Without that relationship, you are lost.

Religion is OK for growth and maturity, but it is not the prerequisite to get into heaven.

There will be many people in heaven IN SPITE OF their religion.


----------



## Dixie Dawg (May 4, 2005)

gordon 2 said:
			
		

> Now the Bahai religion is much in the line of what you speak about as in the commonality of all doctrines and religious similarities. Life good and evil goes on however. Like saying if women ran the world things would be good. NOT!



Part of me feels I should be offended by this comment, but the other part of me is still trying to decipher just exactly what you said....?

Love, light & blessings,
Kerri


----------



## Dixie Dawg (May 4, 2005)

matthewsman said:
			
		

> The Bible is also "lousy "with references that the Lord our God is one,is a jealous God,is a The true God,the living God,The God of wrath,and the God of love depending on the circumstance.for you,a non-believer,and psuedo-intellect try to use a book about a diety you don't believe in as a reference to prove the lack of Him is ineffectual, insulting, and hopefully even you will realize the ignorance in that.......It would be like attempting to prove the lack of a bumper to bumper unlimited warranty by using a warranty book that simply states 3yr 36000unlimited warranty.



IMHO, part of the problem comes when one tries to take a book that was written in one language and translate it into another.  When something is translated, be it a bible or a book or even a television commercial, something is lost in translation.  The person translating it is given the opportunity to translate it the way they understand it, which may or may not be the way it is meant to be written. IMHO, unless someone reads Hebrew or Aramic, they don't really know what the original scriptures said or how they were to be meant. You rely on someone's translation of those words.  Then you have other questions come into play... was the verse meant to be literal? Is there more than one meaning for this word?  Was this the same understanding in the day that it was written as it is now?  Were these words written for everyone, or just a certain group of people?  What context was this written in?  Are these books of the bible in chronological order? Do they follow each other as far as context... meaning does one contradict the other?  Are the messages the same?

Religion will always be one of the most intense discussions one can get into, but no matter what one believes in, three things remain constant facts:
1. Not all religions can be true, so SOMEONE has to be wrong.  But everyone thinks theirs is THE right one.

2. No matter what religion one believes in, EVERYONE will die one day.

3. Vince Dooley will always be the best football coach UGA has ever had.
Oh wait, sorry, wrong thread... that was another one of the most intense discussions one can get into!    

Love, light & blessings,
Kerri


----------



## BANDERSNATCH (May 4, 2005)

I wonder how far off base they were when they translated John 3:16

"For God so loved the world that He gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life"   


You are absolutely right....not all religions can be right.   "Two things can't be opposite and true at the same time!"

Bandy


----------



## AAADawg (May 4, 2005)

Howard Roark said:
			
		

> Any luck yet?





I think the passage Im thinking of is in genesis but im not sure...I just realized that this thread was moved...I thought it was still on the other board...Duh!!!!! (as my daughter would say)


----------



## Howard Roark (May 4, 2005)

There is a footprint on the political forum showing a redirect here.


----------



## AAADawg (May 4, 2005)

Arrowslinger said:
			
		

> I've never heard or seen this What is your source.




Elain Paglia wrote a book called "Adam, Eve and the Serpent" that has a section that details the early days of the Roman Catholic church when it was a polytheistic religion...as well as Cardinal Vincent Carroll's "Early History of Catholicism" And Pete Slezingers "Christianity and Paganism...the ties that Bind" not only describes the polytheims of the early church and the christian movement but aslo descirbes in fascinting detail how some very common "christian" beleifs and rituals are actually age old pagan rites and ritiuals that the church couldnt "beat" out of followers so they adopted them as "christian" ideas. There are countless volumes of similar studies done by theoligans, historians and peopele who are just interested in the subject...if you are realy interested look for them at the library...it is amazing what you can learn.....


----------



## Dixie Dawg (May 4, 2005)

BANDERSNATCH said:
			
		

> I wonder how far off base they were when they translated John 3:16
> 
> "For God so loved the world that He gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life"
> 
> ...



Hi Bandy!  
I guess I am really speaking about the "Old Testament" as opposed to the New when I was talking about translation.... but since you bring that up, I have to ask, do you believe God has always been the same? I mean, do you believe He is the same now as He was in Jesus' time, and the same as He was in Moses' time? Or has He changed over time?

Love, light & blessings,
Kerri


----------



## PWalls (May 4, 2005)

Dixie Dawg said:
			
		

> Hi Bandy!
> I guess I am really speaking about the "Old Testament" as opposed to the New when I was talking about translation.... but since you bring that up, I have to ask, do you believe God has always been the same? I mean, do you believe He is the same now as He was in Jesus' time, and the same as He was in Moses' time? Or has He changed over time?
> 
> Love, light & blessings,
> Kerri



God is God. He doesn't change. You refer to Moses' time and Jesus' time and now. God is in all of those places at the same time. Time has no meaning to him. So he is the same, because there is no "time" to God.


----------



## BANDERSNATCH (May 4, 2005)

Pwalls,

I'm sure she is referring to God 'changing His mind'.   

Kerri,

I believe that when God makes a promise, that He keeps it.   For example, the covenant that He made with Abraham.....still the same today.    God promised a Messiah, and He came.    You say Isaiah 53 was fulfilled by a jewish king (although you don't say how), I say it was fulfilled in Jesus.   King David himself said that the blood of animals couldn't take away sin, even though God set up animal sacrifice.     David's throne was to be established 'forever', and has been established in Jesus.    We see God 'changing His mind' with Ninevah.  God said that that city would be destroyed, but seeing their repentance, changed His mind.   He said He would change His mind if Abraham could find a certain number of righteous men in Sodom.    God does not change though, He has always prefer the repentance, to the punishment of the sinner.   

How do Jews atone for sin, without blood, today?

Bandy


----------



## Dudley Do-Wrong (May 4, 2005)

I must comment on 2 points.

1. Someone mentioned something about things being lost in translation.  I thought about that at one time.  I now see that as an excuse for me to not live by the parts of God's word that didn't agree with my lifestyle.  What's wrong with this?  Well, just exactly what happened to me some years ago.  If one aspect of the Bible is in doubt, then you might as well throw the whole thing away.  For one thing, through study guided by the Holy Spirit, one will see that the events described in the New Testament are the fulfillment of the promises made in the Old Testament; it fits like a custom made glove.
Also, I believe that those who originally translated even the oldest of Scripture, did it under the influence of the Holy Spirit.  Provide that is true, then there can be no mistake.

2. The comment about the catholic church.  It is true that the Romans converted from paganism to Christianity as ordered by emperor Constatine during the 4th century.  Most every culture practiced some sort of pagan or false religion before conversion.  But once converted, there was only one god worshipped, the One True God.  Now, because Constatine basically forced Christianity on the people, he allowed some of the pagan rituals to remain, but not the worship of other gods


----------



## gordon 2 (May 5, 2005)

*Kerri no offence intended.*

Perhaps I failded to indicate that I was answering the author of this thread, Joe Bialek's "if humanity could intergrate all religious beliefs...one spirituality...we would see emergence of world peace." You will find this sentence at the end of this post #!

My point was that with peace and strife, good and evil, religions, are not the problem per say. And as an example, to the comment of those who frequently say, women should run the world, that it would be a much more peaceful place, is an error in my view.  The solution to world peace is not one spirituality,( as in one religion) no more that a world run by females as opposed to males.

I hope this will clarify, but I'm not the greatest poster for comprehention here. I have had lawyers here tell me I should stick to ditch digging rather than try to transfer my thoughts to the american english and its conservative puctuations.  Peace to you sister... If I was a boxer, I suppose I would be all over the place, but I do love the ring. I hope you get my points.


----------



## Dixie Dawg (May 5, 2005)

gordon 2 said:
			
		

> Perhaps I failded to indicate that I was answering the author of this thread, Joe Bialek's "if humanity could intergrate all religious beliefs...one spirituality...we would see emergence of world peace." You will find this sentence at the end of this post #!
> 
> My point was that with peace and strife, good and evil, religions, are not the problem per say. And as an example, to the comment of those who frequently say, women should run the world, that it would be a much more peaceful place, is an error in my view.  The solution to world peace is not one spirituality,( as in one religion) no more that a world run by females as opposed to males.
> 
> I hope this will clarify, but I'm not the greatest poster for comprehention here. I have had lawyers here tell me I should stick to ditch digging rather than try to transfer my thoughts to the american english and its conservative puctuations.  Peace to you sister... If I was a boxer, I suppose I would be all over the place, but I do love the ring. I hope you get my points.




AAhhh!! Yes, I do understand now!  And no, I don't agree that you should 'stick to ditch digging' LOL...  there is a lot lost in message posting (kind of reminds me of the translation thing  ) because you can't 'hear' tone of voice, etc.  So sometimes it's hard to express what your head is trying to say... been there many a time myself!!

Oh, and for the record, I don't necessarily believe the world would be a much better place if it were run by women... maybe decorated a bit better...    

Love, light & blessings to you as well! 
Kerri


----------



## Dixie Dawg (May 5, 2005)

BANDERSNATCH said:
			
		

> Kerri,
> 
> I believe that when God makes a promise, that He keeps it.   For example, the covenant that He made with Abraham.....still the same today.    God promised a Messiah, and He came.    You say Isaiah 53 was fulfilled by a jewish king (although you don't say how), I say it was fulfilled in Jesus.   King David himself said that the blood of animals couldn't take away sin, even though God set up animal sacrifice.     David's throne was to be established 'forever', and has been established in Jesus.    We see God 'changing His mind' with Ninevah.  God said that that city would be destroyed, but seeing their repentance, changed His mind.   He said He would change His mind if Abraham could find a certain number of righteous men in Sodom.    God does not change though, He has always prefer the repentance, to the punishment of the sinner.



Bandy, in case I forget to tell you, I really enjoy discussing these things with you and the rest of the members on these boards, everyone has always used the utmost respect when discussing these topics that sometimes can be very personal!

I am limited on time today, but I'd like to touch on a little of what you wrote.  My reason for asking is because in Deuteronomy chapter 4, God is talking to the Hebrews about how He led them through the desert for 40 years and how He purposely did not appear to them in any image so that they would not worship it or make an idol of Him.  This is where I run into difficulty believing that later He came to earth as a man... He said specifically why He didn't do it back then, where does it say He changed His mind? Did He not know people would make images, statues and paintings of Jesus?  If God doesn't change, this is a bit of a stumper (for me, anyway).

The word "messiah" simply means 'anointed one'... there have been many messiahs, King David was a messiah... and there will be many more.

Also, you made a statement (which I completely agree with) that "He has always preferred the repentance to the punishment of the sinner".  I will agree with this and add... He prefers the repentance of the sinner to sacrifice   (Hosea 6:6 "For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings." Psalm 40:7 "Sacrifice and meal offering You have not desired; but my ears You have opened; burt offering and sin offering You have not required')  And having said that, your next question was:



> How do Jews atone for sin, without blood, today?



Hosea 3:4-5  "For the children of Israel shall abide many days without king or prince, without sacrifice or sacred pillar, without ephod or teraphim.  Afterward, the children of Israel shall return and seek the Lord their God and David their king. They shall fear the Lord and His goodness in the latter days."

Hosea 14:2-3  "Take words with you, and return to the Lord.  Say to Him, "Take away all iniquity; receive us graciously, for we will render for bulls the offering of our lips."

Prayer and repentance takes the place of sacrifice now, as it always did.  Sacrifice was only for unintentional sin... and there were other ways of making atonement... charity was one way, repentance was another.  I can touch more on these later, if you would like, or it can be found in the books of Moses (first 5 of Old Testament).

I'd also just like to say that I am not and would not ever set out to change someone's religious beliefs... I enjoy discussing the differences of opinions and interpretations of scripture, but it is not my goal to cause doubt in anyone or change anyone's mind.  I have a personal relationship with God, and I consider religion a hobby, and I enjoy sharing and discussing that hobby just as I do my others.  I believe everyone is entitled to their own faith and that no matter what you believe in, those beliefs can change your life.  I have seen people whose lives were turned around for the better by believing in Jesus, as well as Mohammed, Buddah and even by giving up religion entirely.  I don't believe the path to God is narrow... I believe He gave us many roads to get to Him because He knew we would all be different, and some things would touch us more than others.  I guess what I'm saying is, I don't believe God put Himself in a box or made it difficult to have a relationship with Him by only allowing one way.  I believe He loves us similarly to how we love our own children (although we can't possibly comprehend how much He loves us), and I know that my daughter can never do anything to stop me from loving her.... God is the same way.

I hope that I  have at least somewhat explained myself well enough to comprehend LOL... trying to type quickly and put coherent thoughts down sometimes do not go hand in hand! And I hope that anything I have said will not be taken the wrong way... everything I have posted is done so with the spirit of friendly discussion and no other intent, and is my own personal understanding of the scriptures... I certainly do not claim to be an expert! 

Love, light & blessings,
Kerri


----------

