# Two Way Radios??



## Davexx1 (Oct 11, 2008)

What has everyone found to be the better/best two way radios?

We have used the older small Motorola walkies before and they seem to not have good sound quality or range.  Are the newer models any better?

Midland brand radios seems to get alot of positive feedback.

Any feedback appreciated.

Thanks, Dave


----------



## Grover Willis (Oct 11, 2008)

If you are in the woods,  you are lucky if you get half a mile out of any of them.  If you expect what they say on the box, then you need to be in a open area without any hills.  We use the garmin gps radios and at least we have a general idea where the other person is and can back track to a last known location so maybe we can get radio contact. good luck.


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Oct 16, 2008)

"Best" two way radios will be ham radios. Most are easily modifyable to go out of band and all come with removable antennas so you can add a higher gain antenna for greater range. The main operational drawback to these FRS/GMRS bubble pack radios you see is the fixed, no-gain, crappy little antennas they come with.

Please do not transmit on ham radio frequencies without a license, and don't listen to anyone telling you that transmitting on other frequencies (like the MURS freqs. you can operate on without a license and on a modified ham handheld) is illegal so don't do it. Yes it is illegal but there is NO enforcement and no one will be able to hear your transmissions more than a mile or two away anyway.


----------



## Davexx1 (Oct 20, 2008)

Can the hand held ham radios mentioned be used on the personal communication channels?

Seems the ham units would be better quality and better performing units than the small Motorola's and/or Midland units, but the ham units would be battery/power hogs, be larger/heavier, etc..

Anyone else use the ham units for personal communications?

Dave


----------



## ROBD (Oct 20, 2008)

I have a set of the little yellow motorola's that i used for the first time this past weekend.  i was about 600 yards across an open field in a condo stand and could not hear anything from my wife on the other side of the field.  there is a small hill in the middle of the field.  Guess if you can not see the person these are about useless.


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Oct 21, 2008)

By personal communications frequencies....there are two different sets-types in use today.

There are the MURS channels (Multi User Radio Service) Those are on VHF so you will want a VHF ham radio also called 2 meter.

The FRS/GMRS channels are UHF so you'd pick a UHF ham radio also called the 440 band as the ham UHF band is between 440-450mhz.

Both types and most all brands will go out of band enough to cover either of these personal bands. But you must check out any particular radio you're looking at to see if it will specifically go out of band far enough for your needs. There are numerous websites detailing ham radio modifications on the internet. Just google them.

Also most ham every ham handheld has variable power settings as a feature so you don't have to run highest power all the time. If 1/2 watt will do, run that. Increase to a higher power level as you need.

Many choices on the market. Icom, Yaesu, Kenwood, Alinco are all good radios.

good luck


----------



## JohnK3 (Oct 21, 2008)

I will warn you, however, do NOT transmit on the ham bands (144MHz-148MHz for 2-meters) without a license.  You may not get caught right away, but if a ham hears you talking, he's probably going to try to talk to you.  Not out of a desire to "bust" you or anything, but out of a desire to meet a new person on the air.  Once he does that, he's going to ask you for your call sign.  If you don't have one, he's probably going to report you.  If he reports, there *are* enforcement actions that happen.  The ARRL newsletters are full of enforcement actions taken by the FCC against unlicensed operators on the ham bands.

Y'know, it's VERY easy to get your license to operate a 2-meter handy-talkie legally.  It'll cost you some time (studying online) and a small bit of cash ($14, I think) to take the test.  Once you have the license, you don't have to worry about getting busted because you were using a ham radio.

I really don't think it's a good idea to encourage anyone to engage in illegal behavior, even if there is no enforcement.  After all, the FCC has been known to enforce the rules upon occasion, even when everyone thought they didn't care.


----------



## paratrooper202 (Oct 22, 2008)

JohnK3 is right! 2 hunters busted this weekend for using Ham freqs for hunting, there have been reports in the hunting camp by a fellow ham monitor that this was going on. Sheriff report filed on the case was turn over to the FCC in Atlanta, Ga, Food for thought.
The test is very easy to pass, if you study. Fines are steep from $500 to $1000 for first time, not worth it if I were you, but you be the judge on that. I think the radios were taken from the guys also.

Chris KI4JPG


----------



## Jim Thompson (Oct 22, 2008)

we have been through so many of the 2ways (models and brands) that its almost pathetic.

seems every couple of years one of the manufactures will pop out with a longer range ability and one of us will jump out there and spend 80-$200 hoping and praying they will get just a hair more range than the last.

but they almost never do  cant tell much difference if any from the 30 milers of today and the 2 milers of the old days.

if we could only get May to learn to text we could throw them all in the garbage.  he is just older and cant quite get the hang of it


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Oct 23, 2008)

Yes yes, I was the first to mention not transmitting on ham frequencies without being a ham.

I am suggesting using the much higher quality ham radios on the MURS or GMRS frequencies.


----------



## Davexx1 (Nov 10, 2008)

After seeing several of the small hand held radios such as the tiny Midland's, Motorola's, etc. advertising 30 miles of range, I was thinking surely they would work a full mile or two thru the woods.

It seems JT has been there, done that, and did not have a good experience.  Thanks for that info, you probably just saved me from the same fate and expense.

The hand held HAM units are without a doubt the better quality, longer distance unit, and their price, size, and weight reflects that.  I was hoping to find a shirt pocket size/weight radio that would work well in the hunting woods.  License would be no problem as I have lots of time to study.    

What is the price range for the brands/types of HAM/2 Meter radios that were mentioned/suggested?

Are HAM units direct radio to radio communications or does the transmission hit a repeater, then the airways?

Dave


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi Dave, 

They do both. Radio to radio (simplex) or through a repeater (half duplex).

Icom makes several nice  basic 2 meter HT's. $100-$125

Both parties, you and whoever you're talking to, are both going to have to be hams to communicate on ham frequencies. Or you can modify them to go out of band and use the VHF MURS frequencies, which these radios will do.

Good luck

I can recommend Ham Radio Outlet in Doraville on Buford Highway for purchasing. Or buy new or used on ebay ect...


----------



## Davexx1 (Nov 10, 2008)

I suspect that none of the rednecks I occasionally hunt with would spend the money for one of the HAM radios so if I did have one, I'd be trying to talk to the guys with the small Midland or Motorola units.  In that situation and some instances, they would be able to hear me on the more powerful HAM unit, but I may not be able to hear them unless the HAM unit has a receive amp.

Do all of the HAM units have to be modified so as they can be used on the same frequencies the small Midland's and Motorola's operate on?  We used to do that to some of the import radios to get the lower bands.  The Galaxy DX55 and a Texas Star was my favorite combination for many years.

Dave


----------



## Aztec (Nov 11, 2008)

I don't think its legal but we have been using marine radios for several years with good results.  We hunt along a river so I don't know if the law requires your to be in a boat.  We can get 4 or 5 miles almost anywhere.


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Nov 11, 2008)

Hi Dave,

Yes the ham radios out of the box will only transmit on the ham bands. Must be modified to transmit out of band although they all have extended receive coverage.

To use a ham to talk with others using a FRS/GMRS, you'll need a UHF (440) ham handheld. You'd have to check into the specs on each one to find one that will go out of band all the way up to the 467mhz frequencies which is where the higher GMRS channels are located. The FRS/GMRS channels are split between frequencies in 462, and 467mhz. I can post a list of the exact frequencies if anyone needs them.


----------



## Randy (Nov 11, 2008)

Aztec said:


> I don't think its legal but we have been using marine radios for several years with good results.  We hunt along a river so I don't know if the law requires your to be in a boat.  We can get 4 or 5 miles almost anywhere.


Marine Radio use outside of a boat is illegal unless it is s base station.

That being said they make some that have the FRS and MUR frequencies and they work better becasue the have more power on the FRS channels.  I have several hand held units like this that I use in my yaks while inshore.


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Nov 11, 2008)

Randy said:


> Marine Radio use outside of a boat is illegal unless it is s base station.
> 
> That being said they make some that have the FRS and MUR frequencies and they work better because the have more power on the FRS channels.  I have several hand held units like this that I use in my yaks while inshore.



Hi Randy, Can you show us an example of one of these? It would have to be a dual-bander as FRS is UHF and MURS is VHF.


Only dual banders I know of are ham rigs (handhelds anyway)

TNX


----------



## Jeb (Nov 12, 2008)

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2558767

http://www.jmsonline.net/UNIDEN-MHS550-VHF-HANDHELD-AM-FM-FRS.htm

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=9007184&type=product&id=1218008587970


----------



## Randy (Nov 12, 2008)

Cornelia_Hiker said:


> Hi Randy, Can you show us an example of one of these? It would have to be a dual-bander as FRS is UHF and MURS is VHF.
> 
> 
> Only dual banders I know of are ham rigs (handhelds anyway)
> ...


Here is one of the ones I have:

http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=93236F


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Nov 12, 2008)

Randy said:


> Here is one of the ones I have:
> 
> http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=93236F




Thanks Jeb and Randy, those Standard's look awesome for real, made by Yaesu. The $320 price though is a lot for the average Joe.


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Nov 12, 2008)

I would still go with one of the ham handhelds even with having to get it modified. This usually only involves opening it and removing-unsoldering 1 diode. No big deal.

The other units all have fixed unity gain (no gain) antennas. They are built-in. Can't remove them. All the ham radios will have removeable antennas either on BNC or SMA connectors (both common) and you'll be able to put a longer, better, higher gain antenna on them.(Also available at the ham shops or ebay, ect...) A better antenna makes all the difference on any transmitting radio from CB radio up to anything else. You would even be able to attach them to a really bigger antenna like a 5/8 wave magnet mount for a vehicle using a length of coax in between, or for that matter you could create a base station at home or a hunting cabin using an even larger and more effective base antenna with a piece of coax in between.

The out of band modifications for all ham radios are freely published on the net and can be found with a google search. Just make sure before buying that the radio you're looking at will go up to at least 468mhz to cover all of the 467mhz GMRS channels that the FRS/GMRS radios use, and when modified. 


good luck!


----------



## Randy (Nov 12, 2008)

Cornelia_Hiker said:


> The $320 price though is a lot for the average Joe.



Admittedly I am not average!


----------



## Davexx1 (Nov 13, 2008)

I like all of those better quality VHF and HAM radios, but I only need the ability to talk on the walkie/talkie channels.

I do want and need a better quality transmitter/receiver to get aditional range on those channels.  I don't need the HAM channels, don't need the marine VHF channels, but it seems that I may have to buy one of those radios to get the better quality and range I want.

$190-$320 for one radio is a big jump from the $60-$90 for a pair of radios.

Seems there should be a good product, that is a good compromise, that is less costly.

Dave


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Nov 14, 2008)

You can get a single band UHF ham radio under $125 and even cheaper, used good condition on ebay. A new extended gain add-on antenna is $25 at the ham stores.


----------



## Twenty five ought six (Nov 15, 2008)

I worked with a fellow that was importing radios that were "ham" radios, but that with a clip of a wire, became super CB radios.  I believe the brand name was "Galaxy" but I may be wrong.  Anyway, he thought he was safe because all he was doing was selling the radio, and purchaser was doing the  clipping and soldering.

That was until the day he got a knock on the door, a cease and desist letter threatening jail time, and a $10,000.00 fine.  

As far as marine VHF, using it on land gets you involved with both the FCC and the Coast Guard.  You can't use it on land sitting in your boat on a trailer.


----------



## Cornelia_Hiker (Nov 15, 2008)

If you live anywhere in NE Ga, you can tune to Channel 19 on the CB and all day long Monday through Friday you can hear The Wolfman's CB Shop at exit 164, I-85, in Carnesville loudly broadcasting their wares and services including dozens of illegal export radios and linear amplifiers. Boldly, proudly, incessantly, all the ding dang day long. Next exit up the road, 166, Cliff's CB Shop behind that there Echo Truck Stop. Same thing. They're not afraid. I am a ham operator and I have one of these illegal 10-11 meter rigs in my vehicle. Use it every day. I'm not afraid either.

The illegal aspect of using a modified ham radio on other services has already been covered. FCC enforcement is nearly non-existent. These radios are low power, line-of-sight operations and the FCC has no monitoring station in Georgia. They USED to have one in Powder Springs years ago but that has been shut down. The FCC ain't coming after such operations unless you are somehow interfering with airport or police-emergency traffic.

Go ye all and have fun with radios


----------



## Mac (Jan 20, 2009)

Good thread,

I am looking to get some type of communications on some property I can't get cell phone service.

What I don't understand,  Why does the 5 watt marine radio pick up well and the 5 watt walkie talkie doesn't?

I didn't see anybody mention a handheld CB radio,  would that work?


----------



## Davexx1 (Feb 2, 2009)

The CB radio bands/channels are very noisy, you can't talk very far.

The marine band VHF hand held radios talk very good and very far, but it is illegal to use them in the woods.  They are for marine application/use only.  I think the performance difference and advantage is because of the frequency they operate on.

The personal communication band type handheld walkie talkie radios do much better than the CB equivilents, are much smaller, use less battery power, are much quieter, etc.  The trouble is their lack of distance in wooded terrain.

Dave


----------

