# 10 questions every intelligent christian must answer



## atlashunter (Jan 6, 2011)

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## VisionCasting (Jan 6, 2011)

There are only 3 distinct questions in this video.  They all stink of bias and the supporting arguments are replete with a lack of any real Biblical knowledge (at best, or possibly purposeful deceit).

The answer to all can be summed up: sin, restraint and natural order.

PS - You post title is incorrect.  The only question all Christians must answer is "Who do you say I am?" - Mark 8:29.  In fact it's the deciding question _*if*_ you are a Christian.


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## stringmusic (Jan 6, 2011)

My favorite quote," Because if we assume that God is imaginary our world makes complete sense"



This short movie had the same style as something I watched back in junior high.


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## stringmusic (Jan 6, 2011)

VisionCasting said:


> There are only 3 distinct questions in this video.  They all stink of bias and the supporting arguments are replete with a lack of any real Biblical knowledge (at best, or possibly purposeful deceit).
> 
> The answer to all can be summed up: sin, restraint and natural order.



basically my answers as well.


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## atlashunter (Jan 6, 2011)

"Why won't God heal amputees?



VisionCasting said:


> The answer to all can be summed up: sin, restraint and natural order.



Is that your final answer?


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## ted_BSR (Jan 6, 2011)

That is one of the most idiotic things I ever watched 4 minutes of.


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## dawg2 (Jan 6, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> That is one of the most idiotic things I ever watched 4 minutes of.



Well, I wouldn't say the "most."  But it would rank in the top 10.


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## ted_BSR (Jan 6, 2011)

dawg2 said:


> Well, I wouldn't say the "most."  But it would rank in the top 10.



I said "one of the most" Dawg. But I'll go top 3!


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## Msteele (Jan 6, 2011)

ted_bsr said:


> that is one of the most idiotic things i ever watched 4 minutes of.



x2!


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## Six million dollar ham (Jan 6, 2011)

Outstanding video.  Thank you for sharing.

I bet the people who take exception, and actually watched it til the end, had their arms crossed and did plenty of squirming and shifting.  That would have to be difficult to swallow, I'd wager.


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## VisionCasting (Jan 6, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> That is one of the most idiotic things I ever watched 4 minutes of.



Hahaha.


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## atlashunter (Jan 6, 2011)

Luke 22
 49 When Jesus’ followers saw what was going to happen, they said, “Lord, should we strike with our swords?” 50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his right ear.

 51 But Jesus answered, “No more of this!” And he touched the man’s ear and healed him. 

Matthew 18
 19 Again, I tell you that if two of you on earth agree about anything you ask for, it will be done for you by my Father in heaven.

John 14
12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

So... why won't God heal amputees? We've got plenty of kids around the world who have lost arms and legs to land mines. They deserve healing too don't they?


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## dawg2 (Jan 6, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> I said "one of the most" Dawg. But I'll go top 3!



I stand corrected.


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## ted_BSR (Jan 7, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> Outstanding video.  Thank you for sharing.
> 
> I bet the people who take exception, and actually watched it til the end, had their arms crossed and did plenty of squirming and shifting.  That would have to be difficult to swallow, I'd wager.



You would lose that bet. My arms are crossed now, because you have fallen for the propoganda of the Anti Christ. Yes these problems and mutilations exist (products of war and hate), but perhaps that prosthetic next to the young boy in the photo is an answer to his prayers. Try and cover up the greatness of God, and you will fail.


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> You would lose that bet. My arms are crossed now, because you have fallen for the propoganda of the Anti Christ. Yes these problems and mutilations exist (products of war and hate), but perhaps that prosthetic next to the young boy in the photo is an answer to his prayers. Try and cover up the greatness of God, and you will fail.


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## VisionCasting (Jan 7, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> ...perhaps that prosthetic next to the young boy in the photo is an answer to his prayers. Try and cover up the greatness of God, and you will fail.



Well said.


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

Has anyone noticed that no person of religion has been able to clarify,but they make excuses and mock or ridicule the person asking the question.


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

*Hmmmmm*



ted_BSR said:


> You would lose that bet. My arms are crossed now, because you have fallen for the propoganda of the Anti Christ. Yes these problems and mutilations exist (products of war and hate), but perhaps that prosthetic next to the young boy in the photo is an answer to his prayers. Try and cover up the greatness of God, and you will fail.



Yes I guess a young boy who stepped on a landmine that the parents prayed were not there to kill there children, would rather have a rubber limb that doesn't work half as well as the one he had. Makes plenty of sense. Im converted.


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## mtnwoman (Jan 7, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> You would lose that bet. My arms are crossed now, because you have fallen for the propoganda of the Anti Christ. Yes these problems and mutilations exist (products of war and hate), but perhaps that prosthetic next to the young boy in the photo is an answer to his prayers. Try and cover up the greatness of God, and you will fail.



To add... those prosthetic legs appear too big. God sends us to provide ones that will fit the child.

Just like God, thru us, sends grain to countries where the rats eat the grain, and yet their children still die of hunger because the rat might be reincarnated uncle albert, and they won't kill the rats. So the rats eat the grain instead of the children. Children starve in the shadow of a holy cow.

Take Job for example....satan is loosed on planet earth, at least for now. And bad things are going to happen to good people.


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## VisionCasting (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:


> Has anyone noticed that no person of religion has been able to clarify,but they make excuses and mock or ridicule the person asking the question.



Au contraire - see post #2.  "The answer to all can be summed up: sin, restraint and natural order."

Next.


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

VisionCasting said:


> Au contraire - see post #2.  "The answer to all can be summed up: sin, restraint and natural order."
> 
> Next.



Yes I read that excuse to justify the reasoning in shallow minds. But what about the horrible response you gave for a child having a prostetic limb. Or the excuse of mountain lady for starving children. She said, because God created rats and he loves them more than his children who he promised to provide for over the birds. That they should starve and rats should dine on peoples humanitarian efforts.


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

Natural order ??? Does that mean God does not make that decision? If god has his hand in everything than everything is devine order and there would be no natural order in a christian faith!!!


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

*Job*



mtnwoman said:


> To add... those prosthetic legs appear too big. God sends us to provide ones that will fit the child.
> 
> Just like God, thru us, sends grain to countries where the rats eat the grain, and yet their children still die of hunger because the rat might be reincarnated uncle albert, and they won't kill the rats. So the rats eat the grain instead of the children. Children starve in the shadow of a holy cow.
> 
> Take Job for example....satan is loosed on planet earth, at least for now. And bad things are going to happen to good people.



The book of job is probably the most evil book,God and the devil (who has access to heaven) make basically a dollar bet on if job will rebute god regardless of what satan does, which God allows at the cost Satan does not kill job. Satan kills all of his family except his wife who curses him,destroys his business and his home,gives him disease,cursed by his friends all because he was FAITHFUL and that god wanted to win a bet. NO THANK YOU  
 If someone came up to me and plotted your demise over a bet it would be my duty of a caring being to warn you of this and try to protect you.


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## VisionCasting (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:


> But what about the horrible response you gave for a child having a prostetic limb.



*Exactly* what horrible excuse did I give for a child having prosthetic limb?


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:


> The book of job is probably the most evil book,





> Satan kills all of his family except his wife who curses him,destroys his business and his home,gives him disease,cursed by his friends


What moral point of reference are you using to come to the conclusions that these are bad/evil events?



> If someone came up to me and plotted your demise over a bet it would be my duty of a caring being to warn you of this and try to protect you.



Why are you a caring being? Is human life sacred? Why would you want to preserve my life, or anyone elses? If I was an quadriplegic would my life still be worth saving to you?


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:


> Has anyone noticed that no person of religion has been able to clarify,but they make excuses and mock or ridicule the person asking the question.



Why dont you clarify things for us then?


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## VisionCasting (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:


> Yes I read that excuse to justify the reasoning in shallow minds.





lazybate said:


> ...but they make excuses and mock or ridicule the person asking the question.



You mean mock and ridicule like referring to others as shallow minded?


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

Jesus didn't go around giving people prosthetics. According to the bible he healed them and you can too. So why isn't it happening? Christians are always praying for the sick. They must believe it works, although it is interesting they also go to the doctor. Seems an odd thing to do when you have the far more effective tool of prayer that doesn't cost a dime. So what is unique about amputees that they can't be healed?


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

VisionCasting said:


> *Exactly* what horrible excuse did I give for a child having prosthetic limb?



You did not make the post my mistake but you were in full agreement. Read post#16 just to agree with something as that turns my stomach.


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Why dont you clarify things for us then?



Ask a direct question? or just watch the video again, if not there are plenty of books, scholars and reasoning that will do that I can easily suggest.


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

Think of all the young men and women at Walter Reed who lost limbs to IED's. I'd be willing to donate to your best faith healing televangelist for every one soldier that they could restore. Why don't we see Christians going into these hospitals and former amputees come running out? Look at all the healing claims of Benny Hinn yet he doesn't visit a place like Walter Reed. Strange isn't it?


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

VisionCasting said:


> You mean mock and ridicule like referring to others as shallow minded?



Ridicule-words or actions intended to envoke contemptuous laughter or feelings towards a person or thing. 
 Shallow minded - one arrogant in thier ways unwilling to falter to objection of facts.

 And don't say that I won't reason or understand the facts of christianity, I was raised in religion and was on my way to becoming a preacher until 6 years ago. When I seen the oppression first hand that is inbreaded in us from birth. The seperation from our fellowman at the cost that you are certain you are right at tha cost that others go to eternal fire.At least athiest do not condem anyone to an eternity they just try to bring awareness.


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> What moral point of reference are you using to come to the conclusions that these are bad/evil events?
> 
> 
> 
> Why are you a caring being? Is human life sacred? Why would you want to preserve my life, or anyone elses? If I was an quadriplegic would my life still be worth saving to you?



You gonna take a shot at these questions?


"For all denunciation implies a moral doctrine of some kind; and the modern revolutionist doubts not only the institution he denounces, but the doctrine by which he denounces it"

Are yall having a hard time with this thread?


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> What moral point of reference are you using to come to the conclusions that these are bad/evil events?
> 
> 
> 
> Why are you a caring being? Is human life sacred? Why would you want to preserve my life, or anyone elses? If I was an quadriplegic would my life still be worth saving to you?



Are you kidding me? How is destroying a mans property and family evil? How does god allowing this on his most faithful while he sit idley by evil? It doesn't sound like I have to worry about being a better person than you. Clearly Religion has not shown you compassion for your fellow man,only contempt.


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:


> Are you kidding me? How is destroying a mans property and family evil? How does god allowing this on his most faithful while he sit idley by evil? It doesn't sound like I have to worry about being a better person than you. Clearly Religion has not shown you compassion for your fellow man,only contempt.



Great answer, still waiting on that moral reference point.


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

Please stay on topic. I don't want the thread to derail into a debate on morality. There are plenty of other threads for that.


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Great answer, still waiting on that moral reference point.



Ok, did you know that I adrenial glands are to big now science proves this and it was because of our flight or fight protection when we were indangered before weapons. Animals that have not been so lucky to evolve as  fast as us still depend on this. We are fortnate enough to have developed reasoning. Can you explain why our frontal lobes are to small for over-sized adrenal glands.This is not a perfect design. How about the fact that a star the size of our sun burns out every second destroying a solor system that possibly holds life, Does this sound like perfect design?


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Please stay on topic. I don't want the thread to derail into a debate on morality. There are plenty of other threads for that.



Point taken.


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Please stay on topic. I don't want the thread to derail into a debate on morality. There are plenty of other threads for that.



Im not making it a thread on morals, I'm simply asking where any of you guys that are wanting the answers to the questions in this video are getting your moral reference point. If we are ever going to agree on any answers to these questions, I think we must be using the same reference point to which we draw moral conclusions on what ought to be done and what ought not to be done.


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:


> Ok, did you know that I adrenial glands are to big now science proves this and it was because of our flight or fight protection when we were indangered before weapons. Animals that have not been so lucky to evolve as  fast as us still depend on this. We are fortnate enough to have developed reasoning. Can you explain why our frontal lobes are to small for over-sized adrenal glands.This is not a perfect design. How about the fact that a star the size of our sun burns out every second destroying a solor system that possibly holds life, Does this sound like perfect design?



?????
Can you decipher this for me.


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

String you are trying to shift the focus an it is pretty obvious. If you would like to take a stab at the questions from the video please do so. Our source of morality is irrelevant to the topic of this thread.


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## lazybate (Jan 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> String you are trying to shift the focus an it is pretty obvious. If you would like to take a stab at the questions from the video please do so. Our source of morality is irrelevant to the topic of this thread.



I appreciate the post but, I don't think that I could ever keep a line of questioning with a people so intent on avoiding a question with another question. Or qouting the scripture that thinks for them, instead of them thinking for themselves.


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> String you are trying to shift the focus an it is pretty obvious. If you would like to take a stab at the questions from the video please do so. Our source of morality is irrelevant to the topic of this thread.



If we are ever going to agree on any answers to these questions, I think we must be using the same reference point to which we draw moral conclusions on what ought to be done and what ought not to be done
I suppose I'm done with this thread then.


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> I suppose I'm done with this thread then.



The questions will still be here waiting for you.


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> The questions will still be here waiting for you.



As will the giant words in post #43 be here for you.


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

Let me help you out string. I have no morality whatsoever and no source of morality. That's your point of reference. Now your bible says the things that I referenced in post #12. Given what it says, explain why it doesn't appear to be true in the case of amputees. It is not a question of morality. It's a question of the truth of the claims made in the bible that you believe.


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

> I have no morality whatsoever and no source of morality.


Ok, finally, a reference point. We will use your morality, or lack thereof, to answer the questions.

we can start with question #6, cause thats one I can remember, 
question:"why do bad things happen to good people"
answer: Good and bad do not exist, I have no morals, so I do not understand the question.


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## ambush80 (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Great answer, still waiting on that moral reference point.



Morals come from Allah Hu Akbar.  Refute?


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Luke 22
> 49 When Jesus’ followers saw what was going to happen, they said, “Lord, should we strike with our swords?” 50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his right ear.
> 
> 51 But Jesus answered, “No more of this!” And he touched the man’s ear and healed him.



Jesus didnt want them to fight.




> John 14
> 12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.


Does this say to you that a Christian can make a leg or arm grow back? How do you know that Jesus was talking about miracles in this instance?



> So... why won't God heal amputees?


Your assuming that they_* need*_ to be healed, how do you know that?



> They deserve healing too don't they?


I dont know


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## stringmusic (Jan 7, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> Morals come from Allah Hu Akbar.  Refute?



I was asking what reference point was being used in asking the questions, not where morals come from. We were asked to stay on topic, we can start another thread on morals if you would like


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## VisionCasting (Jan 7, 2011)

lazybate said:
			
		

> ...seperation from our fellowman at the cost that you are certain you are right at tha cost that others go to eternal fire.At least athiest do not condem anyone to an eternity they just try to bring awareness:



Let's be clear that what I believe, without regard to it's accuracy,  has no actual bearing on anone's eternity (except of course my own).  Why would you even care what I believe?


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Ok, finally, a reference point. We will use your morality, or lack thereof, to answer the questions.
> 
> we can start with question #6, cause thats one I can remember,
> question:"why do bad things happen to good people"
> answer: Good and bad do not exist, I have no morals, so I do not understand the question.



Oh I do understand the question and I'm not asking it from my point of view but from yours. As the video shows, the atheist point of view can provide answers to those questions that make more sense than the believer can and you're demonstrating that here. It's a challenge to provide answers from YOUR point of reference that don't sound absurd. A challenge you have yet to even attempt to take on.


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## atlashunter (Jan 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Jesus didnt want them to fight.



AND... he healed the mans amputated ear.




stringmusic said:


> Does this say to you that a Christian can make a leg or arm grow back? How do you know that Jesus was talking about miracles in this instance?



Yes it does.

Because immediately preceding that he says "Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves.".




stringmusic said:


> Your assuming that they_* need*_ to be healed, how do you know that?



Oh I don't know... maybe because they are missing limbs.




stringmusic said:


> I dont know



Seriously? A little kid gets a body part blown off and you're not sure if they deserve to be restored?


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## stringmusic (Jan 9, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> AND... he healed the mans amputated ear.


Yes he did.





> Yes it does.
> 
> Because immediately preceding that he says "Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves.".



 Why are you classifying works as miracles?




> Oh I don't know... maybe because they are missing limbs.


And you assume that having all four limbs makes for a greater life,maybe for eating with a fork or playing baseball, but not for much else.  I think Jesus makes that a point. 






> Seriously? A little kid gets a body part blown off and you're not sure if they deserve to be restored?


On what grounds do you make the assertion that they do need to be restored?


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## atlashunter (Jan 9, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Why are you classifying works as miracles?



Other way around. I'm classifying miracles as works.










stringmusic said:


> On what grounds do you make the assertion that they do need to be restored?



I'm starting out with the premise that arms and legs are a good thing. Getting them blown off by a land mine is a bad thing.

Maybe if it happened to you it wouldn't really matter to you and given the choice between getting that leg back or living the rest of your life in a wheelchair you would be indifferent about it. I think there is at least some percentage of amputees out there that would like to have their appendages restored if given the option.

Do you think there are any amputees that deserve to be healed? If you had the ability to restore the missing limb of a child and they asked you to, would you do it?


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## stringmusic (Jan 9, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Other way around. I'm classifying miracles as works.


where and why did you come to this conclusion?







> I'm starting out with the premise that arms and legs are a good thing. Getting them blown off by a land mine is a bad thing.


For a Christian, having all four limbs has no bearing on living a fulfilling life or salvation.



> I think there is at least some percentage of amputees out there that would like to have their appendages restored if given the option.


Im sure they would



> Do you think there are any amputees that deserve to be healed?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## atlashunter (Jan 9, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> where and why did you come to this conclusion?



Miracles are by definition works. In this scripture the disciples are asking to be shown the father. They are seeking evidence. He answers saying "Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, or else believe Me for the sake of the works themselves." What works demonstrate evidence of the divine if not miracles? Also there are other verses in John where he is clearly referring to miracles that use the term works. And if you look at different translations some will use the word miracle in place of work.

John 5:36
John 7:21
John 10:38
John 15:24





stringmusic said:


> For a Christian, having all four limbs has no bearing on living a fulfilling life or salvation.



Maybe so but they still pray for and claim healing by faith for all sorts of ailments don't they? So why should missing limbs be an exception?




stringmusic said:


> I dont know, that may sound bad to some, but not when used in compilation with the answer above about having all four limbs and living a fulfilling life and salvation.



 Yeah it sounds bad for a good reason.




stringmusic said:


> Yes I would, but only because I am a human being. I do not assert myself with all knowing ability, I dont know how giving a persons' limb back to them will change there life or the people life around them, you know, for the whole salvation thing.



So God doesn't heal amputees because it's for their own good? How strange that faith healing supposedly works for so many other health problems but in this particular case the patient is always left without healing for their own good.


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## atlashunter (Jan 16, 2011)

Atheists should start a fundraising campaign to send the best faith healer Christians have to Walter Reed. I'm sure we could come up with a large sum for the regrowth of even one soldiers missing limb. You would think Christians would be out there putting hospitals and drug companies out of business if prayer really worked.


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## VisionCasting (Jan 16, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Atheists should start a fundraising campaign...



Wouldn't work. We all know athiests don't give.


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## Six million dollar ham (Jan 16, 2011)

VisionCasting said:


> We all know athiests don't give.



What makes you say that?


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## atlashunter (Jan 16, 2011)

VisionCasting said:


> Wouldn't work. We all know athiests don't give.



This one will. Which faith healer do you want to send?


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## ted_BSR (Jan 26, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> This one will. Which faith healer do you want to send?



Why do you assume we all believe in Faith Healers?


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## atlashunter (Jan 26, 2011)

I don't. If you don't believe in it, my hat's off to you.


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## ted_BSR (Jan 26, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> I don't. If you don't believe in it, my hat's off to you.



I am not saying it is not possible (through God), but there are a lot of nut jobs out there who would capitalize on the weak or trusting through deception and trickery. Only God can heal.


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## atlashunter (Jan 26, 2011)

Ok... two questions.

Why do so many Christians believe in faith healing? If they didn't then the faith healers (they are all nut jobs IMO, don't know if you agree) wouldn't have such large audiences and fat wallets. If faith healing isn't biblical you would think they wouldn't have so many christian followers.

Where is the miracle healing of amputees? If God can do it and you think he might sometimes heal other maladies why no restoration of missing limbs?


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## ted_BSR (Jan 26, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Ok... two questions.
> 
> Why do so many Christians believe in faith healing? If they didn't then the faith healers (they are all nut jobs IMO, don't know if you agree) wouldn't have such large audiences and fat wallets. If faith healing isn't biblical you would think they wouldn't have so many christian followers.
> 
> Where is the miracle healing of amputees? If God can do it and you think he might sometimes heal other maladies why no restoration of missing limbs?



I don't know, there are a lot of people that believe everything on the internet is true too.

Again, I don't know. He is said to be mysterious.


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## atlashunter (Jan 26, 2011)

It _is_ a mystery isn't it?


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## ted_BSR (Jan 26, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> It _is_ a mystery isn't it?



I guess we know what it will take for you to believe. Maybe he is holding out on that limb regeneration thing just for you. I hope it doesn't hurt much.


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## atlashunter (Jan 26, 2011)

I gotta tell you Ted, it would take extraordinary evidence for me to believe. Definitely more evidence than the same results you could get from praying to an empty milk jug.


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## buckmaster10 (Jan 26, 2011)

There are some questions in life that we can't answer as humans. However, the only way healing can come to a person is through Jesus Christ, even doctors admit that. Why do missing limbs not get replaced? Because its not part of God's plan. Could He heal them? Without question, yes. He did bless us with the ability to have prostetics. We are humans, not God. We are not going to understand everything. One thing I do know is that one day every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord.


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## atlashunter (Jan 27, 2011)

We hear much about His mercy and kindness and goodness - in words - the words of His Book and of His pulpit - and the meek multitude is content with this evidence, such as it is, seeking no further; but whoso searcheth after a concreted sample of it will in time acquire fatigue. There being no instances of it. For what are gilded as mercies are not in any recorded case more than mere common justices, and due - due without thanks or compliment. To rescue without personal risk a cripple from a burning house is not a mercy, it is a mere commonplace duty; anybody would do it that could. And not by proxy, either - delegating the work but confiscating the credit for it. If men neglected “God’s poor” and “God’s stricken and helpless ones” as He does, what would become of them? The answer is to be found in those dark lands where man follows His example and turns his indifferent back upon them: they get no help at all; they cry, and plead and pray in vain, they linger and suffer, and miserably die. If you will look at the matter rationally and without prejudice, the proper place to hunt for the facts of His mercy, is not where man does the mercies and He collects the praise, but in those regions where He has the field to Himself.

-Mark Twain

Giving credit where it isn't due is exactly what you are doing buck. Men suffer and die until they come up with medicines and prosthetics. Then you have the gall to give your God the credit who apparently stood by through all the suffering with folded arms. It's a slap in the face to all the people who provide us with the health care that prolongs and improves our lives. I hope you don't use man made health care. Let your actions be a testimony of your faith and depend solely on God for healing.


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## buckmaster10 (Jan 27, 2011)

Although very wise and intelligent people may have produced medicines and prosthetics, it is only through Christ that they were able to do those things. I do give God the credit because I have experienced Him. That's the thing that separates us. I don't know you or anything about you, except of course you're not a Christian lol, but I do know this...that I've experienced God in my life and know how powerful and miraculous He truly is. Nobody can take that away. God doesn't sit on a throne with His arms crossed while everybody is suffering. He is active and working daily.


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## atlashunter (Jan 27, 2011)

I used to make the same personal experience claim. It was the last refuge of belief when all other foundations had disintegrated. In hindsight, the human mind has an amazing ability to see what you want to see.

Maybe he is active and working daily, but he isn't restoring people's missing limbs. How convenient that it isn't "part of his plan", even though it apparently was in Jesus time. As I said before, every thing you say and attribute to God, you can replace the word God with "empty milk jug" and the results will come out the same. You've set up in your mind a situation where God will win even if he doesn't exist.


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## buckmaster10 (Jan 27, 2011)

Well I'm really sorry to hear that. Sounds like there was really no personal experience if it was just a claim, but you can't really argue with God's healing power when people in your family are healed from health problems they should have died from. You don't really understand where I'm coming from and how God's healing power has been shown in my families life, even when doctors had no idea what to do. I'll surely be praying for you atlas! Have a good one.


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## HawgJawl (Jan 27, 2011)

buckmaster10 said:


> Well I'm really sorry to hear that. Sounds like there was really no personal experience if it was just a claim, but you can't really argue with God's healing power when people in your family are healed from health problems they should have died from. You don't really understand where I'm coming from and how God's healing power has been shown in my families life, even when doctors had no idea what to do. I'll surely be praying for you atlas! Have a good one.



In my line of work, I deal with the scum of the earth, the most violent and self-serving members of our society who live off whatever they can take from their victims.  Too often, I see the victim suffering permanent injury or death while the scum escapes unharmed.  When the scum does receive some type of injury that would kill any normal person and the doctors are certain that they will die, they often seem to miraculously recover and return to their evil deeds.  From what I have witness, the more evil someone is, the harder it is to kill them.  I cannot accept that the miraculous healings of these bottom feeders is in any way connected to God.  That only leads that there must be some miraculous healing that is not "through Jesus Christ".


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## atlashunter (Jan 27, 2011)

buckmaster10 said:


> Sounds like there was really no personal experience if it was just a claim, but you can't really argue with God's healing power when people in your family are healed from health problems they should have died from. You don't really understand where I'm coming from and how God's healing power has been shown in my families life, even when doctors had no idea what to do.



It would be a mistake to assume that former believers can't relate to the personal experiences you are talking about. I do know where you are coming from because I've been there.

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## ted_BSR (Jan 27, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> It would be a mistake to assume that former believers can't relate to the personal experiences you are talking about. I do know where you are coming from because I've been there.
> 
> <object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/V-q8WZ1Ibso?version=3"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/V-q8WZ1Ibso?version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="390"></object>
> 
> <object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/SbXJC6KsYWs?version=3"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/SbXJC6KsYWs?version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="390"></object>



Can't argue with YouTube.


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## atlashunter (Jan 27, 2011)




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## VisionCasting (Jan 27, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> Can't argue with YouTube.


----------



## ambush80 (Jan 27, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> Can't argue with YouTube.





VisionCasting said:


>



Care to discuss the content of the videos?


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## Six million dollar ham (Jan 27, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> Can't argue with YouTube.


Wow.  Strong.


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## atlashunter (Jan 28, 2011)

So far the only reason I've seen given for God not healing amputees is it's not part of his plan. Why would an all powerful all loving God plan for people to lose arms and legs and go through life that way but care enough to intervene in so many other mundane and trivial aspects of life?


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## ted_BSR (Jan 28, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> So far the only reason I've seen given for God not healing amputees is it's not part of his plan. Why would an all powerful all loving God plan for people to lose arms and legs and go through life that way but care enough to intervene in so many other mundane and trivial aspects of life?



Why does God let bad things happen to good people?

This is a very basic question. I would have thought you would have run it to ground by now.


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## ted_BSR (Jan 28, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> Wow.  Strong.



I am equally impressed with you Ham.


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## atlashunter (Jan 28, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> Why does God let bad things happen to good people?
> 
> This is a very basic question. I would have thought you would have run it to ground by now.



That's a good question Ted but this issue goes deeper than that. If God intervenes to miraculously undo so much bad in people's lives as Christians love to claim even in very trivial matters, why is there never any such intervention on behalf of the amputee?


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## ted_BSR (Jan 29, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> Care to discuss the content of the videos?



Nope, didn't watch them.


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## ambush80 (Jan 29, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> Nope, didn't watch them.



I'll watch yours if you watch mine.


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## ted_BSR (Jan 29, 2011)

ambush80 said:


> I'll watch yours if you watch mine.



I don't have any YouTube videos.


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## Miguel Cervantes (Jan 29, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> My favorite quote," Because if we assume that God is imaginary our world makes complete sense"
> 
> 
> 
> This short movie had the same style as something I watched back in junior high.


 
Reminds me of a Michael Moore film..


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## buckmaster10 (Jan 29, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> So far the only reason I've seen given for God not healing amputees is it's not part of his plan. Why would an all powerful all loving God plan for people to lose arms and legs and go through life that way but care enough to intervene in so many other mundane and trivial aspects of life?



I think a lot of us assume that we deserve to be healed and that "if God loved us He would do this or that for us to make our life better." This of course is natural for us, however its not until we realize that we are really all wrecks, every single one of us. We screw up and do things wrong all the time. This being said, God doesn't owe us anything. He doesn't have to give us a chance to have eternal life and He most certainly does not owe us our health. He is God, we are sinful people. It's not the fact that God doesn't care about certain people and that He enjoys to see people suffer. That's nonsense. Hate to drive God's plan in the ground, but His will may not make sense to us at times because we cant see the whole picture. For example, if we could see what our life will be like in 20 years, speaking for myself, it would probably scare me to death. I think this question (why doesn't God replace amputee's limbs) is one that no human being can find an answer for. We must trust that God knows what He's doing and leave it to Him.


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## atlashunter (Jan 29, 2011)

buck,

If God didn't heal anyone because we are all wrecks then what you are saying might at least be logical. Or if some people were healed of all sorts of maladies including amputees because God deemed them deserving but not others what you are saying could be logical. But it isn't logical to say God does want some folks healed and answers the prayers to heal them but not if their ailment is a missing appendage. Is there something about amputees that makes them especially undeserving of the healing power that the bible promises? Do you have any biblical basis to believe such a thing?

Does it not make more sense to say, amputees would not be supernaturally healed if no supernatural power existed? Amputees are not supernaturally healed, therefore the most likely explanation is no supernatural power exists OR if it does exist, doesn't intervene in our world.


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## buckmaster10 (Jan 29, 2011)

If no supernatural healing existed, saying no supernatural power existed may be logical. But it isn't logical to say there is no God when people are being healed supernaturally daily. 

It doesn't take healing for God to show His power and existence.

2 Corinthians 12:9 "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness."


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## atlashunter (Jan 29, 2011)

We see claims of supernatural healing but no evidence supporting the claims. Amputees would be very strong evidence but they appear to be exempt for some unknown reason or... the claims are bogus.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Oh I do understand the question and I'm not asking it from my point of view but from yours. As the video shows, the atheist point of view can provide answers to those questions that make more sense than the believer can and you're demonstrating that here.But that's just your opinion or point of view and we know what opinions are like, right? It's a challenge to provide answers from YOUR point of reference that don't sound absurd. A challenge you have yet to even attempt to take on.



Just like you, everyone thinks they are smarter than the next person...


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Atheists should start a fundraising campaign to send the best faith healer Christians have to Walter Reed. I'm sure we could come up with a large sum for the regrowth of even one soldiers missing limb. You would think Christians would be out there putting hospitals and drug companies out of business if prayer really worked.



That wound (unhealing) lasts only a lifetime, a spiritual "unhealing" lasts for eternity....eh?


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> We see claims of supernatural healing but no evidence supporting the claims. Amputees would be very strong evidence but they appear to be exempt for some unknown reason or... the claims are bogus.



You don't think that a finger can be reattached or a heart valve can be replaced? How's about a kidney? How's about cancer cored out, or a blood transfusion? How's about artificial insemination ie virgin or not? You don't think Jehovah Rapha – The Lord our Healer can use the physical/fleshy means that you refer to, to heal? He uses and guides the physical hands of surgeons to heal us. 

Did you know that our liver regenerates itself? I'm sure you did, prolly just didn't wanna mention it.

Why is it impossible to believe that God gave scientists the brains to come up with things they come up with anyway? Medicines, lightbulbs, etc etc. 'Nothing new under the sun', ie electricity, was there always electricity? or was it invented, NO it was discovered. 

I think you have outthunk yourself here my brother....not on just this, but on everything.


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

buckmaster10 said:


> If no supernatural healing existed, saying no supernatural power existed may be logical. But it isn't logical to say there is no God when people are being healed supernaturally daily.
> 
> It doesn't take healing for God to show His power and existence.
> 
> 2 Corinthians 12:9 "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness."



Amen!!

We will be glorified and perfect and healed in all eternity!


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## mtnwoman (Feb 15, 2011)

HawgJawl said:


> In my line of work, I deal with the scum of the earth, the most violent and self-serving members of our society who live off whatever they can take from their victims.  Too often, I see the victim suffering permanent injury or death while the scum escapes unharmed.  When the scum does receive some type of injury that would kill any normal person and the doctors are certain that they will die, they often seem to miraculously recover and return to their evil deeds.  From what I have witness, the more evil someone is, the harder it is to kill them.  I cannot accept that the miraculous healings of these bottom feeders is in any way connected to God.  That only leads that there must be some miraculous healing that is not "through Jesus Christ".



Seems as though someone isn't doing their job well enough to put this scum under the jail where they can't get away....that's just me though, what do I know? Somebody should step up to the plate and fix this problem, I know I would if I worked in that arena.


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## atlashunter (Feb 18, 2011)

mtnwoman said:


> That wound (unhealing) lasts only a lifetime, a spiritual "unhealing" lasts for eternity....eh?



The same could be said of any physical ailment. So why bother with the supernatural healing claims at all?

Let's approach this from a slightly different angle. Do you have any scriptural explanation for why amputees aren't supernaturally healed? The bible gives an example of one being healed and doesn't say they won't or shouldn't be. When Jesus said that anything two people pray for will be done he didn't say "unless you're praying for healing of an amputee". For anyone who really believes the letter of the bible I'm curious to know why it doesn't come as a shock to them that prayer doesn't heal amputees.


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## atlashunter (Feb 18, 2011)

mtnwoman said:


> You don't think that a finger can be reattached or a heart valve can be replaced? How's about a kidney? How's about cancer cored out, or a blood transfusion? How's about artificial insemination ie virgin or not? You don't think Jehovah Rapha – The Lord our Healer can use the physical/fleshy means that you refer to, to heal? He uses and guides the physical hands of surgeons to heal us.



Well if you want to say God achieves healing only through natural means then what's the point? And how would you know that to be any more true than the claim that some other god was guiding the surgeons hands?

If I tell you, "you don't think Apollo, the Roman god of healing, can use and guide the physical hands of surgeons to heal us?" would that convince you? Is there any more reason then to believe in Jehovah Rapha than there is to believe in Apollo?




mtnwoman said:


> Why is it impossible to believe that God gave scientists the brains to come up with things they come up with anyway? Medicines, lightbulbs, etc etc. 'Nothing new under the sun', ie electricity, was there always electricity? or was it invented, NO it was discovered.
> 
> I think you have outthunk yourself here my brother....not on just this, but on everything.



I think you're not thinking enough my sister. 

It's not impossible. I'll readily admit it is just as possible as any other God being the source of these things. Can you admit that possibility? How about the possibility that we came up with these things without any supernatural help after a very long struggle of scratching for knowledge and standing on the shoulders of the generations that came before us? Is that impossible? You really think the first scenario is the most probable?

I'm in agreement with Mark Twain who said the proper place to look for evidence of God isn't where men do the work and he steals the credit but in those places where the field is left to himself.


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## gtparts (Feb 18, 2011)

How is it that it is assumed that "supernatural healing" is for the general purpose of healing? 

How is it that those who scoff at the idea of "supernatural healing" do no understand that faith is the conduit through which God works, if He chooses? Absent the (1) faith and (2) God's will to do so, "supernatural healing" does not occur. 

It has been asked why statistical evidence doesn't support the effectiveness of prayer.

Let me ask this. If the numbers were "skewed" by God to support a significant success rate for prayer being effective, would you place your "faith" in the numbers...... or God?

  Or would you simply say that you are not sure what is going on? Suppose that the norm is that only 6 of every 100 people having burns over 75% of their bodies survives under current medical treatment(s). Further suppose that without any change in the treatments, that number goes to 12 of every 100 and stays at that level. That's doubling the survival rate and there is no attributable medical reason that can be determined. Would you consider the possibility that God was responsible or would you discount the possibility because 88 of 100 still died?

The point is, God is not concerned about statistics. He is concerned about individuals. He is more concerned about our character than our comfort, about our yielded dependence on Him than our self-sufficiency.

 That mankind suffers as a result of living in a fallen world, rendered imperfect by the consequences of sin, is the reason that 100 get burned over 75% of their bodies in the first place. That God heals 6 or 12 out of 100, through medicine or supernatural healing is all a matter of grace. God extends grace to whom He wills to be healed, for His purpose...... for His purpose. It is at the sole discretion of sovereign God, the Creator and it is always the right and just thing.


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## atlashunter (Feb 18, 2011)

I don't care if he is concerned about statistics or not. The statistics will be skewed to whatever degree he intervenes in the world on behalf of the faithful but not on behalf of the faithless.

Statistical differences would be convincing to the degree and consistency that prayer works. If 6% of nonbelievers survive the burns and 12% of believers survived I wouldn't take that as proof beyond any doubt but it would deserve a second look. If on the other hand there had never been a case of non-believers sprouting wings and flying to the moon but every time a believer in a particular religion prayed to their god for it the wings started sprouting and they were on their way, well... that might be just a bit more convincing don't you think?

If people occasionally regrew arms and legs and believers regrew them slightly more frequently that would be less convincing than if noone ever regrew limbs except when a particular god was prayed to.

Here is a golden opportunity for a god that christians claim wants us to know him to set himself apart from all the false gods the devil is trying to deceive us with. Yet he never does it. Claims far more extraordinary than a restored limb are made throughout the bible. So why don't we see them today?


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## speechless33759 (Mar 1, 2011)

Not an answer, but something to think about, 

If God doesn't exist and those kids and our soldiers stepped on those mines, then who placed the mines there in the first place? 

Atlashunter I think many of us can see that you are very intelligent, but also have a personal issue with this. I'm sure seeing some of our guys get burned/limbs tore off/amputated isn't a pretty thing to watch happen and to watch what happens afterwards is also despairing. But I personally know some of our vets who have been blessed to walk again on a prostetic limb given by people of faith. Believe it or not, the faith community is probably one of largest contributors to relief/disaster areas worldwide including prostetics to people who can't afford it. But that still doesn't answer the question. The only person that can answer that is God and you have to ask Him yourself....that's only if you decide to have some spout of irrational thinking.


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## gtparts (Mar 2, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> I don't care if he is concerned about statistics or not. The statistics will be skewed to whatever degree he intervenes in the world on behalf of the faithful but not on behalf of the faithless.
> 
> Statistical differences would be convincing to the degree and consistency that prayer works. If 6% of nonbelievers survive the burns and 12% of believers survived I wouldn't take that as proof beyond any doubt but it would deserve a second look. If on the other hand there had never been a case of non-believers sprouting wings and flying to the moon but every time a believer in a particular religion prayed to their god for it the wings started sprouting and they were on their way, well... that might be just a bit more convincing don't you think?
> 
> ...



Seems you have your answer. For amputees, God shows no favoritism toward any one group, lost or saved. For reasons that He alone knows, the human body was not designed for natural regeneration of limbs. Furthermore, He has chosen not to do so in a miraculous way, either. Perhaps it is that in so doing, He would negate the necessity for faith in the life of just one individual and, being counter to His plan of redemption, He has decided not to implement such supernatural reconstruction.

It is also reasonable to expect that, should supernatural regeneration occur, skepticism would cry "Hoax! Where is the medical waste from the original limb loss? It is most certainly a conspiracy of liars. We demand more documentation than someones word."

 I can even imagine you heading up such a campaign.


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## VisionCasting (Mar 2, 2011)

gtparts said:


> . Perhaps it is that in so doing, He would negate the necessity for faith in the life of just one individual



    There it is.


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## kyewhit (Mar 2, 2011)

God does still heal people today. I've been healed myself, I was born with my spin out of place in my lower back. The only way the doctors could fix it was to fuse it together. So one day when I was 24 I was laying in the floor at home and I was watching a lady by the name of joan hunter she has the gift of healing. So as she was getting ready to pray for peolpe over the tv. I asked Jesus to heal my back. When she started to pray she named a few diseases and she said (I command every back to be healed in Jesus name) and at that time my lower back got hot and when I felt my spin move over to the right and then the heat of God healing power left my back. And I have a x-ray of befor and after the healing. The befor x-ray was taken about 5 months befor Jesus healed my back. And I thank God every day for what he has do for me. Remember this that a man with an experience will never be at the mercy of a man with a theory. And as fare as limbs going out there was a healing movement in 1906 to 1910 called the Azusa Street Revival and the had limbs growing out and there was an other movement in the late 1940's and early 1950's. And I tell you the truth about everything I'am not lie to you because it's a sin. So I tell you the truth again that a great Healing movement is back to america and it will start on the east coast, because the Lord is going to try to get everyone right with him befor its to late and to turn america around.


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## BillyLee1956 (Mar 3, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> Outstanding video.  Thank you for sharing.
> I bet the people who take exception, and actually watched it til the end, had their arms crossed and did plenty of squirming and shifting.  That would have to be difficult to swallow, I'd wager.


Not at all.
True Christians have seen and will continue to see this type of theme until they go to be with the Lord.
Old news just dressed up in "modren" packaging. (yep, thats the "kewl" way to spell and pronounce "modern")
........and the band played on.


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## atlashunter (Mar 6, 2011)

speechless33759 said:


> But I personally know some of our vets who have been blessed to walk again on a prostetic limb given by people of faith. Believe it or not, the faith community is probably one of largest contributors to relief/disaster areas worldwide including prostetics to people who can't afford it. But that still doesn't answer the question. The only person that can answer that is God and you have to ask Him yourself....that's only if you decide to have some spout of irrational thinking.



This isn't directed at you personally but it strikes me as a bit odd that when difficult questions are asked of people who continually make claims about God (including that they have a personal relationship and communication with him) their answer is that you must ask him yourself.


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## vowell462 (Mar 6, 2011)

kyewhit said:


> God does still heal people today. I've been healed myself, I was born with my spin out of place in my lower back. The only way the doctors could fix it was to fuse it together. So one day when I was 24 I was laying in the floor at home and I was watching a lady by the name of joan hunter she has the gift of healing. So as she was getting ready to pray for peolpe over the tv. I asked Jesus to heal my back. When she started to pray she named a few diseases and she said (I command every back to be healed in Jesus name) and at that time my lower back got hot and when I felt my spin move over to the right and then the heat of God healing power left my back. And I have a x-ray of befor and after the healing. The befor x-ray was taken about 5 months befor Jesus healed my back. And I thank God every day for what he has do for me. Remember this that a man with an experience will never be at the mercy of a man with a theory. And as fare as limbs going out there was a healing movement in 1906 to 1910 called the Azusa Street Revival and the had limbs growing out and there was an other movement in the late 1940's and early 1950's. And I tell you the truth about everything I'am not lie to you because it's a sin. So I tell you the truth again that a great Healing movement is back to america and it will start on the east coast, because the Lord is going to try to get everyone right with him befor its to late and to turn america around.



Im glad your back feels better, I really am. The Azusa Street revival actually lasted a few more years than that. However, I have never heard of this revival healing anyones limbs nor can I find any evidence that suggest they did. Im not sure where that is coming from. The Azusa Street Revival was an event that spread the Pentacostal theme. Alot of speaking in tongues, and interracial relationships.


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## Six million dollar ham (Mar 6, 2011)

BillyLee1956 said:


> Not at all.
> True Christians have seen and will continue to see this type of theme until they go to be with the Lord.
> Old news just dressed up in "modren" packaging. (yep, thats the "kewl" way to spell and pronounce "modern")
> ........and the band played on.



I see.  My mistake. 

So BillyLee1956, why doesn't God heal amputees?


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## stringmusic (Mar 6, 2011)

What the deal?!?!?! If God doesnt do what you want Him to do, this aids in all of your disbeliefs?

Why doesnt God give me alot of money?


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## stringmusic (Mar 6, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> I see.  My mistake.
> 
> So BillyLee1956, why doesn't God heal amputees?



Do you really care? If God healed an amputee in front of your face today, you would be seeking psychiatric help tomorrow. Do you really think you would assert the feat to God? Or would you be ecstatic that science has a way of healing amputees?


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## Six million dollar ham (Mar 6, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Do you really care? If God healed an amputee in front of your face today, you would be seeking psychiatric help tomorrow. Do you really think you would assert the feat to God? Or would you be ecstatic that science has a way of healing amputees?



You forget that I've carved out some impossibility that would facilitate instant belief in Jesus were it to be overcome.  Talking animals (in English just so I could verify), regrown limbs.   I'm sure there are others but these two would cinch the deal immediately.


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## stringmusic (Mar 6, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> You forget that I've carved out some impossibility that would facilitate instant belief in Jesus were it to be overcome.  Talking animals (in English just so I could verify), regrown limbs.   I'm sure there are others but these two would cinch the deal immediately.



Sorry, not buying it for a second. The earth itself and the fact that you are on it is much better than a talking dog or an arm growing back. So why not use them, because you have a more "logical" explanation? You would listen to Hitchens/Dawkins/ whoever else give you a more "logical" explanation on why the animal could talk or why the arm grew back, it would only be a matter of time. You dont want to believe, I just hope that you havent accepted that forever.


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## atlashunter (Mar 6, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Sorry, not buying it for a second. The earth itself and the fact that you are on it is much better than a talking dog or an arm growing back. So why not use them, because you have a more "logical" explanation? You would listen to Hitchens/Dawkins/ whoever else give you a more "logical" explanation on why the animal could talk or why the arm grew back, it would only be a matter of time. You dont want to believe, I just hope that you havent accepted that forever.



What makes you think the earth itself is any more evidence of your god than it is of other creator deities?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creator_deity

The same could be said of regenerating limbs but it really depends on the circumstances. If the sun rises on a daily basis and I say a prayer to Ra for the sun to rise and it does that cannot be considered evidence that my prayer worked or Ra is real. Anyone can point to what is and give any number or supernatural explanations for it. If you don't believe all of them then why would you expect anyone to believe yours? If on the other hand there were never any regenerating limbs except for any time someone was prayed for in Jesus name it would at least lend some credibility to the theists claims.


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## ted_BSR (Mar 6, 2011)

Six million dollar ham said:


> You forget that I've carved out some impossibility that would facilitate instant belief in Jesus were it to be overcome.  Talking animals (in English just so I could verify), regrown limbs.   I'm sure there are others but these two would cinch the deal immediately.



You shouldn't make rules about what would be acceptable for God to reveal himself to you. It is like squinting your eyes really tight and proclaiming,"I can SEE!!!"

That being said, I predict that your pitbull will look you directly in your eyes in the near future and ask in the clearest English dialect,"Ham, why don't you BELIEVE?"


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## atlashunter (Mar 6, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> You shouldn't make rules about what would be acceptable for God to reveal himself to you. It is like squinting your eyes really tight and proclaiming,"I can SEE!!!"



Don't you do the same thing with respect to every deity except your own?


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## Six million dollar ham (Mar 6, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> That being said, I predict that your pitbull will look you directly in your eyes in the near future and ask in the clearest English dialect,"Ham, why don't you BELIEVE?"



Yeah, probably.


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## ted_BSR (Mar 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Don't you do the same thing with respect to every deity except your own?



Not at all. My eyes are wide open.


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## atlashunter (Mar 7, 2011)

I see. So you don't have any rules for what serves as evidence of other gods?


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## stringmusic (Mar 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> I see. So you don't have any rules for what serves as evidence of other gods?



Christianity completely seperates itself in Jesus Christ. There is more and I could post a video, put you probably wouldnt care much for watching it.


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## atlashunter (Mar 7, 2011)

stringmusic said:


> Christianity completely seperates itself in Jesus Christ. There is more and I could post a video, put you probably wouldnt care much for watching it.



Jesus is just one of many claimed gods. Maybe you and ted accept such claims on simple assertion but it will take more than that to convince me.


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## ted_BSR (Mar 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Jesus is just one of many claimed gods. Maybe you and ted accept such claims on simple assertion but it will take more than that to convince me.



You should talk to Ham's pitbull.


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## ted_BSR (Mar 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> I see. So you don't have any rules for what serves as evidence of other gods?



I don't think you are the one to be asking that question since you don't believe in any gods. Kind of like asking me to borrow my umbrella when you don't believe in rain.


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## atlashunter (Mar 7, 2011)

No ted it's kind of like asking you to be consistent in what it takes for you to believe in a particular god claim.


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## ted_BSR (Mar 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> No ted it's kind of like asking you to be consistent in what it takes for you to believe in a particular god claim.



I am very consistent in what it takes for me to believe in a particluar god claim, you just don't like my answer.


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## atlashunter (Mar 7, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> I am very consistent in what it takes for me to believe in a particluar god claim, you just don't like my answer.



Great. Now that we've established that, care to answer the question? 

So you don't have any rules for what serves as evidence of other gods?


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## ted_BSR (Mar 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Great. Now that we've established that, care to answer the question?
> 
> So you don't have any rules for what serves as evidence of other gods?



Not really, we have been down that road. Suffice to say, no one else has talking donkeys.


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## atlashunter (Mar 7, 2011)

Didn't think you'd want to go down that road.


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## ted_BSR (Mar 7, 2011)

atlashunter said:


> Didn't think you'd want to go down that road.



Not with you buddy. I'll just go down in my basement and yell at some lumber.


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## JFS (Mar 8, 2011)

ted_BSR said:


> Suffice to say, no one else has talking donkeys.


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