# Thought this might help some of us to understand...



## gtparts (Sep 27, 2012)

http://www.thetwocities.com/practic...-theology/im-kinda-sorta-yeah-not-really-gay/

I am glad to know someone else struggles with the temptation to sin. While this is not one of my temptations, I sure have desires that will quickly dethrone the Lord of my life, if I allow them the possibility of taking root. I pray that when the issue is sin, any sin, we will lean on Christ and the grace he freely provides to those who are His.


----------



## Lowjack (Sep 27, 2012)

"Sin is not dead to us , we are dead to sin "


----------



## Artfuldodger (Sep 27, 2012)

I would agree with your post but would rather use examples that most of us struggle with  like lust, adultery, hate, coveting, and having unatural sex acts with our wives.


----------



## centerpin fan (Sep 27, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> I would agree with your post but would rather use examples that most of us struggle with  like lust, adultery, hate, coveting, and having unatural sex acts with our wives.


----------



## mountainraider68 (Sep 28, 2012)

centerpin fan said:


>



I probably shouldnt have  But i laughed so hard for at least 10 minutes.


----------



## centerpin fan (Sep 28, 2012)

mountainraider68 said:


> I probably shouldnt have  But i laughed so hard for at least 10 minutes.



Glad you liked it.  

I just hope it didn't detract from the OP.


----------



## gtparts (Sep 28, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> I would agree with your post but would rather use examples that most of us struggle with  like lust, adultery, hate, coveting, and having unatural sex acts with our wives.



I didn't exclude any of those, except the 'unatural (sic) sex acts with our wives'. I guess I never gave much thought to having wives, much less those unnatural acts. 

Now, I'll have to add that to my list. I'll pray for you and for you overcoming your struggles, also. 

[Sorry, A-dodger, but it just struck me as a little strange to see that posted here... or anywhere. Through a 3rd party, I heard a true story about a pastor/marriage counselor who fielded that very idea/question from a prospective groom. His response was that, for a married (to each other) and consenting couple, there were no restrictions to their sexual activity beyond what Scripture and the Holy Spirit directed.]
 (I suspect that safety and privacy would also be considerations.)

(back to your post)
It is even worse than that. As a man thinks in his heart (considers in his mind), so is he. As it is referenced in the linked blog, it is only through the renewing of our minds (having the mind of Christ) that continually draws us from such wicked thoughts and actions.


----------



## gtparts (Sep 28, 2012)

Cpf, thanks for the tension-relieving clip. Glad to see that sometimes humor can be used to lighten things up.

Of course the purpose of the OP was to cause us to examine our inability to accurately judge others, not just gays.

Our attitudes and responses are excellent indicators of our need for grace and the necessity of extending it towards others.


----------



## jmharris23 (Sep 28, 2012)

Very good article


----------



## Artfuldodger (Sep 28, 2012)

Lowjack said:


> "Sin is not dead to us , we are dead to sin "


I'm not sure what the verses in the Bible mean, we are dead to sin. I don't think it means we don't sin anymore unless when we do bad things they aren't considered sins anymore. I think Christians struggle with sins daily.
It's a great topic on how we all struggle with sins and trying to overcome them.
I've also heard preachers talk about accidental sinning compared to sinning on purpose. I don't know if I go along with that concept.


----------



## Artfuldodger (Sep 28, 2012)

gtparts said:


> [Sorry, A-dodger, but it just struck me as a little strange to see that posted here... or anywhere. Through a 3rd party, I heard a true story about a pastor/marriage counselor who fielded that very idea/question from a prospective groom. His response was that, for a married (to each other) and consenting couple, there were no restrictions to their sexual activity beyond what Scripture and the Holy Spirit directed.]
> (I suspect that safety and privacy would also be considerations.)
> QUOTE
> 
> I stand corrected as that preacher might be right. I can't justify my statement with scripture.


----------



## StriperAddict (Sep 28, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> I'm not sure what the verses in the Bible mean, we are dead to sin. I don't think it means we don't sin anymore unless when we do bad things they aren't considered sins anymore. I think Christians struggle with sins daily.
> It's a great topic on how we all struggle with sins and trying to overcome them.
> I've also heard preachers talk about accidental sinning compared to sinning on purpose. I don't know if I go along with that concept.


 
This came from the article and he puts it well...



> I’ve learned not to define myself by sins or temptations. My identity is not bound to my sexuality, but to my Savior (Galatians 2:20).


 
Just because we struggle with temptation and sin daily doesn't mean our identity is found there.  It is _IN_ Christ, or as Paul put it, our NEW man.


----------



## gemcgrew (Oct 6, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> I'm not sure what the verses in the Bible mean, we are dead to sin.



Did Christ satisfy the justice of God as our Substitute, or did He not?


----------



## Artfuldodger (Oct 6, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> Did Christ satisfy the justice of God as our Substitute, or did He not?



When Jesus told the woman to "go and sin no more" are you saying she couldn't sin anymore if she was a Christian?

I assume you follow this line of beliefs from the following link. I understand a lot of Christians do, I don't.

From the link;

Question: If you accept and come to Jesus Christ can you sin 
                 again after that point?
                       YES OR NO?

                      Answer: NO!!!

              HOW COULD THAT BE POSSIBLE?
               GET READY FOR SOME TRUTH!

NOTE #2:

Once you have come to Jesus Christ, you can't sin anymore 
                       because
   HE HAS PAID FOR YOUR PAST, PRESENT, AND FUTURE SINS!

   ANY SINS THAT YOU COMMIT AFTER ACCEPTING HIM ARE SINS
        OF THE FLESH AND DIE WITH THE FLESH.

http://www.bibletruthonline.com/goandsinnomore.htm


----------



## Artfuldodger (Oct 6, 2012)

From the link:
Question:
         If you rob a bank, will you go to heaven?

Answer:  Yes, if you have accepted Jesus Christ.
         No, if you have not accepted Jesus Christ.



Question:
         If you kill someone, is it possible to go to heaven?

Answer:  Yes, if you have accepted Jesus Christ.
         No, if you have not accepted Jesus Christ.


Question:

         Do homosexuals and bi-sexuals get into heaven?

Answer:  Yes, if they have accepted Jesus Christ.
         No, if they have not accepted Jesus Christ.(end of quote from link)

Now it looks like the homosexual in the article in the OP has a way out. Repentance isn't a requirement?


----------



## gemcgrew (Oct 6, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> When Jesus told the woman to "go and sin no more" are you saying she couldn't sin anymore if she was a Christian?



If she is in Christ, as far as God's justice is concerned, she never sinned one time. Christ is her Substitute.


----------



## gemcgrew (Oct 6, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> Question:
> 
> Do homosexuals and bi-sexuals get into heaven?
> 
> ...


If by "accepted Jesus Christ", the author is saying they are born again, where is the evidence?



Artfuldodger said:


> Now it looks like the homosexual in the article in the OP has a way out.


A way out of what?



Artfuldodger said:


> Repentance isn't a requirement?


There is repentance that is of no spiritual value. There is a true repentance that is brought about by the working of the Holy Spirit.


----------



## Artfuldodger (Oct 6, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> If by "accepted Jesus Christ", the author is saying they are born again, where is the evidence?
> They believe Jesus died for their sins.
> 
> 
> ...


So Christians who continue to sin or do bad things haven't received the "gift of the Holy Spirit?" Is repentance something a Christian does or the Holy Spirit does? Is there nothing required of a Christian other than to believe? Then the Holy Spirit takes over and turns the new Christian into a robot?


----------



## gemcgrew (Oct 7, 2012)

Artfuldodger said:


> They believe Jesus died for their sins.


 These folks believed Jesus died for their sins, "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." 

As a child, I was taught the historical facts of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. I was taught that Christ died for my sins. I believed it. My belief was of no spiritual value, it was produced by the flesh. What does the Bible tell us the flesh profiteth?



Artfuldodger said:


> A way out of having to repent. If you believe and have accepted Jesus, that's all that is required.


 True conversion always produces repentance.




Artfuldodger said:


> Is repentance something a Christian does or the Holy Spirit does?


It is the goodness of God that leads us to repentance. (Romans 2:4)



Artfuldodger said:


> Is there nothing required of a Christian other than to believe?


Nothing is required of you but all of you.



Artfuldodger said:


> Then the Holy Spirit takes over and turns the new Christian into a robot?


Not a robot, a new creature. Did you create this new creature?


----------



## gemcgrew (Oct 7, 2012)

gtparts said:


> Thought this might help some of us to understand...



I appreciate you posting that link. I have read it twice now and will probably read it twice more. It has caused me to pause and consider and for that I am thankful.


----------



## gtparts (Oct 8, 2012)

gemcgrew said:


> I appreciate you posting that link. I have read it twice now and will probably read it twice more. It has caused me to pause and consider and for that I am thankful.



Glad you found it to be thought provoking.

For all:

Thanks for your responses. Isn't it interesting how we see things so completely black-and-white when we have grown up with prejudices, yet we are forced (sometimes, uncomfortably) to re-evaluate our positions when we are confronted by the mere change of perspective.



R.I.P., Joe South, 1940 - 2012. You have left something of great value and underscored one of the truths of the Gospel, while bringing us the joy of your music.


----------



## mtnwoman (Oct 8, 2012)

Lowjack said:


> "Sin is not dead to us , we are dead to sin "



Amen!!!!

Temptation will never die, we have to die to temptation.
Lord help us, it's hard to die.


----------

